ODD or rebellious brat?

Pink - posted on 11/10/2012

I do will take responsibilities for some of my sons behaviors be cause he's mine but you can't blame odd on the parent if they didn't have behavior problems .Have you ever heard a story about a child living a rough life at home but still beating the odds .It happens everyday,they get

Good grades,are better parents etc.... It's always easy for someone else to judge when their not living their life.And each child with odd is not the same some are mild,moderate,and severe.

Melissa - posted on 08/01/2012

I can't even begin to tell you what it is like having a child with ODD; every minute of every day is chaos.....my husband and I would have to tag team, so that we could get a shower, go to the market, pick up our other son; there is no family vacations, going out to dinner, or going to a movie. AND yes, I can tell you....they will not respond to discipline; ironically, they are wired to oppose anything and everything even if it was a simple suggestion of, "Let's get ice cream tonight," which would seem to be a desirable thing.

There are many factors involved with ODD; underlying mental health issues (eg. ADD, OCD, Bi-Polar, etc). Genetics with mental health issues (my ex-husband is bi-polar I, and has been hospitalized involuntarily for psychotic episodes). And yes, many environmental issues too....it is difficult to focus on parenting when your ex-spouse (children's father) is breaking down your door, slashing your tires, stalking, threatening, etc.

This was ten years ago......my son is now over 18, and just recently moved in with his biological father up north. I worked really hard to get my son therapy and medication (when he was on his medication it was like night and day), but his biological father told him that medication was the government's way to control people (etc, etc, etc). My other son is an honor roll student, varsity and travel soccer player, and yes, there are days, where he is the typical teenager.....oh yes, there is, but never in an instant was he like his brother, so there is an enormous difference between adolescent rebellion and ODD.

Again, my son is now legally an adult, and every day, I worry about him, and the people around him......there is no question when you have dealt with a child with ODD (look into these people's eyes.....they are so spent with exhaustion).

Rachael - posted on 04/30/2012

ODD is the first in a group of disorders that leads to psychopathy. It starts at a very young age and in about half the cases goes on to become Conduct Disorder, which is just more severe ODD. It can then progress to being labelled a sociopath or psychopath (they are the same thing just some places use different names). It's a mental health problem. The person, from a young age, has a blatant disregard and dislike of authority figures and does not care about the rights of others. It can't be disciplined out of a child. It's just how they are. There is the possibility to improve the condition to a point where they function more or less normally if it's caught early and treated intensively but it's not just kids being bad and a parent not disciplining their kid.

Natalie - posted on 04/29/2012

My son was diagnosed with ADHD when he was 5(living with his father) and, in middle school, they added ODD when he stopped doing any work (because he was bored with it.) When he turned 16, he and I discussed it and I shipped his butt off to Job Corps with the understanding that this was it...if he quit this, he wasn't coming back home because there was nothing else that I could do for him. He went, got his GED and his diploma, and completed their business management course with flying colors. He's now about to graduate from Army Infantry training. I, too, think ODD is a cop-out for those who don't want to deal with bad behavior. No matter what their age or "diagnosis," they need to know they will be held accountable!!!

Jaime - posted on 04/23/2012

the sad thing is that whether a kid actually has a problem or not, the parents would rather slap a label on it instead of work with the child and fix it. or the kid claims they have said problem even though they don't and use it as an excuse, like my brother, ugh....

Sal - posted on 04/23/2012

Ohhh and yes it is up to the parents to have some basic consequences in place that they can fall back on, my 16 year old recently got in some trouble (along with 6 mates) and we had to go to a youth conference (extra stressful as hubby is a cop) in the months between his big night of stupid and the conference he was grounded by us, had his pocket money slashed and was not allowed to do his L Plate test..... and he grudgingly done as he was told. He did have that basic respect for us, he bitched and fought about it but did do it, at the conference the parents of several of the other boys were at their witts end as they couldn't keep their sons home and they susequently got in further trouble they just hadn't instilled that respect upon them until the boys were 16-18 years old, it is a bit like shutting the gate after the horse has bolted.

Sal - posted on 04/23/2012

Omg..... My son isn't just. a pain In the ass he had odd..... Yeah right teens are learning their place in the world, they are flooded with new hormones and life has gone from safe secure mum and dad are gods to kids who are just trying to see where they fit in the new world they are in.... I do agree that it might be s real diognosis in the odd case but not a common one, I also agree with the teen- toddler comparison I have 4&5 year olds and a 16 year old and the tanty throwing attention seeking and egocentric behavior is coming at me frOm all sides....

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/23/2012

Oh, there is definitely rebellious teens. Again, it is normal for a teen to push back and be rebellious. This is how they learn who they are and where their place is within society. However, it is then up to the parents to designate a correct consequence that will demonstrate they will not allow or enable the teen to do it again. If the teen keeps doing it, I would have to say there is something missing to the puzzle.

If a teen is able to respect and hear what their parents are saying, they are not going to commit the same offense over and over again. If the parent is able to be forgiving but yet place stern consequence with respect and consistency, the teen is more than likely not going to keep doing the same incorrect thing. A teen often pushes back because they feel their rules are either over the top, unjust or there are not enough solid boundaries. It is important as a parent to look at your boundaries with a objective view. You need to try and put yourself in their shoes (we were all teens once) and do our best at creating fair, sensible but yet strong, consistent guidelines. Ones that you are going to be able to follow through with. Ones that they believe you are not going to flake on, once it is time to give out a consequence.

Is it easy? No, of course not. Who ever said raising children is easy? Does it take a whole lot of effort? Of course it does. Do all parents, even really good ones, entail the ability to always be on the up and up? No, we aren't perfect. However, teaching. molding and guiding your child, starts when they are little and it does not end until they move out.

Jaime - posted on 04/22/2012

...no such thing as rebellious teenagers?? hahahahaahahahaha that's the best thing i've heard all day...

Stifler's - posted on 04/22/2012

I think it';s a personality clash between families to be honest. My parents are still embarrassing and i'm 23. I can't stand being around them.

Janice - posted on 04/22/2012

I do think ODD is real. However, I do believe majority of kids with that label are misdiagnosed.

If you have a child who is horrendously defiant the entire lives then maybe it is ODD. However, a kid who suddenly becomes radically defiant as a teenager probably does not.

I think at 14+ you can choose to "be a brat." Maybe a child with great parents just happens to have a risk taker personality and gets in with the "neglected" kids and starts being defiant.



I do not think that ODD is caused by mediocre parenting. I do believe that severe abuse or neglect during infancy and toddler can trigger ODD in a child who already has a predisposition for mental illness.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

makes not maked....*sigh* too any typos, I'm getting tired! :)

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Oh, I get that Meme! LOL But, that doesn't make them ill or the parents bad, it just maked them wrong.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Well, you know it means absolutely nothing to a teen that their parents are paying the bills. Until they are on their own and experience what that actually means, it is a very distant thought to them. ;)

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Meme-I am unav=ble to answer those questions either because I am not personally involved. It is just what I have been told has/has not happened. I just think that a teen is old enough to know better and needs to behave while someone lese is paying their bills. If not, move out. If you choose to stay, then you need to choose to obey, ALL the rules, even the rediculous ones! If not, you are being a brat, you are not sick.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Happy Mama--I am old enough to make my own decisions of what I think is right or wrong." Obviously, I am not quoting exactly. But my response to that teen is,"Well if you know it, pack your bags and get you own damn place and you won't HAVE to sneak out. You can come and go as you please."



With an older teen, such as 17,18. Yes, if you have done everything and taken everything from good clothing to everything in their room to computers to phones to TV's and they are still going around with this mind set. Yep, I would be inclined to tell them to pack their bags and move on to where they can do as they wish.



However, with that said, I still do not believe they are brats. I also do not think this behaviour is anywhere near that of ODD. I think there is a more underlying problem than noticed. Perhaps there is little to no respect within the home. Little to no understanding between each other. Little to no followed through discipline from a young age. Or too much of everything I just listed. I mean, you cannot be a passive parent for most of your child's years and then all of a sudden decide you want them to listen and obey. It just doesn't work that way.



I also believe that kids, including teens require being somewhat rebellious. It is how they experience situations and realize what life is really about.



Since I do not know the situation you speak of, I can only think that perhaps the child has often been disrespected, misunderstood or has some really stringent "in" times. A child of the age of 17+, should have less parenting attached. There should of course still be home rules but it is also time for the parent to allow for them to experience life on their own. By that age a parent should be satisfied and trusting that they have done a good job. If they are confident in their parenting and how they have thus far raised their child, they should be letting go a bit too. A child that is sneaking out all the time with disregard to their parents rules, has a reason, it just may not be known to them or the parent. It is hard to have an unbiased insight when you are within the very situation.



ETA:

Also, I am not saying a child should never be held accountable. The fact is when you are giving boundaries and consequence, there is a choice for that child. If you have thoroughly explained the choices, then they decide to still go with the choice that was to the negative. Yes, they need to be held accountable. That is when the consequence is enforced. They are being held accountable by having to deal with whatever consequence was explained in the beginning.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

In the situation I know about, the parents have done everything but literally stay awake all night and sit at the window of the girls room. They have given restrictions, they have taken away privelages, they have sought conselling on some level. It comes down to the tens response, "I am going to do what I want to do and there is nothing you can do about it anymore. I am old enough to make my own decisions of what I think is right or wrong." Obviously, I am not quoting exactly. But my response to that teen is,"Well if you know it, pack your bags and get you own damn place and you won't HAVE to sneak out. You can come and go as you please."

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Happy Mama---I would agree that there are probably cases of true ODD out their, I just think it is wrong to blame some one other than the offender for that offenders wrong doing. If a teen ( say 16/17/18) is old enough to sneak out of the house in the middle of the night, time and time, and time again, they are OLD enough to know better, than that is THEIR personal choice and THEY need to be held accountable for their actions instead of blaming the parent or society.

So, for the older children that are misbehaving what are their consequences? It seems to me the consequences are not enough. The teens are not taking their parents seriously and IMO, there is a reason for that. The parents are not standing tall enough to make their statement of what is accpetable and what is not, in their home. Otherwise, these kids would not be doing it, regardless of age.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

I would agree that there are probably cases of true ODD out their, I just think it is wrong to blame some one other than the offender for that offenders wrong doing. If a teen ( say 16/17/18) is old enough to sneak out of the house in the middle of the night, time and time, and time again, they are OLD enough to know better, than that is THEIR personal choice and THEY need to be held accountable for their actions instead of blaming the parent or society. A younger teen (12, 13) or a child, not so much.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

I am sorry I gave you the impression I was bothered by the comparison. I too believe that ADD/ADHD is HIGHLY over diagnnosed and appreciated your comparison. I just got a little concerned when it seemed to high jack my post! LOL

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

All kids are different, which requires a parent to parent each differently in some aspects. So, as for a child that is defiant and has siblings that are well mannered. Perhaps the way the parent is raising, said child, is not the best approach for them. Some kids are more emotional than the next and othrs are much more apt in dealing with sterner parenting.



Sure there are going to be kids that think they know better than their parent and try to defy them on everything. However, it is up to that parent to figure out what is the best approach to help teach and guide that child in the right direction.



ETA:

I am sorry for bringing ADHD into it. I only did because it too has an over diagnoses. Which I believe ODD most definitely does. ;)

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

How did this bcome an ADD/ADHD convo? No offense, especially to Meme and your your situation. I think for a child to be given a diagnosis of a learning difference (which is my belief what these are) is different than ODD, an excuse for bad behaviour. To me, t seems that the consensus is, there is no such thing as rebellious, defiant, teens (which I do not agree with) and therefore if the parents are able to do XYZ or the child was perfectly raised (which I believe is impossible for anyone to do) then the teen must be mentally ill. I just don't buy it. I think a teen who chooses over & over & over & OVER again to defy his/her parents, for whatever reason, is doing so out of choice, not because someone made them or because they have a mental illness.

Now as far as Jefferey D, well, duh on that one.

But I DO personally know some kids who do what they want to do because they want to and can give a rats ass what their parents say or do. PERIOD. And it's not because their parents are not doing a perfectly fine job. Otherwise, how do you explain rebellious, defiant teens who have well behaved, sweet, kind, respectful sibblings. I guess the mental illness thing. I just can NOT wrap my head around that. I think it is because I do not buy into the notion that there is no such thing as a bad kid. I do not believe ALL kids are good or actually want to do good! I know I wasn't! But I did. But I didn't do it because I wanted to and I do not blame it on my parents, my neighbors, my teacher or my "life experiences". I rebelled because I thought I knew better than all of these other people and I was selfish and just plainly, a brat!

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Rebecca---"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead."
~Thomas Paine

I'd also like to know what reason I am abandoning. lol. Sorry, you lost me there.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Rebecca---Doctors with degrees who are invited by the National Institutes of Health as experts in the area of ADHD: Idiots.

Well, I did say it was 14 years ago, didn't I? Best to move on, since trying to find any affirmation in something that was said so long ago is probably not a very good stance.

Wikipedia: a reliable source

No where did I say it was a reliable source. However, I did say everything it states in regard to ADHD is accurate. Therefore in the instance of the definition of ADHD, yeah, the wiki has very correct information.

I would never expect anyone that has not lived it or become thoroughly educated within a particular subject, have any idea of what is actual and what isn't. It's OK that you have your opinion. I guarantee if it were one or more of your kids, you would have a much different outlook. Way to go underminding those children and parents that have been tested exhaustively and have been found to have a "true" cognitive disorder, such as ADHD. I love it when someone that has no real understanding feels they know. ;) Pffffttt.

Rebecca - posted on 04/22/2012

Doctors with degrees who are invited by the National Institutes of Health as experts in the area of ADHD: Idiots.



Wikipedia: a reliable source



"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead."

~Thomas Paine



Moving on to more productive pursuits....

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Rebecca---The one panel member said, "it's really hard to know how to answer this question." Really? Yet they have no problem slapping a kid with that label?



I also believe you will find it is not the specialists that are slapping the children with any diagnoses, it is the GP's. Too many GP's are not educated in specialty areas and they are making diagnoses, which is contributing to a high misdiagnoses rate. Specialists have specific testing and they do not just slap a label and give meds. They assess the child over a period of time.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

I'm pretty sure, by all accounts, Jeffrey Dahmer's parents were polite, respectful, and excellent parents. That didn't prevent Jeffrey Dahmer from being a sociopath.



Ummm, I would be inclined to say he was born with a mental disability. ;)



Rebecca---It is an accurate statement, MeMe. Despite what "Wikipedia" says



I guess they had some idiot doctors on the panel. Out of all 3 specialists I have had my daughter to and she still sees yearly, had the exact same testing. They all put her through the exact same things and every single one of them could and did answer the question of what is ADHD and how is it determined a "true" case. What you heard is not an accurate statement. It is a statement that a few doctors made 14 years ago. 14 years ago, there was no where near as much information and testing as there is today. 14 years is a long time for science and medical findings.



Are you still going to refer back 20 years, when you have this same debate with others in 20 years? lol Come on now, you have to go with what there is now, not what it was 14+ years ago. My daughter was diagnosed in late 2004-early 2005, this was still 6 years after the "so called" statement you heard. She was 5 when the testing started and just turned 6 (within a couple months) when the diagnoses was actually given. It wasn't me that went to the doctor thinking something was wrong either, it was her grade primary teachers (she had two in the same class). I thought she was how all kids were, until I got educated and referenced the previous years did I realize, indeed she was a pary of the "normal" range of children.



Please do not belittle my knowledge. I have lived with and experienced it first hand for 14 years, 9 of them being under medical guidance. I only used wiki because it was the first link I found when I searched, that explains ADHD from top to bottom.

Rebecca - posted on 04/22/2012

It does seem awfully simplistic to me, Happy Mama. And perhaps personally biased as well (e.g., my child has a disease that she was born with; other kids with problems are just the result of poor parenting). I'm pretty sure, by all accounts, Jeffrey Dahmer's parents were polite, respectful, and excellent parents. That didn't prevent Jeffrey Dahmer from being a sociopath.



With respect to the video about the ADHD experts, the testimony I was referring to in contained in the movie Generation RX at about 27 minutes in. In 1998, the National Institutes of Health sponsored a three day conference on ADHD (I was mistaken in thinking it was the DSM meeting -- it was a separate meeting). Experts from around the world were flown in to discuss the "illness". They agreed that there was "no consistent diagnostic test for ADHD" and that the "cause or causes remain speculative". When asked by a reporter how to describe an ADHD child, not a single member of the panel was able to describe an ADHD child by symptomology. The one panel member said, "it's really hard to know how to answer this question." Really? Yet they have no problem slapping a kid with that label?

It is an accurate statement, MeMe. Despite what "Wikipedia" says.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

OK. Makes sense, Wasn't sure if you meant literally or figuratively.

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

rape, molestation, bullying, accident, illness...

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

In what way, Laura?

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

well...sometimes the rest of the world also beats the shit out of people and turns them into assholes, it's not always the parents, but it's always something

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

So there are only 3 choices-bad parents, good kids or mental illness. Nothing else exists. hmmm...just not sure I would agree with that.

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

unless of course you are talking about psychopathy...that's the only way I think you could say a child was "born bad".



and even then...there's not much they can do about that

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Laura---I've never met a bad kid with good parents...and that's not to say nice parents...but parents who are consistant and diligent in their discipline and rewards.

Exactly - me neither.

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

Edited to add

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Off topic, what does ETA mean?

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

I've never met a bad kid with good parents...and that's not to say nice parents...but parents who are consistant and diligent in their discipline and rewards.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Thank you for clarifying. I understand what you are saying but I can not say that I actually agree with it. Maybe in time my feelings will change but I actually do think that some kids and teens are just bad because they choose to be, just as some adults are bad because they choose to be. I do not, at this point, think that personal responsibility is something that *poof* comes to people on their 18th birthday. I know my last statement is over simplifying the thought but it gives an acurate picture of how blown away I am, ok not blown away but surprised none the less, that there is even a thought of ODD. It's all so knew to me still!

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Exactly Laura! Couldn't have said it better. ;)



They aren't meaning to act like that though, their parents' caused it.

Isobel - posted on 04/22/2012

No Happy Mama, what they are saying is that all kids with ODD come from over-bearing families, or situations of neglect...not that all kids who have over-bearing families or neglect WILL have ODD...it's kinda like saying all chihuahuas are dogs, but not all dogs are chihuahuas.



My personal opinion is that ODD is a diagnosis unlike most psychiatric diagnoses in the fact that it is CAUSED by the parents' shitty parenting...which leads to the child becoming a spoiled rotten brat who NEVER does anything they are asked to because they are assholes, then they go to the doctor and the doctor says "they won't do ANYTHING you tell them? That's ODD" because not doing anything your told is the definition of the diagnosis.



Then armed with a three-letter diagnosis, the shitty parent feels vindicated that they were a shitty parent because their kid was so difficult instead of the other way around.



ETA: sorry I'm bitchy, I had 6 screaming girls in my house awake till 4 last night

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

That pretty much sums up my thoughts Happy Mama. IMO, there is no such thing as a child born "bad" or a "brat". There are underlying reasons for their behaviour. All children want to be be "good". It just depends on the environment of which they are raised (which includes decent parents with their child's best interest at heart) and/or they truly have a malfunctioning brain, in certain area's.

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

So, I think I have a clear understanding of your thoughts Meme but I do not want to speak out of turn. If I may, you are saying, that as long as a parent is as consistent as possible and as fair and unbiased in the setting, application, and follow thru of rules and expectations that a child will almost always be a productive and respectful child, teen, whatever....But if a parent who is all those things and more and that child or teen is defiant, then it MUST be a mental disorder. Is it reallly impossible for a teen/child just to be a brat? Again, if I am speaking out of turn, please feel free to correct me.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

I do believe that those children that come from a home with over abuse of rules or under use of rules, will have difficulty. I am not sure that I would say all of them will, since I don't feel that to be true.



Will all children or most that come from a home that uses punishment and reward end up defiant? Absolutely not. Since it is not just these two things that teaches and guides a child. As previously stated, there must be consistency, understanding, boundaries, consequence, compassion, respect, guidance, structure and affection. Without meeting most or all of these things, which would include a discpline ( I don't like the word punishment, as I place spanking in the punishment category) and reward system, you risk your child being defiant more times than not.



For as long as the parents are responsible for their child, they are responsible in teaching them appropriate behaviour. If their child is always defiant, for everything, I think there needs to be some serious family picture taken.



Do I think there is such thing as ODD? Yeah, I do. I just think too many kids are being misdiagnosed. This disorder (just as ADHD/ADD) should be considered when the child has ALWAYS been this way and the family structure is looked at very closely. If it is found that there are no real issues at home, including how the child is taught and guided, then I think it is more than likely a "true" diagnosis.



It is also important to remember, no one is perfect. No parent must be perfect in order to raise a productive child. Perfection is impossible. However, you must take it as a serious job and do your best to put as much effort in as possible. Not over effort and not under effort. Ensuring to meet it in the middle, will give you some damn responsible and respectful children. Unless, of course, they truly have a disorder, which is possible (just not as possbile as some like to think).

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

It seems then that every parent, since it is IMPOSSIBLE for any parent to ALWAYS be consistent, is doomed to have a child that is outright defiant. I don't know what I think about that yet!

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Also-one of the parents on FB mentioned - Well here, I'll just copy and paste it - "Fact: all children with ODD come from homes with rewards and punishments, where the parents dont practice authentic parenting and where there are either too many rules or where there is neglect." Seriousy! Where is the personal responsibility? So, according to this mother, EVERY kids whose parents have rules or rewards is going to be insanely defiant. Really?!?! That is where I am coming from. The original poster described what I would call an absolutely defiant teen! Not just a typical, checking to make sure Mom & Dad are paying attention teen. Here this mother, and others including my IRL friend blame a mental disorder, and I think the kid is just a brat and needs to be told, "it's my way or the highway!"

Again, before people start throwing eggs at me. I am knew to the relm of gentle parenting and I am still trying to figure out what it is I feel and don't feel. This one threw me for a loop!

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Yes, Happy Mama. I do understand what you are saying. I still don't think they are brats. I think it completely has to do with the parents and how they parent. There is always a reaction to an action. If a parent fails at supplying appropriate boundaries, consequences, leadership, support, love, compassion, consistency, many, if not most, children will react this way. Now, there are just so many parents that do not do most or all of the terms I listed above, that there are becoming more and more children that cannot properly obey. They just don't know how. They do not trust their parents, they have been failed and they do not realize this. I didn't as a youth. I do now. If ODD had been around when I was young, it is more than likely something I would have been diagnosed with. However, I have let go of my past enough to realize I am responsible for myself and my actions. Including those of growth from within. I must take action to be a stand up person for my children, otherwise, I risk them feeling and acting out, just as I did.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

As for ODD. I truly believe it has to do with the parents. It is more likely a child with a terrible upbringing will become defined as having ODD. A child of alcoholic parents for instance, a child that is neglected/abused, a child that has extremly passive parents that suddenly try to enforce structure, a child that is not appreciated and is always expected to fail, are at a high risk of having ODD.



ODD, in my opinion does not occur within the womb as ADHD/ADD does (It is my beliefe this is how these disorders occur, from all the studying I have done over the years). I think a child with ODD has a very emotional personality and internally accepts hurt much easier than some other children.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oppositiona...

Happy - posted on 04/22/2012

Meme - I got the impression, and maybe it is a false one, that ODD is not used for describing children that "test the boundaries". I get that all children, hell even most adults, test the boundaries and see how far an authority will let them take it. I am not talking about a teen or child that doesn't always keep curfew or doesn't always bring home the best grades or doesn't always______ you fill in the blank. My impression, from reading several articles and from the discussion I was a part of on FB, is that this is the diagnosis used to describe those teens and kids who NEVER do what they are asked. Those who, as one mother out it, "If I asked my teen to do something, no matter what it was, I expected it NOT to be done." The conversation went on to explain about ODD being a possible reason the the teens behaviour and my thoughts, when I also spoke to my friend IRL about it was, "This kid is just a brat!" I hope I am making sense.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/22/2012

Since my previous thread was quite long, I figured I should separate it. ;)



Rebecca---When you are dealing with the realm of psychiatry, there often isn't a lot from a scientifically measureable perspective determine whether a disorder or condition really exists -- diagnosis is, by its nature, subjective.



I disagree but whats new, right? In regards to ADHD/ADD/ODD a parent should never just take a GP's word for it. That is the biggest issue right now. Many GP's are diagnosing these children, when they have absolutely no training or understanding of the disorders.



In order to ensure a child is being diagnosed accurately, they need to stop allowing GP's make these diagnoses. Mine was not comfortable with doing such a thing. He gave a referral to an actual ADHD specialist, a psychiatrist and a childhood developmental clinic. Within these specialties, they most definitely do have tests to depict if a child truly has a disorder. These tests range from physical to emotional to cognitive. I spent 3 hours with each of them, just answering their questions in regards to my daughter and her historical behaviour and struggles.



Until you are there and you have a child that has gone through the rigourus testing or you are taking up an education process that requires to you learn about disorders, it is very difficult, if not impossible for anyone to understand how it works.



Rebecca---The testimony of the "experts" about ADHD when asked to define it is hysterical --- they couldn't even define what a child with ADHD acts like -- but they know it when they see it.



I am unsure of what experts you are speaking of but that is not an accurate statement.

ADHD - What is it?



Kids with ADHD act without thinking, are hyperactive, and have trouble focusing. They may understand what's expected of them but have trouble following through because they can't sit still, pay attention, or attend to details.



Of course, all kids (especially younger ones) act this way at times, particularly when they're anxious or excited. But the difference with ADHD is that symptoms are present over a longer period of time and occur in different settings. They impair a child's ability to function socially, academically, and at home.



No child under school age, should ever be diagnosed with ADHD/ADD. They are simply too young to make this distinction. However, once they are shcool age, they should be able to demonstrate abilities of the above. If they cannot and it is reoccurring issue every single day, then they need to be assessed.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attention_d...



Wilipedia - Yep I am going there. What is described within the link, fully explains ADHD and very well may I add.