Robin - posted on 02/26/2009

Once they get used to crying they know they will comfort themselves. I wouldn't let other people justify what you believe is right. Just like my neighbor saying I was teaching my kids violence by letting them play with lightsavers if they know the difference between right and wrong and fiction from non-fiction and destinctions between difference and hitting the lightsavers not the person than there shouldn't be any problem my kids are 7 and 8 a little bit bigger but I can understand you situation of people thinking they know it all about everything. My problem is I don't always sit there and argue with there logics to a solution.

Robin - posted on 02/26/2009

Once they get used to crying they know they will comfort themselves. I wouldn't let other people justify what you believe is right. Just like my neighbor saying I was teaching my kids violence by letting them play with lightsavers if they know the difference between right and wrong and fiction from non-fiction and destinctions between difference and hitting the lightsavers not the person than there shouldn't be any problem my kids are 7 and 8 a little bit bigger but I can understand you situation of people thinking they know it all about everything. My problem is I don't always sit there and argue with there logics to a solution.

Hayley - posted on 02/26/2009

Also I find it extremely hard to listen to her cry, mostly I end up in tears too lol any advise on how to get over or ease this aswell?

Hayley - posted on 02/26/2009

I need help with this! My daughter is 16 weeks old and I feed her to sleep. It is such a bad habit because when she wakes up and I'm not there she freaks or when I put her down she wakes up. But when I have tried to get her to soothe herself she works herself up (in a matter of maybe 5min or less) to the point of not being able to breathe, coughing and vomitting from crying so much. Also when she hears my footsteps she cries harder so I try to avoid the hysterics and just get her back up. On the other hand when she is tired enough she is happy to soothe herself to sleep. Have I fed her to sleep for too long? What am i doing wrong?

Samantha - posted on 02/26/2009

just wanted to throw this out there again.

Every child (baby/Tot/Pre-teen/Teenager) is different from one to the next, and every parent is different from one an other.
Sure some of us use some of the same methods but we all use what works for us and what works with our child (ren)
Also everyone is entitled to their own opinion but that doesn't give any one the right to to tell someone else that they are wrong just because they do things differently for you, or because you don't agree with how they are doing something.
Regardless of how you teach your child to sleep when it is time to sleep, there are going to be times when they wake up or refuse to go to sleep no matter what you do.
try going through i am not sleeping because there are monsters that will eat me up when i go to sleep. and the nightmares and being afraid of the dark and sleep walking!! this is what I am going through with my wonderful little 6 yr Grace, right now. have any ideas on how to put a stop to any of these. the night light works for the being afraid of the dark, and re-directing her back into her bedroom when she is sleep walking helps. and all of this has nothing to do with my using of the cio or the ferber methods. any ideas would be great. thanks

Susanna - posted on 02/26/2009

Your experience is similar to mine. My first daughter nursed herself to sleep and was never left alone in her crib unless she was soundly asleep. She's almost six now and still has a hard time going to sleep on her own. My second daughter was left in her crib, sleepy but awake, from the time she was about five months old. She's almost four now and almost always goes to sleep within a few minutes of going to bed.

Brandi - posted on 02/26/2009

Were suppose to be role models for our children, were to lead by example.



I think this statement is a great one, we are suppose to lead by example and lashing out at other people for having a different opinion is teaching our children that it's not ok to have an opinion unless it matches everyone elses. Having new ideas is how many many important things have happened in this world, as well as bad ones, but the point is, it's ok to be different. Just try not to take it to personally, if someone asks for advice then gets mad because it's not what they wanted to hear, they never wanted advice, they wanted validation. I've noticed that on many message boards this happens unfortunately much more than in real life because the computer gives them confidence. Just don't try to take it personal.

LeeAnn - posted on 02/26/2009

Around 10 months old we jumped on board with the Ferber Method and it was wonderful. At first it was really hard, and the longest I let her cry was 15 minutes. But after just 3 days I could go and lay her down while she was awake and off to sleep she would go. What a blessing!! Took so much stress of me, she wouldn't sleep previous to that unless I was holding her and she was right next to me. She has a set bedtime in the evenings as well, they need structure! I would never lay her down and let her cry if I didn't know it was because she was sleepy. If she has been feeling bad or hungry or wet I make sure all of those needs are met, only then would I let my little princess cry it out.

Sophie - posted on 02/26/2009

My oldest daughter was 8 months when I tried it. Her dad and I finally retreated to the front porch. I was awful. It took her 45 min to fall asleep. We went to the door and reasured her we were there like the doctor told us to do but did not pick her up. Then the next night 20 min. The third night 10 min. Fourth night she went right to sleep. My next baby I think I just did it instinctively when he was around 5 months if he got fussy I would let him work it out for a while before I went in to see what was wrong. Most of the time he would stop in less than a minute and go back to sleep. I would peek in anyway. The last one well she liked her sleep. No problem there. One day she disappeared and I was in a panic, couldn't find her anywhere. She was in her crib. She had climbed back in, 10 months old...

Claire - posted on 02/26/2009

Phew!!!! What a long read! My head is spinning now! lol

I just wanted to add my opinion on this matter! I am mum to 3 beautiful girls, aged 9, 3 and nearly 9months, and all have a good bedtime routine and sleep through the night!!

I wouldn't say I use the CIO method as such, more the 'rapid return' method! I have always been strict with bedtimes, and am a firm believer that bedtimes should be bedtimes, and that is that!

With my youngest, I have had a really hard time at bedtimes, but I was adamant that I would not run to her every whimper!! I was not going to spend every night holding her to get her to sleep. I am on my own every evening with the girls, and need to be spending my time with all 3 of my girls, not just concentrating on 1 of them!! It just wasn't fair on my eldest 2!! They all get put to bed awake and all sleep through!

When my llittle one cries, I return to her, make sure she is ok. comfort her and reassure her that I am still here, occassionally I will wind her if needed, and then I return her to her cot, tell her it is 'sleepy time' and then kiss her and leave the room!! I may have to do this a couple of times, but it does pay off in the end!! We have the odd bad night, but most nights she is in bed by 6.30 and then wakes between 7 and 7.30!!

I firmly believe that children need structure, and routine from an early age!! They need to establish a good bedtime routine to enable them to survive in life independantly and confidently, and we as parents, are the ones who need to help establish and practice these early on. Why start something now, that you know you are going to need and have to change at some point in the future!? I would never critisize a parent for choosing alternative methods, but I do feel for those parents that tell me, my child won't go to sleep unless I sit with him/her........my child shares our bed every night.......my child won't go to sleep without me being by his/her side!!! I feel that my children are much happier and content for having a good sleeping pattern and bedtime routine, and definitley have a happier mother that gets some 'me time' of an evening and gets a good nights sleep in her own bed without a child wedged between me and my partner!!! I certainly wouldn't change the way I have chosen to do things, why would I when it works!?

I am not a bad mother for choosing this method, in fact, I consider myself to be a very good mother, we all have our ways in which we do things, and the way we teach our children, but we mustn't forget that WE are the parents, and we should be showing our children how we do things so they grow up to be confident and secure. My children are happy, confident, loved and intelligent, despite the fact I don't let them dictate to me how they are to be brought up and taught!!! I listen to their needs and fulfill them with love and good intentions! They are constantly told they are loved and know that I am always there for them! That doesn't mean I do things their way though.......I do what's in their best interests, for now and for their futures!

x x

Jennifer - posted on 02/26/2009

I used the ferber method with my son and I think it was a gift to him...He is able to sleep in almost any situation. He asks to go to bed when he is tired. He sleeps 11 hours a night and takes one nice nap at 2 years of age. I certainly went in if I thought he was distressed....but really that lasted maybe a day or two. He was originally co-sleeping with me until 5 month...I knew I had to transition him then because I was going back to work. He is absolutely fine. I will do it again with my next child.

Lynsi - posted on 02/26/2009

My daughter was 7 months old and I had not slept at all for those seven months.  She was up every two hours and taking another two to get back to sleep.  Istrated having spells pf passing out bc I was not sleeping.  HEr pediatrician said letting her learn how to fall asleep on her own was indeed what I needed to do.  Not only for her but for my own well being.  I started this on a monday by wed she was taking 3 1 and half hour naps and sleeping 12 hours a night.  Best thing I ever did!  I aslo did babywise its an excellent book and schedule for little ones and their parents.  She was so much happier bc she was sleeping and so was I.  She is just over 2 still takes a 3 hour nap and sleeps 11 hours a night.

Sophie - posted on 02/26/2009

And yes you have to use it at an appropriate age and time. Not when a child is a newborn or sick or there has been a major change in the family.

Corrina - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Rebecca:

And there is a big difference between infants and toddlers. I never let me my newborn "cry it out" but am perfectly content to have used it when she started sleeping in her own room in her toddler bed.

I totally agree, my husband and I are currently co-sleeping with our son, but I know one day we might have to use this method to help our son sleep in his own room one day. That's why I find this posts on sleep so helpful, no matter what method is used.

Sophie - posted on 02/26/2009

I was told by my pediatrician 24 years ago to use the method you are speaking of, my daughter is now a well adjusted 25 year old doctoral student. She has a degree in Molecular and Cell Biology with a genetic minor is married and is happy. My son has just joined the army and is in boot camp. He will be attending Texas A&M like his sister when he finishes. My husband and his ex on the other had picked up their son with every wimper. My step-son is 18 a senior in high school and he falls apart with every little crisis or bump in his plans. He even cries when he gets disciplined - at 18! my husband told me he did not sleep through the night until he was close to 2 years old and he was surprised when our daughter slept through the night at  3 months. Meaning 11pm till her 5am feeding, she was breast fed. I think it made a difference that these children learned to calm themselves. Even now my step-son cannot calm himself and is over excitable.  But knowing this I still would not dream of criticizing anyone for their choices of parenting we each make mistakes along the way, no one is perfect and every child is different.

Rebecca - posted on 02/26/2009

And there is a big difference between infants and toddlers. I never let me my newborn "cry it out" but am perfectly content to have used it when she started sleeping in her own room in her toddler bed.

Rebecca - posted on 02/26/2009

I totally agree with you on this! I used the Ferber Method for a while and it's the only thing that worked for us. Otherwise, we'd just be awake all night long trying to get her to stay in bed and sleep. Don't worry - some of us do have your backs ;)

Corrina - posted on 02/26/2009

I think it's great that you're posting this, b/c you're setting the record straight on the cio method or at least how you chose to use it. There seems to be a lot of misinformation out there about it  and I'm grateful that you were brave enough to put your parenting beliefs and experience out there to help other parents. I have nothing but respect and admiration for you for finding a sleeping method that work well for you and your child.

Sara - posted on 02/26/2009

Thanks Deborah! You know, I just wonder why we can't have an open conversation about stuff like this without getting the people that come off as just looking for a fight. I really do want to have a discussion about sleeping, sleep training and other mom's experiences with things like this. But it seems like every time I make a suggestion on another mom's post, who's looking for help on how to put her child to sleep, about Ferber or any other method like it, people really go off on it and say that you should NEVER do it, etc. It makes me not want to share my experiences with others about stuff like that. Isn't motherhood tough enough?

Deborah - posted on 02/26/2009

I agee with you. I think that moms are not going to agree on everything. I think some are set firmly in their own beliefs, and that is fine. But there should be a line of respect that isn't crossed. Everyone is entitled to their own opions, you  don't have to agree with one mom's choice, infact it could be totaly against your beliefs.

But this place exists for a reason, to bring moms together, to gain advice sometimes even encouragement and make friends.

You can express your own opion, your entitled to it, but you must be mindful of others,have respect,think before you type.

I think that telling someone they are harming their child because you simply don't agree with their method of choice is going above and beyond giving your opion voice.

It is simply dissrespectful and uncalled for and should not happen. We are not here to belittle others or attack others or insinuate a mother's choice whatever it may be is abuse.

Were suppose to be role models for our children, were to lead by example.

I think it is sad that someone would tell Sara she is hurting her child.

Child abuse is a very serious issue that you don't just go around labling it on moms. And perhaps said people invisioned her as abandoning her child leaving to cry for ohurs on end, I don't think that's the case.

Cry it out, breast feed, forula feed, work, stay home, etc. these are all topics similar as politics they can get very heated, diverse opions and beliefs. Bottom line every member should respect fellow members and their right to choose what works for their child and their family.

No one is saying you must agree. But you should have respect. And be mindful of others feelings.

Jolene - posted on 02/26/2009

I completly agree with you. Of course they're are always going to be the people who go overboard on things. Crying it out doesn't meant you let them cry alone about everything. It has to be done properly. I never let my daughter cry over a certain amount of time and if I can tell shes actully getting upset and not just doing her fussy cry anymore, I go in and get her! I don't take her out of the room though so she knows it is still bedtime/naptime. I give her a drink of water and relax her then try again. Also, my parents used the cry it out method on me and I am defiantly not an insucure person with low self esteem. People just think cry it out means no matter whats wrong your just going to plop them in their crib and let them cry themselves to sleep...those people are the ones who are very misinformed.

Angel - posted on 02/26/2009

Ok I would just like to say that when my son is tired I lay him next to me (so def. not the CIO method), but I do this because that is what works best for me right now. I am slowly starting to transition him into falling asleep in his crib, and if he wants to cry for a few minutes when I first set him in there, it's because he is not used to it, and I stay at his crib side and tell him it's ok and what not. BUT THIS IS NOT THE REASON I AM COMMENTING ON THIS POST!!!

The reason I am commenting on this post is because of what I was told at the hospital when I had my son, before I was allowed to leave...

I was told there, that sometimes a baby just needs to cry, and the best thing you as a parent can do is to just put them in their crib and let them cry. NOW IF THAT IS NOT THE CRY IT OUT METHOD...PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS? I know there is a difference between this and what you are doing Sara. To all the people that have shown "research" that says this is horrible, have you bothered to look at the flip side of things? There are going to be people that come up with studies for and against EVERY issue. Think about that when critisizing another parent! Keep in my while reading this post, that I myself do not use the cry it out method or the ferber method right now.

I also would like to point out, I know that my cousin who is the mother of a 3 year old, did not use these methods either, and now to this day, has to fight with her son about bedtime. She will put him to bed and he will leave his bed and do whatever he wants for however long he wants. Is this the right way of doing things?

Sara - posted on 02/26/2009

You know, I do think that at least for me, I wanted to do Ferber because it was laying the groundwork for discipline later. I feel like that if I start out with expectations like going to sleep when it's bedtime and sleeping in your own bed, that will trickle into other things when she's older. I want my daughter to know that I'm in charge. That doesn't mean I want to be a dictator, I just don't want a child that doesn't think I'm serious when I say something. I want her to know that Mommy and Daddy are in charge and while her input is heard, we have the final word, end of discussion. I know kids aren't perfect, I know that no matter what you do they will act out, have tantrums, etc., but I have to admit that I want a well behaved child. From what I can tell by a lot of your posts, I am on the right track!

Brandi - posted on 02/26/2009

One thing that I'm not sure if I've even interpreted correctly but CIO doesn't mean that you let your child scream for hours, there is a difference in cries and we as mother's know what they are. If my child (or anyone elses child for that matter) is crying just to get attention and avoid going to sleep, then heck no I'm not going in there. It then puts my child in charge and not me. I really truly believe that the people that bash CIO or Ferber or any other method out there don't understand it and that's why they are so judgemental about it.



Do some research prior to being judgemental and maybe then you'd understand things better and wouldn't be so judgemental. As well as you'd then know if it's something that may or may not work for you and your child. We all have strong opinions of how we want to raise our children but maybe you'll find something else that works better for you if you open your ears a little and hear what others are trying to tell you.

Julie - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Cindy:

in fact ferber method is child abuse and is harming your child....

your child will grow up with low self esteem and feel abandoned most of the time....

I urge you to do some research into Jungs opinion on this matter....it is negligent and immoral....

 

sorry if the truth hurts...and it isnt too late to change your methods....

Actually, it is not child abuse. It is a difference in opinion that not all parents agree with. I'm sure that there are plenty of things that you have chosen to do with your children, that I would not agree with, and vice-versa. I used the ferber method with my children who are now 7 years old. They do not have low self esteem, and they have never felt abandoned. Like Sara said, it's not like you just throw your kid in bed and ignore them. So, so much for your negligence and immoral argument. I though people on here were supposed to be more opened minded, but you obviously aren't.

And to quote you, "Sorry if the truth hurts".

I couldn't agree more with you Sara- good for you!!

Brandi - posted on 02/26/2009

100% agreed, I do a modified version that works for us but I also would never say another parent is bad for doing it. It's ridiculous that people do and they should really think about what they are saying first. No one is a bad parent for doing it, we all find things that work for us and that's just the way it is.

Amy - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Mary:

can anyone explain to me why an infant so young should learn to "self-soothe"? Isnt that what God gave them parents for and why they are so dependent on us? and how do you know they are "self-soothing" and not just "coping" with the fact that you're not giving them what they need? i am totally serious, im not trying to offend. i wonder how people who believe in CIO make sense of it.

And are you going to be there with a bottle when your child is 25 years old and can't fall asleep???  It's an essential thing to learn, is our point!  No one is telling you to do this, we are just saying quit knocking us for doing it!!!  If the baby is full, not sick, and has a clean diaper, then they are just crying to be rocked to sleep which is ok for like 6 or so months, but then they can figure it out or you nor he/she won't get any sleep.   Quit attacking people for offering advice of their own methods!!!  EVERY CHILD IS DIFFERENT, NO ONE IS SAYING "DO IT MY WAY"  we are just offerring advice when asked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Megan - posted on 02/26/2009

Thank you for posting.  I obviously could not read all 121 posts so I apologize if I repeat anything.  I recently posted on ivillage (on a board with moms with 1 yr olds) about CIO (crying it out) after I had read some posts from moms who were at their wits end and were thinking of "resorting" to CIO.  I told them my story, said it was not for everyone and to please ignore me if you don't think it would work for you.  I still got reamed out.  I am sure there are many people who have been succesful with other methods but there are some, with a one year old that are still getting up in the night.  I refused to do that.  Being tired made me a bad mother, I think far worse that letting my daughter CIO.

Second, I couldn't do Furber.  I always felt that when I went in, my daughter would start crying harder.  It broke my heart.  I decide on Weissbluth's method and just let her CIO (Healthy Sleep Habits Happy Child). In Weissbluth's book he mentions (and scientifically backs up) how bad sleep habits can effect you for the rest of your life leading to ADD, Depression, Insomnia, etc.  He also mentions that babies need anywhere from 14-17 hours of sleep a day.  So much cognitive learning happens during their sleep and teaching good sleep habits are so important for that development.  I can't imagine tha the brain damage that someone mentioned early is any worse than some of the things that can happen when you don't get enough sleep at an early age.  My daughter is now a great sleeper, almost never wakes up in the night and if she does she can get herself back to sleep.  Sometimes I even put her in her crib and she stays awake babbling to herself for a half hour.  If I had stayed with her until she fell asleep I would think that she would never be able to be by herself in her crib which I think is good for her.  She is obviously amusing herself somehow  - it's hysterical to hear her on the moniter.

Now I have some pretty strong opinions about other parenting techniques like co sleeping stuff like that.  But a parenting techinique is a choice and I do my very best not to judge.  And I certainly don't reprimand someone about the dangers of their chosen parenting techiniques.  There are going to be dangers in every techinique in addition to the great love and support that we give our children.  No one technique is better than the other -I think it's how we chose to use them.  Thank you Sara for starting this discussion.

Amy - posted on 02/26/2009

I let my kids cry it out and now nighttime is much better, and my kids are just great! I also have recommended it on this site and have seen the moms quotes freaking out about it too and just laugh. The crying to sleep method works for some kids, and it saves the parents their sanity (crabby parents and babys are a bad mix) It is also recommended by pediatricians and many baby books....why would they give that advice if it was harmful? because it's not. I totally agreee with sara...

Kelly - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Laurie:

I've also read that the Ferber method is not recommended anymore; other doctors have said it is harmful to the infant. That said, I also didn't always immediately respond to their crys. I don't think it hurts them if you can't get to them instantly, but at the same time I think there needs to be balance. I think the key is balance. I read once of a mother who let her infant cry it out, and the next morning she found her dead; and this was a doctor! I don't think it is ever good to ignore your babies crys. If you can't get there instantly that's another thing, but if a baby is crying it's because he/she needs something, and we as the parents need to find out what that is that they need and meet that need.

I think many people are over looking some vital points that other moms are making.  NOONE  is saying that we should leave a child to cry indefinately,  you should always check to ensure that they are safe and ok. Reassuring them and then leaving them to cry for 2 or 5 minutes while you stand on the other side of the door or just out of site IS NOT the same as leaving them to cry until they pass out from exhaustion. And I don't think Anyone is saying that this is a method to use on a newborn.  I let my son cry, then check him and let him know its ok but he has to go to sleep. I have stood inside the door to his room for an hour checking and reassuring him every 5 minutes or so specifically so he knew I was there and so I knew he was ok. He's 3 when he cries its mixed with screams of " I wanna go play some more" am I suppose to let him rule the roost just so that he doesn't cry? Don't think so. Yes I stay till he's settled but unless he's had a really busy day and falls asleep right away I don't wait for him to sleep, just till he's comfortable.  When he cries its cuz he's mad about not getting his own way. Trust me if he had so much as a tiny fever I would know it cus I DO check him, I just don't let him be the boss. Actually even though I do this I am an attached parent, once he's asleep I check him every hour or so, is he covered, did he drop his teddy, is he too hot, etc. Until I go to bed, and then if I get up in the night for water I check him again to make me feel better. So now tell me that because I let him cry for a while at bedtime I am neglecting him or harming him in some way.

Tamara - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Sara:

I just want to throw in here that I was a breastfed baby.  It was the 70's, and my mom did cosleeping, I fed when I wanted to and i suffered as a child from severe tooth decay caused by (according to the doctor's) milk in my mouth.  I think it's safe to say that all milk has sugar in it, and if left in a child's mouth will cause tooth decay.  At 18 months I had all my baby teeth capped because I basically had no enamel.  My adult teeth have been fine, but I just wanted to relay my own personal experience.  And I was also breastfed until I was 4.  I admit it is a little embarrassing to say, mostly because of people's reactions to it.  But, there's nothing wrong with breastfeeding your baby as long as you see fit or is convenient for you.  I still have memories of breastfeeding! 

I don't deny that some kids have dental issues sooner than others due to weak enameal(sp?), it's just been shown that breastfeeding not only does not cause dental caries but actually have a preventative effect.  Don't feel bad or embarrassed for remembering the joys of nursing.  Your mom did a great job nursing you for so long!

Laurie - posted on 02/26/2009

I've also read that the Ferber method is not recommended anymore; other doctors have said it is harmful to the infant. That said, I also didn't always immediately respond to their crys. I don't think it hurts them if you can't get to them instantly, but at the same time I think there needs to be balance. I think the key is balance. I read once of a mother who let her infant cry it out, and the next morning she found her dead; and this was a doctor! I don't think it is ever good to ignore your babies crys. If you can't get there instantly that's another thing, but if a baby is crying it's because he/she needs something, and we as the parents need to find out what that is that they need and meet that need.

Michele - posted on 02/26/2009

I just came on here to have a read of other mommys opinions and am quite upset that people are so judgemental. I have a 5 1/2 month old son who has been sleeping through the night since he was 2 months old. I let him CIO and now he knows that when I put him down its sleep time. He is happier for it. Now he gets a good night sleep as do I. He loves me and never acts like i have hurt him or abused him. My god. we are talking about letting him cry for 10 mins not hours on end.



I am so sick of reading from mothers that say 'this' whatever it may be) is the only way to raise your child. Its beyond absurd to assume that every child should be given the same treatment whether it works or not. I was also only able to breastfeed my son for a month. does that make me a bad parent as well?



I was allowed to CIO and I am a stable, well adjusted person who knows that my parents are, to this day, still there for me. I want my child to grow up knowing that I am always there for him but he is going to have to do things on his own and he will make mistakes. That is life. He will know early on that you can't always get everything you want but his mothers love will never go away.



BTW my son just stirred from his nap and even though he is sick with a cold put his soother back in his own mouth and went back to sleep. Must be a sign of trauma or maybe he feels i wont be there for him so he has to do it himself.... ;) lol .

Toni - posted on 02/26/2009

When I had my baby  (she's 6 and a half now) I loved bringing her into my bed to nurse her but I was so worried about sleeping with her. I've heard several stories, one recently where the father rolled over and smothered his own child. From what I read in parenting books it was considered quite dangerous, especially if you smoked or drank alcohol, but even if not I don't think it's a wise thing to do. I know I wouldn't be able to sleep as soundly and get the proper REM sleep that we need to keep us healthy, if I had a baby in bed with me.

It was my mum that put me on the right path for teaching my baby to put herself to sleep. I'm not the type of parent who believes in a very strict regimen or routine, I fed on demand and put her to sleep around the same time every day, but it wasn't set in stone. I listened to my baby and recognised the signs for hunger, for a nappy change or for tiredness. It's thanks to my mum who one day after she had been changed, fed and winded (baby, not mum...lol), took her from me and just laid her down in her crib. My daughter was about 4 wks old. She just lay there looking up at us. I switched on her monitor, closed the curtains and the door and went into the living room. I could hear her gurgling for a little while and then silence. I checked on her and she was fast asleep. It was great. The urge to always let her sleep on me was always there, but I knew I was giving my daughter a gift and teaching her well. she didn't need me to sleep, she slept fine on her own. It was me that wanted her with me in my arms....not the other way around.

After that my daughter always slept on her own either in her crib, her 'bounce chair', high chair, pushchair or car seat. The only times she ever slept in my arms was on a plane or when she was struggling and in pain during teething.

I think if parents use an AP method not only are they making a rod for their own backs but they are not doing their children any favours. I think the earlier a baby is taught to sleep on it's own the better and less traumatic it is....for the parent. It is a lesson that must be learnt for all children and taught by all parents and by leaving it till a child is older, is teaching them wrong. It confuses them and this is where the crying comes in. Not that there's any harm in letting them cry (not screaming), but if it's done early enough there probably won't be any crying at all, other than the grizzling noises that babies make when they settle themselves.

Kim - posted on 02/26/2009

I wish Ferber's method worked for me.  I tried it for about a week and it does not work if your child is not crying.  My son would just stand and beat the edge of his crib with a smile on his face.  I realized I had to find a different method when he continually missed his naps.  I'm doing the no cry sleep solution now, but it seems that I have to help him fall asleep more now than before I started the method.  But then again, this could be due to the fact that my son is 8 months old and is experiencing separation anxiety.  I'm in favor of any method that gets your child the sleep he needs.

Sara - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Tamara:

Quoting Jo Anna:

I am not criticizing, but from a medical stand poing, it is not good to nurse your child to sleep either.  When your child has teeth, the milk can cause your childs teeth to rot.  This method, comforting as it is, also causes your child to depend on you during scary times like bedtime.  What are you going to do when your child is 3?  Will you still be nursing, what will you do when your child cries because she depends on you and comfort to go to bed?  Will you crawl into bed with your child until she falls asleep?  And, if so will you continue to do this when your child is 8 and has a friend over for a sleep over?  Just questions, I like to know what methods others are using....

Actually nursing is not linked to tooth decay.  What you're thinking of is "bottle mouth" where the child is sleeping with a bottle and the liquid pools in the mouth as opposed to breastfeeding where it slides down the throat quite easily.  http://www.kellymom.com/bf/older-baby/to...

 

If my daughter is still nursing at 3 than so be it.  I seriously doubt she will nurse until 8.  It's a very rare thing for that to happen.  The average weaning age world wide is approximately 4 years old  http://www.kathydettwyler.org/detwean.ht... I have no problem comforting my child when she cries.  It's my job as her mother to do so.  I do, in fact, share a bed with my daughter and my husband.  She sleeps snuggled right between us.

 

She does depend on me to transition her to bedtime but that's ok.  She's only 17 months old.  When she's old enough to transition to bedtime on her own, she will.  Why rush the growing up process?  They're only little once.

I just want to throw in here that I was a breastfed baby.  It was the 70's, and my mom did cosleeping, I fed when I wanted to and i suffered as a child from severe tooth decay caused by (according to the doctor's) milk in my mouth.  I think it's safe to say that all milk has sugar in it, and if left in a child's mouth will cause tooth decay.  At 18 months I had all my baby teeth capped because I basically had no enamel.  My adult teeth have been fine, but I just wanted to relay my own personal experience.  And I was also breastfed until I was 4.  I admit it is a little embarrassing to say, mostly because of people's reactions to it.  But, there's nothing wrong with breastfeeding your baby as long as you see fit or is convenient for you.  I still have memories of breastfeeding! 

Schmoopy - posted on 02/26/2009

I totally agree - we all love our children. Including those of us who choose the Ferber Method! I employed the Ferber Method with amazing success. I chose CIO b/c it was a last resort. I had tried EVERYTHING else.



I think a lot of parents miss an important consideration about CIO....

My DD was unable to put herself to sleep or stay asleep without being held all the time. So she was chronically sleep deprived! Sleep is an integral part of healthy development. It's as important as food and love. So CIO can play an important role in helping your child grow and thrive.

Melissa - posted on 02/26/2009

i also dont belive in that method i always cuddled and loved holding my babies who cares what anyone says they are only little once love them as much as you can

Melissa - posted on 02/26/2009

i also dont belive in that method i always cuddled and loved holding my babies who cares what anyone says they are only little once love them as much as you can

Rhonda - posted on 02/26/2009

Hello, I am an older mom.  Have had five children and have used different methods with each child for bedtime.  I prefer letting them cry it out.  They are more independant and better able to explore their world when they are taught to self-sooth.

I have one that was joined at my hip and wouldn't even stay with dad because I nursed him to sleep every night.  He is still clingy.  Don't listen to the people who would cut you down.  You are the mom.  Your child knows that you are there, and with plenty of attention and love during the day, crying it out at night will do no harm.

Silvia - posted on 02/26/2009

Ferber and 'crying it out' are not equivalent. Ferber didn't 'revise' his theory. He wrote a book basically defending himself against people who hadn't read the first one. Two premises: The child has to be old enough AND you don't just put them down and never walk back in...you come back and reassure. As far as research is concerned, you'll find that people will use Ferber and crying it out interchangeably. It is not true and unfair.

Mary - posted on 02/26/2009

While I don't agree with the cry it out method I wouldn't judge someone who used it.  I just can't stand to hear my son cry and cry and cry....it makes me feel like a bad mother. (iam not saying you are a bad mother!)  When Jayden wakes in the night and cries out I wait a couple of min cause usualy he just winges a bit and then is out like a light again but if he keeps going I go in and rub his back and give him his soother and he calms down again.  He is never hungy he just wants to know I am there.  If he gets really bad yes I do pick him up and cuddle him and maybe rock him a little.  some people think I am setting him up for bad habits but I am not going to listen to my son scream and cry like he is scared to death or let him gag and choke like he does when he get soooo upseat. 

I do what works for me and Jayden and you should do what works for you are your little one.

Michelle - posted on 02/26/2009

Hi Sara,

I am so glad someone posted this comment, I have to agree 100%.  Not all children are born knowing how to sleep and it is training, with correct reassurance and nurturing, it is a highly effective method of sleep training.  My son is turning 3, he is very well rounded and an absolute joy when it comes to bedtime because he knows that sleeping time makes up part of his normal daily routine, both naps and proper bedtime.   

I belive self soothing is a very important part of growing up and this method if done correctly teaches them that, it also will teach your child that there are times when mommy is not going to be around to soothe them, especially in a creche senario where I am sure they will not get the same attention as you would give them, I also belive that it plays a huge postive role not only in sleep and self soothing but later on in seperation anxiety.   

Silvia - posted on 02/26/2009

I understand difference of opinion, but the research that has been done on 'crying it out' has been done on just that 'crying it out' rather than on Ferber. Most people who have these opinions have never read Ferber. There is really a lot less crying than most people imagine. It is a very good thing to teach a baby to sleep on its own. Can you imagine being tired and not being able to fall asleep unless someone else did something for you to do so? In my (professional as well as personal...I'm a developmental psychologist), teaching them that independence is loving if it is done methodically at the appropriate age. Ferber even states that it is not to be done for tiny ones...

Jena - posted on 02/26/2009

Quoting Sara:

Quoting Cindy:

Here are some evidence based facts from proffesionals...seeing as that is what you are basing your opinion on.....and one for all of you to consider...

one from Ferber himself....

 

By: Dr. Stephen Juan

Research suggests that allowing a baby to "cry it out" can cause brain damage. Some experts warn that allowing a baby to "cry it out" causes extreme distress to the baby. And such extreme distress in a newborn has been found to block the full development of certain areas of the brain and causes the brain to produce extra amounts of cortisol, which can be harmful.

According to a University of Pittsburgh study by Dr. M. DeBellis and seven colleagues, published in Biological Psychiatry in 2004, children who suffer early trauma generally develop smaller brains.

A Harvard University study by Dr. M. Teicher and five colleagues, also published in Biological
Psychiatry, claims that the brain areas affected by severe distress are the limbic system, the left
hemisphere, and the corpus callosum. Additional areas that may be involved are the hippocampus and the orbitofrontal cortex.

The Science of Parenting by Dr. Margot Sunderland (Dorling Kindersley, 2006) points out some of the brain damaging effects that can occur if parents fail to properly nurture a baby -- and that means not allowing them to "cry it out."

In the first parenting book to link parent behaviour with infant brain development, Dr. Sunderland
describes how the infant brain is still being "sculpted" after birth. Parents have a major role in
this brain "sculpting" process.

Dr. Sunderland argues that it is crucial that parents meet the reasonable emotional needs of the
infant. This is helped along by providing a continuously emotionally nurturant environment for the
infant.

 

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Dr. Ferber Revisits His 'Crying Baby' Theory

by Allan Coukell

, May 30, 2006 · Dr. Richard Ferber is best known for his advice to parents about children and sleep. He advised that letting babies cry themselves to sleep could be a necessary step in getting young children to sleep in their own beds. But now Ferber is out with a new book reexamining his original theory. Allan Coukell of member station WBUR reports.

 

 

What's new in the revised version of the book?

When the 2006 edition of Solve Your Child's Sleep Problems came out, it was rumored that Ferber had reversed his earlier approach, but that simply isn't true. The new book reiterates a lot of what Ferber wrote in the earlier volume, with some important clarifications and additions:

• Cry it out. In the preface of the new book, Ferber takes pains to clarify his position: "Simply leaving a child in a crib to cry for long periods alone until he falls sleep, no matter how long it takes, is not an approach I approve of. On the contrary, many of the approaches I recommend are designed specifically to avoid unnecessary crying." Ferber's "progressive waiting" technique encourages parents to frequently comfort their child during the sleep training process.

Thank you Sara!!! I was just about to get my book out and type this. For everyone reading this: this an EXACT EXCERPT FROM DR. FERBER'S BOOK.

Cindy, you obviously have not read the book and do not know what you are talking about. I agree with you in believing that CIO is harmful to a child, but that IS NOT WHAT DR. FERBER BELIEVES IN DOING. PLEASE CHECK YOUR FACTS BY READING HIS BOOK BEFORE YOU SAY BLASPHEMOUS THINGS ABOUT HIM.

Danielle - posted on 02/26/2009

A little bit of loung exercise won't hurt anyone.    

Silvia - posted on 02/26/2009

Ferber ROCKS! People who haven't read the book, don't know that the method isn't 'leave your kid 'till he falls asleep from crying exhaustion.' Even the poor doc says that he thinks letting them cry without end is mean! It took a total of 1 night for my daugther at 11 months and 2 nights for my son at 6!

Kyla - posted on 02/26/2009

I so agree with u, we had this chat on babygaga awhile back and ppl were bashing me that it wasn't right and it causes brain damage, I tryed to expain that its ok for 10/15 mins and they are tryed to tell me it was a form of child abuse...blah blah.....



p.s,,,, I think u have explained better then i did thou..lol

Marie - posted on 02/26/2009

I have to say I have used the cry it out method with both my children and they are both happy content and well balanced children. If you ask my almost 8 year old if he feels abandoned he laughs and says "your always there mum". Harmed my children....I think not!!!!

Although I do respect every parent has to do what works for them and others in their family.

Kristen - posted on 02/26/2009

I disagree, I believe Cindy has some serious issues. Anyone who would go as far as she did to say to a complete stranger that because they chose the cry it out method they are being negligent and immoral, has some serious personal issues they need to deal with inside themselves. How dare she say we are harming our child. I have yet to read that someone is leaving their child to cry for long periods of time. Also if they are doing studies of children who were raised on the cry it out method and they are having problems when they are older, there is much more to the story than just that. My daughter will never feel abandoned, if anything she may get sick of us giving her hugs and kisses and telling her we love her too much. My daughter has a strut and she is 18 months, the girl has confidence, to say the least. What she won't be is an overly sensitive, overly dependent child, and I'm not going to have a 30 year old child living at home sucking off the government tit because she is to afraid to leave my side. People don't give their children much credit these days, they can handle a little cry, especially when the end result is many nights of restful sleep and the courage and confidence to do things with out mommy holding their hand every step of the way. Don't be selfish, let your child grow, don't hold them back. By the way, this message is not meant for everyone that didn't use the cry it out method, I'm sorry if it offends you, it is only intended for those who insist on pushing their ridiculous views on this method. Thank you, and good night.