Culture Crisis vs Health Care Crisis

Mary - posted on 09/16/2010 ( 184 moms have responded )

3,348

31

119

This has been making the rounds on FB over the past few days. Just wondering what everyone thought about it....







Pictured is a young physician by the name of Dr. Roger Starner Jones. His short two-paragraph letter to the White House accurately puts the blame on a "Culture Crisis" instead of a "Health Care Crisis"..



It's worth a quick read:





Dear Mr. President:

During my shift in the Emergency Room last night, I had the pleasure of evaluating a patient whose smile revealed an expensive shiny gold tooth, whose body was adorned with a wide assortment of elaborate and costly tattoos, who wore a very expensive brand of tennis shoes and who chatted on a new cellular telephone equipped with a popular R&B ringtone.





While glancing over her patient chart, I happened to notice that her payer status was listed as "Medicaid"! During my examination of her, the patient informed me that she smokes more than one pack of cigarettes every day, eats only at fast-food take-outs, and somehow still has money to buy pretzels and beer. And, you and our Congress expect me to pay for this woman's health care? I contend that our nation's "health care crisis" is not the result of a shortage of quality hospitals, doctors or nurses. Rather, it is the result of a "crisis of culture" a culture in which it is perfectly acceptable to spend money on luxuries and vices while refusing to take care of one's self or, heaven forbid, purchase health insurance. It is a culture based in the irresponsible credo that "I can do whatever I want to because someone else will always take care of me". Once you fix this "culture crisis" that rewards irresponsibility and dependency, you'll be amazed at how quickly our nation's health care difficulties will disappear.



Respectfully,

ROGER STARNER JONES, MD

If you agree...pass it on.

MOST HELPFUL POSTS

Sara - posted on 09/17/2010

9,313

50

584

One of my FB friends just posted this on their status:

Dr. Roger Starner Jones please just treat the patient and don't judge a person by material possessions. Health Care should be a right for all. 60 % of all bankruptcies are due to medical bills and I doubt all of those are from people with R&B ring tones.

Krista - posted on 09/17/2010

12,562

16

842

I agree with Laura. Sure, there are people out there like this.

But there are also plenty of families on Medicaid who desperately need it and who are barely making ends meet. And there are people who are actually dying from lack of treatment, because they cannot afford it.

Why is Dr. Jones not writing about any of them?

Why is he not writing about the patient who didn't seek treatment for a mole, because she couldn't afford the co-pay, and now has stage four skin cancer?

Why is he not writing about the couple whose daughter was just diagnosed with leukemia, and they're uninsured because the dad just got laid off and the family's insurance was cancelled?

I just don't understand why a DOCTOR, someone with the ability to speak as a true voice of authority on the need for universal health care coverage, instead chooses to perpetuate 2010's version of Reagan's "welfare queen driving a Cadillac."

Isobel - posted on 09/19/2010

9,849

0

282

I would just like somebody to rewrite this entire "letter to the editor" but instead of picking on a poor woman...focus on the EXACT same problem from the white collar end.

you know...like the GM executives taking their private jet to go and beg the government for a bail out...or that bank that got the bailout and then used it to hand out millions of dollars in bonuses to it's useless executives.

In fact, those tools cost the American tax payers WAY more money than all the welfare scammers in the world combined.

That's why I don't believe that this letter is real...it is totally intended to make people angry and resentful and fearful of "socialized" medicine.

ME - posted on 09/16/2010

2,978

18

190

I agree with Laura...This type of judgmental attitude is disheartening, and sickening to me. My husband and I had a rather comfy lifestyle until I lost my job for getting pregnant, and then he lost his because his co. was going under...I know that many of you know my personal story, so I won't go into it again in detail...but I'm sure that I've been the subject of much condemnation from my health care providers if this is the attitude they take with their public aid patients. I wear my beautiful sapphire wedding jewelry every day, and I have a few nice things left from when we were a newly married couple with no kids and two full time jobs...perhaps I am expected to pawn or sell all of my special/sentimental things so that others won't be offended by my current poverty...
We MUST do away with for-profit health insurance in this country...it is disgusting, and it's proponents should ashamed of themselves.

Amie - posted on 09/16/2010

6,596

20

408

I agree with Mylene, there's no way to know when this person got these tattoo's or his gold tooth. Nor his financial situation at the moment vs. previously.

The judgmental attitude needs to be dropped, that plays a huge role. People take a book at it's cover a lot more often then they should. If you take the time to actually read a few pages instead of doing the once over you may learn a few things.

Are there people who abuse the system? Of course! There's people who abuse it here in Canada and it's free for every citizen. Doesn't mean we don't have our share of dead beats. I would still rather pay the taxes to make sure every single person who ever needs anything is covered, then to take it away and hope for the best. There are legitimate people who need medicaid and there are the shits. The shits are in the minority I'm sure, they just seem like the majority because they are the ones most talked about.

This conversation has been closed to further comments

184 Comments

View replies by

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

ok i just realized that i effed up too!! looking back i thought dana s was the one that was talking about having assets to qualify for assistance, now that i've looked for it 4 times at least i realize it was DMAK that said it!! i started all the confusion, sorry!! :p

[deleted account]

I don't know if I agree with "DMak ATTACK" though...lmao. Today it's been more like a "DMak ATTEMPT'' that failed miserably. ACK!

[deleted account]

Y'all need to come up with a nickname for me cuz I can't handle this. lmao....OMG! I think I MAY have drank too much coffee this morning trying to cope with my 4am early riser. I'm BUZZIN'

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

Haha, I was wondering WTH was going on. Kati's in the States....Dana M is in Canada.....You're all crazy. :P

Jenni - posted on 09/21/2010

5,928

34

373

Sorry Mary, I must have misunderstood your post. I thought you meant you were so against using govt assistance when unnecessary that your husband didn't take advantage of unemployment insurance.

?? - posted on 09/21/2010

4,974

0

171

Aren't (Canada's) EI & (USA's) unemployment benefits generally the same thing...?

[deleted account]

No, I didn't take it personally. Honestly....I'm just exhausted and my heads spinning. I'm glad you told me which way was up because I was arguing with Kati and she wasn't even talking to me and we have different systems and I was talking about welfare when she was still talking about healthcare....ugh. Not today. I promise I'm not upset though....I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy reading your posts.

I'm gonna get my "click" on.....watch for it....watch for it! lmao. I really hope this makes sense...lmao.

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

oh stop...it got really convoluted there for a while...I wasn't even sure what we were talking about for a bit...it's gone from health care to poverty and back and all the way around...nobody's made an ass of themselves.

I called you a dork out of affection...sorry, I forgot to smile and wink

[deleted account]

I'm just going to bow out of this one because apparently I've made an ass of myself. Two Dana's, different systems, everyone posting at the same time.....it's way too much for my brain to handle....Roxanne was up at 4:30 this morning. Peace out!

Mary - posted on 09/21/2010

3,348

31

119

Firstly, Jennifer, I'm in America, we don't have EI. And, no, my husband and I aren't martyrs. We had a choice. He actually got hired for the company he works for now about a month after he was laid off, but then, their yearly financials came in (this was the end of 2008, when everyone was losing their jobs) and the job he was hired for no longer existed. They gave him a choice - work your way up from an almost minimum wage job, so that when a position opens, you have a shot, or go look elsewhere. If he took that job, he then became ineligible for unemployment (which would have been more than what he would make being underemployed), BUT, if he busted his ass and took this job he was overqualified for, it could pay off down the road, since any future hires were going to occur from within.. He could have sat on his ass, waiting for the perfect new job to come along, but things were looking bleak job-wisefor everyone. The thought of collecting unemployment when he could be making strides towards his future did not sit well with him, even if it meant that things would be more difficult for us in the short term. We sucked it up, and I went with out a lot of sleep those first 10 months, since I did have to return to work full time to keep us afloat, and the cost of childcare was not an option with what he was bringing home. It did pay off for us, since he has now been promoted twice, and is where he should be for his level of education and experience. There was never a guarantee that it would pay off, but had we not sucked it up, and scrimped every penny, he would not have the job he has now. Maybe he would have found something else, or maybe he would still be looking, and have long ago exhausted those unemployment benefits.

[deleted account]

There was mention of income assistance and food stamps, etc. I thought Kati meant that she was already on welfare? Sorry, my bad.

I know our healthcare is free. lmao. Now I'm embarrassed....I thought we had started talking about the welfare system...my bad *hangs head in shame*

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

I think...that Kati has govt help with HEALTH CARE...and resents being told what to do with her money because she accepts govt help with that...no?

[deleted account]

Ok, am I confused? I don't think we're talking about the same thing and I have a feeling it's my fault. Ooops, sorry.

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

sorry i was talking to the other dana!! lol! dana s! i should really start doing that from now on. hehe!

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

and as for the system being designed to keep the poor poor, ohhh yes i agree. i can't go back to school unless we go on welfare, and also get a babysitter. so do i go on welfare? how do i pay for the sitter? should chad take another job that pays waaay less so he can work during the day and be home and AWAKE so we don't need daycare. why put my family in more financial burden? it's a cycle that i can't escape.

[deleted account]

I was told by a government employee, however, that I wouldn't be eligible unless I sold off my assets.

[deleted account]

Kati, I'm totally not upset with the people who do qualify. I hope that's not how you took it. I thought I explained that my frustration is with the system, not it's applicants, UNLESS they lied on their application or are knowingly cheating the system.

And, no, I haven't actually applied....perhaps I should?!! We've been fortunate enough to have wonderful family that was willing to loan us money, interest free. I won't apply unless I'm absolutely desperate.

[deleted account]

I agree also....the system, whether intentionally designed that way or not, makes the rich richer and the poor poorer. FOR SURE!

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

i don't know what to tell you about that dana. we have 2 vehicles, we own our own home. we still qualify. i do know that they deduct some things like daycare to count into the whole monthly income qualifications. have you actually applied? i know 2 families that didn't think they qualified, but because of these deductions they actually did qualify. i can see the frustration, i know i would be. but i would be upset at the income guidelines, not at the people who qualify.

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

and the system is definitely designed to keep the poor poor...and to help the rich get richer.

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

I was going to apply for assistance once, and got told that I couldn't qualify unless I moved to a ghetto. luckily I had a friend who lent me the money I needed to pay off an old student loan so I could get a new one instead of going on welfare...not everybody knows people who can lend them 7 000 dollars so that they don't have to go on welfare

Krista - posted on 09/21/2010

12,562

16

842

Maybe if they weren't vegging out in front of the TV they can't afford, with the top cable package that they can't afford, while texting on their iphones, they'd be more apt to pay attention to how they're being manipulated. Hehe

Heh. Now you're just being a shit-disturber, woman. :)

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

I agree, I think that many people stick with what they're used to. Though I don't know if I'd say our system is set up to keep the poor, poor.

[deleted account]

Kati, you mentioned earlier about "what is considered a luxury?"......part of why I don't qualify for government assistance is because I have assets. In order to qualify they expect me to have NOTHING. They would honestly expect me to sell my vehicle so that I could qualify. I've known plenty of people who just end up putting their vehicles and insurance in someone elses name just so they'll qualify. I don't think our situations are very different and I'm not sure why you qualify and I don't?

Krista - posted on 09/21/2010

12,562

16

842

I manage my money correctly and if I make a mistake and mismanage my money, I go without electricity for 3 days. You won't make that mistake again, once you do it.

That's all well and good, but if it's January and you have a small child, then going without power for three days isn't really much of an option, i'm guessing.

Don't get me wrong, I admire your discipline. But it's very, very easy to get into financial trouble. The system is rigged AGAINST people who are trying to be responsible. It's kind of like a shark's mouth -- the teeth point inwards, making it very easy to get in, but impossible to get out without being torn to shreds.

Sara - posted on 09/21/2010

9,313

50

584

I also think you need to look at the cycle of poverty too. It does always astound me how some people don't seem to want more for themselves, and they're content to scrape by. But the more I think about it, the more I think that if they grew up and that's the way their parents lived because it's the way their parents lived and so on, if that's all you know, what would be the impetus to stop that cycle of poverty? People do it, sure, but it's not easy. I also truly believe that our system is set up to keep the poor poor. Again, that's just my opinion, but the way public assistance works, it's difficult.

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

Maybe if they weren't vegging out in front of the TV they can't afford, with the top cable package that they can't afford, while texting on their iphones, they'd be more apt to pay attention to how they're being manipulated. Hehe

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

i don't really think it's as simple as saying people KNOW that they're getting fucked. i've used one of those check cashing places when i was single and had grant. i needed money to pay my rent. wasn't doing anything at all that would be considered "luxury", and too proud to ask for money from my parents. hell, i'd gotten pregnant on my own it wasn't their responsibility to take care of me. so i thought it was a good idea to use one of those places. oh good god was i wrong!!! now i know better, but then i thought that not having a place to live was the lesser of 2 evils.

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

I don't know...studying marketing, it really does make me sick to see how people are manipulated without even knowing it most of the time.

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

Yeah, I've actually been there. I'm sure most people in this thread make more money than we do. I manage my money correctly and if I make a mistake and mismanage my money, I go without electricity for 3 days. You won't make that mistake again, once you do it.

[deleted account]

Dana, you said the people who use them KNOW they're going to be fucked a week later but they just don't care. I don't believe that's true in all cases. Yes, I KNOW how the vicious cycle works but there are A LOT of people who just don't understand it. It's not always about being greedy.....I believe some people genuinely believe it's going to help them out of they're shitty situation and they believe it's just going to be this one time when they really need it.

Sara - posted on 09/21/2010

9,313

50

584

But Dana, you're operating under the assumption that people understand that their getting fucked...I honestly don't think some people have the ability to look at long term finances and understand that kind of impact. When I was in social services, I did budgets with families. All I have to say about that experience is HOLY SHIT. You'd be surprised. I know that doesn't account for everyone who utilizes those kinds of services, but I would venture to say it's a large chunk of them. And if you had to decide this week whether or not you got to feed your kids or pay your heating bill in January, you're probably not going to think too hard about the implications of paying so much interest on a short-term loan.

Krista - posted on 09/21/2010

12,562

16

842

It's not even that those people don't are, Dana S. But a lot of them feel they have no other choice. Banks won't give out loans for less than $5K, and they certainly won't touch you if your credit is bad. So these people, who may always be just a few hundred dollars short, are usually pretty desperate. And yeah, they know that those payday loan companies are screwing them -- but if you are broke, and your power is about to be shut off, and you only get paid in another 3 days...

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

Haha, yeah, I know that's why they're called predatory lending practices. And the people who use them KNOW that they're going to get fucked a week later, they just don't care, they want money now.

[deleted account]

Yes, Laura....those types of businesses are disgusting and doing absolutely nothing good for our countries.....although they'd suggest they're "helping". Pfffft. What a joke!

Krista - posted on 09/21/2010

12,562

16

842

Sara B. makes a good point (as always). A lot of these people were basically flim-flammed. Hell, I used to WORK for a bank, and I had a hard enough time making heads or tails of our mortgage terms.

So then you had a lot of people without that experience, who maybe weren't very savvy, and who trusted their banker to give them solid financial advice. And their banker said, "Yes, you can afford this house, and it's a great investment!. And if you find later on that you can't make the payments, just sell it! The housing market is hot and house prices are only going up, so you can't lose!"

And what happened? The housing bubble popped, and people couldn't afford these homes, but when they tried to sell them, there were no buyers. Or, they sold them for a lot less than the amount for which they were mortgaged.

But it's their fault because they wanted to live beyond their means.

Poor people are just as human and just as flawed as the rest of us. And we all want to live as well as we can for our money, right? So, if someone reputable says that they can show you a way to live a champagne life on a beer budget...is it such a huge character flaw to believe it?

But, getting back to social assistance and whatnot. I admire Mary's principles, even if I think she was a bit impractical in turning down assistance for which she was legally qualified. Not everybody operates that way. When I was laid off, I qualified for EI. Mind you, this is a system into which I had paid for over a decade. And I qualified for the maximum payment, because my pre-layoff income was quite good.

While unemployed, I looked for work. And I applied for jobs that were in my field. Did I apply for any job that came along? No. I didn't. I did not see the sense in taking a job flipping burgers for minimum wage, when I was making considerably more than that off of EI. It's not that I did not want to work, but I am also a practical person, and it just seemed incredibly foolish to me to even think of making $3 less an hour, just so that I could say I was working.

And now I'm working again, at a great job, and once again am paying into the EI system. I'll be paying into it for the rest of my working life. So I think that in the grand scheme of things, I'm definitely contributing more to the system than I am taking from it.

But, there very well might be some people who think that I should have taken a job cleaning toilets or flipping burgers, and that if I was on EI, that I shouldn't have bought myself any little luxuries. To that, I say "I pay into the system just like you do, so why do you get to decide how I should, or should not use that particular system?"

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

then a couple weeks later you can't pay your rent because you paid moneymart too much of your paycheck...vicious cycle



AND, for the record...I've never said YOUR society once in this thread...I've always said OURS

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

I've seen them here in Canada too....they are generally in bad neighbourhoods ;) same as moneymart...you know the guys who charge something like 36%to get you your paycheck a week early (so you don't lose your apartment)...that's why it's called predatory practice.

Dana - posted on 09/21/2010

11,264

35

489

Well, in this thread we're talking about "the poor", (when in actuality I think we're talking about those who happen to be poor AND are abusing the system) BUT in general it's not just the poor that's getting picked on. We all know it's a cumulative effect.

Also, I have NEVER been in a store that has done that before. So you can't go into one store in the United States and assume they're all like that.

It must have been a rent to own store or whatever they're called. Of course I really don't know, because I don't buy it unless I can pay cash right then and there. ;)

Isobel - posted on 09/21/2010

9,849

0

282

first off...Dana and Sara, you are both proving my point from the beginning...EVERYBODY is living beyond their means...most of us are screwed when ONE ball drops.

why pick on just the poor? why not look at predatory lending practices (like telling people they CAN afford a house when they CANNOT) or like telling old people to invest in garbage plans (like...was it Lehman Bros? was found guilty of) nobody in our society can even tell what they can afford anymore...because marketing companies keep finding away to make people feel like they can afford it.

that was my point near the beginning...I went into an electronic store in the States... and there were no prices on anything...just the cost of the monthly payment plan...when we asked how much a particular TV was...the salesman had to go back to find a manager to look it up!

Our society RELIES on people to be living in debt.

Even now, in this financial crisis...when they do the polls to figure out if and when we are coming out of the recession, first they ask people if they are optimistic...then they check to see how much people are borrowing and spending...it's ridiculous!

Rosie - posted on 09/21/2010

8,657

30

315

i agree that living beyond your means is a problem for EVERYONE in this country, not just those who are on assistance.

Sara - posted on 09/21/2010

9,313

50

584

Well, for you and me, sure it's that simple. We're educated people of above average intelligence. That doesn't exactly describe every person in this country. A lot of people don't understand terms of lending, and are misled about it. Sure, you and I wouldn't sign a document if we didn't understand it, but a lot of people do (obviously), or were duped into getting something that they couldn't afford. It happens.

Join Circle of Moms

Sign up for Circle of Moms and be a part of this community! Membership is just one click away.

Join Circle of Moms