Concerns over Vaccinations

Amanda - posted on 06/27/2012

anyone know the laws for saying no to vaccines in upstate NY? i searched but couldnt find any vaccine friendly doctors :< i live by Utica Ny. any info would be appreciated! :)

Melinda - posted on 06/18/2012

she may have a really sensitive immune system..or over reactive. I would look into alternative vaccine schedules, it is more visits, but less shots at one time.

Rachel - posted on 06/17/2012

I haven't read any other replies, I'll just add my YES! My oldest daughter had a strong high fever. She had a febrile seizure that lasted 30 minutes before the ER was able to control it. They warned me then that she would likely become epileptic from a seizure that severe, and she did. I also know that the provincial medical review board deemed her reaction "normal" because a fever, (even a life threatening, brain altering fever) is listed as an acceptable bodily response. I am not Anti-vaccination, but I am outraged by the misrepresentation and lies perpetrated by the medical establishment when it comes to vaccinations.

Kelly - posted on 06/14/2012

My son's dx of infantile spasms immediately followed his 4 month vaccines too! His neuro won't say it out loud, but the pediatrician and others all say "we know exactly what it was"... the pertussis! He is now 11 and will never get the pertussis portion of the vaccine again.

Brittany - posted on 10/28/2010

My mom is double Aquarius and my husband is Sagittarius/Aquarius and they butt heads like crazy! (They are wayyy too much alike lol)

The Libra will help but it's the hiding feelings and the putting on a happy face instead that worries me. All the Scorpios I know do that and it ends up being disastrous with me but hopefully as her mom, it wont be that much of an issue.

I'd love a Pisces for #2 because I get along with them so well, especially as a little sister or brother to my Layla but I don't know about my husband. I think all of us would do well with a Capricorn =)

Good luck with your little Sagittarius, too! She'll keep you on your toes as soon as she learns to roll over! lol =)

Kayleigh - posted on 10/27/2010

(sorry for the side tangent!)
Libra rising will help A LOT with that disposition, tho... lol... that is my rising sign... I honestly have found ppl that are Libra rising are usually more fair and equal and respectful of ppl's rights than actual Libras... haha...
I wish you the best of luck with your Scorpio ♥
We could probably use some too! ^_^'
♥
we weren't really trying for anything (we weren't "trying at all" we just weren't "not trying" either...) and ended up with an original due date of the day after her fathers birthday (dec 16th)... honestly i wanted a Sagittarius and a girl.. and got at least one wish so hopefully we get the other too! ^_^

its a lot to take on, but my top 2 choices are Sagittarius and Aquarius so, i think i can take it... ^_^'

Brittany - posted on 10/27/2010

I know lol we were trying for a Libra but she decided that she was going to come a little late! lol I did get my way in her rising sign, though. Of course she's my perfect little girl and I would never change a thing about her but I'm glad we have a little time before the pre-teen/teenage years! Oi! haha

Kayleigh - posted on 10/27/2010

104+ can cause brain damage, yeah i would say that is cause for concern :(





Brittany - yeah, I'm really excited to give my daughter a better opportunity than i had... Public school was a waste of time for me...

Scorpio huh! that's a handful! lol. My mom is a Scorpio so if i end up in preterm labor *crosses fingers* and end up with a Scorpio instead of a sag, I'm gonna make her help me with our little handful! but so far things seem good ^_^

I just hope that My fiance and i can handle even raising a Sagittarius! there is a lot there to account for and be understanding of... (I am a Gemini and he is a Sag-, we think we'll be a good team ^_^)



oh and welcome to the forum... beware of stupid/judgmental people... they lurk around every corner! lol ^_^'

Alexis - posted on 10/27/2010

My child did not have an adverse reaction to vaccinations but getting my pediatrician to listen to me about my son when he was sick and not just disregard it as being a new mom was infuriating. I too switched pediatricians. If I understand correctly anything above 103 means its time to go to the doc, and if IBU or Tylenol doesnt beak the fever I would be worried too! Good for you switching docs, I think some get caught up in the same old same old and don't look at each patient individually.

Tiffany - posted on 10/27/2010

My daughter did not get fever with any of her shots until she just got her chickenpox vaccine at her 1 year checkup. I was very nervous and when I called the on call doctor she dismissed me. Luckily I have my daughters nurses phone number and she made me feel a lot better. Your doctor should NEVER under any circumstances laugh at you in a situation like this. You should not only switch doctors, but you should report him. Spiking fevers like that every time would scare the crap out of me too. Find a new pediatrician that will deal with your questions and concerns appropriately.

Brittany - posted on 10/27/2010

Jennifer - Yes, small world! Herkimer college is about 5 minutes away from my house!

Kayleigh - I could always use more love! =P

Thanks for posting that link. You can never have enough resources...

Your daughter is going to have an amazing education!! That's so awesome! My husband is a Sagittarius also but our daughter is a Scorpio (oh boy! =P).

Oh and I only joined CoM last week I think haha but if I had seen your post, I definitely would have backed you up!

Melissa - posted on 10/27/2010

I have had both my daughters vaccinated, I was vaccinated may have gotten some of the things just not as severe. I won't do the flu vaccine, I don't believe in that one, but they do get vaccinated for everything else, I have a great doctor and he is real with me about everything, if he feels it isn't necessary he tells me because he knows I want to know. So we don't do that. He has always been able to finish my questions with answers before I completely finish them and if I am not satisfied with the answer he goes and gives me what he has on it, or where to get more information. Usually he will go do the research and get back to me which works too. My girls have never been sick with anything more than numerous ear infections but I was the same way when I was younger, mostly because like my oldest we like to be in the water a lot. Neither of them had any issues with any of the vaccines, so I think it is really a matter of case by case. None of my daughters friends have had any issues with vaccines either.

Jennifer - posted on 10/27/2010

Brittany- I went to college right outside Utica- Herkimer CCC! :) Ha, small world, huh?!

Sarh- Yup, I always give 5 ml Tylenol to her right before her appointment, then another 5 ml Ibuprofen when we get home. Then I alternate every 2-3 hours with which she gets (both the jerk ped and the pharmacist I work with told me that was fine, as long as the max daily on the acetominophen wasnt exceeded). The pharmacist I work with is very knowledgable, but he's a guy, and his kids are fully grown, so he's a reliable source, but not very compassionate about it, lol. I figured other MOMS would be, lol!

Ashley- Thank you, that was kind of my feelings also!

Kayleigh- wish I had seen that, lol! My thoughts are, no matter what you actually do, we are doing what we believe is best for our children (or we wouldnt be on here, right?!) And best luck to your mom - that is AWESOME!

Sarh - posted on 10/27/2010

My children have never had a high fever like that from their shots. I don't remember what their pediatricians said causes the fever, but he did tell me. Sorry, that's not much help, but when she gets her shots do you give her Tylenol or Motrin w/in an hour of her receiving her shots? I was told to give Tylenol every 6hrs to prevent a fever from starting per the pediatrician. My children have the same pediatrician.

I am glad to see you are switching peds!

Kayleigh - posted on 10/26/2010

Brittany - I think i love you a little... sorry if that weirds you out!
We are homeschooling for JUST those reasons... we will most likely be raising another Sagittarius (her father is one thru and thru!) and we really want her to have the most artistically and scientifically stimulating learning experience possible.. and that is NOT public school... or mass-organized school at all... so she is going to be home schooled by my mother, who is in school to be an astronomer and theoretical physicist right now! ^_^

To Everyone being supportive! - WHERE WERE YOU A MONTH AGO when i got FLAMED for being anti-vax and ACTUALLY KNOWING WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT... I really could have used the support... ^_^ lol.

Jennifer - http://www.thinktwice.com/
they have personal accounts for EVERY vaccine, statistics and REAL ingredient information... probably one of the best resources i have found... I have more if you need them ^_^

ASHLEY - posted on 10/26/2010

never happened to me I have a 15 month old, a 13 yr old and 1 on the way. I would switch doctors as well regardless if you are a first time mom or not he gets paid to answer questions about your childs health. Even if it turns out not be a big deal it is the peds job to explain it to you so you arent freaking out if she has a less common reaction.

Brittany - posted on 10/26/2010

Jennifer- How funny, I was just looking for houses around there the other day! We live about 2 hours apart. I live in westmoreland near utica =)

Alana - posted on 10/26/2010

my boy normally has a fever for a day, and hes mornjy for that first day too, and when e had his jabs at aroubd 6 months, his legs swelled up MASSIVE and he couldnt sit or crawl or anything coz he was in such pain. the doctors werent very nice or sympathetic to me either, so i swapped GP's.
now they give him his jabs in his arms so atleast he isnt in pain when he's walking etc x

Jennifer - posted on 10/26/2010

Brittany- I live in Pulteney (which is literally a four corners, lol) I'm on Keuka Lake, about midway between Corning and Rochester. Where abouts are you?

Jennifer - posted on 10/26/2010

Thanks Jen! I wasnt entirely sure what responses I'd get over vaccinations, I knew it may be touchy! The pedi said that moderate fevers are common, but I was just rather offended for him laughing at me and asking "is she your first child?" I had tried discussing it the last time she was in, because it will literally put her out of commission for almost an entire week, with high fevers for 4 - 5 days, and lethargic for a whole week. And he blew me off then too...
She's not my normal little bouncy energetic girl, and her doctor refuses to discuss the possibility that she may be sensitive to SOMETHING in the vaccines.

Is anyone out there an MD or nurse and might be able to agree/dissagree with that? Could she be sensitive to some filler in the vaccines? I'm not aware of the exact composition of vaccines, do they ALL have fillers in common? Or has anyone else had the doctor tell you that it is "normal" to have SUCH a high fever, as my pedi did? (I really wanted to slap the guy when he did that to me, like I was just being paranoid! I've only ever had one sick visit to the Dr, when she had an ear infection, and I would consider myself the farthest thing from paranoid, LOL!)

Brittany - posted on 10/26/2010

Jennifer, I live in upstate, NY also! What city do you live in?

Jennifer - posted on 10/26/2010

my 2 kids both would run fevers after vaccinations, but never as high as what you have experienced. any discussion about vaccines can become explosive, but what it comes down to is this: you have to act in the best interest of your child. by taking the fevers seriously and switching to a doctor that you feel will be more in tune with your concerns you have accomplished this. kudos to you!!

Jennifer - posted on 10/26/2010

Thank you guys all again so much for the helpful comments and stories. I'm so sorry to hear from all of you these crappy things that the doctors are saying/doing in regards to your decisions about your children. I did just read alot of the articles written by Dr. Sears, as Brittany suggested. And I did fill out an adverse reaction form too! On Dr. Sears' website, I even found some vaccine friendly doctors that aren't more than an hour or so away, so I'll be changing my daughters pedi soon! (I live in upstate NY, so I'm in the middle of no-where, lol, so an hour isn't even considered far!)



I wish I were lucky enough to be able to homeschool! However, second best to that, we recently moved into a new district. We were moving anyways, and I looked into all the area schools. We actually decided on the same school I went to... a SMALL school where all the teachers remember me, and my brother, my two younger cousins, and (LOL) some even remember my FATHER! This school graduates an average of 30 - 40 kids each year, LOL! Like I said, a little on the small side! So, second best to being able to do it myself, I'm 'comfortable' sending her there.



I guess I'll have to look into state laws regarding required vaccines, and perhaps end up doing something different than traditional school - our 'ex-amish' neighbors have 3 girls ages 4, 6, and 7 they homeschool... so perhaps that could be an option since I can't stay home due to work. The shots she received this last time I will NEVER allow her to have again, that was just too scary. And I'm going to have to seriously reconsider some of the boosters, because although this last incident was the worst, she has always had HORRID reactions. Shes never received one shot and had a temperature LESS than 102. And when Tylenol/Ibuprofen won't bring it down?? I just think there's something not right with that...



And I wish everyone the best of luck in your choices- thank you all SO much for all the great advice and comments!!

Kelina - posted on 10/25/2010

If she gets a fever like that again, you can try placing an icepack in between her thighs to bring her temperature down. It works really well.

Bonnie - posted on 10/25/2010

Wow I just can't believe the physician laughed at you. That is crazy! A fever that high is no joke. Both my boys have only had mild fevers in reaction to vaccinations. My husband is a nurse though and our youngest just had a farely high fever recently and he constantly reminds me that with a fever 104 or over, you start loosing brain cells. So it is definately not a joke. I wonder if your physician has kids and if so, if he laughs when his children have a high fever.

Jessica - posted on 10/25/2010

I agree on the vaccines. I have three children, 3, 1, and 6 months. All have never missed a vaccine. My eldest and middle child are fine, however my 6 month old has Infantile Spasms, a rare form of epilepsy and we r stumped as to what's causing it. MRI, CT Scan and x-ray all are normal. Thank Goodness!!! My only guess, 4 month vaccines.

Megan - posted on 10/25/2010

I have to say I am of two minds about vaccinations. I know my son did not have adverse reactions becuase we were off schedule for his vax's when he was diagnosed with PDD-NOS but I honestly think there are way too many too fast for a little body. I am scared to and scared not to and not sure which is worse at this point. Hubby had mumps and measles and wouldn't inflict either on a child after his experience as a kid with them so I don't feel I can shrug off the idea. At the same time, 5 shots seems like way too many in one sitting.

I know I would be finding a new doctor who would actually treat my child if they had a reaction. In fact I will probobly be finding a new doctor anyway since the one we have for our son didn't respect my wishes on a couple of shots (why the hell does a baby need HepB? are they shooting up? nope, are they having sex? nope) At my son's 4 month appointment they did it without asking after I had made it clear that I didn't want him to have it.

For the record however, my husband and I both have a scar each from chicken pox, and I had singles at 18 as well. I will admit though that the doctor at the time suspected that I got the shingles because I was recovering from a really bad bout of Mono that left my immune system weak.

Amanda - posted on 10/25/2010

lol Brittany. I just posted my response and then saw that you posted too.
The reasons you listed for homeschooling, are the exact reasons we are going to homeschool.

Amanda - posted on 10/25/2010

Jennifer-Usually there are exemption forms you can fill out if you choose not to vaccinate. I believe most states have them. Some are specific to religious reasons(I know some parents have flubbed their way through that loop hole). The laws are different for each state, so you will have to check on your state's laws.
We are personally going to homeschool, not for religious reasons. We just feel it is going to be the better choice for our kids. So we aren't worried about vaccine issues.

Brittany - posted on 10/25/2010

I plan to homeschool my child(ren) so it really doesn't effect me, mainly because most public school systems cannot give children individual attention and can only teach lessons in a specific "structured" way that doesn't allow for people that think differently. ALSO, In general, public school systems often discourage creativity and thinking in general in favor of children who can absorb facts and copy those facts onto tests.
In my opinion, remembering facts doesn't help you much in the real world. I, myself value creativity and thinking for yourself much more than "fitting in" to standard education.
The fact that they are starting to and have already cut out art and science from school's curriculums is further proof of that. Art is very important to help express our feelings and help with our understanding of ourselves. If we didn't have art, our history books would be empty! Science is only what be base our whole existence on (whether you're religious or not, this is true).
I'm not bashing public school systems because I know people who really prospered in them but they are not for everyone and unfortunately, a lot of people cannot afford anything else if their child learns differently.

Getting back to your question, Yes, I believe there are montessori, charter, and few private schools that don't require vaccinations but it might be different depending on state law. I can't be sure of that because I haven't done much research on the subject but I know that there are also "homeschool groups" where a parent will teach any number of kids. This is a wonderful alternative for parents who wish to homeschool their kids but either cannot stay home with them or would rather they learn with classmates.

My next step is also finding Layla a chicken-poxed playmate! lol

Jennifer - posted on 10/25/2010

Wow, thank you guys ALL for the help! I am in total agreence, I'm fairly concerned with the effects of these shots. My daughter is about 4 ½, and up until now, we've been pretty dilagent about getting her to her appointments when they're due. But she has always had seemingly excessive reactions, high fevers (103+), rashes, larthary for days afterwards, and the doctors are like, well, it can happen to some kids. She's out of commission for nearly a whole week! And they dont think this is strange...

And I think this latest chicken pox vaccine is, excuse me, assinine. And I have refused that. She's a child, and it seems like a right of passage to have chicken pox. Agreed, its not fun, but most people get them young, and have no permanent marks. (Now I just need to find someone who has them and have Brianna give them a hug, LOL!)

So for those of you who are choosing NOT to vaccinate, how does that work when they become schoolaged? Are you required to homeschool them? Or are you able to put them into public school?

Kayleigh- The doctor gave me supposed reactions to watch for, most of which state "minor" fevers, etc. Is there better information out there?

Amanda and Brittany- Thank you for the websites! I'll be on them tonight! And good luck with the next little ones!!

And thank you guys all, I wasnt sure what types of responses I'd get, knowing how hard Dr. push vaccines!

Brittany - posted on 10/25/2010

Amanda- Wow that's an incredible story! I wanted a homebirth with my daughter but as my first, I had no idea what to expect, I had no idea what I'd be like in labor so I was scared and just decided I'd go with a hospital birth. It went pretty well and I had a great nurse who showed me how to get my daughter to latch on almost immediately after she was born. Now that I know in general what to expect, I really want a homebirth for my second! =)

Here's hoping you will have an easier time breastfeeding #2!

Amanda - posted on 10/25/2010

Brittany-Us too. Isn't awful that people have these preconceived notions that your intelligence level is directly linked to your income level?
Just bc we have no money doesn't mean we don't want the best for our children.
I am having a home birth with this next little guy. We were so lucky to find a midwife who is willing to work with us on payments. I hated my birth experience in the hospital. No one listened to what I wanted and I didn't get very much help with breastfeeding. I even had one nurse tell me I wasn't going to be able to do it. I wanted to smack her. . .Due to circumstances, I wasn't able to breastfeed, but I did end up pumping for my son until he was 16 months.

Brittany - posted on 10/25/2010

Amber, I'm so sorry that happened to your daughter! That's awful...

Amanda, you are very lucky to have a great pediatrician who respects you! I hope to find one someday but because I am on medicaid, doctors seem to have a pre-conceived idea about my intelligence level...

Amanda - posted on 10/25/2010

Brittany-I completely agree with you. My son was vaccinted up until a year(he is 22 months now) when it came time for MMR and Chicken Pox. I did lots of research and it took me that long to finally make a decision on vaccines. I loved Dr Sears Vaccine Book.
Baby#2 is due in Jan and I dont think we will be vaccinating him at all.
Luckily, our pedi is very open-minded and knows I do my research. So he is ok with whatever decisions I make about our sons care.

Amber - posted on 10/25/2010

My 1 year old daughter got a fever of 104 (they warned me this may happen but did not give a reason as to why). Then we brought her back bc a week later she got a huge red welt where she got the shot the dr on call said it was an infection and put her on antibiotics. 2 days later she broke out in an all over body rash (kinda looked like chicken pox) so we brought her back again a different dr said she never had an infection just a reaction and now a virus (and this was in the same drs practice) took her off the antibiotic. It's now been 2 and a half months she still has a slight bluish discoloration on her thigh where she had the shot (the chicken pox shot). All the dr says is it will go away over time.

Brittany - posted on 10/25/2010

My daughter is 11 months old and has never had a vaccine in her life. I have a friend who's son developed epilepsy from them and another who's son had a similar reaction to your child's except his entire body swelled up like a balloon and they refused to treat him after she asked if it might be because of the vaccine!

Certain vaccines I don't agree with based on mere common sense. Like the chicken pox vaccine. Chicken pox is generally a harmless childhood illness that might be irritating for a week and the child would have natural immunity for life against chicken pox and a very high rate of protection from shingles. If the person gets chicken pox as an adult, it might be much more serious and painful and can even cause death in rare cases. The adult cases are where they get all these pneumonia and brain damage things. They begin administering this vaccine to children when the actual illness is most harmless to them. At 12-15 months and it wears off in 4-6 years so they developed a booster to protect them for another 4-6 years. So now the person is 8-12 years old and has a MUCH higher chance of getting shingles and even developing chicken pox later in life because the shot is only about 71% effective. My aunt had that shot and still got chicken pox anyway in her teens and it was very severe, the doctors didn't think she would live. From the literature given to me by a doctor on the importance of this vaccine, it says the risk of death from the shot itself is very small but I haven't been able to find a percentage.

Anyway, that is just an example of why I don't believe in most of these shots.
You might find this article interesting if you've ever wondered why doctors push vaccines so hard -http://www.askdrsears.com/thevaccinebook...

My daughter's first doctor pretty much called us ignorant and kicked us out of his office when I told him we weren't vaccinating. He told us to find another doctor. We searched around for about 9 months (during which time I got the same kind of phone calls that were borderline harassment. My best friend who I listed as my emergency contact also got these calls.
During my daughter's 10 month appointment, the nurses started ganging up on me straight away about why I hadn't gotten her vaccinated and saying horrible things like "you don't want your precious baby to get sick, do you? As her mother, you should care about protecting her!". So the doctor came in and spent the rest of the time pretty much ridiculing us for even considering not vaccinating and telling us all the horrible diseases she could get because we "don't care about her". I barely said a word but the funny thing was that she was feeding me misleading information and actually LYING to me about studies found and when I quoted the actual facts from my memory, she was shocked that I actually knew what I was talking about and started to stammer and say things like "well that's not what I said" or "oh well I meant this-". I know that I can sign a waiver that releases her from being legally responsible for any diseases that may "result" from not vaccinating but what I really want is a doctor that respects me as a parent and doesn't ridicule or insult me for my beliefs.
Still looking...

Amanda - posted on 10/25/2010

Make sure you report the reaction, especially if your pedi isnt going to acknowledge it. If it were me, I wouldn't be getting my child more vaccines or at least only doing one at a time.
Here is the website to report it. http://vaers.hhs.gov/index

Kayleigh - posted on 10/25/2010

First, I would like to say, this may turn into a hot-button issue... so be prepared.

2nd... there is a LOT of evidence that non-allergic reactions happen quite a bit with a lot of vaccines... your daughter's immune system probably doesn't agree with one of the common filler compounds in the vaccines and TDaP has one of the worst track records... how old is she?



MOST physicians will completely refuse to admit that your daughter had a reaction to the vaccines and if you continue to press the issue they may completely refuse to treat you all together. My suggestion would be to do individual research (i can help provide sources if you want) on the actual documented reactions for those vaccines, and the Ingredients...