Leaving kids in the car article

Desiree - posted on 02/19/2012

Here it doesn't matter what Time of the year it is, we are not allowed to leave a child in the car at any time or point. Firstly the risk of Hi-Jacking ( Car-Jacking), the kidnapping of a child and the fact that the temperature here are in the extreme. It doesn't matter you will be arrested for negligence and endangerment. It's just not worth it. Besides in South Africa there shouldn't be a reason to leave a kid unattended as we have Security, Car Guards and Trolley (I think you call it a Shopping Cart) guys. That will gladly help you off load and remove the trolley and return them to the store. We normally hand them a small tip of a couple of bucks. You get to know their faces and whom you can trust.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/19/2012

Megan from the information I gave I believe it should have been interrupted as, if you left your child in the car to retrieve or replace a cart it is not going to fall under child endangerment. You are right there, you could let a by-passer know you are right there. The example I gave was if you were inside a store for a jug of milk (of which some here have saud they do). Then, there is no telling where or how long you have been. Yes, if you are directly beside or within distance and the car is turned off (if it is on, there is a law specific for that) you will more than likely be OK. I am quite sure you would also be OK if you were paying for gas, IMO it is still not an appropriate action, especially if it is hot out.



Funny though, some have now said they would not leave there child if it was sweltering hot out, they would not take them with them if it was. Then this tells me when they are running minute errands they did not need to take them to begin with... ;)



As I stated I asked our family lawyer friend. She works within the criminal portion of the law and has also worked within civil suits.



I also did not say anything about sweltering heat, I said 20 degree or higher. That is not sweltering but it is inside a turned off vehicle.



Here in Canada you canNOT leave the vehicle running in order to leave the air conditioner on. That is a specifically stated law and is illegal to do so, even if only returning a cart.



I have also said earlier, returning a cart is fine. You are not going to get stuck in a line up doing so....

Teresa - posted on 02/18/2012

Yeah, I could never carry the two of them at the same time w/out help. Only did it once completely on my own at 2 weeks old and almost dropped them. Obviously it wasn't a weight issue (about 11 pounds combined) at that point, but it WAS a lack of coordination issue. Needless to say... I pretty much never left the house alone w/ them for a LONG time. Good thing I wasn't single w/ THEM or I never would've survived....

Jodi - posted on 02/18/2012

lol Teresa, it's especially dangerous, because they want to be down to crawl! So they throw themselves back, I refuse to carry the both of them at the same time, I dropped one ONCE (thank GOD it was my parents house with carpeting!!!) and that was the end of that!!! lol (BUT, you should totally see my biceps!!! lmbo)

Teresa - posted on 02/18/2012

Jodi, any woman who contemplates carrying 46 pounds of kid could NEVER be considered lazy in my book. I can barely carry my 35 pound kid for more than a minute or two.... ;)

Jodi - posted on 02/18/2012

First off, I wouldn't leave my kid in the car in sweltering heat. I rarely take my kids anywhere in the sweltering heat besides the lake! Secondly, it takes me WAY less than 5, 3 or even 2 minutes to return a cart.



Aside from idiots who leave their children in cars in extreme weather and/or for extended periods of time, I think it's about weighing the risks. Is there a larger risk for me to carry two 23 lb babies who can't walk yet and allow my 3 year old to walk across a parking lot with traffic when I can't hold her hand or grab her if I need to, or is the risk larger leaving my children in the car for 1 minute, *maybe* a minute and a half to return the cart? Same parking lot situation, but switch it out with books drops at the library (the kind that are on the outside of the building), or video slot drops at the store. It doesn't make me lazy, and if you took my keys or broke my window, you can bet there would be hell to pay. I have never been gone long enough for someone to even wonder how long I've been gone, a) I'm always in sight of my car and b) if you're getting close enough to my vehicle to see my children in it, you've been close enough the whole time to see me.



To call someone lazy just because they have weighed the risks of one situation over another and came out with a different answer than you...that's just, well...ignorant perhaps? Claiming someone who has decided one situation is SAFER than another, when you have decided the same situation is more dangerous (for YOU) shouldn't have children, that's just judgemental, mean and small minded IMO.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/18/2012

Meme, I checked the laws a few times including the ones for BC. Even the RCMP has to prove that it falls under the Child endangerment act before issuing a fine or taking the child away. I know this because it happened in the city I live in over the summer. A woman left her 6 month old baby in the car while she went and shopped at WalMart while the temperature was hovering around 27. She was allowed her daughter back, but is now in court for her actions. Leaving your child in a car to return a shopping cart however wouldn't fall under the child endangerment act in Canada.



As Jodi and most of us are saying, we're talking about 5 minutes at the most to pay for gas or return a shopping cart. Not do our bi weekly grocery shopping or haggle with a bank teller. Especially not when it's over 15C. Besides if it's the bank or a short shopping trip I usually walk to the bank or the grocery store since it's only a few blocks.



Also as Jodi stated, if you smashed my car window I'd sue you for damage to my personal property and being over zealous.

Jodi - posted on 02/18/2012

I'd never leave a young child in a car on a hot day, I mean, that's just stupid. But seriously, leaving a kid in a car while paying for gas or returning a cart does not make one a lazy mother and does not mean they shouldn't have had children.

**Jackie** - posted on 02/18/2012

Sorry, my point is is that I care enough about a dog that I was willing to insult a woman and potentially lose a client and maybe get in trouble. If that was a child, I would have taken her keys without word and gotten him/her. Oh and you can bet you a$$ I would be coming for you. I'd keep on CPS until they did something. You can count on it

**Jackie** - posted on 02/18/2012

Oh. True story: I used to work at a bank and this woman in her late 40s came in and was complaining about something with her account. She sat down with me and I happened to look outside I saw a dog in a car with one window cracked just a bit. I asked her if that was her car and she said yes and obviously didn't even care that it was pushing 90 degrees out. I told her our hours and said that if she wanted to make an appt or come back when it was more convenient for her that would be fine. She looked at me like I was nuts and said she wasn't busy. I figured I'd rather get a slap on the wrist than have a dog die so I said "can I have ur keys? I'd be more than happy to bring your dog in here" She wasn't mad at all (to my surprise). I brought her dog in (cute and tiny little thing) and my co-worker got a soup bowl filled with water and gave it to him. I still don't think she knew anything was wrong.

Laura Zoey - posted on 02/18/2012

You have enough time to smash in the window and sit there with the child until officials arrive but not enough time to wait 5 min in mild weather to see if mom comes back?

I doubt most people walk around with an object that they could use to smash a window anyways so you'd have to look around for something anyways.

Two summers ago I was at the farmers market. I was gone from my car 15 minutes and windows apwere down and when I got inside it was sooooooo hot. Like choke on it hot. I looked over a few cars and happened to see a big furry dog in a car. Windows down halfway. The dog was panting heavily and not moving much.

The police station is two blocks from the farmers market so I called 911 and they sent an officer over. Eric was crying in the back so I left to go home but the operator thanked me and said that was the right thing to do.

Now maybe the dog could have died in the few minutes it took for a cop to arrive and locate an owner or maybe they unlocked the car through the open windows or something idk. But if it had been a child in the car I'd have unlocked the doors and removed the child instantly in that weather.

If the windows were up I'd have called 911 and yes they'd likely tell me to break a window if there wasn't a cop nearby.



I think most everyone here has made clear they aren't talking about extreme weather.

Like days here that are around 40F and my kids are in a car that's been driven a while so its already warm inside, not a risk temperature wise.

**Jackie** - posted on 02/18/2012

If a mother left her child in her car and it was severely hot out I'd have to talk myself out of whoopin her ass when she made it back. I wouldn't smash a window out but I'd call the police on the double and probably verbally harass her (hey, at least I'm admitting it).



I don't understand it, no one has to have children. If a child is an inconvenience for you than don't have them. NO one made you be a mom. Stop being lazy.

Jodi - posted on 02/18/2012

Sorry, but if you smashed my car window because I was putting a shopping cart back, I'd sue you for replacement of the window. I would consider it just a tad over-zealous of you.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/18/2012

Actually Megan that is not fully correct. It falls under Child Endangerment. We do not have a law that is specific to leaving children in a car alone (when it is turned off) but it can be part of child endangerment, as you said. I asked my friend lawyer. So, this is how it would go. If a by-passer see's your child(ren) alone in a vehicle and they call the police or CPS, you will be charged (they cannot determine how long the child was there, it is your word against the by-passer, the police are 99% of the time going to side with the complaintant simply because it is a child involved, there will be an investigation), it is not until you get to court in front of a Judge will it then be decided on whether you are convicted. So, it all depends on the judge, how they feel that day and whether you can "prove" they were not in danger. This is how many of our laws in Canada are, they are purposely left vague, so the Courts have the ability to make the final decision.... ;) However, there is a specific law stating that you cannot leave a child unattended in a running car... I for one, would prefer to not have an investigation on me, just because I needed a jug of milk... How is a by-passer to know how long the child was left in the car? They are not able to know, I for one would call the police. I often don't have 5mins to stand by someone's car, that is their problem not mine, they should not have left their kid then... The kid also may not have another 5mins to wait for me to wait to see if the parent is coming back. I would have no idea how long that child was already in the vehicle and if it was hot out, above 20 or freezing out below 0, I would be smashing the window out, then calling the police. A vehicle can rise or decline by 5 degree's within 3-5 min increments.... That to me is dangerous and I am not waiting for the child to die for anyone. ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/18/2012

Desiree, we don't have any laws about leaving children in cars in the entire Dominion of Canada. I've checked my provincial (BC) laws as well. Unless it's an extended period of time and the conditions can prove that it was endangering the welfare of a child (as a recent case from over the summer was proven) then the RCMP can't do anything but tell you it might not be a good idea to leave a child in a vehicle by themself for such and such a time.

Desiree - posted on 02/17/2012

We had two incidents in South Africa of women leaving their children in the car. This time of the year the temperates are extreme to say the least as it is in Australia. The temperature here reach as High as a 35 degrees Celcius in the shade. Anyway back to my story both mother have been arrested for Child Negligence and causing harm. the children have also been taken away from their mothers. Here there is a Law against leaving Children in the car unattended under the age of 12 for any period of time. This extends to seat belts and sitting in the front seat though not many people know about the law. I do agree with it you can kill a child in a matter of minutes.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/16/2012

I leave my husband on his own for hours at a time Johnny while he watches violent video games and drinks caffienated beverages filled with sugar (a large Bubba Keg mug filled with tea that has at least a 1/2 cup of sugar) I seriously worry about his mental well being at times but it can't be helped.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/16/2012

Maybe it would've been a hard lesson learnt... ;)

Johnny - posted on 02/16/2012

Last night on the way home from the pool I left my husband in the car alone with the keys (I was driving) so he could listen to the hockey game and took my daughter into the store with me. Now that it's been harped on so much, I couldn't stop worrying that he'd get carjacked.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/16/2012

My next trial for leaving my 11 month in the car will be returning a cart at Walmart... without the 7 year old

Cathy - posted on 02/16/2012

*****Mod Notice*****



Please stay on topic. Debating debating procedure... really?



Thank you

Cathy S.

Jodi - posted on 02/16/2012

*eye roll*

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/16/2012

Jodi



You are twisting my words and that to me is laughable and not very adult like. This is what I said.



"Jodi, this is my point. You just don't want to let go do you? ;) Ok, that is fine. Here is my answer."



"That is my point. Now I hope you are able to drop it, as I am. ;) "



No where did I "tell" you to drop it, I said I HOPE you are able to, now that I have explained my arguement more clearly for you. That is you twisting the words to suit your argument. It is incorrect for you to state something that was not "actually" said.



Yes Jodi, this is a debate form, you have made 2 comments during this debate (page 3 and 4), you haven't debated very hard. You didn't really give a strong stance on your opinion, just made up headlines and that people coddle their kids too much in today's time. I provided real stories and information to back up my position.



However, you were not debating these last few times. You were nit picking my words. Big difference. Although, again, I am OK with that, not that you would care too much anyhow, if I wasn't. ;)

Honestly, I could go on forever, I am just thinking of other's here. They do not need to continunoisly hear me saying the same things over and over again.



My point has been made, I do not expect everyone to agree with me, it would be a fairly boring debate if we all agreed. It is not a world filled with rainbows and sunshine. It is rare everyone is going to agree but there is no need to beat the horse down over and over again. ;)



Note: The horse being the debate, NOT me.... ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/15/2012

I know, but for my 11 month old and I it was a new experiance! Luckily DH was at the bank at the other end of the Plaza.

Laura Zoey - posted on 02/15/2012

I wouldn't have even considered returning a cart to be leaving a kid in the car"IMO that's just normal.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/15/2012

I only leave my baby in the car (I did it for the first time today) when I'm still in clear veiw of the car and I can run back and full body slam anyone (I'm 5'4 and 190lbs, I could cause some damage during an adrenaline rush) So just returning or retrieving a shopping cart.



As I've stated a few times the city I live in is rather small and we really only go to my MIL's 2hrs north or my husband's dad's side of the family which is 45 minutes north and both places are even smaller than where I live. The village my MIL lives has a higher chance of nuclear melt down than a child being snatched from a front yard or a car (and there are no nuclear plants in the Okanagan Shuswap area of BC)



I leave my 7 year old locked in the car when I have to run in and out of some place. Honestly I believe where my ex MIL lives is more dangerous than where I live in Central BC.

Brittney - posted on 02/15/2012

When I was a few months old, my mom left me in her car to help my grandma into her house (opening the door for her), in just a few minutes, some other lady had the back car door open and was hovering over me. My mom looked at her and she jumped back into her car and sped off (without me). Anything can happen in this dangerous world.

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2012

"Sorry I hit a nerve Jodi."



Not really. But telling someone to drop it in a debate forum while debating a point and trying to gain clarification is laughable.

Teresa - posted on 02/15/2012

I never really notice if kids are left in cars or not cuz I see it so often here.... I know there is a risk in everything (like leaving your almost 8 year old 'unattended' while you take a shower and having her little brother knock her off the bed and her knee hits her face so hard that her teeth go through her lip and cut her knee....), but here... I'm not kidding when I say the risk is practically zero.

Rebecca - posted on 02/15/2012

You do realize in Europe people leave their kids in their stroller outside of a restaurant if they are sleeping, right?



For me, I think the "risks" of leaving a child unattended (meaning strapped into a car seat in a locked car) are minimal. Unless it is extremely hot or extremely cold, I just don't see what the issue is and certainly don't see it as a "risky" choice.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

BTW - I think I have beaten my opposition to death. I think everyone knows how I feel about the topic. I have no more to argue, as I have stated it all. I must digress, as we are going in circles. I don't want to be nagging my opinion simply because someone wants to pick it to death. I have not picked anyone's to death, I haven't taken anyone's statement and reversed it back to them. I have simply stood still on my stance and will continue to.



Thanks for a great debate. Looking forward to the next one. Perhaps we will agree, perhaps we will not. ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

Sorry I hit a nerve Jodi.



I am only saying that cars get stolen and they could have your child in it, which would then be a carjacking. That's all, that's it, nothing more. You may read all you wish into it and twist and turn all you feel.



So I gave examples, even if they had drivers simply to show it occurs. It doesn't mean there has to be a driver Jodi, just a car unattended. Yes, a car can get stoled ANYWHERE, that's my point, it happens ALL the time. And a child "can" be in it.



I also stated before that a true "car theif" can do so in under 5mins with an alarm and with the doors locked. I also gave examples where it was stated that an older child (toddler), like 2 and up could be coerced into unlocking a door. It only takes a second to unlock/open a door.



All I am saying is why would you risk something if it is something that you would regret the rest of your life? Ok, you have to get a cart, fine, that isn't a biggie. However, you run into a store to get milk? Yeah, that's a bit troublesome...



Here we are back to the driving the street with your child and having an accident. Yep, you're right. Only difference is that is an accident AND you had to drive down the street to get to the parking lot, so you were already willing to take that chance. It is NOT an accident if something terrible happens to your child while unattended, you made the choice to leave them (for that min or two) so it is not an accident.



I said before, we all risk accident as soon as we leave our house, actually the fact that we are alive is a risk of an accident happening. You could wake up and fall down the stairs and go unconscious or slip on ice and fall under a moving car or slip on ice outside your house, the list is endless.



All I am saying is why consciously put your child in that risk? Consciously such as thinking "It will never happen to me" because that is what you are telling yourself. You can't remove yourself from an accident, you just can't. You can however be proactive and do your best to avoid one from occurring.



I bet those parents where something did happen (even if in a slim chance) told themselves that very thing (it will never happen to me), I bet you they are sick for not taking their kids with them. Ok, yes they may get hit by a car now, well that is a part of the risk of life. When you walk you or your child could get hit. I also said 99% of the time you are going in for much longer than a few mins, so you have to take them with you anyhow, so why is that 1% such a big deal to take them with you then too?? I would like an answer to that, as no one has answered it yet. Or is the answer for that 1%, they are safer? Although next time because it will take you 10mins it is safer to risk getting hit by a car while walking? I don't understand.



I find the senseless arguement of "you may drop them on their head" or "they may get hit by a car while walking" or "if the weather is terrible then it is safer for a few mins" is a poor arguement at best. It makes no sense to me what so ever. It is a chance you take every single time you take the for a walk down the road to the park or go to the mall or go for supper or whatever else you do with your child. So, all of a sudden that couple times you need to run in to get milk it is safer to leave them in the car? Usually if you are only running in to get milk, it is a corner store and well, I am not sold that it is as busy as a malls parking lot. I think it is a hassle thing, it has absolutely nothing to do with safety. If it had to do with safety you would see ALL Mom's doing it and the Mom in the OP's post would not have gotten in trouble because it would be the NORM. Since MOST Mom's want to keep their children as safe as possible. There wouldn't be all these sites stating it is a terrible choice to leave a child unattended, even for a minute. Go figure, all those Mom's that I have never ever seen do it must be terribly unsafe parents. I mean I have very seldom seen a kid under age 6 left unattended in a vehicle, so it is not common. I wonder why? Are these Mom's not safe because they choose to take their children with them? I don't think so...



So, I have now added everything I have posted in seperate posts in this thread all into this one post. I think I got all of my thoughts this one time. I do not agree with unattended children and my mind is not going to change.



As I stated before, if you choose to that is your choice. You are not a bad mother, just perhaps a bit more risky of one. ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

@Krista

LOL - Yeah I know and agree. I saw and heard a lot living there... Not so good things ;) A girl was murdered directly across the street from where I lived. :(



When I moved here from AB, I had no idea about Spryfield and with not much choice anyhow. I was a young single Mom going back to school, so was pretty damn broke... 5 years I lived there, right in the heart of it, on River Road... By the time my daughter had to go to school it was time to move, there was NO way I was letting her go to Central Elementary.



So, yes, with the things that happened to me there and the things I saw and heard I am a bit more catious with my children...



I do want to say one thing though. I in no way am saying Halifax (HRM) is terrible. Actually a good 90-95% of the people here are awesome people and it is a beautiful city. Those people would give their shirt off their back for you. It's just the other 5-10% that mess with my trust. ;)

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2012

I get your point MeMe, I just don't see its relevance, and I don't agree with you. I don't HAVE to let it go because THIS is a debate forum and I am choosing to debate your point because it is all over the place and does NOT make sense. Your examples of car jackings are examples where there are drivers in the cars. You are providing statistics on that basis, and it has absolutely no relevance to this debate. And statistics of thefts of a car with no children in it is also irrelevant because you are not comparing apples with apples. Cars are generally stolen when just left ANYWHERE in a car park. I think you will find that the majority of people who leave their children in the car for a moment are not far from their car and are within line of sight, so it is unlikely to happen. Yes, it *could* happen, but it is unlikely. It is a smaller risk than it is driving the streets and potentially having an accident where your children will be injured.



So basically, please don't start to tell me to "let it go", I am debating your point because it is nonsensical. And this IS a debate forum.

Krista - posted on 02/15/2012

Fuck dude, you lived in Spryfield? No wonder you think everybody's a potential assailant.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

Jodi, this is my point. You just don't want to let go do you? ;) Ok, that is fine. Here is my answer.



When you leave a child in the car and it gets stolen, it essentially has turned into a carjacking.



Now, I hope I have been clear. As I know I was clear about it in my other posts.



When an assailant steals a car from the parking lot, there could be YOUR kid in the car. They would not notice this most times, as most times they are not looking in the back seat. Therefore the assailant just carjacked YOUR car with YOUR kid.



That is my point. Now I hope you are able to drop it, as I am. ;)



Now I am all done with proving my side. It is up to each person to make their own decision on how they manage children in a car. I for one will NEVER leave any child or children (no matter how many) in an unattended vehicle. If I have to do some small errands and had 4 children under 5, well the 5 year old walks and the rest are thrown in a cart, or if there is no cart, I use a resource to watch my children so I can complete these errands.



Yes I know everybodies stance here. That is OK for you. You're not a bad mother, just be fully aware of the implications that could occur.



Read THEFT below...



Safety issues:

Hyperthermia/Heatstroke: Did you know that a child’s body heats three to five times faster than an adult’s? And that in ten minutes time a car’s temperature can increase by 19 degrees and will continue to rise? (Safe Kids, Facts about Hyperthermia).



Theft: The vehicle could be stolen with the child inside. In December 2010, a Billings family experienced such an incident. KULR-8 reported that the parents had left the car running and unlocked while returning to the house to get something and in that time the car was stolen with their 7-week-old baby inside. Fortunately the baby was unharmed, but it does happen – even if you lock the doors.



Accidents: Children left in running vehicles (or simply unattended) could find themselves in dangerous, possibly lethal situations. (See, Is it okay to leave your child unattended in a car…for an example).



Medical Emergencies: This point was raised by Fran Childress, MSSW, in the comments of the aforementioned article. She noted that things can change in a moments notice; including medical emergencies of child or parent. In the child’s case, what if she is alone and something occurs (i.e. choking, asthma, etc) or if something happens to the adult, no one would know about the baby or child in the car alone.



Overwhelmingly the evidence indicates that it’s just not wise to leave your child unattended in a car. There are simply too many things that have the potential to go tragically wrong. Even if the chances of something negative occurring were one in a trillion, why take the chance with your child’s life?



Safety tips

A spate of recent thefts involving vehicles with children inside has police and children's advocates urging parents to never leave children alone in automobiles. Some reasons why:

•If the vehicle is running, it can be stolen – along with the children

•An unattended child could accidentally shift the vehicle into gear

•Even if the vehicle is locked, someone could come by and convince a child to unlock the doors

•Intense weather can cause harm – cars heat up and become cold fast



http://www.casfrontenac.ca/parenting-res...



http://www.health.food-recipe-cooking.co...



http://childcare.about.com/od/childsafe2...



http://drivesteady.com/7-reasons-its-not...



http://www.momtastic.com/parenting/featu...



http://pediatrics.about.com/od/safety/a/...



http://www.safekids.org/safety-basics/sa...

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2012

Can I ask what carjackings/attempted carjackings of cars that HAVE drivers in them has to do with this conversation? All it does is prove my point that it is more dangerous to take your kids out in the car at all, and yet we all do that every day. It makes absolutely NO point about leaving them alone in a locked car within your direct sight for 2 minutes while you put a shopping cart away or pay for your gas.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/15/2012

I'm in Kelowna which is half the size of Rochester. The biggest news maker right now are wild fires and trailer fires. We had a shooting at the Casino downtown over the summer. My MIL freaked out and called us (She lives in Canoe which will see Krista's fishing village and lower it to about 80 if that) wondering if DH and I had been at the Casino (yes of course we were! With our 2 daughters in the car!) I seriously believed she was drunk and had been watching the news in Seattle believing it was the news in the Okanagan.



When I lived in Rochester I never had any real run ins with someone trying to harm me. The closest was some guy in a car asking for directions, but I dashed out of there. Yes we had some serious crimes, but it was all on where you lived.



BTW, I left my 11 month old in the car this morning to get a cart from the cart corral because she was sleeping. Easiest time I ever had getting a cart. So now Laura, I can't say I have never done it.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

You are correct Krista. It depends on where you are and who you know. My husband grew up in Williamswood, which is beside Harrietsfield, which is beside Spryfield. He knows many, he isn't acquainted but he knows many undergrounders and we do get alot of info through the grapevine via his parents that still live there...



I lived in Spryfield for 5 years and moved 8 years ago. While living in Spryfield I had my apt broken into and all my bill money stolen. My daughter suffered for a couple years after, she had terrible nightmares, she is the one that found the door broke upon us arriving home! She was only 5 at the time. I was also jumped in my stairwell, while having my head slammed to a stair, the chick was high on something!



So, yes, I am very careful. Coming from Fort Mc Murray AB after living there for 24years (a very high crime rate city too) and never ever having an issue. I have a much different outlook of HRM (been here 13 years).



However, other than someone trying to open my passenger door a couple years ago and those other 2 incidents, I have had no other issues. Although, those 3 incidents were far enough for me to realize there are some serious issues here...

Krista - posted on 02/15/2012

It was an example, something to think about when leaving your children and one of the several reasons I would not leave my children in a vehicle, not only here but anywhere...



And I get what you're saying. And no, I wouldn't leave my kid in a vehicle in Halifax either. But "anywhere"? Well, I would leave my kid in the car to run into our local gas station.



But keep in mind, I live in a fishing village of a few hundred.



Bit of a difference there.

Krista - posted on 02/15/2012

I work downtown and I have been approached several times. I am not saying they were looking to rob me but who knows what their intentions were. I wouldn't take the chance by myself!



They probably just wanted to ask you for some change.



I guess we just have different viewpoints. I don't see everybody who comes up to me as a potential robber. But, I've never been robbed, so perhaps that is why. I also used to work downtown (at 1801 Hollis), and not once was I ever given a hard time. I was approached for change often, but never more than that.



I DID once witness a purse-snatching. The guy booted it down Lower Water Street, but was pursued by about 10 onlookers, who wound up catching the guy and pinning him to the ground until the cops came.



A lot of it depends on where you are and who you know, too. There's a lot of crime in Halifax that can be classified as non-random -- drug deals gone wrong, things like that.



And for the record, yes, I did walk home alone while liquored a few times. Not smart, I will admit. But nothing happened. So I was taking exception to your statement that you can't even walk downtown in daylight anymore. Because that's not at all true. Yes, it has a crime problem, but you're making it sound a LOT worse than it actually is.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

It was an anology I was giving Krista. I said the chance is there, we are no low crime rate city. It was an example, something to think about when leaving your children and one of the several reasons I would not leave my children in a vehicle, not only here but anywhere...

Krista - posted on 02/15/2012

That being said, would I leave my child in the car in Halifax? No. I would not leave my child in the car in Truro, either, or in Amherst, or in any town larger than my own village. That's due more to my own personal comfort level, though, rather than the likelihood of carjackings.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/15/2012

Johnny here are 3 to go with your 2, so that is 5.... I had one of your 2 already, since you already seen it, here are an additional 3... Keeping in mind these were "actual" jackings not "attempted" as I stated.



Dec. 13, 2006

From The Herald



Carjacking suspect appears in court



A 20-year-old man was scheduled to appear in court Tuesday on charges relating to a Monday-night carjacking in Halifax.



A man riding in a taxi in north-end Halifax attempted to rob the driver with a knife at about 11:50 p.m., police said. The two began struggling, eventually ending up outside the cab. The driver received minor injuries.



http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scoti...



http://www.canada.com/news/gets+life+thr...



Krista

It is your choice to walk where you want ALONE in Halifax. People have been advised to be extremly careful walking ALONE. They don't typically bother anyone in a group, if you were drunk at 3am, I highly doubt you were alone! I work downtown and I have been approached several times. I am not saying they were looking to rob me but who knows what their intentions were. I wouldn't take the chance by myself!



Wow Krista, assaults for 2011 equals 1468 and that is only for HRP, I didn't calculate for RCMP. That is not a small number. I am not saying they were all people walking down the street but you tell me how we can decipher which were and which weren't. With an additional 348 robberies, that is with HRP and RCMP. That's no small number either. Again, it has been advised to be extremly careful walking alone downtown. Call the detachment and see what they tell you. ;) I lock my doors when going downtown, I have had a person try and get in my passenger side a couple years ago, it was locked.



Yes, I admitted that it was an incorrect statement of 8, perhaps a few were thefts, perhaps a few never hit the internet out of the paper for whatever legalities. I am not connected with the police detachment, I cannot go pull anything up.



LOL, I did not say it was a waste land. It simply has a very high crime rate for only 100 000 people or so... ;) It has made the news several times due to it's crime rate.



Anyhow, to repeat, yes I mistakenly reported a possible 8 carjackings, they were more than likely mostly thefts. However there were a heck of alot more thefts than 8. As I also stated, when a culprit steals a vehicle from a parking lot, they typically do not realize there is a child in the back (which would make it an unintended carjacking). Go read up on it, I did... ;)



I also stated I agree to disagree. I do not condone leaving children in a vehicle. If others feel comfortable with it great, it is just not for me...

Krista - posted on 02/15/2012

Wow MeMe -- that's some impressive backpedalling you're doing there.



First of all, you say, "Johnny, there have been multiple attempted car jackings here in halifax. No, they did not have kids in them but they could have. Seriously, there were at least 8 attempted last year downtown. You can't even walk downtown in day light anymore because they gang up and jump you to take your ipod.... I am not in a different universe, I work downtown halifax. "



And then you correct it to say, " I was able to find 4 over the past few years. So, to state 8 perhaps was more than what it was last year alone. Sorry for that, it was more of an estimate, since I did say "at least" and I did say "attempted". "



Four over the last few years is a FAR cry from "at least 8 attempted last year downtown."



And seriously -- yes, there have been a few swarming incidents. I'm not denying that Halifax has a crime problem, mainly due to the city focusing on shiny things like convention centres and stadiums, instead of actually taking care of important stuff. But to say that you can't even walk downtown in daylight? That is a SERIOUS exaggeration. I assure you that I have walked downtown in daylight (and while inebriated at 3am) many a time, and have never been approached, let alone assaulted or robbed.



So yes, Halifax does definitely have a crime problem, but it's not the anarchistic wasteland you are making it out to be, thank you.



Here's a link to the weekly crime stats, guys. http://www.halifax.ca/police/CrimeStats/...

Johnny - posted on 02/14/2012

http://atlantic.ctv.ca/servlet/HTMLTempl...



ATV Live at 5 - carjacking search zero results

Google Halifax carjacking seach -3 results in 10 years

Rebecca - posted on 02/14/2012

I pretty much leave my 9 month old twins alone in the car every day when I go to pick up my 4 YO twins. Not seeing this as being a big deal at all. Do you stand over them the whole time they are napping in their cribs during the day too? Because "something" could happen in that minute or two you are out of the room!!!

Jodi - posted on 02/14/2012

Meme, now I am really confused. And this is what I am trying to clarify:



In one post you are saying: "there have been multiple attempted car jackings here in halifax. No, they did not have kids in them but they could have."



So what you are ACTUALLY talking about here are attempted car thefts, not carjackings. As you yourself said, it is only a car jacking if someone is in the car, so how can it be a carjacking if there were no kids in the cars. Sorry, but that is a redundant argument.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/14/2012

Ah yes, carjackings are when people are in the car, yes (and I know you know this...) ;) I was able to find 4 over the past few years. So, to state 8 perhaps was more than what it was last year alone. Sorry for that, it was more of an estimate, since I did say "at least" and I did say "attempted".



However, I do know there were a few attempted by underage kids, so I am not sure if perhaps they are just not world wide info yet, since they would still be undergoing trial, if they were convicted at all. You will need to get ATV - Live at 5, if you want to know everything...



However, there are car thefts very frequently here. More often than not when a child is in a car and it is stolen the culprit does not know it until they have taken the car... which turns into a carjacking (which is why I used the word carjacking in my comments and which hasn't happened (with a kid in an unattended car) that I know of here but could, since car theft is frequent and on the rise).



Is that what you were asking? Just want to make sure I got what you were looking for... ;)

Jodi - posted on 02/14/2012

Meme, Sorry, you must have missed my question:



"And I do say attempted but the victims were only lucky, they either were able to step on the gas or kick the guys a**... ;) "



I'm a little confused. Are you talking car jackings where the driver is in the car?