Gender in names

Merry - posted on 04/18/2012 ( 168 moms have responded )

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Yep this one again :)

What's your take on naming girls boys names or boys girls names or using unisex names for either gender?



I see may many many girls being named boys names. And thus girls are creating many unisex names.



I see very very few boys being named girls names, well, like none! And even very few boys being named unisex names.



It seems that once anyone knows a girl named it, it becomes unisex, and then most moms avoid those names for their boys because it's not manly to have a girls name.



We are all about making our girls be all masculine and tough and equal rights etc so many choose mans names for their girls to give them some sort of edge. But in reality it just takes all the names from boys and makes it painfully obvious that we still value males above females.



It's cool and acceptable to name your girl a boys name because unfortunately the underlying thought is still that males are superior. But it's not ok to name your boy a girls names because unfortunately the underlying thought is that females are inferior.



So wouldn't it make sense to name our girls feminine names and stop the cycle of insinuating boys are better?





Some of my very closest friends have chosen male or unisex names for their daughters and I've never even implied I disliked the choice to them, it's so not my place to say that to my friend and I'm all for allowing moms to name their baby whatever they want, I chose a unique name so I hate it when people try to criticize your name choices.

But since I won't say this to my friends I just had to get it out here online so I apologize if I offended anyone!

And, yeah, ive posted similar stuff before but I still can't get over the underlying issues I have with keeping up this cycle of names moving over to the girls side. Soon I wonder what names will be left for boys haha.







So am I off my rocker? Or is there something to be said for this trend to name girls boys names? Will we run out of boys names? Is it sexist how boys can't be named girls names?

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Mary - posted on 04/24/2012

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This really is one of the more ridiculous debates on here. We all have different preferences when it comes to names - if we didn't, we'd all name our kids the same damned thing. Is a certain name more masculine, feminine, strong or pretty? It really depends on who you ask; for many of us, our gut level feelings or impressions of a particular name are often tied in to knowing someone or something with that same name. I'm amused by the posters on here who say they wanted a "strong" name for their son, or a "pretty" name for their girl; just because your impression of a certain name is that sounds strong does not mean that the rest of the world shares that impression.



To someone else, the name Eric is one they associate with strength, leadership, bravery, and courage. To me, it stirs up images of that whiny, crybaby kid who sat in front of me in 3rd grade, picked his nose, peed his pants repeatedly, and who never, ever knew the right answer when the teacher called on him. Neither one of us is necessarily "right". It's just the personal response that the name invokes in each individual - and that response is often times formed by a past exposure to that name.



I agree wholeheartedly with Johnny - pick a name that rolls off your tongue easily and comfortably; you'll be saying it a gazillion times over the course of your life. It really doesn't matter what another's opinions are of that name, or even what you envision that name to represent; your child is going to develop into the person that they are regardless of what you call them. They most certainly are not going to develop whatever characteristics or personality traits just because you associate those qualities with that name.

Johnny - posted on 04/23/2012

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Holy shit people. Pick a name you can imagine yourself saying multiple times a day every day for the rest of your life without getting sick of it or changing your mind, pick a name that won't saddle your kid with lifelong mocking (Nimrod, Dweezil, Friga Lesbia), pick a name that has some sort of meaning for you and your family, pick a name that signifies a trait that you want your child to possess... there are a myriad of things to consider when choosing a name. Gender? Meh, not that big a deal.



For some reason I happen to prefer names that are traditionally male but have "a" stuck on the end. Michaela (my daughter), Daniela, Erika, Alexa... I don't know why, they just sound good to me for some reason. And while I like the names Daniel and Erik, I'm not a big fan of Michael or Alex for boys. Although I could see using Alex for a girl. I ended up choosing Michaela because she was my college mentor who died at 27 from a heart defect. So it means something to me.



I don't spend a lot of time judging the names other people name their kids. I actually find that obnoxious and petty. As long as the name doesn't offer the kid up for more than the average amount of teasing, it's not up to me! Pilot Inspektor? A bit odd but fine. Nimrod? Yes a kid who I had in daycare was given that name by his parents who only spoke Chinese and didn't know the cultural meaning of the term (the name means "mighty hunter") and when told, changed it immediately. Apple? Not my first choice, but it is a bit cute. Seriously, stick to what's important and drop the pettiness!

Charlie - posted on 04/23/2012

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Yes you are off you rocker to answer that question.

You embody everything that is gender steryotyping, you take away freedom of choice and expression.

My FIANCÉ , a MAN has a predominantly female middle name. Kiersten.

You don't have to get anyone's choice of name but you have no right to make assumptions based on names.

As many have pointed out your view of a name and it's "gender" is mostly speculative and opinion based.

Geeze this thread is absurd, shocking on so many levels in this day and age of education and technology.

It frightens me that one would be so insecure to base their gender stereotypes and ideas of femininity and masculinity in a name.

"a rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

Kate CP - posted on 04/23/2012

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Maybe it's just the phlegm talking but seriously...who cares? As long as your kid isn't going to get the shit beat out of him at school for having a stupid name (and we've all seen some REALLY stupid names) then who gives a rat's ass what kind of name they have?

[deleted account]

I don't think anyone here actually cares what others think of their name choice, but it was an interesting topic to discuss. I doubt anyone here would change their child's name upon hearing "Gee....I think that's to feminine for a boy" or vise versa, but it IS interesting to read about societal perception of certain names and the effects that names have on society. We cannot deny that both society and names have very notable effects on each other as a whole.

If we see a kid named William, we will assume it is a boy because society has conditioned us to. I think the deeper context of this debate was to see if societal perception of certain names, and of femininity as a weakness, could be effected by certain naming trends--in particular naming girls traditionally boys names.

We know that boy's names can take on a feminine air because Ashley, for example was a very strong boy's name and is now in most places considered very feminine, but the question remains in whether girl's names could take on a masculine air if societal trends lead to more of them being used for boys.

No one thinks that having a masculine name makes a boy any more masculine. I doubt anyone thinks giving a little girl a masculine name or unisex name will make her a tom boy, but it is interesting to see if the name will effect society's perception of the girl or not. I don't think it will at this point, but I think society would perceive a little boy with a very feminine name, say Elizabeth, for example, as being feminine--which unfortunately is still considered a weakness in boys.

I think the subject was, could we use naming trends to effect the societal perception that women are weaker? Could taking the masculinity/femininity out names take the societal perception of weakness out of women. I KNOW individually, we do not see women as a weaker sex, but we cannot deny that there are signs that society as a whole still does.

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Merry - posted on 06/21/2012

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I'm in Wisconsin and I've never heard of a male named Kelly. I know plenty girls named it though.
Rope? Lol I kinda like blue or Bo but rope seems really odd to me.
Montana IMO sounds quite feminine based on the letters.
I think it's a pretty name though.

[deleted account]

That is interesting, Sherri, I'm on the East Coast too (of the US), but here Kelly is a very common man's name. Though I do know one girl besides myself who has it. I think it has pretty much reached unisex status around here.



Also, Sharon, I like your taste in names. My father's name is Blue. I LOVE that name, and have never known anyone other than my father to have it.

Sherri - posted on 06/20/2012

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I think if I ever heard a man named Kelly I would laugh. I wouldn't do it to be mean but where I live on the East Coast it is strictly a girls name. I know soooo many Kelly's (including my sister). Everyone being a girl. It was soooo popular for girls born in the 70's, 80's and 90's.



According to the U.S. Social Security Administration, Kelly, girl's name, was ranked #999 in 1944, then steadily gained popularity through 1977 (#10), before declining (#212 in 2006)

[deleted account]

Kool,
I'm the Montana mom and had never heard of anyone with that name before.

I just wanted a unique name and had one.

Some of my other choices were Beau or Bo. Tex, Rope, Blue.

I know, I'm weird, but that is just me.

Jennifer - posted on 06/20/2012

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WOW! Name choices are so personal, I kinda knew this topic would get heated!

My second daughter is the name most people have a problem with. Dylan has always been a strong female name to me. I had friends named Dylan as a child, three, all girls. DeeDee, Ann and Dylan is what they went by. It was on the list of upcoming popular girls names that year, and also in the top 10 sexyist female names. Imagine my surprise when it seems every boy in the world is named Dylan now!! LOL! I knew it was unisex, but I thought 'Dillon' is how the boys name was spelled. *Sigh* I don't mind, and my daughter likes it, so no big deal to us......Except when people who have daughters named Dakota, Alex, Logan, and Kelly say something to me! True story!!

Another lady posted about her daughter Montana, and how it was feminine. To me, that is a unisex name. I know several boys with the name. It just depends where you are, and to a large part, who you've known.

My husband named his son Anthony, before I came along, and thought it was a very masculine name. My son started to go by Tony in 2nd grade. We moved to a different school district, and he refuses to be called that anymore, due to 2 girls named Toni!

I know plenty of men named Lynn, Kelly, Jamie, and Bobby. I even know men named Ashley and Kimberly(both WERE male names) I don't think people are near as scared of naming their sons unisex names as people think. I live in red-neck central. If Bubba came name his boy Ray Lynn and be happy(one of my daughter classmates, very true!), surely Bif from NY wouldn't have a problem with a 'sissy' name!

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I have 2 boys and 2 girls, I lean toward boy names for boys and girl names for girls. However, I don't take a hard stand anywhere. Name your babies what you want.

Raelene Sharon shortened to Rae
Weston Terrance shortened to Wes
Montana Lee shortened to Tana
Wyatt Landry not usually shortened (although I have been known to call him Wy)

It is confusing though when girls are boys and boys are girls.

We have 2 Dakota's and 2 Daytona's in our school. One is a family of 2 sisters and the other is a family of 2 brothers. Never know for sure who the kids are talking about.

Sister in law named Kyle and neice named Ryan another neice named Bret. Nephew with initials D.O.G. and another with J.C.G.

I always keep in mind, you can't tell a book by it's cover and you can't tell a kid by the name they were given.

Mandian - posted on 06/19/2012

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My daughter's name is Jonnie (pronounced Johnny). I named her after my father. She was his 20th grandchild and not one of them was named after him. So that is how she got her name :)

Becky - posted on 05/30/2012

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There are a lot of unisex names that I really like - Madison, Jordan(Jordanne, Jordyn...), Mason, Taylor, Payton (which I always thought was a girl name thanks to One Tree Hill, lol) But I do tend to associate them more strongly with one gender or the other, so for instance, I would name a boy Mason, but not a girl. I would name a girl Madison, but not a boy. As it turned out though, my boys all have names that are not unisex (as far as I know anyway!) Cole, Zachary, and Adam. And if we'd had a girl, her name would have been Emily, which is very feminine. My husband is very traditional when it comes to names and didn't like the unisex ones.
I have nicknames for all my kids, even the two whose names can't really be shortened. Cole is Co-co or Coley (his dad hates that!), Zachary is Zach, of course, and Adam is Addi, which sounds very feminine. Haha, maybe that's because he was supposed to be my girl! :) As they grow up, if they don't like those nicknames, I won't use them. I'm Rebecca, but go by Becky. I just think Becky suits my personality better.

Funch357 - posted on 05/21/2012

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My son's name is Kelly. Here in the U.S. that's usually a girl's name. In Ireland it's usually a boy's name. I intentionally wanted him to have a gender neutral name. I have a gender neutral middle name & it's been helpful to have that as a fallback when job hunting.



Anyway, son's name is short for my last name. Why gender neutral? Because I want people to judge him, esp. when it comes to applying for jobs, based on his abilities, not his gender.



If he wants to, he's free to use his middle name instead, which is an unusual Asian-Indian name that's not easily identified as male or female except by people who are Indian or know a lot about Indian culture.



Gender equality is *extremely* important to me as is people being free to be who they are and like what they want -- to not be pigeonholed into pink tricycles or guns or whatever from the git-go.

[deleted account]

I remember Felix the Cat. I used to have a knitted toy of Felix. I should have kept it, it was so cute.

Jakki - posted on 05/18/2012

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Well it's funny you mentioned Felix the Cat - ever since my boy Felix was born I have confused him with our cat 's name.

eg I would say to my husband "oh I just booted Felix outside because he was irritating me" (this was when Felix the human was 3 months old). So maybe the Felix the Cat thing really was deep in my mind.

But apart from that - nobody else has ever mentioned the Felix the Cat cartoon to my son, I think it's out of date now.

Aleks - posted on 05/18/2012

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Whats worse is that she probably will get a nickname such as "pussy" he he he
(remember Felix the cat?)

[deleted account]

HA! Well Jessica Simpson called her daughter Maxwell, maybe she could be friends with the little girl called Felix!! Little girls called Felix and Maxwell.... the mind boggles

Jakki - posted on 05/17/2012

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We were once having a picnic in a park for my son Felix's birthday. Low and behold, there was a girl there having a birthday party, and she was called Felix too!

I was told off by some of my friends for pulling a face and saying "who'd call their daughter Felix?" and I take their point that I shouldn't criticise somebody else's choice.

(But amongst you guys I can still ask - why would you do that? For the rest of her life she's going to see insensitive people like me react just like I did. That's going to be a burden for her).

Tracie - posted on 05/17/2012

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I named my daughter Peyton. I had only ever heard it used as a girl's name. I was stunned when Peyton Manning came along. He might as well have been named Melissa in my eyes!

I recently met a really nice woman. We were getting along great and then we started talking about our kids. I found out that she had a son the same age as my daughter and he was named Peyton! I thought it was a cute/funny coincidence, but she shot me daggers for having a daughter named Peyton. It's not my fault she gave her son a girl's name! (just kidding!)

Aleks - posted on 05/09/2012

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Thank you Kelly for writing so well what I was actually thinking regarding this post/debate. After reading quite a few posts getting all of their nickers in a twist over this (especially the defensive posts of "what do you care that others have named their daughter a traditionally boys name?" - ITS A FUCKING DEBATE FFS! Is what I wanted to scream at my computer screan..lol) I just couldn't be bothered....
And obviously, this was a pretty good debate topic.. heck, it went on for 8 pages :-)

Anyway, thank you for posting some sanity to this topic, rather than overly emotional and generally illogical rants :-)

Karen - posted on 05/09/2012

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We will never run out of names because people keep making up new ones that I have never heard before!

My name is Karen, which was once a male name. My sister Ashley's name was once a male name too. I guess they really do become female names after a while.

Carlie - posted on 04/26/2012

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I think a big deal is being made of something....that isn't a big deal at all. You can't ask your child, right? Right. Even if other people in your life offer insight and input into your unborn child's life... it is your (and/or your spouse) right to make a decision such as this one.



My daughter's first name is Cooper. I chose this name because I wanted something different for her. And here is the kicker:



IT IS OK TO BE DIFFERENT. And isn't that what this post is about? Yes. It is. A name is just a name. That's it. Albeit...a DIFFERENT one. :)

Aleks - posted on 04/26/2012

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lol@Stifler's Mum.... I chose a name for my 1st born son, Jacob, thinking that it is not a widely used name (although it is a well known name) and was happy to find out that his name was like in the 20s or 30s for the year of his birth - Especially since every other boy being born at around the time seemed to have been named Jack, Isaac, Thomas, Harrison, Blake etc

I was aiming for a "classic", well known, but not over used name, and one that made sense to my family in Poland ( For example Harrison or Blake would have been kind of a WTF? for them), and names from the Bible seem to tick that box, plus while I am not religious I find these names of strong moral standing (usually...lol, not all of them but a lot of them...lol).

Lo- and - behold. Went to school and was in a grade with 2 other boys with the same name (while there was only one Jack, no Isaacs and I think there *may be* a Thomas...lol). And it seems that just about ever year level in his school has AT LEAST one Jacob. There are also a few in the neighbourhood, and I have come across a few in the playgroups and kindergarden - it seems that the area where I live loves that name!!!

While I named my girl Emma (because it really suited her, my preferances were for a bit "stronger", in my eyes, names such as Victoria, Veronica, Anastasja as well as softer and "feminine" ones such as Lilia, Sara and Maya) and while the name at the time was in the top 10 or 20 for the year of birth... I hardly seem to come across many at all in the area where I live :-D

Guess its just the lack of the draw....lol

Stifler's - posted on 04/26/2012

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I just liked my kids names. The only thing I didn't want was a name everyone else would choose aheemmm EMMA and they would have 5 other people named that in their class at school.

Sal - posted on 04/26/2012

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Well while I wanted a definate girl names for my daughter I wanted a strong name also so I dont see strong being a male trait, but I gave them softer, prettier middle names Ingrid grace and Ursula rose

Sarah - posted on 04/24/2012

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There was only 1 other post I read (and I reviewed them again) that made reference to using a "strong" name for a boy. Saying "I want my son to have a strong name", and " I wanted a strong name for our son" are the exact same thing. I still believe her comment was directed towards me. If she stated it wasn't her intention doesn't change the fact that it was directed towards myself or others that feel the same way. I'm not back pedaling at all because my opinion is still valid regardless of whether the intent of her comment was directed towards me or not. I have nothing to apologize for. I am responding to her comments, just as she responded to mine. In fact, she "liked" my comment.

As I said before, TO ME, a strong name is one that doesn't end in a vowel sound. I'm not judging anyone's opinions on names. I was responding to JL's opinion that 'wanting' a strong name for a boy is somehow meaning that I am perpetuating sexist stereotypes and teaching him that he is better than a girl. I disagree with this comment. I also don't agree, nor did I get from anyone's comments that if they didn't pick a "masculine" name for their son he would be somehow less of a boy, or less of a girl if she had a "boy" name. I think in some ways our views are similar in that I think we are all agreeing that judgement of a person's name choice is not appropriate or acceptable, but what I am disagreeing with is the point that if you have a preference for either a masculine or feminine name for your child that you are somehow perpetuating sexist stereotypes and teaching inequality to your children. I find this offensive because I think it doesn't respect that some people just prefer certain names for their children over others. I don't believe it has anything to do with anything other than what they like. Just like some people like chocolate and others don't, or some people like hot weather and some people cold. It's a preference. It doesn't necessarily reflect your world views, just your attraction to a particular thing. I've known MANY women who have named their children things I think are horrendous. Do I tell them that? NO! It's not my place. Just like not everyone will like their names, not everyone likes the ones I selected for my children, and that's okay. That's what makes us all unique and special.

Jodi - posted on 04/24/2012

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"Whether your comment was specifically made to me is irrelevant because my point is the same."

"Since she directly quoted my words, I believe her comment was in reference to my opinion"

So did she directly quote your words or not? That is what you indicated in your first post, and now you are backpedalling? At least have the courtesy to apologise for accusing her of being in specific reference to your opinion. THEN, feel free to further explain your opinion, but heck, at least admit you made an error.

BTW......can I ask WHAT everyone things this *strong* name is? Wouldn't that be a cultural thing? I ask because I genuinely don't understand this view of a strong boys' name. WTF does that actually mean? And does what YOU think it means mean the same thing to the pregnant lady down the street?

Johnny - posted on 04/24/2012

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I couldn't agree more about names having different meanings to different people. One of my favorite boys names was always Yuri, after Omar Sharif's character in Doctor Zhivago. It also happens to be a Russian name which is perfect considering that I was married to a Russian. Unfortunately, I then met a old school mate of Steve's named Yuri, and was disgusted as I watched him, a 40 year old man, chase after teenage high school girls and plan all his vacations in the Phillipines and Thailand (I'm sure we can figure out why). Needless to say, Yuri was quickly crossed off my list of favorite names. It's not that I think that if I named a boy Yuri that he would grow up to be either a pedophile or a handsome womanizing doctor. It's just that now every time I hear the name I feel very sad.

JL - posted on 04/24/2012

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"I still fail to see how someone else's like of a "boy's" name for their daughter OR vice versa is anyone else business. How is it hurting your choice exactly? Because you ( a general you to all those who believe it sexist) are actually saying that if a girl has your son's name it'll make the name mean less? Sound less? Lose strength? What exactly do you fear? No one is saying that YOU have to all pick unisex names. If you want to name your kids Arthur and Elizabeth so people can remember which one is which then do so. And if someone else names their kids Charlie and Sam and people aren't able to figure out when they meet the kid then so be it."


Cathy nailed the point I was making right on the head!!

I don't see sexism in naming your kid a gender specific name or a non gender specific name. I don't see the naming of your daughter with a "pretty soft names" as being sexist. Or naming your son with a "strong" name as being sexist. I don't see naming your daughter a name that traditionally was held by boys sexist. I don't see naming your son a name that is also used by girls sexist.

MY POINT WAS ...that the whole naming thing is NOT sexist and this thread is way over blown over.....what....names. Come on.

The original post was about claiming that naming a girl a tradition boys name like Ryan was upsetting to the poster because it somehow devalued the masculinity of the name and that because boys weren't using girls names that this somehow all equaled out to being sexist. I disagreed with that point in all intent and purposes. I disagree with the entire premise that the way you choose your child's name has some underlying sexist notion to it.

I found it odd that a parent would find it so horrible that her son's middle name was the same as a girls first name and that she found the whole idea sexist. I don't think it is sexist. I think it is petty and an over obsession with names.

Just name your kid what you want but if you are looking at all the kids around you playing at the playground and going through their mentally names and thinking..Pssh that little girl shouldn't be named Ryan that is boys name and how come it is ok for a girl to have a boys name but a boy can't have a girls name..that is sexist. Well my point was REALLY, that is an issue for you. Wow, with the world the way it is we are pissing on each other about names because OH MY a girl has WHAT a boys name...dun dun dun....

Stop fixating on what other people name their kids and claiming it's sexism. Who cares. If Ashley is a name that moves them and they want to name their son Ashley even though mostly girls carry that name now...Who cares..Is that sexist. Hell No it isn't. If someone likes the name Ryan and it makes them think of a beautiful little girl running around playing and they envision their daughter with that name...Who care..Is that sexist. Hell No.

BTW I named my son a name that happens to be unisex. And not because I was fixated on names that were unisex because I wanted to make some fucking feminist point. I named him after an actor from Star Wars because I am a scifi geek and loved the way the name sounded.

Like Mary said what may be a great name to the parent may be for others a name that reminds of snotty like kids we disliked or that annoying mean girl in class that was always flipping her hair in your face. So not matter what name you pick for your kid there will be at least one adult who will not like it and at least one child out there who will pick on them no matter how normal or gender appropriate that name is.

I am not a fan of the name Ashley and that has nothing to do with because boys or girls have it but because I went to elementary school with 4 girls named Ashley who were the pettiest most annoying girls ever. That name reminds me of them.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/24/2012

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I do have to add, that I am still unsure of what a strong and/or pretty name really is. I do agree with Johnny and Mary in regards to it is a personal preference and that's all it is. A personal preference entails so many things. Everyone is going to have their own perception, some may like the name you have chosen and some not so much. Who really cares. I know I don't. i only care what I name my children.

I do agree, though, with some others that it is appropriate to pick names that fit the child's gender. We are either male or female. It is nice to distinguish such a thing with proper naming convention.

In regards to unisex names, well obviously they are defined as unisex because they are for either gender. I could careless really. I mean, I named my daughter Courtnie. I know there are males with that very name. In my mind, though, it is a girls name. That does not mean it isn't in another's mind. Which is fine with me. It is all about what I think for my choices, not what other's think of my choices. ;)

IMO - it is just a name. There will be so many more important things to worry about. Just make sure you like it. ;)

Sal - posted on 04/24/2012

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The thing I find interesting is that people seem to have forgotten that the unisex names have sort of evolved from male and female versions of the same name quiet often, drew might just be named drew now for either sex but was Andrew or andrian or rea is I
Either but probally evolved from Raymond and ralene (or maraea is is the case for a dear gf of mine) or. Sam from samual or samatha so where probally in my generation my cousin (for exmple but there are millions of others) was named Antonia but we all called her toni now it is just they we have simplified to unisex names more easily and frequently

Sherri - posted on 04/23/2012

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@Laura I actually know a few little girls named Sailor or Saylor it is predominately a girls name in the US.

# 2010 – 269 baby girls and 24 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2009 – 277 baby girls and 21 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2008 – 259 baby girls and 34 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2007 – 217 baby girls and 31 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2006 – 200 baby girls and 28 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2005 – 200 baby girls and 22 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2004 – 174 baby girls and 29 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2003 – 166 baby girls and 19 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2002 – 146 baby girls and 28 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2001 – 179 baby girls and 19 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 2000 – 130 baby girls and at least 17 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 1999 – 145 baby girls and 24 baby boys named Saylor/Sailor
# 1998 – 54 baby girls and 16 baby boys named Saylor/Sailo

Kate CP - posted on 04/23/2012

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Sweet merciful fuck.

It's a name. It's not YOUR name. It's not your KID'S name. WHY THE HOLY FUCK DO YOU CARE?! It's not abusive to name a girl Ryan or Drew or Mason or Carter. It's not abusive to name a boy Ashley or Sharon or Lindsey. It IS abusive to name a child "Fuckwad" or "Herpes" or "Hitler" or "Arian Nation".

A girl named Parker isn't odd. A girl named Apple is odd. A boy named Loren isn't odd. A boy named Pilot Inspektor is REALLY fuckin' odd.

Seriously people. SERIOUSLY??

Sarah - posted on 04/23/2012

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Whether your comment was specifically made to me is irrelevant because my point is the same. It appears that you are assuming those who want a strong name are because it is more masculine. No one said boys were stronger or more superior to girls, except you. you can preach all you want about ending sexism, but until you name your daughter Frank or Anthony or your son Isabella or Elizabeth, you perpetuate this yourself and are guilty of the same sexism you claim to be trying to end. It is one thing to want equality and a total other thing to deny that gender differences do existing the society we live in. Should women receive fair and equal pay fir their Labour? Yes. Should men be allowed to take parental Leave? Yes. Should someone identify themselves with a gender that doesn't match society expectations of what they should be based on their genitalia? sure. But leaving children open to the obvious teasing they would receive if they had a name so obviously different than what their actual gender is is ridiculous and cruel, all because their mother wants to make a point that it doesn't Matter? Because in reality it does.

JL - posted on 04/23/2012

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Oh and yes NOW I am referring to Sarah Klauzer since she made a post directed to me.

JL - posted on 04/23/2012

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FFS I was making a generalized comment about ALL the particular comments which were concerned with specifically only choosing and naming boy's strong sounding MASCULINE names and how naming girls names that may be masculine and strong will somehow make them less feminine. When I refer to one person specifically I quote them then respond directly to them. I still don't see in my post where I did that with you....

TBH I don't even really remember what was even in your post. It obviously wasn't one of the ones that got me particularly worked up otherwise I would remember it and would have responded directly to YOU. I read through the whole thread and from reading ALL the posts I had an opinion based off of several points made in several parts of the thread that were in various posts concerning the specific question of masculinity and femininity. Obviously the point I was making was completely missed. If you didn't notice well....you were not the sole person in this entire thread who used the word strong in reference to names. Way to make assumptions. I am going to now jump off the proverbial high horse and go read up on the women's rights events I will be marching and rallying for this weekend. Because I don't just talk bullshit about ending sexism I actually rally against it.

I could honestly care less what anyone names their kids. Unless you name them something like Eva Braun and Adolf Hitler but this OP wasn't about caring what you named your kids it was about sexism associated with more and more girls having boys names....Unless I read the wrong thread......that was what I was responding to.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/23/2012

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Well I think I should have named my son Julia and my daughter Frank. How about that? Now, they wouldn't get teased or anything, right? FFS. Seriously. It makes sense to do our best in picking names to go with the gender. However, I do not think that is the only thing "most" people are thinking when they pick a name. They are looking for meaning, how it sounds (to them), uniqueness, eay to pronunce/hard to pronounce and they are thinking of the kid that will live with it forever.



I fail to see how giving our gender specific child a gender specific name is creating sexism. How about those that do not pick "male/female" names for their child but MAKE them play with gender specific toys and wear ONLY gender specific clothes. What makes them more sexist? The name they chose or all the other acts they display and force upon the child?



Honestly, I prefer to not invoke ridicule and bullying on my kid because of a stupid ass name. We are a world of male and female. Kids are cruel and I am not about to be the minority and start screwing with my kids, just because some people thinks it is sexist not to. When we start all being born with both genitals, than come talk to me about switching gender specific names. Until then I will be picking male names for my "male" children and female names for my "female" children. Meh.



As for all the unisex names out there. Cool, I will let other mothers use them. Do I make comments about it to my children? No. Do I say if I do/don't like a certain name in front of them? Yep. It has nothing to do with gender, though, it has to do with preference. I have an opinion. They can have their own when the time comes. ;)



Do I care what anyone else calls their kid? Not at all. It isn't my kid that has to live with it. Which IS my biggest thought when I am picking a name for my children.

Jodi - posted on 04/23/2012

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Where did she quote your words? You didn't say "I want my son to have a strong name", you said " I wanted a strong name for our son.". I see no direct quote. You also were not the ONLY person saying they wanted a *strong* name (whatever that means, because that would be kind of subjective, really) for their sons, so I am pretty sure Joy wasn't targeting one particular opinion there.

Sarah - posted on 04/23/2012

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Since she directly quoted my words, I believe her comment was in reference to my opinion. It didn't "strike a nerve." I'm pointing out that the stereotypes she is referring to are not my beliefs, but since she made assumptions on my reason that they must be hers. I dont think I was lashing out, that is called a response, this is a debate after all, isn't It?

Charlie - posted on 04/23/2012

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Did Joy Hit a nerve there Sarah ? I can't see any other reason for such an overreaction involving lashing out by making assumptions of her attitude while simultaniously missing her point.

[deleted account]

And as for sexism, what is so wrong with separating the male and female? After all, we are different (no, I didn't say one is better and one is worse... I said we are DIFFERENT) and why should we pretend otherwise?

[deleted account]

@Kate... in regards to names with "a" in them, I think she means names that end in "a". Not just with "a" somewhere in the mix. As far as I understand it, the name that ends in "a" is the feminine form.

Sarah - posted on 04/23/2012

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Jl your better than thou attitude is offensive and poorly directed. Wanting a strong name for my child is not a bad thing nor does it denote any preference or superiority of gender. I never once said I wanted a masculine name, I said I wanted a strong name. If you think that means masculine, whose own perceptions are reflected by that. To me this meant a name that didn't end in a vowel sound. We picked my husbands late grandfathers name because we both liked the name and wanted to honor a man who played an integral part of forming who my husband is. When we had our daughter, we named her after a patient I had, a special needs child that really touched my heart. Yes, I prefer a softer sound for girls names, but that does not mean I don't believe women can and should not be as strong as a man. Whatever I chose to name my children is not for you to judge and make assumptions on how I view gender or my world views. Your ASSUMPTIONS on other peoples choices are what is perpetuating this stereotypes, not someone else's preference on how a name sounds.

JL - posted on 04/23/2012

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I want my son to have a strong name..Umm..then just name him Strong, Muscle, or Bicep because a boy is not manly enough unless he has a strong name. I can't even keep a straight face typing this. As a feminist I find this thread absolutely redonkulous. Some of you don't even see the fact that your issue with names is what is actually sexist and creating an issue for kids. It's not girls taking boys names and not enough boys taking girls names. It's your adult reaction to it that brings sexism, controlled gender values and gender classification to the names. Your need to have your son have a strong name is what teaches HIM that girls are beneath him and NOT strong. So when your son says to you one day, "Eww I don't want to be like a girl or have a girls name." When your son thinks that being like called a girl is one of the worse things that be could be accused of.....Ask yourself where the hell did he learned that from.....

Kate CP - posted on 04/23/2012

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Max. Sam. Tailor.

All "boy" names. All have an A. And all have been used for girls. So have Mason and Carter.

Sorry to say this, Laura, but your "rules" for naming kids are stupid. Most names have a meaning behind them or are a different language. For example:

Laura: Laurel, or plant. [MASCULINE FORMS: Lauro (Italian), Laurus (Late Roman) ]

Krista: German variant of Christina (Christian), saint tortured by her pagan father [MASCULINE FORMS: Christian, Kristian (Scandinavian), Carsten, Christian, Karsten (German), Kristijan, Kristjan (Slovene), Kristijan (Serbian), Kristijan (Croatian), Christian (English)]

Cathy: Short for Catherine (French from Katherine, from the Greek Aikaterine), meaning "Each of the two"

Amanda: from Latin meaning "Lovable or worthy of love" [MASCULINE FORMS: Amando (Spanish), Amando (Portuguese), Amando (Italian), Amand (German), Amandus (Late Roman)]

Janice: elaborate from of Jane, Medieval English form of Jehanne, an Old French feminine form of Johannes (JOHN) [Masculine]


So, if you REALLY want to get picky...almost ALL names are male names with a female variant. That's just how names originated. There are very few genuinely "feminine" names out there.

Merry - posted on 04/23/2012

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It sounds male to me, strong sounds, few vowels, no a in it at all. Most names that are also jobs are male, hunter, gunner, carter, mason, fisher, archer, ranger, sailor. I'venot seen many females named after jobs really.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/23/2012

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Rosie---i think the only problem i have ever had with a name is when i heard someone named their kid adolf hitler.

I hear you there Rosie... Goodness, how could a parent use such a name. **shivers**

Merry - posted on 04/23/2012

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See I have little issue with a kid named pilot lol. At least it's a word and masculine. :)

It's not the individuals I worry about its the trend in general that bugs me, it's not new but it is growing.

Soon you will see girls named Jacob and Benjamin and Steven and Carl. Seriously I just don't get it.

Rosie - posted on 04/23/2012

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i guess i don't really care about what people name their kid, and what gender the name is. if i like it, it gets used. if someone wants to name their kid pilot inspektor go right ahead, i don't give a shit. if someone wants to spell their kids name unusual i think it's neat, if they spell it regular i think it's neat. meh, i think the only problem i have ever had with a name is when i heard someone named their kid adolf hitler. goes a little too far imo.

Merry - posted on 04/23/2012

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Ashley and Lindsey aren't girls names on boys. They're boys names on girls!

They've just been taken so much we forgot that they were boys names!

Amanda - posted on 04/23/2012

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i personally think there is nothing wrong with unisex names or naming girls boy names or naming boys girls names if it fits..or well if the parent likes it..i don't think a boy should be named ashley or lindsey personally but then again now that i think about it i think that is the only girls names i have heard for boys and i kind of like boys names for girls..but only certain names because sometimes the name just belongs to the boys :)

Sarah - posted on 04/22/2012

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My son plays with dolls and loves his sisters pink ride on car. My daughter plays with toy cars. I agree that masculinity and femininity are not defined by a name, however, we live in a society where that is not always agreed on. I wanted a strong name for our son. We picked my husbands grandfathers name. I wanted a feminine name for my daughter because I like them more. I like a softer name for a girl. That is my preference and that is okay. We named our daughter after a patient I once had.

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