Heated spanking debates

Anna - posted on 02/16/2011

Ok so heres whats my opinion we are grown women every parent has their own way of raising their child I personally do spank my child as is my right and choice as her mother. I do not discriminate against those who chose other methods of discipline as I expect others to respect my choice and decisions as a parent.

Charlie - posted on 02/16/2011

I went along to a free positive parenting class run by our health clinic it was great !

Stephanie - posted on 02/15/2011

Also try to consider if something is actually bad enough to warrant a punishment. Give her some leeway for normal toddler behavior. Everything is a learning process for her, including listening to you and understand that she needs to do as you say. Teaching isn't beating your child into submission or making them so afraid of you that they don't step out of line. Let her be a child and love it. Don't stiffle her development by not giving her the freedom to be a child.



Hitting teaches fear, not respect.

Stephanie - posted on 02/15/2011

Mandy- Why do you feel like you had to smack her for jumping on the bed just bc your in-laws were there? Do you feel pressured by them to hit? I think the best thing to do in that situation would be to just redirect her, not smack her bc you think they expect for you to do it. If you dont feel comfortable letting them see you are trying something different just choose to redirect her rather than revert to old ways. I mean really, jumping on the bed is not that big of a deal. Yes, she could fall off and yes it might get on your nerves but kids are kids and it's fun for them. Or, maybe just give her a few minutes of letting her jump while you supervise or hold her hands so she can jump safely for a minute and then tell her that's enough for now. She will really be happy that you put forth the effort to do something positive with her rather than always having a negative reaction. Let her see the loving side of you and let the negative things fall back.

Nikki - posted on 02/15/2011

Mandy, you could also check with your child health clinic. Quite often the run positive parenting classes which would be a fantastic resource for you.

Nikki - posted on 02/15/2011

Wow another Aussie here, and I am very anti smacking. It really is not the norm any more.

Charlie - posted on 02/15/2011

stick with it Mandy there is also a great group who are very supportive if you feel like it isn't working http://www.circleofmoms.com/positive-beh...

There are quiet a few mums on there who are trying time outs as opposed to smacking which they had in the past .

Melissa - posted on 02/15/2011

oh sorry to hear that Loureen. Yeah sounds good Jodi. Cant wait to see how the next few weeks go

Charlie - posted on 02/15/2011

it takes consistency and a lot o patience something I am running short of lately *sigh*

Krista - posted on 02/15/2011

That's a FANTASTIC idea, Jodi. Focus on the good behaviour, keeping things nice and positive, so that she knows what you want her to do. I love it!

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2011

And yes, it is 2 minutes, although given she is nearly 3 you could also get away with 3 minutes. And yes it starts over again every time they get up and move away.

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2011

Mandy, have you tried a reward chart for positive behaviour. I purchased a whole heap of Disney Princess stickers on ebay really cheap (there were hundreds of them) and made up a chart. I explained to her about the reward chart, and she would get stickers for good behaviour, and doing as mummy asked. She LOVED that reward chart. Each time she filled one, we would go shopping and she could choose a cheap book or toy. At times, she forgot, but all it took was a reminder. Sure, she still misbehaved at times - she's a kid, of course she will. BUT, it certainly helped her focus a little more on her behaviour.



So, you could try something like this, and instead of smacking while breastfeeding (as an example) before you sit down, give her an activity and let her know that if she sits and does this quietly while you feed, she can have a sticker on her chart.



Anyway, just a suggestion of what worked for us when my daughter was little.

Melissa - posted on 02/15/2011

thanks for all your help. I live in Perth and it is pretty much the norm, not just in my friends but everyone Ive ever known when I went to daycare my daycare worker hit her kids as well I remember well cause obviously they are not allowd to hit someone elses kids, same with my daughters daycare worker.

Going to give it the best shot I can and am pretty determined to change and see how it goes. It might work it might not. Ive only smacked a few times I smacked last night for jumping on the bed as eveyrone was here inlaws my dad etc and didnt want to do anything otherwise while there was alot of people in the house and alot going on. will try putting her in the dining room wher I can see her so its a little easier to keep her there. So then since shes 2 is it 2 minutes from every time she moves away or stands up

Charlie - posted on 02/15/2011

Yeah not the norm in Australia not the norm AT ALL not where I am from anyway .

Binge drinking is the norm in Australia too doesn't mean we should follow like sheep or make it right .

Mandy said : But hitting is just my normal reaction as I am just used to it now .

Then you need to learn a little self control .

Jodi - posted on 02/15/2011

"Im from Australia. It IS the norm."

Please refrain from painting us all with the same brush. It is no more *the norm* in Australia than anywhere else in the world. Perhaps it is *the norm* because that's how you were brought up and that's what your friends do, but it isn't *the norm* in Australia. In fact, in many states, there are strict regulations on smacking your children - yes, while it is still legal, there are regulations on HOW you may smack your children, etc. But it is not *the norm*.

Krista - posted on 02/15/2011

And its not as if I hit all the time anyhow you make out like I do. But yeah I am Ive only had ot do time out once so I dont know how its going to work but Im trying. Getting her to stay there will be the only problem but will give it my best shot 100%



Mandy, you've said flat-out that you choose hitting as your primary form of discipline, and that your child cringes away from you.



What on earth are we supposed to think?



Please continue trying with the time-outs. If you have a hard time getting her to stay put, then put her in a playpen for her time-outs.



You've been relying on smacking because you feel that it's easiest. Sure, it's "easy" to smack your kid when she's misbehaving while you're nursing. But is it best? Is it actually teaching her anything?



I know that we've gone through this situation with you before, with people being concerned about how you discipline your daughter. Please, for a moment, stop and ask yourself: if ALL of these women think that I'm not going about this the right way, is it possible that maybe I'm NOT going about this the right way?



It does take a lot of time and patience to discipline a child using methods other than hitting. And I understand that you don't have a lot of either. However, your beautiful little girl is worth the effort.



And like one of the other mothers said, you have another baby to think about now. If you hit your little girl every time she misbehaves, what do you think she's going to do to her younger sibling anytime the baby does something she doesn't like? You're teaching her, over and over again, that hitting is how you get your way.



And that's not a good lesson for her to learn.

Iridescent - posted on 02/14/2011

Also, just so you're aware...stating something is "right" just because your neighbors, friends and parents do it, does not make it right. It just proves the point of the "Abuse Cycle". That's all it does.

Iridescent - posted on 02/14/2011

Why would you have time to sit her at a table to eat a meal for 2 hours, yet not enough time to stand her little nose in a corner for 2 minutes for poor behavior? That is simply beyond me. I understand busy life! I live it. And we have enough time to raise our kids in a manner that shows them they are loved, wanted, and have rules to live by and consequences for misbehavior. Kid sat at the table for 30 minutes and won't eat? Well, maybe she's not hungry and should leave, and if she cries she's hungry before snack as a result, she'll possibly eat her snack then. Do you realize a child's stomach (and yours) is only supposed to be the size of one of their own fists? That, in a two year old, is only about 3 ounces at MOST. So a plate of food is really very high expectations, and probably hurting her stomach and causing her to lose the ability to tell when she's even full. There are a lot of ways to teach. For example, your sample of the child being next to you and being naughty. Well sit her on your lap, hold her hands, tell her what she did that wasn't acceptable and let her know she's in time out on your lap until 2 minutes have passed. It's easier yet than when across the room, and so much healthier than smacking them! But, if you're dead set on hitting your kid, nobody can change your behavior and we can only hope you realize what you're doing before you're the one in the situation of not understanding and being beaten for it. Wait...they don't allow you to hit nursing home patients with dementia, do they, because THEN it's abuse.

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

To answer your question about "if it works for you thats the important thing", I do agree with that to an extent but not when it involves hitting a 2 year old child. I think that crosses the line and takes that concept into a completely different arena.
I am really happy to read that you are giving it your best shot. It isn't easy, but it's well worth the effort. I realize that you were brought up in a place where this is the norm and is accepted and I truly do think it's wonderful that you are open to going in a different direction with your children. I know that it's hard when that is what you are acustom to so I really do commend you for opening your mind to something different.
With time outs, it is virtually impossible to get a 2 year old to stay in one spot for very long. Rather than standing her somewhere, maybe make her lay on her bed or sit in a chair, someplace where you are more likely to make progress than say standing in the corner. If she standing in the corner it will be too big of a battle for just starting this way of correction with her and set you up for failure. It may seem like not as big of a punishment to sit somewhere comfortable but you are alot more likely to make positive progress that way.

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

and yep love then more then anything in the world coudlnt love them more if I tried. Wanted to be a mum from a very young age so definately am very appreciative of my family and my fiance

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

I am . And its not as if I hit all the time anyhow you make out like I do. But yeah I am Ive only had ot do time out once so I dont know how its going to work but Im trying. Getting her to stay there will be the only problem but will give it my best shot 100%

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

Look, I am not trying to be nasty to you. I am just trying to get you to see that what you are doing isn't ok. You love your children, right? Then teach them with love and patience, not pain. Nurture and guide them, lead by example. There is a world of difference between children respecting their parents and children FEARING their parents. I have extremely well behaved children and they know I wouldn't harm a hair on their heads. They are 14 months apart so yes, I too had a small baby while running after a toddler and I know it's hard. I know it gets frustrating but hitting a child that young who doesn't understand your purpose accomplishes nothing productive. It causes her physical pain and mental anguish at the hand of her parents so she will learn to be fearful, timid and insecure. Is that what you want? I hope and pray you do follow through and try something different.

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

lol my bad Emma sorry

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

Im from Australia. It IS the norm. If you are not seeing kids get smacked they are being threatened of being smacked. Its not a bad thing its just what most people do. My daughters daycare worker said the otehr day when I came there her daughter is just about to get a smacked bum she was rubbing dirty hands over the TV. She tuned 2 in dec. Do you think that is wrong to? This is a trained professional with 4 kids who is very much in control of her kids and if anything too leniant, parents of the kids have told her shes not tough enough. I do see a counsellor but not for parenting. But we have come across the topic she said well if it works for you thats the important thing. SO isnt it Stephanie? Not being rude asking genuinly. Like I said Im now workig on the time out thing as much as I can

Stifler's - posted on 02/14/2011

This... has officially become a heated spanking debate ;)

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

You are so far off base with your parenting and thought process. It sounds like you would rather defend your actions than actually learn something. There is ALWAYS another way. And your bf hopes she gets scratched??? That is down right evil. And, hitting is illegal in many areas, perhaps it unfortunately isn't where you live. And, yes, many people do go to jail for it. I do realize and respect that everyone parents differently but when said parenting crosses into abuse I am not going to respect that. I will say exactly what I think which is any person who hits a 2 year old child should have their child taken since they obviously don't have the sense or self control not to harm them.
"Obviously the only way is to smack"...obvious to whom? Only to you. You need to seek help. Take a parenting class- they are usually free through social services and get counceling to learn how to be more patient and to properly channel your anger. It sounds like it wouldn't hurt your fiancee to do the same. I am curious as to where you are from since you say everyone smacks their children there?

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

Anyways forget I posted. Its hard for me to try something new when Im getting bagged out here due to personal opinion, when smacking isnt even wrong in the first place I just thought Id try see if something else worked rather then having to resort to that. And Its only been a short time yet I will see how things go with finding time to use the time out methods and work out exactoly what I want to do when it is hard to keep them in the corner lol :)

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

Actually smacking isnt criminal Stephanie, if it was many many people would be in trouble. Dont worry I know the laws. She is nearly 3 so yeah she does understand. Obviously where possible I will try time out but when breast feeding etc and she is right next to me obviously the only way is to smack. She does know how to treat the cat it is just sometimes children her age choosde not to treat them properly. So they do need punishment for that. Otherwise you areletting your child walk all over you. My fiance always says he hopes the cats scratch her one day so teach her a bit of a lesson. Anyway obviously you dont have to agree if your anti smacking that is fine, I am trying other methods and seeing how they work out. Please try to remmber ladies that smacking is not abuse and that you cant go around telling someone they are doing this just because you may disagree with something. I thought you were on the right track for a bit now I realise your not. Please remember everyone has different ways of parenting. I apprecitae all the advice that was good and am now putting it into action with my daughter and will see how it goes :)

Marylea - posted on 02/14/2011

That's okay Katherine lol. As for Mandy you seem pretty stuck in your ways. You say you want to try other methods but then you say they don't work and justify hitting. Everything Stephanie has told you is the truth. It sounds to me from your posts that you're expecting unrealistic behaviour from you barely 3 year old. You've said that because you have a baby its easier to smack your daughter well what you're doing is teaching her daughter that its okay to hit, don't be surprised when she hits her baby sibling for doing something she doesn't like.

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

Also, ask yourself does the punishment fit the "crime". Does a child really deserve to be hit for being messy or inattentive at mealtime? She is acting her age and showing very normal behavior for a 2 year old. If she sits on the cat you need to show her why that isn't ok. Hold the cat and show her how to pet it and explain that it hurts kitty if you're too rough. Kids don't always have to be punished. Teach them something better to do than whatever they did that wasn't right by your standard.

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

Mandy- A child under 2 years old does not understand that when you hit them you are trying to teach them something. They do not associate the action with the punishment at that age. What you are doing is criminal and that is a fact, not a judgement on my part. If you expect her to eat her meal properly at such a young age are you setting a proper example for her? You have to teach by example, not just yell at her and hit. She doesn't understand that! All she sees is that her mommy is hurting her. She has no concept of why you are doing it. Please, believe this and do better for your child.

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

its ok I read her post Katherine before it was erased

Melissa - posted on 02/14/2011

Ive not been on here since last week too busy with the wedding but shoudlnt be on here now, some washing to do, wedding stuff animals to feed but Im just gonna respond quickly. So my kid has never been put in a corner before so when I put her in the corner (for sitting on the cat) first time last night she doesnt get to sit there and keeps standing up Ive got a baby in my arms so I cant enforce prperly only by speaking. how long do you leave them there after they sand up or move away from that spot you have to sit stand there watching them seems very hard. My kid is a few weeks shy of 3 for those who are asking. We dont get time out (hubby and me) we wouldnt have anyone to leave the kids with could possibly leave them with my inlws every now and again but we'd just have to go there to drop them 15 mins there 15 back doenst seem worth it. Weekends would be the only option for that also as he leaves around 4am for work sometimes earlier and is never home earlier then 6pm if that. And Stephanie what do I expect? I expect her to behave and eat properly rather then having to be told every 5 second eat your food hurry up and have her sitting there for an hour or 2 messing around not having her meal so yeah I do expect her to eat nicely. I see she is told the same thing at grand parents so I dont think Im wrong in expectng that

@ Krista E I do spend ages telling her I do tell her what she needs to do its not like I smack outright. SHe is warned that many times then count to 3 then asked again. But Like I said Im trying the other option right now thats why Im trying to figure out how to do it rigth and if it will work for her since this is not something that has/is done in my family with anyone. Ill clarify though I dont think its wrong to smack most people I know smack I know very few people who dont, but Im trying something else as well as an option for behavior that is not so bad. So its not something she is always used to, I definately know I didnt like bieng smcked as a child but at the same time who doesnt i thought to myself after these comments does it matter if I liked it or not its a punishment for doing something wrong

Katherine - posted on 02/14/2011

Marylea, I accidentally erased your post. I meant to erase mine. I am sooo sorry!!!

Katherine - posted on 02/14/2011

@ Mandy, it's sounds like you need a night out and hubby or SO to take the kids off of your hands.
I get really stressed out with my 5yo. I have smacked her butt a few times and then felt awful afterwards. I also have my 2yo who I swore I would never hit and I haven't.
I find that when I don't get time to myself it just escalates and the more it escalates the madder and more intolerant I get.
Every mom deserves a break!!!

Stephanie - posted on 02/14/2011

@Mandy Carson-

I think you would really benefit from a parenting class and individual counceling to get better control of yourself and your actions. When you say that hitting is your normal reaction and you're used to it, as an excuse to continue that behavior that throws a huge red flag in my opinion. You need to get a hold of your own senses and temperament and not take your "habits" and lapse in control and good judgement out on your child. Hitting her for making a mess at mealtime? Really??? She's a child for God's sake. What did you expect???

Stifler's - posted on 02/10/2011

That's exactly what I do with Logan when he climbs on my dishwasher door or plays with the bin. In the play pen with no toys for 1 minute if I have to say NO once and he does it again. It works pretty well.

Krista - posted on 02/10/2011

A lot of parents will designate a specific spot for time-outs within their house. It could be a chair, or a step, or a cushion -- it just has to be someplace easily definable. A playpen even works well, because they can't run off from it.

But the thing is that it gives her more of a chance to correct her behaviour. Your daugher is what, two? Three? It's COMPLETELY normal for her to dawdle and muck around at the table. When you smack her, she's not learning how to better behave. She's just learning that Mommy hurts her.

When she's misbehaving at the table, you have to be specific about what behaviour is not acceptable. "No throwing food" or "Eat your peas" is so much easier for her to understand than "Stop messing around." Sometimes we expect kids to think like little adults, and they just DON'T. You have to be very specific about what you want her to do and what you do not want her to do.

And if she keeps on, you say, "Mommy said no throwing food. If you throw food, you go in time-out." And then if she throws food again, you say very calmly, "No throwing food. Time-out." And you pick her up and put her in the playpen. One minute per year of her age. She'll scream and wail, no doubt, but just ignore it. After the time has passed, you go get her and bring her back, sit her back in her seat, and say, "We eat our supper nicely. See?" And you show her how to eat supper nicely. Really, it doesn't take THAT much longer than a smack, and it teaches her that when she disobeys Mommy, then she loses what she loves the most: Mommy's attention and company. So it's effective, but it won't make her physically afraid of you.

Yes, it's more work than a quick smack, but if you want her to behave, you have to teach her and show her and guide her -- not just swat her when she's done wrong, without properly explaining how to do it right.

I've heard really good things about the book "1,2, 3 Magic". I think it's something that could help you really develop a PLAN for disciplining your daughter, instead of just quickly resorting to spanking because you're tired and frustrated and it's easy.

Melissa - posted on 02/10/2011

so, so far Ive not been able to try timeout but where do u even put your kids, n a corner, lock them in their room? And what happens when they are at the table and messing up do you still keep taking them to timeout wasting ages then bringing them back to eat? These are the times she has played up last few days refusing the eat muckjing around etc so I have had to smack because taking her to timeout will just waste time and we had to go food shop last night and I do have my 6 month old to worry about as well rather then runnig her back and forth to timeout. I give her to the count of 3 to coreect her behavior ..

Krista - posted on 02/09/2011

We all do. I struggle with it myself. There have been times that I've had to quite literally sit on my hands to keep from spanking, when he's being defiant and laughing at me. But I think spanking/smacking is one of those things that once you start doing it, it just seems easier and easier. And I never want to get to that point.

Jaime - posted on 02/09/2011

This subject is never easy to discuss. I don't spank and hope I never will, but I will be honest with you all and say that it is an absolute struggle for me. I really have to focus to keep my head about me when Gray is being mischievous and behaving badly. My instinct is to want to spank him---always! I hate that my upbringing has caused me to have an almost innate reaction when I am beyond my limit of frustration....but that is the reality I face. I can certainly understand why parents spank, but even so, I believe there is a better, more positive and productive option. I do think that based on many of the conversations about spanking here on CoMs, I feel as though we are leaning more heavily toward a non-spanking society in the near future! It is my hope that by the time Gray is a parent he will have learned more positive ways to handle his frustrations and pass that on to his children and so on. Anyway, even though I don't spank, I promise I'm not perfect and still have a ways to go when it comes to positive discipline!

Krista - posted on 02/09/2011

I want my kid to be dissuaded by promised consequences. I don't want him to be AFRAID of me. If Sam ever cowered from me, I think my heart would absolutely break in two.

Lacye - posted on 02/09/2011

I don't spank unless it is the absolutely last resort. Any other time, my daughter gets time outs, she has toys taken away, and afterwards, even though she's not even 2 years old yet, I talk to her and explain what she did wrong. But when she repeatedly doesn't listen, like does something over and over again in one day that I have repeatedly gotten on to her, I will pop her on the butt.

Krista - posted on 02/09/2011

It's never too late to try something new. It can be very hard to change a habit, but "this is how I've always done it" really isn't a good excuse for not changing. And if your child cowers when she does something wrong, then I would say it's definitely time to look into other options. She's worth the effort, right?

We want our kids to respect our authority, but do we want them to be truly AFRAID of us? I know I don't.

Melissa - posted on 02/09/2011

I might try time out, if I remember Ive never done it before Ive only smacked she cowers when she does something wrong I will try and remember to try time out see if that works. But hitting is just my normal reaction as I am just used to it now

Renae - posted on 02/09/2011

Ok, ok, sorry about the moron thing. I actually didn't think it would be that much of an offensive word when I said it, just wasn't thinking I guess. You all have to admit though, there have been times when you felt like resorting to name calling! LOL :)



On another note, its awesome to hear some people did read the information Katherine provided.



I think what frustrates me the most on this and other controversial topics is this lack of education that we talk about. I get that, but all you have to do to educate yourself on many of these topics is type them into a google search and read a few articles. Maybe people just dont think to do the research on things, or they dont realise researching is an option. I dont know.

Stifler's - posted on 02/09/2011

Well it does come down to education. Before CoM I was one of those " just spank them blh blah blah" people. But then I read some other suggestions like time out and stuff and thought I'd try them first before smacking my kid. They work just great.

Krista - posted on 02/09/2011

Tracey, that's a very wise comment. We all want to think of ourselves as good mothers, and we seem to think that in order to think of ourselves that way, we have to have done everything absolutely RIGHT.

I wish that more mothers would realize that being a good mom DOES leave room for mistakes, and that there is absolutely no shame in looking back and thinking, "Yeah, I wish I'd done X, Y or Z differently."

I've seen some moms on COM say, "Yeah, I spanked. And knowing what I know now, if I could go back in time, I would not have spanked, because it was the wrong thing to do." I have a lot of respect for moms who are able to look back objectively like that. But unfortunately, we also see a lot of moms who appear to cling very stubbornly to their past actions, and make it a real point of pride to never even CONSIDER the idea of looking back and thinking, "Yeah, I could have handled that differently."

Katherine - posted on 02/09/2011

Yeah a lot of people think the phrase is from the bible but it's actually from a poem. And I learned that on CoM lol.

Melissa - posted on 02/08/2011

whta an interesting comment Tracey I might have a look myself, although I cannot imagine anything that could stop me being a smacker. My inlaws have almost had me considering it on occasions but it all seems to go out the windom since it is just who I am Ill have a read