Well this is interesting! I've been kicked out of Breastfeeding Moms!

Natasha - posted on 10/31/2009 ( 14 moms have responded )

106

21

8

Yes you heard it here first! Ha ha! This is my official you've been kicked out email, along with my response:



Natasha,



You have launched a personal attack of me on many threads in the past days. For this reason you have been removed from the group. It would have been appropriate to send me a message to discuss your concerns. I will revisit this issue in 10 days with you to see if you are willing at that time to adhear to the guidelines of circle of moms. These guidelines are listed under the guidelines tab at the top of the page.



Chelsea (Admin of breastfeeding moms)







you

a moment ago Well maybe you need to look at your attitude in your posts. I suppose you feel all-powerful to be able to remove me and prevent anyone else agreeing with me.....which you might see that they have! I just one moment ago recieved a message from another within the group saying that they agreed with me on your attitude. Have a look at my post within Jesseca Ali's coversation as to why she left the group.....a woman's decision to breastfeed is heavily influenced by the people who are advising her and if the people who are advising her are completely without compassion, as you seem to be at the moment, it becomes very discouraging and you are more likely to give up. Could you have not given the mum of five looking at going on vacation a bit more credit for what she has achieved in breastfeeding rather than calling her selfish? You are all about child-led weaning and such, but you have one child a little over a year and have not yet come across this hurdle. You have limited REAL experience in the department and yet tell others in no uncertain terms how to conduct their relationship with their child and what is and isn't appropriate. I'm so sorry but whatever chilhood education and lactation education you have does not make you an expert. Real expertise comes from actual experience! Think about this before you respond, but I would love to hear your response!



I wonder how this will go down!



Kerry I hope you dont mind me mentioning that you sent me a message, I didn't mention your name.

14 Comments

View replies by

Victoria - posted on 10/01/2010

121

3

17

I also agree with you here. Breastfeeding is not for everyone, and is a personal choice. If that mother felt the need to stop at 9 months for what ever reason, I commend her for the 9 months that she actually did it! And what's with the "I am a teacher excuse". Agreed, it is a noble profession, however, for every great, inspiring teacher out there, there are two who stink. Good for you for sticking to your guns! As someone who tried for months to breastfeed unsuccessfully, the last thing that I wanted to hear was that giving up would make me appear lazy or complacent. It is a tough enough decision to make and I wouldn't want to put that kind of pressure on another mother. We have enough to worry about!

Natasha - posted on 04/12/2010

106

21

8

I totally agree with you here!! Especially the last bit,they need to step up and parent, set boundaries!!

Dyan - posted on 04/08/2010

32

6

1

:)

I appreciate the responses! I see the point of not starting babies on "meals" of solids too early, but to not let them try just seems like you are not allowing them to learn at their own pace if they are ready. Someone in an attachment parenting group was talking about how in some countries the babies are held constantly and never touch the floor until a year or so. hello?!?!?!? When do they learn to crawl? Circuits around the family bed at night?

So anyway, I stopped visiting that group so much...been busy. Andrew is now 23 weeks old, has tried rice cereal and oatmeal, peas, green beans, avocados, and carrots. He enjoys his "mini meal" but still nurses his usual 5 times a day. I moved him to his own room and lo and behold...he chooses to sleep ALL NIGHT! When he was in his bed in my room everytime he would get up I would nurse him (luckily only once or twice a night), but then he wouldn't nurse long or well at breakfast and bedtime. After a few nights in his own room he just started sleeping. Lucky me, but I still firmly believe that by 9 months at least they are capable of going all night, if the mom will let them. They won't "reverse-cycle" or whatever if you don't let them. Just like your 10 year old won't watch TV all day if you don't let them. Those that nurse their 12 month old 6-8 times PER NIGHT need to be the parent and say no.

Sorry, my turn to rant...

:)

Natasha - posted on 03/20/2010

106

21

8

We are active.....just trying to build up some more members :-) I've had the worst internet trouble lately and have not been able to get on as much as I would like.



I see no problem with a five month old having some first foods......most people know what foods are appropriate to try them on (such as the ones mentioned above, eg. cereal mixed with breastmilk/formula and avocado to name some). If you watch for their reactions and such you will know if they are ready. I would like to say that one of the philosophies that I go by for parenting is that mum knows her baby best, and knows what is best for their individual child. Grabbing food is definitely an indication that they are ready. Some are ready earlier than others, thats just the way it is! I have read some of the posts from the working breastfeeding mothers who say their babies have "reverse-cycled" (what is it, an air-con unit?) and feed throughout the night to "make up" for the fact they don't breastfeed throughout the day.....and then I read that some of these babies were over 12 months old. Not sure who this is really benefitting. Sounds to me that its more of a habit rather than nutrition. If a child over one is given a proper diet it probably won't need as much breastmilk (not saying that it has to be given up, just that 50 feeds in a 24 hour period isn't neccessary). I think the child (and mother) need to maybe learn some better sleeping habits! But hey, just my opinion! One of the ex-moderators of the group has a 16 month old who feeds every half hour and has done so since birth. I have to say that I have started to wonder if maybe these people have given up on all other aspects of the life they before kids and use breastfeeding as something to validate themselves with? Like if they didn't do it they are a complete failure as a person? I just think that its odd to be so devoutly passionate about it to the point that it is your whole life. I honestly think it is the single best thing you can give your child for as long as you can.....but I think that mums need breaks and to learn to give themselves a break! I mean breastfeeding is meant to be the most natural thing you can do with your baby, yet to me it has turned into something so technical, guilt-ridden and confusing thing by some of these people that it hardly sounds appealing! Yet when you peel back the layers and its just mum and bub, relaxed and feeding its the way it should be. Support groups have turned into critical, guilt-inducing messes! If you don't agree with the leader's point of view to aree told that you are causing your baby harm and practically being abusive. Not sure who made her the world authority on babies after having a whole of one - thats right, one - herself. That's no criticism on anyone on their first bub, its all experience and we are all learning (even those one their fifth or sixth will say they learn something everyday), but no one else claims to be an expert either. Why can't they be about support, not critisizing? It would go a lot further in encouraging women to breastfeed in the first place. Well this wasn't meant to be a long rant so I will stop here now :)

Jessica - posted on 03/18/2010

986

20

64

This group doesn't seem to be as active... but I think the people here are definitely willing to be a bit mroe supportive of different choices/experiences! I'd hate to see what those women would think of me, in the process of weaning my 9 month old and giving him *gasp* formula! Hehehe.

Dyan - posted on 03/18/2010

32

6

1

I see this is an older thread..hopefully someone will pick it up and respond to me. I joined the breastfeeding moms group a while back, and I have gotten some good information, but I feel like they are some really hard-core people. They stick to the "no solids until 6 months or more" but can't give me a good reason why. I understand the open-gut closed-gut thing, but at almost 5 months my son is trying to eat MY food. I would rather satisfy his curiosity by giving him some cereal or avocado mixed with breastmilk than find him gnawing on the end of my egg roll when I am not looking! When I have given him some cereal he actually holds the spoon and and helps me get it to his mouth. I don't feel I am harming him by giving him a little...it doesn't replace any breastfeeding, but I feel like I can't mention that in the other group. Also, I don't mind getting up a time or two to feed my son at night...even though his doc says he should be sleeping through the night...but to get up 3-7 times? Is the child really getting enough sleep if they are up that many times in an 11 hour period? I think that group makes me more confused than before! I hope this group is a little more "user friendly".

Iysha - posted on 11/28/2009

1,914

26

203

Woah...HARM their children?!? by weaning....lol. What is she on...I want some...I need a little break from reality!
For being as educated as she claims to be, she is making some very uneducated comments. Weaning before 12 months is not harmful.
I would be glad to be out of "her" group. At least that would be the last comment I would hear from her! At least she is writing some apologies. A series of apologies can't take back the feelings associated with her hurtful comments to those women who were on the other end. I feel for them. People like her really get to me.

Natasha - posted on 11/04/2009

106

21

8

Thats exactly why I started the group Kristin! Real experience is so important, there is a very real emotional aspect to breastfeeding and it impacts all areas of your life, but the other group really doesnt understand this. When you are breastfeeding you need support with not only the technical aspects of it, but also the emotional. I thought that they would support ALL of these things. Spouting medical advice doesn't always help, especially when most of can find something 'medical' to back up nearly anything we say! And nearly everyone I know, including myself, has been given conflicting advice from professionals along the way.

Kristin - posted on 11/01/2009

56

5

7

im glad u said what u did she may have a lot of knowledge and a lot of it is probably great but when it comes to experience she is very critical. The group is supposed to be to support moms to breastfeed and to work through problems but i only see her helping 50% she seems to quote alot of references but that only goes so far what about the emotional aspect. I think if we as moms even enter this site we are looking for others that have gone through the ups and downs not wanting to read articles of medical "stuff" I believe that if we have even taken one step to breastfeed that we know ultimately that breast is best because if we didnt we would have gone straight to formula in the hospital. With my son I had a slew tiny problems that added all up in me stopping and I saw 3 different LC and they said i was doing fine but i ended up with craked bleeding nipples and clogged ducts! My daughter who is 5 months....the LC in the hospital said i was fine but the one at the ped office wanted me to give her formula after a week because she thought her weight was on the low side even though her reg ped said she was fine. So with that said all the medical experience means jack to me! its real life. Yes i supplement once in awhile but because of it I feel like i can breastfeed longer because i know she is getting the nutrition she needs. ( granted i didnt supplement till she was 2 months) But that is what bothers me about that group that if i were to mention my experiennce i would be shot down! So keep up the good work maybe you should rename the group liberal breastfeeding moms!

Natasha - posted on 11/01/2009

106

21

8

Well hopefully I at least got through to her and she understands that her comments are hurtful and rude! So I don't regret saying anything if it has helped others NOT be on the receiving end of some of her garbage. I daresay she got the job because she is a lactation consultant......its the way she tell everyone what to do and that they are bad if they don't follow her ways that irks me,

I put her emails and my response there because I just wanted be honest, so there was no he said, she said stuff. If anyone thinks I was out of line I understand, but geez....some of the things she said! Ugh!

Kerry - posted on 10/31/2009

398

15

64

I can;t believe she did that!! I don't mind you mentioning my message - i'm sure she's probably seen it anyway. It surprises me actually that she was even allowed to be admin, surely more mums would have applied that had breastfeed more than one child over a longer period of time. Anyway - stick to your guns girl, we'll see if I get kicked out because I have pretty much said all the things you have said!! Will keep you posted

Jessica - posted on 10/31/2009

986

20

64

WOW, I can't believe you were actually kicked out!!! It seems like everything is getting way out of hand over there. From the rest of her posts it sounds like maybe she will re evaluate the way she acts towards people... lets hope so anyway!

Natasha - posted on 10/31/2009

106

21

8

Well a positive result I hope!



11:56 pm I belive that adults do need time outs from time to time. I myself take timeouts. I was merely offering you advice when saying that I think you need to work on distancing yourself personally and I myself am taking that advice. I do not feel that I was treating you like a child but I'm sorry if it came off that way.



I understand that I have been over critical in the past and would like to say that the post you are refering to was writen before I was the Admin. of this group (this is no accuse but I do not intend to continue to post in this manner). This is a new position for me and I regret having said some of the things that I said previously now that I am in the spot light so to speak. I will go back and write some apologies, I think that's a great idea. I will not however compromise my beliefs and the hard facts about breastfeeding. I still maintain that weaning before 12 months of age and going cold turkey is harmful to both baby and mother.



As for monitoring myself I have appointed a lot of moderators who are welcome to monitor what I say just as much as they monitor what others say. I will send out a message to them to make sure that they understand that they should also be monitoring my activity. I do not look at myself as being top dog and therefor above the rules and guidelines of this community. It would have been great to have had an admin like myself when I did write what I did about weaning to go on vacation. Unfortunately no one was there to remove my post and warn me so it still stands there today.



When I told you that you are only the second person to be removed I was doing so to send you the message that I am not sitting here removing anyone that has something negetive to say about me. I am only removing those that continually attack individuals. The rules of this community in that aspect state that the second offense against either the guidelines of circle of moms or the guidelines of breastfeeding moms will be grounds for removal for 10 days. I think that it's important to have this waiting period so that everyone can have some breathing room and calm down before revisiting the issue. You had attacks against me posted in many different conversations.







you

a moment ago I really appreciate this response and am grateful that you have responded in the way you have. I think your stance on 12 months is commendable and ideal, and I would not expect you to compromise your beliefs. The fact that you are willing to be moderated by others is a sign of humility and being humble brings respect fro people. I think offerring few apologies may warm people up again. I mentioned the two different approaches I received on advice for breastfeeding because it made all the difference and I think it often makes a difference to how long people breastfeed. Its in Jessica Ali's thread on why she left. I just think the way things come across make all the difference ESPECIALLY to new mums seeking advice on first time breastfeeding. I hope you were able to read it, it really affected me but having good help the second and third time around did too, but in a positive way.



Thankyou for hearing me, I appreciate your sincerity and apologise for being rude, I was just feeling unheard and a little offended (maybe on behalf of others more than anything). Until next time....



Natasha

Natasha - posted on 10/31/2009

106

21

8

Well it goes on! This is the next part of the conversation (of sorts):



You are actually only the second person to be removed and it was on request of others. I love constructive criticism but you crossed the line of what is acceptable in this forum with some language. I changed the guidelines of the group based on constructive critisim and would be happy to continue with revisions if the group wanted me to. There is no way to please all 135,000 plus members. I alos do not feel that because I only have one child I am not qualified to give advice. I have worked very had to become a La Leche League leaderl and attend confrences on breastfeeding so that I do have the correct information on breastfeeding to offer. I am also a teacher with a degree in both elementary education and early childhood education. If you say that I am no educated enough on children to offer advice then I would remind you that it's people with my backround that teach your children. I admit that I became emotional when responding to the question about weaning to go on vacation. It was not professional of me to use the term "lazy" and I have since refrained from becoming to personally involved. It's hard for me to keep back some of my passion when I hear about people doing things to harm their children.



As I said in 10 days I would love to revisit the option of allowing you to post again. I think that you are just as passionate about offering and I think you too need to work on distancing yourself personally.







you

a moment ago Have you apologised to the people you have offended? Do you realize that you are basically saying that these people are abusive? Which they in no way are, they just don't adhere to YOUR ideals in parenting, which is not for everybody. You are trying to say that there is one way to parent and that is your way. People do not harm there children when they are seeking advice about different ways of parenting and do not need you basically telling them they are doing so, it is offensive and outright disgraceful.

Yes you have the correct information on breastfeeding, that is commendable and that is what people are seeking when they come into a group like yours, not to be told that they are basically bad parents. Second I said that expertise comes from experience.....which you can only really say you have when you are leaving this world, thus none of us are true experts! But in all seriousness, I wasn't talking about being a teacher (which is a great occupation), I was talking about parental experience. Of course you can offer advice, but maybe you shouldn't be saying your way is ONE AND ONLY way when you haven't experienced half of what these mothers are talking about for yourself. I am passionate but the only person I have really critisized is you because you have been overly critical of others, but unfortunately there seems to be no way of moderating what you say, the rest of the group has to rely on your self-censorship. It is quite funny that at the start you said that I was removed because of my "personal attack" against you and then have told me that others asked for my removal and I'm only the second person to be removed......I never asked for any other reason, I simply said that I was not the only person who felt this way about your attitude.Why did you need to tell me this? Its like you need to feel better than others, maybe you should work on that! I think you telling me to work on myself is a little condascending and contradictory. Don't treat me like a child who needs to be disciplined and have time-out, I am not one of you students! Have an adult conversation with me and treat me and others as equals not people that come under your authority.

Join Circle of Moms

Sign up for Circle of Moms and be a part of this community! Membership is just one click away.

Join Circle of Moms