A way to catch "bad" moms

Nicole - posted on 02/06/2011 ( 28 moms have responded )

736

6

98

Someone from Child Protective Services could go online and ask a question on a parenting forum (possibly one a mom who has been reported frequents), and asks if something obviously not okay to do with kids, is fine and see how mom’s(esp one who is being monitored responds.

For example:
I am going out to a party tonight and I was wondering how much alcohol my 9 month old should be allowed to consume at the party. She’s teething and I want to share my drinks with her to ease her teething pain. How much would you suggest I share with her? I shot? Two max?

Then people who respond with comments like:

“when my kids are teething I always add a shot of brandy to their milk”

can be monitored

Just a thought.

MOST HELPFUL POSTS

Sharon - posted on 02/07/2011

11,585

12

1315

1. it is not entrapment to simply search someones' name and find stuff they've written on the internet.

2. you do not need a warrant for a wire tap to copy information someone put on the internet.

posting here is tantamount to putting information on a billboard along a highway for EVERYONE to read.

Lawyers do this all the time. The pedophile busters do this all the time. And it sticks. People lose in court all the time with information gathered on the internet.

Carolyn - posted on 02/07/2011

898

19

140

copying information posted on the internet is one thing and no , you dont need a warrant to copy something someone posts on social networking sites, forums etc.



however, if someone posted something, and then to locate that person based on that post by using their IP, you would need a warrant or court order.



big difference between internet tracking and using it to identify an individual and locate them, than using the information they posted freely against them in a court of law.



as far as i know, child welfare authorities also have to go through the courts and follow the law. So to investigate and obtain information illegaly would make it useless anyways and you might as well not even waste the resources.

Amanda - posted on 02/07/2011

2,559

3

366

Posting a post about abuse in hopes to get mothers who agree with it, is entrapment and highly illegal.

But on the other hand if you post something that mentions illegal actions, or whatever can totally be used against you in the court of law. Ie your Facebook status' can be used against you. Any photo you upload to the internet, as well as instant messages. As long as the person you are speaking to doesnt entrap you.

Amie - posted on 02/06/2011

6,596

20

412

Carolyn,

I never mentioned doing it legally. To invade someone's privacy that way you do need to follow the letter of the law.

It can be done though without a court order, it's just not legal. Either way, what's written on an online forum can not often (if at all, I'm not sure our courts have entirely caught up with the internet age) be used in court. Legally gotten or not.

Even if the court order was in hand, even if it is your name showing up, even if it is your IP being used, even if it's your computers signature, there is no guarantee that you are the one sitting at your computer at the moment the words were typed.

Which is also why I said it's a stepping stone. It's not proof. It's an idea of what to look at, if anything.

It doesn't stop at CPS either, it could be applied to many aspects of maintaining our laws.

Break our laws to maintain them. It's not something I'd advocate but I do see why some would be willing to do it.

[deleted account]

I reported a lady on here once who admitted to slashing her ex's tires because she thought the woman called social services on her... I reported her both to the CoMs admin team and I went to the womans profile and sent a screen shot of the post the her local police depatrment's tip hotline email. :)

28 Comments

View replies by

Tia Melissa - posted on 02/08/2011

69

11

2

I'll toss in a "that's a form of entrapment" and up the ante with "just because you say it, doesn't mean you'll actually do it" If I were to be caught for things I've said as opposed to the things I've actually done... Well, I wouldn't be sitting here posting a reply!

[deleted account]

Where I am they don't use anything in court that was written over the internet. If it isn't in the person's actual handwriting (even then they ignore it) or a voice recording(they don't bother to listen to that either) its circumstancial and they wont even bother. I went through this with court with my ex. He wrote threats via e-mail, facebook message, and letters written in his own damn handwriting and signed and dated everything, it still didn't matter when I took all of this to court with me printed off. I had voice recordings from the phone, I followed the law told him immediately I was recording the call and the little machine announced the time and date still didn't matter they didn't bother with it. When my house was shot at I showed the police the remenaints (bullety thingys) and the marks on my house where they hit, they didn't care. Even when you put all of this together it didn't make a difference. I had concrete proof as well as countless eye witnesses that were willing to testify (not just people I was close with but also his own family and neighbours) not only that he was violent, still abusive to me, under the influence, intended to harm myself and have his mother kidnap my child, proof that he by his own choice hadn't had any direct involvement with my son for over a year, that he refused to show up for his visits but would harrass me other days, etc. When we went into court he said the two magical words that made all my efforts completely useless "She's lying". They then gave me the advice just to shelter ourselves and wish for the best since the court now looked at this as a he said she said case and weren't going to bother with it...despite all the concrete proof etc. I had to show them I wasn't lying. As it stands he just doesn't want to be involved so the only thing I can do to protect my son and I is to hope he doesn't change his mind before I go for legal abandonement, until then he can up and decide to start all over again with the profaine calls the busting through my front door screaming and attacking me etc. etc. and when I call the police just claim that he was here to see my son and that I'm full of shit. Even if I sustain extensive injuries they can document them but they wont be mentioned in court. If the courts wont even look at documented proof that a person is continuing abuse, endangering his child, breaking his court order (both from family and his criminal probation) etc. then I really couldn't see children's aid roaming the internet for information that would never be bothered with in court. I don't think thats neccessarily right since I see fb statuses and com posts all the time that to me scream abuse and neglect but the truth is it wont be bothered with. The majority of what people say on here is relative and doesn't really prove anything.

Tracey - posted on 02/07/2011

1,094

2

58

If it became known that social services monitored sites like this there could be a Mum with a problem who would be too scared to ask for advice on here in case someone thought she was a bad parent and reported her?

There are also big differences of laws in different countries so what is legal here in UK could be illegal in USA. Taking alcohol as an example as it was mentioned in the original post - in UK it is legal to have wine with a meal in a restaurant from age 12 but I think it is banned until 21 in some other areas, our age of consent here is 16 but older than this elsewhere. So my daughter could be legally pregnant and married at 16 and drinking at her reception but someone else could see this is breaking many laws.

Jess - posted on 02/07/2011

1,806

3

97

In theory its a good idea, but a site like COM's is international and people come here from countries where the laws don't protect their kids. I mean I could tell you I live anywhere and how would you really ever know the truth ? So much time, and rescources could be waisted looking for people who çan't be brought to justice or those who are just lying to big note themselves in a pissing contest. Seen plenty of those here on COM'S.

I would love a button that reports child abuse though ! Maybe when our cars fly and our homes clean themselves !!!

Ez - posted on 02/07/2011

6,569

25

237

After some of the admissions we've had on here over the last two years, I *wish* it could be used as evidence to crucify these moronic mothers. But the best we can hope for is that it may be enough to initiate an investigation.

Doreen - posted on 02/07/2011

75

22

0

I suppose there could be some sort of "trackers" put in place - but who will man them, even if you start a group on for instance "circle of moms" or where ever - you can't really use this as fire power, a good idea to use as an awareness tool. There are many technicalities regarding privacy and authentism etc. that can't really be bridged in court or by law. There would have to be many other factors.



Also, there are so many different cultures, groups, countries, etc. In theory it would be wonderful if we could use this sort of technology to nail those "big bullies" - but in practice I don't think it will ever be a source of monitoring abusive mothers. You could just “flag” them at the welfare. Some people just make really bad jokes. The only control we have is to keep your eyes WIDE open in your own space / neighbourhood, educate and equip yourself on how to assist those children who are falling between the cracks in the system and who today need your warm smile more than you could ever know.



Even if you can't change the child's circumstance cause they not "THAT" abused... you could make a difference to empower that child by showing kindness, taking time to listen to their story, learning their name - I think we have far more power in the small circles we move in. Maybe starting a site to motivate & educate people on how to make a difference to small people, and what tools and routes to take if we do come across a situation so we handle it with care and it be least traumatic for the child.

Tracey - posted on 02/07/2011

1,094

2

58

Is this not entrapment which I believe is illegal?
How do you know everyone tells the truth on here?
How does Child Protection know about a Mum's internet use?

JuLeah - posted on 02/06/2011

3,133

38

694

Folks disclose ignorance here, not often abuse. If they think they are abusing, they don't share. Others might point out their actions were abusive, but they don't see it that way. So, CPS would uncover ignorance for sure, but how sure are you that each person uses a real screne name and has real contact info?

Charlie - posted on 02/06/2011

11,203

111

409

Well something can be done over things that a written on forums with proper investigation but unfortunately children services are often overworked , underfunded and quiet frankly some of them ( in my country ) are lazy assholes who don't seem to really give a shit about the welfare of children .



I know there are quiet a few dangerous "mothers" on these kinds of forums that deserve a thorough investigation especially the ones who are so proud of their Neolithic behavior.

Carolyn - posted on 02/06/2011

898

19

140

as far as the tracking someones interent usage etc, as far as i know, things like that need a court order or a warrant to invade someones privacy. I doubt any judge would be inclined to grant such based on a post on a forum without the person already being a subject of interest or current investigation.



i could easily while at a friends, use their computer sign up with a fake name or even their name and post utter garbage. or i could take my laptop and use someones unsecured router for internet and do the same.

Kate CP - posted on 02/06/2011

8,942

36

758

Most people would think that a post like that is written by a troll and it would probably be deleted or ignored. Maybe. Then again, you never know with women. :P

Melissa - posted on 02/06/2011

472

1

12

no you are right Emma nothing can be done over something that is written in a forum

Stifler's - posted on 02/06/2011

15,141

154

604

I don't think much can be done unless someone who has seen you do it in person reports it really. People use fake names on here. Email addresses aren't always registered to their real name. People lie all the time online.

Amie - posted on 02/06/2011

6,596

20

412

They wouldn't even need to ask. Just follow the person who they're investigating. The technology is out there to track people and where they go online. Follow that to their posts, it gives them an idea of what to check for when doing home inspections.

I doubt anything written here (or elsewhere online), could be used as proof, but it's a stepping stone. One I wouldn't care how much my tax dollars went towards. If it means children are taken care of, it's enough.

~♥Little Miss - posted on 02/06/2011

21,273

9

3058

I remember that Veronica...and some nuts do things exactly like in the OP statement, or abuse there children. It is unfortunate, but I am not so sure how much can be done from a site like this?

Veronica - posted on 02/06/2011

1,539

61

94

Besides that - I had that lady a few months ago send me a message about how she 'disciplined' her kids (you guys prob. remember it) I reported her directly to COM admin. And pretty positive that I am not the only person who has reported abusive mothers before. So really, in this case on COM or similar, i think the mothers would be enough.

Jodi - posted on 02/06/2011

3,562

36

3907

Like the moderators Nicole? I mean, moderators already check in on certain threads. Some stuff is very subjective, however, so I am not sure that this would be entirely fair either...... I mean, the example you gave is pretty extreme. MOST people on a board like this would automatically think "troll" and would post as much, or feed it, LOL.

Stifler's - posted on 02/06/2011

15,141

154

604

I would believe it. They catch pedos this way, go on MSN posing as a teenage girl and ask older men to meet up then bust them.

Nicole - posted on 02/06/2011

736

6

98

Good point. Maybe the parenting forums could be monitored by a volunteer group, possibly made up of moms

Veronica - posted on 02/06/2011

1,539

61

94

Yea, im not sure if that will work, and i think ive only seen a few outrageous things on COMs before - if a woman posted something 'abusive' on DMs she would be jumped all over in no time - none of us tolerates a lot from anyone -- that person wouldnt survive on here! LOL My impression, abusive people, especially who know it - arent going to publicly display it, its kept secret for the most part - so im not sure how effective it really would be to monitor online chat forums.

Jenn - posted on 02/06/2011

2,683

36

96

Could happen, yes. Likely to happen, no. First of all, how would they know that you frequent this particular board? How would they know your screen name (lots of people use fake names and avatars)? How would they have the time to be trolling pages and pages just in case someone says something questionable?

Join Circle of Moms

Sign up for Circle of Moms and be a part of this community! Membership is just one click away.

Join Circle of Moms