Pro choice-pro life spectrum

Merry - posted on 04/03/2011 ( 98 moms have responded )

9,274

169

248

I see over and over that people say I'm pro choice for everyone else but pro life for myself
Or pro choice as long as the woman isn't using it as north control
Or pro choice unless she is aborting for stupid reasons
Or I'm pro life except for rape cases
Or I'm pro life unless it's incest or the womans life is at risk
Or I'm pro life in it's entirety for babies, but I do agree with death penalty
And then there's the full on pro life, life for all from conception even meaning no birth controls that can terminate an early embryo.

Maybe more variations I don't know of!

I think there should be more terms to define where you stand, but idk what they should be!
But it sure isn't as black and white as pro choice or pro life!

If you see this, leave this form field blank.
Powered by RESPECT not THUMPS

98 Comments

View replies by

Lesa - posted on 04/05/2011

150

6

4

Some people will always abuse the system but that doesn't make it wrong for others who use it for medical reasons, or rape or incest. If we let the government decide what is right for our body then we might as well step back in time a couple hundred years. I don't agree with abortions per se but I also don't agree with someone telling me what I can or can't do with my body.

Jenni - posted on 04/05/2011

5,928

34

373

Here's an interesting tidbit...



Canada has no restrictions on abortions, no criminal laws, NO restriction on gestational age.... NONE.... we are one of the few countries to have zero restrictions on abortions.



Now here's where it gets interesting: http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_ab...



Abortion rates per capita: The USA ranks 6th for highest number of abortions performed whereas Canada ranks 14th out of 19 developed countries.

Merry - posted on 04/05/2011

9,274

169

248

Sarah, my husband thinks if you go in for your second abortion you should have to let them tie your tubes as well!
He's got a good point, but I don't think it could ever become law!

As for the whole D&C stuff, I will admit I have never experienced a miscarriage, I didn't know it was such a long process. I read what they do in a D&C and didn't think it sounded like an option I would pick. But maybe they are both just as awful situations. I'm so sorry you ladies had to go through either one. Sounds so scary. :(

Sara - posted on 04/05/2011

9,313

50

584

You know, I'm just going to throw this out there. Part of the reason I am pro-choice is because for several years I worked in social services with children. After seeing a child born addicted to crack, or abused or neglected, I think some of those children would have been better off if their mothers had just aborted them. I'm totally and completely serious. People talk about having compassion for children who will have no quality of life...a lot of those kids had none, and will never have one. I have truly seen some horrifying things (which is why I don't do it anymore), and that just furthered my resolve that abortion should remain legal and accessable to whomever wants it. That's the reality of the world we live in.

Sarah - posted on 04/05/2011

628

36

19

Off topic but Charlotte's comment reminded me...
I was talking to an ex boyfriend after i had my daughter (to my current boyfriend.) We were talking about his sex life, i'm not sure why? and i was telling him to be careful and always be safe and he said that he refuses to use contraception! Even though i offered to pay for his girlfriend to go on the pill or get an implanon thing, he refused! He said that if she got pregnant she would just get an abortion.. like its not big deal! Then he told me his sister has had 9.... NINE ABORTIONS! While his other sister had 'only' had like 3 or 4!
Needless to say i haven't had much to do with him since! I don't know if she ever got pregnant because i asked him not to tell me.
They really disgust me :( That just proves that there are disgusting people out there who literally use abortion as birth control!
I think there should be a 1 per customer rule..? :)

Charlotte - posted on 04/05/2011

359

43

18

I'm 100% pro-choice because to me pro-choice IS pro-life! It's no life to be forced to have a baby growing inside you when you don't want it not to mention the emotional scars that can leave on the mother and on the child. The only exception is those that use abortion as birth control although I find it hard to believe that any woman could be that stupid!

Becky - posted on 04/05/2011

2,892

44

92

I'm pro-life. I'm also against the death penalty and war. I don't believe one human being has the right to take the life of another, ever.
That said, I understand that there are cases where it is, or seems to be, the only option. When the mother will definitely die if she continues the pregnancy. When someone has a gun pointed at your child's or spouse's head and you have the ability to shoot them first (or the police do). When a tyrant dictator and his army are burning your village, raping your wives and forcing your 7 year old children to become soldiers.
I don't think abortion should be illegal. I don't agree with it, I do think it's murder, no matter what, (and yes, I would feel that way even if I myself had to have one to save my own life, which is the only reason I would have one. I'd still feel that I'd murdered my child.) But I also feel that I cannot step into someone else's life and make that choice for them. I can't tell them they have to give birth to a child who is going to die moments after it's born, in pain. I can't tell them they have to have their rapist's baby. So I don't think it should be illegal. I don't know, does that actually make me pro-choice?
I said before, I'm pro-compassion. :)
In the case of a child with a disability incompatible with life, it's impossible for me to say what I would do not being in that situation. But doctors are not God and they do make mistakes. Friends of mine were told that their daughter had a severe brain abnormality and would likely not even survive to birth, and would only have hours or days to live if she did. She is now two years old. She does have a brain abnormality and a heart disorder, but she is doing well, developing well, and is the most beautiful little girl you have ever seen. I know that they have not regretted their decision to continue the pregnancy for a second. I'm not sure I could take the chance that I could be aborting a baby who actually had a chance at a reasonably good quality of life.

[deleted account]

I guess I could be termed one of those "Pro-Death" people. I am in full support of abortion for any unviable fetuses for any reason whatsoever. I'm also in support of the death penalty, euthanasia and suicide.

Mileage may definitely vary, I know I'm out there on this one.

Sarah - posted on 04/04/2011

628

36

19

My belief is that if you have sex, you deal with the consequences!
I used to call myself pro life, but now i dont know because there are so many variables!
Abortion is okay if..
You are raped
You will die before 28 weeks if you continue the pregnancy
Your baby will definitely die
Your baby will have no quality of life whatsoever

and i'm okay with the morning after pill because i believe that prevents implantation so there isn't a baby to kill yet.

As far as making it illegal goes, i think it should definitely be illegal past 12 weeks unless mum or bub will die.
Abortions past 12 weeks disgust me.


@Lesa, that is an amazing story! I'm so happy you got your miracle :)

Jenni - posted on 04/04/2011

5,928

34

373

Omigod Lesa. That is so beautiful yet frightening. I'm so happy for you and your little girl that you listened to your heart on that one. That is amazing that it seems you knew and couldn't bring yourself to do it, it brings tears to my eyes!

Erin - posted on 04/04/2011

6,569

25

232

I am pro-choice for the same reason as Lisa. I believe in a woman's right to autonomy over her reproductive decisions. For me, that focuses on birth rights. But I can not demand laws and policies that allow women to birth where and how they choose, and not support a woman's right to decide what happens to her uterus at other times.

I actually just had this debate on a birth advocacy FB page, and was in the minority of pro-choice women. It was actually quite shocking, and disheartening for me.

I also agree that if you allow for any exceptions, you are pro-choice. A choice is a choice. There are aspects of abortion policy that I disagree with (I can't get my head around abortion for social reasons up too 24wks - 12 wks is the cut off where I am). But I can't be 'pro-choice with restrictions'. You either are, or you aren't.

[deleted account]

I had a miscarriage at home...if i could do it over i would have had a D&C....it was so hard to go through, i would rather just get it done and over with than to actually see the baby bleed out...i will never forget that experience...

Rosie - posted on 04/04/2011

8,657

30

315

completely agree dana. and in all actuality, i've had two miscarriages, one passed naturally, the second i had a d&c. both were horrifying in their own unique ways. i wouldn't wish either on my worst enemy.

[deleted account]

An abortion pill I disagree with but emergency contraception I have no problem with as that is not aborting a baby it is stopping implantation, which for me is when life begins.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 04/04/2011

18,532

9

2909

Lesa, oh my gosh, that is an amazing, yet scary story. Same to Dana and Theresa. I am sorry that anyone has to go through decisions like this.

I do have a question though. For those of you that say "for rape I think and abortion is ok (or incest etc)" what about the fact that typically the hospital (if you go in) will provide an abortion pill just in case. You may not be pregnant from teh rape, but this will make it so you never even have to know if you were. Where does everyone stand on this? Literally it would be a cell at this point if they do get preggo. It hasn't even started the begining stages of life. I am just curious.

Lesa - posted on 04/04/2011

150

6

4

I am pro choice but to back up the other women on here, I have had 4 miscarriages and my last pregnancy they told me that there was no heartbeat and they gave me pills to get the miscarriage process started. I felt broken. I just couldn't take the pills. I went to the doctor that week and ask him to prove that the baby was dead. Within the week they found her heartbeat and she is my beautiful miracle girl. She is now almost 3. I am thankful, I did not take the pills to abort my child.

Even though I would not abort my own children, I do feel as if every woman has the right to decide over her own body.

Esther - posted on 04/04/2011

3,513

32

144

I fully agree with Dana on the D&C comment. I have had a miscarriage too (my first pregnancy). At the first doctor's visit at 8 weeks the baby measured at 6 weeks and there was no heart beat detectable. For weeks my doctor ran test after test and did ultrasound after ultrasound (even referred me to another doctor who had more advanced equipment) but the baby never grew any more after that and no heart beat was ever found. In week 12 I opted for a D&C. I don't think that was in any way a disrespectful thing to do. I had waited long enough and I had shed enough tears. It was time for us all to move on. It was my choice and it should be my choice.

Which leads me to my stance. I'm pro-choice. Every situation is different. Every person involved is different. There is nothing more personal than having to make this kind of decision. Somehow the abortion debate always gets caricatured by the stories of the women who use abortion as birth control. But I think those women, who take such a grave decision that lightly, are a small minority. Since having been pregnant I have certainly become much more aware of the gravity of it all, but it's impossible to have an abortion without having been pregnant first right? So I think that means that the vast majority of women are well aware of the seriousness of their choice. Personally, I would not choose to have an abortion unless medically necessary (to prevent suffering of the baby or save my own life) but I would not judge someone who choses to have an abortion. I would prefer for it to be limited to say the first 3-4 months and after that only in extreme cases. I recently read a story of a 12 year old girl who was on a school trip when she started to have cramps and gave birth to a child. There is speculation that it may be the result of incest. I just cannot imagine condemning a child (the 12 year old) to go through a 40 week pregnancy by say her father. In those situations, I would not only approve of an abortion, I would most likely advocate it.

Dana - posted on 04/04/2011

11,264

35

489

Laura Hoffmann - posted 1 hour ago



I too would opt against a D&C unless I was in danger. I'd want the baby to pass naturally if at all possible. I feel it's more respectful then a D&C





Unless you've been there you really don't know what it's like. I opted to let my baby pass naturally instead of a D & C, after that I vowed that I'd never do that again if I miscarried.



Putting yourself through the hell of literally bleeding out your dead baby all day long, for days, does not make you a better person or a better parent. It just makes you broken.

[deleted account]

Krista, IDK I think it is easy to sit here and say I wouldn't abort, although I don't think I would because there is always a chance of misdiagnosis and doctor error. But with that said I have never and hopefully never will have to make that choice so although I disagree with abortion I couldn't judge someone who honestly felt they were doing the right thing for their child in such a horrific situation.

[deleted account]

I feel for me to abort, it would be murdering my child. It is killing a baby. Preventing its life after it already started....

I would never do it unless my life was at risk, only because of Gabby, i wouldnt want to leave her here alone...

Still, that is how I feel about it, not how everyone feels about it. So even though i think its wrong, its not my place to make the decision for someone else. I still think its their choice and i would back anyone who makes that decision....because its a hard one to make..

Merry - posted on 04/04/2011

9,274

169

248

I too would opt against a D&C unless I was in danger. I'd want the baby to pass naturally if at all possible. I feel it's more respectful then a D&C

Merry - posted on 04/04/2011

9,274

169

248

Krista, idk honestly what I'd do with a baby doomed to die, I am not familiar with those conditions so I think I'd need more info on what is wrong with my baby and stuff. But I, like Teresa, feel really strongly that god can always intervene in poor situations.
It's hard to imagine, but I think I'd feel worse about ending the baby's life, as opposed to letting it play out as nature dictates. But there's one time I do know I'd medically intervene, I saw a case of a parasitic twin on tv, it literally was killing it's twin to support this parasitic twin. In that situation, babies would be born, but I know I would have to decide to remove the baby that is killing the other baby.
I value life, I don't think one life is more valuable then aboother, but if one life is going to end another life, I see it fit to step in and prevent that.
But like high order multiples, I'd never reduce. I'd imagine maybe I reduced to two babies and those two were already destined to die later in the pregnancy and then I'm left with none.

ME - posted on 04/04/2011

2,978

18

190

Actually, I think that if you consider yourself pro choice for any reason, you must be PRO CHOICE. The reason for my belief is that, if abortion isn't murder in one case, ie, the health of the mother, or rape/incest, then women have the right to make that medical decision privately with their docs. If I suggest that abortion is only okay when the court says it's okay, or when congress says it's okay, etc, then I'm infringing on the recognized right to privacy that all people are granted under the (USA) constitution. I don't know the law in CAN, Brit, Aus, etc...

Krista - posted on 04/04/2011

12,562

16

842

That's heartbreaking, though.

And I guess that's why I don't understand people who say that the law should not make an exception for fetal abnormalities. In your case, the baby was already dead, so the D&C wouldn't have been an abortion, strictly speaking. But I cannot imagine what it would be like for a pregnancy to keep on progressing, but to know that your baby will only live such a short while, and that he or she will suffer horribly the entire time. I would think that it would drive you a little nuts to hear all the well-wishes from unwitting acquaintances.

I've never been in that position, and fate willing, I won't be. But I cannot understand the mindset of someone who would have the temerity to tell another woman, "if you're in that situation, you should legally have to do what I feel is right, regardless of your own emotions on the matter."

[deleted account]

Well... to be perfectly honest, I lived less than a week KNOWING it, but the ultrasound said the baby had already been dead for about 2 weeks.

Krista - posted on 04/04/2011

12,562

16

842

That's fine -- I was just curious as to how you felt about it. I can't imagine having been in a position like yours, living for two whole weeks like that. I'm very sorry that happened to you, hon.

[deleted account]

Krista, while I can understand why you (general you) would choose to abort in that circumstance.... it's not something I can support. I'm too big of a believer in miracles and not playing God.



NOT that I want to bring God into this debate for everyone else. I'm just speaking on me, personally, and how I feel about it. I didn't even have a D&C w/ my second miscarriage (baby had been confirmed dead for about 2 weeks) until the bleeding put my life in danger. That's just how strongly I feel on this topic. I am ONLY speaking for myself and what I believe. You all already know I don't vote, so while I would LIKE for others to share my belief (and for abortion to be illegal)..... I'm not going to force it on you cuz I know that's beyond my rights.

Sneaky - posted on 04/04/2011

1,170

33

130

My husband and I just refer to ourselves as pro-choice with conditions or pro life with exceptions (depends who we are talking to).

Sara - posted on 04/04/2011

9,313

50

584

For me, I'm pro-choice because I don't think my personal moral values should be forced on someone else, nor is it any of my business what someone else decides to do in their lives. Honestly, a woman having an abortion doesn't impact my life one bit. It's her decision, not mine.

Jenni - posted on 04/04/2011

5,928

34

373

I'm pro-choice for anyone under nearly any circumstances. It's not my body and not my choice. I think the only time i'd disagree with it is in cases where the person is being completely irresponsible... refusing to use other forms of BC and continuely using abortion as a method of BC.



For myself, mostly pro-life. I *think* the only situations where I'd consider abortion would be in the case of a rape or if I had a drug/alcohol addiction I couldn't overcome.



Edit to add: Oh and I just read Krista's post and I would also consider abortion with certain fetal abnormalities.

Krista - posted on 04/04/2011

12,562

16

842

Quick question for the pro-lifers. First of all, I'm heartened to see that you at least make an exception for the life of the mother. I've known some pro-lifers who won't even do that, and who called me "selfish" when I said I wouldn't want to die and leave my existing child motherless.

I am wondering what your thoughts are with regards to fetal abnormalities that are incompatible with life.

I'm not talking about Down Syndrome or about some other condition where the child will still have plenty of quality of life. I'm talking about something like Tay-Sachs, or anencephaly...something where the child's life will be extremely short and extremely painful.

Personally, I see it as more of a mercy to terminate a pregnancy like that. If there is absolutely no hope of the child living, or if the child is going to live a short while, but in excruciating agony the entire time...then why legally force a mother to put her child through that?

[deleted account]

I'm the same as Teresa and Laura pro-life unless the mother will die, Teresa described why brilliantly so I'll just copy and paste her post.

"I have stated that I can understand terminating a pregnancy if continuing it would kill (not might eventually, but as in the mother IS dying) the mother, but that IS pro-life because if the mother dies before the baby is viable.... You lose the life of the baby AND the life of the mother. That isn't pro-life. That is anti-abortion and in turn.... pro-death."


I however, struggle with the idea of abortion in rape situations because I can see the distress it can cause for the mother but I also can't see why the baby should be held responsible for something that is completely out of it's control, so IDK really where I stand on that the lines are too blurred for me and depending on the situation my answer will vary. I also don't think abortion can become illegal yet, as we need to increase education - although ultimately I would like to see it illegal except for cases where the mother will die.

Borth control pills in my opinion are not the same as an abortion and although I do have reasons for not wanting to use them again it isn't to do with the morality of them.

I am against the death penalty as well, I don't feel we have the right to take anothers life for whatever reason.

Toni - posted on 04/04/2011

139

50

12

I'm 100% Pro-Life! I made what I called an informed decision when I was 14 after a friend becoming pregnant. I read books and all literature available to me and made my decisions and have never swayed from them.

Jessica - posted on 04/03/2011

986

20

64

There is definitely a broad spectrum. I used to consider myself a lot more pro-choice than I am now. Since having kids myself, I've become a lot more sensitive to the idea of ending a baby's life before they even get a chance.

There are still a couple reasons I consider myself pro choice and not entirely pro-life. 1) I can't judge people in extenuating circumstance, like having life-or-death health issues, or rape victims... where abortion really may be in the best interest. I still can't imagine doing it, but I've never been in a situation like that. And, I am pro-choice from the political perspective. I don't think the government has the right to step in and tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. Not only because I feel that's wrong in itself, but because of the precedent that would set for the possibility of similar laws to be made in the future.

Dana - posted on 04/03/2011

11,264

35

489

It is a broad spectrum. Because I'm pro-choice people have assumed I'd be happy with "killing babies as they fly out of the vagina".

Merry - posted on 04/03/2011

9,274

169

248

Yeah it's like you can either support the womans rights completely, or you can support the fetuses rights completely, or you can balance somewhere in between mom and baby's rights.
Personally I'm a strict pro lifer, no abortions unless, like Teresa said, mom is literally dying from the pregnancy and the baby is too young to try to survive outside of mom.
I waver back and forth on the death penalty, I sometimes feel we are just hurting our society by keeping all the murderers alive for 'life in prison' I see the benefit of just ending their life as opposed to keeping them in jail for the rest of their life.
But I honestly wouldn't vote for death penalty. I just couldn't do it. But to me it's 'more ok' to kill someone who has done such terrible things as to deserve life in jail, then it is to kill someone who is innocent and has done nothing wrong (A fetus)
But my heart can't tolerate the actual thought of death penalty, my mind sees the logic, but that's not enough for me!

Minnie - posted on 04/03/2011

7,076

9

786

There are so many fuzzy grey areas regarding a woman's bodily rights and human rights. I'm pro choice even though I can't stand abortion because I support birthing rights- and women's health rights fall within that.

Rosie - posted on 04/03/2011

8,657

30

315

yeah, there's definitely a spectrum. i myself am pro choice for any reason up to 24 weeks. anything after that, the mothers life had to be in danger, or the baby has a condition that isn't compatable with life.

[deleted account]

I call myself 100% pro-life. I have stated that I can understand terminating a pregnancy if continuing it would kill (not might eventually, but as in the mother IS dying) the mother, but that IS pro-life because if the mother dies before the baby is viable.... You lose the life of the baby AND the life of the mother. That isn't pro-life. That is anti-abortion and in turn.... pro-death.

While I can certainly understand circumstances where a woman may feel like abortion is her only choice.... I don't support it or agree w/ it.

Stifler's - posted on 04/03/2011

15,141

154

597

Someone on here has mentioned before that if you're pro-choice for any reason, then you're pro choice. I agree with that. Being pro life is not supporting any kind of abortion for any reason. Being pro-choice under circumstances is being pro choice.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 04/03/2011

18,532

9

2909

I am pro choice....period. I do get frusterated when I hear women using it as a form of birth control, but it is a freedom that they have to chose what they want. That is the point to me.

Desiree - posted on 04/03/2011

910

17

12

Pro Choice, Pro Life and Human rights all of it infringes on each other, No wonder it is all so confusing.

Krista - posted on 04/03/2011

12,562

16

842

Months ago, I posted up some sort of continuum, describing this. Darned if I can find it now, though.

But I agree with you. There is SUCH a broad range of opinion that it's ridiculous to lump people into "pro-choice" and "pro-life" and think that they all feel the same.

If you see this, leave this form field blank.
Powered by RESPECT not THUMPS

Join Circle of Moms

Sign up for Circle of Moms and be a part of this community! Membership is just one click away.

Join Circle of Moms