Still breastfeeding a 3 yr old...should I stop?

Chantel - posted on 05/05/2009

Quoting Christina :

Thank you for your note. I just joined this moment logged on and here you are. I have the same problem and am battling. My son is 39 months and wants to nurse to sleep and when he wakes up in the middle of the night. It is momentary but it has been a sleep dependency. I try to stop him, have talks, hide in the house you name I have tried it nothing works. As a baby he had a lot of health issues that warranted me to walk the floor hold him and stay up around the clock. I often battle with feeling like I am failing because it is not the "norm" . No one in my family has ever breastfed so it is like living a secret. lol I guess I wonder do they ever wean? I worry about his sleep patterns and him waking twice a night calling for me.

Some babies wake until they wean!  It is normal and natural behavior.  There is nothing wrong.  As a matter of fact, even those who "think" their babies sleep through the night, don't.  They wake several times a night.  If they don't have needs they will gently fall back asleep, if they have needs but are used to them not being met (ignored) then they will self sooth or fuss and cry themselves back to sleep.

Each child has a different need for sleep, some sleep long deep hours, some sleep light, some nap and some never nap....each child is an individual human being with individual needs. 

I always find it funny how we want our children to meet adult needs and fit in to adult lives, but adults often do not give the baby the respect that they expect themselves.....

Anyway, I wouldn't worry about it.  When you wean he may still wake, but that is normal too.  Out of 4 children, I had 2 good sleepers and 2 not so good sleepers, we all survived and worked around each child's needs as they came.

Christina - posted on 05/04/2009

Thank you for your note. I just joined this moment logged on and here you are. I have the same problem and am battling. My son is 39 months and wants to nurse to sleep and when he wakes up in the middle of the night. It is momentary but it has been a sleep dependency. I try to stop him, have talks, hide in the house you name I have tried it nothing works. As a baby he had a lot of health issues that warranted me to walk the floor hold him and stay up around the clock. I often battle with feeling like I am failing because it is not the "norm" . No one in my family has ever breastfed so it is like living a secret. lol I guess I wonder do they ever wean? I worry about his sleep patterns and him waking twice a night calling for me.

Bessie - posted on 05/04/2009

is allright!!!!!
my did it with me until i was 5, i m planning to do less but,the doctor says, do it as soon as you want and you can!!!!!

Hannah - posted on 05/04/2009

I think you guys should do whats best for you. Dont worry about what other people do or how they react to your behavior. If you guys still love it and it feels right keep it up.

Chantel - posted on 05/04/2009

 Example: I just had my baby 3 months ago. I'm now getting bills from the hospital of thousands of dollars b/c the hospital is telling me they do not participate with my health insurance so therefore they will not except the insurance payment. I am ultimately responsible to pay these bills. Americans have a VERY screwed up system!

 

Check with your insurance company, pregnant women are exempt by insurance switching during pregnancy, if you were preregistered before the switch OR that is the facility where your provider has privileges, your insurance company is obligated to pay the fees, although you may have to self submit the bills once the hospital sends them to you.

Contact management in your insurance company to find out, find out when the hospital stopped contracting with your insurance and if it was within your pregnancy, especially within the last 3 months of your pregnancy they should have to pay the bill.

It will take a bit of leg work on your part, but it is worth it. 

On that note, in the US the average midwife makes 3000-5000 dollars a birth, and has a masters degree in nursing and internship, and spend approximately 13-20 hours with each client including prenatal and birth.  The average OB makes between 5000-10000 dollars a birth and spends approx. 2 hours and 45 minutes including prenatal and birth with their patients, although it might be 3.5-4 hours with a surgical birth, but then they get paid more.

The average hospital non complicated vaginal birth in the US costs 10000 dollars on top of OB costs. whereas birth center births are often 8000 dollars including the prenatal care by midwife and birth services and a homebirth is only the cost of midwife and maybe doula if you hire one.

Amazing huh????

Heather - posted on 05/04/2009

Quoting Kate:

I find it very strange that the WIC (what does that stand for?) program offers formula full stop. Those with low income and few resources to pay for medical care are the ones who stand to benefit most from increased rates of breastfeeding!! I wonder if there's kickbacks from the formula companies for whoever set this up?

Nicole - is it automatic that every person eligible for WIC is offered formula for their babies?

Here, support for bottle feeding is only offered if the mother flat out refuses any support for breastfeeding and insists that she has chosen formula. There's a real pro-breastfeeding push from the Australian Government (though some say that's waned since 2001 when the breastfeeding initiative ended and wasn't replaced or renewed), nonetheless, many of the pro-BF policies remain. I think it's primarily because government recognises the public health benefits (and therefore economic and productive benefits) to increased rates of breastfeeding. There's still improvements to be made, however. Some of the Scandinavian countries have discharge BFing rates of 98%. That's awesome!

Do you guys have maternal child and health visits at community health centres after the baby is born to ensure baby is growing well and mother is coping ok? What about immunisations? Are they government or privately funded?

What happens if someone is pregnant, and earns, say $25,000, but can't afford to pay for a hospital birth? Do they just give birth at home? Sorry.. so many questions, I'm very interested in how it all works........

WIC stands for " Women, Infants, and Children" It is a food and nutrition service set up by the government. It is a Federal grant program for which Congress authorizes a specific amount of funds each year for the program. Not everyone can participate in this program. First you have to apply. Then you are placed on a waiting list, in which then the WIC agent or government paid employee selects individuals by level of priority. (who is at greater need for the program) In order to be appoved you must fall into a certain criteria. You are eligible if you are a women who is pregnant or breastfeeding (only up until the infants first year), Infants up until their first year, and Children up until their 5th birthday. AND you must meet income requirements. Income depends on how many individuals are in the household. For example: If it's a couple with one child, your income has to be less than $32,500 a year, which is only $2,700 a month for 3 people to live off of. (to add a  member of the household you add $6,600 to the income for each member) If you are then "lucky" enough to get excepted (keeping in mind that you have to be in pretty bad shape to get approved) Then you are issued something like a government ticket to go and purchase food/formula items. Which is also limited by a specific list of foods that you may use the tickets on.(you can not use the ticket on all grocery items, only selected things) These tickets are only handed out to you monthly, so individuals must me very careful to budget what food they need for the month and what they can buy using the tickets.

The WIC program does not provide any medical care. Medical care is again another program in which you must qualify in order to receive. Immunitations and baby well visits are all privately paid unless you have health insurance from like your employer (that you may pay for out of your pay checks) or pay into a company or you are in a government funded program. Hospitalization for births are again the same. Also, even if you have insurance you are not always guaranteed payment of services. Example: I just had my baby 3 months ago. I'm now getting bills from the hospital of thousands of dollars b/c the hospital is telling me they do not participate with my health insurance so therefore they will not except the insurance payment. I am ultimately responsible to pay these bills. Americans have a VERY screwed up system!

Another point, I know that  these past years there has been a bigger push on advocating breastfeeding more and more. However, the government does not stress it enough. There is little education, especially with lower income communities. They make it too easy to give up on breastfeeding. Also, I find Americans very lazy people. It's too hard to breastfeed. With our fast paced lifestyles we don't have time to bond with our babies. Isn't just so much easier to mix up a bottle and shove it in their mouths.

Chantel - posted on 05/04/2009

Quoting Kate:

I find it very strange that the WIC (what does that stand for?) program offers formula full stop. Those with low income and few resources to pay for medical care are the ones who stand to benefit most from increased rates of breastfeeding!! I wonder if there's kickbacks from the formula companies for whoever set this up?

Nicole - is it automatic that every person eligible for WIC is offered formula for their babies?

Here, support for bottle feeding is only offered if the mother flat out refuses any support for breastfeeding and insists that she has chosen formula. There's a real pro-breastfeeding push from the Australian Government (though some say that's waned since 2001 when the breastfeeding initiative ended and wasn't replaced or renewed), nonetheless, many of the pro-BF policies remain. I think it's primarily because government recognises the public health benefits (and therefore economic and productive benefits) to increased rates of breastfeeding. There's still improvements to be made, however. Some of the Scandinavian countries have discharge BFing rates of 98%. That's awesome!

Do you guys have maternal child and health visits at community health centres after the baby is born to ensure baby is growing well and mother is coping ok? What about immunisations? Are they government or privately funded?

What happens if someone is pregnant, and earns, say $25,000, but can't afford to pay for a hospital birth? Do they just give birth at home? Sorry.. so many questions, I'm very interested in how it all works........

No WIC is health and income based.  Yes, WIC has some pro breastfeeding education and support, but they are also a strong supporter of artificial milk.  It is a government program.

Currently our stats in the US are 60% of mothers breastfeed at the time of birth and 40% breastfeed at approximately 6 months.  It falls drastically from there.

Many medical providers and nurses do not know factual breastfeeding information and are not breastfeeding friendly!  It is a sad fact of generations of formula feeding.  There is a government movement to support breastfeeding but it is VERY weak.  The majority of the issue is that to be politically correct we can not "force" infants to be breastfed and must offer artificial milk options without inference.  Formula is big business.

Only those at high risk and those on state medical assistance get home visits on regular basis.  Many of them do not have the information to support breastfeeding and many support supplementation.  Quite a bit of the medical community completely disregard Le Leche and other breastfeeding support groups as militant.

Add to that that in the US, many mothers work and maternity leave is only up to 6 weeks for most working women, breastfeeding is not supported in daycares and workplaces and while it is protected by law, many women suffer abuse when breastfeeding in public.

There are public government funded health programs, immunization programs push childhood immunizations, but it is the parents right to refuse or delay for medical, religious and in some states conscience reasons.

80% of births occur in hospital.  Those without insurance are covered by state aid during pregnancy if they can not afford care.  Hospital birth is the norm here, and it should be.  Birthcenter and homebirth outcomes for non-risk and low risk pregnancies is healthier, safer and more mother/baby centered.  More women who birthcenter or homebirth breastfeed and breastfeed longer!

We all must remember that doctors and nurses are trained, and that training is medically based.  Birth and breastfeeding are not medical events!!!!!  Midwives are trained in birth, some trained in breastfeeding...there are birth and postpartum doulas who specialize in the non medical care of birthing women, but insurance does not cover this care.  Obstetricians are gynecological surgical specialists. 

Chantel - posted on 05/04/2009

I'm not sure where all of you are getting your info. except for Kate. My advice is to find web sites with better credentials! It looks like we are all on an agreement that breastmilk is the best, except for Chelsea who thinks you should just stop breastfeeding and start on cows milk. First of all you don't need to stop breastfeeding just b/c you have introduced cows milk, which should NOT be started until 12 month according to AAP.  If your child still wants to nurse and your okay with it, continue, there is NO harm. Quoting from AAP "There is no upper limit to the duration of breastfeeding and no evidence of psychologic or developmental harm from breastfeeding into the third year of life or longer."

Secondly,  skim and 2% (low-fat) milk have NO place in the diet. They supply too much protein, potassium, and sodium and not enough calories for the growing children. Children need the fat for proper growth and development, including brain development. AAP recommended 16-20oz of WHOLE milk for toddlers ages 1-2 yrs. Suggested intake for children 2-5 yrs old is 6 servings/day. Which is a variety of milk, yogurt, pudding, cheese, cottage cheese, ect.. And of course we should all be considering organic diary products to stay away from all those antibiotics and hormones.  

World health organization indicates breastfeeding until 2 years old or beyond. 

To be completely factual, children and humans DO NOT need to drink bovine/cow milk EVER.  Most adults are lactose intolerant and drinking bovine milk causes many more problems than the small amount of digestible calcium it contains and humans do not need fat in the form of bovine milk!

A nutritionally rich diet will supply all of the fat necessary.  If you absolutely need to drink a "milk " product, grain or vegetable juices will suffice.

What humans do need to drink is water....

Yogurt, cheeses and other cultured bovine products are healthy and safe in small amounts for most people. 

Itsamystery - posted on 05/04/2009

I find it very strange that the WIC (what does that stand for?) program offers formula full stop. Those with low income and few resources to pay for medical care are the ones who stand to benefit most from increased rates of breastfeeding!! I wonder if there's kickbacks from the formula companies for whoever set this up?

Nicole - is it automatic that every person eligible for WIC is offered formula for their babies?

Here, support for bottle feeding is only offered if the mother flat out refuses any support for breastfeeding and insists that she has chosen formula. There's a real pro-breastfeeding push from the Australian Government (though some say that's waned since 2001 when the breastfeeding initiative ended and wasn't replaced or renewed), nonetheless, many of the pro-BF policies remain. I think it's primarily because government recognises the public health benefits (and therefore economic and productive benefits) to increased rates of breastfeeding. There's still improvements to be made, however. Some of the Scandinavian countries have discharge BFing rates of 98%. That's awesome!

Do you guys have maternal child and health visits at community health centres after the baby is born to ensure baby is growing well and mother is coping ok? What about immunisations? Are they government or privately funded?

What happens if someone is pregnant, and earns, say $25,000, but can't afford to pay for a hospital birth? Do they just give birth at home? Sorry.. so many questions, I'm very interested in how it all works........

Heather - posted on 05/03/2009

Quoting Kate:

It's a bit different where I live (in Australia), most of our hospitals are pro-breastfeeding and have policies to promote breastfeeding (rooming-in, no artificial nipples, no formula offered, etc). Some hospitals will not let mum & baby go home until they have a good latch going (unless mum refuses to breastfeed). There are of course aberrations to this but 83% of mums in Australia are breastfeeding on discharge. It drops down to 54% at 3 months and 32% at six months - although this figure is affected by early introduction of solids (ie more than 32% of mothers are breastfeeding at 6 months, but not exclusively). I have never had discouragement from breastfeeding or picked up any cues that breastfeeding isn't socially acceptable. So I think over here, our problem might be lack of follow up support and information about growth spurts, etc.

I think the reason some people choose 6 months as the time to stop is because they hear that babies should breastfeed for at least 6 months and this creates a mental marker for when to stop (same with the information that says cows milk is safe after the first year - people take this as 'i should switch over to cows milk at 1 months). Without any other information they might assume there are no further benefits. they assume that this is the time to stop.

Do you think it's plausible that since there's little public health coverage in the US, the government has little incentive to promote increased breastfeeding? (correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not very educated about the US health system, have just heard stories that if you don't have private health insurance over there, then you have trouble accessing medical care, so have assumed there isn't much public health care)

Kate you don't have to be well educated about the US to know that our health care system is corrupt!! Just read Nicole's comment about WIC...whats the point of giving these low income family's only 80% of the formula that babies actually need??? They are setting these poor family's up for problems. Of course the family's are going to try and stretch out the formula b/c they can't afford the other 20% needed!! One thing Nicole didn't mention is you have to be dirt poor to even get help like this through the government. Forget it if you actually have a job but just need a little help to get by. If you make more than $20,000 a year you can not get help. I want to know what family could actually live off of $20,000 a year? We definitely need more education and better promotion for breastfeeding. But right now our government is only worried about one thing...$

Heather - posted on 05/03/2009

Quoting Nicole:

Quoting Teresa:

Quoting Kate:

Quoting Chelsea:

you should stop and start her on cow's milk, she needs the fat to grow

actually, the milk of mothers who have breastfed longer than 12 months has 17% fat, compared to only 4% fat in whole cows milk. http://www.medicineonline.com/news/10/61...

Isn't it still recommended for children over the age of 2 to switch to 2% or skim milk?  The child in the OP is 3, so having cow's milk for the fat makes no sense.

I realized after quoting that I should've just quoted the first part.... Oops. :)

Actually, it is recommended that children over two to switch to 1% or skim.  And I totally agree that breastmilk is a much better fat source than cow's milk.

I'm not sure where all of you are getting your info. except for Kate. My advice is to find web sites with better credentials! It looks like we are all on an agreement that breastmilk is the best, except for Chelsea who thinks you should just stop breastfeeding and start on cows milk. First of all you don't need to stop breastfeeding just b/c you have introduced cows milk, which should NOT be started until 12 month according to AAP.  If your child still wants to nurse and your okay with it, continue, there is NO harm. Quoting from AAP "There is no upper limit to the duration of breastfeeding and no evidence of psychologic or developmental harm from breastfeeding into the third year of life or longer."

Secondly,  skim and 2% (low-fat) milk have NO place in the diet. They supply too much protein, potassium, and sodium and not enough calories for the growing children. Children need the fat for proper growth and development, including brain development. AAP recommended 16-20oz of WHOLE milk for toddlers ages 1-2 yrs. Suggested intake for children 2-5 yrs old is 6 servings/day. Which is a variety of milk, yogurt, pudding, cheese, cottage cheese, ect.. And of course we should all be considering organic diary products to stay away from all those antibiotics and hormones.  

Itsamystery - posted on 05/03/2009

I've never heard the recommendation to switch to skim.. who recommends that? I too agree that Breastmilk is a better fat source, as long as mom's diet isn't high in trans and saturated fats, as the fats mom eats affects the kind of fat in the breastmilk. Just another reason to stick to wholesome, healthy foods :)

Nicole - posted on 05/03/2009

Quoting Teresa:

Quoting Kate:

Quoting Chelsea:

you should stop and start her on cow's milk, she needs the fat to grow

actually, the milk of mothers who have breastfed longer than 12 months has 17% fat, compared to only 4% fat in whole cows milk. http://www.medicineonline.com/news/10/61...

Isn't it still recommended for children over the age of 2 to switch to 2% or skim milk?  The child in the OP is 3, so having cow's milk for the fat makes no sense.

I realized after quoting that I should've just quoted the first part.... Oops. :)

Actually, it is recommended that children over two to switch to 1% or skim.  And I totally agree that breastmilk is a much better fat source than cow's milk.

Nicole - posted on 05/03/2009

Quoting Fiona:

Nicole, perhaps u could give some advice on transferring from boob to milk. My daughter doesnt like formula or cows milk so I dont have an alternative to BF at the moment. She has never had a dummy bt has fond an old bottle teat from when I had to supplement when she was young and seems to chew on it so I am going to try a bottle of milk or water with that teat and see if she will swap it for boob at least during the day. Any suggestions? also ptting her to bed worries me as she only settles on the boob. HELP!

I really hate to say this when you are already stressed out about this situation, but I don't recommend giving a bottle at all in this situation.  It sounds like she is old enough to drink from a "sippy" cup.  I would try putting milk in a cup and make it real exciting that she is going to try to drink from a new cup.  Yay!  That may work, but if she refuses the milk, you can try to put breastmilk (if you have any expressed or are able to express) in the cup and make that exciting as well.  I would try these kind of things first, before giving a bottle.  At her age, giving a bottle may be more of a hassle than you know.

If she doesn't seem to get excited about the cup, you can set boundries and not nurse during the day and only nurse at night.  She may struggle with you, but she will soon understand that during the day, she has to take the cup and gets to nurse at bedtime.

I always try to encourage child-led weaning, but also think it is a good idea to set boundries, once the child is old enough.  And if you really want to make the switch, try getting her excited about the cup and then you have to set boundries. 

Let me know how things go...

Oh... and I think we should do one thing at a time...  Try to tackle weaning from the bedtime routine later, because she really needs a milk source and if it's not your's, it needs to be cow's and I would be too concerned if you stop cold turkey and she still refuses other milk.  Once she accepts cow's milk (however that will be), then we will try to tackle one of the hardest things in the weaning process: bedtime.

Nicole, CLC, BFPC

Melissa - posted on 05/03/2009

I think you are awesome! If both you and your child are still interested in nursing, then you should keep at it. WHen trying to wean my 18 month old in January (I was 9 months pregnant) my lactation consultant said "don't offer, don't refuse..." So I could tell my little guy was ready when I gradually decreased the feedings and he didn't ask to nurse more. This was good advice, when you think you're ready. I also think that your breastmilk helps your child no matter what- when you are exposed to a bug, you will develop antibodies to it and pass them on to your child in your milk. It definitely makes a difference. ANd finally, don't wean just because other people tell you that you should- it's what is best for you and your child that should determine what you do. Have you attended any La Leche League meetings? I find that they are welcoming to ALL nursing mothers, whether you decide to wean at a year or are still nursing your toddler. They have good advice. In my group, there is a pregnant mom who is still nursing her 3 yr old, and she is interested in tandem nursing!! Like I said, it is whatever works best for both of you.

Teresa - posted on 05/03/2009

Quoting Kate:

Quoting Chelsea:

you should stop and start her on cow's milk, she needs the fat to grow

actually, the milk of mothers who have breastfed longer than 12 months has 17% fat, compared to only 4% fat in whole cows milk. http://www.medicineonline.com/news/10/61...

Isn't it still recommended for children over the age of 2 to switch to 2% or skim milk?  The child in the OP is 3, so having cow's milk for the fat makes no sense.

I realized after quoting that I should've just quoted the first part.... Oops. :)

Shannon - posted on 05/03/2009

I think it is great that you have beena ble to BF this long!!
With my daughter, she was a biter... and had a full mouth of teeth at 8 months... yup molars too, and I just couldn't do it any longer. No matter what i tried, pressingher face into my chest, pulling her off and loudly saying no.. etc... she still bit me.. however, I pumped till she was almost 2 and she had it in cups or bottles atleast 3 times a day.
My son, he is another whole story... presently he is a littel over 8 months and LOVES to BF.. I am back at work, so I pump 3 times a day at work.. thankfully I work with some true naturalists at my job seeming they are all men for the most part.... they all congradulate me and puch me to continue all the time... (of course they are all older and have gone throughthis with their own wives.. or are soon to be dads trying to convince their wives to do the same!!) Anyway, when I am home he still nurses now atleast 6 times a day eats 3 meals and 2 snacks a day... he won't touch a bottle if mommy is home. Sooo... I will continue to BF him till he is ready to stop, but once he hits about 18 months, add limitations as to when and certainly where... I Hope that will help both of us. Good luck to you.. I hope that you have gotten some good advice to help you!

Fiona - posted on 05/02/2009

So thats where all my fat has been going to, I have lost 16kg breatsfeeding after 1 year. LOL

Fiona - posted on 05/02/2009

Nicole, perhaps u could give some advice on transferring from boob to milk. My daughter doesnt like formula or cows milk so I dont have an alternative to BF at the moment. She has never had a dummy bt has fond an old bottle teat from when I had to supplement when she was young and seems to chew on it so I am going to try a bottle of milk or water with that teat and see if she will swap it for boob at least during the day. Any suggestions? also ptting her to bed worries me as she only settles on the boob. HELP!

Itsamystery - posted on 05/02/2009

Quoting Chelsea:

you should stop and start her on cow's milk, she needs the fat to grow

actually, the milk of mothers who have breastfed longer than 12 months has 17% fat, compared to only 4% fat in whole cows milk. http://www.medicineonline.com/news/10/61...

Chelsea - posted on 05/02/2009

you should stop and start her on cow's milk, she needs the fat to grow

Shelby - posted on 05/02/2009

Okay I breast fed my daughter until she was 2 and a half. If you are wanting to the bond still that goes with breast feeding. Then I see no problem. Though my daughter had a hard time stopping. She still holds my breast like she wants to nurse. Its been 2 years since I stopped.

Olivia - posted on 05/02/2009

I did not read all the posts so this has probably already been stated. I have taken some classes on becoming a lactation consultant and have learned that the benefits of nursing
last as long as you continue to nurse. That being said If you are still comfortable nursing keep doing it. If you are not start trying to wean slowly so your lo has an easier time with it. Congratulations for keeping it up for such a long time.

Morag - posted on 05/02/2009

Never discourage milk drinking in children, especially girls. The hormone estrogen can strip calcium from the bones, which is why women in particular are prone to osteoprosis/arthritis. Its a load of tosh that breastmilk provides no nutritional benefit after 6 months. Its milk. Its illogical for a milk that is nutritionally "the best" for babies until 6 months, suddenly stops yet milk made for an animal suddenly becomes more nutritional. Babies, children, teenagers and women all desperately need calcium in their diets. Breast milk is much more easily absorbed by the human gut because thats what its designed for and this doesn't change because a magic age is met. The reason it is so sweet is to encourge children to keep breastfeeding.

More recently the antibodies may not be absorbed by the gut, but it does dump a lot of antibodies in the gut which helps prevent diarrhea and vomiting. Recently our entire family, even those we hadn't eaten with, just come in contact with, all came down with an awful stomach flu...the only person who didn't was my breastfed 15month old and she hasn't even been vaccinated against rotavirus, even I had it, was still breastfeeding so she had LOTS of contact. Her only difference was breastmilk.

My youngest can be a bit of a pain.. She pulls my top down, can ask for booby... and be moody, but like everything there are set rules. Only at home is the rule. My home, my rules and if anyone doesn't like it they can pee off. She does ask for it out of these times, but then she knows shes not allowed to touch plug sockets but she will happily go round other peoples houses and try to touch theirs... Its just a toddler thing.

Rebecca Lynn - posted on 05/01/2009

I breast fed my son Logan until he was about 2 I only stopped because he started biting and was leaving big sore bruises lol

Rebecca Lynn - posted on 05/01/2009

I feel like it's fine as long as your comfortable with it really. Nothing wrong with it. Maybe she will grow out of it once she starts school next year?

Andrea - posted on 05/01/2009

My daughter is getting close to 7 mos...isn't on solids yet (she's not interested yet) and I am already getting the pressure to wean. I just heard this today..."ooohh my, she's 7 mos.? You better get her on solids!" Why the rush?! In my opinion, toddlers are babies too and I plan on breastfeeding my daughter for as long as she needs it. It would absolutely break my heart to turn her down as well...I can sympathize! I think it's the U.S. that sexualizes breasts SO much and has this hurry up and grow up mentality towards our little ones. I think your daughter will naturally grow out of her need for this probably very soon. You look like you have a great relationship...I think you are both beautiful!! :)

Chantel - posted on 05/01/2009

Quoting Jessica:



I have a question: my daugther has shown a lot of interest in nursing. While I don't want to start nursing her again, is there anything wrong with letting her have some of my breastmilk that I've pumped? Or, since she's weaned, should I just not worry about it? While feeding Gavin cereal last night, Aubrey would stick her finger in the cereal made with breastmilk and said "mmm, it's good." I just feel like Gavin's getting all these wonderful nutrients and Aubrey's not. I'm sorry to step on your toes by posting this in your thread, but I figured everyone here has an interest in breastmilk and toddlers, so who better to ask???

 

Why not let her try nursing.  It wouldn't hurt anything, and she may decide that she would like to nurse a bit here or there, or may refuse and say its not for her.  Let her decide, but offer her your breast!  It will help her to feel wanted and let her know you are willing to share yourself with her too.  Offer and see what she does!

Chantel - posted on 05/01/2009

Your breastmilk gives immunity and nutritional support as long as you nurse! It does not stop being beneficial at 6 months!!!! In some cultures, nursing until 4-5 years old is normal. Here in the US, nursing until 1 year old seems a long time for most and many would disagree that older children benefit from breastmilk. This is absolutely untrue. As long as you nurse your child obtains living benefits from your milk!!!!



The 6th months myth surrounds the child's immunity gained in the womb, which wanes at around 6 months, however passive immunity is given with each nursing for as long as you nurse.



If you really want to wean, then wean. Yes, she will be mad at you for a couple of days....

However if you want to keep nursing, then do. It is up to you.



My last baby nursed until his 3rd birthday, and then his "bubbies" had no more milk. He understood this concept of no more, and that is what we told him, no more, all gone. He was mad at me for a day or so, and then did just fine after that. I wouldn't give even one day of our nursing relationship up!!!!

Allison - posted on 05/01/2009

Quoting Vanessa:

g'day jessica...its a great idea to give your daughter some expressed breast milk in a cup. she will love the sweet taste and it will benefit her health. (so long as your baby boy is well fed, pumping a drink or 2 for your daughter would be fine.....your supply will increase and everyone can be happy.).

I think it's fine to give your older kids breast milk in a cup. My daughter didn't like it, though - she'd been weaned for maybe a year and when I offered her some because she wanted to nurse (and she had forgotten how) she tried it and hated it. I'm sure not all kids would have a strong negative reaction, though :-)

Wendy - posted on 05/01/2009

I'm a strong supporter in Child-Led weaning, however I also feel the nursing relationship should end when it is no longer desirable by mom or child.



I see nothing wrong with nursing a 3 year old. Your child is still getting nutritional, emotional benefits for as long as the relationship continues. If you want to wean that is OK and if you want to continue that is OK, but only you can make that ultimate decision.

Jessica - posted on 05/01/2009

I love that you brought this topic up. I'm a young mommy (was 20 when I had my daughter) and I have a 5 month old son. I stopped nursing my daughter at about 6 months (she's 3 next month), and I really don't have a reason why I did, except that maybe I was worried going to work full time that I wouldn't keep my milk supply up. Now that my son is nearing that age, I've been contemplating what to do. I definitely want to keep nursing as long as I can, and I'm considering nursing past the 1 year mark (which you don't hear about much). The benefits are tremendous, and I love the time we get to spend together. I feel like I "jilted" my daughter by weaning so early. My son isn't breastfed exclusively because I still have a hard time keeping up with his demands, and my work is pretty demanding, so pumping frequently is hard. We just introduced him to cereal made with breastmilk last night and he loved it, but I fully intend to nurse for a long time this time.



I have a question: my daugther has shown a lot of interest in nursing. While I don't want to start nursing her again, is there anything wrong with letting her have some of my breastmilk that I've pumped? Or, since she's weaned, should I just not worry about it? While feeding Gavin cereal last night, Aubrey would stick her finger in the cereal made with breastmilk and said "mmm, it's good." I just feel like Gavin's getting all these wonderful nutrients and Aubrey's not. I'm sorry to step on your toes by posting this in your thread, but I figured everyone here has an interest in breastmilk and toddlers, so who better to ask???

Nicole - posted on 05/01/2009

Quoting Kate:

It's a bit different where I live (in Australia), most of our hospitals are pro-breastfeeding and have policies to promote breastfeeding (rooming-in, no artificial nipples, no formula offered, etc). Some hospitals will not let mum & baby go home until they have a good latch going (unless mum refuses to breastfeed). There are of course aberrations to this but 83% of mums in Australia are breastfeeding on discharge. It drops down to 54% at 3 months and 32% at six months - although this figure is affected by early introduction of solids (ie more than 32% of mothers are breastfeeding at 6 months, but not exclusively). I have never had discouragement from breastfeeding or picked up any cues that breastfeeding isn't socially acceptable. So I think over here, our problem might be lack of follow up support and information about growth spurts, etc.

I think the reason some people choose 6 months as the time to stop is because they hear that babies should breastfeed for at least 6 months and this creates a mental marker for when to stop (same with the information that says cows milk is safe after the first year - people take this as 'i should switch over to cows milk at 1 months). Without any other information they might assume there are no further benefits. they assume that this is the time to stop.

Do you think it's plausible that since there's little public health coverage in the US, the government has little incentive to promote increased breastfeeding? (correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not very educated about the US health system, have just heard stories that if you don't have private health insurance over there, then you have trouble accessing medical care, so have assumed there isn't much public health care)

Well, I can say this:  I provide my services to the WIC program (Women, Infants and Children) and work very closely with them.  This is a government nutritional supplemental program provided to lower income families in the US.  Our WIC building is in the same buiilding as the Department of Health and have been very enlightened on the healthcare system and the impacts on families. 

Well, first:  breastfeeding numbers are very low among those with lower incomes and the WIC program is largely blamed for that because WIC provides free formula with U.S. tax dollars.  And, in my opinion, this is true to some extent.  But, WE are working very hard to promote and encourage breastfeeding numbers to rise (I know this being the instructor for the Prenatal Breastfeeding Classes at WIC and we still provide WIC services and free food to those who are breastfeeding) AND I am very sure that if WIC stopped providing formula, breastfeeding would go up, BUT babies would also start dying and I am sure of that, too.  WIC only provides about 80% of a baby's formula needs and babies have been hospitalized in the past of water intoxication, because families have been diluting the formula to make it stretch further because they can't afford the 20% they now have to pay for.  So it is quite a dilemna! 

Second:  Obviously, alot of the WIC clients are also patients of the Health Department in the same building, because they have no private health insurance.  And there are many problems with the public health care here.  We are constantly dealing with pregnant women who are having a hard time getting Medicaid (the public health care for low income).  And when they do get Medicaid, they are limited on choices of physicians and this can create problems with getting started with breastfeeding and/or continued breastfeeding.  The reason: time!  It takes alot of time and energy to promote and encourage breastfeeding and most physicians/offices don't have the time and/or aren't willing to take the time.  Because Medicaid sets it's own rates and tells physicians and hospitals what they will pay for their services and therefore those particular physicians have to take on more patients than physicians who only take private health insurance to compensate for the loss of income.  It's really sad!  Higher income families usually have private health insurance, do not qualify for WIC, and therefore, are more educated on breastfeeding and breastfeed to save money because the price of formula is so high.

It is a really sad situation.  Now, I don't mean to say that I support socializing the health care in the U.S. because then I think EVERYONE would have the same problems those on Medicaid run into, but I do think there needs to be change!  Maybe something in the middle of the road of the two ideas.  I don't know???  In my opinion, alot of the health care industry in the U.S. are worried more about law suits than the breastfeeding rates!  And that is everyone's fault and we need to rethink it.  Look we know that if breastfeeding rates went up, taxes would go down (WIC, etc.) and the price of healthcare would go down, making it easier on EVERYONE.  Healthcare prices would go down, because breastfeeding benefits are life-long.  Less sick people.  =)

So, yes, the health care system can be blamed for breastfeeding rates, but so can lack of education and support.  If more people were educated on the risks of formula feeding, mother's would not be pressured to stop early.  They would be encouraged to breastfeed! 

Roeana - posted on 05/01/2009

Thank you everyone for your comments, compliments and encouragement. There is so much that you all have said that has really helped me to apply. Thank you so much. Catherine and I will keep on breastfeeding and we'll wait till we're both ready. She is a very social, happy and healthy little girl. And she loves momma at home especially, so this is what added to my frustration but I will focus on her well being and I'm sure she will decide when it's a good time for her to stop. Thanks again for such great support. Yesterday was my first post and signing up and it has been such a great experience. Have a wonderful day to all the momma's. :-)

Itsamystery - posted on 05/01/2009

Sorry Roeana, I jumped in mid-thread without even responding to your orignal post! I think you're doing an awesome job and you should keep going as long as you're happy to, particularly because you said your daughter isn't ready.

As other posters have also said, I think setting limits are the best thing for your own sanity and for the longevity of the BF relationship. A couple of months ago my nearly 2 year old son was nursing more than 10 x per day and it was driving me nuts and really making me miserable and resentful. He is now down to about 4 nursing sessions a day and I'm really enjoying our nursing relationship once again. It sounds like your heart is really for child-led weaning but you're struggling with the demands it makes of you.. so maybe setting some limits will help your BF relationship too.

Itsamystery - posted on 05/01/2009

oops, '1 months' should be '12 months'

Itsamystery - posted on 05/01/2009

It's a bit different where I live (in Australia), most of our hospitals are pro-breastfeeding and have policies to promote breastfeeding (rooming-in, no artificial nipples, no formula offered, etc). Some hospitals will not let mum & baby go home until they have a good latch going (unless mum refuses to breastfeed). There are of course aberrations to this but 83% of mums in Australia are breastfeeding on discharge. It drops down to 54% at 3 months and 32% at six months - although this figure is affected by early introduction of solids (ie more than 32% of mothers are breastfeeding at 6 months, but not exclusively). I have never had discouragement from breastfeeding or picked up any cues that breastfeeding isn't socially acceptable. So I think over here, our problem might be lack of follow up support and information about growth spurts, etc.

I think the reason some people choose 6 months as the time to stop is because they hear that babies should breastfeed for at least 6 months and this creates a mental marker for when to stop (same with the information that says cows milk is safe after the first year - people take this as 'i should switch over to cows milk at 1 months). Without any other information they might assume there are no further benefits. they assume that this is the time to stop.

Do you think it's plausible that since there's little public health coverage in the US, the government has little incentive to promote increased breastfeeding? (correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not very educated about the US health system, have just heard stories that if you don't have private health insurance over there, then you have trouble accessing medical care, so have assumed there isn't much public health care)

Nicole - posted on 04/30/2009

Allison is SO right about this!!! I am constantly saying "I'm sorry I'm not saying your physician is a bad physician, just misinformed" and I hate having to go behind a physican and give our clients the right information about breastfeeding. Look, I'm not saying that ALL physicians are breastfeeding "dumb", but there are enough of them out there not supporting breastfeeding and giving really bad information about breastfeeding and formula. One of the most common thing pediatricians are telling our clients is that it is okay to give solids or other foods before 6 months (breastfeeding OR formula feeding) when the AAP has stated nothing but breastmilk or formula during that time.



The point about breasts being sexualized is so right, too. Can't they be shared for the sake of the child???? =)



Everyone says breastmilk is the best, but how can something be the best when it is the only kind? Is there another form of human milk out there I don't know about??? Formula is cow's milk for one and second, it is not even in same ball park as breastmilk. =)

Allison - posted on 04/30/2009

Quoting Amanda-Lynn:

Sorry to go off topic, but is the misinformation of antibodies no longer pass through breastmilk why most mothers stop at 6 months?

Nicole had some great things to say. I just want to add some more:

I think many women stop because we have an idea that breasts are mainly for sex in the US and are uncomfortable with nursing a child who is getting older. Breastfeeding isn't very accepted, and there is a lot of pressure to wean, with family and friends saying things like "You *still* doing that?" and touting the "benefits" of formula being easier/healthier/better (none of which is true). It's also very easy to get artificial human milk (formula) so many women start to use some formula, which starts to make their milk dry up, which means they have to use more formula, etc until they have no milk left and are using formula full-time. Many pediatricians don't have a lot of breastfeeding information and often tell women things that undermine breastfeeding, like babies will sleep through the night better if they have formula, or that more solid foods is better than breastmilk (it's not).

We just don't have a lot of social support or good breastfeeding education that's out there. I think this is changing a lot now, but still there are many women who are told they cannot breastfeed, mainly because of misinformation. 

The benefits for breastfeeding for *at least* a year are very strong - and even the American Academy of Pediatrics recommends exclusive breastfeeding until 6 months (no solids!) and then continued breastfeeding until 1 year. Other organizations, like the World Health Organization, recommend at least 2 years. There is very strong evidence that breastfeeding is very important for babies and toddlers, yet many people still tell new moms that it doesn't matter, that formula is "fine." 

I could go on, I think, but I won't ;-) I think it's a complex issue, but I agree with Nicole, more moms need to breastfeed and it's beneficial to mom, baby, and society if they do.

Nicole - posted on 04/30/2009

Quoting Amanda-Lynn:

Sorry to go off topic, but is the misinformation of antibodies no longer pass through breastmilk why most mothers stop at 6 months?

Well, that could be part of it, but in my experience it's many reasons.  To name a few that I've heard:  some women refuse to breastfeed a baby with teeth, some start to feel that they have less freedom and think they will get more if they wean, others do not have alot of support around them and find that people become judgemental of those breastfeeding beyond this age, etc.  Mostly I have determined that many mothers feel the baby is no longer a baby beyond 6 months and therefore should not be breastfed.  This is the third hardest problem I face while working with breastfeeding mothers at WIC.  The first is convincing them to breastfeed at all (and we fail miserably with most) and the second is convincing them to stick with it beyond 2 weeks.  Then we run into a road blcok at 3 months and again at 6 months.  It is an ongoing battle.  If I and other WIC employees could convince ALL mothers using WIC to breastfeed, we could save U.S. taxpayers an estimated $5 billion per year!!!!  Amazing!  We're trying...

Amanda - posted on 04/30/2009

Sorry to go off topic, but is the misinformation of antibodies no longer pass through breastmilk why most mothers stop at 6 months?

Cassie - posted on 04/30/2009

my son (17 months) has 2 spots in the house where he can nurse - on his bed or in my office at the computer. If he wants his milkies, he has to go to one of those spots. A lot of the time, he'd rather keep playing.

Nicole - posted on 04/30/2009

I just wanted to add that your daughter is beautiful! I love your profile pic.

Roeana - posted on 04/30/2009

I appreciate everyone's comments.

Emily - posted on 04/30/2009

I am nursing my 2.5 year old. I don't plan on stopping anytime soon but I did notice that when I put some limits on it we were both happier in our nursing relationship. I nurse her in the morning when she wakes up, I do work full time so no nursing during the day unless it is a weekend in which case we nurse before nap, and before bed. If she is hurt or sick I am flexible enough to allow additional nursing. This month I cut out the nighttime nursing (which was up to three times per night). I also stopped the after work nursing session about two weeks ago, although I didn't tell her I was stopping it I just redirect her attention to other things. Instead of nursing I let her help make dinner or give her some fresh fruit. There are millions of reasons to nurse a toddler but just because weaning is child-led doesn't mean it can't be parent involved. She might be easily bored. My oldest was like that. If she wasn't actively doing something she wanted to nurse. Try keeping her occupied with projects, outside time, blocks and lots of play while you are home.

Tara - posted on 04/30/2009

I have to agree with most of the posters here. There is no harm in what you are doing, studies in europe have shown breastfeeding benefits up to the age of six. She will likely naturally ween herself over the next year or two.

Roeana - posted on 04/30/2009

I found a great article, here's the link if you have time to read:
http://www.keepkidshealthy.com/breastfee...
"Breastfeed a Toddler—Why on Earth?"

Allison - posted on 04/30/2009

I think you should keep at it until she is ready to stop. Many extended-nursing kids choose to stop nursing somewhere between 3 and 5, and since she's not nursing constantly, I wouldn't worry about it. Antibodies continue to be in your milk for as long as she nurses (not just until 6 months), so she is still getting benefits. Plus, if she does get sick, she's more likely to be able to stay hydrated with your milk than with anything else.

I disagree with the posters that have said to only breastfeed for the first 6 months - the AAP recommends *at least* 1 year and the WHO recommends *at least* two years.

Nursing past 3 is also not as uncommon as you might think...we just tend to hide it. In many cultures, it's normal to nurse a child up to 4, 5, and even 6.

I'd say if she's not ready, then it's not worth fighting over. You both seem happy and she's staying healthy. Your relationship with her has an extra-special component and will continue with you both for the rest of your lives.

Good luck!

Melissa - posted on 04/30/2009

Well me i agree with everyone in here that its the 6mths are the best time to breastfeed..

sence iam a mother that believes breastfeeding only til 6 mnths of course its cheaper and this and that yea! ok but...it is really hard i agree when you say no.. if you can pump it! give it to her in a cup but she will start school and would want to nurse..... my my two childrens have been breastfed and its hard ... my son is allergic to cows milk and ive tried other ,milks... sometimes i even give him breast milk cause i just had a baby girl so iam currently breastfeeding... and i add chocolate milk sometimes to it or strawberry!... but breast feeding and a mother and child bodding!

must be hard

Roeana - posted on 04/30/2009

Thanks for the reply Amanda.