my adult daughter is a narcissist

Patricia - posted on 11/16/2012 ( 137 moms have responded )

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My 46 year old daughter is truly a narcissist. I have read a lot on line and she fits the description. I have had problems with her all her life, and once again i am out of the picture. I finally realize that it is "Play by my rules, or you are off the team". She has in one day alone sent me about 60 texts, all of which are full of rage and blame. I have a 19 yr old grandson and 14 yr old granddaughter, whom I have been close with all their lives. Now we are once again estranged, not the first time, and what is really breaking my heart, is the grandkids have chosen not to communicate with me either. In the past, I have found myself agreeing with her acceptng blame for what most of the times I never really knew, just to keep the peace. I just can't do that again. She has so many conditions attached to her..."Do as I say, or you will not include you in our lives", Act the way i want you to, or else... or else...you will be punished. She said in one of her many texts, When will will feelings come first...You meaning me, should devote your life to your children, No I dont think so....She had a good childhood...but all should does is blame and make up stuff and I have tried to fix things by agreeing with her and actually told her "I will try and do better". How pathetic is that...The holidays are now here and no family, how can my grandkids just forget me...we had so many good memories...this is just breaking my heart,,,oh I function because I have to...but this is really getting bad...thanks for listening

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Diane - posted on 02/13/2014

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Hi everyone. My daughter is a narcissist, too. I see now that she always was. Even as a child she had a hidden side to her. I used to say she had shuttered eyes. She was the oldest child and the golden one, always shining under my attention and making me laugh. I was her best fan. And then I didn't give her something she wanted because it was morally wrong and she turned on me when she was 21 years old. She married and now she had a husband and no longer needed me for supply. Of course it was years before I could see everything clearly, but now I see how she played me for years and used me and the affection from her was never genuine. Mommy just was her source of supply. The years after that were confusing. She turned her children against me and started spreading rumors about me to our friends. She was cold and haughty and cruel and yes, she almost destroyed me. The evil a narcissist does in insidious and winds around you like a snake until you're almost dead -- no self esteem, no sense of self, and your history robbed from you and replaced with lies. I am so sorry that anyone has to go through that with a child that they loved and reared with every care and love and respect. No one is perfect but I was a good mom. We have been good moms. I think she was born that way. I have had to separate myself and begin a new life without her. It's hard, but I am finding my way. I wish everyone the best who is dealing with this. It's not pretty.

Julie - posted on 02/07/2014

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Narcissisits won't go to therapy together because it is never their problem. They are simply done with you and they will slander and lie to get people to see them as victim and us as monsters. I grieved, I validated, I sent loving little emails and never got a response - it's now been nearly 4 years and I finally have come to the conclusion that I need to live my life and live my truth which is that I was a good and loving mother. I'll not have her steal my joy anymore.

Kathy - posted on 10/14/2013

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I suspect my 34 year old daughter suffers from narcissistic rage behavior. I was a single mom. She was the oldest of three. Since she left home, she has twisted truths to be viewed as a victim. When she went to college, she joined a church and her "testimony" was that I was the cause of all her problems. When I went to visit and went to church with her, I was looked at like some monster. I have two sons who also see her disorder. She is now married with 3 children. Its too hurtful to write about all of the things, but 3 months ago I witnessed her rage at a neighbor, and her 7 year old son. I witnessed my grandchildren constantly hurting each other and watch her husband walk on egg shells. I decided to broach the subject by praying, telling them I had some concerns, and let them know what I read in the Bible first, before even getting to the concerns. Well, to say the least that led to rage, gritted teeth and being told I was lucky that she even shared her children with me. We live in different states. I was at the end of this one other time years ago, when she again, blamed me for every problem she had. Her father has the same problem and my adult children cut off relationships with him. My other 2 children love their sister, but see her as a problem maker. I just can't keep apologizing to keep the peace. My grand babies age range from 3, 6 & 8 and they love me. Her husband acts as mediator for her and defends her anger. He is a good man and I love him very much. The parallels between her and her father are becoming more and more in common. Messy home, the same anti-depressants (which don't work), refusing to take sincere responsibility for their actions, raging, neighbors not liking them (by her own admission, but that is their problem because she yells at the kids). Her boys are just "boys being boys" they are acting out in violent ways. I was a teacher and know the difference. They yell at her that they hate her, and other disrespectful words, which are not corrected. Her husband is getting his PhD, so he tunes out, but he has to because he is studying. But before he was studying, he wouldn't say a word to them unless she told him to. I am concerned and hurt and don't know what to do. She has already ruined my reputation with people I don't even know. She tries to with my sons, but they shut her down. I just don't know what to do. She has convinced her mother-in-law that I am a bad person, so understandably, she steers clear of me, which I feel is a shame, as she is a really good and kind lady, as is her husband. I just don't know what to do. This has not stopped hurting since July and it is now October. Any suggestions?

Elizabethsarmor - posted on 08/20/2014

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I hope the moderator of this web can look over this occasionally to see if there are the "trolls or raging narcissistic children who hate their parents and can not understand [ there truly are parents who are not at fault for their adult children's behavior. A mother who would be seeking support on these webs does not need additional abuse and pain from those trolling to add insult to injury even taking away a place of support and refuge for these parents due to your posting of shame and blame on them. Find your own web support and rage there. Give these parents some space to vent. Blessings

Vicki - posted on 01/06/2014

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My daughter is a narcissist. I did everything for her because I wanted her to make it. She was placed in special education and I fought to get her out. I helped her with her homework, bought her three cars that she totaled, did most of her work in college so she could graduate and have a chance at life. She lied about why she got divorced. She said he had tried to strangle her. The truth was he went out on her. My grand daughter was the greatest thing ever in my life. I was there for my daughter and my grand daughter up until three years ago. I helped take care of my grand daughter, played with her took her movies, paid a number of times for her child care because my daughter kept writing hot checks. My daughter was arrested for a ticket and a warrant was issued, I paid the $600 to get her out, I paid for part of her rent and so on.
She never thank me ever, but that is okay. I let my daughter and grand daughter live with me when my daughter was out of work, I would have never let it be hard on them. About 4 years ago my daughter met this man on the internet and he is living with her. Within a short time, my daughter said my grand daughter could not spend the night with me any more. Within a couple of months she wouldn't let me see her at all and it has been three years. I am afraid my grand daughter will think I have abandoned her and it still eats me up inside. She rents a house in the most expensive part of the Dallas area and tries to get my grand daughter in everything that will hook her up with wealthy neighbors. Two of her friends in the past, have told me that my daughter was a loser and I got really mad at them. However, now I realize she had used them up. I have read a lot about narcissist and it scares me for my grand daughter and that they don't change nor feel empathy for anyone. I really don't know what to do. It seems like you are there too.

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Virginia - posted 1 day ago

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Hey, I am getting notified that I am getting replies but don't see how to access them! HELP!

Virginia - posted 1 day ago

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Here is an update on my darling girl who chose to punish me by having me arrested! She herself has been arrested as well. I tried to do the right thing by meeting with a therapist. She can't handle that because she is a narcissist. Its never about them or their mistakes, its me, I am the broken one. Well I am broken! I have lost a stillborn son as well as my 28 year old 7 years tomorrow. While it would be nice to have ever gotten support from her on any of those awful angelversies OR birthdays or anything would be great but its never happened. She has no empathy for anyone beyond herself! She had to storm out and wait to ambush me in the parking lot out of anyone else's presence. I for one could never ever call my mother a f****ing Bitch! Well finally, I told her she was too. While I may never get mother of the year award, I have no regrets. I finally have my self-respect back. And I am done trying to placate this selfish, self-absorbed person. BTW, I am an RN. I do have an education in dealing with people in that profession capacity for 22 years. I am strong I am learning. Maybe its a kick in the behind from my kids in Heaven telling me that I am. I have to be. Tears, but feeling stonger.

Cindy - posted 1 day ago

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So happy to see that there are other moms on here that have dealt with similar problems.. Often there is a lot of judgement by people who only hear one part of a story.. ( adult children ) No one wants to question or confront the person because they fall into the web of lies that has been laid before them..My husband and I have been together 40 plus years. We have 9 children together.. Our children were loved, nurtured and had all the things they ever needed.. We were not rich , but the kids will always say they loved their childhood and hold wonderful memories of sharing and family.. I also loved our life even during hard times.. Dinners together , outside games and activities together, rides, mini vacations. , sports, .church, We have 15 grandchildren and our children are raising them with the same values..we see nothing wrong in the way we raised our family. Our children always had Great Christmas's and birthdays.. We were always able to provide.. Now you wonder , where am I going with this ? Well, one of our 9 children who is now 38, the 3rd born, was always angry and embarrassed of being in a large family, she always wanted more and would often hit, spit at, and torment her siblings. She would seek out the sympathy of whomever would listen to her stories.. She wanted more then we could give her and would make friends with people based on the wealth of their family and how much sympathy she could garner from her allegations of abuse.. Basically I called it, ( crying wolf ) we loved All our children equally and put lots of effort into our daughter just trying everything to make her happy. It is what parents do.. Nothing ever seemed to make her happy, if she was at school or even years later at work when she came across a person who did not fall in line and agree with her perceptions she would go after them with accusations and assaults.. In her 38 years if life she has used the word rape against several people and even the U.S. Navy, claiming the recruitor who gave her the physical abused her , being her mother I did what I thought I needed to do and called Washington with a complaint.. It never happened she accused men that she worked with of abuse, she accused the day care her son attended of rape, she accused her brothers friend of rape.. She would tell me that men found her so beautiful that the supervisor at the lumber store told her that she was to beautiful to be working there and that's why men bothered her.. Our daughter was never abused, never raped, she was in and out of our house and we tryed everything to help her but God knows how hard it was .. We never gave up but to this day everything that she has done is someone else's fault. She was very involved with drugs through school and to this day. Eventually she became pregnant and I thought maybe this might change her. , we tryed being involved but she cut contact again, during a visit with the doctor they told her that they found drugs and would have to report her if her tests came back positive again.. She changed doctors and said the doctor told her to smoke weed for nausea , I told her I didn't believe that a doctor would recommend that.. So she cut us off.. When her son was born we didn't see him and saw him once when she needed firewood for heat .. She sat smoking weed with her son in car seat soaked in dirty diaper while we cut wood and loaded truck.. I asked her to get help and yes I made a call out of concern for grandchild.. It went no where. The father of the child was in the picture but she often made accusations about him , we didn't talk because she had told vile lies about us, when she was trying to get custody of her son she documented how the 2 of them would capture animals and burn them alive in front if the son, you would think the courts would have mandated counseling but she played the victim card , still they stayed together, did their drugs together and even took pictures of her son at 2 years old smoking weed from a pipe.. Eventually she was arrested for driving under the influence, I went to court with her but she never went back, to avoid being arrested she went to a phych unit and bam, she learned the system and how to scam it.. She met a younger boy on the internet, kicked the father out and had the boy move in with her.. Suddenly she accused the boys father if molesting her son.. Well, I could go on and on, but I will say, I refuse to feel guilty about the way I feel, I'm tired of it , her siblings are tired of it.. She has made allegations and death threats against me and the family .. And after she goes off on a tangent she tries reconnecting , each time she reconnects when she cuts contact the attacks get worse .. I ( we ) are more peed off then hurt .. We have had enough, I, refuse to be attacked verbally and have lies and insults constantly waged against us.. I want her to stand up and be made accountable for all the lies.. At this point, I say, I want to never have any contact , it's much healthier , let her move on and have a life.. Just leave us alone.. She's a adult, she needs to take responcebility for her actions.. She's already destroying her sons life .. And I know if she continues to wage her vile attacks and spreading lies, I will in fact take her to court to prove all the things she spews.. I believe that she probably has mental health issues and her drug anuse has not helped that. What I resent is that the system has turned her into a victim.. And she has never had to take responcebity for her actions.. So if she's out there and can read this , I want her to know that we really are finished, it's healthier for all of us .. I do not feel any love and I know that's ok to say, I'm not going to candy coat it.. I plan on making it legal.. And I don't care if people judge me or my family.. It doesn't matter wheather or not it's your child they have no right to verbally or physically abuse. They are adults, you have done the best parenting possible.. And it's time that they stand up and take responcebility.. As a child my life truly was unbearable, the abuse was terrible but I never let it Impose on my family.. This daughter has benifited by playing the victim and LIEING ! And we are tired if it. We wish her luck on whatever her life journeys take her but we are finished .. Thanks for listening.. And I know that there are other parents out there that are afraid to admit how they feel but at some time you have to stop enabling ..

Virginia - posted 1 day ago

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I am new to this group and over the past few months, I have finally figured out after 7 months of this last silent treatment, I am no longer willing to grovel, beg or plead for whatever I have done this time. I finally was able to get my 32 yr old daughter into a counseling session with me to discuss whatever her issues were with me. I was encouraged until I saw the text from her, bring her passport and last years taxes. Okay, conditions again, Not because she might miss me or something normal like that. As soon as she met her new boyfriend last Memorial Day, it didn't take her long to let go of her narssicitic supply, me. Boy she can manipulate. Now, as of Dec., she is engaged to this one after breaking the engagement of the first fiancé at the same time! She now doesn't call me "mom", she calls me by my first name. When she entered the therapists office, I said hi, she snubbed me. Then the ranting and raving about what a bad person I am, and my whole family hates me. She was there for one reason and one reason only, which I suspected. She interupted the session to ask (demand), where are her things. I didn't bring them. I haven't really had time to look. I was very busy with my other daughter visiting me and I truly wanted to see that she was there only to get her stuff. She got up and told me she is done with me and stormed out. Luckily I was prepared for it. After studying on the ND sites, I have seen the error of my ways, You see, tomorrow is 7 years that we lost my son who was 28. She has been exploiting my bereaved mother's status all of this time, fully well knowing that I would do anything to not have to lose another child in any way shape or form. I just woke up and am tired of her demands on me and being ignored until I grovel, beg or plead asking her to please talk to me," what Have I done? I am sorry, call me, I love you". This IS the last straw! I stayed in the session and when I left, she was waiting to confront me at my car to call me an f'ing bitch, how dare I not give her those things. She got in my face pointing her finger at me, I got scared as she started to push me and squeezed my water bottle which got both of us a little wet. Then I left. When I got home, there were 2 police officers at my door coming to arrest me for assault and battery with a water bottle. This is all because I won't let her control me anymore. I have never been arrested in my life and while is was slightly humiliating, I knew in my heart that she made this up just to punish me! She stated that I threw water on her and then hit her in the chest with my flimsy little water bottle and showed them a red mark on her chest, obviously made by her. She had on a heavy winter coat, really? Okay, they take me home, we have a court date. Then I went to file a cross warrant. I am meeting her at the level that she is escalating this to. Oh, she also yelled at me "Now you have to lose another child because you are dead to me, and you won't be at my wedding or ever meet your grand-children" I said, well, I kind of figured that knowing you. How cruel is that to exploit the bereaved status of your own Mom? I have sent this girl numerous texts, phone calls, invites to counseling. When I found out about a very serious health issue she has, I was told by my other daughter, I sent a beautiful bouquet to her work, No acknowledgment because I didn't call that time. I was afraid of being ignored or yelled at if she did answer. I have figured out that the longer I don't let her control me, the angrier she gets, so who is in control now? Me, I am. I have filed cross charges due to her waiting to attack me away from the therapist, who would never have stood for her behavior or abuse. Now she has to take 2 times off from work. Its really funny to see that once you start treating them the way they treat you, they snap. She called me one time to tell me that she was engaged. I said" Congratulations, do you have anything else to say to me?" Her reply was "NOPE" Then she asked do I have anything to say to her and I replied " I don't know, you haven't spoken to me in months." Then the demands started! "HOW ABOUT AN APOLOGY! Me- "For what?" Then her "OMG! I don't believe you!" I then said that I am hanging up. I cannot let her suck me in again. And I hope that she can't have children. Her health issues may very well prevent that. I have already figured out that they would be pawns. Now that I have figured out that she is an ND to the max, I would rather deal without her abuse because she is so toxic to me. At least I know that I have been a great Mom to all of my kids, supporting and loving to them always, they all had the extras of summer camp and travels overseas with us. I have to live with self-respect for myself and I won't be a martyr for her anymore, like her love is a gift to give and take as she chooses. During one of her mini silent treatments. When I finally begged her to call me, I got the reason out of her ..... are you ready everyone ? ......" You didn't pick up my dry cleaning for me when I asked you to." She also gave me the cold shoulder for one whole month of Dec. She was going to Hawaii for 2 weeks with her first fiancé and asked me to go over every day to take care of and feed her cat. At the time, I was caregiver to my 92 year old Dad who was living with us for 8 months. I told her no because I am up to my eyeballs taking care of him and my own animals and house. And it was December and Christmastime. She blew up and me and refused to speak to me because as she said, "You don't work, you are home all day and you can't find one hour every day to help me? No, I can't. I texted her on Christmas Day to say "Merry Christmas", It was ignored. There is no real love from her to me, no wish for mutual love and respect. I can't be her doormat, whipping post and give in to her emotional terrorism and blackmail. Its really gotten severe over the last few years growing in severity and I don't know why.

Linda - posted 2 days ago

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Well, At a glance it appears that brain patterns indicate less activity in the area of the brain for empathy and more in the area of the brain that when at rest shows excessive self- absorption. That makes so much sense.

And reiterates that we must stay away from them, limit contact- which is so sad to me- but certainly has proven to be true. Each and every event that I've had with my daughter has been disastrous- showers, wedding- etc.

So- absolutely there is a genetic predilection- I think they said 68% can be accounted for by genetics. IN my case I am aware that due to my mother's treatment of me, I was too cautious with my daughter- avoiding confrontation- also she had a recognized anxiety disorder which made me even more cautious- sad- the little girl I thought I could reinvent the mother daughter relationship with- ended up duplicating it.
Linda

Sarah - posted 2 days ago

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The daughter with ODD was not officially diagnosed with ADHD, but she certainly displayed characteristics of the disorder. Both of my daughters are very attractive, and present charming personalities to strangers and colleagues. When I first read about ODD I remember that one of the researchers commented that people with this disorder are often perfectly normal outside the home?! Given your experience in the field, I'm reassured by your thought that my opinion re psychopharm is accurate.

Linda - posted 3 days ago

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Did the child who was dxed ODD also have ADHD? Just wondering as they usually flow together.? I will surely go back to some neuropsych journals to check it out- my husband believed that it was genetic- and he was in med school 40 years ago- when everything was the mother's fault- but I also remember when the Borderline DX first became 'news' how one psychiatrist was saying that these are all 'attractive' people.' Truth is that in my experience with narcissists- they do have a tendency to be able to get away with things more than 'average' in appearance or talent people.
Still my daughter even moves her hands like my mother used to do- with grace I might add. Love your perspective on why there is so little attention paid to this vis a vis psychopharm- and I'm quite sure that's accurate.

Linda

Sarah - posted 3 days ago

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Hi Linda,

Have spent hours on google, looking up "research articles on personality disorders", and "research articles on narcissism". That seems to screen anecdotal information. The heartbreak brought about by personality disorders is horrendous, and I believe that not enough research is being done--perhaps because the pharmaceutical industry doesn't see any payoff in drug development. One article stated that 70% of incarcerated men have personality disorders, so it seems to me that much more research is needed for the sake of society, never mind individuals who suffer.

If you have any trouble finding credible material, I will try to put together a list, with websites that will define narcissism and the other personality disorders. You might want to take into consideration that until recent advances in genetic and neurological research, it was common practice to blame environment, and some older psychiatrists and psychologists adhere to what they were taught in school 40 years ago, or 30, or 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago.

One of my daughters was diagnosed with Oppositional/Defiant disorder when she was only five--we were told her score was "off the charts". She has been a thorn in my heart for 50 years. The younger daughter was perhaps always a narcissist, but only recently became cruel and spiteful. Her long-term use of anxiolytics may have had an adverse effect on her personality. We cannot change these individuals, and need to try to find ways to heal our hearts. Good luck!

Linda - posted 3 days ago

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Sarah Wood, thank you for the info on the research regarding the genetics of this. I have worked in the mental health field all my life- now retired and my husband was a psychiatrist. My daughter from the age of 11 demonstrated the exact manipulative and destructive behaviors of my own mother who was a cruel, deadly narcissist. My father who had no psychological savvy used to say to me 'You're gonna have trouble with her." I in turn got angry with him- but as it has panned out- my God have I suffered on account of her. When she was a teenager- she's in her early 30's now- I found that I was becoming afraid of her- I'd do things to keep her from attacking me as I did with my mother- and so in that way I wondered if I wasn't reinforcing the stuff.
Can you direct me to literature that supports the genetics of this stuff?? And if I find any I w ill post it to the group.

Elaine - posted on 02/25/2015

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Than you Sarah it's hard to walk away but you are right I must it's consuming me
Many thanks

Elaine Steed

Sarah - posted on 02/24/2015

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Your comment about narcissists being made not born is not supported by neurological research. Personality disorders have been demonstrated to be genetic, with neuroscientists finding the alleles associated with narcissism, borderline personality disorder et alia. Your accusatory tone is very unkind to the mothers in this post who are clearly suffering great pain. Can't imagine what you hoped to accomplish.

Sarah - posted on 02/22/2015

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From all the research articles I have read on personality disorders (like narcissism) the conclusion is that these disorders are primarily genetic--the alleles have been found on the bands of chromosomes. So the sad and tired mothers who have narcissistic children should not add guilt to their heartbreak.

Most people are aware of the various mental illnesses that afflict family and friends, but very few people know about personality disorders--which can create havoc in families. The definition of a personality disorder from the Mayo Clinic is "a type of mental disorder in which you have a rigid and unhealthy pattern of thinking, functioning and behaving." Most people with personality disorders lack empathy and remorse--and someone else is always to blame for whatever negative behavior they exhibit.

The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders used by psychiatrists and psychologists only added personality disorders, and the descriptions in the mid-20th century.

While it is very disheartening to discover that a loved child has a previously well-disguised personality disorder like narcissism, there is no cure for them, so we must make ourselves carry on and try to enjoy life without them.

Elaine - posted on 02/21/2015

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To Vicky I have spent 2 hours responding to your letter and the computer somehow lost it please let me know if it's found I can't sleep but can't write anymore
please if any one finds my lost blog let me know Elaine a Steed

Allyson - posted on 02/21/2015

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I would buy the "a narcissistic adult child is made, not born" except that I'm the daughter of a slightly narcissistic mom and did everything possible NOT to follow in my mom's footsteps...I had 3 daughters, nurtured them, encouraged them, etc. and only 1 became unruly, disrespectful, and all the other ugly things that come out when someone is narccissistic...a term I just recently heard about and when I delved further into it, it was like they were talking about my middle daughter. So, is it genetic, kind of? I reallly don't know. All I know is that my 34 yr. old daughter began mistreating me when she was about 13 yrs old and hasnt' stopped. I do all I can for her; I've practically raised her 2 children because she wasn't there for them (drugs, etc.) and now that she's cleaned up her act, she's homeless and i offered her shelter...and I'm so sorry I did. I'm now trying to gather enough $$ to put a down payment on a small vehicle for her so she can hopefully "get on with her life" and take the children with her (their choice)...the kids who have been with me for years and are now treating me with as much disrespect as she does. All I know is, it hurts...and I'm sorry I feel the way I do, but it's like I can't wait for her and her children now to leave me in peace. It's borderline elder abuse (I'm 64). I'm so sorry I helped her and keep helping her...but I just want her gone. I know that sounds cruel and wrong, but I just want to have my older years more peaceful. She has a hard time working with others and thankfully has just recently gotten a job caring for animals (horses) and is doing well with that. Hopefully she'll be able to move out, soon. Her 12 yr old daughter is in counselling for her bad behaviors and I know if they counsellor knew just how MY daughter is, he'd understand the entire situation. As it is I'm always to blame for whatever goes wrong, or even slightly wrong. My heart goes out to all you moms who have an adult child with this disorder

Elaine - posted on 02/21/2015

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Please can I ask a q uestion of any family member or a person with scitzaphrinia
If the meds do stabilise the condition does the hating stop and the love return ?

Vicky - posted on 02/20/2015

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Jennifer was the "perfect"child. So sweet. And she always told me how lucky she was to have me as a mom and how her friends were all so jealous. She had never in any way that I know had hurt, let alone tried to hurt anyone until she tried to kill her father.After Larry died she got really cranky,but NONE of us were even remotely ourselves. But then she started trying to kill me. I was in denial. I would wake up at night and my almost 15 year old son would be on the floor by the couch I was sleeping on, holding a butcher knife. He said that he was so afraid that jennifer was going to kill me. I told him that he was overreacting because his daddy had just died. I tried to get her into counseling but she said she would kill me before getting treatment. That is when she started hitting me super hard, especially in my stomach. I never fought back. I would plead to her to please stop.TThe last time in that time period was when she was hitting so hard in the stomache.I said "Stop honey. You are going to kill the baby." She said that is what she was trying to do. That is when my son, casey, beat the shit out of her. She left that night and moved into her friends' family. [i have no idea what she told them]
When LJ was born, he was way different from other babies. He was/is Autistic like i am [ did not know why I was so different from other people at the time] which affected his behavior. But, there were other things too. He rarely slept [actually that is also an Autistic thing] and screamed as though in terrible pain, I kept bringing him to the doctor and he said he was fine, that every baby is different. When Autism was finally recognized, we all assumed that he had been in pain during his first year of life because of the sensory issues that usually come with autism.

It was years later that the pains came back. He would pass out dozens of times a day from the pain. That's when all the scans started and the lesions on both sides of his thalamus were discovered. A stroke, probably pre-birth, most likely from physical injury since both sides of the talamus are affected. Jennifer has never been told this. Neither has LJ [ I do worry that he will discover it now that he is an adult and can asses his records if he ever chooses to] My daughter is an RN and does work for Kaiser,, which is also our health provider, so I wonder if she knows this.

I do not think my daughter is a psychopath but I do not know. I think that she was so affected by believing my sister and trying to kill her dad that it has horribly affected her percetions. This is all I can handle right now.

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Elaine - posted on 02/20/2015

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Dear Sarah the shock of her husband brain Tumor could have switched on the trigge.r it sound more like schizophrenia or bi polar and she is probably ill she does not hate you it's the illness makes people channel their hate towards the ones they love mostlovelove,mistake was to argue with most

Sarah - posted on 02/19/2015

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Thanks for sharing your story--I thought I was alone in having a 49-year-old daughter turn on me, after I spent all her life loving her, cherishing her, and supporting her. She has recently fabricated stories from her childhood to justify her cruel treatment of her Mom. She is a classic narcissist, although she doesn't seem to display grandiosity. She has just cut off communications--won't answer the phone, and doesn't email. She is planning to dump her spouse because he had to have a brain tumor removed, and still has some lingering disabilities that make it difficult for him to work. She's outraged that he can't contribute more to household expenses, and doesn't appreciate that he has spent all his time creating art, and trying to sell it at local market days.

Vicky - posted on 02/18/2015

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Maybe it is partly my fault that my 39 year old daughter is the way she is. I do not know.

I grew up in a household filled with malignant narcissists where I, being the "weirdo retard"[ decades before I knew I was Autistic] was picked as the scapegoat. The beatings, the rapes, and worse, NEVER hearing I was a good girl or sweet girl, or nice girl or smart or pretty girl ever. Everything [even my older brothers problem with raping little girls] was my fault.

When I was 7 or 8 years old, in one of my mothers' magazines [ I think it was McCalls] I read an article stating that children who had grown up with much tragedy tended to grow up to be happier adults. I chose to believe it 100% and after that most of their
abuse [mot all] slid off like water on a duck.

I started planning on how I was going to raise my child someday, and give her the love I never had. Sounds weird, but, I even worked hard on giving the type of love that my mother had for one of my sisters to the "little Vicky" part of myself
So,I grew up thinking life would be better when I was an adult. I was wrong.Life was more incredibly wonderful than I could have imagined. People were not mean to me. People did not call me ugly. They were nice to me. In retrospect, I was used by many people, but it was so many years later. At the time it gave me confidence. Hell yeah, it is what is called the wrong kind of attention, but any attention that was not brutal abuse felt good to me.

I did a very brief stint working as a Playboy bunny [ not pretty but wore tons of makeup and had a tiny body with ginormous boobs in the days before implants] that is more or less how I met my first husband.

Long story, but we married a few months later and moved to Montana.[ he gave up law school because he was afraid of what my family would do. He thought he would eventually go back, but that never happened.

Exactly 9 months after we were married Jennifer was born. I was incredulous. Actually, I never stopped.she was gorgous and smart, just like her dad. [ beauty queen later on and won bronze metal for the "Olympics of the Mind" when she was 11.

She was so sweet, and funny! OMG I actually got an achy belly from laughing. 2 years later Casey was born. I spent years pinching myself to see if all of this wonderfulness was true.

My husband turned out not to be that great a husband. He didn't really like to work and became alcoholic. It took me so long to realize that I did not have a good marraige and by the time I did, he had already been diagnosed with a fatal type of leukemia. He was sick for 3 and a half years.

When the oncologist told me that Larry was going to die soon, I called my youngest sister. Now, Kym is a major bitch, but she had a degree in psychiatric nursing,and she did love to show off her knowledge. Though I called my family through everyones illnesses and heartaches, she, nor my other families had called to ask how Larry was doing.

I was pregnant with my youngest at the time.[doc said that the chemo he was on was the best birth control. happily not] and Jennifer was 17, Casey 14. My sister called back and was able to convince my daughter that her dad was faking cancer.

Jennifer had recently been raped [pregnant too, aborted] and she BEGGED me not to go to the police because she did not want her daddy to die worrying about her.

so, when I was at work, Jennifer tried to kill Larry. My son and my daughters boyfriend pulled her off. Larry died a few weeks later wondering if his baby girl loved him.

I have to stop again. Will try to do more tommorrow.

Elaine - posted on 02/16/2015

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I have had exactly the same experience except my daughter now 30 has been sectioned under the mental health act with bipolar ,
please look this up I think you will find similar traights my grandchildren are only 7 and 2 so Mium tells them what they don't like or like Its very cruel to the kids too. one minuet they have grandparents the next they are taken away. Your daughter sounds like mine selfish and never sorry . I am the butt of all her problems
It's heartbreaking but she is obviously using your grandchildren as pawns and turning them against you As they are much older than my grandchildren can't you have a private chat with them and say how you feel ?
All the phycology books say to never apologise for something you haven't done pull back a bit let her think you don't need her and ignore her texts She may be ill and need mood stabilisers or counselling
Good luck elaine P S I need to say that my daughters had a very normal childhood was a bit spoiled they were taken by us on holidays all over the world somtimes twice a year also they were never smacked or hit ever

Mary - posted on 02/15/2015

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Honeybee I read your post and the article on personality disorder. I was told that my daughter has that but I also think narcissist describes her as well as sociopath. She has been diagnosed with bi-polar disorder. I've been through hell and back with her and I tried for so so many years with her but it has gotten so bad we now do not speak. If only she would own the things she has done and apologize and move on but she is in denial and will not own up to anything. Her son wants nothing to do with her because of all the abuse she put him through and she denied what she has done to him. My heart breaks for both of them. She has 3 other children and they are all separated now and my heart breaks for them too. There is to much to tell I just can't go down that road again. I will say they all need so much prayer.

Mary - posted on 02/15/2015

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Sorry to hear about all your pain that you daughter has caused you. I been down that road all the lies my daughter has told about me all the bullying she has done to me and all the manipulation for so many years. I cut ties with her 2 years ago it's been hard but I'm ok. I pray you will be too.

Elizabeth - posted on 02/13/2015

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I am so sorry to hear of everyone's pain but dear God, I'm glad I'm not alone. I was looking up Electra complex which didn't quite fit (what little I could find), which led me to narcissism, which led to this post. My daughter is 41 and I'm quite sure she has been a narcissist since the day she was born. From the time she was two months old if there were family or friends over and I put her in another room for quiet at bedtime she screamed bloody murder. If I put her in the playpen in the middle of all of the activity, she slept. Long before the term 'photobomb' was coined, she managed to get into every picture I ever took (I used to think that was cute). I left her father when she was 18 months old not because he beat me up every day, but because he beat HER up when I was at work. I remarried a year and a half later. She hasn't had it easy, and I accept responsibility for anything I have or have not done that contributed to her pain. But I won't be her punching bag anymore.
Turns out he was a pedophile. She told me when she was 28 and said she knew she could make it stop any time, but she was getting what she wanted, so she let it go on. What she ultimately wanted was to have me removed from the family. She was successful, demanding to my husband that either he get rid of me or she would leave. Then the lies began in earnest. She told her sister she took care of her when she was a baby. She was FOUR. She couldn't take care of herself, let alone a baby. But the lie served her well, her sister called me very upset and accusing.
The day she told me about my ex abusing her she turned right around, called her sister and told her I knew about it all along. I DID NOT. She asked me when she was 9 why her dad was in her room naked one night. I said I didn't know and immediately called the authorities. After interviewing her and him, they decided she had been dreaming.
They were successful in their deceit. Is that such a surprise? If the other kids didn't know, and they were a lot closer to her than I, how would I know? I talked to those kids over and over again about sexual abuse. Whenever an ad came on television, whenever they told me about some kid in the neighborhood or in their school, whenever a lifetime movie came on, whenever I read an article in a magazine or the newspaper regarding the subject. I told them if anything like that ever happened to them to tell someone. Anyone. If not me, a neighbor, an adult at school, the lady at the grocery store. SOMEONE. But she never did until it served her purposes 20 years later. That purpose was to keep me and my ex apart. Before I knew what had been going on, we tried to reconcile. She would have none of it. She didn't want him, but she didn't want me to have him either.
When my great grandchildren were born (twins) last year, not a word from her. I got pictures from my other daughter and my grandchildrens facebook pages.
There is so much more, but I'm through with her. She made some nasty comment around Christmas and after telling her it hurt my feelings (something I have never done with her--call her out), waiting a week for acknowledgement and receiving none, I cut ties. Her sister is upset. There was no contact from her over the holidays. Her sister's responses to my few messages over the past few months have been curt. I'm sure HERSELF is at it again. I refuse to suffer the manipulation, the bullying, the deception, the disrespect, the ungratefulness, the complete lack of empathy, the blaming and betrayal anymore. I'm 60 and have had two strokes. As much as it hurts, as sad as it makes me, the emotional injury incurred by setting myself up as her victim by continuing contact with her is just too much to bear. God Bless you all, I hope you find peace. I'm sure there is a grieving process, it certainly feels like a death has occurred. I hope it gets better as time passes. Because right now, I'm a wreck. ♥

Vicky - posted on 02/10/2015

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my 39 year old daughter. So much pain. Right now I am being treated for breast cancer. She actually convinced my neighbors I am faking cancer. So much but that is what is happening now. I cannot stop crying.

Mary - posted on 02/10/2015

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For me I can not and will not love another child. I was Blessed to at least get the chance to fall in love with my Grandkids for their first 9 years of their life just to have them takin from me every time my daughter got mad at me. I was more like their mother and was raising them. My pain cuts so deep that I will never fall in love like that again.

Mandilowthiansmith - posted on 02/06/2015

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Thank you. Wth 4th year Uni Psychology, and 20+ years volunteering with people who frequently have psychiatric issues such as the ones described, I really think that it's up to a doctor to make this decision. And believe me when I say that they like to change their minds. So don't worry about diagnosing someone on a website, and join us in disclosure and solutions.

Mandilowthiansmith - posted on 02/06/2015

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b I am starting to believe that you and I may have been separated at birth ;). You spelled it out for me, and thank you. You are a gem.

It is so rare to hear about the DAUGHTER being the abuser. I am well educated and had a good job, and am popular and well liked. I am particularly sensitive to child abuse because I went through 10 years of advanced abuse (all 3 spectrums) and while I am eccentric and a bit loony, but generally I'm well liked by young and older people too.

My daughter, 23, is gorgeous, brilliant, wilful, and can't keep a job. and She fabricates horrific stories about me. She treats me like the help. She lies to her father about what I am worth, etc. to stir the divorce up (which nearly bankrupted me). The odd time when her dad and I get along, she has a screaming fit. Furious that her dad took a vacation with his gf without her. And boy can she pack a punch! Scratched my face; ripped my hair, Whoa! That was my line in the sand. Zero. Tolerance.

Even with a background in Psyc etc I never really connected with this truth until today, after reading your story. I do not pretend to be free from sin - I smoked when I was pregnant with her, and I am an alcoholic (nearly 25 yrs sober). And it's true, I enabled her. Now I know why my doctor kept saying to be careful around her - she might accuse me of who knows what, and call the police (her words)

Sick stuff but at least we are wiser tor it and are in a position to do something about it - starting with our own self respect. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU MWAHHH BIG FAT KISSY! ;)

Mary - posted on 01/27/2015

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Hello,

Your post was very helpful to me in that I also have experienced these same abuses from my 36 year-old daughter. What I most appreciated about your post was that you said keep on loving them, don't give money or possessions, but just keep them. That is a good perspective that I can appreciate very much.

Thank you!

Honey - posted on 01/22/2015

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A lot of you ladies here, I know I quibbled about your daughters not being narcissists without someone making them so, but I have taken a closer look at some of your stories and I believe that there are lots of genuine mothers here who are in a lot of pain and at a loss as to how their daughters became this way. Reading through, a lot of you are right in that you did nothing immediately obvious that could account for the attitude and actions of your offspring. Looking into personality disorders further, I believe in that case, that quite a few of you children may in fact be displaying signs of Antisocial Personality Disorder, rather than NPD. Reading through this link here http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/insi... it seems that there are many similarities that present themselves in both disorders, but that APD can be caused by genetic/inbuilt personality traits, perhaps exacerbated by upbringing, where as NPD is fundamentally a disorder brought about by childhood, nurturing conditions. I don't know whether this may be of any help to anyone, but I wish you good luck with dealing with your difficult relationships with your daughters.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_...

Honey - posted on 01/22/2015

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All I say to this, is that most narcissists are that way because they were made, not born. These mothers who now cry poor me, are probably the ones who made them the way they were, either by treating them like little princesses who could do no wrong, and always giving into their demands, or smothering and manipulating them. I myself doubt whether the daughter is actually the narcissist, or if in fact it is the original poster. Some of things that the daughter has said sounds like she is drawing some clear boundaries for herself and her children, perhaps after years of being encroached on by the narcissistic mother, and she has just come hear for some validation that she is the one in the right, and not an awful person. So sorry, I don't believe in people dealing down the generations, but I believe in dealing up. If someone is a narcissist, as opposed to someone who is just indulged, it is because someone made them that way, and that person is usually the first narcissist in the chain. Just my two cents.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 01/20/2015

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@ Ms. Wallace: If you have nothing better to say...You know the rest.

If you cannot handle the viewpoint of an adult daughter of a narcissist parent...well, tough! This isn't YOUR website, its a PUBLIC, INTERNATIONAL FORUM.

Furthermore, if you have allegations about ME, specifically, feel free to contact me. You know how.

Nancy - posted on 01/20/2015

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Hi Everyone~I can't believe I finally found a forum where moms are talking about their narcissistic adult daughters and my heart truly goes out to you all. My daughter is 44 & it has taken me this long to get to the "no contact" stage. For those of you who are still trying and if your daughter is, in fact, narcissistic, cut your losses now. I know that sounds cold, but with narcissits there is no hope. For many years my heart kept saying, "She's my daughter." So when she needed a place to go or whatever it may have been, she knew(because my actions told her over & over)mom would always take her back & be there for her every whim, no matter how much abuse she had dished out the last time. I won't go on & on; All of our stories sound scarily similar. Our daughters are never satisfied with just being cruel. They like to make sure everyone else believes you are a horrible person. The longer the "no contact" is avoided, the more relationships, especially with other family members, will be destroyed. The problem is that they can be so charming & believable & other people(including myself)who don't have NPD cannot imagine that someone would lie about this stuff. You can't win. You have to go. I,too, went through the pain of my grandchildren being withheld...what a great tool. It works. I had to let them go, too. It is what it is, but I felt as if I was dying a slow painful death so I really had to choose life. If one hasn't been the victim of a narcissist, there is no way to understand the horror. I have cried to the point of screaming in emotional sorrow. And all I ever really dreamed of being was a mother. Who knew? I stopped feeling sorry for myself and started caring about myself and life is peaceful and I hope to continue to move forward. God bless. And keep writing here....please.

Diane - posted on 01/18/2015

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Hi. Cynthia, if you are reading us, please share more of what your counselor recommends. It sounds solid to me. I have two narcissistic daughters -- my husband was one and he has a family history of it. No love and nurturing on my part changed a thing. I tried to move away to another city, but ended up returning --this is my home, too, and where my job is and my roots and my friends. One daughter I have No Contact with and the other daughter is limited contact. With distance and clarity, I can see that my daughters were always so different from me. Thinking back to their personalities and who they were and who they are now; I realize that the separation we have now perhaps was always meant to be and that as life unfolded, this was always where it would end up. I am a trusting, gentle person (a bully magnet), and I am sensitive and feel deeply. And my children are who they are. They never understood me and always equated kindness and gentleness as weakness to be disdained. Our separation was the only outcome possible. The only good thing is that my years of striving to maintain our relationships helped me to build good relationships with my grandkids. When they are 18, many of them will return to me. As Cynthia said, this is now the End Game.

Jeanie - posted on 01/18/2015

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My husband and my two sons think my daughter is NPD. I set on the fence unable to be sure.
She is 42 and lives with us because she seems unable to support herself in the manner she likes, if she has to pay bills.
I have seen her hurt, use and abuse people in the past. Many times with no remorse. I have known her to change the details of past event to make her self look better. She is confusing in what she wants and what she does. She has hurt me many times with her actions and words.
Her brothers have grown to very much dislike her and not want her around. My husband feels like them but holds on for me.
My problem with this is: Sometime when she gets herself in a mess and needs help out, I see a spark of hope in her, a spark that may lead to her changing. My husband says it is more manipulatng of me.
I hate to give up on her but the family situation is getting rough. My sons want nothing to do with her and my husband is getting a little miffed with me foe indulging her so much.
What do you mothers think, what was your defining moment, what made you sure?
I know when she is not living with us life is much better. Please I will listen to all answers, no judgement.

Jeanie - posted on 01/18/2015

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Hello, Ladies.
I am on the fence here and it hurts. I have a 41.5 year old daughter who could have NPD. My husband (her stepfather) and her two brothers say she has NPD. They say she uses and abuses all of us. Her two brothers have gotten to the point where they do not want her around at all.
I have seen her use people, hurt people and cause harm, with no remorse and even laugh about it. She dose keep me confused with what it is she wants because when I give her what she wants its not good enough and we go on to something else. She has hurt me deeply before.
I tell my husband and sons that sometimes I see a spark of hope that she will change. This is usually after she has gone through a tough time and she needs us. But then I can see some feeling and hope there. My husband and sons just shake their heads.
I think my question here is, How do you know they are NPD, what is the defining trait that , you "just know".
She has caused many problems, seeming to repeat the same ones over and over. Drama is her Queen and It is all about her. She is mostly selfish and does change the past to make her look good.
Have I described a NPD to you?
I really look forward to any responses to this.

Lorraine - posted on 01/09/2015

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Shawn has nothing else to do but cause turmoil. Get off this website, Shawn

Jeanne - posted on 01/08/2015

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I am so sorry to hear what all of you Mom's are going through on here with your daughters, I've been going through it for 10 years or more with my 24.5 year old daughter. She was questioning me on where I would apply for jobs and school and would call and destroy my chances. I'm not sure what to do. I was a single Mom for 20 years with no child support and I couldn't even support myself anymore. I've let her go and don't know my grandsons, now she's trying to get back in my life now that I have another daughter. I can definitely empathize with all of you. But what can be done? I hope to end this and hope it ends for all of you also, but from what i'm seeing dealing with narcissists is that No contact is the only help. That was great in dealing with her father, but she's my child, and whenever she comes back I can't turn her down. We're not alone in all this, which I definitely felt for the last 10 years. thank you everyone for posting, it's helping me to understand a little more. i'm looking for help for how to stop them in their tracks in trying to destroy me. She just met her Dad at 17 for the first time since she was 2, he promised in 1991 to come back and turn the children away from me and he has, he is crazy and dangerous, he almost killed our daughter when she was 15 months old, and me and our son. Our son won't have anything to do with either of them, thank goodness.

Nean - posted on 01/07/2015

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What a revelation it has been reading all of the comments about narcissistic daughters. For the first time in 30 years I have been able to understand what might be going on between my daughter and I! Don't get me wrong, I love my girl with all my heart. She is smart, pretty, funny, she is charismatic and I believe she will achieve much in her life. But she is also cruel, condescending, self pitying, she constantly re-writes history to make herself look the victim (and me the perpetrator), she has absolutely no concept of me as a human being with needs and feelings and deserving of respect. And do you know - she has been this way since she first began to communicate. Rages which resulted in holes in walls and destroyed furniture (she would always deny any memory of this by the way), demands for items which, when purchased, were never good enough, screaming at me for an imagined slight (age 15 - "you promised me a PONY!!), making demeaning comments about me to her friends and in-laws, I could go on and on, but I get the feeling the mothers on this site get my meaning. I am a soft hearted and loving woman, I find it very easy to love my family and friends and offer them anything in the world, as a consequence my close relationships are quite good. But with my daughter I have always struggled to connect. On one occasion I was experiencing a mild depression and - silly me - confided in my daughter my sadness. Well! How dare I be so selfish! She gets to see me once a week and I ruin the visit by feeling down! I bought her an expensive set of car seat covers for her birthday, I was so excited that I could barely contain myself when driving to her flat to present them to her. The look on her face when opening the gift was one of fury. "What makes you think I would EVER want something as ugly as this?" She demanded. I just wanted to cry, honestly, I just didn't get it. Was I really that idiotic, that stupid, that my choice of gift was an insult to her? Was it so selfish of me to feel sad when she visited me? These examples and thousands more constantly caused me to question myself and my mothering. And even when she was obviously abusive, when her behaviour could not be excused away (case in point - my son passed away in a car accident at age 19 and some 12 years later my daughter and I had another falling out - she said I was to never contact her again. Her parting words to me were "will you grieve for me like you did HIM?" So inexcusable that I did not speak to her for many months) even then I would blame myself for failing her as a parent, for not creating the boundaries that I should have with her, for not teaching her right from wrong. So I never actually let myself off the hook. Until now, until stumbling upon this forum. At last there is proof that I am not alone! It is so hard to relate to all the other mothers I know because they don't have the same issues that I do. Sure I know about mother daughter relationships that are toxic but almost always it is about mothers who are immature and self centred and not appreciating their daughters enough. Never have I been able to nod in recognition at a woman's story of heartache because her adult daughter had no empathy toward or respect for her. Until now.
I read in another forum (interestingly enough one dedicated to daughters of narcissistic mothers - yes, you guessed it!) that the first step in recovery was accepting that your narcissistic loved one just does not love you and never will. Whoa...that's tough. But it's absolutely true. One woman on the forum said "it's like my mother is colourblind and I'm trying to get her to appreciate a rainbow..." My daughter does not love me and never will. My beautiful, clever, talented, baby girl who hugged me so tight when she was little does not love me. She does not know how and does not want to know how. How I proceed from here is not clear but here is where I must start if I am ever to live the rich, beautiful life that I deserve. So no my darling I will not grieve for you like I grieved for my son, but I will grieve for you nonetheless. Grieve for the relationship we could have had. And thank you other mothers for helping me so much in my journey.

Tina - posted on 01/06/2015

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Cynthia, can you please tell me what "heading" or "title" this particular thread is under. I JUST found this website and can't figure out how to find this particular thread. Thank you so much. I need this:(

Sheryl - posted on 01/06/2015

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I am 45 and finally doing research to understand my daughter. I had such an abusive mother both physically and emotionally . She was definitely a narcissist. Then of course I married one again physically and mentally abusive .. I stayed for 17 years. I was so broken .. Suicidal in such deep pain daily.. I then left him with the help of the kindest gentlest man on earth. The divorce was so horrendous I ended up with nothing . Literally the man took 3 cars two houses 4 million dollar business and I am extremely poor now but trying to desperately heal mentally . It's a fight daily .. I made so many mistakes with trying to protect my children from him while we were married that they learned only to disrespect and abuse me too. My daughter acts just like him ... It is so awful how badly I failed to change the course of history .. I cry and grieve daily . I no longer trust anyone I have no friends no family but my animals which I have built my life around .. I have withdrawn from the painful hurt of the world .. And I don't know how to trust ever again..

Janice - posted on 01/02/2015

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Hi, I'm the child of an obvious, violent narcissist and an enabler (and of course I may or may not have a disorder myself - no-one can judge that for themselves). I hope I'm not being inappropriate by posting here.

I'm really sorry for those of you who have been hurt, bullied, slandered or manipulated. That is never right from anyone and you are entitled to be furious.

However, I'm a bit disturbed by the number of people on here who seem to be implying that their children have been 'obviously disordered since they were children' and 'used their parents until it was time to find a new source of money/attention/validation/whatever'. This is also natural behavior by children/people trying to get away from abusive family situations. Many of us have some level of psychological problems, caused by abuse. This also feeds into an inability to make good decisions or become fully independent as quickly as we would like.

If someone's only justification for calling their own child abusive is repeated attempts to cut off contact, coupled with anger without deliberate malice, then PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE BE VIGILANT. That person may well be a Narc in disguise heaping yet more blame on the scapegoat who is finally managing to disengage themselves. I can well imagine my narcissistic parent finding forums like this in a few months' time (hi dad!) when he realises I have quietly cut off all contact. Believe me, he is not a person anyone who is already hurting would want in their lives or on their forum.

Shelly - posted on 12/31/2014

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I started looking into this since my daughter has taken my grandchild away AGAIN! She is now expecting a new baby and I am not even sure if I should get excited. I am starting to believe she is a narcissist and no matter how much I try to help her or do for her I am crazy and I am creating drama. She left our home 2 months ago and even though we all miss the grandchild so much we all feel so much better not having all of that drama, walking on egg shells and listening to her demean us all.
I wish I could have a normal relationship with my grandchildren, but I have never been allowed to have her by myself or without her mom looming over me. We have offered to take her to the zoo, movies, the beach and my daughter refuses even if she is allowed to go. I really feel she uses the child as a pawn to manipulate. She even said when she left she was pregnant and we would never see either child again.

Cynthia - posted on 12/28/2014

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My heart goes out to all of you because...i too have two completely self absorbed, mean spirited daughters who are in their 30's as well. It is a tough one because you are damned if you do and damned if you don't with your daughters. We don't want to lose them or our grandchildren but we need to seriously look at the fact that our daughters are abusing us...no matter our ages and holding our hearts hostage by denying us the right to see our grandchildren, by putting us down, by demanding that its their way or the highway, or the "moving forward now" comments as though its our fault that we don't measure up or meet their standards, holy moly the list goes on and on and on with these kids. I have finally in the last month began seeing a therapist....and believe it or not if you get a good one and follow their advice it does make a difference and does work. As he says....you have to start out with the basics and don't go where you are not invited. It seems like a simple statement but its not. It means...do not offer advice to them unless invited, do not go to their homes...unless invited, do not buy your grandchildren or daughers anything...unless invited, the list goes on and on and on. I hope within time i can find a way to find peace in my heart with this but realize that my daughters and I have reached what i am calling End Game....i am entitled to a life, to be happy, to have self worth, to not be criticized for what i have done or failed to do. We need to remember that even tho they are adults we are still the parents and have to set our own boundaries with them as well. God Speed To All Of Us...................

Lee - posted on 12/25/2014

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You leave, no contact period. You may decide to try it again .... Set boundaries but it's soon figured out and child becomes worse! Just leave. It's the sane thing to do, God Bless

Lee - posted on 12/25/2014

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Hey Everyone, I'm also a mom of a Narcisstic daughter, you right about how you're feeling, everything you've done will never be enough, my goodness will never be seen in the content it's given. It's useless to hope they ever love you, really you forfeit your life for them ! Don't feel guilty please! You've done all you can do, nothing ever will be enough, but just keep loving them that's all you can do. Give nothing, as money or items won't buy them just set up your bounderies and keep them! That's important, don't give in cause you will bevseen as weak,, God Bless you xox

Lina - posted on 12/06/2014

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To Lydia Hall, that is great that you can find love in your heart to give to other people. Honestly I'm not sure that my broken heart allows me to do that. I've had children that even called me grandma, but that doesn't replace my loss and I cannot love them the way I love my own. When people try to include me in their celebrations I feel the humiliation of being rejected by my own and as an outsider. I could be with other families for the holidays and pretend that I'm ok, but I'm not and thus stay by myself until the storm that comes with Christmas goes away.

User - posted on 12/05/2014

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I totally support your decision not to get involved in the life of your grandchild since I sit here wishing I had never gotten involved with mine. My two have been used to manipulate and hurt me in every way imaginable. As much as I love them and they love me, I wish I had never met them. I have found that there are many families that crave and totally appreciate a stand-in grandmother. Find a family or two to "adopt" and reap the amazing benefits of being loved and appreciated. I will never stop missing my grandkids, but the love of other children and their parents tremendously reduces the pain.

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