Can she read?!?

Ashley - posted on 03/23/2009

I also have a similar story my daughter was two and I could hear her talking in her room I wen to the door and stood there in astonishment, my daughter was reading "I Udderly love you" by Kate Toms{one of my favorite books to read} Now she is three and reads Robert munch and level 2 books from the library.  I never pushed it I just read to her every day and followed the words with my finger showing her. Kids under 5 are like sponges I tell ya!

Lauryan - posted on 03/14/2009

oh! right ... I get it...



I think the confusion arose from the fact that although I have tried to teach Aiden to sound out words he thinks I'm just crazy when I read the words "like that" ("No mommy don't read it like that - it sounds silly!")



Thanks Deborah... makes sense now... maybe I was just too tired to "get it" the first time round (maybe I am just silly after all ;) )

Deborah - posted on 03/13/2009

I know why you are confused. The whole site and sight usage. They are really called sight words or the Dolch Word list. On the internet for speed purposes a lot of people shorten it to site.

Sight Words (sometimes called the Dolch Word List) are some of the most frequently used words in the English language. Even though they number only about 200, Sight Words comprise approximately 50 to 70 percent of any given general, non-technical text.

Here is a website that has a word list for sight words:
http://gemini.es.brevard.k12.fl.us/shepp...

Hope that helps. But basically the words in the English language that can not be taught through phonics.

Lauryan - posted on 03/13/2009

maybe it's just me having a fuzzy head moment - someone explain sight and site words to me again please?? :D



hehe

Linda - posted on 03/12/2009

My son got phonics in his first year in school i thought it was a mega fun way of learning and far better than the way my daughters were taught

Yelena - posted on 03/09/2009

Oh one more thing Richard Scheery I dont know how to spell his last name exactly and the book is with my son in pre-k now has an amazing collection.  He makes books of words and children look at the pages and he lables everything.  For the parent it is very interactive and you can find many uses of language in that book.  My son and I probably spend about 10  to 15 minutes on each page and it is great because you show them the words, and you can add your own information about it as well.  So you should look into that collection he has a number of books that I am sure your daughter will enjoy and it is great for early reading and site words

Yelena - posted on 03/09/2009

The only thing that I want to say about the labels is to make them big and colorful.  My house is Blue, Yellow, Orange, Green, and Pink.  What I used is the Post it's from Staples in the Teaching Section.  They are quite large and can fit words.  It was very time consuming to write everything out in big bold letters (they recommend to start with capitols) and then just post away on everything you can find!  If your husband has a machine that makes big signs then great but it would be have to be something that can catch your attention and that you can read from across the room! 

Yelena - posted on 03/09/2009

The only thing that I want to say about the labels is to make them big and colorful.  My house is Blue, Yellow, Orange, Green, and Pink.  What I used is the Post it's from Staples in the Teaching Section.  They are quite large and can fit words.  It was very time consuming to write everything out in big bold letters (they recommend to start with capitols) and then just post away on everything you can find!  If your husband has a machine that makes big signs then great but it would be have to be something that can catch your attention and that you can read from across the room! 

Kylie - posted on 03/09/2009

In Kindergarten here the children are introduced to "sight words" and we are told that they are the 100 most common words in the english language that cannot be sounded out. At my kids school they are given between 10-20 words per week to memorize and learn by sight and it is purely memorization. These are usually the first words children learn unless they are taught phonetically by someone. A great series for learning all the sight words without even realising are the Paul Jennings, Rascal books - both my daughter and son loved them and actually my 3 year old is sitting reading one now.

Kylie - posted on 03/09/2009

In Kindergarten here the children are introduced to "sight words" and we are told that they are the 100 most common words in the english language that cannot be sounded out. At my kids school they are given between 10-20 words per week to memorize and learn by sight and it is purely memorization. These are usually the first words children learn unless they are taught phonetically by someone. A great series for learning all the sight words without even realising are the Paul Jennings, Rascal books - both my daughter and son loved them and actually my 3 year old is sitting reading one now.

Deborah - posted on 03/09/2009

Yelena,

I am jumping to conclusions here that you are talking to me but reading your posts I said the same thing about how your son is so much like my daughter. She, however, does not know muscles yet. LOL Just shows that they have their own unique interests even at this age. The label idea is brilliant! My husband has a label machine at the office so I will have him bring it home and take on that task. He would love doing that one. And I am at the point of not wanting to push her. She is my perfectionist and I feel it would hurt more than help if I push. She needs time to do it on her own.

And thank you for referring to them as 'site words'. I used that concept on another board and was slaughtered. Sight words are words that are not sounded out was the argument and even got a list of what those are. But I argued that she memorized those words from sight and did not sound them out and therefore I call them her 'site words'. So I have gotten into the habit of calling her first read words as memorized words.

Yelena - posted on 03/09/2009

Oh wow she is like a copy of my son.  I had the same situation with him I got him the "Letter Factory" which was a leap frog DVD and it worked great and nobody believed me that at that young of an age they have the concept.  And the common words "Site words" are great that she knows because those make the transition to fully reading much easier.  She will soon be able to go and read on her own.  I am in Speech Pathology so another thing I did was lable everything in my house (literally everything) so he can read what it was and just develope more site words.  I feel as if that helps alot to.  And also there are a few more D.V.D's that are by leapfrog about "Complex words"  and it is just an amazing system my son loves it.  But he does not want to read as much any more either he is much more into art, swimming, and drumming now.  I decided that reading 5 books a night and having him read one independently is more then enough.  But he just started independent reading with me after he turned three so she may be to young.  We have to be very careful to not over push them.  It is hard because we know how capable they are and we want them to do it because we can.  I have to stop myself and realize that he is just three and it very quickly grows from loving to read, to feeling forced and hating to do it!!!

Linda - posted on 03/09/2009

My son could read at 2 it was amazin...he could also sat the alphabet both normal and backwards as well ....i never taught him he learned it or memorised it from a toy he had....he is now 8 and a very bright child ....his school have told me he is a gifted child...but 2 be quite honest i don't like him bein called this as other kids pick up on it and i find they can be bullied just for being bright !!!!!!

Deborah - posted on 03/06/2009

"as soon as my daughter could walk, she was bugging people to read to her. (She would walk over with a book and nag "read! read!" and not go away."

The above does not equal hot-housing. It is the opposite of hot-housing. What you describe is the key factor that needs to be their for the gifted child: drive and determination. I have no issue with that. If the child enjoys flashcards then great. My issue is when the parents set up a curriculum for their baby who has shown no interest in learning it and the other factor is the repetition of the curriculum to get them to memorize it. This results in rote memorization, such as shapes. Going over and over the shapes with a baby/toddler when they have shown no interest in shapes. Yes, eventually they learn the shapes and if you point to the shape they can tell you the shape AKA rote memorization but how long before they can further that knowledge and start looking around at typical things around them and make the connection? Do they do it on their own or does the parent do it for them? When they make that connection it is a sign that they have gone beyond rote memorization.

So yes I am anti-hot-housing but what you described about your DD is anything but hot-housing b/c she came to you seeking out the information.

Zoe - posted on 03/06/2009

Quoting Deborah:

No apologies necessary. I just don't want people thinking that I am force feeding my child in the hopes that she reads. As I read a few posts the idea of pushing or pressuring came up and I just wanted to set the record straight. I am so anti hot-housing. So when posts for such things as yourbabycanread show up it annoys me. I think you see a lot of attempts to make one's child Baby Einstein and I fully disagree with this method. Those ARE the children that even out by 3rd grade.

And actually when I read your post I didn't read it as you saying I was pressuring her. Pressure is bad no matter who it comes from and it sounds like your son definitely got a big dose of it from his teacher. And to say she is strong will is barely touching on Katelyn. She is the bossiest kid I have ever seen and when she fully believes she is right she doesn't back down.

Okay.... so pretend for a moment you have a kid that is developmentally advanced.  And hates phonics.  So flash cards are okay for 2nd grade? Kinder? before kinder?  That's all those programs are.   I think people should get to know a child before they dish out the "hot house" insult.  My sister-in-law is really into unschooling (and had a 2nd grader who couldn't read to prove it) but she is the first to admit that as soon as my daughter could walk, she was bugging people to read to her.  (She would walk over with a book and nag "read! read!" and not go away.  My brother's family lived with us for 92 days and they got it often!)  If a parent thinks their kid is into it, so be it.

Paige - posted on 03/05/2009

That's a good point! My son recognizes certain words and just says them vs. sounding them out first. The other day he was having lunch and drinking out of a cup that had the word juice on it and he looks at me and says "See mommy, this says juice" but I never told him that! But when we're spelling words in the tub using letters, he acts as if he doesn't know what I'm taking about. I think that once a child learns the letter sounds, they CAN put words together fairly easy but my not outloud as it might be an embarassing factor for them! Just as when small children recognize themselves in the mirror, Some laugh and make faces, others shy away.

Deborah - posted on 03/05/2009

Yelena. Thanks for the advice. To answer your question: She knows all her ABCs upper and lower cases and the sound each letter makes. All of this was before she was 18 mths. Letters were her fascination and she would bring letter after letter book to me when she was 9 months old asking what's this?

She also has been introduced to some of the phonics rules but I have no idea if she knows them. (Leapfrog DVD about building words).

And as for the simple words: she knows them. I call those her memorization words. She has seen them enough in books that she knows the words but I consider that the beginnings of reading not necessarily reading. She was doing all of that before she was 2 yrs old.

And we are the reading machines ... at least we use to be. She would bring book after book and we would have to sit and read and read and read to her. They say the average kid gets read to about 1000 hrs by the time they enter Kindergarten. I know we hit that by the time she turned two. But in the last few months she hasn't wanted us to read to her near as much. We still read and probably a little more then the normal child but not near as much as we use to. But I follow her lead and if she wants me to read she brings the books to me.

Lauryan - posted on 03/05/2009

thanks for this awesome tip Yelena :D

Yelena - posted on 03/05/2009

It is hard to tell at that age because they do not have the lexicon to explain to us what they think or their capabilities.  My son is three years old and he is now reading on his own (looking at little books and reading word by word).   If she did something like that you can can but since she does not here are some other things you can do to see if she really knows how to read.  Does she know the letters and the sound.  If she knows the sound then maybe.  As someone involved in speech pathology though I have to also let you know that yummIE and bEAr are complex words because there are two vowels in the word and she would have to know how to read it properly which they technically do not realize until they are taught.  So if she was not taught this by you or someone else she may not be reading.  Also if there was a picture of a bear she may just use that as a context and say bear.  If you really want to see if she is reading write a simple word such as "HAT" on a paper make sure it is capitol since most children recognize those letters and see if she will read it or immitate you if you say it.  If she immitates you or reads it on her own then you can give her a sticker.  Then write another word like "MAT" and see if she will read that on her own when tempted with a sticker.  Really at that age that is all you can do until she sits and reads on her own.  Until then make sure you continue to read to her and explore words when you see them.  Point out names at the market and encourage her growth and knowledge

Kimberly - posted on 03/04/2009

hehehe  My gal would never show off her skills in public either (speaking or reading.)  We finally just stopped asking her to do things so other people could see.  Of course the upside to that is that the behaviors are "intrinsically motivating" for them.  heheh  Maybe that will help sooth our worries that people will think we are nuts.  (My girl is in K because they wouldn't let her hop ahead of her birthday for school....so her K teachers are scrambling to keep her in books while she learns how to be a regular 6 year old. :)  Be happy, k. hartvigsen

Tammy - posted on 03/04/2009

My daughter was an early reader but didn't admit it either.  We didn't call it reading or she would get upset, just referred to it as looking at books or playing letter games.  The less of a deal we made about it the better.  She is 16 now and I was telling someone that she could read before kindergarten but they still wouldn't let her start early (her B day is Sept 20 and the cut off is Sept 1).  She got a weird look on her face and said "you know it's funny, I don't remeber ever not being able to read and I can remember going to Florida right before my second b day and you said that the pool at the hotel was closed but I remeber seeing a sign saying open and being mad at you"  OMG the pool was open I just was too tired to take her lol!

Deborah - posted on 03/04/2009

Great advice Morag and one I have concluded is my best option. But your comment about putting her on the spot and she absolutely refuses reminds me of what I use to say about Ms. Katelyn when she was shy about talking in public. (Are we seeing a pattern here? :P ) She would have long sentences at home but in public hardly say anything. So around friends and extended family I felt like they saw me as a nutty mom or something. It finally got to the point that I would say she is my WB frog. Hello my baby, hello my darling when no one else is around and then ribbet ribbet in front of everyone else. She finally got over most of that. She still doesn't talk to the level she can but her sentences are still head turners. I have to admit: sometimes I need validation that I am not nuts! LOL But really she has gotten a lot better about being herself in public and in fact when she went to dance class she was super excited before class started and wanted all the girls to play with her. She even ran up and hugged a few of them. Not typically Katelyn behavior. She is usually the quiet one that stands back so I see her being more comfortable and coming out of her shell a little.

Morag - posted on 03/04/2009

I would probably say she is reading, but if shes anything like lil miss, she'll refuse to do anything if pinned down :) Lil miss can do some amazing things, but if I ever put her on the spot she'll refuse to do it a lot of the time, if I just slip it in naturally to play, she'll happily comply. The Yummie bears incident seems like a clear sign she can read. Being gifted, she is probably picking up the emotion in your voice concerning the subject and is associating that with some form of anxiety which she then connects with her reading. She then denies reading under the belief that it causes negative emotions in you. Even if this is not the case, children often get the wrong end of the stick where adult emotions are concerned because they are very complex even for gifted children.
I would suggest just not mentioning reading with her. If she is clearly reading, don't comment on it or even make a big thing about it. (Do the private celebration dance when she's left the room :) ) If she sees it as entirely normal and nothing exceptional you might find shes a bit more open about it.

Lauryan - posted on 03/04/2009

wow Deborah - congrats - this is really a great thing. And yes to the perfectionism. I think you are just going to have to let her be for this one until she is comfortable with showing her skills.



Aiden is still "Reading" by memorised repeat back, but here and there sight reads a word and then when I call my hubby to show him, Aiden "reads" the wrong word. It seems deliberate, so I have decided that I will just be very casual and chilled about it. Which is hard cause reading is a BIG THING!

Christy - posted on 03/03/2009

Hi everyone, I haven't posted before, but I figured I'd just jump right in.

My daughter could recognize words by this age too. She is 10 years now and reads at an 11th or 12th grade level. Whether it is phonetic or recognizant it is still pretty exciting to see your child grow and learn. Keep reading to her. That was what mine wanted all the time. Also board games are great and more friendly than DVDs and computer.

This post brought back a funny memory of when my daughter was about 4 we were having lunch with a friend who is a LangArts teacher and her (same age)daughter and her mother at California Pizza Kitchen. My daughter started reading the whole menu aloud. I knew that she could read before this but she had to work at some of these new words on the menu. Needless to say the table was silent.

Savor every moment with your daughter she sounds like a lovely little one, and time passes so quickly.

Deborah - posted on 03/03/2009

Sally: That is hilarious! I could so visualize the happy dance when he left the room. And reading your post made a light go off over my head. Of course she is hiding it. She is my little perfectionist. She drove me nuts with walking. She could walk before she was a year old but refused to do it on her own. We spent hours upon hours walking hand and hand with her. I will never forget Halloween and walking door to door of course hand and hand. Everyone was amazed at what a good walker she was but I kept arguing that she isn't technically walking since she won't let go of my hand. So finally two weeks later on my wedding anniversary she gave us the gift of walking on her own. Let go and walked like she had been doing it for years. She was 14 months old at that point. She had a strange knack for doing big milestones on our anniversary. The year before she was not quite 3 months and is when she decided to say her first word: elephant.

So thanks for the light bulb. I really think her issue is perfectionism. And I will have to wait it out and see. Maybe I can have someone challenge her but I really think she just needs her space to perfect the reading until she is comfortable with it.

Sally - posted on 03/03/2009

We had the same questions with our oldest when he was 2 1/2. We were almost positive he could read but still doubted ourselves a little. When he was almost 3 our friend who also is a mother of strong willed children challenged him one day while we were visiting her and he got irritated with her and read a sentence from a magazine cover just to prove to her that he could. Then proceeded to read the names off of just about everything in her kitchen cupboard just in case she still had any doubts about his ability. We did our best to calmly and cheerfully congratulate him and when he walked out of the room smiling, we all laughed and did a little celebration dance when he couldn't see. Eventually she will want everyone to know how good she is at it just give her time to be sure or maybe find a friend to give her a good challenge:). Good Luck.

Rebekah - posted on 03/03/2009

Hey Deborah, I know I said something I couple of times about not sitting her down, but I *do* know your feelings on hot housing, and I meant it in more of a don't worry about it, don't feel like you have to give her formal instruction, you'll figure it all out kind of way. Sorry if it seemed differently. Guess that's the problem with having conversations with posts over a couple of days. And I usually just click and post without re-reading because I'm in a hurry. I'll try to post some more ideas for you soon, btw.

Nicole - posted on 03/02/2009

My older son very much likes others know how how smart he is and will show off every chance he gets. However, my younger son, who is now 5, does not care if you think he is smart or what he knows. We used to try to get him to do the alphabet and he would refuse, but then I would catch him saying it to himself while washing his hands. We didn't know he was reading until he climbed up on my lap and read the first 11 pages of a book. We don't push it with either child. I support their accomplishments, but don't make a huge deal. I don't want them to be defined by how smart they are, or are presumed to be. There is so much more to my little men.

Deborah - posted on 03/02/2009

No apologies necessary. I just don't want people thinking that I am force feeding my child in the hopes that she reads. As I read a few posts the idea of pushing or pressuring came up and I just wanted to set the record straight. I am so anti hot-housing. So when posts for such things as yourbabycanread show up it annoys me. I think you see a lot of attempts to make one's child Baby Einstein and I fully disagree with this method. Those ARE the children that even out by 3rd grade.

And actually when I read your post I didn't read it as you saying I was pressuring her. Pressure is bad no matter who it comes from and it sounds like your son definitely got a big dose of it from his teacher. And to say she is strong will is barely touching on Katelyn. She is the bossiest kid I have ever seen and when she fully believes she is right she doesn't back down.

Kylie - posted on 03/02/2009

Oops sorry Deborah, I didn't mean to infer you were pressuring her (just reread my post). My gripe was with my son's Kindy teacher, which I am only just realising the extent of the affect she has had on him due to another episode yesterday where he had a "meltdown" in class due to his complete fear of not finishing the work on time (he didn't have a pencil to write with and the teacher had left the room and everyone was almost finished by the time she returned and he obviously couldn't start without it) - thankfully his new teacher reassured him that she does not become upset if that happens.

Katelyn sounds very charming, independent and from what you have written has a reasonably strong will, which from a mother of 2 extremely strong willed children, is where I was coming from in terms of the when she is ready part.

Deborah - posted on 03/02/2009

I really am trying not to pressure her with reading. At the age of two does it really matter? No, not at all but it is the moments like described above and many others that I can't help but question if she is. It also might be a sign of her personality in general and stuff to look for when she is in school. I also really don't want her taking it as me pressuring her. I always follow her lead. If she is interested in numbers then great we play with the concept of numbers. If she isn't interested in any concept. Fine too ... she can just play but that rarely happens because she is always bringing something into her play.

And Rebekah ... the idea of phonics and highly gifted kids is documented that for the most part highly gifted kids tend to memorize and don't really like the phonics system. The logic is that at some point they will get stuck and have to rely on phonics but that could be years down the road. So once realizing that information I didn't even bother with phonics but here lately she has been sounding out some words so back it came.

It is reassuring that she isn't the odd ball in her hiding game. When she is ready to let me in then great but I certainly don't plan to push that she prove it to me.

Missy - posted on 03/02/2009

My son is four and acts much like this. He can read anything three, four letters, and some larger words, and I catch him at it - he'll sit in his bed and read Dr. Seuss and think I can't hear him, but if I ever say anything he refuses to admit to it. He also won't read with me - I'll point to a word and ask him what it says and he says "I don't remember that word."

Rebekah - posted on 03/02/2009

I think the semantics of whether reading is defined by recognizing words that you've seen before vs. phonetically reading them is an interesting one. I kind of think we're short changing them to say that they're not reading, when really, what they're doing is not reading in the same way that other children learn to read. They are reading like adults. When I read, I don't sound out words that I'm already familiar with. In fact, it's rare in my daily reading that I come across a word that I don't know how to spell, pronounce and define. Now, I'm all for teaching phonics (Interesting side note: at some point in the 70s apparently phonics fell out of favor and my husband was not taught this at school. He is to this day terrible at sounding out words) and we have some heated discussions about phonics in our house, mainly because so many English words don't follow the rules, and because there are SO many vowel combination variations, let alone the arguments involving S and C or C and K!

Kylie - posted on 03/01/2009

My closest friend is a child psych and she pointed out my daughter was reading at 2 - we still debate this! I was self taught at 3 so it wasn't a real surprise but honestly she never sat down and read a book until Kindy (she started 3 weeks after turning 5) and then was reading books like Black Beauty etc by her 6th birthday. The teacher asked if she could read and I answered no as I had never formally tested her: I always rationalised it to myself as rote memory not actual reading (I obviously now accept she was reading before school and she did admit to this once the teacher questioned her).

And even though she read very well and very early (and is still 7 years above grade level), the enjoyment of reading (which to an avid reader like myself  - is by far the most important part of reading) did not happen until mid Grade 1 and now it is her favourite past time. I'm hoping the same happens for my son, who turns 6 next week. He refused to read because he felt so much pressure and once I really removed the pressure (as best I could as it came from his teacher - and he was in the highest reading group and the youngest in class!!!), he jumped 3 grade (not book) levels within 3 weeks - so you will probably find that when Katelyn is ready she will happily start reading - privately and publicly.

Kimberly - posted on 03/01/2009

We bought a leap pad for my girl about that age and she was the same way.  I think the key is to not force it.  She will read what and when she wants and it will be her secret delight rather than something to have a power-struggle with mom over.  She obviously doesn't need you to make a big deal about it as it is motivating in and of itself.  I would let her be....and check out lots of books from the library for her to enjoy secretly. hehehe k. hartvigsen (P.S.  My kindergartener of the leap pad came home on Friday and said her teacher told her she was reading the 4th grade books. :)  Let her do it herself.)

Deborah - posted on 03/01/2009

Thanks Rebekah ... so I'm not the only one! LOL I swear I scratch my head on some of this and think I must be nuts.

The picking letters out in the grocery store I use to do with her but not so much now but I think the spelling words idea is one I will give a try. And the leapfrog dvd is how she learned the sounds of each letter but that was a while ago and now she really doesn't care to watch those dvds. She also has the letter whammy but never uses it so it clutters the fridge and I am ready to just get rid of it.

But yes ... always looking for some idea so keep them coming!

Rebekah - posted on 03/01/2009

I think the Yummie bears proves that she is reading. I had been telling my husband for a while that Henry was reading and he would come up with excuses and explanations to say that he wasn't. Then after a few incidents similar to yours he finally realized.



I would say, don't push it if she's not interested. She's obviously figuring out what she needs already. For whatever the reason that she is reluctant I would just not make a big deal of it. What I would do is just keep reading to her and try to get new/different books from the library to expose her to more different words. Find some easy readers and let her look through them before you read them to her and see what she does. Henry could read for a long time before he would read TO me, but he would bring me a book in the library and ask me to read it to him and call it by the title. LOL. The other thing you can do is to figure out some games that use reading skills but don't require her to read, per se. Or, in other words, try to out-sneak your sneaky reader. One game that Henry liked at her age was to find something starting with each letter of the alphabet when we're grocery shopping. Sometimes it's an actual item (Apple, Banana), sometimes we do words on signs (Exit, Sale). Another variation is to find letters in words on signs to spell another word, so spell Elephant by finding those letters in order. He would pick some really funny words. I know she already recognizes letters, but it will still encourage her to read things around her and you can point out lots of words she might not know yet. The other thing I would do is stop at the end of a sentence or page when I was reading to him right before the last word or two and have him complete the sentence. He happens to be very good at visualizing words without actually reading them, so we'd also often do games like "what if you took the c off of cat and put a b there?" We'd write or say groups of rhyming words.



I don't usually buy this type of thing, but on the recommendation of a friend we got the Leapfrog Letter Factory DVD and the Word Whammer with magnetic letters. He LOVED both of them, although I did find them somewhat annoying, he was really into spelling words for the longest time before he was "reading." We also got a subscription to Tessy and Tab, which he loved getting in the mail and was just the right level for this last year. Let me know if you want some other suggestions.