No pink for boys: too restrictive or no big deal?

~♥Little Miss - posted on 10/18/2012

Interesting thread but old. Feel free to start a new one.



~DM MoD Little Miss~

Tracy - posted on 10/18/2012

You are right. I have a 12 yr old son who loves pink, so the rule in our house is " only real men wear pink". Last yr I even found T-shirt that had that printed on it. He loved that shirt so much he wore it out.

Tracy - posted on 10/18/2012

You are right. I have a 12 yr old son who loves pink, so the rule in our house is " only real men wear pink". Last yr I even found T-shirt that had that printed on it. He loved that shirt so much he wore it out.

Elizabeth - posted on 01/02/2012

My almost 4 year old loves pink, pretend cooking, wrestling, playing baseball, high heeled shoes *he doesn't wear them, he just admires them, and complements the person wearing them* he is a clean freak, enjoys cleaning and vacuuming, I actually think he is very balanced. He is very rough and tough with the boys, and very self confident already. I have had friends bring up "gay" already though, just because he is aware of fashion, and LOVES pink. I found this highly offensive. people shouldn't be judging a childs orentation Long before the child would even care about something likethat.

Jennifer - posted on 10/02/2011

I think little boys spend so much time with mommy, and they idolize the things we do, that's it's cruel to say no dolls, no makeup, no polish......The men who have problems with their boys being drawn to "girl things" may just need to spend more time them.......the reason I think this btw, is because my son was curious about make-up, and wanted dolls but never showed interest in other girly things; I wear make-up,and had a baby, but never wear pink, polish my nails, etc!

Stifler's - posted on 10/01/2011

I wear lots of black on the bottom but I am not a goth loololol

Joy - posted on 09/30/2011

I happen to like black. But for me, it's because it's slimming and hides a lot. A LOT!!! LOL

Kate - posted on 09/30/2011

I don't think it does. And these days a lot of children's clothes are being made in black. I think that when people wear black head to toe, or do their make-up dark and scary, have solemn expressions - all those things contribute to a 'darkness'. Some people just don't look good in black, and some people (and kids) can just pull it off!
My kids are both quite fair and they are breathtaking in dark colours - personal taste I guess.

Sherri - posted on 09/30/2011

Yes behind black it has a feel of death behind it and definitely has emotional darkness attached to it. However, it depends what it is. A woman can have her flawless little black dress, men suits and that is fine but when dressed in black in head to toe it is creepy.

Kate - posted on 09/30/2011

All through my son's life I have at times dressed him in black and (especially when he was a baby/toddler) my friends and family had a huge issue with it - would say things like "don't you think it's a little morbid" etc - but the truth was that he just looked so gorgeous in it!! They'd say "yes it suits him, but he's so little" - is black the colour of maturity or emotional darkness? Never did get it.
My son is also a 'secret' Barbie lover - would never admit to his friends or choose a Barbie movie himself but happily plays Barbies with his sister and watches the movies over and over if his sister has them on!!
My husband would always freak out if he painted his nails. He grew out of it - maybe he just wanted the freedom to try it or experiment?
I think there are so many ways we restrict because of some strange fear they'll turn out "wrong" but it's our own need to conform and not be 'social misfits' - why put that onto our children?
What amazes me is how people (myself included in ways) can be so fixed in ideas - and who are these people who sit and decide what is going to be 'acceptable'? For today anyway...

Charlie - posted on 09/28/2011

Why is pink feminine?

"Nazi Germany had something to do with the
association of pink with femininity:

"Catholic traditions in Germany and neighboring countries reverse the
current color coding, because of the strong association of blue with
the Virgin Mary...the NAZIs in their concentration camps use a pink
triangle to identify homosexuals. (The yellow star of David is the
best known symbol, used of course to identify Jews. The German system
was quite complicated, using various symbols an colors to identify
criminals, political prisinors, an a whole range of other groups). The
NAZI's choice of pink suggests that it by the 1930s was a color that
in Germany had become associate with girls." - "Gender Specific
Colors"

Here is another site backing the same color history.

"The preferred color to dress young boys in was pink! Blue was
reserved for girls as it was considered the paler, more dainty of the
two colors, and pink was thought to be the stronger (akin to red). It
was not until WWII that the colors were reversed and pink was used for
girls and blue for boys..." - Quote from Dress Maker Magazine
http://www.dressmaker.com/ezine0200.shtm...

"Jo B. Paoletti concludes that the effect of color-coded gender
differences (pink for girls, blue for boys) existed oppositely
initially..." - Quote from book review "The Material Culture of
Gender, the Gender of Material Culture" - Winterthur, Del.: Henry
Francis du Pont Winterthur Museum, 1997 - From the Journal of American
History - Please note that this is a cached page as the current page
is different:
http://tinyurl.com/iy31

While there are also myths and legends supporting both or either color
for gender identification, those resources dealing with straight
history date the identification of pink with femininity to the period of World War II or later."

Jenny - posted on 09/28/2011

When my LG was born she was quite bold and people would always ask 'is she a girl or a boy?' Sometimes they would automatically think she's a boy :(

I didn't understand how they could possibly come up with that conclusion when she was completely covered in pink?!



Would any of you dress your little baby boy in pink? Head to toe, with a cute pink matching blanket?

Ashley - posted on 09/28/2011

I honestly wouldn't have thought much of it but thats just me. My boys wear my heals around the house and try to put make up on. They love baby dolls and i bought my oldest a pink stroller. But would i dress them in pink or have something with butterflies and hearts all over it? Nope ..just as i wouldnt dress my girl in boy clothes but thats just me and everyone has their own opinions about it

Jenni - posted on 09/28/2011

LOL! I'm watching Yo Gabba Gabba with my kids right now and they just had a very large, very manly, beat boxer who was wearing butterfly wings. He did his beat boxing and then flew away across the screen. Made me think of this thread. ;)

Cathy - posted on 09/28/2011

Knowing how to dance was such a fail for Patrick Swayze's sex appeal! NOT

Krista - posted on 09/28/2011

No kidding. I don't know why men keep thinking that it's effeminate to know how to dance. Most women I know would give their eyeteeth for their husbands to know how to dance well.

Jennifer - posted on 09/28/2011

Lol, i may be a bit vindictive, but I'd be tempted to call them and scream about my child being allergic to blue food dye, and what are trying to do kill him?!?(blue is usually mixed at the bakery to make green) Stupid, yep! But they'd probably never play the color switch again!

My son use to take ballet, it was the only 'sport' offered for 3 year olds, and he loved it! One father always made a big deal out of it, and told his son, "dancing is for girls and pansies" I laughed at him, and said, "yet my son is in there with all the beautiful little girls, and yours is out here with you and all the old fat women!" I also pointed out that the men at our local club that danced had much better luck than grouchy, sexist, pigs like himself. He shut up.

TealRose - posted on 09/28/2011

BTW : the junior school that my father in law, husband and my daughter went to has a uniform. It is brown with pink shirts/blouses! And NO one ... but no one minds !!! Why should they? It's a colour... not a way of life !

TealRose - posted on 09/28/2011

Just don't give in to it!! It's a crazy idea! My son is now a tall 27 yr old, who came out of hospital with two little squeezy dollies - one blue and one pink and who loved them! He has worn pink and blue, played with truck and dolls ... and is great thank you !!! lol!!!

BTW .. my grandson is just 6 now - and when he was about 3 - 4 he loved butterflies and dragonflies etc and fortunately they were made in tee shirts for the little boys too !!! Needless to say, he had SEVERAL !!

Jaime - posted on 09/28/2011

Here's what Wikipedia had to say:

"In Western culture, the practice of assigning pink to an individual gender began in the 1920s[12] or earlier.[13] An article in the trade publication Earnshaw's Infants' Department in June 1918 said: "The generally accepted rule is pink for the boys, and blue for the girls. The reason is that pink, being a more decided and stronger color, is more suitable for the boy, while blue, which is more delicate and dainty, is prettier for the girl."[14] From then until the 1940s, pink was considered appropriate for boys because being related to red it was the more masculine and decided color, while blue was considered appropriate for girls because it was the more delicate and dainty color, or related to the Virgin Mary.[15][16][17] Since the 1940s, the societal norm was inverted; pink became considered appropriate for girls and blue appropriate for boys, a practice that has continued into the 21st century.[18]".

So, I wonder why there was a switch from blue to pink for girls and pink to blue for boys? There was mention of the colour pink being strongly associated with Valentine's day and because that day is considerably favoured by the female population, I wonder if there was a shift in colour-gender assigning to market 'Love' as a mass commodity?

Elizabeth - posted on 09/27/2011

I think that gender rules like pink and blue are RIDICULOUS. It's no wonder so many boys grow up into "macho tough guys" that are simply overflowing with testosterone. We don't let them be soft! We don't teach them to be nurturing! Pink is a COLOUR for Pete's sake! A colour. Not a sexual orientation. My 5 year old son says his favourite colour is blue (his choice) but he will happily wear pink. He loves bracelets and I have bought them for him before, and LOVES rainbows and hearts. If we want more sensitive, caring men, then we need to stop forcing our boys into a mold that was created centuries ago. Men can wear any colour. Men can have long hair. Men can even... wait for it! even like rainbows! It does not make them weird, gay or weak.

The same goes for girls. Pink dresses and tiaras are cute but if your little girl likes Hot Wheels then by all means let her play with them! Girls need to learn to be strong and self reliant. And yes, girls can wear blue and still be pretty little girls! It isn't what they are wearing that makes them pretty.

Cyndel - posted on 09/27/2011

From what I was told Red is the color of strength and war, what men's roles were to be strong protector/provider and defend home and country.
Blue was the color of tranquility and peace which is why blue used to be for girls and pink or light red for boys America just had to be opposite on that like everything else.
.

Jenny - posted on 09/27/2011

I know what you mean about boys sweating with long hair! hahhaaa.

I think cultral changes regarding clothing & colours come about by fashion changes and what the celebs are doing. There are a lot of other factors too, but I do think the leading fashion brands have a huge role in what's "in".

Krista - posted on 09/27/2011

I would love to see someone tell a 6 foot tall 4 foot wide Tongan man he was feminine wearing it !

I'd be too busy drooling.

Charlie - posted on 09/27/2011

Tongan men wear essentially what is a skirt I would love to see someone tell a 6 foot tall 4 foot wide Tongan man he was feminine wearing it !

It is cultural I agree but what is culturally acceptable changes and it changes with those willing to go against the norm.

As for hair I like my boys with longer hair however I do shave it when it gets hot because man those boys can sweat !

Sal - posted on 09/27/2011

my sons hair was always short, he gets pretty grouchy when its long, dont know why,but i did let my daughter have hers cut all off when she was little...and yes people said she looked like a boy, even the hair dresser asked if kids would tease her...and for the record kids didn't make anything of it, grown ups did, and she looked beautiful, like a little pixi

Krista - posted on 09/27/2011

I cut my son's hair short, but it's just because it's so insanely thick that it just doesn't work well long. It doesn't go into cute tendrils or curls. It's just this thick, thick mop.

Krista - posted on 09/27/2011

Who knows maybe in 20 years time we will all be wearing futuristic skin tight silver clothing like in the movies! :)))

Oh lordy, I hope I'm dead before that happens. Nobody needs to see my size-18 ass poured into silver spandex.

Stifler's - posted on 09/27/2011

I cut Logan's short because I think it looks super cute.

Sherri - posted on 09/27/2011

I am a stickler for my kids hair being neat, clean and fairly short. They have some say on the style but it has to be over their ears, not in their eyes and we definitely wouldn't allow it to their shoulders or anything. I am one that feels their appearance is a reflection on myself and their father so we are huge sticklers on their hair and clothing anytime they even contemplate leaving the house.

No item of clothing with holes or any stains. Neat, clean hairstyles. etc.

My 14 & 13yr old have some say on style and can choose their own clothing as long as it is approved by my husband and myself. My 5yr old has no say on hairstyles yet and I choose his clothing for him still daily and lay it out.

Jenny - posted on 09/27/2011

My DS hair is real long too. I like it that way and will keep it like that till summer in December. I get comments from my mum on this all the time. But again that is cultral. She always offers to give him a hair cut when he comes over, but that's because for religious reasons she believes boys should have short hair.

It's not just long hair. I see little boys at the mall with some weird hair cuts and it makes me look twice, but only because its different. Doesn't mean its good or bad, its just not the normal.

I have bought a few "salmon" pink shirts for my husband. Pink came into fashion for men back a couple years ago, and I see a lot wearing the colour. Like that lady said, she may by her son a pink Oxford shirt and let him wear it to school. See some forms of pink are okay for boys even today, and you wont get people battling an eyelid. Its about what's in fashion and what is culturally acceptable.

What about the Muslim men? They wear dresses and no one bats an eye lid. Its culturally (and religiously) acceptable for them to wear it.
There are a lot of other cultral examples I could give about dress codes but I think you get my drift.

I think its harmless and not worth stressing over. Who knows maybe in 20 years time we will all be wearing futuristic skin tight silver clothing like in the movies! :)))
I say lighten up.

Joy - posted on 09/27/2011

Jenny, regarding your excerpt.....Princeton source or not...I think that's a load of you know what! No offense! I would never "assign" a color to my son. I just still don't get why taste has anything to do with gender. If a girl likes blue (it happens to be my favorite color), it's fine. But if a boy likes pink or purple or some other "feminine" color, many people think quietly to themselves "Uh oh".

Something similar is happening with myself and my MIL regarding the length of my son's hair. He's about to turn 4 and I've always let him keep his hair long. He's only had maybe 5 hair cuts in his whole life and most of them were just to trim the ends to keep them out of his eyes. It was partly selfish on my part, because I liked the way he looked with long hair. But I would always ask him if he wanted it short and he would always say no. "Do you want your hair short like Daddy's? Or long like Mommy's?" Daddy has a high & tight Marine haircut. Mine is to my waist. He always said he liked it long so since that is also what I liked then that's how it always was. Well, my MIL....ohhhh my MIL. Every time she would see him she would say, TO HIM, "You need to tell your Mommy to get your hair cut!" I'd take it with a grain of salt, leave it be. Then, about a month ago, I was looking at his hair and it was starting to look like a mullet because they were keeping his bangs short but the rest was growing, about at his shoulders. I finally decided that, rather than him end up with a Billy Ray haircut (LOL), I'd get it cut short. BUT, I got him a faux hawk, because it's the one he picked out (and I couldn't have been more proud!). The first time my MIL saw him, his hair wasn't spiked, and it looked just like a normal short hair cut and she said, "Oh Jacob! I like your hair! You look like a BOY now!!!" This is coming from the woman whose hair is cut short....like to her ears short. /head desk. I swear, if the woman wasn't going through cancer treatments I'd have made a stink. I just don't get it though. Why is it SUCH a BIG deal to everyone if a boy has long hair? Girls can wear blue, wear pants, boots, and have short hair. Boys...let's see. They can't wear pink or purple or a dress of any sort and if their hair isn't short people give them funny looks and tell you to cut it. WTF???

Jenny - posted on 09/27/2011

Here's an interesting excerpt "The Princeton group posits that kids become aware by age two that there are two distinct genders and that they belong to one of them. Securing a place in one's gender is important to a child's psychological development. One easy way for a child to achieve this security is by adopting the color assigned to his gender by society and rejecting the other [source: Princeton University]."

Jenny - posted on 09/27/2011

I think it has a lot to do with culture and fitting in. I.e prior to the 1920's both young girls and boys wore dresses, but we rarely see this happen these days. It's just the socially accepted norm of the day. I wouldn't sweat about it unless it was limiting my child in some way, which I have not yet experienced.

Sal - posted on 09/27/2011

while i agree to a point that girls do have more choices of styles and colours (i have a son and daughters) i do think that if girls choose to dress as a boy there is no less grief finger pointing and teasing, they have more 'acceptable' option before they do get attention but then it is just as judgemental, just check out shilo jolie pitt (i guess that is her name) she is always being made a feature of becase she likes boys cloths, i have never seen that in the media about a boy.. and for a young girl at school it is just as hard...

Sherri - posted on 09/27/2011

@Angela if my kids spelled color with a u it would most definitely be marked incorrect in school and corrected to eliminate the u. My son just had a spelling test with the word color and if he had added a u it would be marked wrong.

Krista - posted on 09/27/2011

Elfrieda, you're not wrong about the confidence thing. I was thinking about this thread during my drive to work this morning, and it reminded me of a guy from my high school.

This kid was poorer than poor, and all of his clothes were from second-hand stores. But that kid could have ran circles around Tim Gunn in the "Make It Work" department. On a typical day, he'd be wearing a plum satin shirt and green plaid slacks. He wore the WILDEST stuff. But he was so incredibly confident and friendly and always had a cheery hello for everybody...and everybody adored him. He was actually voted Student of the Year by the student body the year that he graduated.

So yeah, there's the occasional kid who has enough self-confidence to carry that off, and that's seriously awesome. And I would love for my kid to have that much confidence. But I think it's something that comes with time.

Angela - posted on 09/27/2011

JuLeah
"You can't be from America ... you add a 'u' to the word color which we don't do here."
Hogwash it depends when you grew up and where as to the spelling but it can be spelled either way in the USA, both are correct.

Stifler's - posted on 09/26/2011

I'm guessing this is why we have uniforms in Australia. It annoys me that girls can wear anything and noone cares but if a boy was to wear a dress or skirt people would say something but girls can wear pants, blue, green, overalls, etc and it's not a big deal.

Amy - posted on 09/26/2011

It definitely becomes more difficult with school age children. My son picked a plaid backpack for school this year. It is multi colored, but the pink on it seemed to stand out to me. I was so afraid he would be teased about having a "girly" back pack. I even asked another mom I saw in the store with her sons if she would buy that bag. She looked at it and said probably not, but then asked her son (same age as mine) if he liked it. He said he did. I did buy it, and as far as I know, it hasn't been an issue.

Elfrieda - posted on 09/26/2011

@ Sherri

I don't really have a problem with there being "girl's shirts" and "boy's shirts", and that dresses are only for girls, etc. I don't mind boys and girls being different in some ways.



I'm just annoyed that girls get ALL the colours and shapes except the boring ones. (well, boys can have stars, and they're not boring, but you get my point)



So I'd definitely not dress my son up like a girl, but why can't he have a pink lunchbag? Of course I don't want him to be teased, so there's that aspect, but confident kids can pull off a lot.

Krista - posted on 09/26/2011

Sigh. That's a tough one, Sherri. I'll be honest.

On one hand, I hate the idea that my kid has to conform to other peoples' predetermined idea of what constitutes "masculine". And if he loves pink dresses, it would break my heart to take that away from him.

But, by the same token, I know how cruel kids can be. And I know that some things can follow you around until graduation and beyond. In an ideal world, kids would be able to wear whatever they damned well please and not be teased for it. But...we live in a far from ideal world. And considering how devastating bullying can be, and what it can lead to, I don't know how comfortable I am sending my son to school with a big pink bullseye on his forehead.

So I'd probably dissuade him from wearing "girls'" clothes to school, and would hate myself for it.

But I'd get him a pink boys' oxford shirt and tell him to wear it with pride. :)

Sherri - posted on 09/26/2011

So out of curiosity if almost everybody is okay with boys having girl things, pink things etc. Would you allow your child to wear a pink girls shirt or dress to school if they wanted too??

Because although I allowed them to like pink, play with dolls etc as a toddler once they started school I really made sure they were very boyish.

Rebecca - posted on 09/26/2011

Before you get your panties in a bunch, I would make sure it wasn't really the clerk who substituted it. About a month ago, both of my 3 year old boys were at IKEA and they had free face painting. My one son asked to be the pink princess kitty. I was totally fine with it as was my husband. The other one asked to be Minnie Mouse. Their faces were painted by two separate face painters. The lady who painted the Minnie Mouse painted it exactly as pictured -- with little hearts and bows and pink glitter. The other face painter changed my son's pink princess kitty to a blue kitty, with less princess to it. I didn't ask him to do that -- I was actually a little annoyed that he changed the color without asking, but he clearly did it because he felt a little boy shouldn't have a pink princess kitty face. I was actually worried my son was going to have a meltdown because his face wasn't pink, but thankfully he didn't. So it is possible that the clerk just changed it on their own. For me, sometimes my husband balks about the boys liking "girly" things, but most of the times he doesn't. I personally think it's worth pushing about because I don't believe kids shouldn't be restricted in their color choices over something as silly as gender roles. Besides, pink is pretty! ;-)

Tasha - posted on 09/26/2011

Who cares, no one cares if a little girl is wearing blue, why is pink so taboo? I think it sends kids the wrong message, telling them what they can and cant like. I grew up climbing trees, playing gi joes and watching football, as long as the things our children are participating in arent detrimental or harmful in some real way, whats the problem? I say indulge your little guy in what makes him happy, not everyone will understand, but screw them, we arent all the same, thats what makes us who we are, be happy with it!

Adrienne - posted on 09/26/2011

I feel ya. While my son's favorite colors (for now) are red and blue, his blanket that he HAS to have in order to sleep is pink. It was my baby blanket that my Grams made for me and so it's special to him. But we have a couple of friends that kind of tease about the pink blankie. Put my foot down on that one really fast with a "he loves MY baby quilt so much that he can't sleep without it. And really - who can blame him, it has had 35 years of washing and love to make it super soft!" They stopped really fast like I said.

We don't make a big deal out of color choices, toy choices etc in our house. Kids like what they like. I do get frustrated that certain things (Dora, Easy Bake Oven, etc) are marketed for girls and only made in pink and purple though because I don't want my son to be teased by his friends.

Tammy - posted on 09/24/2011

Under 10 boys and girls are practically androgynous; it's society and tradition that dictates their gender specifics.
My 3 year old daughter wears mostly pastel pinks and purples and she's very girly, but she loves to play with trains, loves to pretend play pirates, is on a soccer tots team (the only girl), oh and has a pink plastic lawn mower!
My point? Let your little guy follow his little pink heart; he'll have plenty of time being manly when he hits puberty. :)

Georgia - posted on 09/24/2011

If colour choice and toy preference are supposed to be regulated, then I'm going to be fined sometime very soon. My eldest loves his brand new pink wheelbarrow with pastel coloured gardening tools (the colour was an error on my part because I didn't look at the box). He also loves Tinkerbell. Recently, he discovered nailpolish so his mother had to buy some because she doesn't even do her nails. lol Personally, I hate the colour pink, but the boys love it.

As for the English and speaking/writing English, well, since it originated in England their way is the proper way. Hence why it's called the Queen's English and not the President's English.

Charlie - posted on 09/24/2011

Well my son found a baby doll this morning and has been rocking it to sleep and changing its nappy !

Stifler's - posted on 09/24/2011

My son is constantly going in our wardrobe and pulling out my high heels. I'm more amazed by the fact that he always seems to get them on the right feet. he has to have some perfume too and I always catch him with my lipgloss when he's gotten into my hand bag.