USA Hot Lunches good, bad are we sometimes just too lazy to make a healthy lunch for our kids

Good Day! - posted on 06/23/2011

Jenny, I've been wanting to try it in the food processor. Did your daughter actually churn it the old fashioned way?

Stifler's - posted on 06/23/2011

I don't even eat it unless it's in cooking like quiche or white sauce, cake etc. I just spread the peanut butter, jam etc. straight on the bread.

Jenny - posted on 06/23/2011

Sara, it's not that hard. My daughter made butter a few weekends ago and it tastes great!

Sherri - posted on 06/23/2011

We will only eat margarine here. We hate the taste of actual butter. They are all bad for you it is simply which one you prefer in taste.

Good Day! - posted on 06/23/2011

See? Already an improvement! Soon he'll be eating butter he churned himself in the backyard...or not...but at least he may one day be eating butter!

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

Yes Sara you do sound like my husband :) He now loves to make Spaghetti sauce not from a jar, I showed him how east it was and is getting better. I showed him all the salt to those pre packaged stuff but what motivated him the most was the cost. Making my own spice mix for tacos or sauces etc not only taste better is cost much less :) Salad dressing too.

Good Day! - posted on 06/23/2011

yummmm sounds good Jenny.

Angela, we do what we can. Keep gently working on him. Thankfully my husband was the one that brought me to the healthy side. He even taught me that cooking meant more than opening a package, plopping it on a pan, and popping it in the oven...lol. Oh, and I had to learn that Sunny D did not count as Orange Juice. Yeah, it was bad. Once I learned the basics I took over in the food department in our home. Now he looks to me for answers when it comes to nutrition. I feel we do considerably well, but it's taken us some time to get to the point, and we have plenty of room for improvement.

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

I love yogurt too!

Jenny - posted on 06/23/2011

My favorite snack lately has been plain organic yogurt with raspberries and organic granola from Costco. It is so good and so good for you.

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

@Sara I pretty much go by the same rule. But here in The Netherlands they think butter is fatal but load on the margarine! So my husband always ask for margarine. I buy the most healthy one I can but I tell him not to give it to our daughter :)

Good Day! - posted on 06/23/2011

my rule of thumb when choosing food is to choose what is made from recognizable ingredients...margarine does not fit that rule =)

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

well I let my kid eat a cookie or treat once a day if she eats well. But I must admit the article opened my eye even wider on sugar. I am going to be more careful for sure. I am glad my daughter likes yogurt and plain milk in fact she love just plain yogurt. Now for veggies and fruit...that is my battle.

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

Wow the flies won't eat it.... I agree I won't and I buy the organic butter.
I refuse to eat the margarine it does not taste good to me at all. What is it??? oil and stuff yuck.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 06/23/2011

My kids can eat as much fruit as they want in a day......but I will not let them sit with a tablespoon and eat sugar out of the bag.

But, on the note, the only milk my son would drink was strawberry, and believe me I tried EVERYTHING! Now, he will only drink Vanilla. I am not crazy about this, but at least I use Horizon organic milk. Makes me feel a little better about the choice.

Constance - posted on 06/23/2011

Angela The Butter argument is one for the record books. Afriend of mine several years ago sent me an aticle on the subject. I always thought about saturated fat. I don't recall the entire article, but the one thing that stood out to me was this.
" Put a stick of butter and a stick of margerine on different plates. Put them outside and leave them for a week. After that week go back and check them." I did this an was very surprised. Both had melted but only the real butter had atracted flies they didn't even atempt the other plate. After thatI went to butter and have never looked back.

Cathy - posted on 06/23/2011

4 teaspoons of added sugar in one serving of chocolate milk.

Angela - posted on 06/23/2011

I do know about the carbs to sugar thing... That is why I don't give white breads, rice and the likes. I give those foods as fibers so always whole grains.

But thanks for clarifying the refined sugar, makes more sense now. I had not a clue really! Because I know on packages I see 100 percent natural and then see the sugar...

Thanks Jodi, constance and Cathy for helping me out with this. So if I got it right the AHA is referring to refined sugars. It is still small amount I figured it out to be like one cookie basically. So now I can see the milk issue. I am curious how much sugar it has in it does anyone know? I never had the stuff and when I lived in the USA I never bought it so I never had the chance to look. They have it here but only my oldest son drinks it when he comes home for breaks from school. Maybe I should tell him not to drink the stuff! He is soon to be 22 but I would never let my young child drink flavored milk. Here in NL they have milk mixed with juice sounds weird to me and I never tried it but it is 100 percent juice. Maybe that would be a good alternative for the other flavored milks.

I know corn syrup is awful and well the artificial stuff scares the hell out of me. Especially aspartame , they are thinking of outlawing it over in W. Europe. It has been linked to so many things including blindness!

Slightly off topic but what about butter vs Margarine... I get confused on that one too. I alway thought a small amount of natural butter was better than the fake stuff. My husband disagrees. He eats margarine and I eat butter. Also I find butter has so much flavor you need very little compared to margarine. We use it sparingly. I use a lot of rapeseed oil, olive and the likes.

Cathy - posted on 06/23/2011

Sorry, what I meant was if the AHA is referring to natural sugar in there amounts, rather than refined sugar, then you wouldn't be able to give kids much fruit without going over the limits suggested.

Refined sugar is concentrated and compressed sugar with all the quality nutrients and vitamins stripped. Nothing nutritious about it ... but it does taste good!

Artificial sugars - whole different conversation about how nasty those things are.

Jodi - posted on 06/23/2011

Angela, actually, a lot of things, when you talk sugar, are carbohydrates. Carbohydrates convert to sugar. Animal fats convert to sugar. Proteins convert to sugar. Different foods (pretty much everything) convert to different sugars in the body, and the body processes them all differently. So no, sugar is not all natural, and it isn't all equal. You need to understand the difference between sugar, and conversion to sugar. Fruit sugar (fructose) is lower GI than any refined/processed sugar. (GI meaning glycemic index).



Anyway, it took me many books and many weeks to truly understand. I don't think I can possibly explain in a single post :) My husband is a diabetic.....I had to spend some time educating myself :P

Constance - posted on 06/23/2011

@Angela Refine sugars are regular suger but a larger amount in small dose. Typically a Tsp. of sugar in a glass of water dissolves and sweeten just a little. Refine sugars are made more into a syrup so a Tsp. wilcontain 3x's more sugar.

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

@Cathy S your last sentence you did mean You would no let your child eat much fruit if it was refined right?
But I do get confused about sugar to be honest because isn't sugar natural per say? I do think sugars found in fruit is better than the refined white sugar and I know corn syrup is bad... but it is confusing for me. Call me dumb but I guess I can't be the only once confused.

Cathy - posted on 06/22/2011

I think they are probably talking about refined sugar since that it sugar at it's most concentrated level. You wouldn't let your child eat much fruit if it was natural sugars!

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

I want to add that debates and discussion are a good step. I sure have learned a lot. When I looked up the AHA and saw the average amount of sugar my child should have I was like wow! that is not much. That is like a cookie. unfortunately they do not say refined or natural sugar so I am a bit confused. They do specify saturated fats... Does any of you Mom's know if they mean natural and refined sugars?

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

Do you think finacialy healthier school districts serve better hot lunches?

I have not found that to be the case. My school age kids (when we lived state side) lived in a fairly affluent area and the lunches were terrible. To be honest I do not recall them serving breakfast however they may have and I just did not participate. This is when we lived in D.C. area. We also lived in N.C. and TN. N.C. had a garden and it even had small animals, it was actually a country small town not affluent at all. The TN. school's were so bad I pulled them out of public school and worked for free at a private school so my kids could attend at a discounted price. When I say TN were bad the hot lunches were the least of the problem.

But over all I wonder why I saw such a difference in quality of school lunches and when I read on here I observe the same thing (in the USA) Some Mom's like Sherri Champagne I assume live in the USA. Hers school seem to be much more open and offers more than many.

I know some public schools in America are going down hill quick, in Michigan for example many are simply shutting down. lack of funds...

The hot lunch program is a social program, in fact so is the public school program. But many American's complain of social programs over all. IMHO we need these programs more than any other. We need healthy, happy, educated Americans for America's health and wealth. I hope parents can at least try to make a step in the right direction by demanding better food. In addition I hope that those Americans who have more can try to help those who have less. I think more taxes are needed in the public school system.

Those who can do private I feel have a better chance at pushing because you are paying for it. But in the end every tax payer is paying for it financially.

If the state and fed's asked for more taxes and you knew it would go to schools would you pay it?

I read that the average price for hot lunch is about 1.50 that is nothing really. I mean if you add in all the overhead of food, prep, labor etc.

Good Day! - posted on 06/22/2011

Wow that is very low. Perhaps that's why breakfast is not offered?

Sherri - posted on 06/22/2011

About 4% roughly

Good Day! - posted on 06/22/2011

Out of curiosity Sherri...what is the percentage of free and reduced lunch in your system?

Sherri - posted on 06/22/2011

@Emma breakfast isn't offered in our school system.

Sherri - posted on 06/22/2011

Our school does it is on every school menu that comes out monthly and I am in U.S.

Good Day! - posted on 06/22/2011

I've never seen a hot lunch come with nutritional information...but I'd be interested to look into it. It could be that I never noticed.

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

I have a question to you all do they give the nutritional values and calories etc of hot lunches in any of your schools that provide hot lunch/Breakfast?
I know when my girls went to school in the States they did not but funny thing was McDonald's was forced to do so.

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

Good links to go by for nutrition... Of course these are general for example my daughter is only 2.6 years but she is tall for her age so i go by 3-4 year old. Some go by weight and height that would be better....

Here is what the AHA says about sugar.

http://recipes.familyeducation.com/nutri...

But again this is daily so I think that if people splurge on a ice cream or something once in a while it won't be too bad.

http://www.bcm.edu/cnrc/consumer/archive...

Angela - posted on 06/22/2011

@Kate so glad you found a good option ! Sounds great! As far as not allowing to pack a lunch I would tell them to shove it also! I would lie and say my kid had allergies or change schools if I could. I would fight it for sure.
As far as milk goes as long as parents are aware that for many American kids it is a good source of Vitamin D and that if you don't drink milk use supplements, you can even get levels tested via blood work to see if you child needs it. Most kids only need between 15-30 minutes of direct sunlight on the arms and face to get all the Vit. D they need(adults too) the lighter you are the the less time, Darker skin needs more. If you live like where I do in our winters we only get 10 minutes of direct sunlight (not to be confused with daylight) per day. So almost all kids and adults need it in winter for sure here.
Also some kids (mine) need milk or yogurt and she is over two. (2.6yrs). Her doctor recommends it but she only needs about in usa size 2, 8 oz glasses for all her calcium. That can be yogurt or milk. She simply does not eat enough of the other foods to cover it.
In addition my daughter dietatician told me to give her whole milk she needs the extra fat in her diet because she does not eat fatty foods much. We also use good fats to cook with. But I do think although not needed it is a good calcium source and healthy for most.
@ Dana COULD NOT AGREE WITH YOUR MORE!

Dana - posted on 06/22/2011

Yes, Emma, some (or most?) school districts do. It is for kids who wouldn't normally eat breakfast because their parents can't afford to feed it to them.

Good Day! - posted on 06/22/2011

Emma, it depends. Kids who's families make under a certain income qualify for 'free or reduced breakfast and lunch' Most of those kids eat breakfast and lunch at school. Other kids have the option to pay for breakfast. All kids are required to eat lunch at school...whether it is a bag lunch from home or the school provided lunch.

Stifler's - posted on 06/22/2011

Do kids eat breakfast at school in the USA aswell?

Jenny - posted on 06/22/2011

I am also glad my school doesn't have a lunch program and if it was mandatory they shove it up their ass. I am a huge believer in healthy eating. It forms the base for everything else and eating poorly leads to a lifetime of problems.

Great program Kate! I've been looking into Waldorf or Montessori but I just can't do $4000-$5000 per year in tuition. *Sigh* I know my daughter would thrive in that environment. I guess I'll stick with the public/homeschool mix we have now.

Dana - posted on 06/22/2011

That sounds like a great menu now, Kate! I'm so glad you've found a better school.


Sherri, you made a comment about how we disagree so much in this thread, just imagine how hard it is for them to settle on a menu. - I disagree with that. It would be rather simple for them to just make it healthy, then there would be no argument. Unless you disagree with a healthy menu...

Kristi - posted on 06/22/2011

Our school doesn't have a lunch program, and I am glad for it. It is hard to shop on a budget and make lunches for picky kids when I am stretched for time. I do think, though, that because all the kids bring their lunches, that it's good for them to see different kids eating different foods. Our kids attend a school where family attitudes about nutrition and healthy lifestyles are pretty good and pretty across-the-board. No one really eats much fast food, pop, or junk food. It's not allowed at school, and most families don't eat it other than as an occasional treat (which it's supposed to be). The kids are not allowed to bring pre-packaged items or single-serve foods to teach them about packaging waste, reduce the school's trash bill and keep media labeling out of the school. That fact actually saves me a lot of money! I can buy bulk foods and re-use containers for her lunches. I try to prepare large quantities of things like rice and beans, that the kids like, and that I can serve up quickly. They stay fairly warm in a thermos-like container. Soups are easy too. I can microwave them at home and send them to school in a thermos. Send along crackers and a little fruit and we are good to go. I cut down on wasted fruit by cutting it up. Kids rarely can put away an entire apple when they are still little. I have little washable snack bags and just throw the fruit slices in there. There are so many ways to get around the packing lunch doldrums. Hot lunches that we used to eat in school were terrible with a few exceptions. The salad bars were okay, and once in awhile there was a respectable pasta dish. I agree with Angela, that the occasional chocolate milk is not the big issue, it's parents not taking responsibility for teaching their kids good eating habits. If it was offered by the school, I'd easily allow my kid to make the choice about her milk because I know she would be just as likely to choose regular milk as chocolate. She knows chocolate is a treat. I liked reading that celebrity chefs are getting involved in school lunch programs to show schools how to grow community gardens and involve the kids in preparing nutritious, good to eat meals.

Heather - posted on 06/22/2011

Breakfast: biscuits and gravy (an option every day..)
Lunch: Nachos, pizza hut, arby's, pigs in a blanket; fried burritos. It's awful!! Half of our kids are on free/reduced lunch and these are their main meals. I had a fourth grader who weighed 180 lbs!

Stifler's - posted on 06/21/2011

I said I don't see why they need milk. Any milk not just flavoured milk. No one over 2 needs whole milk.

Jodi - posted on 06/21/2011

It does, doesn't it Cathy? I was almost salivating reading it. Sounds fantastic, and I would have Kate's expectations if I were paying that much for my daughter's school too. That menu sounds very similar to the one at Taylah's old daycare.

Cathy - posted on 06/21/2011

Kate - the new menu sounds much better!

Sherri - posted on 06/21/2011

Oh you said milk so I was assuming you meant plain milk you never actually said flavored milk. Although for kids that will not drink milk and there are MANY I would rather see them drink flavored milk then juice, soda, kool aid etc.

Jodi - posted on 06/21/2011

BTW, I DO allow my kids flavoured milk as a treat, but every day? Nope. Other than water, my kids have a glass of PLAIN milk (at breakfast) and a glass of 100% natural juice (at dinner). And the best part of that is that our water is clear, fresh and free.

Jodi - posted on 06/21/2011

To me, the options should be plain milk or water. I can't see that anyone is against offering milk, just flavoured milk. Many of these kids are getting nothing but crap at home. At the very least, if a school has a lunch program, they should be dishing up the healthiest meals they possibly can. It won't make up for the crap some kids eat outside school, but it's sure as shit a step in a positive direction for those kids. If you want you kids to have falvoured milk to get their calcium, do it in your own time.

Sherri - posted on 06/21/2011

I do understand there is other ways to get calcium but I do believe other than water, milk is a better option to anything else that could be offered. We do not allow juice in our home and I personally hate water with my meals. I drink tons of it all day long but rarely ever with my meals. So what else do you propose if you don't agree with milk?? Although I am not sure why anyone would be against offering milk.

Kate CP - posted on 06/21/2011

No, they don't. Milk really isn't that great of a source of calcium compared to other foods like broccoli, cheese, yogurt, and spinach. There is a TON of carbs (read: sugars) in milk, too. It's not a mandatory item in a kid's diet. As long as they are eating other foods high in calcium they are fine.

Stifler's - posted on 06/21/2011

I still don't think kids need milk that much.

Kate CP - posted on 06/21/2011

Okay, I'm finally back to answer all those pesky questions!



Now, my main objection to the school lunches they are providing my daughter is they are LOADED with carbs and very little fiber and protein. What does that add up to? Constipation. EVERY DAY she was constipated. She would come home and it would be a HUGE fight to try to get her to poop because she just didn't want to because it was too hard. I have no problem with breaded fish cut into sticks. I have a HUGE problem with a bag of frozen fish sticks breaded and deep fried and re-cooked and then served to my kid on a fuckin' platter like it's gourmet. I pay nearly a thousand dollars (US) a month to this school and I think my kid deserves a hell of a lot better than cold cuts on honey-wheat bread and shitty potato chips. The fact that so many people think that a meal that contains so many carbohydrates in them is a good meal speaks to the fact that this country is SO god damn fat. We are addicted to sugar in all forms and it's making us unhealthy is so many ways. They're linking the sugars in processed foods (I don't just mean sugar, I mean carbohydrates that process into sugar) to things like ADHD, OCD, ODD, and other behavioral issues in kids. IT'S JUNK FOOD.



Today I took my daughter to an open house at her (soon to be) new school. It's also a Montessori school, so the curriculum is awesome, and they have a chef there who prepares the food for the kids FRESH. AND the tuition is about the same. Her new menu?



Turkey and (brown) rice casserole

green beans

herb biscuits



Spaghetti w/ mini turkey balls and marinara sauce

green salad

apple sauce (no added sugar)



Veggie burgers on whole wheat bun

fresh fruit (NOT OUT OF A DAMN CAN)



Whole wheat pizza

Cucumbers and baby carrots



Home made macaroni and cheese

fruit salad (again, NOT out of a can)



All the fruits and veggies they serve are fresh and/or organic. They don't fry things in a deep fryer. The food is fresh and tastes good. AND...*AND*!!! If I don't like the food or my daughter won't eat it they'll let me pack a fuckin' lunch and NOT give me a hard time about it.



PS: Beanie weenies are, indeed, baked beans in a sweet sauce with bacon bits and hot dog chunks. Yes, I was so fuckin' thrilled they were feeding that to my kid (no she didn't eat it).