The War on Christmas

Jennifer - posted on 12/28/2011

Other than FB post from friends-no signs here. My kids school sang Christian carols, and did a nativity. The news paper printed all kinds of pictures of living nativities. To be honest, I was rather embarassed, the friends who posted "Don't take Christ out of my Christmas" usually had that post sandwiched between profanity, name calling, and down right non-Christian posts! One guy even followed that post by pretty vulgar pics of his drunk party at a titty-bar!!!

Maggie - posted on 12/28/2011

First let me say I'm a Christian. Now, we say "Happy Holidays" at work - which I find perfectly acceptable. We played Christmas music starting in mid-November. Even the songs that specifically mention Jesus! We sold Christmas trees (not HOLIDAY trees) and decorations. The "X" in Christmas is also acceptable because in Greek Jesus is spelled (something like) "xplotos".
All this nonsense is just as ridiculous as my grandmother telling me that Santa is just Satan dressed up. She had so many reasons this was "true" but seriously?
I said "Happy Holidays" to a customer at work and she said "it's sad that you can't say Merry Christmas because Jesus is the reason for the season" ...I really wanted to say (but couldn't) What about Hannukah??? I think we (Christians) get so caught up in looking for reasons to be upset that we can't even enjoy a good holiday greeting when we get one. Get over it people.

Lisa - posted on 12/14/2011

Hilarious with the Bank One! LOL... EVERYthing gets started with Wal-Mart!! LOL ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/13/2011

My dad's family usually has a kareoke machine for their family christmas party (My dad is 1 of 7 children and they all have children and some of their children have children so a Donnelly get together is a party) We do some crazy renditions of Christmas carols.

Becky - posted on 12/13/2011

My cousin and I do an absolutely lovely rendition of Oh Holy Night, lol!

Sylvia - posted on 12/13/2011

See, I'm happy to listen to Rudolph, etc., once in a while, mixed in with other things. It's the constant barrage that makes me want to run away screaming ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/12/2011

All I can think of to sing in the shower lately are denominational Christmas Carols. I'm not the best singer, and I can't remember all the words, but I'm having fun with Angels we have heard on high and Oh Holy Night. I think there are some good carols on both sides.

Oh tomorrow is my 7 year old's Christmas concert, the grade one class is singing Rudolf the Red Nosed Reindeer :)

Rosie - posted on 12/12/2011

blasphemy!!!

Sylvia - posted on 12/12/2011

I guess that's a matter of taste, Dyan ;)

Rosie - posted on 12/12/2011

i dont' know sylvia, elvis' "santa claus is back in town" is the best christmas song ever, lol!! http://youtu.be/b_9pYpyGmwY

Sylvia - posted on 12/12/2011

I did remember one thing that really annoys me about the increasing public sensitivity to the fact that not everybody in Toronto (most multicultural city in the world!) celebrates Christmas, which I am otherwise generally in favour of: All the good carols are the religious ones, and if you decide you're not going to play religious carols, all that's left is "Jingle Bells" and crap like "Santa Claus Is Coming to Town" and "Here Comes Santa Claus" and "Frosty the Snowman" and frakking "Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer". Everywhere, all the time. For over a month. Blecchhh.

I was reminded of this because last week we were walking through a local mall ::shudder:: on our way to a restaurant for dinner, and there were carollers from the Salvation Army singing "Ding dong! Merrily on High". Singing it very well. In four-part harmony. (Yes, I gave them a donation. Even though I have some issues with their whole shtick.) Then they sang "Once in Royal David's City". And then "O Come, All Ye Faithful". It was lovely. Do I believe Jesus was Mashiach? No, of course not. But you must admit, "Once in Royal David's City" or "The First Nowell" or "O Come, All Ye Faithful" has it over "Here Comes Santa Claus" like a tent.

Rosie - posted on 12/12/2011

nope i have not seen this "war on christmas" anywhere around here.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/07/2011

Considering that the day after Halloween here in Kelowna they started decorating for Christmas (my husband's school has a desert styled Nativity scene on the roof of one building and even the construction equipment has actual strings of lights) because Canada does Thanksgiving in October I've kinda been saying Merry Christmas because it's just being thrown at you.

Stifler's - posted on 12/07/2011

Honestly... I don't go around saying merry christmas OR happy holidays to anyone. Unless it's actually christmas day. I hate how much fuss there is over christmas.. for one fuckin day.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/06/2011

From what I understand here in BC in the public schools we just do Christmas as a non secular holiday. I'd imagine that if the story of Jesus' birth were discussed it would hopefully be done as a some people believe that this happened over 2,000 years ago.

In Canada as in the US we have separation of Church and State and it is enforced. But schools are still allowed to do Christmas pageants and what not.

Jessie - posted on 12/06/2011

I am going to have to fall on the side that a nativity is a bit much for a public school, at least here in the US, other countries obviously may have different mindsets. I would be curious to see how a teacher would present this. IE Would they tell the children it is truth or simply a story some people believe in. Either way someone would end up being offended. Depending on the age of the children, the religious aspect of the holidays should be left at home. Santa, fine, Reindeer, fine....Frosty that creepy magical snowman, sure....Jesus? If you dig on that, that is what Sunday school is for.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/06/2011

Jeannette, I worked at an assisted living facility where 60% of the residents were Jewish. We decorated for both Christmas and Chanukkah because the residents and staff celebrated both. I even said Merry Christmas to a few of them and they said it back. In my mind even if someone doesn't celebrate Christmas you're still wishing them a good day. I was wished Good Shabbos all the time and I thought it was nice.

Jeannette - posted on 12/06/2011

I work at a cafe and to my knowledge we have not been told not to say Merry Christmas. However, unless I know the person, I will probably say Happy Holidays to not offend anybody. I know, I know... I'm not offended when somebody says Happy Hanukkah to me, but I just can't say Merry Christmas to somebody when they may be Jewish or even a Jehovah's Witness who do not celebrate any holidays. We are allowed to wear Santa hats to work the day before Christmas and on Thanksgiving and Easter we say, Happy Thanksgiving or Happy Easter. So I don't know.

I just think it is getting to be ridiculous. I feel bad for when my child eventually enters school and is not able to do all the things we did in school. Valentine's Day cards, the Halloween parade... If somebody doesn't celebrate the holiday, then just ignore it if somebody says Happy Hanukkah or Merry Christmas to you. It's not a big deal and nothing is going to happen because somebody said something to you that you don't practice.

Alessia - posted on 12/06/2011

I wouldn't say there is a "war on Christmas" at all, rather a "war on people who aren't Christian getting yelled at for celebrating Christmas". Seriously people, get over it. If I want to celebrate a secular Christmas with Santa, Star Wars Ornaments and cheesy holiday music, why should you care?

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/06/2011

Jen, despite what you believe about organised religion many people believe that something large enough happened to alter the recording of the timeline in the western hemisphere over 2,000 years ago. Even many Atheists, agnostics and practisers of polytheistic religions will acknowlege that. And as I've said before freedom of religion in the US and Canada doesn't give you freedom from other religions.

I don't feel it's fair for a minority to decide what a larger majority should do and if the majority is willing to compromise that should be allowed. I'm agnostic, but when you live in a predominantly Judeo Christian society you have to realize that your beliefs aren't the norm or embraced by all. And you should respect others beliefs since you expect them to respect yours.

Rebecca - posted on 12/06/2011

I'm not sure why Christians are worried about Christmas somehow being beaten and disappearing. This holiday is one of the oldest holidays out there. It has been co-opted by so many cultures and religions because it is fun and falls during the time of year where one is needed. I don't think there is a huge risk of Christmas falling off the grid, I mean it stuck around after the people who originally created it where all but a faint memory.

Now, there is a chance that people may transform the holiday a bit, just like the early Christians did, to suit their needs. Who cares? By the time it morphs into something todays Christians don't recognize, we'll all be to old to see it or dust.

I say, letting Christmas evolve is the real tradition here. It is just your individual idea of what Christmas is supposed to mean that might get lost in the shuffle. Of course, that's part of the good old Christmas tradition too. Let go people and get into the "real" Christmas spirit.

Tracey - posted on 12/06/2011

My school puts on a nativity play and everyone gets a part no matter what their religion (although a parent can pull their child out for any reason - religious or other). There has not been a single complaint in the 11 years my kids went there regarding the religious aspect - only about who should have got a bigger part.

We teach about all the main religions and celebrate other festivals.

Mary - we have had some very interesting RE lessons where we compared Christianity to Star Wars.

Mary - posted on 12/06/2011

A public school putting on a nativity play is endorsing one religion over another. It also lends severe credence that the story is in fact true

Jen, by that rationale, schools shouldn't be performing plays like Cinderella or The Three Little Pigs, just in case it gives the impression that the school really believes that there is a wolf out there who can huff, puff, and blow your house down ;-)

If I'm not mistaken, Ashley lives in Ireland. According to it's 2002 census, over 90% of it's population is Christian (predominantly Catholic). So really, it comes as no surprise that schools there act out the story of the nativity.

I also think that there is a big difference between endorsement and acknowledgement. The mere act of putting on child's play about nativity doesn't necessarily mean it is promoting the story as absolute truth. By your argument, we should also ban schools from teaching things like Greek or Roman mythology, for fear that someone may view it as promoting that religious practice. Hell, we need to ban Harry Potter and Star Wars as well, lest someone get the idea that schools are promoting witchcraft and wookies.

Jen - posted on 12/06/2011

"Most schools etc were i am do a small play around Mary & Joseph and then songs and something different were all children can take part.Generally songs not around religion."Frosty the snowman and other songs like pop songs"."

If you really think that singing other non-religious Christmas songs after performing a nativity is making it all equal, you couldn't be more wrong. A public school putting on a nativity play is endorsing one religion over another. It also lends severe credence that the story is in fact true (when the evidence for that is zero - especially the facts regarding the census. (no roman census ever had people return to the towns of their birth -never happened. And Augustus didn't pull a census during the entire decade that Jesus was supposedly born.))

So I dislike schools promoting falsehoods and one religion over the other - which is exactly what a nativity play does.

Ashley=) - posted on 12/04/2011

I think in schools and childcare settings.We need to promote diversity.We should not lose our own traditions etc but we should be celebrating, respecting and honoring all cultures and there thinking and ideas also.

Then leave it up to the parents whether or not they send them in at Christmas for example.

Most schools etc were i am do a small play around Mary & Joseph and then songs and something different were all children can take part.Generally songs not around religion."Frosty the snowman and other songs like pop songs".

Its about teaching children to honour one an other's difference's and to learn about each other.I just wish parents could see that.

No one should have to lose there traditions/identity's at all..completely.



@Marina thats sad.

@Meggy..yes just a week ago with our After School group we made Christmas cards with the children for there families and we used XMAS..for space reasons.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/03/2011

Marina, you're right that is bullshit. Is there anything you can do? I think it's nuts myself. My husband is an Atheist and even he tells people Merry Christmas and doesn't think that it should changed. In the US and Canada we have freedom of religion, but people should realize that it doesn't mean freedom from religion

~♥Little Miss - posted on 12/03/2011

Yup. I have seen it. Right in my own sons school. There are 120 students in it, I am gonna say maybe 5 don't celebrate...so now the whole school cannot. I think it is a bunch of bullshit.

Sapphire - posted on 12/03/2011

Just because Christmas is not my holiday doesn't mean I can't be polite when someone says "Merry Christmas" to me. It's not like I wear a giant "Jew here" sign! I've come to accept the fact, grudgingly, that the demographics in my area are overwhemingly Christian-based, and therefore retailers will stock their merchandise to the shoppers in the area. Growing up in New Jersey, it was a very different scenario like the way Mary described. Plus, the older my son gets, I simply don't need to make an issue like I did several years ago with really wanting to blend Hannukah & Christmas. We do celebrate both in our home, and I have relaxed my "offensive" stance in the phrasing of what people say to others this time of year. It's a polite and kind greeting that I want my son to learn as opposed to being uptight and anal about what is said.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/03/2011

I just want to buy the light up moose on Boxing day and figure out how to mail it to a friend of mine back in New York. I could only find happiness at Canadian tire if they had a tunnel that went back to Rochester and one of those million dollar 649 lotto tickets

Sylvia - posted on 12/02/2011

Meggy, that commercial is a few years old, so you probably wouldn't have seen it. It wasn't offensive or anything ... just really dumb. I haven't seen the new one (haven't been watching much TV lately) but I'm not surprised it suggests you can buy happiness at Canadian Tire ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 12/02/2011

My 7 year old's grade one teacher used X instead of Christmas, but I think that was just for space issues on the dry erase board. There is a tree in the classroom, she has Christmas books for independant reading and she even wrapped the classroom door. Heck this morning when I dropped DD off there were Christmas carols playing.

I haven't seen that Canadian Tire ad Sylvia, but I have seen what DH and I believe is the new Canadian Tire commercial. It's a woman and her daughter and the woman is sad because her family isn't there for Christmas, so the daughter suggests they go into town. While they're out her family comes and decorates the house. It's more saying that your Christmas is about family and having a nicely decorated house. But what the hell.

The only war on Christmas is that my MIL is taking two weeks off from work and my younger BIL's girlfriend isn't working Boxing Day. Can't say I blame either of them.

Heck I used to work in assisted living and we always decorated for both holidays

Sylvia - posted on 12/02/2011

@Elfrieda, yeah, I remember that. People sitting in front of fully decorated Christmas tree, with Christmas carols playing in the background, and one says to the other, "What is Santa bringing you for the holidays?" ::facepalm:: Um, Canadian Tire ad guys? If Santa's bringing you something, you're celebrating Christmas (with or without its religious aspect, of course).

But no, I haven't seen any signs of a "War on Christmas" in real life. There are Christmas lights on the fake trees in the lobby of my building. In the lobby where I work, there's a whole Christmas tree with like an angel on the top. This is one of the most multicultural cities in the world, but there is Christmas stuff EVERYWHERE.

I think pretending you're talking about everybody's holidays when it's perfectly clear you really mean Christmas (as in the TV commercial I described above) i s stupid. But the idea that saying "Happy Holidays" (er, last time I checked, the category "holidays" includes Christmas...) is offensive, or constitutes part of a "war on Christmas", is even stupider IMO. It astounds me that some members of a religious/cultural group that's such a huge majority in North America could possibly feel so threatened by the tiny minorities of non-Christmas-celebrating folks among their co-citizens that they have to start claiming they're being persecuted.

My favourite December holiday moment from the last few years was the sign I saw in a local shop advertising a Boxing Day sale on Chanukah decorations XD.

Michele - posted on 12/01/2011

I remember a few years ago (like someone said earlier it could be going on 10 years now, yikes!) a local radio station that always plays Christmas music from the week of Thanksgiving on decided to play holiday music and took all of the religious songs out of the playlist. Yes to Jingle Bells or Rudolph and no to Silent Night and The First Noel.

This is in the Bay Area, but they must have still gotten complaints because the next year the classics were back on the air mixed in with Santa Baby and White Christmas again :)

Krista - posted on 12/01/2011

I'm going to start wishing people a "Smoking Saturnalia". That's awesome.

Jocelyn - posted on 12/01/2011

No War on Christmas here either! I am in the Calgary area, and there is still the GIANT christmas tree in the middle of the malls, complete with santa and elves, christmas music everywhere... I'm Pagan, but very rarely do I ever say "Happy Yule" It's normally just Merry Christmas. I've worked in retail/service for the past 10 years and not once have I been told to say Happy Holidays, or gotten any complaints for saying Merry Christmas. My son goes to preschool and on their monthly calendars they wrote Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, and they are making Advent stars tomorrow.

So yeah, Christmas is still going strong here! Regardless of your reason for celebrating it lol

Johnny - posted on 12/01/2011

I don't think it's about that. I think it is about people being able to choose what they say for themselves. The rest of the year I can say "hello" or "good morning" or "yo" (okay, maybe not) whenever the mood strikes me without a critical analysis of whom I might offend. I don't get why I can't say Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays or Seasons' Greetings or Happy Hannukah or Blessed Yule or Smokin' Saturnalia or just Hello depending on what feels most comfortable for me. Why are other people getting offended by this? I've been wished Happy Eid and Happy Hannukah, and despite not celebrating either of those events, I didn't get all up and offended about it. Quite the contrary. I just said thank you. I don't know where or who these elusive people who get offended by greetings are, but they're assholes. And I don't think they are people of any specific group that have this issue either, these assholes run the gamut from Christians to Jews to Muslims to Atheists to Pagans to Hindus. To me it sort of makes me think of when someone says to me "God Bless You." Now even though I am an agnostic atheist, I don't get offended at all in the slightest. As long as it was meant in good spirit and kindness, I just appreciate the sentiment. That's the point. No on is trying to piss anyone off by wishing them the wrong greeting. Just smile, return your own greeting of choice, and stop being an asshole.

Jane - posted on 12/01/2011

Maybe we should just opt for "Happy Generic Non-Denominational Winter Celebration?" That should cover all bases. :-)

Johnny - posted on 12/01/2011

I find it odd that people get so concerned about the commercialization of Christmas, and then turn around and get upset when said commercialization doesn't reference their specific supposedly faith-based holiday. Which is it? A religious celebration that the secular world is draining of meaning with rampant shopping and the inclusion of pagan and other non-Christian symbolism. Or is it a secual commericalized holiday?

I personally think it can be both and the holiday season can hold whatever meaning you choose to assign it to for yourself. Why do we have to dictate how everyone celebrates?

I know for some Christians who are concerned about the secularization of Christmas, they have chosen to focus their day on the birth of Jesus. They don't have trees and tinsel, they don't do Santa Claus, they don't buy tons of presents, they don't hang wreaths. They spend the day in prayer and reflection, enjoying time with family. I think that's great, and I support their choice.

But I would find it highly obnoxious of any of those same people turned around and told me how to celebrate my holiday time, that I had to say Merry Christmas or risk offending them, that my yule tree was their Christmas tree and if I call it a Holiday tree (so as to include all the tree erecting traditions) I am offending them.

These people who want to keep the Christ in Christmas need to grow up and learn their history. The X is an early Roman Christian secret symbol for Christ. The tree's origins are pagan, as are the wreath, the yule log, the lights, and the feast. If they want to turn those into part of their Christmas celebration, fantastic, have at it. However they don't have the right to co-opt those symbols and then turn around and insist that it is all about Christ.

To me, this is about basic respect for differences. We all have the right to celebrate or not at this time of the year in the way that we choose. I've mentioned before that I have an observant Muslim co-worker who wins the desk decorating contest every year at Christmas. There is garish blow-up "Holiday" tree on the lawn of the Sikh school I drive by on my commute. No one has "ownership" of this time of the year, has the right to tell other people how to celebrate, what to believe, what greetings to give, or even whether they can or cannot take part.

It seems to me the real War on Christmas is being waged by the people making the complaints in the first place. It is intolerant, unkind, and narcissistic. Not exactly the traits that are supposed to be exemplified by any of the followers of the belief systems that celebrate holidays in this season.

Jen - posted on 12/01/2011

Yes because Jesus said that if they don't say Christmas, harrass them for daring to offend you.

Sal - posted on 12/01/2011

I am on the emailing list for handbag store, and last weekni got an email about "happy holiday sales" it didn't cross my mind at all until I got an email apologizing for any offense caused by the use of "holidays" instead of "Christmas" apparently there were complaints.

Krista - posted on 12/01/2011

Joy, I can't believe your friend was so rude. It's your damn concern what you'll put on your status, thank you very much, and she was just way out of line to try to bully you into putting that on your status, without even knowing what your beliefs are!

Stifler's - posted on 11/30/2011

I never repost any statuses. They are always made by dickheads who dont'know what they're on about.

Stifler's - posted on 11/30/2011

And I do think all holidays should be celebrated or there should at least be awareness that life beyond being a bogan with green red adn silver tinsel exists. Christmas decs should be limited to the week before christmas not the whole entire 3 months before.

Stifler's - posted on 11/30/2011

Yeah I've heard about this on Facebook but never actually heard of an individual being not allowed to put up a Christmas tree or say Merry Christmas.

Lacye - posted on 11/30/2011

I also live in the Bible Belt and around this time of the year, my old boss at the gas station would tell us not to say anything about the holidays unless the customer says something about it first. That way, we don't have to listen to them bitch and complain.

I am a Christian, but Happy Holidays doesn't bother me. Christmas isn't the only holiday this month. People should understand that and get over it. Get your head out of your ass!

Jayce - posted on 11/30/2011

I'm in agreement with everyone else here. Except for stupid FB status, I've seen no evidence of a war on Christmas.

Joy - posted on 11/30/2011

I don't know if this counts as part of any war on Christmas but, the other day Jacob and I were taking a walk and he pointed out the "Holiday Trees" (they were pine trees...ironically, in front of a church). I just said, "Yep, aren't they pretty?" and moved on. As some of you know, I don't believe in God(s) or higher powers or any of that. But at the same time, it doesn't bother me one bit if someone wishes me a Merry Christmas or a Happy Holiday. Either/or. It's the spirit behind it that matters anyhow. Holiday tree....Christmas tree...../shrug.

Like some of you, I AM getting over the FB postings. One of my friends the other day had hers set to, "I'm keeping the CHRIST in CHRISTmas! Who's with me???" I didn't repost, for above stated lack of belief. But, juuuust as I was about to scroll away from her status message, she messaged me and asked me to put it as MY status message. I told her, as diplomatically as I could, that I just don't copy/past things to my profile often. She says, "Come on, just post this one thing! It's CHRISTmas!" That's when I told her I don't believe in God(s) and she never replied back to me lol Oh well. Can't win 'em all :D

Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy Season Everyone ♥ (Happy Season is intended to include ALL of it )

Sherri - posted on 11/30/2011

Nope

Rebecca - posted on 11/30/2011

Nope.

Janice - posted on 11/30/2011

Nothing anti-christmas in my neck of the woods;) I hear people say both Merry Christmas and Happy holidays. I personally dont see what the issue is. I come from both Christian and Jewish backgrounds. My mother and her family are Jewish. When my Bubbie was alive she had zero issues with those who said Merry Christmas to her even though she didn't celebrate the holiday. Of course I think those working in retail should stick to "happy holidays" when greeting customers but I think its ridiculous if you are a non-celebrator and you get upset about someone wishing you a Merry Christmas.
I'm beginning to think the whole thing "anti-Christmas thing" was just a FB thing - people trying to get a rise out of others.