Why do SOME single mothers believe they OWN children?

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013 ( 29 moms have responded )

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I have a cousin that is no longer with the father of her child. She made rant posts in the beginning about him being a deadbeat. Recently she posted that he asked her if he could keep her for 4 more days. She responded no, because she was off and she wanted to spend the day with her and he needed to bring her back. I was confused by this. Why do SOME women get to demand the child as if they own the child? Am I wrong for finding her behavior totally selfish, contradictory, and out of line?

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♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 09/03/2013

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Well, it totally depends on what their custody agreements are. You don't know what exactly goes on in any situation that you aren't involved in, and taking information second or third hand always leaves room for a wrong conclusion.

Fact of the matter is, if the paperwork said that daddy had to have kiddo back by Sunday, and he wanted more time, generally it has to be put back before the judge, so he has to get kiddo back by Sunday (for example)

She's probably following the custody order. Unless you are privy to her entire life, and all of the sordid details, I would have to say that you're being quite judgmental.

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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Not all single moms are like that. Maybe they have a custody and visitation agreement you do not know much about. IF this is the case, then if he is not in a joint arrangement of the custody, he has to abide the visitation. And maybe mom missed her child. THat is sound thought right there.

I know a few single moms and one in particular has three children. Today, one is on his own and two are in late teens but still in school. Keep this in mind. She has had total custody of these kids since day one since the separation and divorce. Her ex did not want to be a father of two more kids but he did nothing to stop her getting pregnant while she had tried all forms of birth control at the time that were available both from prescription and non-prescription products. Her chemistry was so that she could get pregnant no matter what she did. He did not use anything. So after first child, she got pregnant 2x more thinking he was wanting to work out the marriage when in fact, he was not willing at all. And 2x, he told her to abort the kids she carried. He got a firm no from her since he did not try to help prevent things. During their time in separation and divorce, a visitation was set after she gained full custody. He has since that day not really abided by this arrangement. Over the years he has called for the kids less and less every year. He has gotten to the point he has seen them maybe 2x this year. It had nothing to do with her "owning" the kids that he did not see them...he chose not to come see them. When he did want to have them, it was out of visitation roster set in court per her terms. When he was supposed to get them he never called or would call last minute after saying he would be there to say he could not come. She did everything to get him to take them on his weekends and holidays. He CHOSE not to do so.

I also know a few other women who have become single moms. They also do not own the kids but if the father can not reach out and make arrangements on getting the kids and does not follow a court order, why should he get to make it up.

Some women do use the kids and try to control the fathers. I know that happens. But not all single moms do this. There are also some dads who hold the kids over the mothers too. IT GOES BOTH WAYS.

Kelly - posted on 09/04/2013

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well Lana it sounds to me like your a good mom and you would do the right thing in this situation but, when u have a child that doesnt want to see there father its not that cut n dry,.....its very expensive to get voice of the child done by a professional n often the information is not submissable in court because both parents have been manipulating the child, i would gather its probably why some abuse cases get overlooked. Once a child is 12 it gets a little easier they can speak on behalf of themselves but again that costs lots of money too and its upto a judge to determine whether theres significant reasons to never see the one parent again. Also the child has to be brave enough to stand up and say what they want and when your only 12 thats alot of pressure. Children are put in a very difficult situation when seperation and or divorce happens, right smak in the middle ..So Its upto the adults to make it as smooth as they can and it takes both parents to make that happen, but sadly some cases the parents torture the children with there banter and unwillingness to bend an inch and never see how truely selfish they are.

Kelly - posted on 09/04/2013

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In your case Danielle i totally agree ..being a parent means all of it, the good and the bad, not just a vacation. As a mom i think were always the ones that are held most responsible but also I think if the situation was different for you, you may see that a father can be just as good of a protector, and its not his fault he wasnt blessed with the ability to carry.

Jodi - posted on 09/04/2013

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Ok, just read the rest of the posts, and see that you think there may be no court order. As others have said, court orders are to protect everyone, and it also takes ANY grey areas out of the equation. It is clear, and it means everyone understands their responsibilities in the co-parenting relationship. Where I live, a court order isn't needed by parents who agree - it can simply be a parenting plan that is filed with the court. The courts still has jurisdiction over it should things go south, but the court did not make the final decisions about the plan, the parents did.

In some co-parenting relationships, it is unfortunate that both (or one of the) parents are not focused on what is best for the child. I am all for the rights of the father, believe me, my husband has been on the end of some really unfair situations. I know we don't have the full story of your scenario, but from the info I do have, I am still not seeing that a denial of a last minute request to extend the arranged visit because SHE was expecting that time with her child is necessarily selfish and controlling. It's not like she is denying him his arranged visit, just the unexpected extension. Maybe he also needs to be a bit more organised and arrange it with more notice. I can see it from both sides.

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Chatterbox1234 - posted on 06/03/2014

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ok i am going to stick my nose in here i think it depends on the type of mother at the moment i am in a situation where i am being told when i can see my little girl and for how long and what i can and cant do its stressing the hell out of me tried meditation she has not showed up she keeps saying she wont leave me alone shes made so many false allegations so in her opinion supervised contact is needed this women used to be nice she has turned nasty negative comments etc all trying to get me angry and then in this supervised contact shes looking for more reasons and more reasons for supervised contact more false allegations since my little girl has been born its been a attitude of keeping me at arms length from my daughter as if she has superiority this women has cheated on me broke up with me over fb got pregnant and has run of with another man i am thick a waste of space a useless father i am a bad role model when in truth ive never been given the chance to be a proper father to my little girl its funny none of this was said when we was together soon as this new man entered her life things changed i have been humiliated bullied by this nasty women i have snapped back at times i dont think anyone can blame me you have to be there to hear it and see it and then u will truly understand men are people with feelings and emotions i know a typical man has a hard shell but there's only so much we can take as people before we crack i had to brake contact in the end as it was not good for my little girl and for me it resulted in me getting depression and thats not good for me and my little girl she paints to everyone else that shes this nice women my family have been scared to confront her in case they lose contact with my little girl some of my single father Friends have been extremely supportive but all the support in the world can not make you feel better with not having your little girl in your live its killing me on the inside all i want to do is focus on me and her love her and be there for her and now that this will always be the case they way shes acted i am not even sure she knows i am her father with the way she has acted i just hope and pray the courts will see what is going on and support me in being a single father shes abused my parental responsibility she did not even involve me in what nursery she goes to her response its my choice as i have custody and its the closet basically she did not decide based on the best pre school only the one that was closest my little girl went to meddoc and i had to find out through my father she did not even tell me what it was about when confronted i broke contact bla bla bla no i am just not agreeing with your terms of contact anymore i am not putting up with her bullying and lies anymore i am a 26 year old man and it just makes me want to cry

LalaBoom - posted on 11/22/2013

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Yes you are correct that behavior like such is selfish.

To answer your question:

Any person (mom/dad) who uses kids as pawn against the other parent is emotionally stunted.

Ev - posted on 09/04/2013

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My daughter has been in that situation of having to tell the judge what she wanted to do. She was not only very stressed but also under the pressure to make a choice. She was so scared she would make one of us so mad at her so she decided on the one that would have been the most upset about the custody, her father. She was so sad she made me mad but I assured her that while I did not like the choice she made, I was not mad at her for doing so. I think if had been done the other way, her father would have been furious. So in the end, I let him have the kids because I knew in a few months time we would be at it again and I could not do that to my kids or myself. They came first.

Lana - posted on 09/04/2013

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I totally understand that it isn't fair for a father to be half assing it believe me I do. If my husband(god forbid) ever decides to leave me and my daughter is like 10 I want it to be up to her to decide whether she likes him, or not. I wouldn't want to take the chances for contact away from her because she will resent me for not allowing her to see him even if she he was crap! She would want to decide that for herself. If he is half assing it and my daughter decides he sucks then it is final. She won't see him much any more. If she decides she wants to see him so be it. If the small amount of contact she got from him made her happy then so be it. I'm staying out of it.

Ev - posted on 09/04/2013

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I can see all sides of it but you have to understand if you are not in the situation that there are underlying things also going on and each case is different. I did not leave my kids, I made the choice to let them live with their father because it was best for them not to worry about where they would be in six months and I was not about to make them pawns. I wanted them to have stability. They got it from me. As a mom, I did not want to give up that but under the circumstances I did not have much choice. All in all, my lawyer told me to look at it this way and I quote part of her words, "think of this as a vacation and let him see what it takes to take care of kids." In one sense of this she was right; let him see what it takes to handle kids and all that goes with them when I was the one that did it all before hand. He found out fast what it was to have to find daycare for after school, to do everything in the evening to get ready for the next day and even go to work himself. Inside of 14 months he got married again. I think that time was because he could not handle the kid end of things. And after that divorce, he married again in another six months but this time its been an 8 year marriage so far. Again, I think part of it was because he needed that person there to take care of the kids. The other part of those words to think of it as a vacation in letting him have majority custody in the joint agreement was not my idea of a vacation. My lawyer did not remember that I was giving up the life I had before this change and it was not easy. It was no vacation for me either. To this day, I still worry about all those times I was not there to take care of my kids.

Danielle - posted on 09/04/2013

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why do men get to pick and choose when its convenient for them to be fathers. My sons father will be gone for months at a time and then try and take our son for quality time. I do not think it is fair for the child to have a half way father. You are either one or you aren't. If you are not ready to be a full time father you shouldn't get any father time. Not saying that parents have to be together but it should be about the kids 100%. In my situation I do what I can to protect my child. I carried them for 9 months and its up to me to protect them. I don't get to just run away when its convenient.

Kelly - posted on 09/04/2013

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I think moms take it upon themselves to be in control of the raising of the children and with justification most times for example if a man and a woman have an argument who usually leaves ?...its not the mothers way normally, not to think of the children everytime she makes a move but fathers very often have the freedom thanks to mom to do whatever they want with no thought for anyone but themselves. I think thats why alot of the time in a custody battle the woman doesnt trust the man she hasnt seen him put in the same effort so its any wonder women act terribly when there is a custody issue Im not condoning it im just saying its understandable ....and yes you are right it is selfish contradictory and out of line and if your cousin was mature she wouldnt be posting such things so in the words of my late grandmother ...consider where its coming from < your cousin is angry and bitter she wants everyone to see her point of veiw because she feels shes put in all the work and now he wants with no regard for her feelings or the life shes trying to rebulid ....and often the realtionship is drained and full of hate, she may be just being mean because she wants to to get back at him. Plus shes responsible in all aspects so shouldnt she be in control ? its just too bad she cant see how it hurts her child atm.

Jodi - posted on 09/04/2013

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If it wasn't his time with her (which I'm guessing it wasn't because he was asking for extra time with no notice?), and she had a day off, I am not seeing that it is unreasonable of her to have said no so that she can spend her day off with the child, as per what may have been the visitation schedule. If there is no visitation schedule, then maybe dad should get it done so that the visits are clear and in black and white. If there is, then he wouldn't have had to ask and there would have been no grounds on which she could say no. Who is to say she didn't have plans, on the belief that her daughter would be home with her. She has the right to say no without being seen as selfish or contradictory.

Dove - posted on 09/03/2013

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Exactly Lana.... you have some 'dads' threaten to take the kids away and never return them (just as you have some 'moms' that play the same game)... and if you have the other parent (the one not making threats) WANTING the kids to be with both parents.... is it any wonder that they decide forbid access without a court order? If they did allow access without that paper... the parent who wanted to work together could be the one fighting like crazy just to see the kids at all.

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013

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SHEESH.. I forgot about the case where she sent her son to Europe with his dad for the summer and he never gave him back. 4 years later she still doesn't have him. Hm.. I totally get the court order thing now. If she would have had one then the father would not have been able to keep him.

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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What it boils down to is that the children suffer most for it all. When parents act like jerks when it comes to custody, it hurts the children more than it does the adults. THe kids have no say in how things are going to work out and time and time again, they are hurt, confused, and do not understand why people are so hateful to each other.

Dove - posted on 09/03/2013

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A court order protects everyone. Even in cases where the parents agree a court order is best because two people agreeing today does not necessarily mean they will agree 6 months from now. Stuff happens, people change. IF the parents are in agreement they can make up their own order and just have it notarized by the court, but I am always in favor of having a court order.

As to answer your question of why some women are like that.... maybe the same reason some men abandon their children and 'blame' the mother.... because people are jerks.

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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Lana, I used a friend who got full custody as an example of a single mom who did not abuse the fact she had the kids all the time. THe father was behind his choices not her. She had set up a visitation roster that worked for her and the judge agreed it was int he best interest of her kids. He NEVER wanted more but did not help to prevent it either.

But as for visitation: If it is set up and mom has full custody or main custody in joint custody; the father does have to go to court to get visitation changed to something different. But in my case, the visitation roster said that if the parents could work it out and extend or have extra time with kids, then it could be done and would not hurt the initial custody agreement.

To answer question NO 1: Court orders are necessary. You can find a few hundred examples at best on here of women asking about visitation for the father's of their kids. They have not set up anything but think that they have 100 percent control of their kiddo/kiddos without one. Fact is that if there is no court order in place, there is nothing stopping EITHER parent from taking the kids and moving. If there is a court order in place and a move is made without proper connections with court and parents, that parent can land in hot water. Also court ordered visitation, custody and support are all set up to help maintain the life of the child, the relationship of child/parents, and maintain some semblance of stability. At least in theory. Also an order can help prevent one parent from keeping the kids from the other in many forms. If a court order is not in place then anything goes. BUT A PARENT CAN NOT TAKE A CHILD OUT OF THE COUNTRY NOR GET A PASSPORT TO GO OUT OF COUNTRY ON A CHILD UNLESS BOTH PARENTS SIGN FOR IT.

Your statement about agreements going into effect if parents can not agree on anything: It does not matter to a judge if an agreement is made out of the court. Its not a legal binding document. As I said above, if there is nothing in writing and court approved, anything goes. Its a he said/she said world then.

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013

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I did read it. If you would relax for a second I responded. The post about calling it like I see it wasn't even directed at you. Chill this is just a conversation between mothers.

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013

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Okay Evelynn I can see how that makes sense, I was thinking you meant it as a "daddy has to get court approval for dates and times" type thing. Like you were trying to dictate the time he gets. Whoops. I tend to read too far into things. So court orders aren't necessary when the two parents come to an agreement? They are only put into place if the parents can't reach an agreement.

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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Lana-did you read my post? THey do it because they can or they want to hold something over the dad's head. They want control. Or as in the case of another poster saying something to the line of having lost their identity in their kids. But this goes for all manner of parents no matter if single or married or otherwise. Its not always the moms that do this. Dads do it too. Not all but some.

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013

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I'm not picking at them. The majority of my newsfeed on Fbook are pissed off single moms. I call it like I see it. I certainly don't have any of my married or mothers in a relationship caliing out their "baby daddy". Since this is a site for mothers I would appreciate being enlightened on the issue. Why do SOME mothers treat children as property?

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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Lana-the reason that there is such a thing as custody orders, visitation and support orders is for the benefit of the children. IT IS NOT A CONTROL THING. The only ones who make it a control issue are the two so-called adults in the situation. IF they use the kids to try to make life hellish for each other, then the kids are being used as pawns and are nothing more than that to the parents. THey do not take what is going on with the kids into consideration. Even with those orders in place, one parent holds it over the other. I have seen it, I have experienced it, and I have had to learn to deal with it. Its not easy trying to be the parent that wants to work things out with the other, and the other parent will not cooperate. THat is why I am glad we have that court order, because you can be sure if he did things against it, his butt would be back in court to correct it. Don't get me wrong....I am not talking nick picky stuff but real things like major decisions in doctors, school stuff, and visitation issues.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 09/03/2013

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Were yo9u in on the divorce, Lana? a fly on the wall, perhaps? If not, you really don't know anything about it for sure.

Ev - posted on 09/03/2013

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And I wonder, why pick at just single moms? There are plenty of people either way that act as though kids are property. Not only is this bad for the situation, the kids have to suffer for it.

Lana - posted on 09/03/2013

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No court order. I never knew one was ever necessary actually. Sounds like a control issue if a man cant go get his own seed without permission from the mother.

Michelle - posted on 09/03/2013

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There are definitely women out there whose entire identity is tied to their role as a mother. Anyone who puts their identity in jeopardy is automatically the enemy. You are not wrong to be frustrated with your cousin for being short sighted in allowing the father of her child to have ample access to the children.

In my experience, this tends to happen more often in younger mothers. And younger mothers tend to be more likely to fall into the single mom category. So yes, there are a fair number of single moms who act like their children are property.

However, lets be fair. There are also a huge majority of single moms who cry themselves to bed because they just let their ex have extra time with their kids because they know its the best thing for the children. And there are married moms out there who emotionally abuse their children.

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