What has God done for you?

Samantha - posted on 06/16/2010 ( 319 moms have responded )

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I just read someone's post about what if there is no God. As a Christian even hearing those words hurt my heart. So I just wanted to hear from those of you who do have a personal relationship with Jesus what he means to you and what has He done for you?
Here's mine.
When I was 11 my mother was divorcing her 2nd husband my father had another family that filled his time and my other siblings were busy with there own life. I could go on for hours about how lonely and sad I was all day every day. No one noticed cause everyone was too busy to even notice me. I would ride my bike for miles in the middle of the night in the rain and hurry home knowing I was in trouble to find no one knew I was gone. My heart was broken my spirit destroyed. One weekend while with my dad we went to a new church my step-mothers friend told her about. At first it was too much. But several weeks later I found myself even more broken and even more open. I walked down to the altar and all I could do was cry. I was probably down there for several hours just crying to God. I had nothing to offer Him nothing to say. And just as though He was in flesh and blood I felt Him come to me put His arms around me and say " I AM HERE, I SEE YOU AND I AM NOT GOING ANYWHERE." He was my father my mother and my friend. He came at a time I needed Him the most. I have fallen many times since then, got into drugs and what not, you name it I did it. But every time He was there with me protecting me even when I cursed His name. Today I am a born again Christian. I love my God more than anything or anyone. He saved me when no one else cared. He's as real to me as the breath I breathe. I can only hope I live a Godly example that my children will know His love and love Him like I do.

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Jocelyn - posted on 06/22/2010

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Ooo complicated question Jen! in cases like that, it might not have been karma from THIS current life that caused something awful like a rape to happen to a person. I believe that in order to get to the highest level of conscience, to finally evolve enough that you no longer need to get reincarnated (you have nothing left to learn), every single person has to have EVERY experience, at some point during one of their lives.

Karma equals everything out. In a really simplistic example, if someone where raped in this life, maybe in a past life they (not necessarily raped but) were the cause of some heinous act on another person.

Then there are the souls whose whole purpose is to act as a "prop" if you will (hear me out lol it isn't as bad as it sounds, I just don't know the right word to really explain it :P) These "props" are highly advanced souls, and they come back to help other people evolve. For instance, you have a young child who gets shot by a stray bullet; maybe one of the main reasons that that child is here on earth is to teach her parents *insert lesson here* (acceptance, loss, love overcoming all challenges etc).

But I also have another theory that goes hand in hand with karma. We (when we are in pure form) choose what lessons we want to experience in our upcoming life (this goes back to the "every experience". So a rape might not be caused by karma. I could be YOUR choice to experience a rape so you can learn *insert lesson here*

I hope that this kind of made sense :)

[deleted account]

Hi Jocelyn

I have a question about Karma and the Rule of Three if I may. Going by this concept, if I'm understanding it correctly. The way it it has been explained to me is that for each of your actions, good/bad, it will be returned to you.

So how would this not mean that the victim of a crime such as rape for example did not do something to bring about that awful circumstance?

Jocelyn - posted on 06/22/2010

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Since it's been pretty "Christian vs Atheist" I'm going tho throw in my view here (pagan) and touch on some of the subjects.

We don't believe in a heaven or hell. We "reap what we sow" in this life and our past lives. It's called Karma. What you put into the universe and how you live your life transfers over to your other lives. Karma is "gathered" in four ways: through thoughts, through words, through actions that we perform ourselves and through actions others do under our instructions.
Everything that we have ever thought, spoken, done or caused is Karma; not God's Will. Cause and Effect.
We don't live completely self-centred hedonistic lifestyles because we realize that we are part of something bigger; the world, and everything that encompasses the world as we know it. We raise our children to be good, caring, tolerant members of said society, and we ourselves strive to be good, caring, tolerant members of society, because that is how the world functions. If everyone had the view that the world revolved around themselves, then society as we know it would disintegrate. We would never had made it this far.
We get up in the morning because life is a beautiful thing. We get up in the morning because we have our children, our lovers, our friends. Pagans aren't completely Godless. Depending on your path you can believe in a singular God/Energy/Being, you can believe in a God and Goddess, or you can believe in multiple (ie the Roman Gods and Goddesses), or you can "worship" (for lack of a better word) nature itself. There are many different paths you can believe in, and if you were to get 5 pagan's in a room and ask them specific questions of this nature, you will get 5 different answers. For me, it's more of a spiritual way of life, as opposed to a "religion". No one thinks that their life is worthless just because we don't believe in heaven and a specific everlasting life. Our lives are everlasting (through reincarnation) and through the affect that we have on others. Our everlasting touch, if you may.

Tanya - posted on 06/22/2010

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You have free will/ Oh but you must pick a or b. Well really you have to pick a.
Cake or death?

[deleted account]

Anyone else sometimes wonder why certain types of Christians want to feel persecuted? I know there's the 'blessed are those who are persecuted for my name's sake' thing but geez, that seems like an awfully depressing way to want to live.

[deleted account]

Ah Krista, I forgot the coffee. I can't drink it myself but I haven't started a day without tea since 1986.

[deleted account]

Laura, you ask several questions and I will try to be as thorough as I can. But before I do, was it really necessary to tell people to go ahead and 'bash?' I often wonder at the insistence people have to please persecute. I do not bash, I do not insult. I ask questions and sometimes my questions and answers are not easy to swallow. That is not bashing. It's thinking.

First and foremost, you need to understand that atheism is not a worldview like Christianity or other religions. It simply is the rejection of a claim. That claim being that a god or gods exist. What you are describing in your first few questions is nihilism, not atheism. There are many worldviews that both the believer and the non-believer embrace equally.

Are you familiar with secular humanism or naturalism at all?

But to be specific - why do we live, bother to get out of bed, etc.? Well, why not? It is my very strong view that the atheist has the stronger reason to get up than the anyone else. Because we (certainly not all but using 'we' is easier than continually saying 'some not all') recognize that when we're dead, that's it. There is nothing else. Therefore we better make darn good use of the time we have. To suggest that we're all slugabeds because there is no afterlife really needs more reasoning behind it. Are you aware that proportionately speaking, atheists commit suicide far less than their Christian sisters? That proportionately speaking, there are fewer atheists in prison than their Christian brothers? Perhaps it is because we know there isn't a final deathbed get-out-of-hell free card? Maybe.

I am an atheist but my worldview is that of secular humanism. I do not consider myself worthless because like all human beings, I make my own worth. Everybody does. I'm sure you know the expression, providence helps those who help themselves? Well, the secular humanist helps themselves and their fellow humans because no one else will.

You talk a great deal about free will and the stuff on earth that is bad. Well, why is it that way? Have you ever read anything by Mark Twain? He writes what I consider a brilliant essay on the creation of the fly. A creature that torments both the rich, the poor, the human and the lower animals. I recommend it. you can find it free online, and it's in the larger work "Fables of Man."

As to robots, I hear this a lot. Let me ask you this, are you capable of sin in Heaven? Do you still have free will in Heaven?

For the analogy of our children suddenly hating us. This is not a good analogy because we do not hate your god. We simply do not accept your premise that he's there. The theist is the one making the claim. We ask you to support it. I could just as easily ask why you are so angry at Thor or Lord Brahma but it would be silly because you do not believe either exists. So you can't be mad at them, can you?

The idea that my living and breathing being proof is faulty is a few ways. Add to that the other popular ideas of beauty in the world, newborn babies, etc. If new life is proof of god btw, then maggots are also such but I digress. All these things prove is that they themselves are there. They can be explained in very non-paranormal ways that work without needing a god. By saying God did it, you are adding to a system that already works on its own.

Science is not a faith based system though my friend. Do you require faith to say 2+2=4? Of course not. Do you need faith to say that a circle is a circle and not a square? No. Do you need faith to say that gravity will hold you down to the earth and keep you from flying towards Jupiter? No. That's not faith. Merrian-Websters defines faith in many ways but the one most people think of is this: firm belief in something for which there is no proof. Science offers proof. It takes no special opening of the heart or closing of the mind. Anyone can learn this stuff by reading a few books. It never requires that leap of faith.

I can only answer your statements to the best of my ability. I have included some links to wiki for definitions on the worldviews I mentioned.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihilism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_hum...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalism_(philosophy)

Thanks for reading and thinking about what I wrote. Always appreciated. :-)

Krista - posted on 06/22/2010

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Well if there isnt a God and there is no heaven after we die then why live?

Seriously? Well, I don't know about you, but there's a lot of stuff here in THIS life that makes life worth living. Family, friends, the chance to do good works and positively affect other peoples' lives, the opportunity to experience beautiful music and art and scenery and all of the amazing things that this world has to offer. I mean, are you honestly saying that the ONLY thing keeping you from offing yourself is your belief in God? That's really, really sad that your life is so empty on its own merits.

Seriously ladies what gets you out of bed on a bad day?

My own determination and optimism. And coffee. And my son's smile.

Why would you try to be a good mother if it all was just a random chance for life?

Um, because I want my child to be a happy, productive member of society?

If there is no Afterlife then i assume you dont ever spend a second doing anything you dont like because after all this is all you get right?

No. You're completely wrong. You are operating on this asinine assumption that atheists are these hedonists who have absolutely no morals because we do not fear a godly judgment. And your assumptions are wrong and offensive. I do not NEED the promise of an afterlife in order to be a good person. I am a good person because it makes me and those around me happier and more fulfilled, and because being a good person is the RIGHT thing to do.

Honestly, I have no idea if you've been sheltered or what, but you really need to step out from behind your Bible and get to know some people who don't share your worldview, because you have got some really bizarre ideas about atheists.

Isobel - posted on 06/22/2010

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I find it sad that religious people like Laura (that felt weird) don't seem capable of seeing the world for the wondrous, beautiful place that it is...the only thing worth living for is the after life...it's like needing to watch pornography to get through sex. You say we feel worthless? You are the one who likened yourself to a dog. I take care of my children because I created them, they are my responsibility, and I want them to become productive members of society who are capable of thinking for themselves and enjoying every moment that they have here on this planet.

I'm sorry that you feel so much worry in this life...cause it's too short.

And by the way...I agree...GodHatesYou is a ridiculous name for an atheist website...but I assume that's the only thing we'll agree on. And while I told you to wear your big-girl panties to these debates...I didn't say to be openly hostile and nasty.

[deleted account]

Laura said:
"If you are mad at God then that only tells me that you do believe in him!"
Laura, I don't think anyone here has said that they were mad at God.(I assume you were speaking to those of us who are atheists.) How could we be mad at someone/something we don't believe in?

And I'm really tired of people who disagree with you being accused of bashing and picking on you (the general you.) People are always going to disagree on lots of topics!

And incidentally, science is not faith - it's FACTS that are evidence based and can be proven.

And I really cannot understand your explanation of why bad stuff happens.

Merry - posted on 06/22/2010

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Well if there isnt a God and there is no heaven after we die then why live?
Seriously ladies what gets you out of bed on a bad day?
Why would you try to be a good mother if it all was just a random chance for life?
Why care for your kid if you think they are being too naughty?
If there is no Afterlife then i assume you dont ever spend a second doing anything you dont like because after all this is all you get right?
It would be such a miserable life to think that I am worthless. Each person is just a random chance of science?
And dont talk like science is athiest. Science is a faith too and if you believe in one aspect of science then you might be believing right along with the christians.
If you are alive and breathing then God has done something for you.
If you dont believe in God then thats your own choice but i have to say i cant Imagine not wanting to have someone who loves you and would give up his life for you.
As for the questions about if he loves you then why does bad things happen- God made humans because he wanted to share the world with us. He made us perfect but offered us the choice to be bad. He didnt want to creat robots because unlike a dog, a robot will follow you everywhere, but when your dog obeys you it is so much sweeter because he chose to love you. same with God
He gave us the choice to obey or not. So he knows that those who do love him are all the sweeter to him. Now as for bad things. God set up the universe with rules. ie SCIENCE phhysics chemistry etc. He set up these laws of nature so we could grow and learn and develope as a society. He allows us to learn the way it works so we can better ourselves and stay in a learning way. Well if he allows us to choose bad, then there has to be bad for us to choose right? so if there is bad in the world then sometimes it happens to good people. He is fair and so just because you are one of the ones following him he isnt going to jus give you a free pass on life. THats what heaven is about but here on earth everyone gets crap just like the other one. After life the ones who chose him get the rewards but here on earth we are all suseptible to the same crap. cancer, diabetes, rape, drugs, fires, hurricanes, slavery, murder.
He wont micromanage us because many still dont want him in their lives, so he give us the hope of heaven but tells us that even with God on your side, you wont have a perfect life. I may die today but i have comfort knowing this isnt all i have. think about if you had children and you love them all the same and raised them as best you could. But when they all grew up two of them decided they didnt love you, they ssaid they hated you and didnt want you in their life, you called them but they didnt answer the phone, if you saw them on the street they would ignore you. you tried to show them that you loved them but they ignored it and claimed you didnt love them. they even started telling people they didnt have a mother. that you didnt exist. thats what is happening here too. As a mom you would take them back in a heartbeat if they ever changed their minds but you are not able to shove yourself into their hearts.
God is fair, and he loves all humans the same, he wont give special care to those who love him back because he loves us all the same. so for me my mom got cancer when she was 38 and died when she was 40 she left behind 4 kids ages 18, 15, 13, and 6. this isnt "fair" as she was a believer in God. but who says life is fair? we chose to sin and do bad things so this is how it is. She gets her reward for believing in heaven and that is how God rewards us. I have to live without her now and that feels unfair to me but i am still a sinful person and i have to remind myself that earth will never be perfect. the only thing i can hope for is that i could help someone else to see the truth in Gods plan and oin me in heaven one day.
bash away i know how much you all love to pick on the people who are certain of themselves. If you are mad at God then that only tells me that you do believe in him!

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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Apparently I was right and this thread has run its course...
I feel like "Corena, Conversation Killer"!
;)

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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Hmmm...what has God done for me?

Well, there are so many things that I believe God has done for me that it would take a while to list them all and in the end its all perspective right? If someone else does not believe that those things were done by God then nothing is going to make them believe they were. I can handle people's disbelief but it somewhat feels like cheapening events in my life that are sacred to me by opening them up for dissection and possible ridicule.
I will say that I have seen more than one physical miracle though. In fact the first one is how I started on the path to God in the first place. I guess I could tell about that one.
My dad has another daughter who at the time was about 4 or 5. My stepmom had started the vehicle to go somewhere with one of the older boys. She had forgotten something inside and, believing that her son was firmly strapped in, ran into the house to get it, leaving the car running. In the minute she was gone her son somehow got out of his seat and managed to slip the car into gear. It ran over her daughter who was playing outside. It did not graze her or knock her over, it ran over her chest and the side of her head. I saw her little shirt after with clear tire tread over the chest. She definitely should have been crushed and killed.
Other than a little bruising and a scrape on her head and face where the car pushed it inot the ground, she was completely unharmed. No one could understand it, even the doctors and nurses.
It was a miracle.

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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Well maybe you could answer the original poster's question about what God has done for you...put some perspective back on your side of the debate. I would be interested to read what you have to say. I can perfectly respect your right to decline further comment as well, if you so choose to just leave it as it stands now.

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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I think this is probably just a comedy of errors...misunderstandings because it is hard to figure out someone's true intent in writing. No tone of voice or body language and all that.
I am not offended, I am not constantly sad...it truly was just a post "in the moment", based on what I had just read. It didn't even really have anything to do with my spiritual beliefs...I just don't like anybody being disrespected with no real cause.
Does that make sense?
I am not sure about contributing more to this thread...it seems to have run its course. I could be wrong though. It's been known to happen.

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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And having said all of that Corena...I truly hope you decide to participate in this thread and we can get past this. It might help you to know that I've spent the better part of my life being sad about the way people treat others...especially in my own family. On Saturday even, I was taken aback by my step-mother and her shitty attitude toward me. She full-out reprimanded me in front of my entire family (I'm 30 years old). I'm not a child and I don't feel that I deserved to be treated that way...I was very upset and I even cried about it for a while, but I eventually resigned to the fact that I can't control how others treat me and what they say, I can only control how I react and let it affect me. Yes, I agree with you that at times the hurt is so overwhelming that it's difficult to see past it and let go of the sad feelings. I'm not at all chiding you for feeling sad, I'm just simply saying that it's your choice to remain that way. You are human and I realize that...I have NO ill judgment of you whatsoever and I fully respect people and their right to believe as they choose. I would never insult your beliefs...I might make fun of some of the fanatical viewpoints of religion as a WHOLE...but you as an individual I cannot judge because it is not my place. Joking also helps me to realize that life is not always meant to be serious...if God does exist, do you think that He doesn't laugh?

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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No one is friggin' assuming or judging...I'm pretty sure that's been cleared up already. If that's how you feel, that's on you! I can't help you to feel less judged because I'm not going to change who I am and what I say to suit you. I haven't said anything hurtful or slanderous. If you took my comment out of context then I suppose it would explain why you feel judged...although I still have a difficult time making that correlation. Bottom line for me is that you can continue to be sad for the way people 'sometimes' treat each other, or just accept that sometimes that's how it goes...people can be kind and people can be shitty, but it's up to each individual to decide how it will affect them. I'm just not sure why it's getting to you so much if you "don't care what people believe". Just be confident in what you believe and leave it at that.

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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Actually what you said was...

"Corena, you can either accept that there are others in this world that do not share your views, or continue to be sad and never be open to understanding individual beliefs."

That very clearly implies that I was sad because I don't accept that other people don't see things as I do. Which is completely untrue.
I do "realize that not everyone shares the belief that God is love" and I have no problem seeing the merit in shared information. I was not only focusing on the bad. I merely posted a comment based on the feelings that this thread stirred in me generally. I was neither implying or assuming that anyone else did or should feel the same as I did in that moment. I was simply sharing the feelings I was having in that moment. Why is it so offensive to you that I might care how people treat each other? That I might be saddened by how people talk to each other some times? I was not even solely commenting on the posts by non-Christians. I was, and am, just as saddened by how a lot of people who call themselves Christians respond to those who don't share their beliefs. To be entirely honest, I am usually more offended, irritated and saddened by the posts of "christians" than I am by anyone else.
I had no issue with the jokes and I read this thread after posts were deleted so I missed a lot of things. I have assumed that the OP was saying things that would have angered and saddened me as well, probably more because she claims to be a Christian.

The bottom line for me is this...
I have NO problem with others not believing what I believe.
I have NO problem listening to, learning from and even, GASP!, becoming friends with people who don't share my spiritual beliefs.
I never said I was offended about anything, I said I was sad. It's ok to feel what you feel and recognize and acknowlege those feelings in the moment.
The only problem I have at the moment is feeling like assumptions are being made about me that are based completely on someone's ideas of who I am instead of what I am actually posting. Assumptions that could not be further from the truth of who I am, for that matter.
I have no issue with you or anyone else. In future though I will be much more careful about sharing how I am feeling for fear of being completely misunderstood and, YES, judged.

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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Ahhhh...a classic case of someone seeing what they want, instead of actually reading what is written:



I said: "you can either accept that there are others in this world that do not share your views"....I did not say "you don't accept people who's beliefs are different than yours". There is a difference. My statement implies some accountability on your part to realize that not everyone shares the belief that 'God is love' and to move past that point to see the merit in the information that has been shared back and forth on both sides. You are focusing only on those posts which you deem to be of a 'superior, mocking or judgmental' nature and thus catering your responses to a personal feeling of sadness at a conversation that has been both enjoyable AND diverse



"I don't care what people believe"...well then why waste your time being sad? If I am packed and ready for my journey to the eternal hell fires with my Hawaiian Tropic sun tan lotion and my yummy marshmallows, then why not just tell me to enjoy the suffering rather than be offended? I'm fully prepared and more than happy to hear your views and I've actually gained a ton of perspective from this conversation. It hasn't changed my views, but I have new-found respect for religion on the basis that there are people that can believe differently and still have a mutual respect for one another. The jokes were just jokes...the other comments were probably in response to comments that the original poster deleted and there's nothing to be done about that. Just enjoy the conversation and contribute to the discussion or be sad about it...either way there is no judgment on my part.

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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@ Jaime
Where did you get the impression that I don't accept people who's beliefs are different than mine?
I did not say anything that should lead you to make that assumption about me.
You are wrong. I am not unaccepting. I don't care what people believe. I care that people treat each other with respect and love. I have absolutely no problem with people not believing what I believe, that is their choice.
Are you possibly "judging" me based on my spiritual beliefs?

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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@ Dana.
Are you purposely trying to start an argument? How is my being sad when people are not nice to each other judging?
Perhaps that is not how you intended your post to come across, I know that the written word can be greatly misconstrued.
I am not judging anyone.
It makes me sad when people seem unwilling to care about others regardless of their beliefs or lifestyles, etc...
I didn't say I was judging anyone, I simply stated how this thread makes me FEEL when I read it.

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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Corena, you can either accept that there are others in this world that do not share your views, or continue to be sad and never be open to understanding individual beliefs. Love is a free emotion that is experienced differently by everyone. For you God is love...for me love is a grilled cheese sandwich.

[deleted account]

So, if He loves us no matter what we believe then why are you sad? So, HE doesn't judge but you do?

Corena - posted on 06/21/2010

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It makes me sad because I, as a Christian, believe that God is love. I believe He loves everyone on earth, no matter what they believe or how they are living.
It makes me sad that this thread is so full of judgement, mocking and superiority...on both sides.

Jaime - posted on 06/21/2010

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I like what you have said Gina..it's a healthy balance for believers and non-believers.

Gina - posted on 06/21/2010

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ok I want to add something, everyone is talking about Christian's. Not all people are Christian's, there are many faiths, also having faith doesn't mean you belong to a group,or whatever you call them.That was a big problem for me,groups or just people telling me what to feel, act and believe. I believe in what makes sense to me, while in some things I do have blind faith[ I agree with Terese's burning building] other things I say 'you got to be kidding!'!! It's not easy to explain, but organized religion is not for me but I respect all religion's and people.I hope that makes sense!

Isobel - posted on 06/21/2010

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see but if I were to say that I thought it was sad that so many people spent valuable time on "church", I would be attacking and mocking religion...is anybody starting to see the double standard yet?

Krista - posted on 06/21/2010

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Yeah, I just don't get why people who DO believe in God get so sad and offended and hurt when they find out that other people don't believe in God. It's kind of silly, really. Why can't people just be content to have their own beliefs and not get all hung up on whether other people believe the same things?

*Lisa* - posted on 06/20/2010

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Thanks Jamie! We had his first day at the beach and he fell asleep on the way home on the bus. He slept like that for 45 mins! Too much excitement I guess.

[deleted account]

Me too Corena. It makes me sad to see people use their faith as a battering ram. It makes me sad that some people cannot be happy in their own relationship with their chosen diety unless they tell everyone else how miserable they must be because they think differently.

It makes me sad that the word heretic is still considered a negative and that blasphemy laws exist in our world.

Jaime - posted on 06/20/2010

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p.s. Lisa...your profile picture is so sweet...I love sleeping babies with their chubby little cheeks and their content little sighs......Ahhhhhhh, so peaceful!

Jaime - posted on 06/20/2010

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In a nutshell an apatheist neither confirms nor denies the existence of God.

Corena, it's unfortunate that you are saddened by this conversation. There are a lot of valid points on both sides and so far it has been a pretty civil discussion. Feel free to jump in...

*Lisa* - posted on 06/20/2010

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I looked up that term and found that it meant 'In other words, an apatheist is someone who considers the question of the existence of gods as neither meaningful nor relevant to his or her life'. Einstein certainly did say that his mind was a limited human mind and was just as annoyed by fanatical atheists as fanatical religious people. So I guess he sits on the fence here, neither claiming to believe there is a God, or that there isn't.

Becky - posted on 06/20/2010

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thank you for sharing your story. I was forced as a child to go to church when my parents did not go. and for a long time i rebelled. but things happened in my life i just believed in a higher power and i was ok with that. then I had my daughter, who like all children are a gift. I do believe in God, his miracles happen everyday with me... waking up and writing this today is a great thing...
we all have free will. the ability to do what we choose to do. if we choose to believe in God or a higher power than so be it. but it is still free will.

Jessie - posted on 06/20/2010

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LOl, Dana, I did have a little chuckle when it all made sense. Made it a whole lot funnier even with the missing posts :)

Jaime - posted on 06/20/2010

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That's apatheism according to what I researched Lisa. Or 'pragmatic' atheism is another way to put it.

*Lisa* - posted on 06/20/2010

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I didn't say that they believed in a personal God, they just denied that there was NO God.

Jaime - posted on 06/20/2010

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Thanks Jen, I was just a bit confused because if they rejected atheism then they wouldn't question God would they? They might not fully accept atheism, but my thinking is that they didn't altogether reject it either. Apatheism might best describe some of their viewpoints.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apatheism

[deleted account]

@ Jamie, Einstein definitely rejected religion. I think Galileo probably was a Catholic to the end but his unorthodox views on the nature of the universe got him in serious trouble. I doubt he was an atheist but he definitely rejected the current religious thinking.

[deleted account]

Hi Jamie, my seat has been reserved at the bonfire for a long time. LOL On other forums, I have offered (and still do) to bring the Sahlen's hot dogs and the spicy cornbread. Gotta keep the heat up ya know. :-)

Thanks for the welcome!

Jaime - posted on 06/20/2010

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Okay, so are we saying that they did deny atheism or that they didn't? From what I'm reading, all of these guys rejected a lot of Christian ideals and ideas about God....so unless it's just too early in the morning for me to comprehend what I'm reading...did they or did they not say they don't believe in God?

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