Pitbulls and Children
MOST HELPFUL POSTS
Kate CP - posted on 02/08/2010
Well I have to put in my two cents since I'm a dog trainer and rescue worker. I think every dog is equally dangerous around small children. The problem is people get stupid and lazy and leave the dog alone (if even just for a moment) with the kid. Any large dog with strong jaws are capable of inflicting serious or fatal damage to a human being if provoked. What provokes a dog? Anything can which is why it's so important to never, EVER leave a dog alone with a child for any length of time. My dogs aren't allowed in my daughter's room, aren't allowed on the sofas when she's sitting up there, and they have to go to their beds (or kennel) whenever we are eating.
Some fun facts about "pitbulls":
1. There is no such dog. :D The word "Pitbull" these days has become a term encompassing any type of dog with a large, square head. People are constantly typing dogs as a "pit" when in fact they're something else entirely like a Cane Corso.
2. American Staffordshire Terriers were bred to fight other dogs and be sweet and docile to their handlers. Any dog that showed any aggression was immediately destroyed. So the idea that all "pits" are bred to be vicious isn't really true: they're bred to be vicious to other animals, NOT humans.
3. Staffordshire terriers are actually known as the "Nanny dog" for their calm and sweet disposition around children
4. "Pits" cannot lock their jaws, that is a myth. They are very stubborn and strong, however, thus the reasoning behind what many "pit" owners call a "bite bar" which is a long rod (usually metal) that a "pit" owner will use to pry open their dog's mouth should they get into a fight.
5. The traditional American Staffordshire Terrier only weighs in at 30-40 pounds. The dogs you see that around 60 pounds and up have been bred with mastiffs to get their massive size.
Now, some dog facts you may not know:
The dog breed that bites most frequently: chihuahua
The dog breed that bites most frequently and causes damage that requires medical attention: cocker spaniels followed closely by yellow labs
For a fun game, try finding the pitbull:
Want to know what kind of dog the dog trainer is afraid of? Chow chows. Why? I can't tell what they're thinking or what they're about to do. And they are completely unpredictable-even more so than other breeds of dog. The breed of dog that I absolutely just DO NOT like (not fear, but just can't stand) is the chihuahua and boston terriers. They both drive me nuts. :P
Kyle - posted on 02/08/2010
If these links don't work just Google Pit bull saves lives.
NOT ALL BIG MUSCULAR DOGS ARE MONSTERS!
Jenny - posted on 01/31/2010
I have two APBT's, aged 7 &6. They are just dogs in different suits. There are asshats out there who can wreck any dog for public behaviour. Any dog can bite and any dog can attack. I have taught my children not to approach strange dogs, espeically not to touch them unexpectedly. I have taught them not to share food with dogs. I crate train so they have their own special spot where the kids are not allowed to go. I do not allow them to play alone together with dogs, especially more than one dog at a time.
I trust my pets completely and they have bomb proof temperments but I prefer to live pro-actively with dogs and reduce any potential risks.
Kate CP - posted on 02/09/2010
If two adults own a dog, and they NEVER bring it around other people, then what's going to happen when the girl scouts come around selling cookies
Oo! Oo! I know what happens! I've had to deal with it! I had a couple come to me once because they had a rat terrier who was a vicious little dog and bit every one. AND there were a few people who needed stitches, too. Know why? They NEVER socialized the dog properly. Now, they took it every where with them but it was always being held or in a carrier and that will make any dog insecure and nuts. It took months of work just to get the dog to trust me enough to take a treat from my hand and NOT try to eat ME at the same time.
Ahh, the glory of dog parks. The problem with dog parks are, of course, the stupid people. You get the people who bring the big dogs to the small dog section because "He's just such a sweetie and would get beat up over in the large dog area." Then the morons who bring their little dachshund into the large dog area because "She's always been so rough and can hold her own!" I saw said dachshund get chased by one large dog while they were playing. Then another dog joined in. And another and another until you had a pack of large dogs chasing this one small dog. Pack hunt mentality set in and the dog was literally torn apart in seconds.
Dogs are never the problem. HUMANS are the problem. They do stupid things because they think that dogs act and feel like humans. Dogs don't get "angry" and "sad" and "happy" like humans do. It's not the same emotion and so using a label for a human emotion can be dangerous. Your dog didn't pee on your couch because he's mad at you. He peed on your couch because you were usually home by 4:30 in the afternoon and, yes, he can normally hold it much longer than that but you changed the rules by not coming home at the normal time. When one rule changes for a dog the animal thinks that all the rules have changed and new behaviors begin. Dogs are non-confrontational in nature and THAT is why when you shout at a dog they look away and "act guilty". It's not because they ARE guilty or have that emotion, it's because they are sending you the message "I don't want to fight." Dogs are not humans not in any form or fashion and the sooner humans can get that through their thick skulls the better off all dogs and dog owners will be.
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Unfortunately, PBs seem to be the pet of choice for ignorant no dicks with something to prove. They can be very hairtrigger, depending on how overly bred their line, but, like any dog, it's all about the owners standing up and being Alphas. Any dog can get out of hand if they are not controlled. And the reason chihuahuas are the number one aggressive dog is because people treat them like toys and do not teach them respect and obedience.
Charlene - posted on 02/28/2010
Belinda, I couldn't agree more. I also don't think that people understand how much exercise Dalmatians need or that they are very hyper for the first two years. A lot of people get them because they are cute, but don't want to put the time and effort into exercising and training them. A lot of people give them up before they hit their first birthday.
Also, my neighbour had two Dals when I was younger who were very mild tempered and good with kids, but one was deaf and he said something like 1 out of 7 of them are because they are so inbred.
This guy though, spent more time walking, running and biking with these two dogs and going to the dog park than any other dog owner that I knew/know. And sometimes it still wasn't enough for the dogs!
Lyndsay - posted on 02/28/2010
This topic makes me go ballistic. Pitbulls are actually banned here in Ontario... it is illegal to own one born after summer 2006, when the ban went into effect. They are not vicious because they are pitbulls, they are vicious because their owners train them to be that way. Pitbulls are extremely loyal dogs and they are strong, which is why they are one of the most common types of dogs to be trained as a guard dog or other type of attack dog. Since the ban on pitbulls, the incidence of dog bites or attacks by rottweilers and dobermans has gone up immensely. Oh, what a shock -- those are also strong, loyal dogs that people choose to guard them/their families/whatever. I really don't get how people can't see the connection there.
As for pitbulls with small children. I have a two and a half year old boy and an almost two year old pitbull (she was born after the ban, in the summer of 2008), and they are the best of friends. My dog does not have a mean bone in her body... she is gentle and she is patient with him, and I'm actually more afraid for her most of the time than I am for my son. He climbs on top of her and rides her like a pony and she lets him.. when he jumps on her while she's having a nap she gets up to play with him, then will go back to bed when he's bored. She knows her place in the family and she is honestly the most well behaved dog I have ever owned. When I was a kid I owned a miniature wiener dog and he bit me in the face because I tried to pick him up. My current dog, the supposedly vicious maneater, has never even barked or growled at me.
Belinda - posted on 02/28/2010
Charlene: I don't think a lot of people realize how aggressive a Dalmation can be. I had one as a child (101 Dalmations had just come out) and he was wonderful with us but would tear you up of he didn't know you. They are not good for kids.
Charlene - posted on 02/27/2010
I have to disagree that it's ALL to do with the owners, A LOT yes, but there is still that small percentage of temperment that's hardwired into their brains.. that's the same with ANY breed though.
From my encounters with 'Pitbulls', they are usually docile and quite often so dopey/dumb that they are just too cute not too love. That being said, I will never own one just because of a couple seperate occasions, where I personally witnessed very well trained pitbulls attack unsuspecting people, unprovoked. I still have friends that own these types of dogs and I still pet them and everything, I will just never own one.
Of course this is biased, but I also have biased reasons for not owning dalmations, rotweilers and ESPECIALLY germen shephards. (I had a GS tear up my back when I was 3. I still have the scars from it.)
Belinda - posted on 02/27/2010
I agree that Pits get a bad rap. There are a lot of aggressive dogs out there. The problem is that my friend had the lower half of his face ripped off by a pit that had been part of the family since he was a pup. My friend was 4, and he has "fake" lips now. So I'm a little gun shy on them. They aren't allowed in Navy Housing though so I'm good. Neither are Chow's, Akita's, Staffordshires (of any kind), Rotties, Dobermans, or American Bulldogs.
Sue - posted on 02/27/2010
Unfortunately pits have got a bad rep because they are a classic dog for fighting and some owners train them to be fighters which I personally absolutely deplore. However as stated in the 1st response they are number 7 on the list and most often fight other dogs.
As a family we have decided to not have any pets until our little one is able to look after a pet herself and as she has trouble with her toys atm its probably gonna be 2-3 years before we consider owning a pet let alone get one.
I have no trouble with these breeds being around children as long as I trust the owners, my best friend when young had a Staffordshire bull terrier and she was one of the most well behaved dogs I know. Even better than our German Shepard who was kicked real bad by the garbage guys one morning.
I have witnessed a golden retriever attack a child and I always used to get growled at by a corgi who lived down the road every time I went to school and that thing used to claw at the ground. One morning it did get out from beneath the gate but the owner was able to get it back in the yard before it reached me. But I have no doubt that corgi would have attacked me.
Its not the dog its the owners who need to be looked at.
Kate CP - posted on 02/27/2010
Shelby, if your brother's dog is truly a service dog and has been trained and certified as a service dog then there would be no problem leaving your kids with the dog-SUPERVISED! I actually watched a pit bull attack an animal services officer (watch the video)
You can hear the nutty fat lady telling people they are about to be attacked and then sics the dog on the officer. Broke the woman's hand, caused nerve damage...this same dog attacked a man and his daughter a few days prior (which is why animal control was out there). This video makes me hate the owner. I feel so sorry for this pitbull who was, btw, destroyed. This dog could have been a wonderful, loving pet and was turned into a monster by his wacko owner. The fact of the matter is stupid and/or mean people should not own animals nor should they be allowed to breed. :P
Sharon - posted on 02/27/2010
I think the telling difference is what a pit does after it attacks. It doesn't let go. It holds and grinds down. Those square jaws lock up and there is no getting them off. When an untrained pit of poor breeding decides to attack - nothing but a gun or a pipe wrench or a 2 x 4 is going to get it off. Pits attacking small kids just pretty much leads to death.
Its hard to imagine having a pitbull because I'm not fond of short haired dogs, but I've known several...wonderful dogs. Perfectly sweet and loving, just accepting of everyong.
I'm a fan of the other scary dog... chowchows. I had two chows when my first son was born and they were awesome. I still NEVER left the baby/child alone with them.
Shut a gate, close a door or take one of them with you but NEVER leave a baby alone with any dog.
I was bit over and over by my mothers' rotten maltese. Wonky lil bugger.
I honestly don't think a pitbull is any different than any other dog except for its propensity to punish (or attack, I haven't decided). With training and care - this shouldn't be an issue.
I think chihuahuas are at the top of the list now, just because there are so many. I think all those little dogs can be rotten nippers!
This may be the same issue for pitbulls... so many attacks because there are so many.
I don't know where you got the stats from but I haven't read of a rottweiler attack in years. But every day I see a pitbull attack in the news.
Shelby - posted on 02/27/2010
I see this is an old thread but I'll go ahead and post. So many people compare the Pitbull to the number one dog to attack...a chihuahua. Now, This is just my personal opinion, but if I HAD to choose because in no way do I want to see one of my children hurt, but choosing between a scar from an ankle biter that you can quickly even "throw" off your child if need be, is a WHOLE lot different than putting your children in the ground from their throats being ripped out by a PitBull or a Rott, or other "Aggressive" breed dog. Since most dogs are usually made to be put down after they attack someone, It usually is the first time they bite that they kill a child. It usually is the case that they had been around people all the time, They usually are well trained. Its just that when dogs turn (because they all CAN) What is the EXTENT of the harm that can be done? Then ask yourself if it is worth the chance. To me, No, its not worth it. My cousin has a German Shepard. GREAT dog..So Far. Service Dog at that, My cousin is deaf. Yet I still won't let my children stay in there. That is a 175 pound dog...Do I think that he could do more damage to my children than if they were bit by a poodle...HELL YES! Especially since the more aggressive breed dogs aren't apt to bite a kid on the arm or the fingers...They are going for the throat. Most deaths in children that I have read about come from the child being attacked and bit mainly in the throat area...Not from bleeding out from a wound where the child was bit on the hand from getting too close to the dog's mouth.
I just would never ever take that risk with my kids. I know there are a lot of places now that won't allow certain breeds into housing areas.
Jane - posted on 02/16/2010
I remember a conversation MANY years ago about this very thing...except it was with Doberman's. I think you get what I mean here....dogs can be trained to be wonderful or nasty. I don't think it's the breed but the people who raise them.
Jenny - posted on 02/16/2010
Just wanted to add a couple things on the media portrayal of "pitbulls".
The first things is the average person cannot properly identify one. Any short haired, muscular dog with a wedge shaped head is labelled "pitbull". There are numerous cases in Ontario of owners trying to save their lab/boxers crosses and the like becasue the description for pitbull is "looks like a pitbull". This false ID has severly altered any proper statistics.
The second part is the media does not want people to be afraid of their family pet. Ask yourself this: how many dog attacks from a dog that wasn't a pitbull/rottweiller/doberman/mastiff have you seen in the media? I'm betting slim to none. Now is this because these breeds don't attack? The bite stats tell us that is not the case. They are just not reported. We had a case in my city of a child approaching a tied up Lab and getting a chuck taken out of his face. One radio station reported the breed so I know it was known but no other media outlet would go near the story.
It's become a witch hunt against my beloved breed. So sad as they are fantastic family dogs who's image has been severly marred by the asshats of the world who need an ego on a leash.
Kate CP - posted on 02/16/2010
Susanne, when they did the autopsy on the baby they probably checked the bite marks and compared them to that of the staff and the JRT. As you know, a JRT's muzzle is a different size and shape than that of a Staffie. I would be willing to bet that the bite marks on the baby matched the dental patterns of a JRT and NOT a Staffie since in the article it states that the JRT was the one who mauled the baby. Plus that's not exactly a "clean" activity those dogs got into. The one who did the mauling was probably covered in blood.
Dog licences were abolished in the UK in 1987. 1991 saw the introduction of the Dangerous dog act.
The 1991 Act required dogs 'bred for fighting' to be kept muzzled at all times in public
places. They had also to be neutered and identified by tattoo, and placed on a register called the ‘Index of Exempted Dogs’. Section 1 of the Act made it an offence for such a 'specially controlled' dog to be off the lead or unmuzzled in a public place. Dogs which had not been placed on the register were outlawed, although a limited amnesty was granted for late registration.
I would strongly support legislation for dog licencing as laid out in this article
Mary - posted on 02/16/2010
Where I ive, dogs are supposed to be licensed...problem is, it's really pretty meaningless, and it in no way screens the owners. All I needed to do to obtain one is provide proof of yearly vaccinations...and I really only need one to obtain access to my local dog park for my boys to play off leash with other dogs.
Now, I will say that SOME shelters do an incredible job of screening potential owners before allowing them to adopt. The rescue where I obtained Charlie made us do 2 "visits" with him, to watch us interact with him, as well as walking him around other dogs. We had to provide 3 references, all of whom they called. We had to give them the name and number of the vet we planned to use...they called them to check our prior history with other pets. They came and did a home visit as well, to make sure we were providing a safe environment for for Charlie as well. This whole process took over 2 weeks, which also ensured that this was not an impulse adoption...and they came by a month after we brought him home to see that all was going well with us and the dog. We also signed a form stating that if, for whatever reason, things did not work out, we would return him to them , and not just give him away. All of this was done to make sure that both dog and owner were a good fit, and to reduce the chances of Charlie needing to be bounced around from home to home.
When we got the second dog, I didn't need to jump through all the same hoops, since by then, I was a volunteer there, but we did have to schedule an appointment with an animal behaviorist, and bring Charlie and Sammy together, to make sure that they would be compatible. We had to pay for this in addition to the regular adoption fees. I give this shelter a lot of credit...they go to an incredible amount of effort to make sure their dogs are going to good homes, with owners that care enough to put in all the time and effort required to adopt one of their dogs. I should add that all of these dogs are screened as well, so that animals that not good with kids don't go to a home with one, or dogs that require a high level of activity do not go into a home where they won't get the needed amount of exercise and stimulation.
In a perfect world, EVERYONE would have to go through a similar process prior to getting any type of animal.
If you're going to bring back the dog licence it needs to be across the board for ALL breeds of dog. Maybe it would reduce the number of incidents of cruelty. Maybe it would act as a deterant from the impulsive purchase of a dog that people aren't properly prepared to care for. There are many pro's I can see to a dog licence but not not directed at only one breed ... all dogs have potential to do damage under the care of irresponsible owners.
Mary - posted on 02/16/2010
Was thinking about this thread the other day...I was walking my dogs, with my 15 month old strapped on my back. We had just had out 2nd blizzard in 3 days...and everyone was out shoveling, many with their dogs off-lease in their driveways. I was walking in a neighboring court, when out of nowhere this little sheltie comes tearing up the road, growling and barking, and chomps on my pit bull's leg. Gotta give my guys credit...they stood their ground, moved in front of me and the baby, but they did not lunge back. They growled and snapped when this little monster got too close, but they remained calm and attentive. The lunatic neighbor finally came running up the court, and yelled AT ME for "walking those killer dogs" in her court (it's a public road) and getting her little yip dog "scared and riled up"!!!! Now, I was polite, and simply pointed out that my dogs were leashed, and had been attacked by her off-leash dog (who was still growling and snapping in her arms). I told her she was lucky my "killer" dogs were so well behaved, unlike her own, and that it was obvious that neither of my dogs were aggressive, since her dog would not have fared well in attacking 2 much larger, stronger animals. At this point, several people had come out, and told this lunatic to stop screaming before she scared my daughter (who was actually laughing, and yelling "puppies!"), and to take her obnoxious dog inside. Through it all, my dogs just sat at attention, until I gave the signal that it was time to go.
So, in this scenario, it really did all come down to training and ownership, NOT breed.
Kyle that little dog attacked and killed that child or was it the staff in the same room doing the attacking? Probably it was both of them but guess whose huge jaws would've done the most amount of damage? Look im not saying these dogs should be banned what i would like to see is that people have to have a licence to own them so that they can be vetted before they are allowed to be responsible for something that can possibly be so dangerous. I think most people on here agree it comes down to the way a dog is treated and trained well we should be making sure they are going to owners that are capable of doing this. The some of the people i know with staffs and rottweilers etc shouldnt be allowed to bring up kids let alone dogs.
Samantha - posted on 02/11/2010
There are way too many replies in this for me to be able to read them all. I just wanted to say that any breed of dog can attack a child and any breed of dog can be a wonderful, loving household pet. It's all in the training.
And just for fun, here's my 10 month old son with a pit my friends are fostering-
Kate CP - posted on 02/10/2010
JRTs (also known as Parson Russell Terriers) are not well known for being "pack" animals. They are actually some of the most vicious dogs when it comes to other small creatures like cats, rodents (bunnies included), dogs, and children. I would never let my child pet a JRT. But I let my daughter play with pits all day long. The thing is, I'M ALWAYS THERE! You *never* hear about a child being mauled to death by a dog while their mother just sits and watches. The problem is NOT the damn dogs! The problem is the stupid HUMANS who leave defenseless children with ANIMALS who are unpredictable by nature.
Also, modern day chihuahuas are more than capable of mauling an infant to death. A traditional chihuahua is only supposed to max out at about 6 pounds. I've met "chihuahuas" that topped out at 10-12 pounds. A 10 pound dog can easily kill a child under the age of say, 9 months, if they are prone in a carrier, crib, or bassinet. ANY dog can bite. ANY dog can inflict serious damage. And ANY dog can kill a human...just depends on the size of the human and how much time the dog has.
And you don't need to "train" a dog to attack other dogs. All you have to do is keep them isolated and expose them to what are called "reactive" dogs. By exposing a dog who may otherwise be calm and docile around other canines to a reactive dog (one who barks, lunges, bites, growls, stares, etc) you create another reactive dog. Many reactive dogs are labeled as "aggressive" and they simply are not. It's easy to make any dog act aggressively to a human or another animal: just don't train them properly and you'll have a hard to manage, mean, crazy dog in about 3 -4 weeks.
There was an incident like that in England last year but that involved a baby being mauled to death by both a Jack Russell and a Pitbull. The baby had been left sleeping in a carrycot on the table while being cared for by his grandmother, who had also fallen asleep. She never should have left a child alone in a room with dogs regardless of him being on a raised surface!
I hate Jack Russells. My uncle has one. It nearly ripped my brothers ear off when it was just a pup. It's also the only dog thats ever bitten my Beagle. I was not impressed when they brought the bitch to our house at Christmas. Had to keep my dog confined to the kitchen to stop her attacking him .... evil little rodent!!!
Sunshine - posted on 02/10/2010
i seen this & thought Id share it!!!
You know the dog park is where my "PITBILL" was attacked 4 times!!!
SHE NEVER FOUGHT BACK~~
But like i said before its in a dogs nature. Since I been here & go to the new dog park I havent had no problems.. There are a lot of people who own this breed that goes...
I personally love the dog park!
Mary - posted on 02/10/2010
Ugh...this is still going on!
Susanne...I would not be okay with ANY dog biting or attacking me, my family, or my dogs (or anyone else, for that matter). Size and breed are irrelevant. I too, always have my boys leashed, and they have NEVER attacked or even barked at a passerby...even those small, obnoxious, kick-me dogs that yap and growl their heads off at my dogs. My boys just simply keep on moving without a backwards glance. Oh, I know you think my Pit mix is a public danger...and that's fine. If nothing else, his mere appearance protects me from having to converse with nasty, judgemental "breed profilers" whom would probably just annoy the crap out of me anyway. I'm sure I'm better off for not interacting with someone like that.
I agree that in a perfect world, nobody should have to worry about anyone else's dog. But that is just not reality. I am a responsible pet owner with well behaved animals. Yet everytime I leave the house to walk them, I DO have to worry about the behavior of any other dogs we may encounter. I see people coming with their yapping, pulling dogs on those friggin retractable leashes (which need to be abolished, IMO). Now, my boys know better than to get riled up over those shennanigans, but I cannot control the fools who do not pull their mutts in line. I often make the mistake of saying the boys are friendly...only to have some stupid little mini-daschound come over and chomp on their leg. I sometimes WISH that my Pit would snap back at the little bugger...he simply growls a little, and continues to move on. Chances are, that same owner is somewhere on COM wenching about how some horrible pit bull attacked her dog...and half the fools on here will believe that, simply based on all of the misinformation and prejudice against the breed.
Krista - posted on 02/10/2010
As for your comment about dogs need to be around other people etc yes i agree but keep them to your own family and friends i dont want other peoples dogs putting my kids at risk i shouldnt have to worry about them its not my dog
But that's unrealistic. People bring their dogs for walks, no? So unless the dog owner gets the cops to pre-clear the streets of all other people, it's pretty much a given that the dog is going to encounter strange children, old people, people in wheelchairs, and all sorts of other people with whom the dog is not familiar.
That is why it is VITAL, when you get a pup, to bring it everywhere and introduce it to everybody -- so that they experience a broad range of humanity and animal life.
We adopted a 12-year old Lhasa Apso mix many years ago. The dog had never been socialized to kids or to other dogs. He loved old people, could be a bit nippy with regular adults, and adored cats (he'd been raised with them). It was hard work socializing him, but it had to be done -- we lived next door to an elementary school, so it was impossible to avoid kids when I took him for a walk. So first I introduced him to some kids I knew, and made sure that they approached him on his level, with their hand held in a loose fist facing down, and let Dreyf sniff their hand, and then waited until he approached them. After we did this for awhile I'd let strange kids come around him but made them follow the same instructions, and they were all very good at being cautious with him. It only took two months and he grew to love kids. He'd see them and would roll onto his back and let them pet his belly.
This is what needs to be done with all dogs and particularly with "aggressive" breeds -- it's a gradual process and it requires doing a lot of homework, maintaining your authority at all times, and always being both diligent AND vigilant. Limiting the dog's social circle does not do the dog or its community any favours at all.
Krista i realise thats not what you where you were going with it but you unwittingly proved my point a small dog would have to spend a lot more time mauling a child to kill it where as a big dog such as a staff could kill a child in a few minutes. As for your comment about dogs need to be around other people etc yes i agree but keep them to your own family and friends i dont want other peoples dogs putting my kids at risk i shouldnt have to worry about them its not my dog. I have my own dogs that are kept on leads when they are walked, the only time they are without a lead is in our house or garden, my dogs have never frightened or harassed any member of the public. I dont think its much to expect everyone else to do the same.
Krista - posted on 02/09/2010
And Krista you nailed it in one these big dogs do more damage than smaller dogs and that is the reason why they are more dangerous and should be kept away from people outside of the family they are owned by.
Um no, that's not where I was going with that. I only mentioned that because people were asking why you never hear of fatalities associated with smaller dogs, and the answer is "Duh, because they're smaller, and thus less likely to inflict mortal wounds." I DON'T think that controversial breeds should be kept away from people outside of their own family -- that's a terrible idea. Dogs need to be socialized with other dogs, with other animals, and with other human beings in order for them to be properly trained. If two adults own a dog, and they NEVER bring it around other people, then what's going to happen when the girl scouts come around selling cookies?
ALL dogs need to be properly trained and socialized. And NOBODY should ever get a dog without doing their homework, knowing the breed, knowing its characteristics and challenges, and ensuring that they are properly equipped to deal with that dog. Sedentary people who are away all day long should not own Border Collies. People who are very active and like to run should not own English Bulldogs. People with prize gardens should not own terriers. And people who don't want to spend time training and socializing their dog should not own a Puli, a Chow, or any other dog that is strong-willed, wary of strangers, or aggressive towards other dogs or people.
Kyle - posted on 02/09/2010
Susan, I don't know if you read my last post but I said I do agree if signs say the dogd must be leashed then they should. Fortunately, here in Ohio we have dog parks and a dog beach that is fenced in where you can let your dog off the leash to roam and play with other dogs. I will also add there are many of rotts and pitbulls there and when there is a dog fight it is usually the small dogs that are getting snippy. and it's not because they feel intimidated by the big dogs because there is a section for the small dogs and a section for the big dogs so they are separated.
Kyle where i come from dogs are supposed to be kept on a lead in public places that includes parks it says so on the gate as you go in i really dont see what the problem is with dog owners keeping to those rules if i can do it with my dogs so can everyone else! And Krista you nailed it in one these big dogs do more damage than smaller dogs and that is the reason why they are more dangerous and should be kept away from people outside of the family they are owned by.
Sunshine - posted on 02/09/2010
Dang yeah I didn't mean Campbell, I get so FURIOUS about this topic I must of just was NOT paying attention, haha!! Nobody actually uses ANY breed for what their purpose is for... Maybe here & there people do that.. But not many I agree with you there...
I have read OVER & OVER on the "Pitbull" Breed & a lot of people DONT think before they type (me including) But Ive done my home work:) :)
They just hear the BAD things before they hear the good things...
Which upsets me ENTIRELY!!!
Kate CP - posted on 02/09/2010
I also wanted to add that just because a dog was bred for a certain task doesn't mean they will do or be what that intended task was. I have an Alaskan husky (bred to mush) and I live in Texas. He's the laziest dog I've ever seen and wouldn't pull a sled to save his life. The same thing with terriers. Most terrier breeds were bred to hunt rodents. In this day and age if you plopped a Yorkie down in a room full of rats it would run screaming in fear. So just because the original purpose of a dog was to be a fighting dog doesn't mean that they are inherently vicious toward other animals. That was just their original purpose 150 years ago.
Kate CP - posted on 02/09/2010
...I'm guessing you're referring to me, Kate CAPEHART. And I have done my research, thank you very much. The Staffordshire terrier and Bull terrier was bred to be a fighting dog to bait bulls and other dogs. If you look up the breed on the AKC website, it's written there in black and white. The American Pit Bull Terrier (a different dog entirely) was bred to be a family pet for people who lived in the city or small homes.
You know, it's really rather rude to insist that I haven't done any research on the breed when I have worked with pit rescue, fostered pits, and trained them for years.
Sunshine - posted on 02/09/2010
I personally never call me Baby Girl a Pitbull I say staffi Once you talk to someone about a pitbull they always get a hair up their butt & automatically start judging!! :(
KATE CAMPBELL: They WERE NOT bred to fight... They were bred to TAKE DOWN BULLS.. People just started breeding them to fight ONLY b/c they "have powerful jaws" & they can make money off the winning dog! That annoys me people need to do more research on the breed before they can talk crap! Stop listening to what people tell you start doing research!! You never know til you actually own the breed...
Mary - posted on 02/09/2010
Thanks, Kate! (I was hoping you would find this thread!!)
I'm with you on the Chows...I try not to discriminate based on breed, but my experiences with them have left me a bit leery of them. They are the breed that my shelter has the most trouble with, and the one that most often has to be put down, despite valiant efforts to rehab them for repeated episodes of both dog and human aggression ;(. The worst part about them is that they look so cute & fluffy, so many people get them, not realizing their aggressive tendencies.
I always refer to my dog as a pit bull, cause it's easiest to convey his primary breed. He's a resue, and of some type of mixed heritage...looks to be mostly Staffie, but his back end looks like a Greyhound! Whatever, he is an incredible dog...very intelligent, sensitive to all of our moods, and exceptionally eager to please. This made him very easy to train, as compared to my bull-headed ridgeback mix, or the lab I had previously. Obviously, I'm a big fan of rescues...I will always have dogs in my life, and they will always be shelter dogs in need of home. I am so glad that there are people like you in this world who continue to make this possible for some truly deserving animals =)
Jodi - posted on 02/09/2010
Kate, thank you for your post, that was awesome!!
Just for the record, my brother has a staffie. He also has 3 kids aged 3, 7, and 9. That dog is absolutely fantastic with the kids. I've had him stay here with us before too, and he was great with our family as well. Poor thing is getting a little old these days, but he is gorgeous and we all love him.
Kyle - posted on 02/08/2010
Why has a dog got as much right to be in a public park? My local park as a big sign on the gate keep dogs on leads and no dogs in the play area. It really annoys me when people dont listen to the rules they are there for a reason. No dog whatever the breed should be off a lead anywhere except on the owners property if you ask me.
If a public park is going to allow dogs then I think every dog, even Pit Bulls and Rotts have every right to be there as any other breed dog has. That is like saying Muslims can't go to an airport because they might blow up a plane. I'm not racist, that's just a valid example. and yes I agree if signs say a dog must be leashed then they should. Thats why I take my dog to the dog park. Then she doesn't have to be leashed. Even though she is and has always been lazy and doesn't play anyways. She just sits there.
Krista - posted on 02/08/2010
The dog breed that bites most frequently and causes damage that requires medical attention: cocker spaniels followed closely by yellow labs
And if I'm not mistaken, those are two of the most heavily bred dogs out there, no? It seems that any breed, when it becomes super-popular, tends to suffer not just in health and longevity, but in temperament.
Krista - posted on 02/08/2010
I'm not a particular fan of Chows, just from the experience I've had with them. Someone around here had one, and just let the dog run loose, wily-nilly all over the place, and it attacked my geriatric Lhasa Apso while I was walking him. No harm done, thank goodness, but since then I've had a bit of a bias against Chows, fair or not.
Sunshine - posted on 02/08/2010
That was awesome!!
But I will disagree with the American Staffi was bred to fight.. The were oringially bred to take down Bulls.. People these days YES breed them to fight..
But I love your post that was awesome!!
PS.. Ive been attacked ONE time in my life and that ALSO happened to be a CHOW!!!
Sunshine - posted on 02/08/2010
Here are some videos Ive found on American Staffis etc... I thought that were cute!!
Here a couple pits at the dog park;
Im sure if this dog wanted a bite he would of took it;)
This Staffi looks mean don't he.. Looks like he is protecting his master, right!
NOW TOO ROTTWEILERS!!!!
If you know anyone like me who owns a rottweiler they are the BIGGEST babies, lol!
This post got me started!!! Sorry about all the videos I am tryin to make a point that ALL is not bad....:) :) They are very loyal!!
For a dog to attacked they HAVE to be provoked...
You show fear to a dog & they will sense that!!
Charlie - posted on 02/08/2010
I think the difference is foxies and Jacks are more likely to attack but not kill , pitbulls and rotties are less likely to attack but under the supervision of a reckless owner IF they do attack they are more likely to kill IMO.
Krista - posted on 02/08/2010
Susanne, you never hear about a child being killed by a jack russell or a spaniel because for the most part, they're small dogs, and thus, their bite is less damaging. I would be very interested in seeing the stats for dog BITES, not necessarily fatalities. My guess is that per capita, you have a LOT more dog bites from smaller dogs -- mainly because small dogs tend to be spoiled, and owners tend to laugh off any signs of aggression, whereas with a big dog, it's definitely not considered "cute" if they bare their teeth and growl.
Anyhoodle, I do still think that some breeds are slightly more prone to aggression than others (and you always have variances within breeds, too -- males tend to be more aggressive with other dogs, whereas females who have had litters can be more aggressive with humans), but that if properly trained and understood, ANY breed can be a great family pet.
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