Boyfriend's Ex will not let his daughter come to our house without her coming too!

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010 ( 62 moms have responded )

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I am just wondering if I'm the only person who thinks this is completely messed up! My bf's ex will not let their daughter come to our house unless she is with her. She said we could come there but only for a few hours and then we would have to leave. Now she lives 3 and a half hours away from us. So we would have to spend 7 hours on the road to go and see his other daughter for just 2 or 3 hours. We don't have that kind of money and when she is told this, she says "Well it's not my fault he lives so far away." Well it's not our fault she lives so far away either. This person has no job, has never had a job before in her entire life, lives with her parents (who takes care of her daughter more than she does because she is constantly on the computer or stuck up her new boyfriend's butt), and acts like my boyfriend has all the money in the world and is constantly asking for money(even though he pays her child support!) We are thinking about getting a lawyer and taking her to court over this but I first wanted to talk to her like adults and try to settle this without going to court. She tells me that she just can't let her daughter come up here alone and that she's her child. I understand that it's her child but it's not that she can't let her come here by herself, she won't. And the environment they are living in is so unhealthy because they have a bunch of animals and on top of that have 11 people living in a single wide trailer! Am I the only person that thinks that it's messed up or what?

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Sharon - posted on 11/06/2010

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I do get it lacey - kind of.

But you aren't really getting us.

You are not doing well financially. Evidently the man can't afford two kids. Really he can't.

You two should cut your losses, pay the child support and only visit when you can afford to.

Take her to court for fair custody rights. But leave the money part out of the equation.

I'm incredibly saddened that you guys are so poor you can't afford decent diapers or food. Really - you need to think things through better. Your planning skills leave a lot to be desired.

Petra - posted on 11/07/2010

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Layce - the advice the other girls are giving you is simple and you just don't seem to be grasping it. If you can not afford to go see your SD every other weekend, or even once a month, you are not going to be able to afford the travel to have her for a full week once a month, never mind the cost of caring for her when she is with you. The multitude of excuses you have for not going to see her aren't going to vanish with a custody order granting visitation, and a Judge is going to see that.

Court costs next to nothing if you go without a lawyer. A basic visitation agreement does not require a lawyer and a Judge won't look down on you for not having one for such a common, easily dealt with issue. Do your homework, pay your filing fees, and take what you can get. If you don't go to court, you're stuck with what your SD's mother decides. Whining about it isn't going to make her change, and it sure won't gain you any sympathy. If all you've got are excuses to not go see her, why bother trying to get her at all? If she is that important to your hubby, he would be busting his ass and jumping through the hoops to get some time with her. Trust me, that is what a Judge is going to see if you go to Court with this argument.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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No-one is saying she should Layce. What I am trying to say is that she would still go without these things if you had his daughter staying for a week, because that costs money too. I would rather choose the full week too, but the advice is that UNTIL you can get court ordered visitation, take what you can get because it will show the judge that your boyfriend REALLY wants to see his daughter. You can't force his ex to meet you half way right now. Once you have a court order, fine, you have something legal that says she has to. BUT until then, you are the ones at the disadvantage and you need to take the high road, get over it and just take what you can get!!!



I am not saying the ex is right, she's not. She's being a bitch about it because she can. But you CAN'T do anything about it without a court order.



But also keep in mind if you keep using the excuse that you didn't go every other weekend because you couldn't afford it, then the judge will seriously question how you can afford to have her for a full week.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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Lacye, I think the point Laura is trying to make is that you need to take whatever the ex is giving right now, while you go through the courts to get a better deal. Do the few hours every other week. Take whatever you can get. By showing the dedication and the consistency, you will have a MUCH better chance of getting a better deal.

[deleted account]

I would suggest that he saves up the money to make the drive at least once a month. My dad drove 17 hours straight each way to come get us in Canada, and he lived in California. And no, he wasn't rich either. It's a miracle how much strength and money parents can muster up when it comes to their kids, though.

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Tara - posted on 11/07/2010

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Holy! I just read through all the posts and WOW!

Lacye, I agree with those who said visit when you can afford it now and start the process of gaining longer visitation rights contingent on your financial situation improving in the future. Your ex should be doing everything he can to form a bond with his other daughter, perhaps they can share time on a web cam chat every other night? He needs to show that he will take whatever he can get/afford right now. Otherwise it all seems about money.

I am an ex. We share custody. I drive a 2 hour 20 minute round trip drive every Thursday and Sunday to meet my ex who also drives the same distance so that our kids can see him almost as much as they see me. So each of us put in over 4 hours a week of driving so we can spend time with our children. It's not cheap, costs me over $20 in gas and is a pain in the ass, but I do because I know my girls are better for it, and because I have no more right to them than he does. He is their parent the same as I am.
He pays not child support as he makes little money working for a non profit and still has the kids 3 out of every 7 days and so still has a large home, full fridge etc. my oldest also lives there and my 14 year old with me, so it's a very even split. We didn't want to involve the courts beyond a legal and joint custody agreement, we both left the issue of support open in our documents in the event either of us comes into money or gets a better paying job etc. and can contribute to the others expenses.
Let this happen slowly, for everyone's sake. I really think that until you and your husband can afford to at least make the trip to see her once or twice a month you won't be able to convince a judge that he should have any kind of visitation beyond what is already in place.

Isobel - posted on 11/07/2010

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Nothing you just said means anything. I'm going to try to explain this to you ONE more time.

If you can't afford to drive to visit her now, the judge is not going to make an order that says the mother HAS to let you take her home for a week...cause how will you afford to go get her and feed her for a week if you can't afford to visit...

Get it yet? I'm starting to think you expected a pity party about what a bitch your boyfriend's ex is instead of solid advice...oh well

and as for saying that it's not worth the trip cause it's only a few hours? That isn't how I see it (or how a judge would see it) Take full maximum advantage of every moment he is allowed to be with his daughter...a)because that's what a good Dad does and b) because it will help you win in court.

as for the court fees...if you are going to have money from your tax return, use it for visits and court fees instead of a lawyer...pretty simple if you ask me.

Katherine - posted on 11/07/2010

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I propose you take care of you guys first. That government assistance we were talking about? THEN delve into the other mess. You obviously can't do both without some help.

Lacye - posted on 11/07/2010

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Teresa, it's not the same at all. I'm not saying my child is more important. Really and truely I'm not. But just because she is older, does that make her any more important? Because her parents aren't together? That's not my fault or my daughter's.

Laura. you want me to spell every little detail out for you. OK. I have said before, I really don't want to have to go to court because of the cost, yes everybody, we have thought of this. I would love if we could make some sort of agreement with her so he would be able to see his other daughter. I'm not saying she has to bring her all the way up here. Not once have I ever said that. I just wish she would compromise with us and meet us halfway. But instead she is making it to where we have to take her to court. I didn't just decide one day, Oh! I want to make my life, her life and his life miserable and bitch about all this. No. I know what she is doing is shitty to him and it pisses me off because he is a great guy and a great dad. He does whatever he can for me and our daughter and he tries with his other daughter but his ex won't give him the chance. That is all we have been asking her for is a chance.

And Sharon, I may have to buy the cheap diapers, but they work a lot better than the expensive brand. I don't put a diaper that isn't decent on my child's butt. thanks.

[deleted account]

I know. That was part of my point. The 2 of them blame me for everything and 99% of it is simply not true.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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no offense Teresa...but I think your ex's wife disagrees (about you being a "good ex") ;P

[deleted account]

I want my ex to grow up for the sake of his kids too, but I highly doubt it's going to happen and I'm really not looking forward to having to continue dealing w/ him for the next 15.5 years, but that's what happens when you have kids w/ someone. You're stuck w/ them whether you're w/ them or not. Did you know this man had a child w/ another woman when you met him? What was the situation then? Why is your child more important to him (cuz I know why she's more important to you) than his first child?

Sorry for what you're going through here, but it sounds too much like my situation (though I'm a GOOD ex) for me to have much sympathy for you.


And since I know my response isn't very nice I'm going to stop it now before I turn it into my own vent. ;)

~Jennifer - posted on 11/06/2010

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...you want a chick that lives with her kid in a single wide with 8 other people to grow up?

....good luck with that.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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Actually, now that I think about it, I suspect it won't ever be done with, because I am still going to share weddings, grandchildren, etc with my ex........



Need a drink, that's depressing :P

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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Lacye, just for the record, I want for my ex to grow up and be an adult about stuff too, but I have been divorced from him for 11 years now, he is 42 years old, and if I try to contact him about anything in relation to our son, he either hangs up the phone or goes off the deep end. So as much as I hope this isn't the case for you, I just want to give you the heads up now that sometimes, they never grow up, and it becomes a situation you have to learn to live with. There have been many times over the years where I wish it would just be done with, but it will never be done with until my son is 18. Only another 5 years. I'm just being brutally honest. I am also a step-mother, so being on both sides of that fence, I can honestly say I know it sucks, but it never actually goes away. It gets easier though.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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You want her to grow up and do what??? drop off and pick up the child (cause you can't) or give you a gas card? (cause you can't afford to travel) or perhaps she should pay you to take them (like I do with my ex)... WHAT DO YOU REALLY WANT??? please...I am a divorced mother...spell it out to me...what (step by step) do you want? cause I don't get it.

Kate CP - posted on 11/06/2010

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*cringes* Kate. My name is Kate. Not Katie...Kate.

Sorry, that's a pet peeve of mine. :P

Amanda - posted on 11/06/2010

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I personally think that you should go talk to an attorney. Hear their legal side before making any further decisions. We can all sit here and say our sides and opinions but I think you're best bet is to ask a professional and hear something from them. Good Luck!!

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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i finally got what you are saying Jodi thanks.
No Katie i don't want a cookie. i'm on a diet. you can have it though.
Holly: we have been looking into Legal Aid and more than likely going to go with that. We don't even buy the expensive diapers for the child we share, we have to buy the ones from dollar general, which work better anyways. i understand that it's not cheap to have her here but we found out that she had a miscarriage recently and this was the first time we offered to have her for a week without her coming too. i wanted to be nice and try to be helpful but she got rude and snappy with me.
What we want Laura is for his ex to grow up and be an adult about it all. but it's not going to happen. what i want is for this whole mess to be done and over with so that will be one less thing we have to worry about. what i want is a little bit of understanding. but that's not going to happen either apparently.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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What do you even want? If you can't afford to visit her every other weekend, then you certainly can't afford to have her come visit you...and if you can't afford either of those you CERTAINLY can't afford a lawyer...this is ridiculous!

What do you WANT?

[deleted account]

I'm a little confused... obviously the child is not old enough for school yet (because of the talk of 1 week every month), but what are you guys planning to do for visitation when she starts school? This is something the judge will look at and ask you (especially if the child is getting close to school age - 3 or 4).



As for the court fees... does your state have what's called a fee waiver? It's a paper that you fill out with your income and expenses and if you make under a certain amount ALL court fees are waived. My hubby and I have one in California (we have full custody of our oldest, who is my stepdaughter). It's really nice knowing we can get all our court stuff done and filed without having to go into debt to do it. Also, there is always legal aid for free or cheap lawyers depending on your income and expenses (and where I live they are "real" lawyers that donate their time, not the "bottom of the barrel" lawyers that couldn't get any other job...).



Honestly, if making a trip down there once or twice a month would make it so hard on you guys that you wouldn;t be able to buy diapers, then you are either A) buying WAY too expensive diapers, or B) not financially fit to have the older child with you guys for any length of time. It is not cheap to feed, house, and clothe another child. Plus, you guys would have to drive out to get her and drive her home at the end of each visit (or at least halfway). The gas costs stack up on top of the cost of having an extra child in your home, even if it's just for one week every month...



I'm not trying to be mean here. These are things that you just HAVE to think about because I can guarantee that the judge will think about this stuff and ask for your future plans and financial ability. You guys need to be prepared and please listen to the other ladies (especially Laura and Jodi - like me, they have been through a lot in regards to custody battles and their advice is very sound). I know it's hard, and I know it sucks sometimes, but there are times that the truth hurts. No one likes to be told to suck it up, but honestly those exact words are some of the best advice I have ever gotten while dealing with the custody crap to keep our oldest daughter with us, where she belongs.

Kate CP - posted on 11/06/2010

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Layce, you've already answered your own questions. You can't afford it so you need to go on government assistance: do it. You have tried being civil and talking it out with her and it doesn't work: take her to court. What, exactly, are you hoping to get out of this? Would you like a cookie?

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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i'm sorry to hear about your husband's ex Sharon. it's not just about the money. it never has been. it's a part, don't get me wrong, but it's not all. if things don't go her way, she takes it out on my bf. even if it has nothing to do with him. she has told us before that we weren't ever allowed to see her again. and when her issues were finally settled out, then she would be nice again. it's just all the crap that we have taken from her and we have tried multiple times to talk rationally with her. but it never works.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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once again, should my child go with out diapers and me go to my family and beg for diaper money? as for the one week thing, we would only see her for maybe 6 or 7 hours a month if we went every other weekend to see her and if we had her for one week out of the month, that would be days to spend with her. which would you rather choose. and if she met us half way, which we have tried to arrange with her before, that would be great. but she doesn't. we have to drive that amount all the time. not just some of it.

[deleted account]

Take it to court. Even when parents are agreeable it's always best to have everything down in writing for future reference.

Sharon - posted on 11/06/2010

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Yeah - I was starting to lean the OPs way until this second page.

I agree the ex is being a bitch. If you want to fight her based on being allowed more visitation time, I get it.

But if this is bitch fest about money - you're so wrong.

When my husband was paying child support we didn't take a vacation, buy a new car, or anything like that.

We had to drive 8 hours to pick him up, drive 8 hours to take him back, pay for all his sports, pay for his health insurance, which his mother never used, then tried to send us the bills, fucking bitch.

With that and her committing multiple accounts of fraud we couldn't win jack shit in the way of custody. oh man she fucked up so many ways and she was a lousy mom, and a complete bitch to everyone around her. Her own child hates her and didn't want to live with her and as soon as he could he moved THOUSANDS of miles away. OOPS a little of my bitterness came through, lol. :: sigh :: it sucks.

Take her to court next spring for more visitation and travel to see her once a month, staying over night in a hotel room with a pool/jacuzzi and keep track of your expenses.

Arguing that it will save you money for the child to visit you will get you no where with the judge.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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But Layce, you also said you want her for one week a month....how are you going to afford that over a day trip once every other week?

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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the only thing we have left to sacrifice is what we have to buy for our daughter together. surely a judge will understand that. as i said, we try as much as possible to see her. if we got visitation, yeah, we would get her. maybe not more than one week out of a month but we would at least do that. we have tried to do that with her. but once again, she won't let the child come here without her coming too. and a lot of the times, at the last minute, she will say "we aren't coming. you will just have to deal with it." and when we have gone to get both of them, we drove all the way down there to pick her and the child up, they stayed for a week, drove them all the way back home, and then had to struggle for the next 2 weeks to make up for what we had to spend. yes we have sacrificed to see her. as i said earlier, i had to borrow money from my family so we would have things for our daughter and food.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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What needs of your daughter's are you sacrificing? You already explained that it actually WASN'T about the money (because we have established that it will cost more to have her for a week every month than to see her for a few hours every other weekend), so what are you sacrificing?

Just FYI, my husband's son lives 3 hours away. He drives 1 1/2 there and 1 1/2 hours back (to the half way point) every second Friday to pick him up, and 1 1/2 hours there and 1 1/2 hours back (to the halfway point) on Sunday to take him home. On weekends when his ex can't make it, he will drive all the way. He gives up 6 hours of driving time every second weekend to see his son. And sometimes, he gives up a lot more driving time than that.

And as I said, I don't understand what needs of your daughter's you'd be sacrificing?

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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to which the judge would reply "if you are not willing to sacrifice to see her, then why would you be willing to sacrifice to have her visit you in your home?"

Like I said, I don't make the rules...I just know how to play the game.

If you don't want to sacrifice to see his daughter then don't. Just don't blame it on anybody else either.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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like i said, we have tried that Laura. but how are we supposed to sacrifice things that our own daughter needs to go down there? my daughter should go on the back burner? i'm sorry. i can't do that. we are going to court, i will take your advice about the no lawyer, but i can't sacrifice my daughter's needs because his ex wants to act this way.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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What I am explaining to you is not what I assume...it's what the judge will assume.



if you do not sacrifice to visit her on a regular basis, the judge will assume that you do not intend on sacrificing to have her visit you regularly.



All I'm saying is...if you want to impress the judge and win your case...visit her as much as possible, regardless of the circumstances.



I don't make the rules up, I just know how to follow them.

Katherine - posted on 11/06/2010

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Do it. Then you won't have to worry about food and medical. You'll have the money for gas and he can prove he really does want to see his daughter. It may take a while so doit ASAP. They will also pay electric bills and rent.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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Jodi we try. we really do. but there's not much we can do when one minute she says it's ok and the next she says it's not and she doesn't want us to have anything to do with the child because we couldn't get up enough money to get down there. (yes i forgot to mention that part, sorry) i'm not trying to make excuses for us. it's not like we just don't care and don't want to go see her. we just don't have the money to go every other weekend. we have tried that and it didn't end very well. we had to borrow money from my family just to eat for a while and had to pay it all back when my grant money came in.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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how am i making excuses? you are asking questions and i'm answering them. you are obviously assuming way too much if you think he doesn't care. the fact of the matter is, he does. he gets upset about it all the time. but am i supposed to let my daughter go without because his ex wants to be unreasonable? we have scrimped and scraped for some extra money to go down there and see her. it's not like we don't try to see her at all. if that we didn't then yeah i would agree with you. but we do try. do we get to as often as we like? no because we have obligations here. so are you suggesting that we forget all of that just to go down there and starve when we get back? just for a few hours that we don't even really get to interact with her. would it really be worth it then to have to listen to my daughter cry because she's hungry?

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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court fees are something like $500...please.

You are making excuses now...clearly he doesn't feel like it's worth 7 hours driving to see his daughter for a few hours...fine...let her mother win.

why does it have to be one or the other...if you want a slam dunk in court, you HAVE to visit as much as you possibly can.

If you don't visit, she will tell the court that you don't care.

It really IS THAT simple.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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the thing about visiting her every other weekend, is the fact we would only have a few hours to spend with her. and not just with her. her mother would be there. and when she is with us, she doesn't let us hardly interact with her. yes it might be cheaper to go every other weekend to spend a few hours versus getting her for an entire week but it's not really worth it when we don't get to spend actual quality time with her. at least with the week we can spend time with her and interact with her without interference from his ex. and apparently the lawyers here are a lot cheaper than where you are from Laura. even if we don't have a lawyer, we would still have to pay court fees. do we have to have a lawyer, no we don't. but a lot of times it looks better if you have a lawyer. or at least that is what i've been told.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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My ex was literally TOLD by the judge to settle, but he dragged it out and fought EVERYTHING just to cost me money, because I had a lawyer and he didn't.



My lawyer also ripped me off though...don't spend any time chit chatting with him about whatever he wants to talk about...cause he's billing you for it.



as soon as I qualified for legal aid and my lawyer was free, he settled.

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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I think I have spent about the same as you have on lawyers Laura.......and the only reason we didn't spend more is because we came to an agreement before it went to the court for a full hearing (because HIS lawyer told him he didn't have a leg to stand on with his claims), and we only had to appear before the judge to have the agreement put on record. The second time I only spent $2000 because my ex decided not to show up, so they gave me everything I asked for and more. So yeah, it could have been VERY expensive had it needed to go to a full hearing.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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and before you say it...it doesn't matter if it's for visitation or custody...it only matters how many hours your lawyer spends on your case, and IF his ex is being difficult, you could be spending even more than I did...instead of just visiting more often and going to court without a lawyer.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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and if you just visit more often you can save $$$ I don't know how much you THINK lawyers cost...but when I fought for custody, I spent over $10 000.



If you can file for visitation without a lawyer WHICH YOU CAN, and you will be successful if you visit more often, why would you prefer to spend that kind of money on a lawyer over gas money for visitation?

Jodi - posted on 11/06/2010

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I don't get it. You are proposing having her for one week a month, and you can afford that (including feeding her and clothing her, etc for that week), but you can't afford the fuel to visit every other weekend for a day trip? I'm kind of with Laura on that one....I'm not sure I quite understand how you can afford one and not the other.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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we aren't talking about every other weekend. for now all we could actually afford is once a month, which isn't enough but until i get my degree it will have to do. Yes we have thought this through. We want to have her in our lives, very much so. The main problem is she will not let us do that.

Yes Erin that's what we are having the trouble with. we are wanting to go to court to have this finalized and worked through. We wanted to do it civilly but she's not giving us a chance to do it. We don't have the money for gas and really don't have the money for a bus ticket for us to go down there. That is the only reason why we aren't going down there. If we had the money we would go. We have even offered to meet her half way and go to a park and play for a while. but she won't agree to that either. we have tried everything we can think of. we have even gone out of our way to try and work something out where it won't be breaking us and would still work for her. she just won't agree to anything we have tried.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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If you can't afford to drive to visit her every other weekend now...how do you propose to pick her up every other weekend for visitation...and then feed her.

Are you sure you have thought this through?

Ez - posted on 11/06/2010

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If your boyfriend wanted to see that child, he would. Driving a few hours each way would be no deterrent for a lot of fathers. What is it you can't afford? The petrol? Take a bus. Make it happen. His first child should not miss out because he has now set up a new family.



In saying that, go to court and get it all formalised. Until there are official visitation arrangements made, access will be at the mother's discretion as she is the primary caregiver.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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he affords the kids he has. i'm not saying he can't. but we don't have the money to drive down there every other week. the only reason why we are thinking about getting a lawyer is because tax season is coming up soon and that is what we are going to use to take her to court with. we aren't so stupid as to do it when we don't have the spare money. and my point of the whole matter is, we don't have the money to go down there and see her for just a few hours even if we don't take her to court. we are not rich people, we aren't in the hole but we aren't rich people. We have enough to send the child support and still have food and able to buy the daughter we share what she needs but we do not have the money to go down there every other week and see her for a few hours and then turn around and come back. on top of that we don't have the opportunity for that either since i'm a college student and he works all weekend. during the week, i'm in classes, and on the weekend, he works. all we want is to be able to get her for like a week once a month so we can spend time with her and see her and enjoy her like we do our daughter and we would take her back. that's all we want. and that's what we are trying to take her to court for.

Isobel - posted on 11/06/2010

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As a divorce mother myself, I would suggest that yes...he shouldn't have made anymore children if he couldn't afford the one he has...sorry.

I said that you don't even need a lawyer though, just go to court, tell the judge that the mother is withholding access and he will be granted access. If she then she can be held in contempt of court and possibly arrested.

I don't understand how driving a few hours every other week would take anything away from your daughter...hiring a lawyer would certainly take more away from her than just paying for gas every other week. And you won't need a lawyer if you spend the time to drive out every other weekend (or every weekend if it were MY kids) in order to look like a star in the eyes of the court.

Sorry, I just don't understand the problem here.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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the only reason why it's legal Kathrine is because in the state i live in, we have to take her to actual court to get visitation rights set. we only had to go through the department of human services to get the child support set up. that is the only reason why she is getting away with it. we want to get custody of her but where we live is considered a "mother's state" meaning most of the time, the court system is going to side with the mother in custody hearings unless we can prove she is an unfit mother but all we have is hearsay and it will not hold up in court.

Lacye - posted on 11/06/2010

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Laura



she took him to DHS, that's how he ended up paying child support. we are planning on taking her to court, as i said above. we just wanted to try to work it out like adults, which is also something i said above. but please tell me how we are expected to go and see her for just a few hours when we are making ends meat as it is? he and I also share a child together. should we take away from her because the mother of his other child is being a douche bag? If we had the money, we would be down there seeing her. seeing as we don't, well i think you get my point on that one.

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