Stroller wars: Seniors vs Babies

Johnny - posted on 08/03/2011

Perhaps in your closest city Sherri. In my city our buses are designed for strollers to be wheeled on and left unfolded with children properly strapped in. There are belts on the floor to secure them with. If it can be avoided (iunless there are too many strollers or wheelchairs) we are not supposed to take the kid out of the stroller. It's a bigger pain to have someone hauling a folded stroller on and off than just wheeling up & down the ramp. In recent years, since the system got all the accessibilty upgrades, I do not think I've seen anyone fold up their stroller for the bus.

Erin - posted on 08/03/2011

Wow I never knew of these Stroller Wars lol. I have not ridden a bus since school, so I'm obviously out of the loop. But I think how I would feel about a stroller blocking the aisle or taking up room would be dependent on the mother's attitude. If she was loaded to the eyeballs with shopping and clearly trying to minimise the inconvenience to others, I would be understanding of her situation. Just like when we have a waiting room full of crying babies and screaming kids. If the mothers are doing their best in a difficult situation (and a sick kid in a doctor's waiting room is far from easy), they have my sympathy. If they are ignoring their distressed or unruly child to play on their phone, then I get pissed off.

I don't know what the situation is on our public transport in regards to strollers. And I don't know what the solution is if it is a problem. I guess just a bit of courtesy and understanding from all sides would help. If you can fold the stroller, do it. If you can't, be apologetic about it and do your best to cause as little fuss as possible. And if you encounter a mother who is clearly struggling with arm loads of shopping, a stroller, and a kid or two, have some compassion and offer to help her!

Sherri - posted on 08/03/2011

Yes Laura if you have multiples and have to rely on public transportation you have to fold up your stroller period. You can not even enter the bus unless your stroller is already folded and child in your arms and if your stroller can not fit under the seat it won't even be allowed on the bus at all as it can not remain in the aisles.

I don't even use public transportation (as we don't have any in this town) but even I know this is the rules for the next city over. I am so sorry but if you can't abide by the rules don't use public transportation.

Rosie - posted on 08/03/2011

those women definitely should've folded their strollers up.
i guess i don't understand why they wouldn't, are they just super bitches or what? what gives them more rights than others? i don't think getting rid of strollers on buses is a good thing either, i just think these women could've handled things differently.

Johnny - posted on 08/03/2011

As long as I could sit while holding my child I would have no issue with this. But the way our drivers fly around corners and such, it would be a serious danger to stand and hold a child too. I used to wear my daughter in my Ergo on the bus, much easier, and on a couple of occasions was standing in the aisle. Other passengers always gave up a seat because they thought it was safer. Sometimes I chose to stand because I could rock her to sleep and still hold on with both hands, but often I would appreciate the courtesy. Courtesy & common sense. That is what everyone needs to demonstrate more often.

I will add that on our local transit, there are areas set up for wheelchairs and stroller using moms are welcome to park there as long as there are no wheelchairs in them. I have never witnessed any confronation about it. The bigger problem is middle aged men unwilling to give up their seats for the elderly. Although like many issues, people love to bitch about the most piddly little things on the internet instead of politely dealing with a concern in person because they can't manage their own miserable selves.

Cathy - posted on 08/03/2011

Common sense needs to prevail here. If you are a parent who relies on public transport to get around then you need to consider that when you purchase your stroller. Buy one that is lightweight and folds compact and quick.

A single bus couldn't accommodate 6 wheelchairs. They'd be breaking a fair few health and safety rules. Why should 6 strollers be any different? The women were being obnoxious.

As for triplets, you can buy triple umbrella strollers. Although I think under exceptional circumstances a bus driver and the other passengers would be considerate.

Kelly - posted on 08/03/2011

My town addressed this problem by adding an additional fare for strollers, and making space towards the middle of the bus, right by the emergency exits, for mom's to stand with strollers. They did that by removing 3 rows of seats and putting in those poles you hold on to while standing. It did not affect the capacity much because adults without strollers can still ride in that area if seats are full and the front seats are still reserved for seniors. Plus, If there are no seniors on the bus, anyone can sit in the senior seats, but they have to get up if a senior gets on.

If they want to collapse the stroller, they can use a seat and stow the stroller in an open compartment in the back, but they still have to pay the extra fare. I don't know how much it is, but I know it's not much.

Jurnee - posted on 08/03/2011

Thats a good question Laura. I would love to hear from moms of multiples how they navigate public transportation.

Laura Zoey - posted on 08/03/2011

What if a mom has triplets? Must she also hold all 3 babies and somehow collapse the stroller and carry it onto the bus?

Krista - posted on 08/03/2011

And frankly, considering some of the other cases I've seen on the Halifax buses, a stroller is the least of my worries.

I was once sitting across from this one woman whose whole body was all covered in sores. And she sat there and scratched at those sores for my entire 45-minute commute. I just about barfed.

Sherri - posted on 08/03/2011

Sorry moms but it is common knowledge you want to ride public transportation fold up your stroller and carry your kid. Don't like it, then don't use public transportation.

No sympathy what so ever for entitled people who think they don't have to follow the damn rules.

Laura Zoey - posted on 08/03/2011

I'm glad I don't use the bus! Lol but if I did have to use a bus and I couldn't collapse the stroller I'd be apologetic and try to make everyone happy regardless of my being an inconvenience. I'd do my best to not be a bother.

Jurnee - posted on 08/03/2011

I lived in NY when my older children were babies/toddlers. I frequently rode public transportation and it was basically general knowledge that you had to fold up your stroller to ride the bus. Whenever practical I would use the small umbrella stroller, as it was easier to fold. Might it be an inconveniece to have to lug a stroller while holding a baby/toddler, sure,but children arent convenient. Public transportation is for everyone,it's just simple courtesy to follow the rules.

Krista - posted on 08/03/2011

It does sound like these women were being obnoxious. We've seen this issue before, and I think that it needs addressing. Instead of trying to lay blame, perhaps the Halifax Transit Authority needs to work on finding solutions -- allowing parents with strollers to use the Access-A-Bus, perhaps?

Because even if they HAD collapsed their strollers, they would have still been blocking the aisles. It's not like there's a whole lot of leg room on those buses. I've been on them MANY a time, and I'm not a tall woman, but my knees were always jammed up against the seat in front of me. There would be no room to tuck in the strollers, so they would have all been half-way out into the aisles anyway.

The HTA DID come out with some newer buses awhile back, which were smaller, with fewer seats, but roomier. A lot of the seats were similar to train-style seating, where you have two rows of seats facing each other. The space in between would be plenty wide for a stroller, collapsed or not. Perhaps the answer is to have more of those buses on the road, instead of their old, "jam them in like sardines" ones.

Elfrieda - posted on 08/03/2011

Probably the women were already feeling defensive because they knew they weren't welcome (especially in a pack - how many strollers did they have?) and instead of being apologetic they got aggressive.



Before I was a mother, I took the bus for a 1 1/2 hour commute each way every day. I saw a lot of bus behaviour, and I can tell you that when we saw a stroller rolling up, there were groans. Depend on it, toes will get crushed, it'll be crowded, and everybody's miserable, including the poor woman who brought the thing on board. (although a happy baby who smiled at people made it all better, and it actually was a highlight of the trip)



It made me decide that if I ever have to take a bus with a baby, I'll shell out the money for one of those really compact strollers, or just use an umbrella stroller. It's difficult to fold it up, especially if the woman has been shopping, because she's using it as a cart for all her stuff.



I felt bad for them, but I always sat in the section that was up the stairs so that I wouldn't have to be near them. It's made me really conscious of not running into people or blocking them when I'm out with the stroller. Now that my son is older, I just use an umbrella stroller, which is a huge relief.

Rebecca - posted on 08/03/2011

Who the f said if you can't afford a car you shouldn't have a kid? That is an ignorant comment.

I live in a big city. I cost a huge amount to keep a car in that city. There is a massive public transit system and I pay a huge amount of money in rent to have it at my doorstep. Owning a car here is a money pit. It is way more sensible to use a car share programme and public transit. It certainly doesn't mean you shouldn't have kids if you choose to avoid that hassle.

Personally, if I wasn't comfy folding the stroller, I'd get off the bus and get the next one. I hate buses generally. Thank God, I have a great subway to ride and a streetcar if I need it. No need to really ride a bus if I don't want to.

Katherine - posted on 08/03/2011

Absolutely. Funny I was just going to do the same thing Mary.

Mary - posted on 08/03/2011

Erin, the funny thing is, I don't think that they are the exception. It's raining here this am (no dog walking, and the hubby is home), so I did a little exploring on the subject; there are tons of articles, blogs, and commentaries about stroller issues and public transportation.

The simple truth is that most passengers, parent or not, is using public transportation (buses, subway, light rail) because of necessity. The needs, comfort, and safety of a mother and small child(ren) do not override those of others. They are of equal priority.

Katherine - posted on 08/03/2011

You are probably right. But now that this happened it could become an epidemic.

Erin - posted on 08/03/2011

Actually, I'm sure Heather is not the exception. That's her point. Most mums using public transport are doing so out of necessity. I'm sure they'd rather be in a car and out of everyone's way too!

Yes, this example is extreme. These women sound obnoxious as hell. But I can't imagine that even close to a majority of mothers on the bus act this way.

Katherine - posted on 08/03/2011

I agree Mary. They don't have that right. Heather's case is different IMO, but those when who did the "stand off" had NO business blocking seats for those seniors.

Mary - posted on 08/03/2011

This is definitely a case of "your rights end where mine begin".
While mothers with strollers have a right to ride the bus, they absolutely do NOT have the "right" to take up or block access to seats for others (handicapped, elderly, or not) with all of their paraphernalia.

Mothers like this can argue all they want about their "needs" and the difficulties they face in maneuvering around town with their little ones, strollers, and shopping bags. You are not alone in having needs, wants, and bags. I looked it up; in my area, up to two children under the age of six are allowed to ride free with a paying adult. This, in essence, means that you are not even paying for those additional seats you are so self-righteous about denying others.

I just wonder, in 30 years or more, how entitled these same moms will feel when they are then that arthritic senior. I'd love to see how they respond when a young, healthy mom with a toddler refuses to fold up her stroller, so that their then-failing and painful joints and limbs have to stand for 30 minutes on that bus. I have a feeling they will view the whole situation a little differently by then.

Katherine - posted on 08/02/2011

Well Heather you're obviously the exception to the rule.

Lady Heather - posted on 08/02/2011

I have to admit - I am extremely uncomfortable holding my kid on my lap on the bus and I'm just glad it's never come up for me before. She squiggles and squirms and if the bus stopped short I don't trust myself to hold on to her. I try to take the most compact stroller I can, but I live in a place with crazy weather and in the winter I simply can't take an umbrella stroller. I have to take something big with tires that can get through the ice and snow. And my big stroller really isn't going to be reduced much in size if I fold it.



I certainly wouldn't cause a scene and I would always do my best to take up as little space as possible because everybody deserves to ride the bus if they need to.



But that's just the point - everybody does including parents. I think there's this weird attitude that we mums just take our strollers on the bus for fun or something - like it's not really necessary. Trust me, if I could drive you can bet your ass I would. I walk whenever I can because I hate the whole ordeal of the bus. I've been told to "just put her in a carrier". Oh yeah? And where do I put the diaper bag and all the shopping? I'm just supposed to haul all that around on my person? Oh, and should I do that now that I'm pregnant too? I don't even have a lap for her to sit on right now.



I also get the old "why do you have kids if you can't afford a car?". My husband makes well into 6 figures and I don't have to work people. I don't drive because I have a medical condition. I guess all people with mild forms of epilepsy just shouldn't have kids because they might take up too much space on the bus?



Yeah, I am a little sensitive about this. I am always respectful to my fellow bus riders, but I expect some respect too. It is not easy being a mum who can't drive. It is not easy when I'm out with my toddler and I'm tired from hauling around the gut and she starts tantruming and there's no bus for another 45 minutes. I can't just wait for the next one. It really blows and it's not something I would do if I didn't have to. I don't take a stroller on the bus to spite people. If strollers were banned on transit most of this town would be entirely cut off to me and I would be virtually housebound in the winter. I'm not really seeing how that is fair to me or my kids.



/rant

Katherine - posted on 08/02/2011

The entitlement is what pisses me off too. These are senior citizens, how disrespectful. And to act in a manner that gets the police surrounding the bus? Ludicrous.

Kate CP - posted on 08/02/2011

If I was alone and had two children (say, for example, twins) that I needed to hold then yes, I would have thrown a huge fit about it. But if I were alone and had my five year old and my 6 month old with me I would have folded up the stroller and held my son on my lap. I actually just did that recently on an airport shuttle. It wasn't even a second thought to take my son out of his stroller and hold him so I could stow the stroller to make more room for other passengers.

Some moms do think they are entitled and it pisses me off. Showing some courtesy and compassion for our fellow human beings is a good lesson for our kids to see.