Is it advisable for me to bath my 10 year old son?

Adefemi - posted on 06/26/2012 ( 120 moms have responded )

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Is a good thing for me to bath my 10 year old son?

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Kathy - posted on 09/13/2013

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MY POST WAS INACCURATE. My daughter still bathes with my 10 year old grandson who is 10. I think this should stop, but I don't know how to approach her. Any suggestions?

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Why are you still bathing him at this age? Does he have special needs that require you helping him? I have four sons, ages 11, 8, 6, and 22 months, and the only one I still bathe is my 22 month old. The others bathe themselves. My 11 year old has special needs, and I don't even bathe him. At this age they need privacy and should be independent enough to take care of their own hygiene.

Sherri - posted on 11/26/2012

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Although 10 imo may be too old to bath. I don't think that is too old for parents to see the naked or kids to see their parents nude. Gender is irrelevant.

Kay - posted on 02/19/2013

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I sometimes help my 15 nrly 16 yr old to wash her hair, whilst she is dressed xxx

Julie - posted on 08/10/2012

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If you have not taught him how to bathe properly by himself yet, then you need to start. Teach him the steps to washing hair, face and body parts properly as well as rinsing. He can also start taking shower instead of bath, if he isn't already.

If you have taught him how to properly. Start going in every other shower and checking that his hair is clean, asking if he is doing ok. Supervising the shower. I do "smell checks" on my 10 year old, and have sent him back in the shower to try again if he is not cleaned properly.

Now he is almost 11 and I just threaten, "I will do it for him" if he does not do it right....he says "No, I got it!"

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Suzi - posted on 10/26/2013

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If he's not disabled, I can't think of any reason to be bathing him at 10 years old

Julia - posted on 09/24/2013

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In a nice way just be frank with your daughter that you think he might be getting a little old to bath with his mom. My son is 7 and has been bathing by himself since he was 4 but I will on occasion help him wash his hair since he still hasn't mastered keeping the soap out of his eyes in the shower (he instinctively tips his head forward). When he goes to his grandmothers he asks to take a bath with her. Usually she says know but a couple times she gave in and once you give in they are relentless. Maybe there is more to the story and he is asking and he doesn't know how to say no. Or maybe she forgets he is getting older because he is always her baby. Who knows. Try talking. Just be gentle. Try something like gee little Johnie will be starting puberty soon can you believe it. Then as the conversation goes just ask do you think maybe he is ready to shower solo? His friends might tease him if they found out he still showered with mommy. By putting it in a question it puts the ball in her court.

Emilia - posted on 09/20/2013

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I don't know about anyone else, but my daughter started showers at 7 and was doing them herself a 7 1/2. If he is okay with it, then I don't think it's a big deal, so long as he knows ow to. It's an important life skill. But, just realize, that very soon his body will be changing and he will probably want more privacy. So down and ask him if he is comfortable. That's all that matters. As long as it all clean and respectable.

Edwina - posted on 05/17/2013

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I think if you wand your daughter enjoy bath times together, it should carry on without suspicion. All these moms that get so appalled need to get therapy cos they are so hung up! I agree with Annabel (posted 2/19); if you can't let go, that might be a different concern. She should be able to bath on her own but if, sometimes, you get in together, that's fine. Why should hers and your nudity be hidden away just cos she's 10; it's daft!

Carrie - posted on 05/13/2013

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NO, it's not. Unless he is special needs and can't take care of himself I'd sure be curious as to why you are even asking. Actually, I don't want to know.

Kristi - posted on 05/10/2013

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I bath with 9yr old son. We have a fun time with all the bubbles. Yeah sometimes he looks at my breasts. But we just play and he says it doesn't bother him that mom has no clothes on.

Shea - posted on 05/07/2013

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My son has been taking his showers on his own since he was 8. Whoever bathes with her 11 year old son needs to respect his privacy and not be exposing herself around a preteen. That's disturbing and shameful!

Gil - posted on 05/05/2013

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Yes it is certainly ok. I still bathe with my 11 year old son. His dad does also. It is natural and not to be discouraged.

Barbara - posted on 02/19/2013

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I help with her hair, but only when asked, and only if she's clothed. Privacy is important to teens any mine is 15.

Annabel - posted on 02/19/2013

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The main issue here is letting go - additional needs aside by 8 kids should have acquired the skills to shower and bathe themselves, they will need reminding to do it, but they shouldn't need help, I encouraged mine com about 5, first under supervision, then some days (so I could still ensure cleanliness) then always. It's not about nudity either, we don't have a lock in the house (internal that is, the front door does lock would be burglars) though they are now getting more private, shutting the door and putting a robe on before leaving the bathroom (now teens). I do help with hair colouring ( a contentious issue I don't like it but every other kids does it) but we do it over the sink. Let go, but gradually, I know they are our babies but they need the life skills to be independent - and from 8 or so there are scout trips, school trips, sleepovers, they need to have the skills away from home.

Kay - posted on 02/18/2013

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Hi, my 11 year old daughter showers herself since 10 yrs old, plus has a bath with her 8 yr old sister. My eldest nrly 16 has shwered/washed her hair since 9 yrs old xx

Barbara - posted on 02/18/2013

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I think most kids over the age of 8 or 9 are perfectly capable of bathing themselves. My daughter didn't want me in the bathroom after about age 8. I ran the tub, poured bubble bath for lots of bubbles and gave her her favorite tub toys, checked the water temp and let her do her thing until she called me in to help her rinse her looooong blonde hair (she had trouble getting all the shampoo rinsed out.) Beyond that, unless the child has a medical issue, I just think it's overkill and mom's or dad's bathing their children just don't want to let go and let the kid have privacy, grow up just a little bit. Kids learn incrementally from DOING, not doing PERFECTLY, just DOING. At 15, my daughter locks her bathroom door when she showers to make sure I DON'T accidentally barge in on her with towels or TP (like I can't hear the shower running, right?!) She rightfully wants her privacy and I honor that. Parents who don't honor their children's need and right for privacy have issues beyond the scope of this site. I'm glad this is the last day for posts on this topic, heaven knows it's been scrubbed of any new insight.

Sandra - posted on 02/17/2013

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I am suprised this topic has such longevity. Is it because moms can't detach from kids, or sons in particular? They need their privacy to enforce their identity. When mine was 9 he had multiple bad breaks in his arm and for a time I helped him bathe, steadying the
cast, we didn't need more accidents.
I would hope in life when we get to where we are impared or old that out kids will physically help us.

Kerrie - posted on 02/17/2013

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Are you really still bathing teenagers?! I hope this was a mistake and you honestly not really saying you are bathing teens.

Kerrie - posted on 02/17/2013

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At 10 years old, your son should be able to bath himself. If he is more comfortable with you being in the bathroom while he is bathing, fine, just don't be the one to wash his hair or body up. Give him some bath toys to play with too so when he is finished washing up, at least he can have some fun too.

Claudia - posted on 02/14/2013

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At 10 years old, you're moving into the creepy range. His body is going to begin changing, and he needs to develop these life skills. Expect that he's not going to get as clean as you would get him. Make him take additional baths if needed. But it's time for his to do this on his own.

Kristy - posted on 01/31/2013

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He's old enough to bathe or shower himself. Omg my boys showered themselves much younger than this. This seems odd to me

Sara - posted on 01/15/2013

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Cecilia, I just read your response and I just wanted to repeat this, because (and maybe I'm just overly touchy now) it appears you may have thought I was genuinely judging you. I am not. I was just trying to use your experience with your daughter to prove a point.

As parents I think we all feel at times like our way is the "right" way. I feel like I have the right to disagree, I have the right to state my opinion (when it is asked for) and I have the right to draw my own conclusions and walk away from a situation shaking my head and muttering to myself "that's not how I would do it" (please also understand, I am extremely sarcastic) What I don't feel I have a right to do is place judgement on someone for doing it their way. Just because I would do it differently, doesn't mean someone else is wrong for doing it their way.

To everyone:

This woman asked if bathing her 10 year old son was acceptable. She stated he was uncomfortable with it. THAT IS ALL ANY OF US KNOWS. Let's not jump to conclusions about her or her child or most of the women responding, (sorry, but if your 16 yo son is still being bathed by you I have to wonder why, furthermore if you are having a family shower with adolescents or teenagers... come on... you opened yourself up for criticism there, there are limits.) I do feel like a 10 yo SHOULD be doing their own bathing if they are capable. BUT, it does not mean they WILL and I do not feel like leaving them to sit in filth is the answer. I feel like every child is different. They each learn differently and grow differently. I can say that because my experience is with a 10 yo son that needs reminding (again, physically, he does a good job on his own, IF he is reminded to DO IT) Maybe if he was perfect (sarcasm) I would feel like I have a right to judge. But he is not and therefore MY experience as a parent may be different from yours, IF your son was like mine, you may find you feel exactly the same way I do. The point is there are opinions and there are judgements... no one wants to feel their parenting is being judged. And it's not my place to tell someone else how to raise their children. Don't get me wrong, there is a time and a PLACE to step in, I have stepped in with parents when I felt it necessary, but use your better judgement. I assure you, there IS something YOU do as a parent that you feel is perfectly acceptable, that someone else may feel is... how can I put this politely... bat-shit crazy! So remember that when you are getting ready to judge, someone else is judging you too. How would YOU like to be addressed?

Dove - posted on 01/13/2013

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Unless there are extenuating circumstances (disability or temporary injury requiring assistance).... I can not imagine helping a child of either gender bathing at 10. Family nudity I don't have a problem with, but I've never personally met a 10 year old who couldn't bathe him/herself. Heck, my son isn't even 5 years old and all I wash of him are his hair and back. He's more than capable of doing the rest.

Cecilia - posted on 01/12/2013

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As far as breastfeeding issue goes. I don't think it's anyone in those cases is seeing the child as a sexual object. As it was brought up the breast are the item of sexuality. Mind you we all know their purpose isn't for sex. The opposite is true when it comes to male genitals. It does not have another purpose. That is where this topic is upsetting people.

Now there is a story of a woman who breast feeds her 6 and 8 year old daughters.(not sure if i have the ages right on but they were over 5 i know that) Now for me... that is wrong. There is a time for those activities. I don't know when i stop seeing it as acceptable any more but i know it's before 5. The same goes with washing your child. There is a time to stop.

Sara, I get what you mean. I personally struggled with the idea of doing it myself. I know some might think she will have issues with her image and thinking she needs to do these things to be pretty or accepted. The reason i did it was opposite. She already hated her hair. She always has no matter what i've done to make her see she has beautiful hair . In my mind i figured okay 8 small streaks in her hair isn't going to change the world. I'd rather hair than tattoos or piercings any day of the week. To me it's even better than wearing make-up.(which she doesn't do) When i did it nothing touched her scalp. i avoided the letting her come in contact with any of it. I think my over-caution might have even been why she was scared to rinse it.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/12/2013

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This is for Scott: Hi Scot! Just a point of clarification. There may be a misunderstanding. You said, "you're wrong editing his posts." In case you were responding to me, I did not edit anyone's posts. I noticed that his posts were gone. Either someone from Circle of Moms did it, or he did it himself. I don't think anyone in this discussion has the ability to edit anyone's posts other than their own. Only staff can do that, and I don't think there are any members of staff participating in the discussion.

PAMELA - posted on 01/12/2013

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I have 4 children-23, 15, and twin 10yr olds. Of all my children, I have encouraged independence in bathing themselves since about the age of 6. Of course the 23 is off living on her own now. The 15yr old who is a boy definitely needs his privacy. He gets bent out of shape, respectively even if I do something like walk in the bathroom to hang him a clean towel, or wash rag. I wouldn't expect any differently of a 15yr old boy. At these times I was not thinking, and just in Mom mode of bringing him clean towels. Even my oldest at this age needed her own privacy, and I tried to respect it for the most part as well. Now my 10yr old twins(b & g), I still have to go in the bathroom to remind them only did you do this/that(wash your privates, rinse your hair good, etc..), but again they do for themselves, not me. Now the only time I have ever had to go in & help is sometimes my twin boy who has ADD gets in his hurried state & did not wash his hair good,etc but still as for his privates never would I do that. I hand the wash rag to him, tell him how to do it properly(for 1 I am a single Mother & he has never had his Father around to tell him how to care for his male anatomy properly.) We teach them that no one, but them should ever touch them there, and I of all people should be the 1 showing this respect to him. I can't imagine how uncomfortable your son would feel having "Mommy" washing him like a 2yr old! Yes, you may need to spot check to make sure they did everything properly, but you should not be touching them, making them feel uncomfortable, inferior to their need for privacy, and independence. & I am not talking about touching their privates only! I am talking their whole body & identity. I am not saying in any way the poster was only regarding her post to washing the boys privates. I just feel children need to become independent in meeting their own personal needs, and part of this development is their own privacy w/their bodies. Now if my children ask for my assistance, I am not going to turn them away, but it's only at their request. If it's something I feel they can still do themselves, I will stress it to them. Again, it's because they need to learn independence, and confidence that they can do for themselves.

Darlene - posted on 01/12/2013

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well I WOULD SAY ABSALUTLY NOT I DO HAVE 2 boys and @ 10 my oldest was most deff NOT HAVING MOM do any of it so thats a HELL NO!!

Chasmodai - posted on 01/08/2013

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Yes, I do. I agree completely. It reminds me of the rape culture issue. Women are told what to wear, where to go, how to conduct themselves to keep them from being raped. Obviously they aren't the problem, the rapist is the problem. As soon as a woman or a child remove their clothing, they are immediately sexualized.

Sara - posted on 01/08/2013

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I love the fact that this conversation has become civil! Here is something to ponder, I am bringing it up to show another aspect of this topic...

Women breastfeeding in public has become a huge issue, WHY? Is it because women who are breastfeeding are somehow abusing their children sexually because they allow them to latch onto a breast for nourishment? Is it because a woman breastfeeding her child is somehow trying to catch the attention of your husband and arouse him from across the room? Does breastfeeding in public mean you are also going to have sex in public? NO, it is because society has made breasts a sexual object, granted breasts are sexual in nature, however the sole purpose, even the main purpose of breasts is NOT a sexual purpose. If breasts were not viewed as a sexual object NO ONE would have an issue with a woman nursing her child in public!

If you don't view your child as a sexual object NO ONE should take issue with their being assisted or supervised while bathing. It is not "wrong", it is not "sexual", it is not a privacy issue. It is simply a hygiene issue, nothing more, nothing less... unless of course you are one of those people who are finding it sexual, IF that is the case then and only then does it become abuse. In which case, yes, it is wrong.

From what I see, this woman did not ask if it was acceptable to bathe her son since she is attracted to him. I did not defend her actions after seeing she found some sort of arousal in the action, I did not EVER state that I view my child as a sexual object. It was the people that jumped in and made some sort of assumption, not having the full details or not considering the details they had before placing judgement and blame. I'm sorry, but I don't find that helpful to anyone in any way. And I take offense at it.

And for the record I did breastfeed :-) all three of my children, my girls were breastfed for just past two years each and my son until he was 15 months (he was a biter!!! Teeth came in an my nips were off limits!!!) I was told once, quite rudely, by a woman no less, that if I felt like I HAD to do "that" I should at least go into a bathroom stall to do it. I very politely told her I would see fit to nurse my daughter in a TOILET stall when she saw fit to eat HER meal in a toilet stall as well!

I see very little difference here, I was not "wrong" to feed my child (regardless of how uncomfortable it made people around me, that is THEIR issue and it is not my responsibility to take my child into a bathroom to feed her because someone else has a problem with breasts) (by the way, I was completely covered with a receiving blanket from start to finish) Similarly, it is not my responsibility to neglect my child's hygiene because others may think it is perverse. I am doing no wrong by my child, the discomfort it THEIR issue.

What if I were to say I find the color pink to be extremely sexual and I am uncomfortable being in the presence of anyone wearing pink? Does that mean no one should wear pink because I find it uncomfortable? What if 20 people in a general area find it uncomfortable, does THAT mean no one should wear pink? Let's just break it down to complete ridiculousness (is that a word). I feel like I'm being incredibly redundant, but maybe the issue here is just that people need to look at the big picture.

Cecilia, (I'm not judging or attacking, just trying to make a point, so please don't take this the wrong way, I'm simply using your story as an example) I would not allow MY daughter to have highlights right now, she is twelve, I feel like it sends the wrong message about her body image to allow her to change it in such a way (yes, I am exaggerating for effect) I also feel like the chemicals used in such a process are very unhealthy and pose a physical risk/threat to her (ie: child abuse) (again, exaggerating for effect) Yet, I don't propose to have any right to tell you what to do with your child. I certainly am not going to attack you for it. Judge you for it. Nor will I slander you as a mother or threaten to report you for abuse ;-) I am going to assume you know what YOU are doing and would not put your child's health or well being in danger. EVEN IF I don't agree with your actions. (for the record, I couldn't care less that your daughter has highlights)

I really hope the meaning I was going for is taken correctly there, do you see my point everyone?

Chasmodai - posted on 01/07/2013

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Yes, Cecilia, I think there is nothing wrong with that at all. We provide our children with all of their hygiene care when they are helpless, then we gradually back off until we are just supervising, sitting by the tub while they wash themselves. Later, we just remind them what to do, then check after, "Let me see behind your ears, please," and "Please go back in there and do it again, you forgot your ears." But in unusual circumstances it would be weird NOT to assist the child. Those hair treatments can be scary for a young person. I'm thinking of the perms I used to get when I was a child.

I read in a child psychology book that all young children go through a phase where they think they want to marry their opposite sex parent, and may even flirt with them a bit. They may act out sexual feelings toward the parent. This is considered normal. The child doesn't know any better, but of course the parent does. This doesn't mean the parent should accept or encourage these advances, but they should be handled lovingly. It also doesn't mean that if the parent sees the child without clothing, sexual abuse must be happening.

I think the difference is not whether or not the parent sees the child without clothes, or even whether or not the child sees the parent without clothes, but how does the parent perceive the child. Does the parent see human beings as sexual objects, and vulnerable human beings as potential opportunities? In this case, that's a very bad situation. Is the parent respectful of self and others, and does the parent convey that respect to the child? In my opinion that's far more important than how that particular family handles hygiene.

Okay, so here's a question: Let's say dad is a hairdresser. Daughter wants highlights. They decide to do it at home, and they don't have a shampoo sink. Let's say daughter says, "It would be easier if I just got in the shower." I don't know, maybe the daughter would wear a swimsuit, or maybe she wouldn't, or maybe Dad might say, "I'm not comfortable with this, let's call your mother," but I CAN visualize a scenario where she gets in the shower, dad helps rinse her hair, and nothing perverse happens. I think if dad doesn't see his daughter as a potential sexual object, and he's not perverted, it is completely fine. Not all people see every human as a potential sexual plaything. To a normal person, a daughter is a daughter, not a sex object. Any man worth his salt would protect her and she would be able to trust him.

What if your child is an adolescent, and needs help with shaving or feminine hygiene? Obviously we help. We don't do more than what is appropriate. What if mom is out of town on business and daughter has her first period? Maybe dad has to be the one to take her to the drugstore, and help her pick out the right products. He might say, "Your mom uses a heating pad if it gets too bad," or, "Let's call your mom, she'll have some advice." But he would definitely be there for her - not see her naked, not get intimate, but certainly be straightforward with helpful information without getting squeamish. He wouldn't do anything any differently than a mom would do. He would care about her comfort, and want to help reduce any anxiety she might be experiencing.

Cecilia - posted on 01/06/2013

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I will say this, my daughter is 12.. Tonight i was putting highlights in her hair. She was scared of rinsing it out and getting it in her eyes while rinsing in the shower. I was trying to hang her head over the tub and rinse it. She said to me "wouldn't this be easier if i just get in the shower?" I said "actually it would be." So she stripped down got in the shower and leaned her head back as i rinsed her hair. (standing outside the shower)

I personally would never ask her to allow me to do it. I only did it per her request. She was fine with it, obviously. Once i was done rinsing it i said okay get yourself dried off and i'll be in the living room, because i still had to straiten her hair for school tomorrow.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/06/2013

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Brava, Sara! I completely agree with you. Scott, I don't have any daughters, only sons, but I do think that if I did have daughters, I would have no qualms about my husband seeing them without clothes or assisting them with personal hygiene or bathing if it were needed. If a child needs assistance, and is not yet independent, then we provide whatever assistance is required - period. But then, I'm not married to a pervert and it would never cross anyone's mind in my house. In fact, I do think that getting too hung about it would arouse my suspicion. I would wonder if the individual is projecting.

Sara - posted on 01/06/2013

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Why do you feel the need to make something out of nothing? I just don't get it. There was no hysteria, there were no inflammatory remarks made by me. I had nothing to do with Darrell's post's being removed, my guess is he either realized he was looking more like the ass he is and left or someone in admin did not approve of his threats and got rid of him. In fact, I'm looking at your name right now thinking it looks pretty suspiciously made up and wondering if you aren't really Darrell trying to get another dig in without being detected.

For the record, if my ex-husband needed to check in on the kids the only one I would have an issue with is my oldest, not because of her age, but because of the fact that she has hit puberty and has developed breasts and pubic hair and SHE would feel incredibly uncomfortable having her father see her naked. Now, I heard he was showering with our youngest daughter shortly after we divorced and yes I did call him and tell him I didn't want him doing that. Not because I feel like he is doing anything to her in a physical manner or he is being inappropriate with her in a sexual manner, but she was 6 and I just feel like that is getting to be too old to shower with dad. But, she has her own hygiene issues (this girl never wipes! Well, she's much better than she was) our pediatrician's suggestion (because it was causing UTI's) was to assist her when she wipes! I go in and make sure she's washing her bottom too!

As it stands, last week my oldest daughter (she is 12 1/2) asked me to come into the bathroom and help her get a snarl (snarl is being very modest) out of her hair. She was not at all uncomfortable with me being in there and it took me close to 45 min to get her hair combed through. In the end I cut it, even though the snarl was out at that point, her hair just does that. No matter what we put in it or wash it with, it turns to a rat's nest within moments. Incidentally, her new cut looks great on her!

Maybe in my family we are less modest about nudity, maybe in yours you aren't. But if I'm not doing anything wrong and you're not doing anything wrong, who the hell are either of us to JUDGE the other? I can tell you from my own personal experience my parents were hippies. We had a sweat lodge in the woods behind our house and I saw more naked bodies than you can probably imagine. I grew up with people around me who had no shame about their bodies. People who had very few hang-ups. Not only did it teach me to respect my body and love what I have been given, I am in no way scarred from it, neither are my sisters and NONE of it was EVER sexual. I was molested, but not by any of those people... it was the church going, clothing wearing, better than the rest of us neighbor! You know the type, one of those people who would never let anyone see him in his boxers, he had no qualms whatsoever about sticking his fingers in my shorts! THAT scarred me, THAT has had a lasting impact on every sexual experience I have ever had. Seeing my father naked when I was twelve, not at all! Make nudity bad and guess what happens, it becomes one of those things your kids are going to be curious about and feel ashamed of. Make it forbidden and they almost always want to know more. It's human nature to want what you can't have. My kids know a penis is a penis and a vagina is a vagina. We are very open about sexuality and about the differences between boys and girls and we talk about things candidly so there is no need for shyness or embarrassment or shame. My kids know that they are special and that their bodies are special and should be cherished and are theirs and no one else should touch them. Nudity is not sex, there is nothing wrong with nudity (God made us naked you know, no one has ever been born in clothes) I realize that's probably going to ruffle some feathers and by no means am I saying run around naked especially in front of your kids, but seriously what is the hang-up? Make it such a big deal and it will be a big deal! But hey, you do what works for you and I'll do what works for me. I won't judge you, so don't judge me.

Notice please, her question was "Is it acceptable to bathe my 10 year old son?" She did not ask if it was acceptable to stare at his genitals or fantasize about him or touch him inappropriately. She asked about bathing. There was nothing sexual about it. Similarly, I never said I enjoy humiliating my son, I said if he is embarrassed, good. Maybe that will be incentive for him to pay more attention to what he is doing. There is no reason our children should be spared from embarrassment. I promise you, my kids embarrass me, a LOT. Why should they be immune from it when I am not? (They also make me proud, a LOT)

Chasmodai - posted on 01/06/2013

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I think that it's possible to present an opposing or unpopular point of view while simultaneously conveying respect to the others on the board. He did not do this.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/06/2013

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It wasn't the opinion, it was threatening to report one of the moms and then coming back and saying that he DID report her. He did not simply present a different point of view, but did so with venom and vitriol. I'm glad he's gone, what he had to offer was not supportive or helpful. Regardless of whether his points were salient or worthy of consideration, the tone used can completely wreck the usefulness of the discussion.

Scott - posted on 01/06/2013

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I have been following this thread for a week now and I am surprised Darrell's posts were eliminated. I thought he had some salient points. So much for a different opinion!. For the most part, I cannot fathom any child 10 years old being bathed by a parent, let alone a parent of the opposite sex. Darrell makes a strong point, would any of you be comfortable if it was a Dad in there with his daughter making sure she bathed properly, whether she was embarrassed or not?
I have re-read Sara's response several times, taking out the hysteria parts, I personally think she is dead wrong. I don't know about anyone else but she makes some pretty inflammatory statements.At the end of the Day, if she does get a visit from some authority, if she is doing nothing wrong so be it.I have no intention of responding to this blog again, but your wrong editing Darrell's posts.

Barbara - posted on 01/06/2013

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Cecilia, I didn't mean to sound critical of you. My teenage daughter can drive me looney-tunes with frustration at times and I haven't always handled things as well as I wish I would have, far from it.

I did identify my own feelings of humiliation because I had been accused of doing something as a fairly young child (fourth grade), stood up in front of my entire class and humiliated by the teacher in the class for at least a week or two until the real culprit was discovered. The teacher never did apologize to me for the humiliation I was undeservedly subjected to.

I totally agree that truth is the best way - and it's sometimes hard for kids this age to be truthful, they are so busy proving to themselves that they don't need mom's 'interference' any more that they overcompensate by lying. We've also had things 'disappear' and have worked a variety of different behavioral attitudes to address this issue. As you said, some have worked well, others not so well. Heaven knows, parenting (especially parenting teens) isn't for sissies! Good luck to you and your son and I hope things improve for both of you. Trust, once broken, is very hard to restore and it must be a two-way street to function at all. We are still working on rebuilding the bridge of trust between my daughter and myself.

Cecilia - posted on 01/06/2013

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Barbara, i know there are other ways of doing it. At the point when it was done i was frustrated. I had a child stealing from me and other family members and lying about it all. We tried different avenues since this happened. some have worked some havn't.. None have been perfect.

Truth is the best way, and the way i'm using now is to ask him to trust me. He thinks these small lies will make me so angry at him, so he refused to tell me the truth. I've shown him the truth is the better option. I've worked on not blaming him soon as something is missing to show him he can trust me,and that I trust him.

Barbara - posted on 01/06/2013

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I'm not saying that what you did was child abuse, or that you should have been prosecuted for this, but it must certainly have been humiliating for your son. I couldn't do that to my daughter and I have caught her in some whopper lies since becoming a teen. There's no point in recrimination here, but I wondered if there might have been a better avenue to corrective action than humiliation.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/05/2013

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Sara, and All: Darrells posts have been removed. It's possible that he has been banned - I hope Circle of Moms doesn't tolerate people coming on here and threatening people.

This is supposed to be a place where moms can hang up and discuss the challenges of parenting. Some of these discussions can become heated, especially when people don't know how to disagree civilly or misinterpret disagreement as a sign of disrespect. Some people feel their opinion is the only valid one and have a hard time admitting that opposing points of view can also be valid. But some people like to go online just to argue and upset people, and those people are hopefully dealt with when they are flagged.

I have read a lot of interesting opinions and ideas on Circle of Moms, and I just hope that the bad eggs don't drive the good people away from the forums.

Sara - posted on 01/05/2013

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My son could not care less about me seeing him naked, he wouldn't care if I did bathe him, I don't simply because he does need to do it himself (and really, I have enough to do, why add more when it isn't necessary). In fact, last summer we had an incident where he sat on (I am assuming he sat on them) a nest of seed ticks, if you don't know what that is, it is a tick the size of a pinhead, tiny! A nest is hundreds, if not thousands of them. Had this child been afraid of me seeing him naked he would probably have waited much longer than he did (a day or two) to ask me to look at his scrotum and tell him what was wrong with it. COVERED in ticks. That poor boy! But you know what, I was proud of him. He had a problem, he came to me and addressed it straight forwardly. He made me promise not to tell my boyfriend because he was very embarrassed and didn't want another man to know he had "things on his balls" proving to me there is a little man in him after all. He tends to be the most sensitive of my kids and not very masculine! I try to encourage his strengths and help him come to his own conclusions about his weaknesses. After all, since when does a ten year old really listen to his mother. Seriously, there will come a day when it bothers him, I hope that day comes soon, cuz like I've said, I got better things to do. When that day comes, he'll let me know. I know he can do it, he does do it and he does a good job of it, once he is reminded... what he doesn't do is REMEMBER to do it on his own. People, this should not be an issue for any of you. Grow up and find a real cause to get worked up about. There are real monsters all around us, quite trying to make me fit into that mold when I clearly don't.

Cecilia - posted on 01/05/2013

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I think if your son has been asked if he minds, and he says no... You're fine. I think your case is no different than me knocking on the door while my kids are in the bathroom and yelling in "don't forget your hair." I do feel that strait up bathing your child who can reach around and do it if you let them- is a little different.

As far as who reported it, the school.. He went to school and told his teacher what I had "done to him." She called on me. It was seen as mental abuse. So yep, if i beat him they can't touch me. Oh how silly this world is.

Sara - posted on 01/05/2013

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You are correct, and frankly I am shocked at some of the ridiculous things parents are forced to defend in an attempt to parent their children. Unfortunately it is people like Darrell that make it necessary. That being said, I did ask my son (because honestly it had never occurred to me he might be bothered by it because he has never given me any indication it does) so I asked him if it bothered him and his response (this poor abused child, let me tell you) was "No Mom, if you don't ask me I forget a lot." There are no delusions in our home as to what kind of children are here. Noah is a brilliant child, but very much an airhead. Like I have said before, someday he will begin to remember, in the meantime I will continue to remind him. And for the record, I would not have thought to write "liar" on my child's forehead but I think it is a brilliant idea! We have a minimum of one if not two generations of young people that have no concept of what accountability, respect, appreciation, work ethic, or pride in a job well done is (to name just a few things) they feel like the fact that they are breathing means the world owes them something. THEY NEED TO LEARN HUMILITY, it is a good lesson to have!!! Who in their right mind would report that as child abuse?

Cecilia - posted on 01/05/2013

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Sara, you might be surprised at what is seen as child abuse. My son lied to me, no joke, 12 times in one day. He was 12 years old. I didn't know what else to do. the lying had been going on for at least a year. I took a washable marker and wrote liar on his head. I stood him in the mirror and told him this is what i see right now. I told him to get in the shower and head to bed. Mind you his lies did drastically slow down after that.

I'm not saying what i did was perfect..by no means. I still to this day do not see it as child abuse. Guess what, i was charged and convicted of that exact thing. I did not lose my kids but i did spend 6 months of community service for this act. If i would have beat him with my hand, they would allow that....

I'm just saying that maybe in your mind you don't see it as child abuse/neglect, does not mean the courts would agree.

Sara - posted on 01/05/2013

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And Barbara,

Darrell's issue is he's a bully and I am not cowering to him so he is becoming more and more aggressive and trying to scare me with threats of reporting me for something that is not a legitimate concern. My guess is he's got some pretty serious issues he's trying not to deal with and attacking me has become a form of distraction for him ;-) Don't worry Darrell, I won't take it personally, go ahead and be the ass you feel you need to be. I'll still be here when it's all said and done, after all, they don't lock up moms who make sure their sons butts are clean.

Sara - posted on 01/05/2013

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Darrell, Why don't you be a gem and give me the contact info for who you reported me to so I can give them a call and invite them over to my home so they can talk to my son. I have nothing to hide! My son is a very well adjusted child and is in absolutely no way, shape, or form abused. In fact the only issue we have in our house that is actually of concern to me is that my oldest child is still struggling with the fact that her dad and I divorced. In fact, if her dad had the ability to HE would also tell you our son indeed needs some reminding when it comes to bathing. He would also tell you I am a good mother and that you are being an ass. I'm guessing there are a lot of people out there reading these posts who agree just as strongly with me but for whatever reason chose not to stand up for this woman or me once you turned your hatred to me. So bring it on, walking into the bathroom, sitting down on the toilet and asking my son if he has washed his bottom yet is NOT child abuse. And absolutely no one in their right mind would think it is. It is simply a mom making sure her son has done what he should do in the shower before he gets out. The person who is a sicko is you, for trying to turn an innocent shower into some sort of kiddie porn episode.

Barbara - posted on 01/05/2013

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Sara,
I agree with you that Darrell has been verbally abusive and excessively aggressive in his attacks on you and others on this thread. I'm mystified why any one would report a caring mom to the authorities for 'suspected child abuse' over something this mundane. Everyone has different standards and different take on an issue like this and, with the exception of child predators, no one is really right or wrong. I've gotten myself upset over some of the things that were posted here and then I realized that I can simply avoid this thread and move on to other threads that are more helpful to me and others. I've dumped one thread on teenage pot smoking for the very same reason, ridiculous and inaccurate posts that don't reflect the morays and values I want to raise my children to observe. If Darrell or anyone else wants to call me 'controlling' because of this - go ahead. I live by values I personally subscribe to, obey the law, go to church on Sunday's, treat others with the same level of respect that I want to be treated by, help those in need, be faithful to those whom I love, in our school and church communities and our larger community beyond those gates. I'd like to tell you to take what Darrell say's with a grain of salt and blow it off, he's not going to change his mind and clearly you are comfortable where you are with what you are doing and for that reason have no desire to change your mind. Fine. If Darrell wants to be one of those aggressive on-line bloggers, let him. He lived without my input before, and I without his - let him go and be well with yourself.

Sara - posted on 01/05/2013

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Darrell, why do you feel the need to label a child as having something "wrong" with him if he does not meet YOUR expectations? Perhaps my child is simply not a cookie cutter kid! Perhaps it does not mean ANYTHING other than as his mother I am doing my best to teach him and be patient as he learns! Yet you report me for sexual abuse, by the way, I guess whoever you reported me to didn't agree with you since they have not contacted me. I would also like to point out I used my real (full) name while you simply go by "Darrell" making it impossible to report YOU for any suspected abuse I would have to call you out on the fact that I still feel you are nothing more than a bully and a pot stirrer. I think you are enjoying being an ass, and make no mistake about it, that is exactly what you are. My son is EXTREMELY intelligent, by the age of four he was reading chapter books of a third grade level. Even more impressive is I was busy taking care of a home and raising three children and had not had much time to sit down and TEACH him... he learned the alphabet and taught himself to read! He is in fourth grade but he is working at a higher level than my 7th grader, his school has spoken with me about moving him up because he is so smart. Is it abuse that I said no? I know MY child. Socially he is not advanced enough for that kind of a move. Again, he is EXTREMELY intelligent. Perhaps you would have agreed with his 2nd grade teacher who told me he was not comprehending anything he reads ( he can quote you the exact text days later, yet somehow as his teacher she felt he wasn't "getting it") it took me several parent teacher conferences to get to the bottom of it... she was demanding that he stand up in front of class and tell them what he read, he is shy and was embarrassed at how much more advanced he was than his classmates so he would simply refuse to speak. She took this as not "getting it" and suggested he needed special reading classes to "catch up" to the rest of his class. My child does not have special needs, he is simply a 10 year old boy who becomes mesmerized by water! He will play in it, he will stare at it, he will literally stand outside of the water and watch it go down the drain of the tub and NEVER get wet. There is NOTHING wrong with my going into the bathroom and sitting down (I'm sorry, did you think my life was all bon bons and massages? I'm TIRED, I'm taking care of three children, my boyfriend, two dogs,one that is a 9 week old puppy, two cats, a home, a yard, an ex-husband who coddles our children and teaches them to disrespect my authority, and everything else in my life except ME, all the while working up to 36 hours at a time to support my family because I am a WOMAN!!! I came here to interact with WOMEN not assholes like you!!! Hence my criticism of you being on Circle of MOMS!!! YOU WILL NEVER BE A MOM!!! I want to interact with MOTHERS!!! not be judged by yet another man, that does not make me a man-hater, it makes me a woman who wants to interact with other women) so yes, I SIT DOWN... for about three minutes!!! I make sure the boy has washed his bottom, that doesn't mean I stick my nose up his ass, it doesn't mean I'm looking at his penis and fantasizing about him, it doesn't mean I ENJOY embarrassing him or I'm getting off on being in the room with a naked boy, it means, like I already said, I ask him if he has washed his bottom, while he is in the shower, behind the shower curtain, so I know his bottom is clean because he CAN do a good job, but he gets distracted and forgets!!! I ask him if he has washed his hair. If he has not I ask him if he needs help or if it is particularly dirty I just help him, because at THIS POINT he does not have the attention span to focus on his hair while the water is running! I am not concerned about whether he has "special needs" I have repeatedly pointed out HE SHOULD BE DOING IT ON HIS OWN!!! But he gets distracted (because he is a ten year old boy) Why is it those of you judging me feel I should be okay with just allowing my children to stay distracted? He doesn't hang up his back pack, should I just leave it on the middle of the walkway, no, I should remind him it needs to be done, same with his snack when he leaves his plate on the table and the jelly and peanut butter open in my kitchen, should I just leave it? Clean it up for him and say nothing? Not expect him to do anything for himself? Or should I guide him and teach him so that when he is an adult he is not completely helpless because I've done everything for him? I am not hovering, I am not coddling, I am not enabling, I am trying to keep him on track when it comes to his cleanliness. So call me a monster, call me a sicko (might I remind you it was YOU that found wrong in it, making me again wonder why your mind immediately jumps to perversion, but again, you are not being up front about who you are so we cannot report you!) report me for abuse, I know I am not hurting anyone. Your opinion means nothing to me as you can't even show yourself to be intelligent enough to make an argument without making ridiculous accusations and calling names, that's exactly what a person does when they have no valid point!!! Which, by the way, you have proven your point invalid by approving these actions for nudists and "people across the pond" and children with special needs. Each person is an individual, each person learns differently and at a different pace, my son is no exception! You and everyone else here judging, are being narrow minded. None of you are in our homes, none of you are raising our children, none of you are living our lives. I have to give all of YOU the benefit of doubt and assume you are doing your best to parent, how about giving the rest of us the same courtesy and not attacking a woman for asking a question!!!

Barbara - posted on 01/04/2013

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Darrell:
A helicopter mom is one who hovers for fear that her child will need something that he/she isn't capable of providing for him/her self even when they are quite capable. I didn't say is was ok to be a helicopter mom, just that some parents are, particularly some mothers. but fathers can fall into this spectrum as well. In fact, a helicopter parent teaches the child that s/he is incapable of doing for oneself and this attitude breeds insecurities in a child that may hamper them all of their life. It isn't the most positive way to parent, but I'm not here to judge other parents, just offer my take or my view on the problems that are presented here. When the debate becomes heated, no genuine interaction can take place and so it is time for me to gracefully (I hope) bow out and let others handle the discussion. This thread has become very heated with accusations and attacks all around and I don't feel that this is an appropriate way to engage with other parents questions, fears, concerns, or just 'wondering'. I'm far from perfect parent, I've made my own mistakes. as have many, but I'm trying to learn a better, healthier, more positive way to parent my teenage daughter everyday. Sometimes I blow it, other times I'm more successful. Life is a learning process, and NONE of us has ALL the answers, including me.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/04/2013

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Hi Barbara:

I think your contribution to the discussion is very helpful, especially since it is civil.

Because I have a child with special needs, I have been consulting child development specialists on a consistent basis for several years, and I have also been volunteering in special education classrooms for many years. I've also already raised one of my kids - he's 24 now. So maybe I have a different perspective. What I have seen is that each of my three sons have had different needs, different strengths, and have each developed at their own pace, despite two of them being what you would call "typical." There is no one-size-fits-all approach to parenting.

Even among kids with special needs, developmentally they are all over the map. Some are very high functioning and some are very low functioning, Each is affected by their condition differently. In the classroom where I volunteer, some of the kids are very independent, and some are still in diapers. So some might be bathing independently at a young age, and some not.

I know that the child development experts say that the developmental charts are merely a guideline. if a child is not developing within the guideline, it may be a good idea to check to make sure there aren't any underlying problems. If there aren't any, simply figure out what the child needs in terms of skill development, and work on that. It's pointless to have hard a fast rules like, "a child MUST be out of diapers by X years or MUST be self-bathing by X years." It's important to meet the child where he is. It's the pinnacle of respect to accept that your child is a unique individual.

For some families, it might also be cultural. I have noticed that families from different cultures handle child rearing differently and some are more involved with their children than others. I seem to recall reading somewhere that in Japan especially before World War II, in rural communities it was not uncommon for family members to bathe together. It was not sexual, it was practical. This is the closest thing I can find to a link about it: http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan...

Having said that, I am acquainted with families who allow their older children to be quite filthy. I believe that as a parent, it's my responsibility to not tolerate that. There are real consequences to poor hygiene. Whether it's laziness, disrespect, lack of knowledge, lack of ability, ignorance, or whatever the reason, it's my job to figure out what is causing the problem and address it. If I had a ten year old who was not keeping himself clean, and the problem was that he didn't seem to have a grasp on the procedures, I would teach him - and if I felt it was necessary I would give him a bath. However, if I felt there was a better way to do it, I would try that. Some kids just don't have the self awareness to realize that they stink! :)

My special needs child may not ever be able to bathe himself. It's too soon to know for sure. Kids with his condition can be affected to varying degrees and in many different ways, so there is no way to predict. I am acquainted with a woman who is a foster mother to two adults with Down's. One of them is 45 years of age and must be bathed daily. The other one is more independent.

Anyway, the OP may be a helicopter parent, or it may be that this is her first child and she just didn't realize that her son is too old and needs more privacy and independence, or she may have a typical child who is not as independent yet, or it may be cultural. Personally, I am glad that she cares enough about her son to give him a good bath, and cares enough to question whether she should start doing something else. What she is doing may be perfectly normal and appropriate in her child's individual circumstances. I am inclined to wonder at what age did she bathe herself independently? Sometimes we parent the way we were parented.

Barbara - posted on 01/04/2013

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I do think that Susan has a point. If this is a special needs case, or if the boy in question has an issue about hygiene, then maybe mom is just trying to be a good mom. If one or both of these issues isn't the problem, then I think we have a helicopter mom who hovers excessively to assuage her own issues. Either way, none of us really knows here and since concerns raised by others, both appropriately and inappropriately, seem to have ruffled feathers, I can't see where any additional comment from me will be helpful.

Chasmodai - posted on 01/04/2013

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I've read this thread and I think that bathing a a ten year old is not necessarily abuse. It might not be the best thing for the kid, or it might be necessary, but it depends on the kid.

One idea that works well is to make a hygiene chart. It can be laminated so that it won't be ruined if it gets splashed. Make a list of steps to follow, similarly to a chore chart. For younger kids, pictures can be used. The chart can be customized to the needs of the child.

Here are some: http://www.freeprintablebehaviorcharts.c...
http://www.chorecharts.net/preview/Hygie...
http://www.mypersonalhygiene.com/persona...

The goal is for our children to grow up to be as independent as possible. We want them to become adults who know how to care for themselves properly. Have you ever met an adult with poor personal hygiene? Adults with poor personal hygiene can have all sorts of problems as a result. Obviously we can't bathe them until they are 30 so at some point they must learn how to do it for themselves.

We have a 14 year disabled son. We try very hard to do all we can to teach him to bathe himself independently. However, he has been known to flood the bathroom, sit in a tub full of ice cold water, and come out of the tub no cleaner than when he came in. He will use an entire bottle of soap in one bath, waste it down the drain and still not get clean. He has other hygiene problems, as well. The smell can become very offensive. From a health standpoint, it's necessary to supervise this closely. He also has a compromised immune system and his health can be in jeopardy if he is not kept clean. He cannot wash his own hair. If he tries, he only gets the top and sides, and never the back of his head. We have a handle on the situation. Eventually we may need to get an occupational therapist to work with him on his hygiene. My only point is that it depends on the kid.

We also have a 12 year old son who keeps himself pretty clean but still needs to be reminded. His independence has increased gradually. I guess we started to "back away from the bathtub" when he was about 6, but we still needed to supervise somewhat and gradually decreased the supervision over time.

Kids can get fungal infections and other problems if they are not clean. Recently I was standing in line behind a group of adolescent boys at the grocery store. I accidentally got a glimpse into one of the boy's ears. Ugh! My first thought was, "Where is that child's mother?"

We respect our children's privacy, but we have never treated them as if their bodies were "bad" or sexualized them in any way. They are not ashamed of their bodies, and they are not embarrassed if we happen to see them without their clothes. If we do happen to see them without their clothes, we do not react, or become offended. At the same time we teach respect for themselves and others.

We are not a nudist family, but I really think that we have far too many sexual hangups in the USA. Of course sexual exploitation of children is wrong. Exploitation of anyone is wrong. I think it's possible for a family to be open about nudity while protecting their children from sexual or any type of abuse, and still teach appropriate boundaries, and loving and affirming sexual ethics. It's also possible for a family to be extremely modest to the point of being uptight, everybody staying covered all the time- and sexual abuse can still be going on in that family. How long the parents help the child with bathing is not necessarily an indicator of sexual abuse.

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