Ear Cropping/Tail Docking/Dew Claws

Jenny - posted on 03/08/2011 ( 261 moms have responded )

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I didn't want to derail the circumcision thread so though tI'd start a new topic. What are your opinions on ear cropping, dew claw removal and tail docking?

I am ok with ear cropping as it is cartilage and have both my dogs done as well as did the aftercare for quite a few others. I refused dew claw removal as I draw the line at bone. I feel the same way about tails.

We have a great vet and she does crops for $250.

Our crops:
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/je...
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/je...
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/je...
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/je...

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Charlie - posted on 03/11/2011

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Humans already played "god" when they took animals to unnatural enviroments in new countries destroying the local wildlife and surrounding land .



OUr feral cats get HUGE twice the size of a domestic cat some the size of a small leopard and are killing off our native animals , yes rodents like bilbies .



Shooting ISN"T the main way feral cats are controlled 1080 is the favoured method. 1080 is a synthetically produced substance that is a replication of a naturally occurring poison found in plant species such as poison bush, kite leaf poison bush, poison pea, and wallflower poison bush. Although native animals can eat the foliage, seeds and flowers of the plants with no ill effect, it is deadly on the feral animals that have not evolved alongside it.



it clears the feral cat population in a large area saving our native fauna shooting has to be used by highly trained specialists in areas where these naturally occurring plants are not found because the native fauna do not have a resistance to 1080 and would be killed off too .

Tara - posted on 03/10/2011

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Marina, I did not come on here just to "fight" with you. Sorry I don't find you that special.
I also didn't come to defend or support Jodi or Cathy,
I came on, I read the replies and I decided that I should add my two cents about allowing feral cats to live rather than kill them off.
I still say it's inhumane to de-claw a cat, and I think it is inhumane to let feral cats live and breed and die the way they do. Taking other eco-systems and animal species with them.
hu·mane (hy-mn)
adj.
1. Characterized by kindness, mercy, or compassion: a humane judge.
in·hu·mane (nhy-mn)
adj.
Lacking pity or compassion.

See? It is humane to end the suffering of feral cats, it is driven by compassion for them.
It is inhumane to de-claw a cat because it shows a lack of pity or compassion for the animal.

Jodi - posted on 03/12/2011

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I agree with Loureen, we are not desenstized to it at all. Do you really think, if there were a better solution, we wouldn't jump on it? Of COURSE, we don't like the idea of mass culling of any animal. But as I have already said, while the tough of that may be repugnant, the alternative is UNthinkable. I appreciate how you feel about it, but as you say, you are in America. It's all very good to sit back and say "tut tut tut, how very crel to those poor cats", but honestly, the reality is a single cat can do more damage than you can comprehend, and in its lifetime will kill hundreds, if not THOUSANDS of native wildlife that have actually naturally adapted and evolved over time to having no natural predator. As a result, we have species on the verge of becoming extinct. In fact, there are predictions, that if something isn't done, some of these species WILL be extinct in the next 10-20 years.



Tara is right. If you find it inhumane, exactly what do you propose as an appropriate solution, if not what is already being done? Because so far, you have continually said it is wrong, but you have been unable to provide a viable solution (desexing is NOT a viable solution, because it releases them to continue killing for the remainder of their life).



It is also being assumed that because we SUPPORT the eradication programs, that we *like* it. Not necessarily. I don't like it. But I agree with it and support it as the right thing to do.

Charlie - posted on 03/12/2011

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Marina said " I feel the mass destruction of animals is wrong."



Feral cats in Australia ARE CAUSING the mass destruction and extinction of our native animals , we are being realistic , we are weighing up the best method of keeping our local fauna in existance and unfourtunatly the unnatural , feral , degradating cat has to go , our eco system depends on it keeping it's numbers down .



Tell me , would you be happy to let a foreign feral animal kill off your local fauna to the point of extinction because you couldn't deal with culling the animal ?

As a child we had masses of fairy penguins that lived on my nanna's back cliff to the ocean and feral cats WIPED THEM OUT it took 10 years AFTER the cats were cleared from the area for a small amount of fairy penguins to return and start reproducing again .



It's not about being desensitized or it being a lifestyle (LOL) it's about making the right choice for the survival of our native creatures the birds , the rodents , the reptiles ALL native to our country .

[deleted account]

Wow, this thread really took off.

On the feral cat issue in Australia, I tend to side with extermination not just euthanasia in a bid to control these pests (although if humane euthanasia of the entire feral cat population were financially viable and realistic given the sheer numbers and environmental factors, I would favour that). Is it inhumane? Sure it could be considered as much. Do I feel like a hypocrite for supporting that, but opposing declawing? Not one bit. By declawing, you are removing a valuable and important part of the cats anatomy and then forcing it to live with the repercussions of your alterations. Euthanising or exterminating feral cats removes them quickly and effectively from suffering in often less than ideal conditions and prevents them from contributing anymore to the destruction of native fauna. Catching, neutering and releasing does not address the damage that they cause, the absolute havoc that they wreak on the environment, let alone the stress that must cause a wild animal only to return them to dangerous and sub-par living conditions.

I love cats, but think that it is very hard here in Australia to be a responsible cat owner and be fair to your cat and our country. I have lived with a cat owner whose cats roamed free day and night, I was devastated by the amount of wildlife they killed (from rats and mice in the shed to a variety of native marsupials, reptiles, songbirds and beautiful, endangered gliders amongst more). I have owned a cat myself (owners abandoned him in a house I once rented after they left) and kept him inside except for occasional supervised outings during the day. This was partly for his benefit to avoid the risks of injury and/or death from paralysis ticks, pythons and venomous snakes, wild and domesticated dogs, traffic etc as well as to minimise the destruction of our local wildlife. We had enough insects make their way into our house or on the verandahs (crickets, spiders, beetles, cockroaches) and even the occasional pest rodents that would satisfy his hunting instincts inside and we were vigilant with his worming regime to protect him from the dangers that even those prey posed to him. And yet he still managed to destroy enough 'exotic', endangered and beautiful native wildlife to make me vow to never own another cat in Australia. He caught and killed a small lace monitor in broad daylight after being outside only 5 minutes, he would catch and kill small bats that would fly into the open verandahs after bugs at night, sunbirds (little native honeyeaters) that had raised generations of chicks in a nest hanging from the verandah roof stopped nesting there after being stalked by him for a few months. There were many more examples like this in his lifetime.

Cats are beautiful, majestic animals and when domesticated they can be rewarding and loveable pets, but they are very efficient killers and in my country they can also be very destructive environmental pests. As much as I love cats, I would never declaw one to fulfil any requirement to have one as a pet, I will just never own one ever again and instead will support mandatory registration, de-sexing of non-licensed breeders and enforced night time curfews for domestic cats and extermination of feral cat populations.

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Vegemite - posted on 03/13/2011

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hey I'm learning this computer thingy. I copied and pasted a link hahah

Tara - posted on 03/12/2011

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Yes Marina I know, I was being sarcastic, because really you seem to think that nature should be allowed to just be... so if nature is the answer to the problem, than introducing wild dogs would let "nature" act naturally, predator and prey.
It would make the problem worse because all the cats would be eaten and only wild dogs would be left and then we would have to cull all of them too...

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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Many are inhumanely shot, poisoned, trapped, bagged, put into boxes and left on doorsteps to be "humanely" put to sleep. It is not all dandy ways of disposal. I am actually the one who brought all this up Tara, when it was argued that it is inhumane to declaw cats. That I think it is inhumane to kill ferel cats, but others think declawing is inhumane. That is how this was all initiated.



I have to go clean....I have said my points continuously...I feel I have made some excellent arguments...and so have many of you. I still feel it is wrong, and many of you support it. At this point, I am letting bygones be bygones. This is getting no where, and is in my opinion leading to...or going to lead to something ugly. I am done.





*edited to add* Tara, introducing another animal into Australias Eco system that will kill wild life will not cure that over population of cats. It will contribute to the destruction of the natural wild life. This is not a solution, but would make the problem worse.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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I am pro spaying and neutering ferel animals. I have made that abundantly clear throughout this thread. Wolves, coyotes, foxes, these are truly wild dogs.

Tara - posted on 03/12/2011

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wild dogs are not wolves, coyotes or foxes, those are distinct species of canines. I am talking about truly wild DOGS, the kind normally living in a home with people. Packs of wild dogs live all over the world, tormenting people and pets and livestock.
People can put up fences and they can also shoot them if they are on their property.
I am not twisting your point, I am asking what your solution to the problem would be. And also trying to understand how far your opinion goes, when is it okay to cull an invasive species for the protection of the native species?
Or is there no limit to the destruction they can create under the watch of us humans? When do we take responsibility for the actions of our forefathers?
Is it okay just to say "we created this problem so now we should just ignore it."
In an ideal world there would be room for every species to proliferate and flourish, but that is not the case, and to do so is detrimental to many many other already threatened species.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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See what I mean? Your arguments are simply argumentative....obviously you know that would be ridiculous. Wild dogs, their are plenty....they are called wolves and other things like foxes. Their are abundances of them in areas killing chickens, rabbits, farm animals of all sorts. People put up fencese, and protection for their farm animals. I am not even going to address the rest of it. The point that I am trying to make is either being ignored, overlooke, misunderstood,...or twisted into a different arguement.

Tara - posted on 03/12/2011

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I get that it is your opinion Marina, I'm just wondering what solutions you have as an alternative to the culling of these cats?

What if there were suddenly an explosion of coyotes where you live, and they began eating all domesticated pets and other wildlife, suppose they were coming into your backyard at night, tearing up your pets and leaving balls of fur and blood everywhere?

What if they were wandering into the parking lot of the local supermarket and scaring people and small children.

Would it still be okay to just ignore the problem because we as humans have invaded their space and so they have no where else to go?

What if instead of wild cats it was wild dogs, who were carrying toddlers off for snacks and chasing people off their own property?

Would it be okay then to cull them to ensure the survival of other species?

There's a thought, why not let a bunch of dogs loose in Australia, they could act as a natural predator to the cats, they could simply eat the cats into extinction.

Seems simple enough, let nature do it's thing.

Although I'm sure it would be considered inhumane to allow a pack of wild dogs to attack a colony of cats, including kittens. But it would be nature doing it's job, no?

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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Tara, IF was IN Australia, I would not be "hiding my head in the sand." I am in America, where I cannot advocate physically with my beliefs. This is how I feel about the situation.



They were introduced by humans, and were not only introduced by ships. They were introduced into the wild by owners not taking care of their responsibility as a cat owner. I feel the mass destruction of animals is wrong. You don't respect my opinion? That is your choice and right, just like me feeling this situation in Australia is inhumane.

Tara - posted on 03/12/2011

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Cats didn't come to Australia because people wanted fuzzy, purring pets to cuddle with at night, they were brought over on ships with all the convicts to control the rodent population on the ships, they were released into the wild once they docked in Australia. They flourished because there were abundant food sources that had no real predators prior to cats getting there.
So yes it was humans that brought the cats, a long long long time ago. And so because of that the rest of the native eco-systems should suffer until it's extinction?

Invasive species are wreaking havoc around the globe, killing off native species everywhere, yes this is due to human traveling and human activity sometimes intentional (purple lustrife as an example) some were not intentional (zebra mussels for example) so are we supposed to just allow these invasive species to flourish to the point of the decimation of entire species of animals and plants just because it was our fault to begin with??
If that is the case, then you had better look around your own neighbourhood and see how many invasive species are currently attempting to eradicate many native species right in your own backyard.
Should all the cats in Australia simply be left to continue their utterly indiscriminate killing of entire species? So that nothing is left except cats and the animals that feed one them?
Do they even have any natural predators in Australia?
Are there even any large predators that will eat cats as a source of food? No.
So what is your solution to this ever growing problem other than to hide your head in the sand and say "It's so inhumane, it's our fault they're here so just let them be."
That's not going to help the cats or the other species currently threatened by them.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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It is comparing apples with apple sauce...we did not introduce deer into the places that are becoming over populated...but the cats were introduced by owners that abanded their cats in Australial. It was made so much worse by people being irresponsible about pet care.......NOW I am gonna get it for sure....let the berating commence!

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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Kind of the same difference Mary. Acceptance of the need of declawing an indoor cat, or sending it to it's death at a humane society or wherever. It is all along the same lines, and I was attempting to maybe show that it has become such a part of the Australian lifestyle, that it is viewed as the norm instead of as killing.

I feel the same about hunting, I hate it. I lived in Missouri for 10 years where most male adults hunted. Unfortunately, when there was an overpopulation of deer (or whatever) it was viewed as overpopulation becousse of the destruction of crops. It is very much along the ideas of survival of the fitest. You provide alot of food, population goes up. You reduce the amount of food accessable, the population goes down. This is a double edged sword, becouse the crops are for people, but the food is providing for more animals, and raising the population.

I have all the thoughts perfectly in my head, I hope I have succeeded in translating it onto the computer.

Mary - posted on 03/12/2011

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Marina, I wonder if it not so much a desensitizing to it, as opposed to the acceptance of the need.

For example, I cannot bear the thought of hunting...I just cannot understand people like my FIL, who cannot wait for the arrival of deer season. How can anyone derive pleasure from killing an animal with a gun? Yes, he eats what he kills, but he really enjoys the actual hunting part.

However, I also understand that in many areas, such as my own, the deer population is out of control. Their numbers have swelled to well beyond what their environment can support, and many are slowly starving to death. They are also wandering out of their habitats to find sustenance, making them susceptible to the dangers of man (especially cars).

While the concept still bugs me, I can also understand that there is also a real need for my local DNR to organize hunts aimed soled at reducing the local populations in specific areas where they are out of control.

I don't "like" the idea of killing feral cats, but I do think that Australia is faced with difficult dilemma for which eradication might be the only answer. I know it seems hypocritical to outlaw the declawing of domesticated cats while killing those that are feral, but on deeper reflection, I actually find that these policies support an attempt to humanely treat ALL of Australia's animals, both indigenous and domestic.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/12/2011

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Fiiona, the fact that you let your own cat outside astounds me.....especially when you felt so strongly about the wild life.

Jodi, it seems like maybe you have all become a bit dessensitized to the situation? Just like I have over the 10 years declawing cats? This isn't a new problem in Australia, so living your lifes thinking ferel cats need to be exterminated became the norm.

Jodi - posted on 03/12/2011

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So, I am not sure if I missed someone, but it seems to me all the Aussies who have posted in this thread are not opposed to extremination of feral cats. Notice I did not say anyone *likes* it, but because of the damage to our wildlife and environment, we support it.

I understand, Marina, why you may be opposed to it. But you do not live here. Have you ever even visited? Do you TRULY understand the fragile nature of our eco-system? This is about more than a cat. It is about the hundreds of animals/birds/reptiles that cat will kill in its lifetime in a delivate environment that is not designed to include feral cats.

Yes, humans already played God when they introduced cats into Australia. By exterminating the feral cats, we are not playing God, we are rectifying our mistakes.

I totally agree with Fiona. I would never own a cat. I have seen what they can do to native wildlife, and believe me, neither is that humane.

I don't *like* that we have a need to exterminate feral cats. But the fact is, we do. And I don't believe that it is wrong to exterminate them, because the alternative is unthinkable.

Kate CP - posted on 03/11/2011

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I have never, in my 13+ years of animal care and training including veterinary assistance, seen a kitten as young as 12 weeks go into heat. I would guess that the kittens you were spaying weren't really 12 weeks at all but just very small for their age.

Vegemite - posted on 03/11/2011

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I didn't say typically Kate I said they can and if a cat cannot go into heat as early as 3 month then i guess those cats we speyed at that age and were going into heat may have just been possums.

Kate CP - posted on 03/11/2011

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Actually tail docking can be for therapeutic reasons sometimes. When a dog gets happy tail injury (yes, it's a real condition) the usual treatment is amputation.

Kate CP - posted on 03/11/2011

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No, cats cannot go into heat at 3 months of age. That's too young. They recommend doing spays at 12 weeks because there is typically zero chance the cat will be pregnant or in heat at that age. And they typically have a litter about twice a year.

Vegemite - posted on 03/11/2011

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Kate perhaps i should have said 3 months to be more accurate for breeding not queening. A little over 2 month gestation, 7 weeks to weening = 3.5 months or around 15 weeks + the 2 months for gestation again for queening. Or when kittens are just about weened a cat can go into heat if there is a male about at around 12weeks or 3 months after breeding for the previous litter, that is breeding up to every 3 months or up to 4 times a year. Am I correct?

A cat can come into heat as early as 12 weeks or 3months that is why it is recommended to have them desexed at this time. I have assisted in speys as young as 12weeks and found the cat is coming into heat with it's enlarged, blood filled reproductive system as evidence.

Sherri - posted on 03/11/2011

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also every pet owner is very irresponsible if they do not spay and neuter there animals as well.

Sherri - posted on 03/11/2011

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I think it should be against the law for ear cropping, tail docking or declawing. There is no reason to do it other than appearance. So glad they are finally doing away with it for boxers. My boxer has a full tail and droppy ears and I would never have him any other way.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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Loureen, just look up Australia's ferel cat dilemna...lost of articles will come up. I have to go put my son to sleep. I will have time in the morning.

The article did not specify large animals only being shot by helicopters...but that would make sense.

Charlie - posted on 03/11/2011

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Can we have links to these articles Marina ? I am interested to see the source .

Generally feral camels and horses are shot by helicopter not cats the shooters are highly trained and specialize in arial shooting .

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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I completely agree with everything Kate has said, except one thing. Cats can spontaneously ovulate when an intact male cat is around...and can have get pregnant at anytime after their heat cycles start at yes around 6 months of age. This just means it is important to spay and neuter your pets please. Listen to Bob Barker!

Shannen, I did look at several articles, and I even found some that said they shoot them from helicopters...can't imagine how accurate of a shot that is...potentially maiming insted of killing.

Kate CP - posted on 03/11/2011

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Okay, unless y'all are talking about some new weird species of felis catus then I have to clear up a few things:

1. They ARE NOT capable of breeding at 12 weeks of age. Between 5-7 months is the typical age of sexual maturity.
2. They CANNOT breed every 12 weeks. The gestational period is about 66 days then you have to factor in another 6-7 weeks to wean the kittens and THEN you have to wait until the queen's next heat cycle. Your average domestic cat can have 2-3 litters per year and average 4 kittens per litter.

Also, I have to say that not spaying or neutering your pets because you don't want to "play God" is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You play God just by OWNING the damn animal. It's YOUR responsibility to care for it and make sure it's healthy and part of that is ensuring that you're not littering the face of the earth with MORE unwanted, uncared for, and unhealthy animals. You have any idea how many cats and dogs are euthanized EVERY DAY in local shelters? THOUSANDS. In the US alone there are roughly 2.5 dogs and 3 cats PER PERSON (not per household, PER PERSON). There is NO logical reason to NOT spay or neuter your pets UNLESS you either breed or show your animals. And if you compete in confirmation trials (animal shows) then you're typically a breeder. And even then I'm not too keen on the idea. Spay and neuter your pets, people.

[deleted account]

@ Marina,
"It hunts a wide range of prey, with mammals typically making up the bulk of their diet. Rabbits and other similar sized mammal species are major prey items but cats will also target the young of larger species."
A little biti have taken from :
http://www.wildliferesearchmanagement.co...

http://library.thinkquest.org/03oct/0012...

"It has caused the extinction of some species on islands and is thought to have contributed to the disappearance of many ground-dwelling birds and mammals on the mainland"
From:
http://www.environment.gov.au/biodiversi...

"I have looked up several articles now concerning the over population of ferel cats in Australia, and this article imparticular had me intrigued. Not only does it show that cats are partial more towards small rodents, but also typical birds...not exotic animals. Also, that more animals have been killed by human hands rather than cats."

Marina, All our Native Animals are exotic. The birds which they have killed were our natives. They also go after small mammals or baby ones that may be a bit bigger then themselves. Can you not just rely onb one source instead look at a few and post them.
I didn't realise how strongly i felt for our natuve wildlife until this has been brought up.

LaCi - posted on 03/11/2011

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I don't LIKE any of it. Sometime I see the benefit in cropping, certain breeds are REALLY prone to ear problems and I can understand it. I'm not into it for decorative purposes, and really I just prefer the big floppy dog ears. I had a declawed cat. I love him dearly. I would NEVER declaw another cat, I've had dogs with clipped tails and would never ever do that either (they were already snipped)

I guess, I'm anti all but can see a wee bit of reason for ear cropping. I also had a dog with bad ear problems, it sucked, poor little guy.

Vegemite - posted on 03/11/2011

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Yes we do have a shooting program for feral cats as we do for feral dear, feral camels and the over population of kangaroos in the outback and skip is delicious. However the gunmen aren't just joe off the street who likes to shoot a gun. They are highly trained and these animals are shot and dead before they even know they've been shot, then there is the person who goes up to each animal immediately after to make sure they are dead, who does this job? When I worked on a cattle station I did with dear. How many did I find still alive? Around 1 per outing.

Stephanie that might be true about the survival rate of kittens but cats can do this up to every 12 weeks from 12 weeks of age. They are not just wild but living in an environment they are not native in and destroying it. The kinds of animals they eat are: frogs, lizard, birds, rodents, possums and yes some can grow large enough for koalas. They also fight with and kill pet cats. These animals only had Tasmanian tigers (now extinct) and Tasmanian devils as large carnivore predators and as the names suggest they only lived in Tasmania. The animals aren't rampant they are endangered. As far as the Dingo goes they are also an introduced animal but they have been here for thousand of years and were brought here and domesticated by Aboriginal Australians and as they fit well into the ecosystem without destroying anything they are left alone.

Jane - posted on 03/11/2011

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I have 4 basset hounds...they'd look pretty funny with cropped ears (lol). In all seriousness, I have no opinion really on this but when I read it, I kept thinking about my basset hounds and their hugely long ears and it made me chuckle.

Jessica - posted on 03/11/2011

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Their lives are shorter and they maybe have 1-3 kittens survive per litter. Within the home it is the "owners" discretion but "feral" is just another word for a cat that has gone back to the way things were before its ancestors were "domesticated" by humans. A house cat is a cat that chooses to love humans and a dog is a wolf that has forgotten how to be a wolf. To be honest it isn't the cats fault that humans took them to Australia and furthermore the rodents DID have a natural enemy... that the humans made extinct... and so they became rampant and cats were introduced. Why don't you just assist the dingo population if you want to meddle so damn bad. bigger carnivores EAT smaller carnivores.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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Stephanie, I definately agree that humans are the cancer of earth, but I will say that the breeding capacity of cats is much higher than that of humans....I also feel it is my responsibility of a cat or dog owner to spay and neuter to reduce the population of unwanted pets that will just in turn get euthinized.

Jessica - posted on 03/11/2011

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I have an issue with humans playing "god" in general. it isn't our place to meddle. Fix too many healthy cats and the number of healthy kittens goes down... possibly destroying the species eventually. If you let it be then nature will straighten it out. Feral cats have as much right to live as we do. While I understand the program I can honestly say that before agreeing with anything for another creature you should ask "would I want this for myself or my family?" HUMANS overpopulate the planet more than cats. WE cause the extermination of hundreds of species every year.... and we think it is our job to moderate when something like "feral" cats comes up?

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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Unfortunately Laura, that is alot of what is happening. So far, every article that I have found says that is one of the ways to control ferel cat population. Another reason for me not to be a fan.

Merry - posted on 03/11/2011

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I only can accept euthenasia for the destruction of ferrel cats. I DO NOT agree with shooting, or hunting, or otherwise inhumanely killing these cats.
That's disgusting.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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@ Jodi...another part of the article:

"Though initally used as a guideline, by August 1994 Dr. Paton's survey had been discredited. Observation of hunting cats had shown that they preferred rabbit or feral pigeons. Birds and small lizards are not practical prey for a healthy feral cat. The death of countless native animals as a result of poison laid for mice during a recent mouse plague showed that the impact of cats on wildlife was overshadowed by the impact of indiscriminate killing methods employed by humans".

Jodi - posted on 03/11/2011

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Marina, a number of small rodents in this country ARE exotic animals, and the cats are actually their only predator.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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This is a part of that same article:

"In the Australian press, other suggestions included compulsory declawing and defanging! The press carries frequent reports of pet cats being stolen, tortured and killed as part of neighbourhood anti-cat pogroms although perpetrators are most likely using the wildlife bandwagon as an excuse to satisfy their own sadistic tendencies"

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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These ferel cats are not being trapped, and euthinised humanely, they are being shot...also, if they are trapped....apparently they can be put in bags???? Weird...unethical...inhumane.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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I have looked up several articles now concerning the over population of ferel cats in Australia, and this article imparticular had me intrigued. Not only does it show that cats are partial more towards small rodents, but also typical birds...not exotic animals. Also, that more animals have been killed by human hands rather than cats.

Mary said it well. We would catch and fix and release. I am glad that I got a chance to participate in my local community in aiding the population control of ferel cats.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/11/2011

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This does not sound humane by any standards to me:

In 1992, at a cattle station in the South Western Australian outback Professor J. Pettigrew of the Universtiy of Queensland shot 175 ferals in a 10 square kilometre area. The army shot a further 400 in three days yet a few weeks later they returned to shoot a further 200. According to Professor Pettigrew cats were pouring into the vacuum created by the extermination program. Such wholesale killing is condemned as inhumane; some of the cats killed would undoubtedly have been feeding kittens which faced a slow death through starvation or by being eaten alive by "bull-ants."

Morialta Reserve reported that the cat population had actually grown since culling. Survivors of the cull had bred and their offspring were too crafty to be shot or trapped! In contrast the trap-neuter-release of cats in 84 colonies led to an overall reduction in cat numbers as no unneutered cats were attracted to the colony and no kittens were born to replace cats which died.

It is a disturbing topic, but the Australian feral and stray population needs to be managed — humanely — both for the sake of the cats and the native animals, while voluntary measures need to be taken to control the pet population before knee-jerk legislation threatens the future of cat-ownership in Australia.

Anti-Cat Legislation?
There is a problem with pet overpopulation and stray cats. 36,000 stray and unwanted pet cats were destroyed in Victoria alone during 1992, but many others join the feral population. Unneutered strays are highly visible in urban areas. According to the Australian RSPCA, people often did not bother looking for a lost cat, assuming it had either eloped or been run over.

Some of the methods of disposing of unwanted cats are horrific. The Hobart-based animal welfare group "Feline" reported that in Devonport, Tasmania the City Council offers free disposal of "unwanted cats." Cats are put into hessian bags and left in a small metal box at the council depot until they are collected and destroyed. Cats dumped while the depot is closed may be subjected to extremes of heat or cold and must suffer unimaginable distress. The Council claims it lacks the manpower to hold onto the cats in case the owners show up, giving any cat-haters licence to dispose of somebody's pet, knowing that the owner has no way of retrieving it. The depot's sign reads: UNWANTED AND STRAY CATS MAY BE LEFT HERE BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 8 A.M. & 2 P.M. WEEKDAYS. PLEASE USE HESSIAN BAGS PROVIDED.

http://www.feralcat.com/sarah1.html

Merry - posted on 03/11/2011

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I think the ferel cat issue is a tough call.
Trap neuter release has some good points, but so does colony euthanasia. We don't know which is more humane, so we choose the lesser of two evils. But everyone has a different idea as to what's the lesser of two evils.
Euthanasia has it's pros and cons
Pro- quick fix
Simpler
Protects nature
Protects from diseases
Ends the nuisance
Doesn't let the cats hurt each other anymore
Cons- it's not too humane
The cats die
Trap neuter release has it's as well.
Pros- cats get to live
Cats don't reproduce
Problem would disappear eventually if all were neutered
Cons- cat still is taking out wildlife
Still can catch and carry disease
Still can suffer the elements
Still can fight and kill each other
Pain of surgery
Trauma of being captured and caged
Stress from being captured

In the end, euthanasia has the best pros and the least cons but the con of the dead cats is a big one for most people to accept.
Me too, I love my cats and wish all cats had a good life etc. But honestly given the facts and everything involved I think euthanasia is the best option. I think we are supposed to protect as much animals as we can, and if you saw a cat killing a bird, do you rescue the bird? Or do you say good job kitty?
It's all animal life.

Let's face it, if right now in one second every ferrel cat were to disappear, wouldn't it be a good thing?

The tough thing is for them to 'disappear' we have to do it to them.
It's a sad choice, but i feel it's the best of two sad choices.

Mary - posted on 03/11/2011

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In the past, I have taken part in two catch-neuter-release programs in my state. Both have been in fairly rural areas. I just want to point out that the vast majority of these cats were not diseased or in poor health, or even malnourished. The few that were, were euthanized, both to prevent them from infecting other cats, and also because there was a good chance they wouldn't survive the procedure (particularly the anesthesia). Desexing these animals is actually an indirect way of improving their quality of life; it curbs population overgrowth, thereby providing less competition for the area's resources.

Now, I cannot make much comment about the situation in Australia, since I do not live there, nor am I familiar with the impact that an overgrown feral cat population has on the indigenous wildlife. My experiences and knowledge are only with the feral cats in my general area.

Vegemite - posted on 03/11/2011

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hahah stephanie i've never heard anyone else say their psychiatrist has said the animal thing to them before. Glad I'm not the only one.

Jessica - posted on 03/10/2011

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I do not support animal cruelty. MY ears were "cropped" because they were abnormal and kinda pointy... and my teath were filed because my guardian didn't like them. I do not support it on ppl or animals. perhaps YOU should try it and then see if your opinion is the same. it is incredibly painful. IF you love them then WHY make them feel pain so they can have ears YOU like better... especially when they don't want that and YOU are just being selfish. In retrospect my phyciatrist says I relate more to animals since humans treated me badly and I don't "feel" human... but how do you FEEL human and why would I want to if it meant making innocent creatures be cut and hurt to be more pleasing to my eyes?

Vegemite - posted on 03/10/2011

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yep this desex and release is a huge logistical operation and nobody but the cats benefits from it, even that can be debated as it is hugely stressful for them to be trapped, tranquilized, transported, possibly tranquilized again, caged, tranquilized again, prepped for anaesthesia, anaesthetised, given surgery (major for females), they can't be given pain medication because feral cats are, well, too feral to be touched without tranquilizers, caged again for up to 6 weeks for recovery, tranquilized, transported then released. All this done to cats that are usually diseased and in poor health making just the anaesthesia possibly deadly. Eradication benefits everyone except the dead cats which again is up for debate.

Jodi - posted on 03/10/2011

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Krista explained it well. I DO see it as inhumane, not only to the cats, but the wildlife, to leave the feral cats alive. I don't care whether you see it that way, and I don't care whether you agree. That is my view on the issue. I don't beleive it IS hypocritical, because I DO believe putting feral cats (and a number of other feral animals) to sleep is the MOST humane solution across the board. Just desexing and releasing doesn't solve the issue of the wildlife, which also has to factor in the issue of what is humane and what isn't. It isn't a black and white issue, there are a LOT of grey areas.

I don't believe the homeless person example is a good one, nor relevant, because the homeless person is doing no harm to anyone else. The feral cat is.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 03/10/2011

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I appreciate the fact that you can see both perspective Krista.

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