Sick of people judging young moms based on statistics!

[deleted account] ( 97 moms have responded )

I am 20 and the mom of an 18 month old. I am sick of reading comments from people who think all young mothers are crappy. I love my son, work, and go to college full time while carrying a 4.0. What give people the right to judge. Their own children are proply doing things they don't even know about behind their back, but instead of paying attention to them, they want to trash other young moms. Just venting. Feel free to add your thoughts!!!!

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[deleted account]

Jamie, you can educate a person all you want, but it is ultimately up to that individual to use what they are taught. There are many women out there that have the knowledge yet still throw caution to the wind. And yes, there are many women out there who are not properly educated in the matter, but that is beside the point--whether or not someone ends up on welfare really is that person's business. Have you ever lost a job, suddenly couldn't make ends meet, and then found out you were pregnant? Or worse, something happened to you or your spouse and now you have half the income and half the stability? If not, you really have no room to talk. Everyone's circumstances are different. Do not assume in this world (and this economy especially) that those who take government assistance in any way shape or form are always the teen mother, always the unstable individual, or the uneducated. Again, like I said--everyone's circumstances are different.

As far as stability is concerned: no one is ever truly stable in every sense of the word. You can always use/need more money to raise a child, and even "if" you do--things happen and you could loose all of it in a short period of time. Just ask anyone who has suffered a loss, medical problems, or lost a job. Also, you can never really gauge how emotionally stable you will be when you have children until you have them. There are perfectly sane women out there that cannot handle the reality of having kids, and there are perfectly sane women who end up developing postpartum depression. There are so many things that can happen, that you really just cannot assume that everything will remain in its ideal state. And finally, from a biological stand point, the best physical time to have children is during the early 20's, when many of us are still "unstable".

[deleted account]

Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.


Actually, I have a PhD in Computational Neurophysiology (at the age of 25 while raising a young child, no less) and work in cerebellar research, which requires a strong mathematics background.  What have YOU to show for your life besides your ignorant judgments?  Your pathetic attempt at insulting me only illustrates both your complete lack of understanding of simple mathematics, statistics, and your utterly repulsive boorish behavior. 

Jessica - posted on 05/20/2009

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Jamie, I have seen you in other posts and you are straight up rude and offensive. Why are you in these board if you are so much better than everyone. These groups are made to be a support and help moms, not for people to pass judgement.

I had my first son at the age of 18, my husband and I had saved enough money through my pregnancy to buy a condo and moved out. Without gov. assistance and from hard work and education we started our family at a young age. We have completely dedicated and gave ourselves up to have our family. By the age of 21 we had three beautiful boys and moved into a home. We are financially stable and more well off than most people who waited and look down on us, he is in the pipefitters union and has all the benefits any family would want or need. I own a small natural products company with my sister and am able to stay home with my 3 children. My children are loved, provided for, safe, and fed. So am I good enough for you, have I passed your test?

Amie - posted on 05/06/2009

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Jamie, I think you missed the point of this post. Yes statistics don't lie BUT a lot of us get judged based on those and lump us with the rest. It really is annoying and can be quite the piss off.

Leslie, I remember the feeling all to well and still have to put up with the same crap. I turned 27 this past January. I have 4 kids. My oldest will be 9 in July, my youngest is a month old. When my fiance and I go out we get looks and people are always asking us Are they all yours? My gosh you're so young! How do you handle it? I "handle it" quite well thank you! My hubby and I make a great income, we own our home, multiple vehicles, our finances are in order, our wills are in place, we have RRSP's, college funds for our kids, etc. We both work for all of these things, as did my parents and his parents. Our parents instilled great morals in us and a strong sense of family. Our oldest two are not his biologically but you would know no different since their biological dad is no longer in the picture by his own choice. Either way though I've worked my butt off for my kids and my fiance now does the same. Just because I started young doesn't mean I sit on my butt and go oh poor me it's so hard. Yes it is hard but I get up and do it every day and would not change any of it. =) Lumping me with the rest of the dead beats is just not right. You do not know me or my situation. Try taking a step back and thinking before passing judgment or better yet, keep your mouths shut.

Nicole - posted on 05/23/2009

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I think its wrong that people get judged, i get judged all the time. I am 26 and have a 5yr old a 3yr old and am 6 mths preg. I think that most women know when they are ready to have kids, i did.
I was 19 when i met my partner we were both working (in the same place) we got together and a month later we were talking about kids. we got preg 3 months later i was only 20.
We are only renting, only my partner works, we are not married yet but we are extremely happy, our children are extremely happy, our kids are our world, we plan on getting married next year. You cant judge people by age or how the live financially, because you dont know the whole story.

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Jacqui - posted on 05/23/2009

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Hi Leslie i agree with u i had my first child at 19 and had so many people tell me that i would never get anywhere in life, i loved my son and i managed to stay at uni and i am now 24 a registered div 1 nurse and a mother of 2. I don;t think that we should have been judged i have seen mums as old as 30 do things that i would never do to my children and i feel it doesn't matter if u r 18 of 35 when u r a first time mum it is a learning thing nobody is perfect and we all do what works for us. Yes having children young can be tough but isnt it at any age? I love both my children and would never want to change that i had them young

Julie - posted on 05/23/2009

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hi,im 27 and got 4 children and get judged nearly every day,a couple of times people have rudely asked me if they are all my children,they say "they arn't all your children are they" how rude is that,what gets on my nerves the most is they do not even know me.And i know sometimes people are just making conversation but i get fed up of them saying you have got your hands full havnt you.There has been a couple of times where i have had to feed my daughter in a supermarket so you can image having a 6yr,5yr,2yr old keeping them happy is quite hard,but when people are passing you they say god love how do you cope,your brave.I think they are so rude.I could go on and on but i better not ha,i just think its wrong how people judge young moms.Good luck with college and take care Leslie.xx

[deleted account]

Thanks to everyone who has been writing on this thread with the intent of supporting young mothers. You guys are great. Hope everyone keep writing and supporting each other on this thread and others.

[deleted account]

Shalaina, my dear, you are absolutely right. The sad part about it is I was trying to drive home another subtle point, which you and the others pick up on (yay!)--you can't educate someone who refuses to be educated. Unfortunately that's the scientist in me, constantly trying to drive in a point or prove my hypothesis. Old habits die hard, I guess. LOL

Thank you ladies for all of the support, and thank you Leslie for starting this thread--it really helps many of us to know that we are not alone in our struggles. This is the real reason why many of us are here at CoM in the first place: support and understanding.

Shalaina - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Loureen:

In regards to Jamie and her comments ( which i found rude and offensive ) its sad to see someone who apparently works helping families ( an hounorable job ) come onto a young mothers website and do the exact opposite , diss young mums , put down people from a lower economic bracket and and is blatently rude to a mother who has done amazing things with her life ( rachael ) have you got a chip on your shoulder or do you really think your so much better than everyone else ?


Loureen, you took the words out of my mouth. I couldn't believe that she had this great job with helping young mothers and then comes here and talks so bad about them. Jamie truly amazes me. Rachel, I would give up on trying to get through to her.  You are a brilliant mother and were nice to try and prove a point to her but she's being childish, not quite acting her age it seems. I thought your way of proving statistics are not always the way to go was great and really appreciated the thought you put into it. If I was Jamie I think I would have gotten it! Oh well! Leslie you sound like an awesome Mom yourself, just keep it up. I'm 24, married and due with our first in July. I get looks because I seriously look as if I am 16 and a couple people thought I was too young to have a child (in my family no less)....but my husband and I decided the time was right. Even though we are still finishing up school (taking my last class right now!), we have been living on our own for over 3 years now and taking care of ourselves. Oh...we are receiving WIC to buy milk, juice, cereal, etc and when the baby is here formula...sorry Jamie for using my resources to help out. It's only for a little while though while he finds the job he wants after graduation.

Shalaina - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Loureen:

In regards to Jamie and her comments ( which i found rude and offensive ) its sad to see someone who apparently works helping families ( an hounorable job ) come onto a young mothers website and do the exact opposite , diss young mums , put down people from a lower economic bracket and and is blatently rude to a mother who has done amazing things with her life ( rachael ) have you got a chip on your shoulder or do you really think your so much better than everyone else ?


Loureen, you took the words out of my mouth. I couldn't believe that she had this great job with helping young mothers and then comes here and talks so bad about them. Jamie truly amazes me. Rachel, I would give up on trying to get through to her.  You are a brilliant mother and were nice to try and prove a point to her but she's being childish, not quite acting her age it seems. I thought your way of proving statistics are not always the way to go was great and really appreciated the thought you put into it. If I was Jamie I think I would have gotten it! Oh well! Leslie you sound like an awesome Mom yourself, just keep it up. I'm 24, married and due with our first in July. I get looks because I seriously look as if I am 16 and a couple people thought I was too young to have a child (in my family no less)....but my husband and I decided the time was right. Even though we are still finishing up school (taking my last class right now!), we have been living on our own for over 3 years now and taking care of ourselves. Oh...we are receiving WIC to buy milk, juice, cereal, etc and when the baby is here formula...sorry Jamie for using my resources to help out. It's only for a little while though while he finds the job he wants after graduation.

Veronica - posted on 05/21/2009

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It is crap, I now 26 was 17 when i had my first, I was treated like crap in the hospital because i was a young mum that wasn't married. I have two girls 9 and 6 and i think i have done a pretty good job for how young i was, I am still with the father of both because they are questions ya get from people who find out how old ya were we doing well, been together 10yrs in june, As they say age doesn't matter it depends on the person.

[deleted account]

Very true, and a very valid point. There are a number of studies and statistics that show negative effects on children including child abuse/child murder from combined families, where both parents work full time, and even being children of military personnel. There are just as many studies that also show negative effects on marriage for being involved in the same three topics. Now, does this mean that everyone who is in a combined family, has two full-time working parents, or military personnel is going to experience any of the negative attributes reported in these studies? Of course not. Is it likely that everyone within the situations listed will experience any of the negative attributes? No. Will some? Probably, but not everyone. In reality, it's the percentage of that sample population given in those studies that had those effects, and it's unfair to judge everyone based upon these numbers. Once again, it's the faulty generalizations and conclusions drawn from these studies that can cause these unfair judgments on people.

Jessica - posted on 05/21/2009

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Jamie, I think the point you are missing is that their are many good young moms and to group all young moms into 1 category and to think that all young moms are bad is wrong. I give everyone a chance and see who people are before making a judgement. One of the best mothers I know is a single mom of a 4 year old, she had her when she was 18. She is in school full time, works full time, and has an amazing relationship with her daughter. She is a bartender and lives in affordable housing. She is a better parent than many that I know that waited to have children. Meeting new and different people makes you wiser and being so judgemental truly limits you. You will also teach this entitlement attitude to your daughter, which I consider the worst personality trait.

When I had my 1st child it was not planned but my husband and I have taken full responsibilty for our decisions and still managed to complete our goals. We are completely dedicated to our family and income has nothing to do with parenting. We bought a condo after having our 1st son my husband was making decent money but only enough to cover the bills, he got into the pipefitters union and makes a great wage and on top of that his company provides a work truck with gas card, an additional 10$ an hour to retirement/pension, and provides us with great healthcare. I would assume that he makes more than your husband and your amazing self. Being more well off has not changed my parenting or how well we can parent. I have been poor and middle class and my children are treated the same and I am the same parent.

There are many judgements people could make about you and your family and I would hope that people are open to you and don't immediatly judge you. No one is perfect, you are young just like the rest of us, your husband is divorced and has a child from a previous marriage, people judge military families in a certain way, and you both work full time.

[deleted account]

Quoting Rachael:

I thought I'd do a little study based upon this thread:

Data set: 1245CST "Sick of people..." conversation thread
The numbers reported are absolute, and not normalized data. Significance cannot be shown.

Total # replies: 168
---of which are Jamie's: 12 (17.65%)

Total # direct responses to Jamie: 16 (23.53%)
---of which are negative in response (state disagreement): 14 (87.5%)
---of which are neutral: 1 (6.25%)
---of which are positive: 1 (6.25%)

Total # of post respondents: 30
---of which replied directly to Jamie: 7 (23.3%)
---of which state Jamie is "judgmental": 6 (85.71%)
---of which are neutral respondents (posted but did not reply directly to Jamie): 23 (76.67%)

Total number of indirect replies that judgment based on statistics is a negative attribute: 40 (58.82%)
Total number of replies that are neutral: 1 (1.47%)
Total number of "Other" replies: 27 (39.7%)

According to the data, the conclusion must be drawn that the majority of the population who responded to the post feel that making judgments based upon statistics is a negative attribute (58.82%). Of the people who responded directly to Jamie's posts, the vast majority (87.5%) both disagree with her replies and have stated that she has a judgmental attitude (85.71%). The overall conclusion is, based upon these numbers, Jamie is judgmental person and is received negatively by the sample population.


There, Jamie, now how do YOU like being judged by statistics?

Seeing as you are likely to miss my point (again... reporting: 100% of your responses), I'll illustrate it for you. What do these numbers actually say about you? Absolutely nothing. It doesn't tell us anything about you, your circumstances, or who you are as a person. It only provides us a small glimmer of information about you based upon your responses and the sample population here. To judge you based upon this numbers without actually really knowing anything about you would be incredibly unfair. You are not a number, you're a person. Despite your behavior here, your insults, and even going as far as accusing me of fabricating my PhD-- I'm still willing to give the benefit of the doubt that you're actually a lovely person in real life. These conversations or numbers say nothing about you, which is why it is so reprehensible to judge people based on them.

Stats are based upon a given population's data, and it is generally assumed that a given population is random. However, this does not always happen--this leads to skewed data and a population bias, resulting in a faulty conclusion. Misinterpretation of these numbers is what leads to many of the faulty generalizations that people draw from the data set, causing a complete misunderstanding of what the data is actually trying to say. As a scientist, I deal with this ALL THE TIME and it is frustrating. This cute little cartoon illustrates this (literally): http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive....

All and all, you are entitled to your opinion and no one here is trying to get you to change that. What we have been trying to do is to get you to at least see where we're coming from, and to see us eye-to-eye. Up until this point, no one has made any personal attacks against you or has outright insulted you, and there is no reason for you to even continue to do so. Just because we don't agree with you, it doesn't mean that we don't understand where you're coming from, and it doesn't mean that any of us have to get downright nasty about it. Your attacks were downright hateful when there was absolutely no reason for it what-so-ever. We're here to be supportive and to educate, not to be hateful or attacking. If that's what your intentions are (and I'm not saying they are), please go somewhere else.



You have made some really good points Rachael! 



Jamie,  This conversation is meant for young mothers who need to vent about the judgement they recieve for having children at their age. I do not start this for people such as yourself to be ugly and attack those who don't agree with you. I am pretty sure eveyone here for the most part does not think children younger then 18 should have kids, but its happens and we should support them, not tear them down.  I had my son at 18. I am one of people you so greatly judge...



 



I started this post just venting my frustration about people like you, Jamie, thinking I am to young to be a mom and care for my child.  This had nothing to do with 13 year old mothers that have to see u unfortunately for help. 

[deleted account]

Quoting Jamie:



Quoting Leslie:




Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.








How can you judge her for using mathmatical facts regarding statistics and correlations when you base your opinions of young mothers on statistics.  If you are going to base your opinions on such informaiton don't put people down for pointing out that you are basing your information on a mathmatical comparison that does infact have misleading properties.  You do not need to google informaiton on variables and correlations to have an understanding of them. They teach such information in college algebra and psychology 101.  It is rather sad to see that you have to cut down other people to defend your beliefs rather than defend your beliefs with facts. 








      









If youd like to see facts come to my office and Ill be more then happy to show you facts. You can see how many cases come across my desk where a mother cant care for her kids. and you can see how many are young moms. Heck I have moms come in that arent even old enough to drive. So while you want numbers I can show you an office full of numbers. How about Colin, 2, his mom is 17, she didnt want to feed him a lot becaue he would weigh to much for her to carry. Hes now behind on walking and has a feeding tube. SO yes I do know what Im talking about. Because sadly a lot of young moms think they know what they are doing or they can handle it, and when that baby pops out they havent got a clue.






You see a percentage of young women who need help with caring for their children. I agree that it is not a good thing for a 13-17 year old to get pregnant, however I dont believe in passing judgement on them and I don't believe that they would have been abusive to their children if people who are supposed to help would do their jobs.  Lets face it...my generation and even younger generations are being brought up on watching TV and playing on the internet. A lot of parents are too busy to be involed like they should be in their childrens lives. Most parent leave the school to educate children and teens on sex. So if you want to judge anyone...you should judge their parents.  Secondly, I understand u see a negative side of young pregnancy, but there plently of young mom's who make it and provide for their children in a healthy and happy environment.  I promise you, that if you delt with older married mothers who are divorced, you would see many abused and hurt children.  Hospital are reporting a rise in child abuse in families due the stress of the economy.  I people on hear understand were you are coming from, but you make point in a very ugly way that is mean. I hope you are not like this with the girls you see.



By the way.. how does anyone even know you deal with pregnant teens all day...you could be lying..just like you claim Rach is...

[deleted account]

Quoting Emily:

People judge based on statistics all the time. Stereotypes exist for a reason. If a sizable percentage of young mothers consistently make mistakes then as a young mother you must go out of your way to prove that you are an exception. It's just the way it is. I had to do the same thing when I was a young mother even though I was 22 when I had my first and had a college degree. Perhaps you shouldn't have to but it doesn't change the fact that until you prove otherwise people will see what they expect to see.


I agree with you. Don't mind their comments/attitude and prove their prejudice wrong.

Charlie - posted on 05/21/2009

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In regards to Jamie and her comments ( which i found rude and offensive ) its sad to see someone who apparently works helping families ( an hounorable job ) come onto a young mothers website and do the exact opposite , diss young mums , put down people from a lower economic bracket and and is blatently rude to a mother who has done amazing things with her life ( rachael ) have you got a chip on your shoulder or do you really think your so much better than everyone else ?

[deleted account]

That's funny. If you don't care what I have to say then why, oh why do you keep responding to my posts? Go live in the real world, have fun there...oh wait, you're stuck here just having to have something to say back.



And by the way, prove that I've googled anything. Seriously, post my search history and IP log for the world to see. Oh wait, you can't, now can you?

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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No not illiterate, Just didnt care to read your entire post, ok most of your post, ok so like 90%. All you do is google stuff and I can do that myself. So happy googling, ill go be a"complete idiot and a nasty hateful person". You keep living in the computer world, while I deal with the real world.

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Acutally dont care what you have to say, over it about 12 hours ago. Im not illiterate, just not interested in what you wrote. So happy googling.

[deleted account]

Really? Is that the best you can do? Are you completely illiterate--can you not read? I was actually trying to make amends with you. But it's clear that you just want to fight. Fine, have fun. You will just continue to make yourself look like a complete idiot and a nasty, hateful person. And if that helps you sleep better at night, then good for you!

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Rachael:

I thought I'd do a little study based upon this thread:

Data set: 1245CST "Sick of people..." conversation thread
The numbers reported are absolute, and not normalized data. Significance cannot be shown.

Total # replies: 168
---of which are Jamie's: 12 (17.65%)

Total # direct responses to Jamie: 16 (23.53%)
---of which are negative in response (state disagreement): 14 (87.5%)
---of which are neutral: 1 (6.25%)
---of which are positive: 1 (6.25%)

Total # of post respondents: 30
---of which replied directly to Jamie: 7 (23.3%)
---of which state Jamie is "judgmental": 6 (85.71%)
---of which are neutral respondents (posted but did not reply directly to Jamie): 23 (76.67%)

Total number of indirect replies that judgment based on statistics is a negative attribute: 40 (58.82%)
Total number of replies that are neutral: 1 (1.47%)
Total number of "Other" replies: 27 (39.7%)

According to the data, the conclusion must be drawn that the majority of the population who responded to the post feel that making judgments based upon statistics is a negative attribute (58.82%). Of the people who responded directly to Jamie's posts, the vast majority (87.5%) both disagree with her replies and have stated that she has a judgmental attitude (85.71%). The overall conclusion is, based upon these numbers, Jamie is judgmental person and is received negatively by the sample population.


There, Jamie, now how do YOU like being judged by statistics?

Seeing as you are likely to miss my point (again... reporting: 100% of your responses), I'll illustrate it for you. What do these numbers actually say about you? Absolutely nothing. It doesn't tell us anything about you, your circumstances, or who you are as a person. It only provides us a small glimmer of information about you based upon your responses and the sample population here. To judge you based upon this numbers without actually really knowing anything about you would be incredibly unfair. You are not a number, you're a person. Despite your behavior here, your insults, and even going as far as accusing me of fabricating my PhD-- I'm still willing to give the benefit of the doubt that you're actually a lovely person in real life. These conversations or numbers say nothing about you, which is why it is so reprehensible to judge people based on them.

Stats are based upon a given population's data, and it is generally assumed that a given population is random. However, this does not always happen--this leads to skewed data and a population bias, resulting in a faulty conclusion. Misinterpretation of these numbers is what leads to many of the faulty generalizations that people draw from the data set, causing a complete misunderstanding of what the data is actually trying to say. As a scientist, I deal with this ALL THE TIME and it is frustrating. This cute little cartoon illustrates this (literally): http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive....

All and all, you are entitled to your opinion and no one here is trying to get you to change that. What we have been trying to do is to get you to at least see where we're coming from, and to see us eye-to-eye. Up until this point, no one has made any personal attacks against you or has outright insulted you, and there is no reason for you to even continue to do so. Just because we don't agree with you, it doesn't mean that we don't understand where you're coming from, and it doesn't mean that any of us have to get downright nasty about it. Your attacks were downright hateful when there was absolutely no reason for it what-so-ever. We're here to be supportive and to educate, not to be hateful or attacking. If that's what your intentions are (and I'm not saying they are), please go somewhere else.



Again its good to see you know how to google. Everyone should be resourceful.

Kerry - posted on 05/21/2009

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i had my baby daughter Ruby 5 months ago.i am 20 years old,fell pregnant at 19.me and my partner have been together nearly 3 years.im always getting judged for being a "young mum".but my doc said its best to try for a baby at 19 if your happy in a relationship than to wait til your in your 30's as you have a less chance of conceiving.my partner works 5-7 days a week and i worked until i was 8months pregnant.yes we do struggle but ruby NEVER goes without! shes always got nice clothes on,food in her tummy and a roof over her head.young mums can be brill mums,sometimes better then "older mums".just depends on many factors in a womans life.

[deleted account]

I thought I'd do a little study based upon this thread:

Data set: 1245CST "Sick of people..." conversation thread
The numbers reported are absolute, and not normalized data. Significance cannot be shown.

Total # replies: 168
---of which are Jamie's: 12 (17.65%)

Total # direct responses to Jamie: 16 (23.53%)
---of which are negative in response (state disagreement): 14 (87.5%)
---of which are neutral: 1 (6.25%)
---of which are positive: 1 (6.25%)

Total # of post respondents: 30
---of which replied directly to Jamie: 7 (23.3%)
---of which state Jamie is "judgmental": 6 (85.71%)
---of which are neutral respondents (posted but did not reply directly to Jamie): 23 (76.67%)

Total number of indirect replies that judgment based on statistics is a negative attribute: 40 (58.82%)
Total number of replies that are neutral: 1 (1.47%)
Total number of "Other" replies: 27 (39.7%)

According to the data, the conclusion must be drawn that the majority of the population who responded to the post feel that making judgments based upon statistics is a negative attribute (58.82%). Of the people who responded directly to Jamie's posts, the vast majority (87.5%) both disagree with her replies and have stated that she has a judgmental attitude (85.71%). The overall conclusion is, based upon these numbers, Jamie is judgmental person and is received negatively by the sample population.


There, Jamie, now how do YOU like being judged by statistics?

Seeing as you are likely to miss my point (again... reporting: 100% of your responses), I'll illustrate it for you. What do these numbers actually say about you? Absolutely nothing. It doesn't tell us anything about you, your circumstances, or who you are as a person. It only provides us a small glimmer of information about you based upon your responses and the sample population here. To judge you based upon this numbers without actually really knowing anything about you would be incredibly unfair. You are not a number, you're a person. Despite your behavior here, your insults, and even going as far as accusing me of fabricating my PhD-- I'm still willing to give the benefit of the doubt that you're actually a lovely person in real life. These conversations or numbers say nothing about you, which is why it is so reprehensible to judge people based on them.

Stats are based upon a given population's data, and it is generally assumed that a given population is random. However, this does not always happen--this leads to skewed data and a population bias, resulting in a faulty conclusion. Misinterpretation of these numbers is what leads to many of the faulty generalizations that people draw from the data set, causing a complete misunderstanding of what the data is actually trying to say. As a scientist, I deal with this ALL THE TIME and it is frustrating. This cute little cartoon illustrates this (literally): http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive....

All and all, you are entitled to your opinion and no one here is trying to get you to change that. What we have been trying to do is to get you to at least see where we're coming from, and to see us eye-to-eye. Up until this point, no one has made any personal attacks against you or has outright insulted you, and there is no reason for you to even continue to do so. Just because we don't agree with you, it doesn't mean that we don't understand where you're coming from, and it doesn't mean that any of us have to get downright nasty about it. Your attacks were downright hateful when there was absolutely no reason for it what-so-ever. We're here to be supportive and to educate, not to be hateful or attacking. If that's what your intentions are (and I'm not saying they are), please go somewhere else.

Courtney - posted on 05/21/2009

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I agree with you! not all young Moms are BAD! I had two kids by the time I was 20 and I was single. I take care of my kids they are the best thing that could have ever happened to me! I am 28 now but I still get looks from people! Like at school when I take my kids to school all the other Mom's stare at me. Actually today I had lunch at school with my 8 year old and one of the teachers asked me and my daughter if I was her sister! I guess it could be a compliment? It sounds like you are doing everything right and you just have to not care what other people think! It def. can be a struggle sometimes but hang in there!

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Leslie:



Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.






How can you judge her for using mathmatical facts regarding statistics and correlations when you base your opinions of young mothers on statistics.  If you are going to base your opinions on such informaiton don't put people down for pointing out that you are basing your information on a mathmatical comparison that does infact have misleading properties.  You do not need to google informaiton on variables and correlations to have an understanding of them. They teach such information in college algebra and psychology 101.  It is rather sad to see that you have to cut down other people to defend your beliefs rather than defend your beliefs with facts. 






      





If youd like to see facts come to my office and Ill be more then happy to show you facts. You can see how many cases come across my desk where a mother cant care for her kids. and you can see how many are young moms. Heck I have moms come in that arent even old enough to drive. So while you want numbers I can show you an office full of numbers. How about Colin, 2, his mom is 17, she didnt want to feed him a lot becaue he would weigh to much for her to carry. Hes now behind on walking and has a feeding tube. SO yes I do know what Im talking about. Because sadly a lot of young moms think they know what they are doing or they can handle it, and when that baby pops out they havent got a clue.

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Jessica:

Jamie, I have seen you in other posts and you are straight up rude and offensive. Why are you in these board if you are so much better than everyone. These groups are made to be a support and help moms, not for people to pass judgement.
I had my first son at the age of 18, my husband and I had saved enough money through my pregnancy to buy a condo and moved out. Without gov. assistance and from hard work and education we started our family at a young age. We have completely dedicated and gave ourselves up to have our family. By the age of 21 we had three beautiful boys and moved into a home. We are financially stable and more well off than most people who waited and look down on us, he is in the pipefitters union and has all the benefits any family would want or need. I own a small natural products company with my sister and am able to stay home with my 3 children. My children are loved, provided for, safe, and fed. So am I good enough for you, have I passed your test?



Oh, would also like to point out that you must not have all of my posts. because not all of my posts are rude and offensive. I have offered lots of good advice on this board. But yes I am opinionated and wont apologize for that. I have my beliefs you have yours. If you were jewish I wouldnt fault your religion or assume everything you have said is bad simply because I do not believe in who you have  choosen to follow. So dont assume everything i say is rude and offensive.

Lindsay - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Jamie:



Quoting Rachael:




Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.







Actually, I have a PhD in Computational Neurophysiology (at the age of 25 while raising a young child, no less) and work in cerebellar research, which requires a strong mathematics background.  What have YOU to show for your life besides your ignorant judgments?  Your pathetic attempt at insulting me only illustrates both your complete lack of understanding of simple mathematics, statistics, and your utterly repulsive boorish behavior. 









Honestly, I doubt your PhD. Not really buying that.  As for having ignorant judgments, sorry, just very opinionated. And I do understand simple mathematics. Again 2+2=4, or are the schools teaching wrong information.  Again when you get a real brain, and also understand social skills then you can talk to me, until, you reprint your fake PhD off the computer (guess what I just made myself one). In the mean Im ill go back to my job where I help children and families all day long. These same families with these same girls who have kids and cant take care of them. Maybe you want to use your supposed math skills to count how many court orders come across me desk everyday. or to calculate every hour i spend on the phones with judges and attorneys. Or the number of times ive had to hand a tissue to a crying child in my office. So while you say Im ignorant I see this problem everyday, and its not slowing down. Again its about fact. Fact is  I will still get between 5 & 6 new files a day, and thats just in my office. I couldnt tell you how many other offices there are in my city, but for me to get 5 or 6 a day is way to many. In case you couldnt google fast enough thats 26-30 new moms that cant take care of their kids. So call me ignorant all you want, facts dont lie. Just you with your fake PhD.





I know I don't quite fit in the category as a young teen mother, but either way you cannot lump together how teen and other young mothers take care of their children based on what you only encounter at your work. So it may be true those mothers have trouble taking care of those children, but that doesn't mean all young mothers are like that. I say it all depends on the individuals current lifestyle, some just have it harder than others.



 



Also according to community guidelines, isn't stereotyping against the rules?

Lindsay - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Jamie:



Quoting Rachael:




Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.







Actually, I have a PhD in Computational Neurophysiology (at the age of 25 while raising a young child, no less) and work in cerebellar research, which requires a strong mathematics background.  What have YOU to show for your life besides your ignorant judgments?  Your pathetic attempt at insulting me only illustrates both your complete lack of understanding of simple mathematics, statistics, and your utterly repulsive boorish behavior. 









Honestly, I doubt your PhD. Not really buying that.  As for having ignorant judgments, sorry, just very opinionated. And I do understand simple mathematics. Again 2+2=4, or are the schools teaching wrong information.  Again when you get a real brain, and also understand social skills then you can talk to me, until, you reprint your fake PhD off the computer (guess what I just made myself one). In the mean Im ill go back to my job where I help children and families all day long. These same families with these same girls who have kids and cant take care of them. Maybe you want to use your supposed math skills to count how many court orders come across me desk everyday. or to calculate every hour i spend on the phones with judges and attorneys. Or the number of times ive had to hand a tissue to a crying child in my office. So while you say Im ignorant I see this problem everyday, and its not slowing down. Again its about fact. Fact is  I will still get between 5 & 6 new files a day, and thats just in my office. I couldnt tell you how many other offices there are in my city, but for me to get 5 or 6 a day is way to many. In case you couldnt google fast enough thats 26-30 new moms that cant take care of their kids. So call me ignorant all you want, facts dont lie. Just you with your fake PhD.





I know I don't quite fit in the category as a young teen mother, but either way you cannot lump together how teen and other young mothers take care of their children based on what you only encounter at your work. So it may be true those mothers have trouble taking care of those children, but that doesn't mean all young mothers are like that. I say it all depends on the individuals current lifestyle, some just have it harder than others.



 



Also according to community guidelines, isn't stereotyping against the rules?

[deleted account]

Quoting Jamie:



Quoting Rachael:




Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.







Actually, I have a PhD in Computational Neurophysiology (at the age of 25 while raising a young child, no less) and work in cerebellar research, which requires a strong mathematics background.  What have YOU to show for your life besides your ignorant judgments?  Your pathetic attempt at insulting me only illustrates both your complete lack of understanding of simple mathematics, statistics, and your utterly repulsive boorish behavior. 









Honestly, I doubt your PhD. Not really buying that.  As for having ignorant judgments, sorry, just very opinionated. And I do understand simple mathematics. Again 2+2=4, or are the schools teaching wrong information.  Again when you get a real brain, and also understand social skills then you can talk to me, until, you reprint your fake PhD off the computer (guess what I just made myself one). In the mean Im ill go back to my job where I help children and families all day long. These same families with these same girls who have kids and cant take care of them. Maybe you want to use your supposed math skills to count how many court orders come across me desk everyday. or to calculate every hour i spend on the phones with judges and attorneys. Or the number of times ive had to hand a tissue to a crying child in my office. So while you say Im ignorant I see this problem everyday, and its not slowing down. Again its about fact. Fact is  I will still get between 5 & 6 new files a day, and thats just in my office. I couldnt tell you how many other offices there are in my city, but for me to get 5 or 6 a day is way to many. In case you couldnt google fast enough thats 26-30 new moms that cant take care of their kids. So call me ignorant all you want, facts dont lie. Just you with your fake PhD.





 



Wow.  You really are a very sad and pathetic person.  I truly feel sorry for you.  Just because you're incapable of getting a PhD does not mean others are not.  What, my PhD is fake because you have no understanding of my field?  Fine by me.  Feel free to come by my lab anytime, I'll not only show you my degrees, but I'll also show you my grants, publications, and accolades.  



And don't talk to me about social skills when you have been nothing but rude, judgmental and downright insulting to EVERYONE here.  Also, if you're going to continue this drivel at least use proper English spelling and grammar--you're only continually looking like a complete idiot, and it's painful to read.

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Jessica:

Jamie, Don't throw toys in the trash, it is more green to recycle. The more responsible parents do this. Also being a good mom has nothing to do with how many or how little toys your child has or having a nice car, or amazing careers, you are missing the mark entirely. 2 parents with full time careers is not always the best for young children.



Sorry , I miss spoke we dont throw them in the trash, they get past on/ Or like clothes, my friends kids are younger so they go there. But I was making a point, My kids arent spoiled and dont have ton of toys.  And I didnt say that both parents had to have careers, but woman are always wanting equality, so why can I not go out and make a living like my husband, why cant I be independent and have a career and complete school.  And I dont feel Im missing the mark. I think my idea of a young mother is different from others. I dont consider a mom over 20 a young mother. I think having kids in your 20s is the right thing to do. I do however think having kids at a childhood age is unhealthy and does more harm then good. For every 1 young mother that does things right there are 5 or 6 that do things the wrong way. And thats the problem.  And for some reason Im a horrible bitch for thinking it is flat out wrong and disgusting for a high school student to have a baby. But hey thats my opinion and if that makes me a bitch then so be it.

Jamie - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Rachael:



Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.





Actually, I have a PhD in Computational Neurophysiology (at the age of 25 while raising a young child, no less) and work in cerebellar research, which requires a strong mathematics background.  What have YOU to show for your life besides your ignorant judgments?  Your pathetic attempt at insulting me only illustrates both your complete lack of understanding of simple mathematics, statistics, and your utterly repulsive boorish behavior. 





Honestly, I doubt your PhD. Not really buying that.  As for having ignorant judgments, sorry, just very opinionated. And I do understand simple mathematics. Again 2+2=4, or are the schools teaching wrong information.  Again when you get a real brain, and also understand social skills then you can talk to me, until, you reprint your fake PhD off the computer (guess what I just made myself one). In the mean Im ill go back to my job where I help children and families all day long. These same families with these same girls who have kids and cant take care of them. Maybe you want to use your supposed math skills to count how many court orders come across me desk everyday. or to calculate every hour i spend on the phones with judges and attorneys. Or the number of times ive had to hand a tissue to a crying child in my office. So while you say Im ignorant I see this problem everyday, and its not slowing down. Again its about fact. Fact is  I will still get between 5 & 6 new files a day, and thats just in my office. I couldnt tell you how many other offices there are in my city, but for me to get 5 or 6 a day is way to many. In case you couldnt google fast enough thats 26-30 new moms that cant take care of their kids. So call me ignorant all you want, facts dont lie. Just you with your fake PhD.

[deleted account]

Quoting Emma:

Hi Leslie,
Its nice to know im not the only one frustrated by this. 30 years ago it would have been a vry different story. We can be young mums an good mums too why should we all be tainted with the same brush??? I really hate it when i go down the street and get so many looks from people i feel like screaming at them. I wanted my kids young and im a good mum. I think all those people should back off. Im a stay at home mum of two young boys and only 25 why is age so important??? Shpuldnt the important thing be that our kids are loved well looked after cared for natured and have a fun loving family be all that matters not what age the parents are???? There are bad parents of all ages it takes all types to make up the world and not all young mums are unmarried or bad or selfish. Society needs to look closer at individuals and not make rush decisions based on in proper facts. Leslie hold your head high because it sounds like ur a great loving mum and hats off to you!!


Emma,



Thanks for the support.  You are right about the fact that 30 years ago, it would have been considered the best thing for an 18 year old to get married and start a family.  It seems today that moms are looked down for not waiting until they are in the height of their careers and allowing a nanny to care for their children.  I don't see anything wrong with having children young if you are a responsible individual.  I mean age does not determine how good of a parent you will be.  Thanks again for your kind and thoughtful words!!

Jessica - posted on 05/21/2009

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Quoting Carlita:



Everyone has to struggle in life, OH WAIT let me clarify that && not generalize. Quite a few ppl do have to struggle with life, whether it be in the beginning while living with their mother's && father's or towards the middle when they have their own kids, or even towards the end. We all take something with us when we do, && we teach our children thru these struggles how to cope && react && handle themselves in that kind of situation. {If I am going off topic pls anyone feel free to point it out} You don't need to have it "all together" as you so delicatly put it, when raising your children. Its the sacrifices, the lessons, the love, && the joy you give them is what is accounted for. Teaching them && growing together as a family, is what matters. && Yes taking care of them, making sure they are healthy, happy, safe && full. Many families have done so on a low income or even on gov't assistance. Their the ones who put their kids first, who make sure their kids have before them. How dare you point the finger && judge someone && who can && cannot have kids. Its ppl like you who don't realize the ugliness of the actual parent who doesn't take care of their kids whatsoever. Who could care less if they have clean clothes, warm home, healthy food






Great post, sums up being young and having a family esp. when you are not prepared. It takes a lot more work, effort, and sacrifice when you are not ready and I actually think this is what has made me a better parent. I am not perfect my family is always learning and growing but we love our children and are dedicated to giving them a good life.

Charlie - posted on 05/20/2009

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and may i add midwives mostly agree that your 20's is the your bodies peak time tp give birth !

Emma - posted on 05/20/2009

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Hi Leslie,
Its nice to know im not the only one frustrated by this. 30 years ago it would have been a vry different story. We can be young mums an good mums too why should we all be tainted with the same brush??? I really hate it when i go down the street and get so many looks from people i feel like screaming at them. I wanted my kids young and im a good mum. I think all those people should back off. Im a stay at home mum of two young boys and only 25 why is age so important??? Shpuldnt the important thing be that our kids are loved well looked after cared for natured and have a fun loving family be all that matters not what age the parents are???? There are bad parents of all ages it takes all types to make up the world and not all young mums are unmarried or bad or selfish. Society needs to look closer at individuals and not make rush decisions based on in proper facts. Leslie hold your head high because it sounds like ur a great loving mum and hats off to you!!

Brenda - posted on 05/20/2009

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Quoting Amber:

I just had my first son 3 months ago at age 20 and I'm also going to school full-time and I don't regret having him so early at all! I'm so happy that there are other mom's out there like me who love being a mom and who work hard even though they started young and they don't regret it. :)


you can regret it i love my baby girl who is 2 who will be 3 in aug and i have baby #2 a little boy due in oct i love my babies.  I know i should have finished college all the way before i had kids but i love my little miricles from God.

Alleta - posted on 05/20/2009

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well in my case, my mother was going through a divorce wheni was 16 because my stepdad was on drugs she took in 3 of my cousins, 3 that were my stepdads and then she had her 3 and someone had to take care of us so my mother worked her butt of like a man and i was the 2nd oldest and my sister (the oldest) moved to be with my dad and i had to take care of them, football games, volleyball games, homework, cleaning, cooking and laundry and anything that had to do with being a mom to help my mom i did it and had to grow up very fast! so with all that said i got married at 2 months shy of being 19, my husband was 20, had 4 miscarriages from 19-20, and finally have a son that is 8 months old and i love it and am very responsible. some women are just meant to be mothers and it doesnt matter how young or old you are it has everything to do with what kind of level you are able to think on, and how responsible you can be and if you feel that you are ready then go for it and you dont have to be rich but make sure that you can take care of them first and always put your children before yourself....food clothes, dr.appts, but at the same time make sure you are taken care of too so you can take care of your little ones! and if you are a young mother like me and so many others have fun growing old with your kids!

Amber - posted on 05/20/2009

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I just had my first son 3 months ago at age 20 and I'm also going to school full-time and I don't regret having him so early at all! I'm so happy that there are other mom's out there like me who love being a mom and who work hard even though they started young and they don't regret it. :)

Brenda - posted on 05/20/2009

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isnt that the truth we have this lady that use to be in my sunday school class at church and she use to say horrible comments about young moms and i an 22 almost 23 and i am a damned good mom excuse the lang and it always bothered me i work and take care of my daughter and future son on the way and hate how people say things about young moms now i do know some young moms who mommy and daddy take the baby so they can go party and that crap makes me so mad i mean you laid down and had a baby so take care of the beautiful baby instead of letting mommy and daddy do it all the time but that is what happens a few bad young mothers gives other young moms a bad name

Carlita - posted on 05/20/2009

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Quoting Jessica:

Jamie, I have seen you in other posts and you are straight up rude and offensive. Why are you in these board if you are so much better than everyone. These groups are made to be a support and help moms, not for people to pass judgement.
I had my first son at the age of 18, my husband and I had saved enough money through my pregnancy to buy a condo and moved out. Without gov. assistance and from hard work and education we started our family at a young age. We have completely dedicated and gave ourselves up to have our family. By the age of 21 we had three beautiful boys and moved into a home. We are financially stable and more well off than most people who waited and look down on us, he is in the pipefitters union and has all the benefits any family would want or need. I own a small natural products company with my sister and am able to stay home with my 3 children. My children are loved, provided for, safe, and fed. So am I good enough for you, have I passed your test?


ROTFL! Idk what I loved more about this comment, but you got right to the point. It is kinda sad we have ppl like Jamie, who feel its okay to go around passing judgement on everyone else but themselves;



 



Everyone has to struggle in life, OH WAIT let me clarify that && not generalize. Quite a few ppl do have to struggle with life, whether it be in the beginning while living with their mother's && father's or towards the middle when they have their own kids, or even towards the end. We all take something with us when we do, && we teach our children thru these struggles how to cope && react && handle themselves in that kind of situation. {If I am going off topic pls anyone feel free to point it out} You don't need to have it "all together" as you so delicatly put it, when raising your children. Its the sacrifices, the lessons, the love, && the joy you give them is what is accounted for. Teaching them && growing together as a family, is what matters. && Yes taking care of them, making sure they are healthy, happy, safe && full. Many families have done so on a low income or even on gov't assistance. Their the ones who put their kids first, who make sure their kids have before them. How dare you point the finger && judge someone && who can && cannot have kids. Its ppl like you who don't realize the ugliness of the actual parent who doesn't take care of their kids whatsoever. Who could care less if they have clean clothes, warm home, healthy food.



 



Psssh, ugggh. I hope I didn't go off topic lol

Jessica - posted on 05/20/2009

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Jamie, Don't throw toys in the trash, it is more green to recycle. The more responsible parents do this. Also being a good mom has nothing to do with how many or how little toys your child has or having a nice car, or amazing careers, you are missing the mark entirely. 2 parents with full time careers is not always the best for young children.

[deleted account]

Quoting Jamie:

Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.



How can you judge her for using mathmatical facts regarding statistics and correlations when you base your opinions of young mothers on statistics.  If you are going to base your opinions on such informaiton don't put people down for pointing out that you are basing your information on a mathmatical comparison that does infact have misleading properties.  You do not need to google informaiton on variables and correlations to have an understanding of them. They teach such information in college algebra and psychology 101.  It is rather sad to see that you have to cut down other people to defend your beliefs rather than defend your beliefs with facts. 



      

Charlie - posted on 05/20/2009

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Quoting Jamie:

Rachael, I define being ready to have a baby as being able to take care of a child in everyway. Physically, Emotionally and Financially. Babies need more then love, they need a roof over thier head, clothes on their back and food in thier tummies. If you cant provide that on your own with out govt. assistance I feel you shouldnt be having a baby. .



Jamie i find your " defintition" to be to be mostly true yes a child needs love , housing , clothing and food , but to say that you dont think people on govt. assistance should have children , quite frankly is disgusting you really dont think they deserve the human right to bear children??? Their house may be smaller , there clothes second hand , and food might not be fancy but more often than not they are loved sometimes more so than their counterparts i am  24 year old with a , son a wonderful partner and a career as a teacher  and i am a product of of one those govt. assisted families i had an amazing upbringing full of love , and i find your comment quite  offensive .

Jamie - posted on 05/20/2009

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Rachael: WTF? Sorry but 2+2=4. I said nothin about variable or all that crap. Its nice to know you know how to google. So apparently you can read. Good for you. Its also apparent you must be one of the young mothers I refer too. Googling something then copy/paste it does not make you smart. SO when you form your own opinion not someone elses then please talk to me. Oh and I dont think Lindsay is a young mother.

[deleted account]

Quoting Lindsay:

I would like to add that judging a young mother based on statistics is about the same as just calling them "a number". And not all young mothers have babies by accident. I had mine when I was 23 years old, but I actually was planning to have a baby then. Now being 25 years old I have planned again to have another child, because it was my decision and I knew I could take care of them and I have the adequate help to.

Even if it was by accident there are many assistance programs out there to help. And that is not a bad thing at all. It actually shows that even though the pregnancy might have been an accident they are still responsible enough to get the help to provide for their child they care about. It is absolutely nothing to be ashamed about.


EXACTLY!  There is also a saying in science and statistics that "correlation does not cause causation"--meaning that just because there appears to be a relationship based upon a correlation, it does not necessarily exist.  You can throw all the numbers and statistics you want, but it's how you interpret those numbers that give them any real meaning.  Case in point: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en...  



The graph clearly shows that there is a correlation between the increase of global temperature and the decline of pirates.  One could interpret the graph and state that "global warming is caused by a decline of pirates", when in reality no causality between the two actually exists.



Also, Jamie-- 2+2 does NOT always equal 4.  It ONLY equals 4 IF AND ONLY IF the condition exists where 1+1=2.  That condition changes depending on what base you are talking about.  If it's base-10, then yes it's true, if it's something else like base-13 then NO.  And don't even get me started on complex variables....



 

Joanna - posted on 05/20/2009

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i am a mom to a step-daughter that is 3 and i am 31 weeks along i am married and i am 22 i get looks all the time. it gets old this one time i was not wearing my wedding band due to my hands being swollen and this lady came up to me mind you she looked like she was in her late 30's and says i dont know how such young unmarried moms can do this with 1 child and one on the way i said to the lady 1. i am married and 2. why does my life conscurn you and just walked away its people like this that make me mad

Lindsay - posted on 05/20/2009

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I would like to add that judging a young mother based on statistics is about the same as just calling them "a number". And not all young mothers have babies by accident. I had mine when I was 23 years old, but I actually was planning to have a baby then. Now being 25 years old I have planned again to have another child, because it was my decision and I knew I could take care of them and I have the adequate help to.

Even if it was by accident there are many assistance programs out there to help. And that is not a bad thing at all. It actually shows that even though the pregnancy might have been an accident they are still responsible enough to get the help to provide for their child they care about. It is absolutely nothing to be ashamed about.

Jamie - posted on 05/20/2009

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Would just like to point out numbers dont lie. And while it may not hold true to all situations, there probably are a few good young moms, you can lie about numbers 2+2 is always going to equal 4. Congrats to those moms who have had kids at a young age and still be able to complete school and make the best life possible for them and thier child(ren). And I feel sorry for those kids whos mothers get pregnant and are not ready to be parents.

Lindsay - posted on 05/19/2009

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To all keep it simple, regardless of how young you may seem, just as long as YOU KNOW you are financially, emotionally, and physically, it is your and your husband/fiancee/boyfriend's decision alone to have a child. To be judged based on age is silly. So you may not have a bachelors degree, or a high paying job (but I manage to get by on a low to middle income from my job) I manage to keep my son healthy and happy. I am not perfect, but I make a damn good mother in my opinion. So don't worry when those "older mothers" judge you based on first impression pre-determined statistics without getting to know you completely first. You don't need that added stress in your life. I hope this helped, dearie.

Amanda - posted on 05/11/2009

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I too know how u feel, I was 19 when I had my first and sometimes people had way too much to say about me, I was lucky to have an extremely supportive family who always protected me from these busy bodies. Although I must admit it got worse as I got older having an older child, yet still looking young and being mistaken for an 18 year old when I was in fact 28. People would comment saying 'what were you 10 when you had him?', I just take it as a compliment now lol.

[deleted account]

Quoting Emma:

ou just have to remember that anyone who bad mouths a person be it for age or for gender or for the area they live in or for any other reason they can think of are just venting their insecurities onto the people they bad mouth. we must come to understand that these people have problems in their lives or are unfulfilled somehow that they feel the need to be shit heads to others in order to make themselves feel better. this truly is a sad thing.. let us wish all these people the best in their lives and the best of luck in sorting out their problems and being fulfilled in their lives.. do you agree leslie ;)



I do agree. Your are correct. :)

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