any ideas how to deal with behaviour problems?

Marie - posted on 01/06/2009 ( 50 moms have responded )

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i have 6 kids but my problems are with my 10 year old boy! he has been having problems since he was a small baby and they r just getting worse!he has a complete lack of respect for most adults and authority figures is a constant disruptive presence in school,bullies my younger kids,kicks.hits,swears purposely starts arguments etc.we have been seeing a pscycologist but 2 b honest not looking like it gonna be much help.we all at end of our tether-none of the others want him here and i am losing my hope now!
i think a lot of it is genetics?his biological father was not a nice man. any ideas or just a chat would be great.

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Rosella - posted on 09/10/2013

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Alright mommy, some of this may come from his father but that's no excuse have a talk with him and if that doesnt work it's time for the belt. i hate to say it but it is. he needs to lean it isnt okay and when i say belt time it doesnt have to be an HOUR LONG maybe just a few pats and end him to his room for a couple of minutes and he'll probably learn.

Christine - posted on 01/10/2009

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 Another thing to consider ... How does the child sleep?   One of the doctors had me keep a log of sleeping patterns and eventually determined that my daughter had a sleeping disorder because of enlarged tonsils.  The cronic fatigue from poor sleep was causing the irritability and mood problems.  She didn't have tonsilitis, sore throats or anything like that ... jusr large tonsils.  I was shocked!    It is not a cure-all or alternative to counselling etc, but if there is a physical issue that can be remedied .. it doesn't hurt to look into other causes for the behavior.

Michelle - posted on 01/10/2009

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if the school is refusing to test him, and they are the one's presenting the issue with you, then ask them where can they suggest for you to have him tested. sometimes the schools have agencies they use. and if your really lucky they can send you to a testing site within your district and the results will be sent to you and the school, then they can provide you with the help for your son that is within the school's budget.

Christine - posted on 01/10/2009

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1-2-3 Magic has a great program and definitely worth a try.  There is a book and a video on it.   I got the program 10 years ago when having troubles with my oldest child (now 23) and found it worked better with the youger kids in controlling and preventing the outbursts.   

Michelle - posted on 01/10/2009

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sometimes, it's just a boy being a boy....however, this sounds like something more than that. talk to your pediatrician maybe have him run a few test. it could be as simple as adhd, or maybe teratts. maybe the doctor can prescribed a medication, such a depokate or lithium. even though these medicatons, like depokate are for seizure disorders, it can also be used as a mood stabilizer....i work with dual diagnosis children that's how i know so much about medication. and if your doctor and you agree to a pyshcotropic medication, don't be worried or scared...it's only to help better your son.

Tracy - posted on 01/10/2009

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I contacted my sons school about the testing and they told me that I need to take him to the pediatrican. I have heard from others that schools don't like to test kids, especially if it's a smaller type of problem, it cuts into their funding. Anybody know what my rights are in getting him tested, he is in a charter school so I think the rules are different.

Angela - posted on 01/10/2009

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towards the ends when i was saying give him a few weeks- what i meant to say was give him a few weeks to start changing before you give stiff punishment-then set him down and discuss consequences.

sorry

Angela - posted on 01/10/2009

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- i am a mother of 5 kids with #6 on the way. i have never tried a program- the only thing i was told about my 9 year old getting into trouble almost every day at school was positive reinforcement. praise him for the things he does well. it worked for awhile for me, but he started up again. crap hit the fan a month before halloween and i tiold him i had enough. me and my husband sat him down and agreed that if he got in trouble one more time that he would not go trick or treating. he got into trouble agian and we stood our ground. he didn't go trick or treating and i have seen a change. neither of these things work for my 10 year old or my 6 year old. every child is different and with as many kids as we have it is difficult to give the 1 on1 attention that they need. when we do give attention it seems to be more of don't do that or didn't i tell you to stop, be nice, etc.. it is hard. try finding time to spend with him- 10 minutes a day- get him to help with laundry or dinner so you two can talk by yourselves. get him to help you with stuff - let him know that he is a positive influence in your home and life. please remmeber that bad habits are hard to break so give him afew wekks to start changing with stiff punishment, but then set him down and let him know that he will start facing consequences for his actions and that you will not back down. i wish i could give you amillion answers because i know how it feels to be disrespected by your child and it is frustrating and it hurts. i started to ask myself what was i doing wrong. anf you knw it is not us it is just a child trying to find his place in his home and life. it will get better, but make sure that you let him know that you are there as a mother, friend and teacher.

Karen - posted on 01/10/2009

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When you are seen by a professional ask them to test for ASD (Autism spectrum Disorder) he sounds exactly like my younger son (now 12) he was diagnosed with Aspergers I also have a 23 year old with special needs and an 18 year old with Autism so have done alot of training and research lol

Marie - posted on 01/10/2009

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hi can only tell u how i got to where i am now-and its a ongoing process.go to doc or health visitor explain problems and they will refer u 2 someone it is dealt with differently though i think it depends where u live?

[deleted account]

This sounds just like what am experiencing with my six year old. I am wondering what path to go down with him as I have a 21mth old & don't want her to pick up his bad habits.

Traci - posted on 01/09/2009

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This seems to be more common than we all think!  My step daughter was and can be the same way.  Fortunately my husband and his ex finally took her to a therapist and they put her on concerta.  I know many people think that drugs are not the answer but when you find a 7 year old girl putting a pillow over the face of a 4 year old girl,on more than one occasion, there is a big problem!  At first you are not going to like the way he is on the meds but they do get better and are very good kids once the system is use to taking it.  My step daughter was kind of a zombie at first and we all thought about taking her off of it but the doctors said it takes time to regulate it.  I am very glad we listened to the drs.  Our only problem now is that her mother does not make sure she is taking it in the morning like she should and by the time she is out of school she is a wholey terror! The aggressions, the lying, the screaming, fighting with siblings and just plain being a devil.  I can always tell when she doesn't take it because she has this grin on her face like what can I do to you know.  I really hope you look into concerta because her grades are better, her lying has ALMOST stopped, our home life is better, the kids get along, and the crying has stopped also.  I'm not sure if I helped at all but I have been there and all you want to do is runaway or scream or drink your night away.  I have never heard of the 1-2-3 magic program but I am proof that for once a drug can really help.  As the kids get older you have to increase the dosage but it is well worth having some peace in your life!!!!  GOOD LUCK!!  :)

Karen - posted on 01/09/2009

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1-2-3-Magic can also be changed as the child gets older. Each kid is different and each parent can work that out for themselves. The thing with 1-2-3-Magic is you don't have to start at 1, you can escalate to 2 or to 3. The way I would have responded to my child if he questioned chances is, right okay, from now on I'm counting you on a 3 since you don't need the warnings.



My stepson is 13 and still a control freak! We rarely count these days because he has just evened out so much this school year. However, sometimes I get a reminder through something I read that yes, I need to step up on that behavior again and we do. You can slip back into the backtalking or arguing instead of counting it. When he does become too much, by counting him, I get instant results whether it's a 1 or whatever. He is so well trained to it.



One other thing, because he is a visual kid, I have always used my fingers at the same time so that he visually process that. It also means that I don't always have to be verbal in social situations either. If you go over the book again you will find that there are other alternatives to the consequences and the reasonings behind it. With an ODD child, you have to make sure you win the battle. These kids are hell on authority figures.



One teacher in 4th grade had a hell of a time with him after he returned from the other school district. She was more often than not having to make a call to the resource teacher to remove him from the room because she couldn't control his insubordination. Eventually, she thought about what I had told her, and she got instant results from him by simply picking up his points sheet and taking off a point each time he refused to obey her requests. So, by stepping outside the proverbial box she found a way to get control. He needed the visuals, he couldnt correlate losing points that gave him rewards at the end of the day from her telling him to do something and him refusing. But when she picked up his point sheet to remove a point he could then correlate that with being a negative thing (punishment).



She is the only teacher who willingly tried something like we did with him and like magic, it worked.

Marie - posted on 01/09/2009

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Maybe if he has heard you say he is like his father - and he is believing it?  Make sure you treat him exactly the same as the other kids - love him - reprimand him - and if he plays up take his favourite posession away from him (my 12 year old couldn't live without his psp) - and tell him he can have it back when he behaves.  Always praise the behaviour you want more of.  He is probably feeling alienated as no one wants him there - make him feel belonged and give him responsibilities and rewards for these. Good Luck

Nicole - posted on 01/09/2009

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My older son started with the fresh behavior and I was ready to pull my hair out so I did something I swore I would never do and I went to the bookstore.  I found a great book that really helped me.  My son realized I was serious and I stayed calm.  It really helped me and gave me new ideas on how to deal with him without yelling.  The book is called 1-2-3 Magic by Thomas w. Phelan, Ph.D.



An example is: My son never kept his room clean, no matter what punishments I gave so I told him I would clean his room for him but he was going to pay me to do the work.  He was a little confused but I explained that for every item that I picked up for him he would owe me 2 minutes early bed time.  Well, for a messy room that adds up fast no to mention it's a punishment that doesn't punish you. If you know what I mean.  There are tons of examples in this book and I noticed an improvement within 3 days.  Although I won't lie those three days sucked royally.  Good Luck - Nikki

User - posted on 01/09/2009

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I agree with 123 magic for younger kids. We have used it for many years but as my Aspergers boy hit about 10 he once said to me "but you always gave me til "3".(he is very literial) That was it for that. I made it clear they only get one warning, that unacceptable behaviour is UNACCEPTIBAL!! My biggest help was "Supper Nanny",,Joe Frost is my hero!! I even let my kids watch it with me and we would talk about the eposide. I think with them seeing some one else explaining unacceptable behaviour and tecnics they seen I wasn't making this stuff up but I was really tring to make things easier for us all. Of course we all get off track some times but we just start fresh,every day is a fresh day.

Some thing else very important is I grew up in a house where DAD was alway right and lord help you if you questioned him. We allow our kids to voice their opinion(resptfully).They are allowed to say if they don't understand something or question our actions.My Asperger boy once questioned me as to why I always go straight to taking computer and game privilages away first(My words I think were "all electrics) We came to joint decision if bad behaviour happened while playing games he lost game privilages or if it was computer he lost computer privliges and so on...As the boys have gotten older we include them in deciding concequence and 9 out of 10 times they pick stricter concequences than I would so I end up being the good guy when I say well this time...and I less what they have suggested.

It is very important in our house to keep a routne as much as possible. Of course there are always "glitches" but I have lists in their rooms and on fridge as to what is expected ex. School days up by 7am,breakfast table by 7:30, morning chorse done by 8am.(their dad goes to work at 8) then free time til school. My list also helps to get their dad to help out before he leaves(or is was that in a dream..lol)

Katie - posted on 01/08/2009

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With him having a lot of siblings maybe he is just crying out for some form of attention, whether good or bad maybe he needs a lot of attention for whatever reason. Maybe he is being bullied at school as well or by someone older than him. I think seeing a psychologist will be good for him just give it time. It takes people a long time to open up. Try to talk to him as much as you can a son always respects his mother more than anyone else. Keep lines of communications open. He is a male so he's going to have issues admitting he has any kind of problem.lol

Katia - posted on 01/08/2009

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Try and get an assesment on your child maybe he got some kind of Autism going on you need to talk to a health visitor or your Doc about this my son has got Aspergers and i do belive the 1-2-3 tecnique does work and u have to be firm and stand your grounds or it might just be as simple as he need YOU to spend time with just him he might just feel left out being that you have 6 children!!!

Lisa - posted on 01/08/2009

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Hi darl what ever you do don't give up hope i have an 8 yr old who has ADHD and possably aspergers who sounds simmilar to your child have you tried seeing a peadiatrition they can be quite helpful not sure what else to tell you right now except dont give up.



 

Amy Mae - posted on 01/07/2009

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Has anyone tried the Nurtured Heart Approach?  It can work miracles.  As a teacher, I've watched my most difficult students transform before my eyes, and watched parents at the end of their rope relax.  They actually come in to school smiling now!  Our school adopted the approach and we offer training to our staff and parents.  Really.  The students that I once dreaded seeing are now some of my favorites!  The NHA has totally changed my life.  I tried 1,2,3 magic and there are some things about it that work well for some children, but I've had much more success with this approach.  And it works for everyone, not just difficult children.  It is useful for "easy" kids, and even adults!  My whole world is a much more positive place now.  I really can't say enough wonderful things.  Check out the book, Transforming The Difficult Child  and/or the website http://difficultchild.com/

Karen - posted on 01/07/2009

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I can relate to the school stuff as well. Calling my husband or threatening to call my husband would make my stepson go into a panic! Yeah, it sounds bad, what it meant was that his father and I could make him do what he wouldn't do for others, even talking to him on the phone.



We were lucky to get a good resource teacher from the start. His problem is that people who let him get away with things get no joy from him. He needed to have constant checks and reward/behavioral charts etc, along with role playing to help him learn better social behaviors and make better choices. Many schools just don't have the ability to do this. Is why the AEA needs to be called in to help implement interventions and train the staff in what they need to do.



My brother is an expert in this field so I also got alot of tips from him. He is based in Queensland, Australia, where he was hired to train the specialist teams that go into the schools. His words to me were, that if you can't get the teachers onboard, then you've lost. The weakest part of it all is the teachers. Many are still entrenched in outmoded methods, or just believe the kids are bad and should be punished, therefore don't believe in reward systems.



A Functional Behavior Assessment is also a good thing to have done on your child. Unfortunately, my brother's idea of one of those and the type we received had no relation to each other. Each state and each school district are at their own levels of education in regards to behavorally challenged children. At the end of the day, the diagnosis isn't as important as the interventions to address the behavioral issues. Also, drugs aren't always the answer. Unfortunately, America is so entrenched in the drug scene that too many children are on drugs and don't receive the relearning they need to function appropriately.



If most of these parents on here are American and you others are from other countries, you wont get the same responses as here in America. America has alot more money in their school systems and if you have insurance you're gonna get what you want eventually from someone.



The new big diagnosis here is bi-polar in children. It isnt without controversey. Infact IPTV.com's Frontline news had a very good series of documentaries on this very topic. You can go their website to view these programs. The biggest thing I have had to fight here is the desire to put your child on drugs. That is why we chose to get a professional private opionion because I wasn't going to have teachers tell me that was the best option. This boy is now 13 and doing well. He still takes alittle more maintenance than others, but he has been given the skills to use in life. I also believe it is because we began behavioral interventions at a young age 312 that this has enabled him to learn skills and have them embedded in his psyche long enough for his behaviors to not become anti-social. In our case, we chose the right thing for him.



I just think about what my brother has given me in terms of knowledge, even about his field and what they are able to do for autistic children through assessments and empirical data. Some solutions are as simpe as swinging the child for 10 mins at a certain time of the day before their behavior starts. Amazing stuff.



Good luck to everyone, it's so hard dealing with all these issues.

Nenna - posted on 01/07/2009

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I am a mother of five, and my 12 year old had similar problems. I seem that no one could really help me and I only tried hard to please him as much as I could in order for him to behave. His good behaviour lasted only hours but it helped then, lilttle did I know then how wrong I was doing!



However one day I was alone at home with him, he wa not feeling well and I had this great idea of no fighting with him, and be his pscycologist. I kew after hours that hi has very angry, and frustation was his main word! I asked family memeber to take my other children for the weekend, and really helped me a lot with my son who is now 12, I got to know more his frustations, and the bulliness was only a way of keeping his failures at school or with friends from showing, I notice that he was not really a "bad boy" how everyone including me called him, he is a very sensitive little boy with tons of frustrations and beleive it or not STRESS...I sarted spending more time alone with him, walking, playing and fishing, little by little he became better. And my first task was to help him achieve his homework without frustation. He felt proud of himself everytime he was done on his own. I went to the shool and ask for help without him knowing, teachers send less work for him to complete. we started with simple tasks, also we included at home washing his own dish like everyone else, or help me set up the table for dinner time, and everytime he will get upset and mean ...rude...I will remind him very calmly what we talked about. I will send him to his room, he will kick and so on, but minutes later I made apologized, Im glad to tell you that my son had this problem when he was 7  or 8 now hes 12 and Im very happy with him and all my other children. It wasnt easy at all. It was buiding a whole different rutine, for all of us, so all of us had tasks to complete as much as he did, I had printed TO DO list on the fridge with everyone names on it, I also started noticing that having many children is a blessing, full of hard work, everyone is very special and unique, and each single one of them needs their own time alone with parents,siblings learn to respect their "time alone" and they also love it!



The vocabulary stared working better everytime I will correct not only him but all of them and not only when he cursed but always correcting them all from a mistake or so on...I believe that our children with very strong behavioural problems, arent born like that! They perhaps never learned how to express their feelings or didnt really learn how to comunicate at an early age with parents, most of all if you are a busy mommy like me =) so its a good thing to start now all over again and hold his hand to walk him once again the same steps hes already walked but perhaps forgot how to...with your help love and patience he will do it.



Last but not least ALWAYS REMEMBER NOT TO LOOK FOR SCUSSES LIKE: "Ive done this Ive tried that" or he "already knows" "I tell him one t housand times" and on...Just sit down and take it from the bottom of your heart and begin. Remember you are his mother and only you can help him better because hes bond to you  by the love his has for you!



Hope this helps somehow. I worked for me it was very difficul and it didnt happen from one day to other...it took ling but hes an exelent little boy now, he plays around with his sibling and has lots of friends...my down side??? I never got him better at school...he comlpletes his works because he has to not because he really tries!



Much love!!!

User - posted on 01/07/2009

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Hi, Im Bonnie. My son is 14 end of this month. We dealt with many behaviour problems when he was younger, Once realizing he has Asperger's Syndrome(high functioning Autism) we were able to get help to manage it, School no longer looked at him as a bad kid but a kid that needed to be taught things differently.He has grown out of most of the bad behaviour problems but will continue todeal with social delay.I had always felt he always wanted to be in charge or self centered but as he aged and he started reading about Aspergers he has explained to me he just wants things to run as they should and as soon as thing go off(say playing sports and some one cheats) he just looses it. He is very easy to have sensory over load. Now we know to look for sign as he is becoming adjetated, he paces. Very important point he has a brother 2 1/2 years younger and he will push his buttons. We blamed the older boy for some time then came to see the younger was pushing him to melt down. We work hard to keep them in check,but boys will be boys

Cindy - posted on 01/07/2009

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I have an eight and  nine year boy and a twelve year old daughter.  my eight year old boy is my problem child.  similir behavior of yours.   I find if he is lacking sleep or becomes tired he is at his worse.  this is when he can be walking by some one and kick them and keep walking as if he has done nothing wrong.  when addressed about it he will say what I did not do that.  I will always make him appoligizes but really the only way my son does not continue the bab behavior is making sure he goes and lays down for awhile.  The school has even sent him home for being tired and when he got home he was far from that but I really do not think the school knows what they are talking about.  there has been times he will not do school work at school but I will come to school and tell him he needs to do it and he will.  I have found some teachers he will listen to great adn others he will give continues problems.  My son is one that needs good rest, and someone he will trust and enjoy to actually behave better for.  if he does not like the person he will not work well with that person.  My son is on no meds or having any counciling but is not bad for me since he does understand if he acts up he has to appoligize and take a break.  My children have no TV and Video games in there rooms either so they have nothing that keeps them up either.

Marie - posted on 01/07/2009

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JUST AS SOME OF Y HAVE SAID I WOULD DESCRIBE MY SONS BEHAVIOUR AS ALMOST SCHIZOPHRENIC-IF HE IS HAVING A "OK"DAY HE IS LOVING AND WOULD DO ANYTHING 4 U BUT IF IT A PROB DAY THERE IS NOTHING U CAN DO WITH HIM-TIME OUT,PRIVILGES TAKEN AWAY,HIM MAKING HIS OWN DECISIONS ETC.LETS HOPE SOME GOOD COMES OUT OF HIS NEXT APP!MOST OF U I THINK LIVE IN AMERICA BUT I LIVE IN ENGLAND SYSTEM WORKS DIFF HERE.ANY IDEAS 4 STEPS NOIW?I GONNA CHECKOUT THE WEBSITES GIVEN BUT IF THE AUTHO FIGS DONT AGREE WITH ME ONLY CHOICE I HAVE IS 2 PAY PRIVATE?

Melanie - posted on 01/06/2009

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Just a suggestion, have an independent agency do his testing.  Unfortunately, school districts are businesses and if testing shows a need for special services that dips into the districts funds.  You will get the best unbiased testing from an independant agency. 

Melanie - posted on 01/06/2009

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 I am a social work major in Ohio, but my son has Childhood onset bipolar disorder.  Have you seen much of this in your area?  We are seeing lots of kids with ADHD, ODD, or many other behavioral disorders, even comorbid disorders that actually fit the diagnosis for Childhood onset bipolar.  Not widely diagnosed yet due to stigmas associated with bipolar, but I've seen amazing results in kids treated with mood stabilizers.  Just wondering what you were seeing in your area. 

Melanie - posted on 01/06/2009

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They probably won't want to diagnose at this young an age, but ask about Childhood Onset Bipolar Disorder.  Different than adult manic deppressive Bipolar Disorder.  Google it and you will find tons of info.

Melanie - posted on 01/06/2009

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We loved Concerta...at first.  Just be careful, it has been know to cause or make anger/rages worse.  It usually takes a year or two to start seeing this side effect.  Good Luck!

Melanie - posted on 01/06/2009

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My oldest is 14 1/2 and I feel your pain!  He has finally been diagnosed with Childhood onset bipolar disorder and the mood stabilizer med Depakote has made a HUGE difference!  He's actually tolerable now!  We started off with an ADHD diagnosis in 1st grade, and ODD diagnosis in 3rd grade, and tried multiple cocktails of meds.  He's on several meds now, but the Depakote seems to be the catalyst to improvement.  My suggestion is if you aren't getting any results with the psych dr's you are seeing find a new one!  We had to do that a couple times til we found a good fit.  Also, we found that having a separate counselor and psych dr helped too!  Good luck and hang in there, let me know i you just need an ear to vent to!  I'm actually a Social Work major because of my experiences.  I'm hoping to work with other struggling parents in my area helping navigate the available resources or the kids AND the parents.

Katrina - posted on 01/06/2009

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It may very well be allergies.  That would be a good thing to check on.  That alone has made a big difference in the lives of children.  Also it may be that family issues have not been taken care of.  Children need to know forgiveness, understanding and healing in their family to be happy, healthy and do well functioning in school. 



I have found that praying with my children and for them really calms them down and calms me too!  The Lord has promised us that he will save our children when we bring them to HIm.  It might be a very new idea to some of you but it has helped me so much and brought a calm and peace to our home.  It takes time to make changes but these changes are good changes and you will be blessed as you add these things to your life.  Aloha!



 

Diane - posted on 01/06/2009

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I too have an autistic son who now 11 we adopted him at age 3 along with his little brothers. We use ABA for James and his brothers. . We also use some of the information in a book called "Transforming the Difficult Child," the nurtured heart approach. We use a velcro pic/word schedule [ the list includes, breakfast, teeth, dressing, bus ride, school exc.] for each activity of our day. they put the days schedule together each morning it only takes a few minutes, if there is a change we call it a zigzag. they know that things will be different during that time for that day. Carol Grey's website provides information on social stories and ABA. We have wrap around services with a local mental health agency and he is in a special program at school. Along with autism he also has ptsd and reactive attachment disorder. The more predictabity you can provide for your child the easier it is to manage the day. We use these same tools with his brothers who are 8 and 10, They are odd, ocd and rads. Our life has become less confusing not perfect but better, There is also a program for EBD kids in our school system, which uses ABA as the managment plan for their students. It works. I teach boys with autism at the high school level and we use the ABA program. It is success oriented but remember to try to work on one thing at a time, above all be consistent with expectations it helps to have a written list for them to refer to as well.

Tracy - posted on 01/06/2009

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Thanks for all the responses, he has not been screened I was always told he was too young but now that he is 8 I am going to have the school psychologist test him. I have heard alot about food allergies, thank you for suggesting that as well, I will look into finding someone who does that as well.

Amanda - posted on 01/06/2009

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I have an autistic son.  To help deal with some of his behavioral issues I have started attending an ABA workshop called Behavioral Solutions.  The workshops focus on how to handle these types of issues and will also do in home visits. 

Erika - posted on 01/06/2009

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has he been screened for ADHD?  defianance and disruptive behavior is a part of it; he sounds like my daughter; she has been diagnosed with it and is not a hyper child, she just sh lack of control and is very implsive and makes bad decisions. 

Karen - posted on 01/06/2009

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I don't know enough about allergies, but yes, if the behaviors aren't consistent then there could be a case for allergies. I do have a grandson with multiple allergies and when he has had something he's allergic to he gets eczema really bad and he feels unwell and he becomes difficult with his behaviors.



ODD doesn't change, it's there all the time and everything, but everything is cause for a power play by the ODD child. The sad part is that when they aren't getting the interventions they need, they learn to feel bad about themselves and the cycle goes on for them. I had to write a letter to a school district we moved to when stepson was in 3rd grade, to ask the board to let him go back to his old school. Fortunately, we had the IEP's and behavior sheets to prove our point, plus we had the support of his previous resource teacher and the principal of his old school. I know that they told the supervisor of the old district that he needed to okay my stepsons return. Thank god they let him go because it was past time for open enrolment applications and the district AEA psychologist refused to release us. She told us it was our fault.



During that year at the new school, he went from one minor behavior in 5 mths to averaging 9 major behaviors per week. The school district and AEA were unable to apply the interventions that worked to make him successful. For his psychological wellbeing, and for the sake of his future, he needed to get out of that district that had suspended him 3 times and put him in a place where he didn't think he was anything but bad.



It took the old school district one year to get his behaviors back where they needed to be. The resource teacher told us that it was as though all the 2 years of work they'd done on him in 1st and 2nd grade had been wiped away. They had to spend that next year retraining him to be successful.



My motto in life is that "Children are as good as the adults around them". And yes, I do quote that to the school staff that insist they are right and botch it up in the process!

Luisa - posted on 01/06/2009

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I am a behavior specialist and I work with kids who have behaviors problems both in their homes and in school. I would be more than happy to help if you have some more specifics, but, my best suggestion is to see if you have any agencies like mine in your area. All states have different supports in place for children with behavior and other psychological problems. In Pennsylvania it is wraparound and there are a team of specialists who help develop different approaches to manage specific behaviors as well as putting in supports to try to figure out the reasons for the behaviors. What seems like just out of the blue behaviors for no reason sometimes has a purpose, only the people around do not always see or understand the purpose. A school psychologist could help you find programs as should the private psychologist you are seeing. Ask questions, they also have a ton of information online if you know where to look. Unfortunately, I don't know where to look, I can't help with that. Good luck. The best advice I give parents of children with ODD is be consistent and be clear with what you expect with clear consequences, no room for arguing and put it on the choices your kids make. If you do this, this is what will happen, if you choose to do this, this is what will happen, so it is the choice the child makes knowing the outcome and follow through with both the positive and the negative outcomes. Good luck. Tough behavior problem to deal with.

Paulette - posted on 01/06/2009

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A lot of what I am hearing is all about the behavior of the children. I had posted about allergies from foods affecting behaviors....what do you think Marie, Karen and Tracy?

Tracy - posted on 01/06/2009

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I am having similiar problems with my son he is 8 and has been very Jekyl and Hyde behavior since he was 2. I have taken him to a therapist they said he was to young for testing, done 1-2-3 Magic, my problem is when I need to put him in timeout he won't go on his own I have to physically take him and then he won't stay in his room, I have to stand there and hold the door since I was told locking him in would be child abuse. His mouth is another problem, he screams at me I hate you! your the worst mother in the world, I wish I had a different family, lately he calls me the devil. He doesn't get into trouble at school, thats why I don;t think it's a mental thing, he seems to struggle with frustration, at times I feel so broken, mentally, spiritually. But when he's in a good mood he is the most thoughtful, loving, sweetest child, it shocks me how he is so contrasting in moods. Does this sound like anyone elses kids, I would love to know what you have done.

Karen - posted on 01/06/2009

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Yes, my stepson too is a bright boy, he averages A's and B's. He is so smart that he knows how to get the adults going around him. The website I pointed you to has articles on this and just how destructive and ODD child can be to peace and orderliness. They defy all authority figures naturally.



I came into this family when he was 31/2 years old after having brought up a family of three of my own. I knew instantly that this child was different and because I like structure and control in my home, I searched for help. We began with Positive Discipline for Pre-Schoolers which worked for us as well. However, the non-arguing method of the 1-2-3-Magic was the best for him and us.



We had to go to great lengths to change his behaviors and we found that no chances worked best for his need to control. The premise is, that everyone knows the rules, therefore when they are broken there is time-out. Yes, it did mean having to put him back time and time again without talking without looking at him. It did mean months to work on each behavioral change as he fought everything.



It also means that you use rewards to encourage the good behaviors and you remove those rewards when they are not exhibited. So, find something he really likes and make it that he has to earn so many points or do many things to earn his time on the video game (say). That means he can only play the video when he's earned it.



Also what worked for my stepson is that when he refused to take responsiblity for his choices we just went through a litany of questions to get him to give the answers. Watching his face when he gave the rule back to you was a treat He'd get this look on his face as though to say, UH UH, I'm cornered now! Once they've told you the rule, then they can't argue that they don't know it, or that his behavior didnt break any.



Please go to those sites I gave you and learn as much as you can. If he hasn't got an IEP now, he should have one. You can ask the school to call in the AEA or you can call them yourself. He needs all the support and interventions available to ensure his success. It doesn't get better, it gets worse as they get older. We all know how volatile teenagers are. Many of these kids end up in the system if their behaviors are not changed when they are younger.

Marie - posted on 01/06/2009

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thanks for all your  comments i have read about odd and i too think it could be this(not adhd) he is a constant disruption in school and most days has to be removed from class,he has been excluded on a few occasions and on report several times. academically he was above average but in last 4 years or so has really dropped down to below average-he is a bright boy just cant be bothered-or his words"i dont care" or his other fav quote is "it wasnt me" even if u saw him do it!

Paulette - posted on 01/06/2009

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Hi Marie, I totally understand your fustrations. I do think the other posts might have a good point about a disorder whether it is dyspraxia to odd....but what I wonder is if food allergies are playing a role in his moods. Gluten and dairy are two of the biggest. Not to forget red food dyes. For my brother it was red food dyes...they made him rage in irritability and anger. With my son and even myself, it is dairy and gluten that make us irritable. I had allergy testing done...the allergist told me that when the body is out of balance from allergens it has to have some way of showing and moods is one way, skin is another and gastrointestinal is another. So I am suggesting allergy testing, it is not a whole solution but it could help. Try to write down or ask him to keep a food journal to see what he is eating and you can give this to the allergist to help find out what to test. Caffeine is a thing that kids go over board on too. If they go to many hours without it when they're use to it, they get a headache. I hope this gives you some direction. Take care.

Karen - posted on 01/06/2009

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Most importantly, don't let schools push you around either. They are not always the be all and end all of your child's success. It takes parents with convictions to advocate at all times for the best intersts of their child.

Jada - posted on 01/06/2009

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I would suggest starting with the pediatrition but then getting a referral to a doctor who specializes in behavioral disorders. Also I would ask that he have a quantitative EEG. This type of EEG looks at the entire brain including the frontal lobe and temporal lobes which is where many behavioral issues are from. My son is six and we have been through the ringer with him. He was finally diagnosed with cerebral dysrythmia and mood disorder NOS. He takes a lot of medicine but we have our boy back, where as before the medication was unbarable to live with. I say that truthfully as we have five boys, two older than him and two younger than him. We live in a small town so we did have to travel for all of his treatments and testing but a year later I have no regrets. We also had to resort to residential treatment for a period of time which gave the doctors the time with him they needed to diagnose him properly. He had been hospitalized three time prior to that, in two week increments and that just was not enough because they might not act the same at the hospital as they do at home.

Karen - posted on 01/06/2009

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Just so people realize, you don't have to have ADHD to have ODD. When the school came to us when he was in kindergarten and told us he had ADHD and drugs would be a good idea (AEA in attendance), that's when we decided to take him to a recommended paychologist to have him tested.



We involved the AEA when he was at pre-school and the teachers were having problems them. Through everything, it has been the schools unwillingness to implement 1-2-3-Magic which as successful in our home. The AEA social worker backed me up when it came to the crunch in grade 1. She made the resource and classroom teachers watch the videos and read the book and to implement the interventions. Once they did that, his tantrums etc stopped after 1 week. The resource teacher who had fought me on this came to me and told me that it worked for him.



Sometimes parents just do too much talking back to the child instead of implementing the intervention. This causes an environment of enabling. Enabling the child to argue with you. Yes, you do need to keep at it, just like everything else in life with children. Yes, you do need all people involved in their care to be doing the same interventions. However, even if the schools refuse, what you teach them at home will also go through life with them. It all starts in the home! Unfortnately, I have found that most so called experts negate the parents and push their own agendas.



It is always a good idea to get a specialist opinion and test done to ensure your child has no other issues. I was adamant that I was not going to have teachers and an AEA social worker diagnose my child without a specialist doing the testing.



Good luck.

Lorrie - posted on 01/06/2009

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your pediatrician needs to see him to be sure he does not have disorder of some type such as oppositional disorde wich children tend to want control over everybody and everything..his symptoms sound very familiar to aspergers disorder or adhd. Good luck and keep us informed.

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I too have 5 children, I feel your pain! My son is delayed but you wouldn't know it be looking at him, when he was five he was out of control, we had a few doctors look at him, so we had a clear picture of what we were dealing with. He has Global Disability Sydrome, this affects moods, education, and mostly behavior. He is on Concerta...and I don't care what anybody says, he is an angel now is in special ed. but integrated in asome grade six classes, he's so happy and that is what it's about. He belongs. Your son may have depression or a mood disorder, mention to his doctor that you want behavioral management or to look into mood disorder clinics, if you get a diagnosis, there are grants and support systems out there for you. How is he in school? All the best Marie, hang in there.

Amy - posted on 01/06/2009

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1-2-3 Magic does work, but you have to stick with it. My 6 year old has problems away from me. At home I can pretty much control the situation. There are still problems with Lying or just trying to get away with what he can. He has recently started talking about how no one likes him or how "he thinks" they think his toys are "stupid" or what ever negitive work he can think of. 1-2-3 will help the behavior but it will take time to help what is actually causing the problem. My feeling is that if my son thinks he is not worth the effort or good enough then he doesn't treat himself in that manner or his peers. Your not the only one going through this as a parent, but our kids are the ones that probably feel alone.

Karen - posted on 01/06/2009

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Sounds like you need the 1-2-3-Magic program. It works wonders for children that are oppositional defiant, ADHD. I can also give you a link to another site I like to go to that have alot of blogs and articles by a child psychologist who has a program for difficult children. I have a step-son who was diagnosed at age 7 with Oppositional Defiance and was told to use the 1-2-3-Magic program. It really works for him and he is now 13 and doing very well at school and in life in general. He has also been on an IEP since kindgergarten as his behaviors got in the way of him being successful at school. The links are: http://www.empoweringparents.com/Why-the... and http://www.parentmagic.com/. The parent magic has the list of books to buy to help you with managing your child's behaviors. Actually, it's great to use for any children. You can also get this book in most libraries and book stores.

Denise - posted on 01/06/2009

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i have the same problem with my 13 yr old..its very frusterating and no one seems to help till its to late..for my other kids i have us in a group therapy session so they understand that its not proper...maybe you can get him a mentor or something like that..big brother, etc...

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