c section envy! what a load of crap.

Erin - posted on 12/19/2010

**Mod Alert**
Ok I have deleted the 'text talk' post because it contained a clear personal attack. I also deleted the several posts replying to it and will be locking this thread now.

Erin - DM Mod

Natasha - posted on 12/19/2010

Wow, so I thought that this was going to be a good post. I was waaaaaaaaaaaaay off base. I thought that the c-section post was crazy, but you seem to be making a case for her. I was lucky enough to give birth to my son "naturally" but have a very close friend who had to have a section. I was lucky enough to breastfeed, up until my son got sick and the stress and worry caused me to go dry, however I know many moms who have choosen to bottle feed. I was lucky enough concieve my son, and the baby I am carrying now, even the one that I lost, all naturally with no help needed, however there are many women I love and care about who have not/are not able to do so and will have to spend thousands of dollars, fultile attempts, and go through so much heartache to have the chance to carry a baby. I also know and love many women who will never be able to carry a baby, and I weep for them and thier pain.
I understand that you were lucky, and that the c-section post offended you, I just thought the woman was out to lunch. But to put down everyone who chooses to make decsions that you didn't/wouldn't make is crazy as well. I also think that it is funny that you blame being British as the reason for coming off snotty. I have plently of British family members and friends who are not snotty.

Kate CP - posted on 12/19/2010

I second Krista's vote.

Krista - posted on 12/19/2010

Mods, I think this thread needs to be locked. It started off badly and is just getting worse and worse.

Shauna - posted on 12/19/2010

Ha! i wish i could just conceive in the "moment of magic" it took two years to conceive my son, and a miscarriage prior to my son that was the worst thing i have ever had to go through as a mother. The Dr asking me if i want a priest present while they remove my dead baby from me. I ENVIED women that could get pregnant with a snap of a finger .... i wanted a natural childbirth but that didnt happen i ended in C-section .. i wanted to breastfeed at least to 1 yr of age but production stoped at 7 mo even with BF on demand using a high quality pump etc .... I do find this post a little hurtful. Maybe the wording is just off and you meant something else ... im not sure.

Doreen - posted on 12/19/2010

Let's see if we can shed some light on that topic for you... I agree with you Becky you are blessed and what is more important is that you are in tune with your "womanhood" and comfortable in it, that you perceive yourself as someone superior because of it - is shit. I just don't think that everyone is, it is not always a choice, it is circumstancial a lot of the time and decisions are often based on many influencing factors... What is sad and a horror is that people judge you the way you judge them... Good old Karma!!!

Stifler's - posted on 12/19/2010

I wanted to breastfeed and ended up bottle feeding and I can see why someone would bottle feed electively. It's much easier to work and someone else can do it for you when you want to sleep a whole night and they go longer between feeds and all sorts of reasons. I guess with c-sections not that I've had one that some people think missing the labour bit is less painful than abdominal surgery. Whatever floats your boat, as Kate says.

Chatty - posted on 12/19/2010

You don't have to actually say it. The tone and arrogance in your original post suggests plenty!

Becky - posted on 12/19/2010

I cant find the bit in my post where i say i "think less of anyone!

Kate CP - posted on 12/19/2010

Becky, I don't understand why a woman would CHOOSE to do those things over other "natural" methods of conceiving and birthing but that doesn't mean I think less of a woman who does choose one or all of those methods.

Like I said in my original quote "whatever floats your boat".

Chatty - posted on 12/19/2010

Ya, I was wondering that also, Kate. She obviously thinks it helps her argument somehow but that comment was obviously taken out of another thread and can not be put into context here.

Becky, Kate would have never worded things the way she did in that comment under different circumstances, thread or context.

Kate CP - posted on 12/19/2010

WTH? What was the point of quoting me?

Chatty - posted on 12/19/2010

Just because you don't understand it, doesn't mean it's wrong. I would never electively do any of those things either but I can sort of understand why someone would want to and if you saw my body after having my daughter you'd possibly understand why too. Your opinioned was formed based on your easy, non-problematic pregnancy, labour and delivery but many women have experienced and seen friends and family experience it much differently and perhaps that is why they have the opinions they do.



You just need to open your mind and try and put yourself in someone elses situation, lifestyle etc. Your way isn't the right way! There is no right or wrong....just different!



I choose to show compassion and empathy. I choose to not be judgemental.

Becky - posted on 12/19/2010

No, what i am saying is that i don't understand why a woman would choose to have en-vitro, a surrogate a c section or bottle feed, just for her own convenience and to keep her body "pre motherhood."
and as a said before i would do all of the above if i had to,i just find it hard to understand why someone would choose to.
And all mothers should be proud of themselves for doing the best for their child under whatever circumstances life throws at them.

Stifler's - posted on 12/19/2010

I don't see what the OP had to do with the c-section post. It was about elective c-sections. Are you saying those who had an emergency c-section or couldn't breastfeed due to it not being as easy as all that shouldn't be proud of themselves because they didn't do everything by the book?

Jaime - posted on 12/19/2010

I think it's safe to say that the wording in the OP, like so many before me have already stated, can be considered offensive by some. I also think it's a bit pointless to bring up Kate's comment when she genuinely explained the reason behind her opinion.

1) There are many men and women who simply cannot conceive naturally. Perhaps the woman does not produce viable eggs or the man has a low sperm count, or it's even possible that one is allergic to the other's bodily fluids. Should these people not reproduce even if they feel it is a necessary part of being a couple and a family?
http://www.babycenter.com/404_what-is-a-...

2) Perhaps a woman's uterus is unfit to carry healthy babies. Perhaps she is constantly plagued with miscarriages or ovarian cysts or has had to have a hysterectomy before she is able to conceive because of some illness. Should she never be allowed feel love toward another little human being, whether she birthed it or not, because her body just wasn't capable of handling it?

3) Some women's bodies are just not made for vaginal births, like my mother with her narrow masculine pelvis, and many women cannot handle the pain associated with vaginal births. Should they chew on leather to fight through the pain and agony of trying to give birth naturally, only to die on the table because a doctor refused to give them a c-section, as was the case with my mother? (who did live, but her heart had stopped for two minutes while in labor with me)

4) Some women do not make enough breastmilk or are too sick to breastfeed after giving birth, or give birth to babies who are too sick to breastfeed and thus their milk dries up. Are they lesser mothers because they are unable to breastfeed?

Are women who go through these situations lesser mothers because their bodies don't function like other mothers' bodies?

I think not.

Nikki - posted on 12/19/2010

You just don't get it. What you said is very offensive to many mothers. Digging Kate's comment up isn't going to help your cause. You can copy and paste mine too, doesn't take away from the fact you worded your post in an arrogant and self righteous way.

Becky - posted on 12/19/2010

4,67436
Kate Capehart - posted 4 days ago
I'm not envious of having some one cut me open and rip a baby out of my uterus. I think it's stupid to have a c-section for no reason. It's major abdominal surgery and a huge risk for infection.

But hey, whatever floats yer boat.
??????

Sarah - posted on 12/18/2010

Hey! I'm British and I'm not snotty!!!!!!!

As all the other ladies here have said, I think perhaps you may have phrased things in a slightly inflammatory way.
If you "don't get it" then why don't you ask, instead of throwing judgements around?

Katherine - posted on 12/18/2010

I agree with what Jenn said. The post is offensive, basically saying everyone who couldn't do things the natural way is a bad mom.

That's what I'm reading.....

Ooo - posted on 12/18/2010

There's no need for jealousy or judgement. Birth is birth. Who cares? Not me.

Julianne - posted on 12/18/2010

???? wtf is all i can say

Rebecca - posted on 12/18/2010

I find this attitude as odd as the OP's c-section post. You may not have intended to sound holier than thou but from where I'm standing that's what I'm hearing. I think the kicker is "Not with synthetic milk through a bleached rubber nipple". I'm all for confidence in your choices but not at the expense of others...especially when some of what you sound proud about are not choices for some women. Alas, a pleb like me had to nourish her child from my sub par silicon nipple because otherwise I'd have had to take those really "natural" pills that make you lactate more or my kid would have starved. As well, I guess I missed the "magic" of squeezing my kid out of my vagina because of that epidural (curse that ole medical condition that made "natural" birth beyond my reach).

Amie - posted on 12/18/2010

*** MOD Warning ***

I have deleted two posts from this thread. No personal attacks ladies.

Amie
~ DM mod

Bonnie - posted on 12/18/2010

Are you saying that you are better than every other woman who has done the latter in comparison? Because truly this is what it sounds like. If someone outright chooses to do the latter of the two, they are wrong or looked down upon? I'm wondering what high horse you got off of.
And to refer back to the c-section envy post, it wasn't mainly that she chose to have a c-section that was causing the uproar, it was the fact that she was stating and assuming that women who gave birth vaginally are envious of her and other mothers who had c-sections.

Tah - posted on 12/18/2010

i just read this and felt the need to ask, do all these things make you feel better than those who have not conceived naturally, breastfed, or had a vaginal birth?...cause it doesn't...but it comes off that way..

Nikki - posted on 12/18/2010

I am just in a constant shitty mood Dana!

It was a post from the welcome page, some idiot woman saying women were envious because she had an elective c section.

Jocelyn - posted on 12/18/2010

Yeah I agree that the c-section envy post was a load of shit, but Becky your post is just as bad.

Chatty - posted on 12/18/2010

Nikki, I've noticed you REALLY coming out of your shell lately! ;)

P.S. I have no idea what this "other" debate is that you gals are refering to!

Rosie - posted on 12/18/2010

glad i could oblige :)

Kate CP - posted on 12/18/2010

Oh, Kati...you made me guffaw! xD

Chatty - posted on 12/18/2010

I heart you, Mary!

Mary - posted on 12/18/2010

Well, as a an L&D nurse who has seen more than her fair share of demolished bottoms, I do sort of see where someone could have c-section envy. I recently posted in another thread about my personal award for worst bottom, so I won't revisit those details (it was the stuff nightmares are made of). BUT, I will say that this woman, and numerous others not only have a bit of envy, but are damned well entitled to it.

I am glad that you were able to conceive without effort and carry to viability. I'm glad that you were able to give birth vaginally and breastfeed you baby.

That does not make you special or superior...just really fucking lucking.

Lose the condescending judgmental attitude, please.

Charlie - posted on 12/18/2010

hmmmm indeed.

Chatty - posted on 12/18/2010

Hmmm...

Teresa - posted on 12/18/2010

That c-section post has already been debated here. Many, many people agree w/ you that it doesn't make sense to CHOOSE a c-section, but the wording of your post is no better than hers was.

Becky - posted on 12/18/2010

If you have read the c section post, what it seems to say is that for her own convenience she would rather have a c section. i would have en-vitro a surrogate a c section and bottle feed if i had to, but to choose to? i don't get it.
Also being british i probably do sound snotty sorry.

Kate CP - posted on 12/18/2010

What was the point of this post except to make women who have envitro, use a serrogate, birth with pain meds and/or have a c-section, and feed formula feel bad?

Amanda - posted on 12/18/2010

... i may be missing your point.... are you saying that a woman who chooses a surrogate, artificial inseminations, or adoption, or bottle feeds is the same as a woman who "chooses" a c-section???? that's a load of crap, and also, you so passively mention that some "can't do all of the above", so why post an offensive poem? because frankly, i have labor envy, but i am done being down on my body about it. i am thankful to have 2 healthy and happy babies and a healthy happy me.... technically it was a choice to have a c-section, so bite me

Sara - posted on 12/18/2010

Well, while I agree that "c-section envy" is a load of pure shite, I think that the things you've listed above are mother's perogative to chose. One is not better than another, it's just different choices and different life experiences. Saying it's "sad" denotes a level of judgement that is unnecessary IMHO. How does it impact you if a woman choses to have a c-section? Or bottle feed? Or use a surrogate?

~Jennifer - posted on 12/18/2010

.....do you realize that the way you worded your post makes you sound pretty fucking snotty?

Methinks you need to consider your words more carefully as well.