should they be sleeping through the night at that age?

Amanda - posted on 05/14/2009 ( 42 moms have responded )

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why is it that some mothers think their newborns and young infants MUST sleep through the night and even let them cry it out without feeding them?

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Ashley - posted on 05/19/2009

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I honestly think this is an important question and can relate to it a lot. Amanda, I know you and I have gone back and forth on this issue in many other posts, but I think I might be able to shed a little light on this subject. If you are a first time mom, there are so many unknowns...why is she crying? is she hungry? tired? overstimulated? cold? scared? in pain? and there are SO many books out there about child rearing which almost all of them contradict each other. When I first had my daughter I thought I would know exactly what to do. I am a nurse, I was quite comfortable with babies, and I was sure my motherly instinct would kick in as soon as I gave birth. Well, with all of my hormones surging through my body, and the sleep deprivation, I continued to doubt myself on almost everything. Consequently I was having a hell of a time getting into any kind of a routine. When my daughter was 10 weeks old I hired an infant sleep consultant that gave me age appropriate expectations for sleep and nutritional needs and it was a life saver. I finally had something to help me get into a good routine, because up until then I was clueless, and I was going out of my mind with sleep deprivation, not to mention feeling like a horrible mother as I was spending hours on end trying to rock my baby back to sleep after feeding and changing her only to have her wake up the second I put her down. Prior to hiring my consultant I did read so many books just to find an age appropriate expectation of how long a stretch I could expect my baby to sleep at night and I never really came across it. Maybe I was looking in the wrong place, but I found nearly all of the baby books out there to be useless. I never let my daughter cry if I thought she was hungry. The very first night I decided to not wake her for a dreamfeed, she woke up shortly after. So I fixed a bottle to see if she was truly hungry or just using my breast to soothe herself back to sleep. She took the bottle for about 30 seconds and then didn't want it. That's when I learned she did not need to eat at that time, but she was nearly 3 months old. After that I wanted her to learn how to put herself back to sleep without using my breast to do it, that was my choice as her mother. I think all of us mom's can get into a habit of judging each other, but what's the point? The mom's that post on here wanting to know how to get their 7 week old to sleep longer at night are truly exhausted and probably have no help from their significant other and just want to know what they should do to help their baby sleep a little longer at night. The first few months are the hardest as there is not a lot of literature to help guide a new mom and to provide realistic expectations for newborns and young babies. And I don't know about anyone else, but typically it's the mothers getting up all of the time in the middle of the night to spend the time getting their babies back to sleep. Some people's maternity leave is only 8 weeks (mine was!) then it's back to work. So I think many mom's of young infants look forward to the night when they get some more sleep, especially if they will be putting in a full day of work the next day. It's very easy to get overwhelmed with everything that goes with becoming a mom. And you can listen to everybody's two cents worth but when it comes down to it, hopefully the mother will do what she thinks is best for her baby. Sometimes when the baby is still so young and the mom is still so new she's just not sure what the best thing to do is yet, so she may look here for some advice. And maybe sometimes she may need a reality check, especially if she thinks their 7 week old should be sleeping an 8 hour stretch. Anyway, I don't know if that helped at all, but it's one new mom's perspective...

Erin - posted on 05/19/2009

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Quoting Michele:



Quoting Erin:

Obviously there are things we can do to encourage good sleeping habits. If a baby knows how to self-soothe (which we can help them to learn), and they wake during the night but aren't hungry they can go back off happily - my daughter does this a lot of nights.







So how do I help her to learn this without some period of crying? 








 I did it by teaching my daughter to fall asleep in her cot, rather than in my arms.  I watched for her tired signs, made sure she wasn't hungry/dirty, wrapped her tightly, gave her a few minutes quiet cuddle time in her room, then put her down sleepy but awake. She did protest for a few minutes initially, so I stayed with her by her cot, reassuring her with my presence but without talking or picking her up, until she dropped off. To me there's a big difference between a baby having a sleepy grizzle and them screaming because they've been left alone and don't know how to go to sleep without the comfort of their mother. I found the length of time I had to pat her became less and less, and in 2 days I was able to walk out of the room while she was still awake. Once a baby has mastered this at bedtime (or naptime) they are then able to self-soothe if they happen to stir during the night.





 

Natalie - posted on 05/18/2009

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Quoting Melissa:



Quoting Natalie:

I think it's crazy too !! my daughter is 5 months and i still breastfeed on demand, i'm usually up 5 times a night (at the moment more but thats cause her sleep pattern has gone all weird and thats another story ! ha ha ) and it's funny that someone mentioned about the nappies, because although my daughter usually gets up a lot, normally (i say normally because if anyone has seen any of my other posts they will see that i am having a nightmare with my daughter a night at the moment so nothing is what it has been) but usually i dream feed my daughter and because she never usually wakes up I actually got freaked out about the nappy situation and change her about 12am in her sleep as well, some of my friends think i'm mental but i can't stand the idea of her laying in all her toilet all night, it's gross.

On the subject of sleep tho, I can't understand what mum could leave their child crying and not even check if they are hungry let alone just comfort them if they need it, whats wrong with just letting your child know your there for them. some people are nuts !

and thats my two pence's worth !!!






In every way you are so much like myself. I wake my son up still for bum changes as he will blister the first time I dont.(I did try one night when he seemed exhausted)But never again! I change him feed him and hes back in his bed at the most 10 minutes as he usually sleeps through the bum change and he doesnt feed but lately hes been eating more probably due to a growth spurt. It is awesone to find other moms out there like me. Sometimes if he wakes up I just say mommy is here he goes back to sleep I am in no way saying that they are ALWAYS hungry but regardless of there reason whether it may be comfort, food, bum changes. Who are we to say they should not have that after all do we not as adults sometime want the same thing why expect more out of a baby then of yourself.






 






My daughter woke up every hour to feed I did not like that but I did not use CIO at all I slowly got her to feed for five  minutes longer by keeping her awake and made the feed more efficient and that was at 6 months but I believe there is no reason for CIO just would like to add even though I do not use CIO my son does self sooth I place him in his crib clean fed and a bit drowsy 5- 10 min later hes asleep no crying at all because he knows he is safe,





ha ha glad i'm not the only one with the sleeping nappy changes, my friends tell me to leave her, it's fine, and i think they feel i'm judging them by not changing their babies, but i'm not at all, also my daughter quite often goes a proper toilet at night which is another reason i like to change her !

Natalie - posted on 05/18/2009

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Quoting Melissa:



Quoting Natalie:

I think it's crazy too !! my daughter is 5 months and i still breastfeed on demand, i'm usually up 5 times a night (at the moment more but thats cause her sleep pattern has gone all weird and thats another story ! ha ha ) and it's funny that someone mentioned about the nappies, because although my daughter usually gets up a lot, normally (i say normally because if anyone has seen any of my other posts they will see that i am having a nightmare with my daughter a night at the moment so nothing is what it has been) but usually i dream feed my daughter and because she never usually wakes up I actually got freaked out about the nappy situation and change her about 12am in her sleep as well, some of my friends think i'm mental but i can't stand the idea of her laying in all her toilet all night, it's gross.

On the subject of sleep tho, I can't understand what mum could leave their child crying and not even check if they are hungry let alone just comfort them if they need it, whats wrong with just letting your child know your there for them. some people are nuts !

and thats my two pence's worth !!!






In every way you are so much like myself. I wake my son up still for bum changes as he will blister the first time I dont.(I did try one night when he seemed exhausted)But never again! I change him feed him and hes back in his bed at the most 10 minutes as he usually sleeps through the bum change and he doesnt feed but lately hes been eating more probably due to a growth spurt. It is awesone to find other moms out there like me. Sometimes if he wakes up I just say mommy is here he goes back to sleep I am in no way saying that they are ALWAYS hungry but regardless of there reason whether it may be comfort, food, bum changes. Who are we to say they should not have that after all do we not as adults sometime want the same thing why expect more out of a baby then of yourself.






 






My daughter woke up every hour to feed I did not like that but I did not use CIO at all I slowly got her to feed for five  minutes longer by keeping her awake and made the feed more efficient and that was at 6 months but I believe there is no reason for CIO just would like to add even though I do not use CIO my son does self sooth I place him in his crib clean fed and a bit drowsy 5- 10 min later hes asleep no crying at all because he knows he is safe,





ha ha glad i'm not the only one with the sleeping nappy changes, my friends tell me to leave her, it's fine, and i think they feel i'm judging them by not changing their babies, but i'm not at all, also my daughter quite often goes a proper toilet at night which is another reason i like to change her !

Amanda - posted on 05/18/2009

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Quoting Tamarra:

Babies should start sleeping through the night by the time they are 6 months old. My son is almost 6 months and has only been sleeping through the night since he was 4 and a half months old, but that was due to his eczema.


Where is the written rule that states babies SHOULD sleep through at 6 months?



And as the post staed we were talking about newborns and young infants (a few weeks old-a couple months old)

Tamarra - posted on 05/18/2009

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Babies should start sleeping through the night by the time they are 6 months old. My son is almost 6 months and has only been sleeping through the night since he was 4 and a half months old, but that was due to his eczema.

Michele - posted on 05/18/2009

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Quoting Erin:

Obviously there are things we can do to encourage good sleeping habits. If a baby knows how to self-soothe (which we can help them to learn), and they wake during the night but aren't hungry they can go back off happily - my daughter does this a lot of nights.


So how do I help her to learn this without some period of crying? 


 

Esther - posted on 05/18/2009

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Quoting Krista:

My son's six months now, and what I wonder is, when he wakes at night (usually only once) is it actually because he's hungry? Or is it out of habit, and he needs that bottle in his mouth to fall asleep, because that's what he's used to? Sometimes if I turn on his lullabies and give him his teddy, he'll fall right asleep again, without crying. In that case, he must not have been hungry. If he keeps crying, I always feed him, but I really don't know if he needs it anymore. I guess I'm just hoping that he'll start sleeping through the night every night and I won't have to wean him off the night time bottle. But, as long as he wakes up crying in the night, I suppose I'll keep waking up and feeding him!



My son did that. When you get the sense that he's drinking more out of habit than out of need, try cutting back on the amount of milk you are giving him. If you normally give him a 4 oz bottle, cut that back to 3 oz, then the next night 2 oz etc. To be safe you could keep another 2 oz bottle handy in case he really is hungry/thirsty but with my son, just cutting back helped him sleep through. I guess at some point the 1 oz just wasn't worth waking up for anymore but I didn't have to go cold turkey on him either.

Esther - posted on 05/18/2009

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OMG - Amanda - I am SOOOOO with you. I'm always shocked when I see posts from moms who are asking why their 8 week old "still" isn't sleeping through the night. I'm a first-time mom myself and am plenty clueless on a lot of issues but I never expected that from my son. If he had slept through the night that early, I would have been on my knees with grattitude don't get me wrong, but I never expected that.



Personally I'm no fan of CIO or even "controlled crying" methods even for older kids (my son is now 16 months old and finally sleeping through the night most nights but I still respond immediately if he wakes up and calls me - he never cries) but to each her own I guess. However, for kids under 6 months I personally think it's just cruel. To me, all kids are different and eventually they all sleep through the night when THEY are ready - not when we are ready. They all have different needs and our jobs as moms is to meet those needs as best we can. A need for comfort is just as legitimate to me as a need for food or a clean diaper. I feel very strongly that the reason my son is easy going, always happy, listens to me and is very good about communicating his needs without crying is because I always responded to him. He has never tried to climb out of his crib yet because he knows that all he needs to do is call "mama" and I'll be there. There are plenty of times where I will see on the video monitor that he's awake and sitting up and he'll talk to himself, make jokes (at least I assume since he'll start laughing out loud at something he said to himself) and after about 10 mins go back down and back to sleep without any intervention from me. So he is clearly able to self soothe and I never had to let him cry to "teach" him that. Yes, it took a while to get to this point, but I have no regrets at all and I really seriously doubt that letting him cry would have changed anything, except maybe his overall demeanor and certainly it would have caused me some tears too to hear him like that.



MAYBE for some kids it is the only answer. I don't know. I don't know those kids like I know mine. But for me and for my son, it definitely would not have been.

Mel - posted on 05/18/2009

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ours took one hour and a half for each bottle therefore it was not fair to wake her up, just let it go thru while she slept if we'd tried to change her nappy in these night feeds she would not have gone back down. thankfully we now use bigger feeding tubes which the milk goes thru in about 40 minutes

Melissa - posted on 05/17/2009

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Quoting Natalie:

I think it's crazy too !! my daughter is 5 months and i still breastfeed on demand, i'm usually up 5 times a night (at the moment more but thats cause her sleep pattern has gone all weird and thats another story ! ha ha ) and it's funny that someone mentioned about the nappies, because although my daughter usually gets up a lot, normally (i say normally because if anyone has seen any of my other posts they will see that i am having a nightmare with my daughter a night at the moment so nothing is what it has been) but usually i dream feed my daughter and because she never usually wakes up I actually got freaked out about the nappy situation and change her about 12am in her sleep as well, some of my friends think i'm mental but i can't stand the idea of her laying in all her toilet all night, it's gross.

On the subject of sleep tho, I can't understand what mum could leave their child crying and not even check if they are hungry let alone just comfort them if they need it, whats wrong with just letting your child know your there for them. some people are nuts !

and thats my two pence's worth !!!



In every way you are so much like myself. I wake my son up still for bum changes as he will blister the first time I dont.(I did try one night when he seemed exhausted)But never again! I change him feed him and hes back in his bed at the most 10 minutes as he usually sleeps through the bum change and he doesnt feed but lately hes been eating more probably due to a growth spurt. It is awesone to find other moms out there like me. Sometimes if he wakes up I just say mommy is here he goes back to sleep I am in no way saying that they are ALWAYS hungry but regardless of there reason whether it may be comfort, food, bum changes. Who are we to say they should not have that after all do we not as adults sometime want the same thing why expect more out of a baby then of yourself.



 



My daughter woke up every hour to feed I did not like that but I did not use CIO at all I slowly got her to feed for five  minutes longer by keeping her awake and made the feed more efficient and that was at 6 months but I believe there is no reason for CIO just would like to add even though I do not use CIO my son does self sooth I place him in his crib clean fed and a bit drowsy 5- 10 min later hes asleep no crying at all because he knows he is safe,

Mel - posted on 05/17/2009

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ive only seen one person on here write that they let their baby go hungry and i was appalled it all, but i dont think its something every mother does

Krista - posted on 05/17/2009

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My son's six months now, and what I wonder is, when he wakes at night (usually only once) is it actually because he's hungry? Or is it out of habit, and he needs that bottle in his mouth to fall asleep, because that's what he's used to? Sometimes if I turn on his lullabies and give him his teddy, he'll fall right asleep again, without crying. In that case, he must not have been hungry. If he keeps crying, I always feed him, but I really don't know if he needs it anymore. I guess I'm just hoping that he'll start sleeping through the night every night and I won't have to wean him off the night time bottle. But, as long as he wakes up crying in the night, I suppose I'll keep waking up and feeding him!

Natalie - posted on 05/17/2009

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I think it's crazy too !! my daughter is 5 months and i still breastfeed on demand, i'm usually up 5 times a night (at the moment more but thats cause her sleep pattern has gone all weird and thats another story ! ha ha ) and it's funny that someone mentioned about the nappies, because although my daughter usually gets up a lot, normally (i say normally because if anyone has seen any of my other posts they will see that i am having a nightmare with my daughter a night at the moment so nothing is what it has been) but usually i dream feed my daughter and because she never usually wakes up I actually got freaked out about the nappy situation and change her about 12am in her sleep as well, some of my friends think i'm mental but i can't stand the idea of her laying in all her toilet all night, it's gross.

On the subject of sleep tho, I can't understand what mum could leave their child crying and not even check if they are hungry let alone just comfort them if they need it, whats wrong with just letting your child know your there for them. some people are nuts !

and thats my two pence's worth !!!

Amanda - posted on 05/17/2009

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Quoting Julia:



Quoting Amanda:




Quoting Julia:





Quoting Amanda:

The difference between babies and pups, babies need to eat at night which is why they wake. it is cruel to make a hungry baby go back to sleep with no food which is what I am talking about in this post.









I don't know anyone who would let their baby CIO with no food if the baby is hungry...I agree....that is cruel. ...I'm not sure where you got the idea that people do that?










Yes, babies know when they are hungry, but are not capable of regulating their hunger patterns. And yes babies know when they are tired, but they are not capable of establishing their own sleep/wake cycles on their own. 










If you train your baby at an early age into a routine your baby CAN sleep through the night  at an early age.as their hunger patterns stabalize.  The reason for this stabilization is that the hunger mechanism (digestion and absorption) operates as if it has a metabolic memory that is reinforced by routine.   These babies establish many restful and continuous periods of sleep.  This nighttime sleep is in addition to the baby's regular naptimes during the day.










It is a lot easier to get a baby into a routine at an early age that try and do it later when it's a bit older/bigger....just as it's easier to train a dog earlier than later...just as it's easier to start to discipline earlier than later. 










Oh and pups need to eat at night too!!!...trust me.










  










 













I actually came across a number of mothers here on circle of moms who believe in letting the baby cry through the night when they wake for food.








I agree a schedual is good. Mine was on a 4 hour schedual from birth and now is demand feed at 10 months.









Why don't you ask the mothers that you've come across why they let their babies cry through the night when they wake for food?? they'll give your answer!






Actually no, they just go on the attack. they claim that babies need sleep to grow, while they also need food and I think food being far more important than sleep. babies will sleep when they are tired. Babies are suposed to be allowed to eat whan they are hungry but some mothers wont allow it. They just let them sleep through without food.



this is wrong. the expectation is wrong.

Julia - posted on 05/17/2009

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Quoting Amanda:



Quoting Julia:




Quoting Amanda:

The difference between babies and pups, babies need to eat at night which is why they wake. it is cruel to make a hungry baby go back to sleep with no food which is what I am talking about in this post.







I don't know anyone who would let their baby CIO with no food if the baby is hungry...I agree....that is cruel. ...I'm not sure where you got the idea that people do that?








Yes, babies know when they are hungry, but are not capable of regulating their hunger patterns. And yes babies know when they are tired, but they are not capable of establishing their own sleep/wake cycles on their own. 








If you train your baby at an early age into a routine your baby CAN sleep through the night  at an early age.as their hunger patterns stabalize.  The reason for this stabilization is that the hunger mechanism (digestion and absorption) operates as if it has a metabolic memory that is reinforced by routine.   These babies establish many restful and continuous periods of sleep.  This nighttime sleep is in addition to the baby's regular naptimes during the day.








It is a lot easier to get a baby into a routine at an early age that try and do it later when it's a bit older/bigger....just as it's easier to train a dog earlier than later...just as it's easier to start to discipline earlier than later. 








Oh and pups need to eat at night too!!!...trust me.








  








 










I actually came across a number of mothers here on circle of moms who believe in letting the baby cry through the night when they wake for food.






I agree a schedual is good. Mine was on a 4 hour schedual from birth and now is demand feed at 10 months.





Why don't you ask the mothers that you've come across why they let their babies cry through the night when they wake for food?? they'll give your answer!

Jacqueline - posted on 05/16/2009

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I have 3 boys youngest 1yr and i never leave him to cry i find he gets too distressed and it is not fair on him or his brothers in the same room. He was breastfed untill 6mth and was sleeping through at 3mth. While i could not imagine not having my baby by my side in those early hours .

Amanda - posted on 05/16/2009

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Quoting Julia:



Quoting Amanda:

The difference between babies and pups, babies need to eat at night which is why they wake. it is cruel to make a hungry baby go back to sleep with no food which is what I am talking about in this post.





I don't know anyone who would let their baby CIO with no food if the baby is hungry...I agree....that is cruel. ...I'm not sure where you got the idea that people do that?






Yes, babies know when they are hungry, but are not capable of regulating their hunger patterns. And yes babies know when they are tired, but they are not capable of establishing their own sleep/wake cycles on their own. 






If you train your baby at an early age into a routine your baby CAN sleep through the night  at an early age.as their hunger patterns stabalize.  The reason for this stabilization is that the hunger mechanism (digestion and absorption) operates as if it has a metabolic memory that is reinforced by routine.   These babies establish many restful and continuous periods of sleep.  This nighttime sleep is in addition to the baby's regular naptimes during the day.






It is a lot easier to get a baby into a routine at an early age that try and do it later when it's a bit older/bigger....just as it's easier to train a dog earlier than later...just as it's easier to start to discipline earlier than later. 






Oh and pups need to eat at night too!!!...trust me.






  






 






I actually came across a number of mothers here on circle of moms who believe in letting the baby cry through the night when they wake for food.



I agree a schedual is good. Mine was on a 4 hour schedual from birth and now is demand feed at 10 months.

Julia - posted on 05/16/2009

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Quoting Amanda:

The difference between babies and pups, babies need to eat at night which is why they wake. it is cruel to make a hungry baby go back to sleep with no food which is what I am talking about in this post.


I don't know anyone who would let their baby CIO with no food if the baby is hungry...I agree....that is cruel. ...I'm not sure where you got the idea that people do that?



Yes, babies know when they are hungry, but are not capable of regulating their hunger patterns. And yes babies know when they are tired, but they are not capable of establishing their own sleep/wake cycles on their own. 



If you train your baby at an early age into a routine your baby CAN sleep through the night  at an early age.as their hunger patterns stabalize.  The reason for this stabilization is that the hunger mechanism (digestion and absorption) operates as if it has a metabolic memory that is reinforced by routine.   These babies establish many restful and continuous periods of sleep.  This nighttime sleep is in addition to the baby's regular naptimes during the day.



It is a lot easier to get a baby into a routine at an early age that try and do it later when it's a bit older/bigger....just as it's easier to train a dog earlier than later...just as it's easier to start to discipline earlier than later. 



Oh and pups need to eat at night too!!!...trust me.



  



 

Mel - posted on 05/15/2009

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oh with regards to the nappies, alot of babies sleep even 13 hours from birth and obviously you are not going to just wake them up to change their nappy during the night if you are sleeping peacefully. mine has gone 12 hours without nappy changes as long as i can remember overnight and has never had nappy rash. this is because if we woke her to do feeds at midnight then she would not go back to sleep as she would have had to much sleep by the time we woke her up. we would get her out the cot feed her over and hour and a half then put her back in bed still sleeping.

Mel - posted on 05/15/2009

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Quoting Brittany:



Quoting Melissa:

Cant believe that Melissa im shocked reading it. thats really bad, its like something you should be able to take legal action against. When i had mine at 18 i got accused of wanting to leave the hospital to take drugs and they lectured me on breast feeding and taking drugs. I was pretty shocked myself that they coud even think that. I didnt have the best experience at the hospital mine was asleep all day and awake all nigth every night crying and i mean she did not even sleep for a few seconds or minutes just all night i didnt get why because i was so sore from feeding her, and they just kept on telling me to keep feeding her for the whole week i was in there. I later found out she has a tongue tie and id been starving her for 3 weeks hence the reason she was losing weight. Why dont they check for these things in every hospital? Alot of people i know that is the first thing they notice , my child health nurse 3 weeks later at my first check up said well she has a tongue tie so thats why you need to get her on formula for weight gain and she needs to be bottle fed, whether i express or formula feed. she wanted me to do half half but i feel so terrible shes been starving for 3 weeks i did all formula i wanted to make her feel happy and not hungry and not like i was starving her. she gained 90 grams over night and slept so much better. I was disgusted with that hospital i know she wont remember it but she was so weak they told me she had a "weak cry" as well. im disgusted with everything my baby was put through for 4 months thru lack of doing tests.





I am so apalled at the hospitals you and Melissa went to. I had a great hospital. They didn't even have a nursery, the baby stays with mom all the time. The mom can ask the nurses to watch the baby while they get some sleep but I didn't. I wanted my daughter with me at all times. They only took her out of the room to give her a spongebath and to give her tests. what kind of tests did your hospital do? Mine did a newborn screening test for hereditary diseases/ disorders and they even did a hearing test. We have to go back and get both done again but the hospital did them to begin with.





I had to get the rubella again before i left so i got that injection and they did the hearing test for mine and the needles at birth that they do. Im not exactly sure of anything else.

Amanda - posted on 05/15/2009

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The difference between babies and pups, babies need to eat at night which is why they wake. it is cruel to make a hungry baby go back to sleep with no food which is what I am talking about in this post.

Julia - posted on 05/15/2009

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This might sound strange to a few people and I don't mean to offend anyone by writing this...these are my thoughts as a Veterinary Nurse who has seen many dogs and done puppy training and SPCA work.



It is far easier to train a puppy the right way from an early age with the right environment and structure to their day they become a very obedient, happy dog with a good nature. If you take a dog that is a bit older who is passed the ideal training age it becomes a lot harder (but possible) and a lot more work for the owner to train that dog.



If I can relate that to bringing up a baby (not saying that we are animals and should be treated like one) but with the whole training/guiding a baby to sleep/eat in a routine (except for growth spurts) It is a whole heap easier to start from when they are little...and when I mean little I mean from when you milk comes in and settles down. You hardly have to use the CIO method as they mold easy into routine (healthy babies I'm talking about) ...why wait until they are older when it's harder and they are more knowing to start to teach them to self sooth and sleep longer??...that to me is more harsh on the child than on a baby.

Amanda - posted on 05/15/2009

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Quoting Erin:



Quoting Sara:

Erin, I agree with you. While I think that young babies should not be sleep trained, I do believe that around 6 or 7 months you need to decide where and how you want them to sleep. I wanted my daughter to sleep in her own room, in her own crib. I wanted her to be able to soothe herself to sleep, and I think that's very appropriate. But, you're right, expecting a 1 month old or even a three or four month old to sleep is unrealistic...I'm not sure where people get this idea from?






Hey just wanted to clarify what I meant by 'sleep training'.... As I said,  for us, this applied to the daytime sleeps rather than at night. And this issue wasn't to get her to sleep LONGER but to get her to sleep AT ALL lol. Until she was 9 weeks old and I began to teach her to self-soothe my daughter only slept in my arms through the day, maybe in the bouncer with the vibrate on, and even then only for 10-20 mins. As you can imagine this made for a very tired, cranky baby. So my decision to sleep train so young was purely for my daughter's benefit. Like you, my aim was to get her to settle herself off to sleep in her cot, and we achieved this within a couple of days. I never let her Cry It Out, in fact she really didn't get distressed at all. If she did cry I stood with her and patted and 'sshhhh'ed her til she calmed down, then she would drop off. It was honestly the best thing I could ever have done, as my daughter is now much happier, but I certainly don't agree with forcing a strict routine on young babies.





Nap training is what you are talking baout. this is perfectly acceptable and is nothing like CIO through the night.

Erin - posted on 05/15/2009

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Quoting Sara:

Erin, I agree with you. While I think that young babies should not be sleep trained, I do believe that around 6 or 7 months you need to decide where and how you want them to sleep. I wanted my daughter to sleep in her own room, in her own crib. I wanted her to be able to soothe herself to sleep, and I think that's very appropriate. But, you're right, expecting a 1 month old or even a three or four month old to sleep is unrealistic...I'm not sure where people get this idea from?



Hey just wanted to clarify what I meant by 'sleep training'.... As I said,  for us, this applied to the daytime sleeps rather than at night. And this issue wasn't to get her to sleep LONGER but to get her to sleep AT ALL lol. Until she was 9 weeks old and I began to teach her to self-soothe my daughter only slept in my arms through the day, maybe in the bouncer with the vibrate on, and even then only for 10-20 mins. As you can imagine this made for a very tired, cranky baby. So my decision to sleep train so young was purely for my daughter's benefit. Like you, my aim was to get her to settle herself off to sleep in her cot, and we achieved this within a couple of days. I never let her Cry It Out, in fact she really didn't get distressed at all. If she did cry I stood with her and patted and 'sshhhh'ed her til she calmed down, then she would drop off. It was honestly the best thing I could ever have done, as my daughter is now much happier, but I certainly don't agree with forcing a strict routine on young babies.

Sara - posted on 05/15/2009

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Erin, I agree with you. While I think that young babies should not be sleep trained, I do believe that around 6 or 7 months you need to decide where and how you want them to sleep. I wanted my daughter to sleep in her own room, in her own crib. I wanted her to be able to soothe herself to sleep, and I think that's very appropriate. But, you're right, expecting a 1 month old or even a three or four month old to sleep is unrealistic...I'm not sure where people get this idea from?

Brittany - posted on 05/15/2009

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Quoting Melissa:

Cant believe that Melissa im shocked reading it. thats really bad, its like something you should be able to take legal action against. When i had mine at 18 i got accused of wanting to leave the hospital to take drugs and they lectured me on breast feeding and taking drugs. I was pretty shocked myself that they coud even think that. I didnt have the best experience at the hospital mine was asleep all day and awake all nigth every night crying and i mean she did not even sleep for a few seconds or minutes just all night i didnt get why because i was so sore from feeding her, and they just kept on telling me to keep feeding her for the whole week i was in there. I later found out she has a tongue tie and id been starving her for 3 weeks hence the reason she was losing weight. Why dont they check for these things in every hospital? Alot of people i know that is the first thing they notice , my child health nurse 3 weeks later at my first check up said well she has a tongue tie so thats why you need to get her on formula for weight gain and she needs to be bottle fed, whether i express or formula feed. she wanted me to do half half but i feel so terrible shes been starving for 3 weeks i did all formula i wanted to make her feel happy and not hungry and not like i was starving her. she gained 90 grams over night and slept so much better. I was disgusted with that hospital i know she wont remember it but she was so weak they told me she had a "weak cry" as well. im disgusted with everything my baby was put through for 4 months thru lack of doing tests.


I am so apalled at the hospitals you and Melissa went to. I had a great hospital. They didn't even have a nursery, the baby stays with mom all the time. The mom can ask the nurses to watch the baby while they get some sleep but I didn't. I wanted my daughter with me at all times. They only took her out of the room to give her a spongebath and to give her tests. what kind of tests did your hospital do? Mine did a newborn screening test for hereditary diseases/ disorders and they even did a hearing test. We have to go back and get both done again but the hospital did them to begin with.

Brittany - posted on 05/15/2009

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My baby is 3 weeks old. I let her cry when she just wants to be held and i have to do school work or clean (if she cries for more than 5 minutes I pick her up) but I couldn't imagine letting her cry if she's hungry. When I let her cry for 5minutes it's after making sure she's not hungry, doesn't need a diaper, doesn't need to be burped, and doesn't want her pacifier. But I'm lucky because she does sleep through most of the night, i usually give her a bottle at 10 or 11 and then she sleeps until 4. I make sure she's eating the right amount during the day though. I agree that letting a baby cry when they are hungry, need a diaper, or need to be burped is borderline abuse if not straight abuse.

Amanda - posted on 05/15/2009

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Sometimes I get up at night to use the washroom or get a glass of water. My 10 month old sleeps through most of the night from 7pm to 7am which she just started doing a few weeks ago. prior to that she was up every night every 4 hours or so. now she gets up at 10pm for 6 ounces and again at 5 am for another 6 which typicaly takes not more than 10-15 minutes to finish than she is back to sleep. sometimes she just wants a swallow to wet her mouth and then she falls back to sleep. Mine will not sleep in a wet diaper and will scream until it is changed. That is one thing that botherd me about these "my baby sleeps soundly for 12 hours" people. they dont change the diaper that whole time! since we all know how often a young infant wets this can cause a big problem. I have a child in my daycare that sleeps from 6 pm to 5 am without a bottle or diaper and when I change her in the morning at 5:30am her bum is usally red with specks of blood. I cant imagine how painful that is for her.

Chantel - posted on 05/15/2009

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I thought about posting this same thing, lol:) I never tried to force my daughter to sleep through the night. I wished she would at some times but I never did CIO. She started sleeping through on her own at 9 months. Also about the hospital thing, they never took her from me for any amount of time at all. Erin, I agree with you about the hunger thing. I had so many people tell me to stop feeding her at night and let her cry it out because she doesn't "need" a bottle at night after six months. I hated that. She gave it up on her own and we're all fine.

Melissa - posted on 05/15/2009

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Erin that is a good point how babies are judged. They are definately compared to other babies when people try to do that to me I just reply I am sorry I had a baby he will be a baby for as long as he can I can never get this time back. They typically leave me alone then. lol

Mel - posted on 05/15/2009

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thats an awesome post Erin, ive heard many mention these books where they teach babies how to get into a routine from birth. sounds interesting and something id love to have a look at if i did not live in australia. i wonder what they recommend to help babies learn how to self soothe and sleep through at that age.

Erin - posted on 05/15/2009

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It seems that sleeping through the night has become the standard by which all babies are judged, and I find it a bit ridiculous. I was blessed with a baby who has 'slept through' from the night we came home from hospital (6-7 hour stretches initially) and now, at 3 months, sleeps 6pm-6am. Because of this everyone oohs and aahhs and assumes she is a 'good' baby (how can there be a 'bad' baby?!?!?!). I smile and acknowlege that yes, I am lucky, but she in fact can be quite difficult at times (she is extremely loud and intense when upset) and suffered badly with colic til about 10 weeks. The reponse I get is always the same - 'oh but she sleeps through the night'... Yes she does, but it is through nothing I have done. I have engaged in some sleep training with her to set a solid routine for her naps during the day (not involving letting her cry it out), but the long blocks of sleep at night have been all her own doing. I truly believe babies will go all night without a feed and 'sleep through' when they're ready, and agree trying to force the issue is unfair. We wouldn't like being told to go to bed hungry! Obviously there are things we can do to encourage good sleeping habits. If a baby knows how to self-soothe (which we can help them to learn), and they wake during the night but aren't hungry they can go back off happily - my daughter does this a lot of nights. But on the odd occasion, like last night, she will not go back to sleep and wants a feed. Fine. I don't withhold the bottle because I know she can go all night without it. Our hunger patterns are not set in stone.. why should theirs be??

Julia - posted on 05/15/2009

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I think it's because when our Grannies and Mums had their babies they were allowed to stay in the hosptials for up to 3 weeks if they wanted. They also fed their babies on a schedule (thanks to the midwifes in the hospital it was easy to do as they took the babies away to the nursary so the mums didn't have to hear her baby cry) When they got home with their baby after a couple of weeks the baby was in a good routine.



I believe that getting your baby into a good feeding routine at the start will help with getting a baby to sleep through the night by an early age (some a little earlier and some a bit later) These days everyone is being told to demand feed so the babies aren't in firm routine...hence the lack of long sleep during the nights.



So in answer to your question...the mothers that think they 'must sleep through the night' is probably because they know it is possible for a baby to sleep through the night..BUT..I do not agree with letting them cry without a feed....knowing that they've been fed I would let them cry or knowing that they've slept through the night and there is nothing wrong I would let them cry too. Everyone has their own standards...don't let it affect you and your way of parenting...you are the mother and it's your life..do what works for you and your baby.

Cathelijn - posted on 05/15/2009

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I Agree with the original post about mums expecting their babies to sleep through but I think a lot has to do with society, like Kylie said lots of people do lie and say their baby sleeps through because they feel that because everyones baby seems to sleep through their baby should as well and as soon as you say your baby doesn't sleep through people feel sorry for you. I was lucky that my daughter started sleeping through at about 10 weeks ( 6 hours a night) now she can sleep up to 12 hours but sometimes still wakes up to eat I don't mind ofcourse I like my sleep but I know it is not something I can do or want to do something about. I also Co-sleep but I don't like to tell people about it because they all look at me like I am crazy! I wish mum's would be more honest with eachother that's why I am so happy with circle of mums!



P.S Maybe it is just here in the UK but if you had a normal birth and you and your baby are happy and healthy you can leave after 6 hours! My daughter was born at 2 AM and I left the hospital at 4 PM just because it took a long time for the doctor to come and check the baby. No one took my baby anywhere she stayed with me the whole time..

Mel - posted on 05/14/2009

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Cant believe that Melissa im shocked reading it. thats really bad, its like something you should be able to take legal action against. When i had mine at 18 i got accused of wanting to leave the hospital to take drugs and they lectured me on breast feeding and taking drugs. I was pretty shocked myself that they coud even think that. I didnt have the best experience at the hospital mine was asleep all day and awake all nigth every night crying and i mean she did not even sleep for a few seconds or minutes just all night i didnt get why because i was so sore from feeding her, and they just kept on telling me to keep feeding her for the whole week i was in there. I later found out she has a tongue tie and id been starving her for 3 weeks hence the reason she was losing weight. Why dont they check for these things in every hospital? Alot of people i know that is the first thing they notice , my child health nurse 3 weeks later at my first check up said well she has a tongue tie so thats why you need to get her on formula for weight gain and she needs to be bottle fed, whether i express or formula feed. she wanted me to do half half but i feel so terrible shes been starving for 3 weeks i did all formula i wanted to make her feel happy and not hungry and not like i was starving her. she gained 90 grams over night and slept so much better. I was disgusted with that hospital i know she wont remember it but she was so weak they told me she had a "weak cry" as well. im disgusted with everything my baby was put through for 4 months thru lack of doing tests.

Melissa - posted on 05/14/2009

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I had my first I was 18 the nurses too her and I begged to let her sleep in my room the nurse replied with I was stoo young.. I was mad but I let it go knowwing they were already thinking of making us stay for 5 days so I thought better to just agree they were supposed to brring her to me every 3 hours as she was small...I woke up two hours later stayed up to wait and still 2 hours after that no baby I began to think and worry this whole time but I told myself they were possibly busy so I got up over to the nursery I could see in the next room a bunch of nurses watching movie and my baby along with others were screaming so I grabbed mine and left they didnt come to my room for hours later till the next shift started needless to say I complained how I was able to take my baby un noticed... Hospitals should not have nurseys unless it is under 3 hours .... In Canada right from birth till six months we are told to feed on demand my health nurse would probably slap me if I said I want a new born to cry it out and sleep through the night.. Id have CPS here the next day!

Kylie - posted on 05/14/2009

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sorry Melissa i didn't mean 2 hours so mum can recover i meant the whole night for the first 3 days in hospital

Mel - posted on 05/14/2009

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well in response to Kylie, a women who has just spend a day or more in labour and given birth should be allowed to sleep before having to take care of her child, look at what she has just gone thru, this is why they take the child away for 2 hours to let the mum get the rest she needs to take care of her baby.

i do find it odd that people do ask how do I get my one month old to sleep through the night. You sure feel like saying well dont have a baby if you dont want to look after it, your baby is hungry you idiot. But we have to try and be respectful. If you baby sleeps through fanatastic if not deal with it, its called mother hood. Letting them cry it out with out feeding them at this age is borderline abuse

Kylie - posted on 05/14/2009

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Good question Amanda. I’ve though about this for a while. Maybe it stems from those hospitals that take newborns away from their mothers and put them in the nursery overnight so the Mum can sleep which ultimately sets up unrealistic expectations or perhaps it has to do with western society in general. I get asked often by strangers and friends if my baby is a “good baby” and by that they mean is he sleeping though. Even people who don’t have children ask me if my baby is sleeping through the night like this is the first successful parenting milestone. When I say no he’s up a few times a night for a feed or cuddle I get the “ohh your poor thing! You must be so exhausted, have you let him cry yet?!” With my first baby, some mums at my young mothers group lied and said their babies were sleeping through because they didn’t want to look like bad mothers. I also hid the fact that I co-slept because I was young and afraid to be judged negatively.

I think lots of people have made a lot of money by using this “sleeping through” myth to con parents into buying into their “sleep system” of training their baby to stay asleep for the whole night. I’ve seen people on this site say things like babies need a solid10-12 hours straight sleep so they can develop correctly. Imagine how that makes a new mum with a baby up every 2-3 hours throughout the night feel.

I think babies will sleep through when they are ready and it’s so selfish and cruel of mothers to force young babies 6 months and under to sleep longer by leaving them to cry it out or withhold feeds in the night. As I keep saying.. who ever said parenting was a 12 hour a day job!?

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