Tylenol Toxicity

Kate - posted on 07/02/2009

Oh, I know it's true. People don't know, and sadly, don't WANT to know. I can't tell you how many hundreds of hours I have spent doing research and reading studies myself, to come to that conclusion.

But I thought I'd put it out there because maybe someone who's never thought about it will see it and ask why, and a dialogue could begin. It's a hot topic right now, and a very important one. Much more so than people realize.

Guggie - posted on 07/02/2009

Quoting Kate:

Quoting Guggie:

 

Even motrin is better.

 

Although not much.  It can still cause liver damage.

Medications do not outweigh the risks.  In my opinion, almost ever.  Vaccinations NEVER outweigh the risk.  All medications and vaccinations should be avoided.

There are natural remedies and other things you can do, of course, but that's a very long discussion.

Yes, but I would hazard to say that the majority of people would be very uncomfortable with this statement because they have not researched the relevant science enough to see this.

For example, I was just talking to someone who is terrified of Tetanus and wants to get the DTaP just for that reason. She is terrified because she has never read the CDC stats (30 cases of tetanus last year, 5 deadly, I think 4 cases were children). She doesn't know that Tetanus becomes deadly because elderly farmers refuse to get treatment. She doesn't know that vaccinated people get Tetanus almost as frequently as vaccine free people. She doesn't know that the immunoglobulin is going to be faster and more effective than the vaccine. She doesn't know that the FDA and CDC admit that the DTaP is incriminated in encephalitis, gullain barre, asthma, anaphylactic shock, death etc.

There is such a deficiency in knowledge that it is impossible to get through. Where would you begin? It might take 10 good hours of research to pour through the medical studies I just condensed in the paragraph above, and that's assuming a willingness to find and pay for the studies, and an ability to breakdown raw statistical data and use anatomical and medical concepts to apply conclusions to a population number.

Kate - posted on 07/02/2009

Quoting Guggie:

 

Even motrin is better.

 

Although not much.  It can still cause liver damage.

Medications do not outweigh the risks.  In my opinion, almost ever.  Vaccinations NEVER outweigh the risk.  All medications and vaccinations should be avoided.

There are natural remedies and other things you can do, of course, but that's a very long discussion.

Guggie - posted on 07/02/2009

Quoting Sarah:

Quoting Kate:
As of today, Vicodan and Percocet were pulled from the market. And not because they're narcotics -- because they contain Tylenol.

My understanding was that the same committee recommended pulling the products or putting a "black box" label on them, but that they have not been removed from the market as of this time.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/30/ace...

While I understand concerns about medications, I think it's important to keep much of this in perspective.  All medications are essentially poisons that have what we consider to have basically beneficial side effects.  When anyone overdoses something, obviously we are going to see more negative effects than positives.  And it's not unreasonable to expect that some people will react badly to even normal dosages for whatever reason.  It is unfortunate, but that's just part of the deal.  There is nothing...no med, no vaccine, no surgery, no treatment...that we can guarantee will be safe for everybody.  Also, there are always going to be people who don't follow direction and many overdoses result from that.  There's just not much we can do about people who don't want to listen. (And in looking at the reasoning presented, at least by the media, for the recommendation, it seems like a lot of their concern is for people not reading labels or following directions about not taking certain meds together.)  It seems pretty ridiculous to limit access or remove something from the market that has benefits just because some people don't have good sense.

That said, I fully support continued research and changing recommendations and dosages and instructions as necessary.  I just think that often when we see things like this on TV or read about it online, it's easy to panic and get carried away. Even with scientific studies, it is often very hard to establish clear cause and effect. There are so many variables that play into the situation, some of which we do not even really understand yet.  Absolutely read and research, but remember keep it in perspective as well.

Here's my perspective:

1. There is no scientific basis to administer tylenol before or after vaccinating.

2. I have yet to hear from a parent that their doctor recommended NOT administering tylenol.

Even motrin is better.

Sarah - posted on 07/01/2009

Quoting Kate:
As of today, Vicodan and Percocet were pulled from the market. And not because they're narcotics -- because they contain Tylenol.

My understanding was that the same committee recommended pulling the products or putting a "black box" label on them, but that they have not been removed from the market as of this time.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/30/ace...

While I understand concerns about medications, I think it's important to keep much of this in perspective.  All medications are essentially poisons that have what we consider to have basically beneficial side effects.  When anyone overdoses something, obviously we are going to see more negative effects than positives.  And it's not unreasonable to expect that some people will react badly to even normal dosages for whatever reason.  It is unfortunate, but that's just part of the deal.  There is nothing...no med, no vaccine, no surgery, no treatment...that we can guarantee will be safe for everybody.  Also, there are always going to be people who don't follow direction and many overdoses result from that.  There's just not much we can do about people who don't want to listen. (And in looking at the reasoning presented, at least by the media, for the recommendation, it seems like a lot of their concern is for people not reading labels or following directions about not taking certain meds together.)  It seems pretty ridiculous to limit access or remove something from the market that has benefits just because some people don't have good sense.

That said, I fully support continued research and changing recommendations and dosages and instructions as necessary.  I just think that often when we see things like this on TV or read about it online, it's easy to panic and get carried away. Even with scientific studies, it is often very hard to establish clear cause and effect. There are so many variables that play into the situation, some of which we do not even really understand yet.  Absolutely read and research, but remember keep it in perspective as well.

Kate - posted on 07/01/2009

Guggie, you are right. Tylenol impairs the liver, which impairs the body's ability to clear itself of toxins. Pair that with vaccines and you have a very dangerous combination.

As of today, Vicodan and Percocet were pulled from the market. And not because they're narcotics -- because they contain Tylenol.

Kate - posted on 07/01/2009

Guggie, you are right. Tylenol impairs the liver, which impairs the body's ability to clear itself of toxins. Pair that with vaccines and you have a very dangerous combination.

As of today, Vicodan and Percocet were pulled from the market. And not because they're narcotics -- because they contain Tylenol.

Guggie - posted on 07/01/2009

Many of the medications that are given to women after birth contain acetaminophen (Tylox, Darvocet, Lorcet, Lortab, etc).

Another thing that I discovered is that the practice of administering Tylenol before vaccinations is not supported by scientific evidence.

I've also found evidence that Tylenol causes mitochondrial damage:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18626...

“Since the first mitochondrial dysfunction was described in the 1960s, the medicine has advanced in its understanding the role mitochondria play in health and disease. Damage to mitochondria is now understood to play a role in the pathogenesis of a wide range of seemingly unrelated disorders such as schizophrenia, bipolar disease, dementia, Alzheimer's disease, epilepsy, migraine headaches, strokes, neuropathic pain, Parkinson's disease, ataxia, transient ischemic attack, cardiomyopathy, coronary artery disease, chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia, retinitis pigmentosa, diabetes, hepatitis C, and primary biliary cirrhosis. Medications have now emerged as a major cause of mitochondrial damage, which may explain many adverse effects. All classes of psychotropic drugs have been documented to damage mitochondria, as have stain medications, analgesics such as acetaminophen, and many others. While targeted nutrient therapies using antioxidants or their precursors (e. g., N-acetylcysteine) hold promise for improving mitochondrial function, there are large gaps in our knowledge. The most rational approach is to understand the mechanisms underlying mitochondrial damage for specific medications and attempt to counteract their deleterious effects with nutritional therapies. This article reviews our basic understanding of how mitochondria function and how medications damage mitochondria to create their occasionally fatal adverse effects.”

Even the AAP begrudgingly admits they might have been wrong about food dyes wrt to behavior problems... http://www.feingold.org/Research/PDFstud...

...A recent metaanalysis
of 15 trials concludes that there is “accumulating evidence
that neurobehavioral toxicity may characterize a variety of widely
distributed chemicals.” Some children may be more sensitive to
the effects of these chemicals, and the authors suggest there is a
need to better identify responders. In real life, practitioners faced
with hyperactive preschoolers have a reasonable option to offer
parents. For the child without a medical, emotional, or environmental
etiology of ADHD behaviors, a trial of a preservative-free,
food coloring–free diet is a reasonable intervention.

Although quite complicated, this was a carefully conducted
study in which the investigators went to great lengths to eliminate
bias and to rigorously measure outcomes. The results are
hard to follow and somewhat inconsistent. For many of the
assessments there were small but statistically significant differences
of measured behaviors in children who consumed the
food additives compared with those who did not. In each case
increased hyperactive behaviors were associated with consuming
the additives. For those comparisons in which no statistically
significant differences were found, there was a trend for more
hyperactive behaviors associated with the food additive drink
in virtually every assessment. Thus, the overall findings of the
study are clear and require that even we skeptics, who have long
doubted parental claims of the effects of various foods on the
behavior of their children, admit we might have been wrong."

Here is an article that I found awhile back that may help explain how Tylenol could possibly be associated with autism/mitochondrial disease. Keep in mind the glutathione depleting properties of Tylenol...

http://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/6...

Researchers may have discovered a new way to monitor mitochondrial diseases, a spectrum of disorders caused by genetic errors in mitochondria, the fuel-burning factories within cells that produce energy necessary for life. A new study reveals that people with these diseases may be deficient in glutathione, a toxin-fighting molecule made by the body that helps repair damage wrought by wayward mitochondria.

"We found very clearly that the glutathione levels were low in our mitochondrial disease patients," says Gregory Enns, a pediatrician and geneticist at Stanford University in Palo Alto, Calif. and coauthor of the study published this week in the online edition of the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. By measuring blood levels of glutathione, researchers may be able to assess the severity of a patient's disease and gauge how well therapies are working, Enns notes.

Mitochondrial diseases stem from gene defects in the cells' mitochondria, which convert energy from food into energy the body can use. These genetic errors lead to the production of dysfunctional proteins that spew toxins into the cells. "It's a little bit like a car engine; if it doesn't work well, it produces smoke," Enns says. In mitochondrial diseases, that "smoke" consists of free radicals—unstable molecules such as hydrogen peroxide that damage the cell's DNA, proteins, and lipids (fats), preventing them from functioning properly and causing them to die prematurely.

Scientists have identified over three dozen types of mitochondrial diseases, and the symptoms vary widely depending on which organ or organs, such as the heart, brain and liver, are affected. Newborns with the diseases can suffer seizures and lethal organ failure in the first few days of life, while other patients manage to make it into their 40s and even 50s before experiencing more benign symptoms such as weakness and inability to do physical activity. The severity of these disorders vary immensely, making it difficult to generalize how many years are knocked off the average patient's lifespan, Enns notes. Among the most famous cases of mitochondrial disease: nine-year-old Hannah Poling, whose mitochondrial disorder caused autism-like symptoms that were exacerbated by routine childhood vaccinations.

Mitochondrial diseases affect about one in every 8,500 adults in the U.S. (0.1 percent of the population), and doctors often treat them with cocktails of antioxidants including vitamin C and vitamin E that are believed to combat free radical damage caused by the disease, according to Enns. One key problem, he notes, is that doctors don't really understand how these antioxidants work -- or how effective they are in staving off symptoms in the long run.

In their study, Enns and his colleagues compared blood samples taken from 20 patients with mitochondrial disease ages two to 36 with those of 20 healthy patients ages 25 to 47. Levels of glutathione, a molecule the body makes to combat free radical damage, in the white blood cells of the diseased patients were 20 to 25 percent lower than those in the healthy crew, indicating that the body's ability to fight free radical damage was compromised, according to first author Kondala Atkuri, a biochemist at Stanford.

This study suggests that glutathione blood levels might serve as a good indicator of how large a toll these diseases are taking on the body, which could come in handy in drug trials, Enns says. "Before we can give drugs to patients in a clinical trial," he says, "we need to establish the biomarkers [such as glutathione] to see if treatments are working."

I've also learned that autism rates are much higher in those with Down Syndrome. Possibly because they are already deficient in glutathione due to their genetic makeup.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19067...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17410...

http://www.gotdownsyndrome.net/glutathio...

Guggie - posted on 07/01/2009

Tylenol depletes Glutathione levels. Gultathione is important to the immune system.
http://www.thorne.com/media/glutathione....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_benz...

"...Professor Peter Piper of the University of Sheffield claims that sodium benzoate by itself can damage and inactivate vital parts of DNA in a cell's mitochondria. Mitochondria consume oxygen to generate ATP, the body's energy currency. If they are damaged due to disease, the cell malfunctions and may enter apoptosis. There are many illnesses now tied to DNA damage, including Parkinson's and other neurodegenerative diseases, but above all, the aging process in general.[9][10][11][12][13]"


I then thought immediately about Hannah Poling, the little girl who was developed autism from vaccines, so says the federal government. However, it is believed that she had an "underlying mitochondrial disorder" which pre-disposed her to developing autism from the shots. (If you google Hannah Poling and mitochodrial disorder, you'll come up with tons of stuff.)

So I wonder if by giving tylenol before vaccines, we are interfering with our children's mitochodrial function, thus predisposing them to autism.

http://www.newtreatments.org/Sulfur/ga/2...

Dr. Rosemary Waring's research shows that the lack of sulfate is the
primary problem in 73% of these children (another study found low
levels in 92%), but all of those Waring checked had a low PST level
too. Similar sulfate deficiencies have been reported in people with
migraine, rheumatoid arthritis, jaundice, and other allergic
conditions all of which are anecdotally reported as common in the
families of people with autism. Adequate sulfoxidation requires
adequate supplies of B-vitamins, especially vitamin B6. The PST
enzymes are inhibited or overloaded by chocolate, bananas, orange
juice, vanillin, and food colorants such as tartrazine. Removal of
these from the diet and supplementation of sulfates may well relieve
all these symptoms. The lack of sulfation could well be due to the
largely carbohydrate diet of most of these children. It is likely a
combination of all these things. In any case, toxic compounds of
these aforementioned chemicals can build to dangerous levels. A high
value for the tIAG (?) as well as a high reading for DHPPA (rather
HPHPA-a phenolic metabolite of tyrosine) both indicate a PST problem.


I read with horror this paragraph:

"Since sulfur intake is low, and its oxidation is slow in many
autistic children, sulfate is low, and PST activity is slower than it
would be otherwise. It would seem that this sub optimality of
sulphotransferase activity is a function of low plasma sulfate levels
rather than of deficits in the actual enzyme. Cellular level
enzymatic effects of mercury's binding with proteins include blockage
of sulfur oxidation processes and of the neurotransmitter amino
acids. These have been found to be significant factors in many
autistics. Thus, mercury, and any foodstuff that requires or uses up
sulfate ions during its metabolism, will make the situation worse.
These foodstuffs include foods that supply neurotransmitters, like
bananas (serotonin), chocolate (phenylethylamine), and cheese
(tyramine), apple juice (and one mother reports her child drank a
quart a day!), citrus fruit juices, and paracetamol (Tylenol™). For
instance, one or two minutes after a dose of Tylenol™, the entire
supply of sulfate in the liver is gone!"

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19210...

“A growing number of studies show that regular use of acetaminophen (paracetamol) carries a dose-dependent risk of developing allergies in general and asthma in particular and of worsening other respiratory diseases and lung function. The most disturbing finding has come from the population-based Avon Longitudinal Study of Parents and Children, in which use of paracetamol-but not aspirin-in late pregnancy was positively associated with asthma when comparing children whose mothers took paracetamol "sometimes" and "most days/daily" with those whose mothers never took it. Assuming a causal relationship, the percentage of asthma attributable to paracetamol use in late pregnancy was 7%. In this review, we present data from the most important studies published since 2000. Although the pathophysiology remains unclear, the available data justify a warning to the general public that the uncritical use of over-the-counter acetaminophen can lead to the development of allergies and asthma, even in utero.”

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15706...

“The prevalence of asthma has increased worldwide. The reasons for this rise remain unclear. Various studies have reported an association between acetaminophen, a widely used analgesic, and diagnosed asthma. In a prospective cohort study, the rate of newly diagnosed asthma was 63% higher among frequent acetaminophen users than nonusers in multivariate analyses. Studies of patients with asthma suggest that acetaminophen challenge can precipitate a decline in FEV(1) > 15% among sensitive individuals. This article reviews the existing literature and evaluates the epidemiologic and pathophysiologic evidence underlying a possible link between acetaminophen and asthma.”

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12911...

“INTRODUCTION: A link between regular paracetamol intake and asthma in adults has recently been postulated. Detoxification of paracetamol may deplete stores of glutathione, which is one of the major antioxidants present in the lung. A reduced source of glutathione in the lung may lead to increased oxidative damage to the epithelium and hence increased frequency and severity of asthma attacks in susceptible individuals. AIM OF STUDY: This study aimed to determine whether regular intake of maximum therapeutic doses of paracetamol reduced serum antioxidant capacity in healthy volunteers. METHODS: Fifteen young healthy volunteers (nine men, six women, mean age 21.3 years, range 19-32) took maximum therapeutic doses of paracetamol (1 g four times a day) for 14 days. On days 0 and 14 blood samples were taken at baseline and hourly for a period of 4 h following ingestion of 1 g paracetamol. Single venous blood samples were collected 1 h after ingestion of 1 g paracetamol on days 4, 7 and 10. Blood samples were analysed for serum paracetamol concentration and total antioxidant capacity. RESULTS: Mean total antioxidant capacity was significantly reduced over the 3-h post-dosing on both days 0 and 14 (P < 0.01). The results from days 4, 7 and 10 showed a trend towards reduced antioxidant activity over time. On day 14 values were consistently lower compared with the corresponding times on day 0 (P < 0.01 at 0, 1, 3 and 4 h, P < 0.05 at 2 h). CONCLUSIONS: Chronic ingestion of maximum therapeutic doses of paracetamol depletes serum antioxidant capacity in healthy volunteers in as few as 14 days, possibly by a reduction in glutathione. This may have implications for analgesic use in asthmatic individuals. Further studies are now required to assess the impact of paracetamol on antioxidant defences in the lung.”

Tylenol is known to deplete glutathione, (this is why an overdose will kill you-it exhausts the body's supply of glutathione, and the liver can no longer excrete it). Glutathione is the body's "master antioxidant" and is essential for eliminating toxins, including mercury, from the body. Studies are showing that many autistic kids are deficient in glutathione, and also have abnormalities with sulfation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11568...

“BACKGROUND: The inflammatory cells documented in chronic otitis media with effusion (OME) spontaneously release oxidants which can induce middle ear (ME) epithelial cell damage. Glutathione (GSH), a major extracellular antioxidant in humans, plays a central role in antioxidant defense. PURPOSE: To evaluate the effects of GSH treatment on chronic otitis media with effusion (OME). SUBJECTS AND INTERVENTION: Sixty children with chronic OME were enrolled, 30 of whom were randomly assigned to the treatment group and 30 to the placebo group. Patients in the treatment group received 600 mg glutathione in 4 mL saline per day subdivided into five 2-minute administrations given by nasal aerosol every 3 or 4 waking hours for 2 weeks. Patients in the control group received 4 mL saline per day following the same procedure as for GSH treatment. RESULTS: Three months after therapy improvement had occurred in 66.6% of patients in the GSH-treated group and in 8% of the control subjects (P

Guggie - posted on 07/01/2009

oh wow I was just researching into this. I have opened a pandora's box. tylenol is scary! Basically I found a bunch of studies implicating tylenol use before and after vaccines as a potential reason for vaccine complications. It appears that the use of this drug (not exactly the name brand tylenol) causes a myriad of immunological and biological complications that, when occurring simultaneously w/ multiple vaccinations, causes neurological issues.

Very very shocking when you think that most doctors recommend tylenol before and after vaccines or to alleviate fevers and swelling in association with vaccines.

One researcher even went so far as to claim this connection as a trigger for autism.

gosh where did I put all my links on this....

Sapphire - posted on 07/01/2009

Thanks! I hate hate hate giving my son Tylenol or other OTC meds unless it's a last resort. On the other hand, my husband is the first to suggest something at the slightest fever. I've been fortunate that in the past 4 years, my son is a healthy kid and rarely ever gets sick.

Minnie - posted on 07/01/2009

Yep. My husband's uncle's girlfriend (lol that's a mouthful) ended up in the ER a few months ago with a damaged liver from overdosing on tylenol after breaking her ankle in a car crash.



Thanks for the info.