2 Month old son is drama queen

HJP - posted on 01/09/2016 ( 37 moms have responded )

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Our two month old son loves to be carried all the time. If you stop walking, he starts crying and is very determined to get you to back on move. Sometimes we try to let him scream it out (since anyway he is not hungry, has clean diaper and is being hold - he should be fine, right?), but he can be so dramatic that it breaks our heart to listen to him and we usually end up giving up and continue walking.

What we should do? Just let him 'win' or should we already start setting limits?

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Sarah - posted on 01/12/2016

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How did I miss this? Busy work week back in school, along with lice outbreak..I digress.

When you look this sort of topic up online you will find opinions that range from one extreme to the other. Articles abound about attachment parenting, baby-wearing , cry-it-out and "Ferberizing" Keep in mind that much of the information is subjective and can be widely interpreted. One expert (and I mean fully credentialed physicians or psychologists) will argue that by immediately tending to your child's cries inhibits his ability to find a way to meet his own needs, while another argues that by tending answering you child's cries without delay teaches them that that are safe and prevents them from panicking and actually helps them learn to manage their emotions.
I have four kids and my first like to held, for hours and hour, by a standing and preferably moving person. So I do know how you feel, exhausted and frustrated. I do know that this time was brief, less than three months and he was ready to be down on the floor, in a swing or held and rocked.
Babies are born dependent and cry to let us know that they need something. That is biology. A two month old does not have reasoning ability. The theory of a two month old understanding a cause and effect is not accurate. I know it can be interpreted, that baby cries, I feed baby, baby stops crying and therefore learns cause and effect. A two month old's brain is just not developed enough to master the reasoning of "if I do A, then I will get B".
I think you'll find success in a sling or baby carrier. Before long your little guy will be letting you know he wants to be down, to creep about and explore.
IMO, this post got so heated so quickly because of the terminology "drama queen" which sort of casts a negative light on your opinion of your baby's personality. I don't believe that is how it was intended but even just reading the title made me furrow my brow and then read every response.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 01/11/2016

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Once again, I have read all of your posts and everyone elses. Please try opening your mind to others advice. We are all here to help one another, but when you ask a question that you clearly don't want answers to, then obviously no amount of advice wll help.

Jodi - posted on 01/10/2016

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Ah, Dove, I stopped bothering. There is no point. This OP already knows it all. Let them figure it out for themselves.

Sarah - posted on 01/10/2016

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Wow a lot has been said since I late responded. As those have suggested a sing may help as that is movement. Also the brand "4moms" has a momaroo that might be of interest to you. It has lots of different motions that babies tend to like (car ride, kangaroo, tree swing, etc.)

I have a 8 month old that has always loved to be held and moving since she was born. She loves to be on the move! Nothing worked for her but to babywear.....hence my suggestion to you. If I was just holding her I had to always be moving. When I would babywear her I did not have to always be moving. Babywearing creates a womb effect that is soothing and comforting for baby. They are snuggled up to you, hear your heartbeat, smell you, are nice a warm and cuddled. Often times they will fall to sleep in the carrier. I can usually do all the things I need to do with her in the carrier. It is a win/win. She is content and not crying and I can still do what I need to do. I do not feel "manipulated" by her at all because we are both winning. I actually feel this is her personality. She likes to be on the move. She does not like to sit still. She was crawling at 6 months. She likes to take everything in. She is a quick and fast learning. I think because she likes to be on the move she learns a lot. She likes to be held and is a very happy baby.....she likes that comfort. As someone else stated don't disregard something before you know much about it. Babywearing is not just holding your baby.....there is more to it and speaking from a mom who also has a baby that likes to be held AND on the move I thought it might help you.

Dove - posted on 01/10/2016

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And yes... I read where you said he is being held.

I've been taking care of kids for 22 years and raising them for 14... and at 2 months old they are not consciously manipulating you and their wants ARE their needs at that age. My youngest child screamed like he was being murdered EVERY time he cried from birth until he was 3 years old. Oh my goodness he is stubborn and demanding and has a wicked temper. Guess what... he also has depression and anxiety (genetic... likely from birth). Oh... and he also had reflux for the first 6 months of his life. I can only imagine how much WORSE he would have been and how much longer it would have taken to get a grip on the situation if I had just let him cry instead of doing whatever he needed to comfort him.

All kids are different... and they all have different needs. Catering to their needs in infancy is a parent's job... it is vital. Now, if you have a child that just fusses/whines a bit... yeah, go ahead and let them fuss/whine for a few minutes when necessary... but if you have a freak the heck out screamer... you don't just let them cry.

Granted, there were a few times that my son DID just have to cry (for a minute or two)... because I was a single mom w/ two older kids (and the need to pee... I wasn't physically capable of baby wearing), but anytime I could attend to whatever he wanted.... I did.

My son is still a stubborn, demanding, almost 8 year old w/ a wicked temper... but it took time and maturity (and some counseling) for us to get to a 'good' place... If I had to redo his infancy and toddlerhood again? i wouldn't change a thing because the most important lesson he learned is that mom is ALWAYS there for him 100%... no matter how difficult of a child his brain may make him at times.

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Sarah - posted on 01/10/2016

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HJP look and see if you have a baby wearing group where you live. They will let you try on and try out many different carriers so you can find which one works best for you. Some are better then others. The ergonomic ones are the best ones to use. It's the safest on baby's hips and easier to carry. The group will also help with showing you how to wear.....many people wear too low.

Dove - posted on 01/10/2016

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And no... a newborn doesn't 'want' to stay awake when they are cranky and need sleep... but there would be something else (a wide variety of reasons) keeping them from getting what they want/need (which would be the sleep)... and it's up to the parents to help meet those other needs, so that they can get to sleep.

Dove - posted on 01/10/2016

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You can disagree w/ child development experts all you want... doesn't make it so. lol

And no... I'm not calling myself an expert... just the fact that I've studied a variety of them in the past 22 years. ;)

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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Thanks for reasonable answers from some of you!

@Sarah
Thanks for telling your experiences with baby wearing. I've already tried one, but he don't really enjoy it, but I'll probably try another after your suggestion that it might help him to relax even when we're not moving.

@~♥Little Miss Can't Be Wrong♥~
You still don't get it! I'm not talking about putting him down. Just read the earlier messages as many times as needed to understand or refrain yourself from posting any more.

Him learning the cause and effect is real and of course he will utilize all his means to get what he needs as well as what he wants. And I disagree that all babies needs are their wants. Sometimes your babies can be cranky and want to stay up in the night when they actually need to sleep. Just one example.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 01/10/2016

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You have gotten some really excellent advice here which you don't seem interested in. What exactly are you looking for?

Dove - posted on 01/10/2016

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He's 2 months old... you hold that baby as much as he wants/needs to be held. He was held and fed 24/7 for 9 months and now he's been in this cold, cruel world for a mere 2... Do whatever it takes to make him feel loved and secure. Period.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 01/10/2016

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Clearly you came on here just to get replies to validate your feelings, and thoughts. But, you are wrong. Babies don't manipulate. They know what feels right. So if you need someone to say it, KEEP giving your baby what he wants. To be held. Why? Cause it makes your baby comfortable. Makes your baby happy. Keeps baby from crying. Give your baby what he wants.

I have 2 children. I have been through this. You are not the only parent in the world that has a baby that cries when it is put down. This is not special, or different. EVERY baby wants to be held, so keep holding him. Keep loving him.

Jodi - posted on 01/10/2016

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I can see why you feel the need to "win" with your baby. That seems to be an issue for you.

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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You clearly have some kind of anger management issues and for your kids sake I wish you'll find some professional help so they don't have to suffer with such issues... All the best.

Jodi - posted on 01/10/2016

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Yes, it is getting ridiculous. That's one thing on which I will agree with you.

1. What are your psychology/medical credentials? I question this because you seem to think reading all these articles qualifies you to dispute every single person who is here, and yet...wow! we are all mothers having raised SEVERAL children...and yes, some of us have psychology degrees and have done quite a bit of research around infant development. But what would we know...we don't read "The Week". If you are going to accuse others on this site of not comprehending the situation, while you spout proverbial diarrhea, I would suggest you come clean with your credentials. Because otherwise, you are merely a first time parent who has no real clue what they are doing and needs help but are refusing to actually accept it because you believe everything on the INTERNETZ.

2. Did you actually even READ that study? None of it supports anything you are saying. Allow me to elaborate.
(1) The study was on TWO infants. Not a huge study sample. In fact, not enough to even make it statistically significant in anyone's books.
(2) " 98 percent of Baby R's crying bouts came after something negative" . So that actually indicates that there was a REASON for the crying in 98% of incidences. This is exactly what people here have been saying.
(3) "But one day, at around the 11-month mark, a tearful episode was preceded and followed by laughs and smiles." - Wow...who knew an ELEVEN MONTH OLD could manipulate. NOT A 2 MONTH OLD!!!!

3. I wish I could say what I really want to say.

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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This is getting ridiculous... I didn't say you say to do CIO and yes, I'm the one suggesting CIO, but not where my baby would need to cry alone, but on my arms. You clearly have huge troubles comprehending the situation so please refrain yourself from answering anymore.

Michelle - posted on 01/10/2016

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Why did you post this if you are just shooting down every reply?
I also didn't say to do CIO at all! In fact no one has suggested it. You are the one that has been bringing it up in each of your replies.
In regards to your latest link: Just because only 2 babies in the whole world were compared to each other it must be true. You'll need to get some better backing for your claims.

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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And actually, more I read and think about it, more I'm inclined to believe that 2 month old is capable of 'manipulating' (but not necessarily on negative sense, just a way to communicate). After baby learns CAUSE and EFFECT (2/3 month old) they can manipulate and 'act out', that's a fact.

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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http://theweek.com/articles/452763/manip...

In this study they found out that babies indeed are 'fake' crying. It's their method of showing if they WANT something as well as if they NEED something. There's clear difference between those two. 2 month old definitely can be a 'drama queen', if he has a temperament and is able to show it if he doesn't get what he WANTS.

As said, crying it out method (used mostly related to sleeping though) is a way to set limits for a baby and it can get very DRAMATIC when you do this first time and the baby cries and screams to get what they want. And many parents experience is that it helps tremendously developing great sleeping habits for their baby.

I'm not even asking about full CIO-method, I would be holding him in my arms, just not walking around.

And I'm still baffled how you think baby wearing helps? I would still have to be walking, even though my hands would be free. And I doubt that many of you would be willing to carry AND walk 14 hours every day, it's just not practical.

But yes, as I said, I just ordered a swing and I hope that'll help.

And seriously, some of you should pull your head out from your rear end and stop the hypocrisy.

Michelle - posted on 01/10/2016

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Like the other ladies have said, a 2 month old can NOT be a "drama queen".
We understand that you are still holding him and that he just wants to keep moving. Like the others have said, baby wearing could be a solution for you.
You will also need to find ways to settle him with having to move with him. Have you thought about a baby swing? That will give him movement and you can swaddle him so he feel secure.

Also please stop getting nasty with the others that are trying to help you with suggestions. You have posted on a public forum and will get a lot of different answers. If you don't agree with the advice then don't respond to it, simple.

Jodi - posted on 01/10/2016

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No need to start insulting people.

The fact is, at 2 months, this isn't about you winning and the baby losing the battle. But clearly you are the one who has done all the reading. I'm sure you have a psychology major and studies in child development psychology too, so I will leave you to it. Good luck!

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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And just to add to conversation, that there's plenty of studies and many doctors recommending just few month old baby to 'Cry It Out' which is exactly that - SETTING LIMITS. I'm not looking validation as you suggest, like I said, I'm unable to just let him cry it out (even I'm actually holding him, not that he is alone) and I'll end up letting him get what he want (me running around the house while holding him). And I'd be fine doing that, if that's beneficial for his development. But I'm starting to question if it would be better for him to not give in and just hold him while staying still? Even if that means he needs to cry it out.

Quite a few studies and experiences around the net suggest, that babies who have cried it out have better sleeping habits/skills compared to those who never had to cry it out - thus 'won'.

You can check the thread here to see some more sensible comments regarding letting baby cry:
http://www.babycenter.com/400_should-i-l...

HJP - posted on 01/10/2016

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Still you can't seem to understand what I'm saying Jodi. Please read my post again, especially the part "And yet you are still telling that baby just want to be held - my point is that baby IS being held". And again you are suggesting baby wearing, even that doesn't really do anything different from holding my baby. I repeat one more time so you will finally get it.

Baby is being held all the time. That's just not enough for him - only constantly walking is.

Baby wearing would only help with constantly walking, but I can't be carrying him 14 hours/day every day. And your ignorance and poor ability to judge people's (and probably babies) behavior bothers me.

Thanks for American Woman, I just ordered Fisher-Price baby swing. Hopefully he'll be happy with that :)

Jodi - posted on 01/09/2016

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"From your response it's quite clear you just read the topic title, not what I actually wrote."

No, I read the entire post. It bothers me that you think a 2 month old can "win" or needs "limits" set or is "dramatic" and calling a 2 month old a "drama queen". It's a baby not a 6 year old.

I agree with the others. Baby wearing.

"And yet you are still telling that baby just want to be held - my point is that baby IS being held. I'm haven't said a word about putting him down and letting him cry by himself. I'm saying that at some point I have to stop (while still holding him) and that's when he gets angry and WANTS to continue walking."

That's why people are suggesting wearing your baby. Have you looked into it.

Also, have you spoken to your baby's doctor and had a check up? As I said earlier, generally constant crying means something, but in a 2 month old it doesn't mean letting them cry it out and learning their limits.

"If you were to say that he is just 2 month old baby and he should get what he WANTS, I would be more inclined to listen to your advice, but your comments are very ignorant and not to the point. And what I've been reading, you should already start setting limits for a few months old baby (though on literature the advice usually starts with 4 month old)."

So why bother asking if you were only after validation?

Also, have you read the literature on attachment disorder? I suggest you read that too.

American - posted on 01/09/2016

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First off I agree that 2 month olds can't manipulate as their brains are not yet developed at that age to understand that act. I also believe that he shouldn't be just crying it out but I have a couple suggestions......does the baby have gas?? It could be that the rocking movement relieves some of that pain. Also try swaddling him it makes them feel the warmth and comfort of the womb. You can also place baby in swing as the gentle swinging could just be your answer. My middle child lived in his swing and swung in it till he was too big to fit. He learned to climb in and out of it and it was a blessing. I was able to spend time with my oldest and get some things done around th house.

HJP - posted on 01/09/2016

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And yet you are still telling that baby just want to be held - my point is that baby IS being held. I'm haven't said a word about putting him down and letting him cry by himself. I'm saying that at some point I have to stop (while still holding him) and that's when he gets angry and WANTS to continue walking. That's not a physiological need. And maybe it's hard to grasp for someone whos baby haven't yet developed personality, but I can say with certainty that he is trying to get what he wants by intensifying his only method of communication.

If you were to say that he is just 2 month old baby and he should get what he WANTS, I would be more inclined to listen to your advice, but your comments are very ignorant and not to the point. And what I've been reading, you should already start setting limits for a few months old baby (though on literature the advice usually starts with 4 month old).

I'm sure there's plenty of other parents whos baby is already developing personality and temperament and they're trying to figure out the right way to proceed with him. Set limits or let him get what he wants without boundaries?

~♥Little Miss - posted on 01/09/2016

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Congratulations on your new baby! BABY! Babies do not know how to manipulate or win battles. They can only communicate by crying to let you know they want something, hunger, wet etc. He was in his momma's belly for 40 weeks. She was constantly moving around unless asleep. It is like a nice rocking motion constantly. It is also a tight warm environment and very cozy. This is what baby has been used to for 40 weeks, so this is what baby still wants. It is totally normal.

As someone mention earlier, baby wearing. Yes. You are already carrying bub around, but baby wearing gives baby all the mentioned above comforts, but gives the adult access to hands and a bit more freedom.

I would not let my children scream/cry it out. They are not being dramatic, they just cannot talk to you and tell you their needs. Being held and touch is a biological need. Baby could be fed, dry, perfect temp, but being held is all they want.

Yes, I read all your posts.

HJP - posted on 01/09/2016

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From your response it's quite clear you just read the topic title, not what I actually wrote. He is being held all the time, the problem is just that's not enough, he would like us to be walking around the house 12 hours EVERY day. Also, he sleeps fine at night so I have no idea why you are talking about sleepless nights or brain damage - which have nothing to do with what I wrote.

And yes, I'm 100% he is a drama queen and doesn't NEED to be on the move, just WANTS to be on the move. It happens even if we don't sit down, we carry him and just stop standing still. Also, sometimes if he is feeling lazy, he just quits in the middle of crying and be like nothing happened, which further proofs he's just practicing his acting skills.

You jumping to accusations is not helping and is rather naïve.

Sarah - posted on 01/09/2016

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You may want to look into babywearing. As Jodi said he is 2 months old and is being a very normal 2 month old. Babywearing makes them feel all snuggled up to you very much like In the womb. Then it gives you hands free to get some things done. Remember though you now have a newborn. Your life now revolves around them not you.

Sarah - posted on 01/09/2016

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You may want to look into babywearing. As Jodi said he is 2 months old and is being a very normal 2 month old. Babywearing makes them feel all snuggled up to you very much like In the womb. Then it gives you hands free to get some things done. Remember though you now have a newborn. Your life now revolves around them not you.

Jodi - posted on 01/09/2016

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OMG, a 2 months old is NOT a drama queen. Your 2 month old has basic needs. If he is crying there is a reason, you just haven't figured it out. You do not set limits on a 2 month old - they don't understand yet. If he' snot hungry, and clean, then maybe he just wants to be held. Just remember, he spent 9 months snug and cosy in his mother's belly.......you expect him to give that up in 2 months? Being woken at night and sleepless nights are part of the parenting territory.

Do NOT let him scream at night because you think he is okay. He is 2 months old. That is not okay and borders on abuse. There is also evidence that it causes permanent ongoing trauma to the brain. If you need me to, I can give you studies, but I've done trauma training as part of my teaching professional development and psychology degree, and believe me, you do NOT want to have a child with trauma.

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