How wrong was this bus driver?

Sharon - posted on 03/02/2011 ( 54 moms have responded )

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http://www.kirotv.com/news/27046618/deta...

SNOHOMISH COUNTY, Washington -- A local mother said she is outraged after seeing surveillance video showing her 6-year-old daughter getting jerked to the floor of her school bus by a Snohomish School District bus driver.

School officials first told KIRO 7 news partner The Daily Herald in Everett about the incident that occurred on Jan. 20.

School bus surveillance video shows that the 63-year-old bus driver had lost his patience with students behind him. When a kindergarten student stands up and faces the back of the moving bus, the driver grabs her over his shoulder, grabs her by her backpack and roughly yanks her to the ground.

“That’s what’s going to happen if I hit the brakes. Now go in that seat and sit down!” the driver is heard saying on the video.

WATCH IT: School Bus Video Shows Girl Jerked To Floor By Driver

The Cathcart Elementary student in the video is Kynzie Reavely. Her mother, Ashley Reavely, said she might have never have known about the incident, but a student reported it to the school, and the school called Reavely.

“They said a little girl on her bus had been pulled down by the bus driver. They didn’t tell me it was Kynzie, and they said Kynzie might be traumatized by it,” said Reavely.

Reavely said she found out from her daughter that she was the student who was pulled down.

“I said, ‘Well I heard the bus driver put his hands on a little girl on your bus,’ and she said, ‘No mommy, he put his hands on me,’” said Reavely.

When the school showed Reavely the video, Reavely said she wanted to file assault charges.

“There should be more of a law when it comes to assault, especially on a little kid,” said Reavely.

“I’m not going to ride the bus anymore,” said Kynzie.

The Snohomish School District released the following statement:

"The Snohomish School District acted on the matter immediately upon learning of the Jan. 20 incident on a Cathcart Elementary afternoon bus route. The bus driver in question was placed on leave pending an investigation. He subsequently no longer works for the District, and the route has been reassigned. We reported the situation to the Snohomish County Sheriff and referred the incident to OSPI for further investigation."

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I don't think he was wrong enough to be fired. I'm not altogether happy about it, but look at where she is at? If he had slammed on the brakes, chances are she wouldn't have hit the floor, she would have hit the windshield, possibly gone through it and wound up dead.

I think being jerked to the floor is the LEAST painful lesson she could have gotten in "stay in your seat."

In listening to her mother and the childs' snotty "I won't be taking the bus anymore" bullshit, I'm not surprised at all that she stood up and turned to face the rear of the bus. What for? What child gets out of their seat? My kids learned their lesson when I slammed on the brakes to avoid killing a cat that darted into the road. EVERYTHING on the seats slammed into the backs of the seats, dashboard and windshield. It scared the piss out of them. GOOD.

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Vegemite - posted on 03/04/2011

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My grandmother in law once told me "It's better for your kids the kicked in the bum by your boot than to be kicked in the head by the horses hoof."

I completely agree and that's what the driver did. He was probably petrified of a child getting out of their seat, being thrown down the isle and seriously injured.

If that had been my kid they'd be in trouble for standing up on the bus and not doing what they were told by the adult in charge of them at the time.

It sounds like this girl is a little brat and she learnt in from her mother.

Lindsay - posted on 03/03/2011

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The way I understand the seatbelts on busses thing is that it's actually safer for the kids to not be buckled up. In the event of an accident, the kids need to be able to get off the bus as quickly as possible. Dealing with restraints could actually do more harm than good.

[deleted account]

You know what surprises me? I haven't been on a school bus in....well over 20 years so....I figured by this point in time, they would have seat belts on school busses. I mean, if I can get a giant ticket for not having my 3 year old properly restrained in my car, then why is it ok for him to get onto a bus that is 3 times bigger than my car and ride in a giant seat unrestrained?

[deleted account]

This, along with Danielle's thread about a week ago, is exactly why there should be two adults on school buses. How do you expect someone to safely drive a vehicle while supervising 30+ children...especially children with parents that won't discipline them for breaking a school bus safety rule...NO STANDING.

Amie - posted on 03/03/2011

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While he definitely could have handled that better. If the kids don't listen up here after 2 warnings, they get kicked off the bus. The parents are expected to find other transportation for them. Which could really suck for some since all schools start at the same time but not all of them are in the same town. (Like us, our younger ones go to elementary in one town, our oldest goes to another in a different town.)

They are to sit, be quiet and not mess around. The bus driver gives out one warning, then the school officials do, after that it's up to the parents to find a new way for their kids to get to school. We just moved to a rural setting for our kids, they already knew how to behave on a bus though - they were taught while we were still in the city during field trips.

The driver was in the wrong for how he handled it. That little girl should have been handed a warning about being one step closer to being kicked off for not obeying bus rules instead. As it is written on our bus rules; It's a privilege - not a right.

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Sally - posted on 02/09/2012

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I don't think the bus driver was wrong not only was the girl a danger to herself she was a danger to the other children. What if she'd tripped or something and distracted the driver who then had a accident. If i was one of those other childrens parents , id behaving words with the mother about her kid

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/08/2012

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He was already at his wits end, you could tell he was already angry. She just happened to be in his line of contact... he should've pulled over and reconducted his demeanor. All kids can get annoying, I think the ones in the back were what got the bus driver all worked up to begin with. However, there is no excuse for the girl to be turned around either but I remember doing it all the time while on the bus! I don't remember all of us on a packed bus sitting straight forward like angels...



A very good reason, as others have stated to have an attendant on the bus and in IMO 3 point seatbelts. This kid or any of them would not have been out of their seat or turning the wrong way if these two things were on the bus.

Mrs. - posted on 02/08/2012

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On one hand, the little girl and no one else on that bus will ever be standing up again...so lesson was learned. Just not sure the ends justified the means on this one.



In the actual video I saw on youtube, it was just a short clip, you have no idea how fast they are going, how many times she's been asked to sit down or anything. I have no doubt the little girl was not listening and was putting herself in danger by doing that. There is a blame to be put on the kid and her level of respect for authority before the snatch and grab.



The actual snatch and grab was very violent looking. He may have been justified in upping the level of discipline...pulling the bus over and telling her what could happen if she kept up the behaviour. However, in trying to "protect her" from a potential risk if he were to hit on the brakes suddenly, he basically used her as a crash test dummy. At that point, he is not protecting her, but upping the risk of head injury. He is lucky, he could have given that kid a serious neck or head injury, by what you can see in the video. You never know, it take so little force to fuck up the rest of a kid's life.



See, I happen to believe he was justified in reacting strongly and maybe in a physical manner. However, I don't think he needed to yank the kid up and down onto the floor to get the message across.



I have no doubt the kid is probably annoying and doesn't listen...doesn't mean she should get a head injury out of it.

Jodi - posted on 02/08/2012

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I'm kind of on the fence here. I mean, on the one hand, yeah, he could definately had saved her life with his little "lesson", on the other hand, it's not up to the bus driver to be giving lessons to a child. He should have pulled over and gotten everything under control...himself included.



I think I would have words with him along the lines of, "please don't put your hands on my child, I understand you were doing it out of concern, and frustrationa s well, but next time I want to know and *I* will take care of disciplining my child, that is not your job." But, I'm not in that situation, I never have been, I could see myself losing it over someone putting their hands on my child in the manner described.



The kid should have known better, a 6 year old knows to sit their butt down when a vehicle is in motion, an adult bus driver knows he shouldn't be yanking kids to the floor. I do wonder if the child received an disciplinary action though? Because, you can bet your butt, my child would think twice about that behavior again when I was through with her! (And I don't mean that in a physical punishment kind of way. Just for the record.)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/08/2012

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I'm sorry but he definitely could've been much more adult like. I do not think that was an acceptable manor he took at all! If it were my kid I would've been having some harsh words with him but I definitely would not want him fired. I would definitely be speaking to my child as well, as the girl was not following the rules. However, the bus driver was not following the rules either, he cannot be doing things like that, regardless of how stressed he was. I do not spank or hit my kids, I would never ever pull them like that, no one else had better be. He should have stopped the bus and got himself and the bus back under control!!

Trina - posted on 02/08/2012

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As A parent if my child is misbehaving and someone does an action like that may later save his life I would back the bus driver up. I wish my child would stand up on the bus and me find out about it

Krista - posted on 03/05/2011

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I didn't read all of the previous comments, but I watched the video, and here's my take:
The bus driver was obviously already losing patience and didn't react appropriately to the little girl standing up. No, it's not safe for her to be standing, but he has no right to put his hands on her. I teach 6 year olds, and they try your patience like crazy, but if you can't deal with children without losing it on them, you shouldn't have a job that involves interacting with them on a daily basis.

If the little girl is a problem, her mom should be made aware, and if the behaviour continues, she should not be allowed on the bus anymore. The driver also could have pulled over to speak with the children if they were getting out of hand, rather than taking his focus from the road in order to yank her to the floor. He was definitely in the wrong!

Vegemite - posted on 03/05/2011

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So my mum was a bus driver, now retired, and i told her about this. As I was telling her she sat silently. Then she told me about a co-worker who had a school run and kids were standing up and doing the usually things school kids do. When he had to break hard a year 8 boy came flying down the isle and smashed his head on the hard metal front of the bus. Well he died and the bus driver, last mum heard, was still in and out of mental hospitals because the poor thing can't handle that he killed a child. So I don't see how this alternative is better for anyone involved, I think I'd rather see what happened on this video.

[deleted account]

Well personally I would prefer if anybody didn't yank my daughter to the ground, but you are right in this case, it could have been 1000x worse. She could have been killed and she should not have been standing about on the bus. I think that the bus driver could have tried other methods, but who knows, maybe he did and nothing worked. Some parents are just over-dramatic with incidents like this. I would have asked that he didn't "yank," but have a bit of a "you deserved it" attitude with my daughter. She should also be punished for being a little brat.

[deleted account]

No one(including parents in that way) should be able to get physical with a child, that physical contact was not appropriate at ALL! I I do hope parents and children learn something from this every body has a moment when tolerance levels are tested , the bus driver had none at that point, it is to bad this had to happen, the bus driver was wrong but the child was wrong also, reality is if anyone did that to my child even if my child was wrong my tolerance/temperment would probably get the best of me.

Isobel - posted on 03/04/2011

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If my kid's life was in danger somehow by standing up in her classroom? YEAH, I would have no problem with her grabbing his shirt and yanking him down.

She was clearly ignoring his warnings to sit down, so he MADE her sit down for her own good.

I say good on him.

Jane - posted on 03/03/2011

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Touch my kids you now have the wrath of Jane. The driver deserved to lose their job and should never work with children again. Plain and simple.

Nikkole - posted on 03/03/2011

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I can see where the bus driver lost his cool, when i rode the buss about 6 years ago the kids where HORRIBLE not all but most they would jump around SCREAM at the top of there lungs, fight with each other, make fun of the bus driver, move around to different seats it was a mess! I think putting hands on the child was too much BUT when you are driving kids around in a HUGE bus and kids are standing and doing all these crazy things if he were to get into an accident the kids could be hurt very badly! I agree they should have a teachers aid or SOMEONE to help monitor the bus while the bus driver is doing his job driving the bus! And parents need to teach there kids to be better behaved on the bus and at school!!

[deleted account]

I agree Amie, that she should have been warned about being kicked off the bus. However, that doesn't solve the immediate problem of her standing. He'd obviously warned her before, and it did no good. Plus, the district would have to be behind that sort of rule and consequence. It's great that your district has that rule in place, but it's possible that this particular district didn't have that. So we're coming back to "how else could he have handled the situation?" I'm not saying he was justified in how he handled her. But it's entirely possible that his hands were tied, and at that precise moment that was the only way to make the child sit down. It's a no-win for him.

Lindsay - posted on 03/03/2011

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I've got mixed feelings on this one. The video wasn't pleasant to see by any means but we also only see a very tiny clip of it. I don't know the area at all but I do know that we live in a rural area. Our busses are travelling on highways at high speeds (55 mph). So if this situation happened on one of our busses, in order to pull over this girl would have been more injured by the sudden stop than what happened between her and the driver.

[deleted account]

Good idea about having high school students help out Stephanie.

I honestly wouldn't mind paying slightly higher taxes to pay for assistants so that children would be safer on school buses. It's insane that all school bus drivers don't already have assistants.

[deleted account]

I agree that he did have other options. I don't understand why there aren't monitors or assistants on school buses. It's crazy not to! You have this driver who has all of these kids lives in his hands, who should be doing nothing other than paying 100% attention to what he's doing which should be safely driving these kids to school and back. Really, how much would it actually cost to have an assistant? Two hours in the morning and maybe 2 in the afternoon. I don't think it would be a budget breaker. Or they could at least assign a high school kid this duty just like they assign teens lunch room duty and pay them a few bucks. They could even let it count as a credit or volunteer work that would look good on their college apps.

[deleted account]

What if pulling over wasn't an option? He may have been on an interstate.

Okay, I agree that his actions were a little harsh, but I don't think he was intentionally trying to harm her. I don't think he saw that he had other options at that point. He needed to make her understand how important sitting in your seat is. It's life or death...a classroom is not life or death. Classroom teachers can easily call the office on an intercom if back up is needed.

If he HAD slammed on the brakes and she'd flown through the windshield, wouldn't everyone be saying that he should have been paying better attention to the kids? It's really a no win situation for this man.

Again, I agree that he did slam her down pretty hard. I even think that he should be reprimanded in some way. But loosing his job over this is way over the top. And it doesn't solve the problem of bus safety...unruly children distracting a bus driver.

[deleted account]

Good point Joy. If he were paying attention to DRIVING.... how the heck did he have enough time to pay attention to yanking up a kid and throwing her on the ground.....??? And if he were able to DO that while maintaining control of the bus.... he had other options.

I don't agree w/ the kid standing in the bus and I HOPE the mother actually had a talk w/ her kid about bus safety, but that does not excuse this man's actions.

[deleted account]

So, in a classroom setting, if a teacher had asked one of her students to sit down and the child didn't listen and stood up two or three times after being told to sit down each time....you're saying it would be acceptable for the teacher to snatch the child up and slam them into a seat? The driver of the bus had other options. The child DOES need to listen and behave and keep her butt in a seat. The child DOES need to obey the driver. But if that had been my kid? I probably wouldn't be suing anybody but I'd definitely be having strong words with that driver about keeping his hands to himself and NEVER touching my child or anyone else's again in that manner. Can we all just agree that the driver had other options? I mean, pulling over is the most logical one. Someone said earlier that pulling over may not have been a safe option.....but reaching around while driving a multi ton vehicle and snatching a child up (while controlling said vehicle with one hand) and throwing her to the ground...that's safe? Safer than pulling over?

[deleted account]

I think we know that yelling doesn't always work. And the fact that he said, "You wouldn't listen to me" tells me that she'd been warned.

Isobel - posted on 03/03/2011

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I would've had a private conversation with the driver...then my kid would've got back on the bus, apologized for not following the rules, and I would EXPECT an apology in return.

If my child didn't get an apology in return, I would speak to somebody in the school, but I certainly wouldn't be behaving the way this mother did.

[deleted account]

Slam a kid down on the ground and you could give them a concussion and even kill them.... even if you meant them no physical harm. What if having that backpack on was the only thing that kept her from being killed? Think assault charges would be too much if she were dead?

Maybe that's farfetched, maybe not. A second grader gave my daughter a concussion last year and it was 100% by accident by simply bumping into her.....

Bonnie - posted on 03/03/2011

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It can be tough having to deal with that many rowdy kids on the bus, but that doesn't give the bus driver the right to touch her and push her down. There are other ways to show authority. Just like teachers aren't suppose to lay their hands on the students, the bus drivers shouldn't either.

[deleted account]

This man's life is ruined now, though. He's "labeled". This happened where I live, about 20 miles away, and it's been all over tv. I don't think he meant to hurt her either. I think the words "He layed his hands on a child" were taken and ran with. I'm not defending what he did bc yes it was wrong and yes as a mother I would have been livid, but I don't think he deserves to be judged as harshly as he has been.

Sarah - posted on 03/03/2011

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Wow yeah he was pretty rough with her. That was definitely a little uncalled for. But, at the same time, that little brat needs to learn to keep her butt in the seat.

Mary - posted on 03/03/2011

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I'm surprised to find myself a little divided on this. Admittedly, his actions appear a bit brutal in that video...but it also seems as if the girl wasn't really injured, either. I'm left wondering if this is one of those times where things look worse than they really are.



It seems like we are asking the impossible of our bus drivers; be responsible for the the thirty-some kids in your charge and pay attention to the road. Not to mention, you will be held accountable for anything that occurs on the bus between those children, and crucified if you become distracted and cause an accident.



Had that been my child, there is no doubt I would have been enraged at the bus driver's roughness with her, but I think I would have handled it much differently. I would have complained, certainly, but in a much more private manner, and requested that the bus driver be reassigned to another route. I would never have considered assault charges, because when I really look at that video, I'm not left with the impression that his true intent was to not assault her, but rather a frustrated attempt to physically get her attention that went horribly wrong. I know I myself, in an attempt to stop my toddler from doing something I thought would harm her, have reached out to grab her, and inadvertently caused her to fall down. I really think that's what happened here....he was frustrated with a child that wouldn't listen, and when he reached out grabbed at her backpack, his force was too great (probably as a result of his anger). I'm not implying that his actions were okay, it's just that I don't think his actual intent was to harm her.

[deleted account]

I can see his frustration- I remember riding the bus as a kid and it was a mad house. BUT, if you lay a hand on one of my kids you'll likely spend eternity digging that hand out of your arse, at the very least. I don't care what the reason, you don't touch someone's kid like that. He really could have hurt her. Yes, she should have been sitting but lets not forget that she is 5 f'ing years old! I don't know about everyone else's experience but in mine, 5 year olds aren't the easiest to reason with especially when you aren't right in their face and especially if there are alot of other children thrown into the mix. He had the right to be annoyed but he handled it in a bad way. He acted in haste.

Nikki - posted on 03/03/2011

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I would have found a way to charge him with assault, loosing his job is not a harsh enough punishment. I really don't give a shit if he was getting frustrated, if the kids don't behave they should be reported to the school and the parents, if the behaviour continues ban them from the bus. simple. No abuse required.

I have worked with some pretty horrendous children who have been in dangerous situations, hurt me, hurt others, had me in tears and pulling my hair out but you can't abuse other people's children.

Stifler's - posted on 03/03/2011

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I've never been on a bus with seatbelts. Except one of those minivan style buses.

Tracey - posted on 03/03/2011

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Don't the school buses have seatbelts?
Whenever my class goes on a trip they all have to wear seatbelts and the bus won't move until everyone including teachers is belted.

Sharon - posted on 03/02/2011

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Oh the other thing that gets me? they don't show what was going on before that incident. What if this was a repeat offense issue?

Lacye - posted on 03/02/2011

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The bus driver was pretty rough with her. she is a 6 year old child. While she did know better, he shouldn't have yanked her down like that. There are much better ways of handling that type of situation.

With that said, if it was my child, I would press charges (probably get into trouble myself because I would have gone after him in a fit of rage) but I also would have gotten a hold of my child too.

Katherine - posted on 03/02/2011

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I really don't think he should have touched her, but I can see his point and concern. They are his responsibility.
It's a sticky situation......

Kate CP - posted on 03/02/2011

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The fact that the kid didn't tell her mom until her mom started asking about it tells me that the kid knew she was in the wrong and was afraid her mom would feel the same way...and she should. The kid was being a brat and it sounds like her mom lets the little snot get away with murder. "She might be traumatized" my ass. You mean an adult actually enforced a rule? My god! The horror! :P

[deleted account]

I agree that kids need to be taught to respect authority. But he slammed her down pretty hard. What if she had hit her head when he slammed her? Given her a concussion? Would everyone still be defending the bus driver? Just asking because from what I can see in the video (and my husband agrees), the only thing that kept her head from getting slammed onto the floor of the bus was the fact that she had her backpack on. This wasn't a carefully planned thing the driver did, and he wasn't trying to teach her a lesson. He was frustrated, she stood up and he reacted. If he'd hurt her, everyone would be singing a different tune. And while I don't think it's fair to villanize him, and while I can understand that bus drivers need help, I still won't ever think it's acceptable to lay hands on a child like that. He had other options.

Stifler's - posted on 03/02/2011

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Yeah I agree, that kid will go on thinking she's right and have no respect for authority if the mum is just like "I can't believe you did this to my kid.. abuse!" and not even recognise that her kid was being dangerous which is what caused the whole incident. I can't stand parents like that "It's not MY kids". YES, love... yes it is.

Karen - posted on 03/02/2011

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I fully support that bus driver and all the others who have to put up with a bunch of untrained kids and their parents who justify their behavior rather than back up the adult in charge. The little girl should be traumatized...enough so that she never stands up again in a bus/car, etc. He didn't slap her, he grabbed her by her backpack and taught her a lesson. Good for him. Too bad the girl's mother when told about the incident didn't say (in front of her daughter), "Well, that was a lesson well learned."

[deleted account]

My school bus driver was a mean woman but she had us under control, that's for sure. Day one she assigned us seats. No music, no talking above a whisper and she wasn't afraid to pull over and make us late for school if someone misbehaved.

I do agree that bus drivers need an attendant to look after the kids so they can concentrate on driving. That would be a good solution, for the kids' safety, as well as giving more jobs to people who need them.

Stifler's - posted on 03/02/2011

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Having a scary bus driver is a good idea. Mr. T always had kids eating, blaring music on the stereo, moving between seats, fighting, throwing things out the window on my school bus. He would every so often have a go at everyone but no one really listened and thank god nothing crazy happened. Then Mr. Sharpe took over, banned the radio, banned anyone doing stupid shit from the bus (their parents were not happy but it was his bus company so tough shit) and scared the hell out of everyone. There were no more fights or running around or eating.

Lady Heather - posted on 03/02/2011

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I definitely think school buses should have an attendant too. The best thing for him to do would have been to pull over, but that's not always safe. I know I've had bus drivers do it before though. Other than that a driver is really hooped. Telling kids to sit down when they know full well you can't make them is not very effective. I hope to heck this girl's mum at least made sure she understood that she was wrong too.

I guess the other option is to be like my father in law. He is a school bus driver and basically strikes terror into the hearts of all the children because he looks like a big scary Viking. Maybe we should only hire scary looking drivers. The day a kid stands up on his bus is the day the world stops turning. Heck, my sister is 30 years old and she's still scared of him for no reason.

Stifler's - posted on 03/02/2011

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I feel sorry for the bus driver. "THE BUS DRIVER PUT HIS HANDS ON A LITTLE KID!". Way to defame someone and make them look like a pedo. Kids would be a pain in the arse running around the bus, hopefully this teaches the other kids to stay sitting down while the bus is moving so they don't fly into the windscreen if he has to hit the brakes.

[deleted account]

I agree that the girl shouldn't have gotten out of her seat but I think the driver should have said something before putting hands on the girl. If it was my kid, I don't think I'd want him on the bus with that driver. I don't care how frustrated he was with the kids, NO ONE has permission to lay hands on my kid, especially in that way. That being said, I think all kids need to learn a lesson similar to the one you taught your kids Sharon. But in the end, kids are kids and no matter what, they don't always listen. But that doesn't give the people in charge of them the right to get physical with them, IMO.

[deleted account]

I wouldn't be having my kid ride the bus anymore either. She was stupid for standing in the bus and assault is better than death, but.... it IS still assault and I think it was right that he lost his job.

Rosie - posted on 03/02/2011

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um there are other ways to have a child sit down, like telling them?? if htis was my kid, that bus driver wouldn't know what the hell hit him. anybody lays their hand on my kid, and they can't expect to get a slap on the wrist. old bastard.

Sarah - posted on 03/02/2011

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It's tough because I think that he was quite extreme with what he did......but......he's spot on in a way because it would have been a lot worse if he had had to slam the brakes on.

If I was that girls mother, yes, I would be pissed that the bus driver had pulled her down, BUT I would also be having serious words with my daughter about behaving sensibly and safely on the bus! It seems like that has been overlooked by her mother completely.

It would be another story if the driver had had to slam his brakes on and there was a really bad accident.........then he would probably be in even more trouble. Tough one.

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