new topics

Julie - posted on 07/08/2010

Proverbs 17:10
"Rebuke is more effective for a wise man Than a hundred blows on a fool."


That is one that jumped out at me... discipline needs to be appropriate to the person being given it - no good punishing someone who has no idea what they are being punished for, or punishing them out of proportion to what they are doing.

I'm not against smacking at all - I just rarely do with my daughter because her (mis)behaviour is generally related to her autism eg, punishing her because she can't sit still like an average 8 year old would achieve nothing as she's not deliberately not sitting still.

Parents need to become as wise as they possibly can when it comes to discipline - to neither over do it or not do it enough - both have negative long term effects on children.

And at the end of the day, all we can do is hand it over to God to work in the hearts of our children when we don't get it perfect.

Pamela - posted on 07/08/2010

Dear Molly,

I didn't read your earlier post but I think perhaps people that criticized need to review their bible for what God says about discipline.
Deuteronomy 8:5
"You should know in your heart that as a man chastens his son, so the LORD your God chastens you."
[Note: "chastens" means to chastise literally with blows or figuratively with words]

Deuteronomy 21:18
"If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey the voice of his father or the voice of his mother, and who, when they have chastened him, will not heed them,"

Proverbs 10:13
"Wisdom is found on the lips of him who has understanding, But a rod is for the back of him who is devoid of understanding."

Proverbs 13:24
"He who spares his rod hates his son, But he who loves him disciplines him promptly."

Proverbs 15:10
"Harsh discipline is for him who forsakes the way, And he who hates correction will die."

Proverbs 17:10
"Rebuke is more effective for a wise man Than a hundred blows on a fool."

Proverbs 19:18
"Chasten your son while there is hope, And do not set your heart on his destruction."

Proverbs 19:25
"Strike a scoffer, and the simple will become wary; Rebuke one who has understanding, and he will discern knowledge."

Proverbs 19:29
"Judgments are prepared for scoffers, And beatings for the backs of fools."

Proverbs 20:30
"Blows that hurt cleanse away evil, As do stripes the inner depths of the heart."

Proverbs 22:6
"Train up a child in the way he should go, And when he is old he will not depart from it."

Proverbs 22:15
"Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; The rod of correction will drive it far from him."

Proverbs 23:13-14
"Do not withhold correction from a child, For if you beat him with a rod, he will not die. You shall beat him with a rod, And deliver his soul from hell."

Proverbs 26:3
"A whip for the horse, A bridle for the donkey, And a rod for the fool's back."

Proverbs 29:15
"The rod and rebuke give wisdom, But a child left to himself brings shame to his mother."

Proverbs 29:17
"Correct your son, and he will give you rest; Yes, he will give delight to your soul."

Hebrews 12:5-11
"And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons: "My son, do not despise the chastening of the LORD, Nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him; For whom the LORD loves He chastens, And scourges every son whom He receives." If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten? But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons. Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live? For they indeed for a few days chastened us as seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness. Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it."

Carla - posted on 07/07/2010

Julie L, I think the passage you are talking about is Colossians 3:21: 'Fathers, provoke not your children to anger, lest they be discouraged.'

Your situation, as you well know, was different than most persons, in that your parent took disciplining to an art form. Loving Christian discipline teaches, not torments. Solomon said (and I'm paraphrasing): Spank your kids, and don't quit when they cry. You will save their souls. (Proverbs 23:13-14)

I certainly am not a proponent of spanking with anything other than your hand, although I have been known to give one of the older ones a smack with the fly swatter ;) I have found with our grandbabies that the Naughty chair works wonderfully, and we don't HAVE to spank. I think the principle of the naughty chair could be used in church, as well as at home.

Whatever method we use, discipline is for teaching, not because your child has bugged you in some way, or is interferring with your TV watching. If you can get your point across without spanking, and you achieve the desired results, why not use it?

God bless, my darlings!

Julie - posted on 07/03/2010

Molly don't feel bad. Nothing should be taboo to ask.

I think the problem was (and is) most people are shocked that any church would provide something to a hit a child with.

I'm not against spanking at all but using a weapon to hit a child I find deeply offensive and cannot understand how any church would provide this.

I have no idea what the laws in the US are, but here, using an object to hit a child is very much illegal.

Also, if a child is so unruly that smacking with a hand doesn't work, then honestly, hitting the with an object won't make much of a difference. If a smack with a hand doesn't work, they need professional help - either they have some kind of medical condition, or have an attitude problem so bad that they need the other type of professional help eg some kind of counselling etc.

I know from being beaten with objects as a child, all it did was make me nearly hate my mother. Admittedly, nearly all of the beatings were because, in her serious mental illness, she had imagined I had done something wrong and she would try to beat a confession out of me for something I knew nothing about and I refused to tell a lie and say I had done something I had not (or in other cases, someone had done something, but not me and sometimes I'd cave in because she'd beat both my brother and I til someone admitted to it, and even when I knew he was the one, he couldn't take the beatings - but more often than not, what my mum was accusing us of, she'd either done it herself without realising, or my dad done it when she wasn't around, or it was purely in her head).

But even, for example, when my brother had done what my mum was beating us for, the very reason I took the blame was no child should be hit with an object. It doesn't teach a child to be good - it just teaches them violence, it teaches them bitterness, it teaches them to just get sneakier to not get caught next time, it teaches them to hate their parents and it teaches them that those who are bigger bully those who are smaller.

There is a passage in the bible that is aimed at parents, telling them not to alienate their children. I can't remember exactly where but it's the one about when your child asks for bread, not to give them a stone or something similar (help me out anyone?).

We must be careful not to alienate our children - especially in a world that makes it so easy for the state to snatch children from loving homes just because the kids don't want to follow the parents' rules.

We are called to show the world that we are upstanding citizens, so that we cannot be accused of wrongdoing and embarrass Jesus.

On the issue of smacking, particularly with objects, I believe strongly that that is what applies - everything is permissable, but not everything is beneficial. Smacking is one of those things - and hitting kids with objects just opens a can of worms that christians would be best to avoid - above reproach, we need to be.

Molly please don't feel the need to worry about asking any question though... if one does not ask, one does not learn. Even you 110% disagree with what a responder has said, you still will learn something from reading their response, even if only to be more firm in your own views on whatever subject it is.

Molly - posted on 07/02/2010

A cry room is a room at a church and does double duty from what I got answers on I thought it was a room to take unrully children when they act up in church and you can spank them in there there are bench's and paddles to use one side boys and the other girls, that is what i saw where I used to live in texas. Other moms say its a room for babys to cry and not upheld the service , I guess its what you make it.

Melanie - posted on 07/01/2010

I may regret asking this but.... what is a cry room?

Molly - posted on 07/01/2010

thank you everybody I feel better and I will ask more questions thanks for making me feel better.

Cindy - posted on 06/30/2010

Molly,

I just posted in the other thread. You are ok. Please no worries.

Heather - posted on 06/24/2010

Dear goodness- I'm so sorry if I made you feel you are a terrible person by exiting myself out of the other conversation. I read later posts of yours and realized you weren't asking the exact question that I thought you were asking. I am not in any way opposed to spanking and plan to use it as a method of discipline (sparingly, but when needed). In any case- please don't think you are disliked or need to run everything past someone else before making a post.

Molly - posted on 06/23/2010

thanks who have responded I feel better thanks and god bless

Jill - posted on 06/23/2010

your not a terrible person .... everyone has an opinion on the subject ... and you have to respect that as we respect yours....God bless

Cynthia - posted on 06/22/2010

Romans 8:1

Penny - posted on 06/22/2010

Molly, I don't think you're abusing this forum. You had a genuine question and were asking other moms for help. You are not a terrible person just because others may disagree with the way you parent. Don't ever forget how much God loves you! Many blessings!