Wrong twin aborted in Australia

Merry - posted on 02/08/2012 ( 35 moms have responded )

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http://my.news.yahoo.com/wrong-twin-fetu...



I’ve written before about the horrible practice of “toin coss” abortions, where one healthy twin is aborted because (for whatever unacceptable reason) the mother does not want to have two babies born.



In a shocking story from Australia, a healthy 32-week twin was “accidentally” aborted when doctors mistakenly killed the healthy twin when they were attempting to abort the sick twin, as the Australian Herald Sun paper reports:



A Victorian mother, pregnant with twin boys she had already named, had made the agonising decision to abort one of the babies on doctors’ advice.



She had been told that one twin had a congenital heart defect that would require years of operations, if he survived at all.



An ultrasound clinician had checked the healthy baby, who was in a separate sac to the sick baby, before the termination.



But just after 2.30pm on Tuesday the wrong baby was injected, terminating the healthy pregnancy.



The mother then had an emergency caesarean section and the sick child was terminated in a three-hour operation.



The hospital has announced there will be an “investigation” into what went wrong. But obviously what went wrong is that doctors suggested to the mother that she abort one of her twins. The hospital in a statement called the mistake a “terrible tragedy” but how would they have described the outcome if the doctors had made the right choice about which child to abort? Would that be a “resounding success”?!



Steven Ertelt at LifeNews notes that this case in Australia is not the first example of this happening:



Officials in Italy, in 2007, investigated a botched abortion done on twin brothers where the healthy brother became the victim of the abortion and the twin, who has Down syndrome, lived. The disabled brother was the target of the abortion procedure and the case is raising the ugly specter of abortions done to kill disabled people. The abortion was done on a 38-year-old woman in Milan.







***********thats a copy and paste. I didn't write that :)

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Jennifer - posted on 02/09/2012

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Sherri, I do agree that we should not judge, but I for one, don't have a problem debating the story in an impersonable way. If I actually knew this woman, I would be very kind and supportive to her. I would not have told her the abortion was a good idea, maybe even voiced my concerns. But what is done is done, she lost her child. No point in hurting her more. It isn't like she beat the baby, she made a legal, medically supported choice. She needs support now, and I hope she gets it from friends and family.



I work with special needs children. I love them all very much. I do not have the problems their parents face, to which I am eternally grateful. But, I think it is very wrong to abort them. I UNDERSTAND WHY, but I just don't support it. No one can garuntee how these kids will turn out. I've seen 'miracles' My cousin, who was suppose to be severly brain damaged, and had 18 surgeries her first year is now happy, healthy, married, the mother of an 18 month old, and an RN. She is also the only link to her mother who tagically was killed at 21. A boy in my son's class has down's. He is the most giving, positive, friendly child I've ever known. He is a beaming ray. Girls fight over who gets to sit by him. A family feud is brewing already, his 5 sisters all want him. Not to mention his athelitic ability is legandary!

Many autistic people add to our knowledge and their skills are becoming very useful to many industries. Yes, some kids are liabilitys for their entire lives, but most parents would never change that.



There are no promises with kids. Some of the kids I work with were 'normal', but through injury or illness have become handicapped. Should we be able to euthanize them also? I know most don't agree with me, but I see it the same way. To me, it is no different than the Chinese mothers who choose abortion for girl babies. The mothers have a dream for their child, and they make decisions based on that dream. I can not call it selfish, because I do believe that parents believe the child would be better off not being born, but we just can't say that for certain.

Jacqueline - posted on 02/09/2012

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My niece was born with two holes in her heart and a few in her lungs. She was born, had surgery and was GIVEN a chance at life. guess what, she was GIVEN a chance to live by her mother NOT listening to doctors who say ABORT ABORT ABORT! This beautiful little girl is 4 years and healthy :)



In my opinion... my doctors asked if I wanted to test to see if there were any problems with my kids in the 'oven'. And I refused. I would love my child no matter how they came out. And take the nesessary step if they were born with disablilties.



If my doctor told me you need to abort so you dont have to 'deal' with the problems... I would, pardon my language, tell him/her to fuck off and tell them where to shove it. Then get a new OBGYN.



I think abortions are okay in the case insest, rape or if god forbid it happens a 12, 13 year old gets pregnant for any certain reason, as their choice. I know a gal who was raped and got pregnant and kept the baby. Poor girl was 14. But she loves her child. It wasnt the babies fault! Incest there are GOING to be birth disabilities, somewhere down the line. And its just gross. Very Gross.



We arent put threw things we can not handle. Yes a GOOD support system is important but not all people have it. Minds are so easily mold-able, you can think everything is fine till you someone tells you different. A doctor does have a to do with molding your mind when your pregnant. But there are some things you need to take into consideration. Killing your baby because he/she has a disability. Given the way technology is growing I wouldnt think about aborting.



My friends daughter has Neuroblastoma, she is 3. They said she pretty much born with this cancer. And she is going to die in just a few months. She is a petite 3 year old, who had a football sized cancer tumor in her back WRAPPED around her spin, stomach kidneys etc. With possitive thoughts, people who cared with possitive love and caring. NEW TECHNOGOLY this very RARE cancer is 98% out of her little body. 12 rounds of chemo. She will live to see her 4th BIRTHDAY!



I say ANYTHING is possible if GIVEN the chance. bad thoughts cause bad thing to happen.



My opinion being said I do respect everyone elses. Sry if mine sounds rude or disrespectful to you. :-)

Merry - posted on 02/09/2012

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No Sarah I'm really not a judgemental person.

I have many many friends whose parenting styles are completely different then mine and you'd never know I disagree



When someone kills a human I get angry. When that human is a baby it's even more infuriating.



When I hear stories like this or like the ones where a girl delivers a baby in a back alley and cuts it up and throws it in the trash I am sorry. I judge.

I wouldn't say it to her. Because I thi it would do no good. Women who can do that are not right in their heads.



Now if a woman feels her fetus is not a baby and contemplates an abortion or has one then I can't really argue or judge. It's not a human in her eyes' its not her child in her eyes. So to her it's not wrong.



This was a near term baby. This was a named child. You can't convince me she did this without feeling herself like she killed her baby.



So Sarah quit judging me. Idk why moms have to get all uppity about calling moms judgemental. This is a debate. I have strong feelings on this debate.

I don't have to pretend like I support her actions here. That's why it's a debate.

Sherri - posted on 02/09/2012

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@Jennifer in our case we did look at the big picture we would never be able to pay medical bills, we are older parents and if this child was down syndrome who would care for this child when we aren't here to do so anymore. They would most likely end up in a home somewhere. It would be a strain on our marriage that may or may not make it and our #1 reason would be how unfair a special needs child would take from our already 3 healthy children.



Now if we were forced with the decision to abort or not because of a defect. We also would not have tried for another child, we would have been done.



If something happened once the child was already here that is a totally different scenario and would be things that we would be forced to deal with. However, that isn't even the same. A child who you are attached too and already alive is not the same as a fetus.

Jennifer - posted on 08/14/2012

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Oh good grief...get off my high horse? Why? Then I would have to look up to see you sitting up there on yours. Don't sit there and preach to me about making the best decision for your baby. Please. Do your think, seriously, for one minute that your baby would choose death when he could have a very happy, full life? If someone can't handle what life throws at them, there's always someone else that is willing to.
Down Syndrome is a sick excuse for murder.

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Sherri - posted on 08/15/2012

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Yes I am Catholic Laura. I am also prochoice and for gay marriage as well.

Merry - posted on 08/15/2012

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I agree krista. I've never heard anyone say that's how God thinks of babies with deadly diseases. That's a sick explanation.
Babies have diseases sometimes the same reason adults do, and that's because when we chose to sin we fell from immortality. Now as mortals we have illnesses and diseases. Sometimes it affects babies and sometimes adults.
But all can go to heaven.thats gods promise.

Sherri I thought you were catholic? I figured Christians all would be against abortion. But I do understand how you came to your decision, and am glad you didn't have to do it. :)

Krista - posted on 08/15/2012

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To put it bluntly, any god who would decide to saddle a baby with something like Tay-Sachs disease, just to teach Mommy and Daddy a valuable life lesson, is a sadistic, sick bastard who does NOT deserve praise and worship.

Krista - posted on 08/15/2012

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This is obviously a horrible tragedy, but I think it is very wrong to judge the mother for making that decision.

Sadly, there are plenty of mothers out there who find out that their much-loved, much-wanted babies have a fetal abnormality that is incompatible with life, and that the baby will not survive outside the womb, or will only live a very short, painful life.

To some of you, it is selfish to terminate such a pregnancy. Others view it as sparing the baby a short, brutish life of suffering. Regardless, it is an agonizing situation for ANY mother, and I really do not think that any of us should judge a mother who is in such a terrible position.

I also have to comment on this: "At the end of the day God decides which babies will be healthy and which ones won't which will pull through and which ones were only meant to be a temporary gift. All babies are gifts and until they are here you will never know what they were meant to teach you. Sadly these angels never got the teach theirs. "

I mean, really? So you honestly think that your god consciously decides to have some babies develop with horrible, painful, fatal conditions, simply as a TEACHING method? And any mother faced with that situation should be made to let her baby live out a short life full of pain and agony and heartbreak and suffering, because it's all a valuable learning experience?

Pardon me, but that is seriously fucked up.

Sherri - posted on 08/15/2012

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You did get down on me and said I was sick, inhumane, cruel, cold and inhumane. If that isn't putting me down then please let me know what is??

You don't have to agree with abortion but whether it is legal or not it will still happen. The only thing that making abortion illegal does is cause more deaths. Since woman will simply go to someone who will preform an illegal abortion in an unsterile environment which will cause thousands of moms to die as well from infections. It happened time and time again before Roe vs. Wade but one thing that remained is woman still got abortions.

I don't believe a fetus is a baby till it is viable outside the womb. Till that time it is simply a parasite that only lives because it is connected to the host. Remove the host and it is nothing but a clump of cells or a parasite that will die. Once it can live outside the womb on its own or even with some support then and only then is it considered a baby.

Jennifer - posted on 08/15/2012

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A fetus IS a baby. If not, then please explain to me what, exactly, it is. Arms, legs, fingers and toes, beating heart, nervous system, a brain, a gender...a small human body, housed in an adult human until full development is attained.
But I do understand how you people have brainwashed yourselves into believing that it isn't a living human being until it is pushed out of your vagina. That's when the magic happens and it becomes an actual 'person'.
I know we don't have to agree, and I most definitely DO have the right to judge you or anyone else if and whenever I want to. It's called freedom. Which you and the rest of the liberal jackals believe you are entitled to without boundaries, but anyone who disagrees with you is not.
Who says I don't have 'the right'? We all judge. To say that you don't is self righteous drivel. If you knew someone that molested a child, would you judge? How about someone who forcibly injected their teenager with heroin?
I have not been in your shoes, per say, but I am a 38 year old with 4 children, from 19 to 10 months old...the 10 month old being a very unpleasant (at the time) shock. I went through being on the 'older' side of the pregnancy scale, the offers of genetic testing, the necessary information regarding my increased risk of having complications or a Down Syndrome child. My husband and I aren't wealthy, we're not saints, and we don't have a perfect marriage or family. But one thing we DO have is the knowledge that life is sacred. Doesn't matter if that life isn't perfect. It's still sacred. Did the thought of having a Down Syndrome child scare me? You better believe it did. I didn't have much confidence in myself being able to handle it.
But I knew that if it happened, somehow we would manage, and we would love that child just as we loved our others.
I'm not getting down on you...I'm sorry if I come across that way. I just can't see the other side of it, try as I might. I guess I don't really want to. I have a 100% conviction that a baby in the womb is a living human being that has all choice taken from him/her. It's not fair, and it makes me sick.

Sherri - posted on 08/14/2012

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Well abortion is not the same as murder and is perfectly legal and necessary in our society.

So you can go preach your anti abortion propaganda somewhere else because I will always be pro choice and you will not guilt me into changing my view. I also will not feel badly that, that was almost a real decision I almost had to make. You don't have to agree but it most certainly would have been best for my child and my already living children and my family.

You don't however, have to agree but you most definitely don't have the right to judge me or anyone else because it is something you don't agree with. You weren't the one that would have had to pay for the medical bills, you couldn't tell me the severity of the downs whether they would be high functioning or barely able to function ever, you would not have had to pay for the home to house them in for life after my husband and I were gone and yes we are older parents which played a big part into our decision.

Once again since a fetus is not a baby, abortion can't be murder.

Sherri - posted on 08/14/2012

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@Jennifer you do not know my life or the circumstances that led to the decision we almost had to make. So yes for OUR family and if the testing had come back positive for down syndrome it most certainly would have been best to abort our pregnancy and we would have. We did not take the decision lightly and it was the most agonizing decision we would have ever had to make. How dare you who was not in my shoes judge me.

You can kindly get off your high horse and quite honestly shove it. I was far from cold, immoral or inhumane. I was a mom who had an agonizing decision to make for my baby and my family.

Jennifer - posted on 08/14/2012

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@ Sherri...how dare you say it was what was 'best for the baby'.
How could you possibly know that? Do you know anyone with Down Syndrome? I know several and they are some of the happiest, most content, joyous people. To sentence them to death because they have special needs is one of the cruelest, most inhumane things I have ever heard. What the crap is happening to human beings now? How have we become so cold and immoral?
Sickening.

Sally - posted on 02/13/2012

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Karma's a bitch. People aborting "defective" babies who weren't is common enough that some places have laws that when it happens late enough that the "oops" baby could survive doctors are just supposed to put it in a closet and wait for it to die on it's own. It's quite sickening really.

Amanda - posted on 02/10/2012

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In all reality and this is something I have yet to read. Doctors are human and obviously techs are too. Lab techs, Radiology techs all are human which means there is a margin for error in ALL their results. I have seen first hand parents scared out of their minds and babies being subjected to very painful testing because of test results which in the end were questionable or even wrong. At the end of the day God decides which babies will be healthy and which ones won't which will pull through and which ones were only meant to be a temporary gift. All babies are gifts and until they are here you will never know what they were meant to teach you. Sadly these angels never got the teach theirs. This is a clear cut case of doctors and others playing God with tragic results.

Jamie - posted on 02/09/2012

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Oh goodness....I had my son around 32/33 weeks I couldn't imagine an abortion at that stage. Makes me sick to think about it.



The second child (that could potentially have correctable operations in the future) was aborted possibly full term!?



I had a friend who had multiple tests done during her pregnancy that all confirmed her child had Down Syndrome. She went on to carry to term and her baby had NOTHING wrong with him. I wonder how many aborted "sick" babies this happens to.



So sad. Even if the baby does have some sort of condition doesn't make their life any less important or meaningful. We can learn so much from these people. That is a tragedy.

Merry - posted on 02/09/2012

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Yes in the three hour c section the other twin was terminated. How?idk. Pretty sure partial birth abortions were illegal.

Jamie - posted on 02/09/2012

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Did she go on to have another abortion with the other twin?



What really gets me about these cases is that these mothers often choose to have the sick surviving child. That makes no sense to me...Truthfully, no abortion makes sense to me, though.

Sherri - posted on 02/09/2012

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Jennifer I empathize with you and can't even fathom what you went through with the loss of your child. Please don't think I am even referencing any of that through my posting of this topic.

Jennifer - posted on 02/09/2012

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Your right, I don't have to support it. It was your decision to make. But I am stating opionion. It is my decision, and I'm stating why it is my opionion. Just as you did. The thing that bothers me (and you haven't acted this way) was the way I was treated. I'm suppose to pity this woman who lost a baby because of a choice she made. (My heart does go out to her, and I don't blame her) but the death of my baby was trivialized because she was assumed to be damaged goods.

Sherri - posted on 02/09/2012

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Well you don't have to support it, as it wasn't your life to decide anything or live with what ever consequences where decided upon.



Oh and our baby was named from day 1 so he has always had a name as well.

Jennifer - posted on 02/09/2012

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Sherri, I do understand your point, and I see why you choose it. But I still just can't support it. My youngest was a late in life baby, and had increased risk. I refused testing. Pissed my doctors off beyond belief. I know how the medical feild views handicapped kids. BUT it is also very personal for me, too. I lost my second baby. She was still born. I wish I'd had a taser for every b*tch nurse who said "oh she was probably defective anyway, be happy!" The one who asked if it was a planned pregnancy almost did get hit. She said, in front of my parents and my son, "well, if she wasn't planned and probably would have been handicapped, I see no reason to be upset. It was just a glob of cells!" The baby had been 7 and 1/2 months along, had been named Hannah, and we had an ultra sound video of her sucking her toes.



My cousin that I mentioned before, would have been aborted had ultrasound been as advanced as it is today. She had a hole in her heart and two in her stomach. Her scars run from her collar bone to her pelvis. She spent 15 months in the hospital before being aloud to go home. All total, she has been in the hospital for 4 years and a few days. I'm pretty sure her mother died thinking she should never have given birth to that baby, as she died 6 weeks before the baby got to go home. I can't tell you how much comfort she was to her gramma, though. The doctors swore she'd never make it past her first surgery, and kept saying any day now, she'll be dead!

Sherri - posted on 02/09/2012

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I know a parent that has a child born with half a heart and the torture and agony this child has endured her whole life, the stress it has put on there marriage. I know there are days they wish she had never been born. They know her diagnosis is terminal and now it is just a daily waiting game whether she will live to see another day.



Her last stint in the hospital left her in a medically induced coma for almost 2mo's and she woke not being able to speak or walk. She will never have her true voice back but she is finally walking again. However, she was so angry because she missed the last 2mo's of school, and so many just day to day things that is time she can never get back.

Merry - posted on 02/09/2012

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And if you knew me at all you'd know I judge my own parenting FAR more then I judge others.

NO one is as judged by me as myself.



No I don't have a child with a heart defect.

My kids are both healthy and well.

But I do know two boys with serious heart disorders.

And I know they appreciate their lives.

And their parents are blessed to have them as their sons.

Sarah - posted on 02/09/2012

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BTW - Have you ever taken care of a kid with a congenital heart defect? I have. There are different kinds with different degrees of severity, but she was told her babe would have many years of surgeries. Open heart surgery is very painful, dangerous, and poses a very real risk of death (with every one). These babes are on medication pretty much their whole lives, in and out of hospital (usually in more than out), and can have a myriad of other problems. She was also told he may not survive at all. Some heart defects result in death within minutes of birth, and not a pleasant one. Quality of life (for me) trumps quantity.

Sarah - posted on 02/09/2012

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Laura, you seem to be very judgmental on other people's lives. Do you apply the same judgement to your own? If you did, you'd stop passing judgement because it's not up to you to do so.

Merry - posted on 02/09/2012

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I can respect that it might have been best for the parents or other kids or family. But dying isn't best for a baby unless it's in pain.

I know two babies well right now who have very serious hear conditions. They're going through tons of surgeries and feeding tubes and all sorts of stuff.

But they sure don't look like they'd rather be dead!



Aborting at 10 weeks or so is a whole different ball game then aborting at 32 weeks after you know the sex and named the baby.

Once it's named it's a part of your family! I don't understand how anyone could do it that late.

I'm assuming the dr made it very clear how much this was the best choice because what mom would decide this on her own?

Sherri - posted on 02/08/2012

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You were not in her position and nobody should or can judge her for making a decision to try and save a baby from the pain of death shortly after birth.



Not to mention she had been to specialists that strongly encouraged that this was the best thing to do. I am sure the agony to make such a decision was not done lightly and was made with all the information at hand with many doctors and specialists as well, it was what she truly believed was in the best interest for her babies.



My tests for this pregnancy came back positive for Downs as well and I did go through the most invasive testing to 100% rule out any chance of downs. I knew the risks of having a miscarriage were high and chose to go through with the testing anyways. Why? because if this child had downs I would have aborted the fetus.



It was not a decision my husband and I made lightly and we were in agony with the decision but it was what was best for our family and the baby.

Merry - posted on 02/08/2012

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I agree judging is wrong but who doesn't?

Anytime babies or kids or adults are killed I feel justified in my anger at the responsible party.

Sarah - posted on 02/08/2012

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I feel bad for the poor mother. I can't imagine that it was an easy decision for her to make, and lose 1 baby let alone 2 must be devastating. I don't think I'd be able to abort a baby if I were in the same situation, but I never have so I can't say how my true feelings would be. I don't think it's fair to judge someone for making that decision, I don't think anyone takes it lightly, and I'm sure they consider all options. Raising a special needs child is extremely difficult and often breaks families apart. Judging someone for not being sure they could potentially do it alone is wrong.

Sherri - posted on 02/08/2012

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I meant that it had already been posted on the debate board prior to your two posts.

Merry - posted on 02/08/2012

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I looked on a few different news story pages and most said 2011. Maybe its just similar to an older story.

Sherri - posted on 02/08/2012

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This is a pretty old story now. I will have to try and find the original post and copy and post my response that I posted on that one.

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