Research against men in the labour room

Charlie - posted on 08/27/2009 ( 45 moms have responded )

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This week, the Mail reported a new survey which said fathers should be allowed to stay overnight in hospital on the day their baby is born.

But how much should a man be involved in his child's birth? Leading obstetrician Michel Odent has been instrumental in influencing childbirth practices for decades.

Here, with a view that will outrage many - but will strike a chord with thousands of others - he describes why he believes that when a woman goes into labour, her partner should stay well away.

For many years, I have not been able to speak openly about my views that the presence of a father in a delivery room is not only unnecessary, but also hinders labour.

To utter such a thing over the past two decades would have been regarded as heresy, and flies in the face of popular convention.

But having been involved in childbirth for 50 years, and having been in charge of 15,000 births, I have reached the stage where I feel it is time to state what I - and many midwives and fellow obstetricians - privately consider the obvious.

That there is little good to come for either sex from having a man at the birth of a child.

For her, his presence is a hindrance, and a significant factor in why labours are longer, more painful and more likely to result in intervention than ever.

As for the effect on a man - well, was I surprised to hear a friend of mine state that watching his wife giving birth had started a chain of events that led to the couple's divorce?

Women should be left alone to give birth in peace without the distraction of their partner at their bedside

Or another lady describing how the day after her husband had watched her deliver their child, he had fled to his hometown of Rome, and never returned again?

For many men, the emotional fallout of watching their partner have their baby can never be overcome.

When I was first involved in obstetrics in the Fifties, it was unheard of for a man to be present as their child was born.

Childbirth was predominately a woman's business - usually carried out at home - and while a man may be in the vicinity at the time of labour, he would usually be found in the kitchen, boiling copious amounts of water, and therefore would miss the actual event.

However, by 1970, a handful of women started to ask for their husbands to be present at the birth, a shift that began to occur in many Western countries at about the same time.

There are a variety of reasons for this, including the fact that birth was being increasingly concentrated in hospitals rather than at home, and the rise of the smaller nuclear family meant women increasingly turned to their husbands for support in all areas of their life, rather than relying on their mothers or aunts.

What we didn't anticipate at the time was that this occasional demand from a handful of women would, in a matter of years, become doctrine.

By the late Seventies, all pregnant women were saying they could not imagine giving birth without their husband at their side.

And not only was the husband now nearly always present at birth, but with his wife clasping his hand during labour and screaming out for reassurance, he became an active participant.

At the time, it was widely believed there were many benefits to be had from the father's presence.

It was said sharing such an experience would strengthen ties between the couple and help the father bond with his baby.

It was said his reassurance would make birth easier, and that the rate of intervention in pregnancy would decrease as a result.

This shift to having the father in the delivery room was one which was shrouded by optimism.

However, little scientific study was conducted to find out if there was any truth to these claims.

And even at the time, I had my reservations. I didn't want to judge, but I knew from experience that the presence of a man is not always a positive thing.

Fast-forward to today, and there is still a lack of scientific study on this subject.

But having been in charge of thousands of births, at homes, in hospitals, in the UK, in France, with the father present, with him absent, I have reached my own conclusions.

I am more and more convinced that the participation of the father is one of the main reasons for long and difficult labours.

And there are a number of basic physiological reasons for this.

First, a labouring woman needs to be protected against any stimulation of the thinking part of her brain - the neocortex - for labour to proceed with any degree of ease.

This part of the brain needs to take a back seat and allow the primal "unthinking" part of the brain connected to basic vital functions to take over.

A woman in labour needs to be in a private world where she doesn't have to think or talk.

Yet, motivated by a desire to "share the experience", the man asks questions and offers words of reassurance and advice.

In doing so, he denies his partner the quiet mind that she needs.

The second reason is that the father's release of the stress hormone adrenaline as he watches his partner labour causes her anxiety, and prevents her from relaxing.

No matter how much he tries to smile and appear relaxed, he cannot help but feel anxious. And the release of adrenaline is contagious.

It has been proven that it is physically impossible to be in a complete state of relaxation if there is an individual standing next to you who is tense and full of adrenaline.

The effect of this is that, with a man present, a woman cannot be as relaxed as she needs to be during labour, and hence the process becomes longer and more difficult.

We must keep in mind that mammals cannot release oxytocin - the key hormone in childbirth - when they are also being influenced by the stressful effects of hormones of the adrenaline family.

I have been with many women as they struggle to give birth with their partner at their side.

Yet the moment he leaves the room, the baby arrives. Afterwards, they say it was just "bad luck" he wasn't there the moment their child was born.

Luck, however, is little to do with it. The truth is that without him there, the woman is finally able to relax into labour in a way that speeds up delivery.

After birth, too, a woman needs a few moments alone with her baby, particularly between the time the child is born and she delivers the placenta.

And this is not just about her need to bond with her baby.

Physically, in order to deliver the placenta with ease, her levels of oxytocin - the hormone of love - need to peak.

This happens if she has a moment in which she can forget everything about the world, save for her baby, and if she has time in which she can look into the baby's eyes, make contact with its skin and take in its smell without any distractions.

Often, as soon as a baby is born, men cannot help but say something or try to touch the baby.

Their interference at this key moment is more often than not the main cause for a difficult delivery of the placenta, too.

But it is not just the fact that men slow down labour that makes me cautious about their presence at the birth.

There are two other important questions that I would like to see answered scientifically.

The first is, are we sure that all men can easily cope with the strong emotional reaction they have when they participate in the birth?

Over the years, I have seen something akin to post-natal depression in many men who have been present at the birth.

In its mild form, men often take to their bed in the week following the birth, complaining of everything from a stomach ache or migraine to a 24-hour bug.

Their wives, meanwhile, are up and about, caring for their baby and in good spirits, and tell me how unfortunate it is that their husband has been struck down by one ailment or another.

But it is well known by those who study depression that rather than admit a low mood, men often offer up a symptom as a reason to why they have taken to their bed.

There are also men who try to find ways to escape the reality of what they have been through.

This could just be a night at the pub, or a day playing golf when their child is a day old.

I've known of perfectly well-balanced men who held their wife's hand through labour then left the next day never to return again.

And in the most graphic example, one perfectly healthy man had his first experience of schizophrenia two days after watching his wife give birth. Was this his way of escaping reality?

Generally speaking, I have noticed that the more the man has participated at the birth and the worse his wife's labour has been, the higher the risks of post-natal "symptoms" are.

Of course, this is not the case for all men, but it seems without doubt that some men are at risk of being unwell or depressed due to having seen their partners labour.

The final question I would like to see answered is what, if a man is present at birth, will be the effect on the sexual attraction he feels towards his wife over the long term?

When men first started standing at their partner's side during labour, I remember my mother's generation saying, very matter of factly, that the couple's intimate life would be ruined as a result.

And, given that the key to eroticism is a degree of mystery, I am left believing they had a point.

There are many things we do in private in order to preserve a degree of modesty and mystery.

And, for the benefit of our sex lives, it may be worth adding childbirth to this list.

I have three children and wasn't present at any of their births.

My first two were born before it was considered normal for a man to be at the birth of their child. But my youngest son was born in 1985, at home.

As it happens, at the exact moment our son arrived in the world, the midwife was on her way down the street and I, having made my excuses realising he was about to be born, was fiddling with the thermostat on the central heating boiler downstairs.

My partner did not know it, but I had given her the exceptionally rare, but ideal situation in which to give birth: she felt secure, she knew the midwife was minutes away and I was downstairs, yet she had complete privacy and no one was watching her.

If there are any doubts, we only have to look across the rest of the mammal world in order to see that no other female, save the human female, invites her sexual partner to witness her giving birth.

Of course, it would not be possible for women to give birth alone.

But the optimum situation for women is to give birth with an experienced midwife, or another woman - known as a doula.

The key to the perfect birthing partner is finding a mother figure who can help, keep a low profile and remain silent.

It is only 35 years since men first entered the delivery room, yet we have welcomed them in without question.

At the present time, when birth is more difficult and longer than ever, when more women need drugs or Caesareans, we have to dare to smash the limits of political correctness and ask whether men should really be present at birth.

When we take into consideration the effects of this on male and female, it seems the answer is not.

It is time to go back to basics, and turn modern convention on its head.

When it comes to the delivery suite, men would be well advised to stay away.

What are your thoughts on this

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45 Comments

View replies by

Joy - posted on 09/03/2009

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Well my opinion on this is going to sound pretty on the fence. I think that in the same way all pregnant women are different, and all babies are different, and all labor experiences are different.....all men are different too. Some men may see their woman in pain and not be able to handle it. Some men (like my husband) could think of no place they would rather be than to be there the whole time helping me breathe and to see his son come into this world. Every man is different. I think that people need to be honest about it though, from the start. Like early on in pregnancy. It's a topic that needs to be discussed and if the man really REALLY doesn't think he can handle being in the room, if he REALLY doesn't think he'll be able to support and be a positive energy in the room, then I think he shouldn't be in the room and the mommy to be needs to accept it and find someone else who WANTS to be there. Someone who could actually be of some help. I really disagree with most of that article though (sorry but I didn't read the ENTIRE thing lol damn it was too long!). But as for it being a detriment to the labor process....whatever. I can tell you that if my husband hadn't been there, I can guarantee that my labor wouldn't have gone as smoothly as it did. Now if he had said early on that he didn't want to be there, I would have asked my best friend and then she would have gone to the classes with me and I would have been fine with that.....my feelings would have been a little bit hurt but I'm a big girl and I would have gotten over it.

Konda - posted on 09/02/2009

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Uhhh, nope, no one 'hurt my little feelings'. I have a right to my opinion, that is what a forum is for....mine might be like and asshole and stink, but it is still mine.



However, I do apologize if I offended.....I am opinionated.....



No not all men can handle being in the delivery room, I am sure that seeing a woman stretched out like that could turn any man off. I sure he wonders if he can ever satisfy her again. And I am sure there are other reasons. Yet, most men know that ahead of time and don't go in to begin with. Like Sharon said, men gut deer and fish.

Erin - posted on 09/02/2009

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My husband & I had been together for almost 10 yrs by the time our first was born, he watched his mother deliver his brother @ 13 so had already experienced this once before. He is also one of those that is not bothered by blood, guts & gore; knows all those useless bits of information; could read the results of his MRI when his Dr. couldn't (small town!); took care of his grandma & her clostomy(sp?) bag; played an integral part in saving a young man's life on the columbia river who had a SERIOUS head wound... So seeing our son born was NOT something that was going to make his stomach flop, my labor was horribly long (no I don't think that was because of him) and he did a wonderful job playing nurse! Could I have done it w/out him, SURE! But he was NOT useless and was very helpful. My mom, aunt, sister & husband were there, it wouldn't have mattered who was there, when it came time to push I was SOOO gone that I couldn't tell you how many ppl were there! But I trust my husband with my life and was very glad he was there to cut the cord, hold our son, and take care of things! Because having such a long labor I was absolutely USELESS afterwards! He did go pale when my heartrate dropped and they pushed my mom out of the room? Guess having your wife almost die kinda makes you freak, just a little :) I don't think that experience hurt our relationship though. He was seriously more weirded out by my breasts being utters then giving birth!

Samantha - posted on 09/01/2009

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I really think that having my fiance there with me was the best possible situation. I was really stressed until I saw him walk into the room to help me! I think men are good birthing partners and I really believe that it is also really beneficial for the father to watch their baby be born. It is a better bonding experience not just for the parents, but also with the baby as well.

Isobel - posted on 08/31/2009

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I disagree...but then again, the man/partner I had at the time was a useless jackass- if yours isn't, more power to ya

Sharon - posted on 08/30/2009

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We got way off the subject. All the replies have been so interesting I kind of lost sight of what the original question was.



Are men/partners bad for the laboring mother? My answer is no.



Maybe some men can't handle it, but neither can some women. I think most of us here are so level headed we can't fathom it but I've seen them - the spastic freakish women, who are shocked when they survive or the womant they are with survives the birth process.

Mary - posted on 08/30/2009

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These recent posts bring up a good point...there are some "support" people who are just plain detrimental to the laboring woman. I always feel badly for the girls who have been bullied into letting their mother, MIL, SIL, sister, father, or whomever be present for the birth. More often than not, these 'spectators' are there for purely selfish reasons, and are less than helpful or supportive. As a nurse, I try to get a moment alone with my patient and ask them who THEY want in the room, and offer to boot anyone else out with some bullshit fairytale about our visitor's policy...I could care lee if I piss them off, since I never have to see them again. It's much easier on the patient to let me be the bad guy, and enable her to have the birth that SHE wants.



It also makes me sad when everyone has been so focused on the momma, and one the baby comes out...poof!...everyone makes a beeline for the baby, and the poor new momma ceases to exist. All those damned "support" people, and they totally ditch her, can't even be bothered to fetch her some water or help her tie back her hair. AND, they all want to hold the baby, snatching it from momma's arms, and get annoyed if we suggest that MAYBE, the baby might want to nurse, or just snuggle with the one person it recognizes by smell, sound, and feel.



I also think it sometimes makes some partners feel a bit useless when another domineering female, be it her mother or his, takes over. He already feels a bit nervous and uncomfortable and useless, and the know-it-all women make him even more reticent to take part in the process. This is why I did not want my own mother even on site when Molly was born. I love her, and we are very close, but she is a retired L&D nurse. I know that, had she been there, John would have taken a back seat, and let her do everything I may have needed...he woud have figured she knew better than him. She was a bit disappointed with this, but I think she saw the wisdom of this choice after the fact. Truth is, once she held her granddaughter, none of it mattered to her anyway!

Isobel - posted on 08/30/2009

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I had my mom, my husband, and my best friend at the hospital for the birth of my first.



My husband was a useless dolt (thank god we're divorced ;)), my mom was in tears at seeing her baby in so much pain...



my friend was AWESOME...she just laughed at everyone else and brought me what I wanted when I wanted it.



For the birth of my second I had only my very best friend and it was the best experience of my life...she has known me since we were children, so she knew exactly what I would want in advance, and she already had 3 children and knew exactly what I was going through.



I have discussed the possibility of more children with the man i'm with now and he doesn't want to be there...that's almost enough to make me want to have one ;)



To each their own...the baby is the miracle and men get to love them for the rest of their livesI think we deserve to meet them first.

Sharon - posted on 08/30/2009

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LOL Loureen my mother was in the room for my first - the look of utter panic on her face would have been comical if I had heard from the doctor first. The baby was so purple/bluish she though he was dead, it was that first few seconds after birth where they don't make a sound yet. OMG I saw her face before I saw the babys'. LOL Its funny now but back then I think I scared the nurse when my heart rate disappeared!



My mom and her best friend wound up in the room through a miscommunication. Neither one of them had ever seen a birth thanks to modern medicine that believed an unconcious woman is best way back when.



My poor mother who doesn't like gross stuff wound up standing behing the delivery doctor and almost got hit with a squirt of birth fluid. SMH I'm so surprised she didn't hurl right then.

Charlie - posted on 08/30/2009

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Not every man is cut out for the labor room , it doesn't make them a bad dad , not at all .
Jamie was the only one allowed in the room while i was in labor and i was in labor for 48 hours !! he left and slept at home because i told him to and came back in the morning .
He talked to me when i wanted him to and when i didnt want to talk he sat quietly and didn't say a word just .
He was completely supportive , although i wanted him there if he had chosen not to i would understand .
Let me just say there was no way in HELL my mother was going to be in the room ! what a nightmare that would be , i love mum but she freaks out so easily .

Sapphire - posted on 08/29/2009

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I'm also just remembered that I sent my husband home to feed the cats and sleep for a few hours. Seriously-he was no good to either of us if he tried to pull a 24 hour all-nighter. I was admitted at 8 pm (against my will-another story though) and by 3 am I demanded that he go home and sleep. Set the alarm for 4-5 hours later, shower, eat, feed cats, attempt to install a car seat, and come back. Then I asked the nurse if there was anything she could give me to make me sleep. And I suppose it worked cause next thing I knew it was about 7-8 am. I also remember telling the nurses that I wanted NO visitors except my husband. My mother would have driven me up a wall! Oh, and in the childbirth classes, I was the one who began to get faint & dizzy by the explanation of what was going to happen. But that's me in general-I tend to be a fainter at the description of medical procedures. OK, so I rambled-the point is, I wanted, needed, and craved my husband to be present at our son's birth in any capacity of him being in the room. I fully expected him to be up at my face, but he surprised me by watching the birth.

ME - posted on 08/29/2009

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Mary...you make SO much sense, I'm so glad you contributed to this one! Thanks!



I've been following this, but not replying. I had a crazy birthing experience. I wanted Travis with me EVERY second. I did let him leave for food, and to get some exercise, and at one point, so I could sleep. I was in labor for six hours before we went to the hospital. After another 10 hours AT the hospital, was not progressing, and they were trying to push a c-section for hours. My VERY good friend is a Doula, and she was there with me too. My fr.-in-law was at the hospital, and some other friends were there as well. It was wonderful to have them all with me, because it went on for hours and hours. When my Doula friend finally told me that I had no choice and HAD to have a c-sect., I was crushed, but it was still wonderful to have all of my supportive, loving friends around me. I was SO relieved that they let Travis come into the OR with me. I was really scared, and I didn't want to do it without him. He didn't tell me, but he was more terrified than I was. He stopped on the way to the OR, and threw up. He stood by my head, holding my hand the whole time, and he was able to take pictures and see Miles the second he was born. The docs put Miles on my chest while the sowed me up, and Travis stood right there with me the whole time. He didn't tell me until the next morning how frightened he'd been...and I would NEVER have known, he was perfect! It was just as important that he got to spend the next four days in the hospital with Miles and I. I couldn't have done THAT part without him. I was in pretty bad pain, and needed him to help me in and out of the shower, to the BR, and on the walks they made me take around the ward.



That said, I would NEVER judge a woman or family that made different decisions from my hubby and I.

Mary - posted on 08/29/2009

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Wow....



First of all, to Konda...I need to believe that you didn't mean what you said to Amie in quite the way it came across to the rest of us. I just can't fathom that as a woman, and mother, that anyone could say something so rude, heartless, and insensitive as that reply was without ANY inside knowledge or provocation.



As for having Daddy in the delivery room...I had my husband, and only him, with me. I wouldn't even let my parents be AT the hospital...they knew we were there, and John called to update them every so often, but I didn't want them there until after she was born. I felt very strongly that those first few moments of her life should just be about us...the three of us as a family. It is a choice that I will always be glad that I made...for both John and I, that entire day was a magical, beautiful time that we will both cherish forever. John did much better than I anticipated with the entire labor and birth, and it only further cemented the love that we have for each other, and our daughter.



However, as an L&D nurse, I have witnessed hundreds of births, and what was right for me and my family is not best for everyone. Not all husbands belong in the room...it can be downright horrifying and scarring for some of them. Over the years, I've learned not to judge quite as much as I once would have...we all have our strengths and weaknesses. Not being present for the birth of one's child does not necessarliy equate to being a bad father or less than loving spouse. In SOME cases, it can...but not always. Some women really don't want their partner there...they feel more comfortable, or get more support, from a friend, sister or mother. It's really a highly personal choice, and one which is sometimes dictated by your culture as well. In the end, all that really matters is that the laboring women is getting the support she needs from SOMEONE of her choosing. As for the daddy...well being present for the birth of your child does not automatically make you a good father...it's what they do in the years following that moment that truly matters.

Cathy - posted on 08/29/2009

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Some guys just aren't made to cope with the whole childbirth thing.

I had a home birth. My partner was there throughout the labour. When I needed him for a reassuring hug because I was tired and feeling completely drained he was there. For the most part he just fetched the midwives cups of tea and snacks.

When it came to the final stage of pushing he was out of the way. He wouldn't have been any help to me at that point. He doesn't know the best way to deliver a baby, that's why I had midwives. And to be totally honest he's really not good with any of the gross girly stuff.

I had my baby, cuddled him till they were ready to stitch me up, then he went straight to his Dad.

He was as involved in the birth as I needed him to be .... and involved as much as he could stomach. It's not a natural thing for men. If a man genuinely wants to be there and the mother wants it too, and vice versa, then no one has the right to decide that it's the right or wrong option.

Johnny - posted on 08/28/2009

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One of the men in our pre-natal group vomited and passed out during the actual delivery. He was very gung-ho about being there, according to his wife he was extremely supportive during the labor part, and just went to pieces when it was time for her to push. I don't think anyone, including him, could have predicted that. So I guess you never know. But my girlfriend (the wife) says she'll still have him there next time. He needs a second chance to see the birth I guess. He's a great and involved father, and I'm pretty sure their sex life is fine (if it wasn't, we'd be hearing about it LOL). I mentioned this thread to her on the phone today, and she thought while it's true that men can clearly be a problem, it's their baby too, and it's only right for them to be there if they choose to be. I'm not sure if I totally agree with that, but given what she went through, I didn't argue.

Kylie - posted on 08/28/2009

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My husband's mate took two laptops to the delivery suite and apparently spent the majority of the labor trying to get them networked and sorting out wireless internet connection and chatting on msn. He also went to grab some lunch and didn't come back for 2 hours. Men like that should not be in the delivery room.

Katie - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Amie:

Katie and Kylie,

You both stated you needed your husband's there. I was just wondering if you really mean that.
It obviously turned out fine in the end.. but what if it hadn't? What if either of them had been like my ex? Would you really have sacrificed your relationships just to have support for a few hours of labor?


Yes, I needed Liam there. BUT I knew going into it that he would be fully able to handle what he was about to see. We had talked about EVERYTHING that could/would happen and he was very excited about witnessing the birth. If I knew he was weary about it and he had expressed any concern I wouldn't of forced him to be in the room but would have expected him to be right outside the door.



So no, if Liam had been like your ex I would not have sacrificed the relationship---but with that being said it still COULD have gone bad and I probably would say I didn't need him there and I imagine in your case it was a "if only i knew this would happen" sort of deal. 



I hope that makes sense. 

Christa - posted on 08/28/2009

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the father that DOESN'T want to be there for the birth of his child, or to show support to his wife.....doesn't want to be a husband or father. bad priorities!

Sharon - posted on 08/28/2009

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And I have to add, Any man who uses the excuse that BIRTH was the reason why he left his wife is a fktard. Men gut deer, gut fish - gory death - the incredible birth of their offspring causes them to what? fall out of love? be so disgusted after seeing the vagina all torn apart they can't stand to look their wife in the face? WHAT THE FK is that about? Pathetic losers.

My husband isn't perfect - god knows, I know, but his respect for me only grew after seeing the birth of our children. I guess I'll have to go thank him now for not losing his nuts after seeing the birth of our kids.

My husband wasn't "needed" by me in the delivery room. I wanted him there because this was the make it or break it moment to see our children. Were they going to be perfect like the scans showed? For better or worse I wanted him to see their and mine, triumphant moment.

I would have been happy to do it on my own and share the moment with good friends & family. But he obviously wasn't a hinderance.

Sharon - posted on 08/28/2009

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What a crock. All of my labors were under 4 hours, we discussed politics, cracked jokes, and sent the dr.s aide out to look up research topics. and that bit about a woman "not needing to think" What twaddle!! LOL.

Sapphire - posted on 08/28/2009

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Well shit Amie, for your next kid I'll teleport myself to your birthing room ;-) I'll have those psychic powers of knowing the exact moment to poof my way to you!

Krista - posted on 08/28/2009

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Ok, I've been thinking more about how useful/useless my husband was. When I read that some of you thought that you wouldn't have been able to do it without them present, my first reaction was "hell yeah, I could've done it without him!" But, I guess it depends if we're talking about just the delivery, or the whole hospital stay.



Thinking back on the delivery, he wasn't a bunch of help, besides handing me my water, as I mentioned before. I didn't want to talk, and I really didn't want to be touched at that point. He kept trying to rub my back between contractions, and it felt like he was rubbing my skin raw in the same spot over and over, but I didn't even want to talk enough to tell him to quit! I definitely could have done without him in the delivery room, but I am glad that he was there to be a part of it.



Thinking back to the three days that I was in the hospital after Cohen was born, I really couldn't have done that without him. I was so stitched up and sore that I could barely move and needed help every time I got out of bed. Cohen slept in my room every night, but I could not get out of bed to feed him, so Derrick slept on the chair and would hand him to me for feeds or change him himself. I felt so emotional and overwhelmed with the pain, hormones, and breast feeding hell, that when Derrick had to go home for an hour in the mornings to shower and have breakfast, and I was alone with Cohen, I was stressed right out and couldn't wait until he came back! I can't imagine if he had gone home every night and I was left to take care of my tiny baby on my own, while barely being able to move.

Kate CP - posted on 08/28/2009

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Could we get back on the topic at hand instead of arguing about psychic phenomenon?

Amie - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Kylie:



Quoting Amie:

Katie and Kylie,

You both stated you needed your husband's there. I was just wondering if you really mean that.
It obviously turned out fine in the end.. but what if it hadn't? What if either of them had been like my ex? Would you really have sacrificed your relationships just to have support for a few hours of labor?





I didn’t get any notifications for this thread..weird!
I needed my husband.. 100% mean it. I think if my relationship wasn’t solid enough and he couldn’t look at me the same or be interested in having sex because he’d seen me give birth I’d want to know sooner rather than later. Prior to our first birth my husband was nervous, he hates blood and was worried about me being in pain, he said he was going to stay up my end and hold my hand but he ended up watching the baby come out, cutting the cord and he was the one who asked for them to put the placenta in the doggy bag so he could put it in the garden lol. We’ve been through a lot worse than childbirth together so if he had decided to bail on me and our baby after such a special occasion in our lives then… good riddance! That’s not a man I want to grow old with.
I’d have to say I doubt your relationship fell apart solely because of the labor and birth of your child.  If you could, would you go back and not have him in the labor room, so that you would both still be together?





No it was't the sole reason. It was a major reason along with a few other major reasons. As in any relationship though it is not just any one thing that causes it to end.



 



If I could go back and keep him out. Yes I would. Not so much for the reason that it would have prolonged our relationship; But in that he was of absolutely no help in that room, was more a distraction than anything and fell to pieces so badly I had to drive myself to the hospital. Should have known at that moment he was going to be utterly useless the rest of the time. haha.



 



It would have been nice too to not have to shuffle the kids around so much coordinating schedules and things just so they could see their father during that time. But that part of it all is pretty minuscule in the bigger picture. They still got a chance to know him, my oldest still has many memories of him, my son does not. That's how life goes though sometimes I guess. It's not always rosey. = )

Sarah - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Konda:



Quoting Amie:



 








He was a good father to them up until I started dating Ryan.  Then it slowly got bad and he fully stopped seeing the kids when they started calling Ryan dad.






It does happen and each and everyone of you can believe it's not true. I really don't care.






But Konda don't assume things when I state what I know, especially on personal matters.










LOL, yeah, whatever, it was the birth, go on believing that....and it was the birth that made him stop being a father, not the fact that the kids had started calling another man DADDY!





WOW........Konda i wish i was psychic......fancy knowing EXACTLY how Amie's life and relationships go! That's clever! :)

?? - posted on 08/28/2009

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Shit Amie... how dare you know what happened in your life!!!!!!!

THANK THE DONKEY that Konda is here to tell you how it really happened!!!



LOL, yeah, whatever, it was the birth, go on believing that....and it was the birth that made him stop being a father, not the fact that the kids had started calling another man DADDY!




Lemme just point this out Konda - in case your pills have, I dunno, messed with your mental state or something and you are unable to actually logically decipher what you said.



(Oh yea, if you take offense to me saying that - well... tough shit... seeing as how you find it perfectly acceptable to decipher Amie's life and what she says and twist it around to what you want - I feel it's quite fair for me to do the same to you, a virtual stranger. Only I don't actually mean to be offensive - I'm just pointing it out.)



Her ex, told her - IN A LETTER - that he purposefully took the time to write out and make sure she read it that the birth of the children was a factor in the reason in which he left her. YOU KONDA PARKER ARE NO ONE TO DISPUTE THAT.



Amie also already said it was her dating Ryan that made her ex start to be a bad father and that it went downhill from there - from the birth until she started dating Ryan that her ex started to be less and less of a father...... Now.. I dunno about you... but there aren't many children that I know that start calling some guy that mommy is dating DADDY before it taking PLENTY OF TIME for them to bond and become close and for that child to become comfortable enough with calling that man DADDY. AND IF HER EX WAS ALREADY DISINIGRATING AS A FATHER that would open the door even more so for her two older children to feel more comfortable calling the man that mommy is dating, daddy. And again YOU KONDA PARKER ARE NO ONE TO DISPUTE THAT.



Wow you are one RUDE RUDE person. How DARE you, you should be right ashamed of yourself right now Konda, for speaking to Amie in that way. You owe her an apology, you rude rude rude person.









As far as fathers in the delivery room goes - to each their own. This is just another one of those decisions that has nothing to do with anyone BUT the woman giving birth and the father of the child. Everyone else should go suck a lemon. If daddy wants to be there, he damn well should be there - if mommy says NO then daddy should respect that. Delivery room status goes MOMMY, DADDY and everyone else should just be happy they are even allowd to be in the lives of those two people.

Kylie - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Amie:

Katie and Kylie,

You both stated you needed your husband's there. I was just wondering if you really mean that.
It obviously turned out fine in the end.. but what if it hadn't? What if either of them had been like my ex? Would you really have sacrificed your relationships just to have support for a few hours of labor?


I didn’t get any notifications for this thread..weird!
I needed my husband.. 100% mean it. I think if my relationship wasn’t solid enough and he couldn’t look at me the same or be interested in having sex because he’d seen me give birth I’d want to know sooner rather than later. Prior to our first birth my husband was nervous, he hates blood and was worried about me being in pain, he said he was going to stay up my end and hold my hand but he ended up watching the baby come out, cutting the cord and he was the one who asked for them to put the placenta in the doggy bag so he could put it in the garden lol. We’ve been through a lot worse than childbirth together so if he had decided to bail on me and our baby after such a special occasion in our lives then… good riddance! That’s not a man I want to grow old with.
I’d have to say I doubt your relationship fell apart solely because of the labor and birth of your child.  If you could, would you go back and not have him in the labor room, so that you would both still be together?

Sarah - posted on 08/28/2009

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Ok, so when i had my eldest, there was NO WAY i wanted my boyfriend (now my husband) at the birth. He didn't want to be there, and i could think of no-one worse to be there! My mum and my best friend were AMAZING birthing partners and i wouldn't have changed it for the world.
Perhaps it was the state of our relationship at the time (which is whole other story lol!) that made it end up that way, but that was the way is was. I even made him wait outside for over an hour after baby was born before i let him in! (mainly because i was being stitched up!)
When i got pregnant with my youngest, we talked about whether or not my husband would be there.....i said i wanted him there so he could see for himself how much it bloody hurt! haha! We were in a better place then, and although he was apprehensive, he agreed he should be there. As it happened, i had an emergency C-section, so he never got to witness the pain bit anyway! lol

I guess the thing was, it didn't matter who was there, as long as it was someone who was COMFORTABLE being there, someone that loved me and someone who would be able to speak for me when i couldn't, talk when i needed it, shut up when i needed it, etc.
The first time round.....that person was NOT my husband.......second time round.....it was.
I KNEW first time, he wouldn't cope, he would end up doing more harm than good, so i 'let him off the hook' (for my own benefit too) second time....he'd changed, it was RIGHT for him to be there.

I think you as the woman who will be going through it all, need to make that judgement. Whoever you want there is fine you know?
:)

Sapphire - posted on 08/28/2009

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I don't buy into the theory at all. It's a decision an individual couple makes and what is best for them at that very moment. No way in hell would I want my mom or sister or extended family in the delivery room! I needed my husband, end of story. My husband was the only one who calmed me down enough so I could get off the monitors for a short time. I hated the circumstances of my son's birth and if my husband was told he couldn't be there to support me I would have unplugged every monitor, removed IVs, and walk out of the hospital. With so many birthing options these days, you honestly cannot say that one style is superior to others. Whether you want the entire friggin' extended family surrounding you or simply your partner, it is a personal decision and different for everyone.

Kate CP - posted on 08/28/2009

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Honestly, I agree with the old fart who wrote this. I love my husband...but when he went home for a couple of hours to do something (I really don't remember what) and it was just women in the room with me...I felt NORMAL. My mom was a huge support. I remember during one contraction I said "Mom, I'm losing it." She was calm, kept rubbing my back (and she has fibromyalgia so I know that hurt her) and said "No, you're not. You're doing fine. Just breathe." I closed my eyes and just fell into it. My mom had to call my husband and tell him the baby was coming and would he like to be there at the birth of his child? My husband was a good support...but I could tell he was just nervous and didn't want to be there. He didn't want to cut the cord, he didn't want to watch...I could just tell he didn't feel comfortable with it. Looking back I remember him being my support right after the baby was born. I was shaking like a leaf cause labor is a serious workout and he just held me and told me I did a great job. I loved having him there after Sam was born...but while I was in the middle of birthing I felt closer and more secure with my mother and the female nurses who were there. I just knew that whatever I went through these women understood and knew how to help me cope. My husband was just kind of lost. I just asked him "How would you feel about not being there for the birth of our second child?" and he said "I think I would be okay with it." This is something I've actually been tossing around in my head for a while. Now it's just come to the front of my thinking. I will have to ponder this more. ;)

Konda - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Amie:


 






He was a good father to them up until I started dating Ryan.  Then it slowly got bad and he fully stopped seeing the kids when they started calling Ryan dad.



It does happen and each and everyone of you can believe it's not true. I really don't care.



But Konda don't assume things when I state what I know, especially on personal matters.






LOL, yeah, whatever, it was the birth, go on believing that....and it was the birth that made him stop being a father, not the fact that the kids had started calling another man DADDY!

Amie - posted on 08/28/2009

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Quoting Konda:

Sorry Amie, I don't think he left you because he was in the labor room....I do believe that is a crock of shit he fed to you, he wanted out and used that as an excuse.

Yes, I wanted my husband there. I had two c-sections and was very happy to have that special moment of the 'first glimpse" with my husband and my mother.


 



 



You can be sorry all you want. You weren't there. You did not read the letter and if I still had it I'd scan it and post it.



 



Some men really well and truly can not handle it.



 



He was a good father to them up until I started dating Ryan.  Then it slowly got bad and he fully stopped seeing the kids when they started calling Ryan dad.



 



It does happen and each and everyone of you can believe it's not true. I really don't care.



 



But Konda don't assume things when I state what I know, especially on personal matters.

Konda - posted on 08/28/2009

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Sorry Amie, I don't think he left you because he was in the labor room....I do believe that is a crock of shit he fed to you, he wanted out and used that as an excuse.



Yes, I wanted my husband there. I had two c-sections and was very happy to have that special moment of the 'first glimpse" with my husband and my mother.

Dana - posted on 08/28/2009

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I can understand some parts of this article and then some parts are just idiotic. I ended up with a C-section because my son was breech but, prior to having it I had contractions for a while and went up to 6cm (the hospital was quite busy and I don't think they, thought I'd move along so fast). It was great having my husband there, especially during the C-section. Although I knew I'd probably have a C I wasn't expecting it to be six weeks early. At the time I felt fine but, looking back I was nervous. Funny how you can do that. I also was extremely thirsty, my husband was a life saver wiping my lips with a damp rag. Could I have done it without him, yes but, I'm glad I didn't have to.



I think it all depends on what kind of person you both are. There are some men who can't handle it. Some never look at your hoo-ha the same again. I don't think it makes them weak, they're just people. As for the men who take off right after, I think that has alot to do with the fact that, they aren't getting any sleep, they arent' getting any hoo-ha and generally, everyone is crabby. My husband and I hardly ever fight but, that first month or two is hard. Now those men, the one's who run off, are WEAK men.



Bottom line, this guy has some great theories, great idea's but he still comes off like an A-hole

Anna - posted on 08/28/2009

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I think this is a bunch of crap, how does anyone know what an individual can truly handle or need? The decision for a husband to be in the room with his wife is a decision they make together as a family, they are not being forced to be there. My husband wanted to be in the room and I wanted him there too. He was an amazing birth coach, cut the cord, took pictures and was so happy at the birth of each of our children. I did need his love and support and calm reassurance that I was doing a great job. My second birth was only 3 hrs from onset of labour to delivery, only 2 pushes, no epidural. I do not believe having a husband in the room hinders the birthing process. I certainly don't understand how anyone can believe a man would leave a woman based on watching a miracle happen. There are definetly other issues there and as for the onset of schizophrenia, please... that is a predisposition that is genetic, it's not caused by watching the "trauma" of birth. It would be a violation of rights not to allow a husband to be in the room, and in the US husbands are allowed to stay overnight the whole time mother and baby are in the hospital. Besides, the kind of man who doesn't want to be in the room to watch the birth of his child, is not the kind of man I would marry anyway.

Jessica - posted on 08/28/2009

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I think this is ridiculous. I know he says that the optimal place to give birth is at home with a midwife but that is not the norm nowadays and you can't tell me that with the normal chaos of hospital the husbands are the main reason women can't relax. With people constantly in and out of your room, being hooked up to IVs and a bloodpessure cuff that goes off whenever, and having a constant update on how slow or quick you are progressing probably doesn't help the situation either. I'm not saying all husbands are made to deal with childbirth but don't tell me that is the reason they leave, maybe the reality of fatherhood hit them and the just couldn't man up.



Everyone is different and some men just can't handle the women they love in pain but I have seen mothers who cause just as much stress and have urged their daughters to take the epidural.



I'm thankful for my husband, he was with me in the delivery room and for thepast two births he was with me in the birthing tub and I don't think I could've done it w/out him.

Krista - posted on 08/28/2009

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I really don't have a lot of sympathy for men and what they have to "go through" while supporting their wives in giving birth to their children. I had my husband with me, and he was great. He was most useful in sticking the straw from my glass of water in my mouth after each push. Holy frig was I thirsty! He still talks about how amazing it was to be there and to witness our son coming in to the world. Of course, some men would be more of a distraction than others, and if their wives want to do it alone, that's great for them. For me, if I was the writer's wife, giving birth alone at home while my midwife was done the street and my loser husband was adjusting the thermostat, I'd have been PISSED off! I imagine he lets his wife change all the diapers and handle all of the middle of the night crying too...

Amie - posted on 08/28/2009

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Katie and Kylie,

You both stated you needed your husband's there. I was just wondering if you really mean that.
It obviously turned out fine in the end.. but what if it hadn't? What if either of them had been like my ex? Would you really have sacrificed your relationships just to have support for a few hours of labor?

Cathelijn - posted on 08/28/2009

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To be honest I do understand what the article is saying, It comes down to labour being all about the woman. Some men just can't handle it and might be better kept out of the labour room. My husband was with me because i wanted him to have the experience. He was great during my contractions but when it came to pushing I really went into the zone and I wouldnt have cared if he was there or not (I wouldnt have cared either if there were 10 million other people watching) I know it sounds mean and I loved it that he was there but at the end of the day it was me pushing the baby out he could not help me in anyway. I was happy though that he saw the baby first and that he cut the cord. He was calm all the way through labour but when he saw the placenta flopping out he almost fainted...

Lindsay - posted on 08/28/2009

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We my experiences, having Josh there when I delivered Madeline and Cooper made us so much closer. It relaxed me to have him there and I'm pretty sure he would have been a ball of nerves if he wasn't there to know what was happening and when. It hasn't hindered our sexual or emotional relationship but only made it stronger. That being said, I can see where it could be a strain on a relationship. It just depends on the individuals. I wouldn't have been upset with Josh if he wasn't comfortable being in there because I totally left it up to him. I don't think it should be a given that the father needs to be present. I think each couple should made that decision themselves.

Katie - posted on 08/28/2009

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I NEEDED my man there. He was a HUGE support system for me and was a pretty damn good labour coach too :) My mom was there too...now that was hindering to my labour...lol next time she can wait outside the door with my best friend (we are only allowed 2 people in the room). I also love the fact that this was a man who wrote this article. Next time he has a baby, he can let us know if he wants his partner there or not haha...

Amie - posted on 08/28/2009

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As many here know my family is a blended one. Ryan is not the biological father of my oldest two. Their father is one of the men that Dr. Odent is talking about in this article.

Their father was not present during my first though. I only wanted my mom and dad there. I'm glad my wishes were respected and glad they both agreed to be there. My dad spent 7 hours rubbing his knuckles into my back after the drugs wore off. My mom kept on top of the nurses and doctor to make sure they were doing what they were supposed to. It was my first so I had no idea what to expect.

With my 2nd their father was present though. I can understand what Dr. Odent is saying because of him. He did not handle it well. A week after my 2nd was born I went back home to say good bye to my grandma, she was dying. He had to work so he stayed behind. I tried getting a hold of him the entire time I was gone. No answer. I came home to him having moved out and a note explaining he couldn't stay with me anymore.

Ryan on the other hand did a fantastic job being there for me. He was a little shook up by it all though but he still remained my rock. He sat quietly with me, he held my hand, he sat behind me while I pushed. He kept himself completely together until after Caitlin was born and he was out of the room. He walked to the waiting room, saw his parents (who had arrived just as I started to push) and started crying.

With Allie he was better. He did it all again, sat with me, held my hand, walked with me. He was still a little upset but he knew what to expect fully the 2nd time around and handled it all beautifully. It has not affected our relationship inside or outside the bedroom. It has brought us closer and he has a newfound respect for women.

There really are some men that can not handle seeing a woman labor though. It really does affect them to the extreme. I will never understand this though. After all.....

It's not THEM pushing out a 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 lbs. baby!

Johnny - posted on 08/27/2009

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Very interesting Loureen. All I can speak to is my own experience. I had a 52 hour labour, 36 of which were at home, alone with my husband. At the 24th hour, the midwife came and checked me, stayed for about an hour, I was 4 cm dilated. At the 30th hour, my hubby passed out from exhaustion, I could not sleep and continued to labor alone on my birthing ball. As time passed, I became more & more anxious and feeling very alone. When he woke up, I told him I was feeling very strange and checked my blood pressure. It had skyrocketed and was extremely high (after having been very low throughout the pregnancy). We went straight to the hospital, and it began to decline with him there holding my hand. When the midwife had him leave for a while, it went back up. I believe that he was an incredible solace to me during the long labor, and when I was pushing, he was great.

Before the birth, I had requested a silent birth. Meaning that I could make as much noise as I wanted, but everyone else should be as quiet as possible. (I know it's a Scientology idea, but it appealed to me). My hubby was amazing at supporting this. He was incredibly peaceful and serene when with me. Which is even more awesome for a high-strung guy like him. He was quiet, shushed everyone, and made my birthing space very calm. I think if not for that and a very patient midwife, I probably would have had a c-section. Now, I can see what Dr. Odent is saying though, if the hubby was excitable and very tense, I think it could cause a laboring mother problems. For me though, if I have another child, I plan to try to do it at home with just my husband, doula, and midwife. I'll be trusting him to provide that wonderful space again. He did such a great job the first time. And it doesn't seem to have affected our sex life in any way at all. But our emotional connection is more deep.

Sorry that was so long.

Kylie - posted on 08/27/2009

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What crap..i needed my husband there and helped me get through the pain and shock of it all. The whole experience made us closer and he gained a new level of respect for me. My husband supported and looked after me and our unborn babies for the 9 months, it was completely natural that he was and wanted to be present at their births. My mum and sister both begged to be my support person but I felt like birth was such and intimate thing I didn’t want anyone but my husband.
I think men could be a hindrance if they really don’t want to be there and freaking out and whining about why is it taking so long etc. but if someone had asked my hubby to leave the delivery room because he was in the way he would have told them to get donkeyed.
Screw modesty and mystery, if i have to go through childbirth then he should have to too.

Charlie - posted on 08/27/2009

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um sorry that was so long , lol