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Joanna - posted on 08/07/2010

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There in no way should be a restriction on how many a person can have. It's a right for a woman to do with her body as she chooses.

That being said, to me if you have more than one or two, personally I'd think you aren't the sharpest crayon in the box, to not understand birth control.

Lyndsay - posted on 08/11/2010

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I think that, at that point, the abortion clinic needs to be offering them something different. Like installing a free IUD on the way out or something.

Kimberly - posted on 08/09/2010

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"You have one abortion and learn from it (I'm not talking about abortions advised by doctors or rape or whatever..."

one thing i have never understood, if a person views abortion as murder or taking a life (i, personally, don't) isn't it still murder whether the woman was raped or the pregnancy is making her sick? what makes those situations different and the abortions in those situation different? maybe i'm just playing devils advocate, and i've never had an abortion myself, but if one believes an abortion is murder than the circumstances leading up to it are irrelevant, its always murder.

i think abortion is a tough decision for almost everyone. i do find myself wondering about women who have had multiple abortions because they accidentally got pregnant and for no other reason. i think with rights come responsibility and that abortion should be safe legal and rare. i'd probably look at a woman who's had mulitiple abortions due to irresponsibility as, well, irresponsible. there could be a little judgement in there, mainly because a woman who puts herself in that predicament over and over shows an amazing lack of respect for herself. birth control fails, health ailments creep up, but if you don't wanna be pregnant do everything you can to prevent it. i learned my lesson after my first and only whoopsie. if you do wanna be pregnant and find yourself unable to continue your pregnancy, my sympathies to you.

every child should be a wanted child. i believe children being unwanted and in some cases viewed as a punishment for sex is why there is so much abuse toward children in this world.

Charlie - posted on 08/09/2010

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So April , because her birth control failed its her mistake ?

Sorry but if she was taking precaution and still fell pregnant , and it does happen , its not her "mistake " .

I have two sons through failed birth control it happens all the time , if she cannot afford the child she probably cannot afford the pregnancy .

April - posted on 08/10/2010

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@ Loureen...even if the first time was due to failed birth control, it is certaintly a problem to have multiple cases of failed birth control. so i guess she should keep on having abortions because that's the only method that's worked for her? get pregnant on the pill...have an abortion. condom breaks...have an abortion is that how it works??

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Lacrecia - posted on 08/22/2010

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i would def look at them diffrent, and i wuould wonder how they could just keep doing it. i don't think their should be restriction because i don't want anyone to tell me what i can or can't do with my body. however i do think that a woman going back to the abortion clinic back and fourth like its a causly day a her fav store or something should be advised to seek councling.

Jessica - posted on 08/22/2010

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I would definitely look at them differently. I would then proceed to give them a LOAD of condoms and give them a stern talking to. I'm not against abortion per se, but it should NEVER be used as a form of contraception, which they are obviously doing.

Kimberly - posted on 08/14/2010

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i feel you, emma. i had a great pregnancy, no complications or anything, but i have ZERO desire to be pregnant ever again! i want to adopt and skip over potty training and everything, lol.

Danielle - posted on 08/11/2010

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I think a three strikes and you're out limit should be placed in effect. Especially where I live because it's covered here and you don't even have to pay for it.

Charlie - posted on 08/11/2010

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April - If thats what she has to do for her particular situation then thats what she had to do .

The right to abort and reasons for it is not black and white , there are all areas of grey , situations we may not know or understand and quiet frankly its none of our buisness , most people do not take the decision to abort lightly , its a very heavy decision and one most people live with everyday without having other random strangers judging them, no one likes the women who abuse the right to have a choice and its hard not to judge them but it doesnt mean all people who have had more than one abortion do it as birth control or make the decision as lightly as discarding the days trash , try not to judge on face value because unless we know them personally we will never know the full extent of their story .

Maggie - posted on 08/10/2010

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it would depend on the circumstance of the pregnancy. i feel it's an individual choice and i respect that but careless pregnancy when the couple know they do not want a baby results in judgement. i know too many people who cannot get pregnant or who are unable to carry full term to not be upset by the irresponsibility.

Stifler's - posted on 08/10/2010

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I wasn't talking about kids that aren't babies, I was talking about babies. Sorry. I was looking up adoption because I hate being pregnant. I'd love to be a foster mum or something.

Kimberly - posted on 08/10/2010

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@emma-- there may be more ppl wanting to adopt babies than there are babies to adopt, but the reality is the majority of kids who need to be adopted AREN'T BABIES.

Louise - posted on 08/10/2010

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All I can say to this ladies is there are some women out there that abuse the system and use abortion as a quick fix rather than taking care of there contraception needs. Most abortions are to women that are single or not in a stable relationship and these women should be thinking pill and condom for protection. How many people have fallen pregnant using to methods of contraception? I know accidents happen and this nobody is judging. But a person that has an accident 4/5 times is either very unlucky or irresponsible. I am sure this debate will go on for months.

April - posted on 08/10/2010

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i wasn't intending to be mean and was even giving the benefit of the doubt. i did say that i am sure it wasn't what she intended. i am sure she didn't lay awake at night and say to herself "ooh! everytime i get pregnant by accident, i'm going to have an abortion". i'm certain that is not how she was thinking. but thinking and doing are sometimes different things.



on the other side of the coin, i was not trying to be nice either. i was trying to be honest.



Hannah, I'm sorry if i hurt your feelings or made you feel like you were being judged personally. IMO judging you would be like calling you a bad name, but judging your actions by saying it was wrong is totally different.

[deleted account]

Each to there own but as a mother already,i would be fit for the mental if i killed my unborn doing what i felt was right and the best outcome for all but killing a unborn child is to much for me..i wouldnt kill someone standing in front of me i wont kill an innocent baby who didnt ask to be there.I would of made that choice for them and i wont make the choice to kill them..i would break my back working to make ends meat and provide what was needed for him/her and my other children.I would of got myself into the mess i wont take the easy way out,its hard but an easy solution as there's no child to provide her at the end of the day with abortion for those who use it as birth control and simply dont care and many are like that believe me.

.I grew up in care and my experience wasnt Rosie but many families are good parents who will do a good job and if push came to shove i would adopt but knowing me id take on the responsibility to do it myself.I dont expect others to feel the same,we all do what we are comfortable doing and for many the will do anything but abort and how can you tell them there wrong..just like i cant tell someone who does it there wrong.

[deleted account]

Emma, on the adoption issue babies are harder to adopt (I can only speak from within the UK) because they are rarer - generally parents do not choose to give up their babies at birth many mums try to look after them and either have them removed from their care or give them up after a couple of years because they cannot cope. Also a lot of babies are cared for by family members that are not the parents so they never go into the system.

MOST people who are in a situation to adopt want to adopt a baby, which means there are huge waiting lists for them as there are so few to adopt. Babies are generally around 1 year old before they can be adopted as well due to the legal ramifications of having babies adopted (if they are being removed the parents can fight the decision, and if they are being given up the parents have a cooling off period before they can be adopted). This may be why people consider adopting from abroad.

Preference is given to people who are willing to adopt a disabled child (many children to be adopted are disabled to some extent due to the circumstances that lead to them being in the system) or sibling groups (this is the fastest way to get a baby - have a baby and their older brother or sister who is about 3).

This leads to many unwanted children in the system because when babies reach a certain age people are less likly to want them, as they are less likely to choose a disabled baby because they want their child to be perfect.

C. - posted on 08/10/2010

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"Is there a difference between judging someone personally and judging their actions?"

Yes, there is. Judging someone's actions is completely different from judging them as a person. For instance, a friend of mine likes to go out and party all the time, despite getting DUIs and crap.. Do I still love her for her? Yes. Do I still think she is a good person? Yes. Do I think she makes the best choices all the time? No.

You're never going to not judge someone. No matter how highly you think of yourself, there will always be a point in time where EVERYONE makes a judgement about someone or their actions. It does not mean you think of them as a horrible person, it just means you think they could have possibly done something better or different to avoid certain situations.

You know.. I really love how people say they wouldn't judge.. But then how many time are those same people talking about someone's weight, haircolor, clothing, etc.. Nobody is perfect and yes everyone makes a judgement now and then. It does not mean we think those people are horrible in any way, it just means we don't agree with something. And guess what? Nobody is ever going to agree with everything or everyone 100% of the time.

Kimberly - posted on 08/10/2010

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In fiscal year 2000, 150,703 Foster children were adopted in the United States, many by their foster parents or relatives of their biological parents. (wiki)

Approximately 120,000 children are adopted each year in the United States. (aacp.org)

according to the gutmacher institute, approximately 50% of pregnancies are unintended/unwanted. there could be way more adoptions, but there aren't. to me, that says something.

Kimberly - posted on 08/10/2010

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By adopting children within the U.S. these will generally be infants who are African-American Hispanic, or of mixed race. Caucasian children are usually dealt with by private Adoption agencies and not put up for public .

"The 2000 Census tells us there are 281,421,906 Americans; it was the first Census to count "adopted children in the household." However, until mid-2003, the Census withheld that data for 3 years. It was then finally estimated, for 1 out of every 6 households counted, that :

1.6-million "adopted children" are under age 18, or "born since the 1980s";

1.4-million were domestic adoptions;

200,000 (13%) of the adopted children were foreign-born;

47,555 - from Korea

21,053 - from China

19,631 - from Russia

18,000 - from Mexico

7,793 - from India

2.5% of the U.S. population is estimate to be adopted children;

2.5% are estimated to be age 18 or over;

4.4-million step-kids are under 18, or

5% of the population is estimated to be step-children

-2000 U.S. Census"

Stifler's - posted on 08/09/2010

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I was looking it up the other day for some reason and there was some spiel on a government site about more people wanting to adopt than there are babies up for adoption hence why it's such a long slow process.

Kimberly - posted on 08/09/2010

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@emma- there are thousands of couples waiting to adopt, but millions of unwanted pregnancies each year that are carried to term. how does that equate out to the stats you're thinking of?

♏*PHOENIX*♏ - posted on 08/09/2010

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@ Emma....I think you are right, but is not adopting babies from other countries….it seems more people like to adopt from other parts of the world instead of in there own “Backyard”
What statistic are you speaking of??

Stifler's - posted on 08/09/2010

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@ Kimberly... the statistics actually say there's more people wanting to adopt than babies to be adopted.

Ava - posted on 08/09/2010

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Four abortions is excessive. The person needs to invest in birth control of some sort, regardless of your position on abortion or "reasons they may have we don't know". If you've been raped and gotten pregnant four times, again, *get some fucking birth control* if you're not going to go to the police about it. There's NO excuse for having four abortions and not doing anything about it. Mirena could fix that in a ten minute gynecological exam. It would certainly be cheaper than having four abortions. ;)

Kimberly - posted on 08/09/2010

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also, on the issue of adoption: it is ideally an option, but the reality is that our systems are filled with kids that no one wants or will adopt. i couldn't take that risk with a child i loved enough to want to give it a better life. the chance that they grow up in the system only to be booted out with only bus fare on their 18th birthday.

adoption is a noble idea, but the reality is that it doesn't happen often enough, and when it does people are often going to other countries because our adoption process is FUBAR.

Kimberly - posted on 08/09/2010

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having an abortion does not increase your chances for cancer, or make you more likely to have miscarriages later. having an abortion is LESS dangerous than carrying a pregnancy to term, medically speaking. just wanted to clear that up.

Kimberly - posted on 08/09/2010

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most doctors won't tie your tubes if you've never had children. i asked them to tie my tubes during my c-section with my one and only child, i was 23, and they refused. said i was too young. they certainly wouldn't have done it if i'd never been pregnant before. they always ask "what if you change your mind?"

if i change my mind i'll adopt. the love i have to give to children doesn't hinge on them being biologically connected to me.

Lindsay - posted on 08/09/2010

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Something just popped in my head. I hear people saying that one excuse is acceptable to get an abortion and others are not. I think we all need to remember that we don't know what someone else is going through. We may think we know, but we don't. Even if someone claims that they have an abortion for an unwanted pregnancy, there could be so many underlying factors. In some cases, maybe a woman was raped by a family member and is too embarrassed for the world to know. Sometimes maybe it's easier for someone to claim an unwanted pregnancy when they don't want the entire world to know what's really going on....just a thought...

Charlie - posted on 08/09/2010

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This thread has many posts that are a great example of judging a situation before knowing the exact reasons for her pregnancies , if there were to be restrictions what would be the choice for a young girl being sexually assaulted in her home , perhaps by a family member , she continuously falls pregnant , third time pregnant then what ? you must have your fathers child ? just one example of many circumstances that need a woman to exercise her right to abort .

Ava - posted on 08/09/2010

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I wouldn't look at them the same; they're using it as a form of birth control, obviously, which is wrong flat out. I wouldn't treat them different outwardly, but I can't promise I'd still appreciate them the same.

Shelley - posted on 08/09/2010

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April.

"Hannah...i don't judge you personally but i do judge your actions. this was something that happened to you more than once. i don't believe in making the same mistake twice. and to make the same mistake more than once with the same solution (abortion)...that's using abortion as birth control. even if that's not what you intended."



Did you read what you wrote?

I wish i could have it all together like you.

Is there a difference between judging someone personally and judging their actions?

I feel that your post came across really mean.

Sharon - posted on 08/09/2010

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Agree with Loureen.

I'm sorry but I could never adopt out my child to strangers. I just don't have that kind of faith in strangers.

If I took a pregnancy test today & it were positive, I'd schedule an abortion asap. Our finances, my new job, our current house, all go against having another child right now.

Catherine - posted on 08/09/2010

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I will start that although some people would call me pro-life, I consider myself to be pro-birth control. In this day and age, we should not be seeing the sheer number of unwanted pregnancies that we do. That being said, one concern I haven't seen here is that an abortion is a major medical procedure, and one that could possibly have serious consequences for the woman. It raises your risks for breast cancer, cervical and ovarian cancers, and complications with later pregnancies that you might want to carry to term, and some of these risks increase significantly the more abortions a woman has. Personally, I think adoption is an underutilized option in this country. My father was adopted by a loving couple who could not have children of their own, and he had a great life, and there are thousands of couples who have to wait for years to adopt an infant. I don't believe that women should have to raise a child they don't want, but I do hope that more women will consider options besides abortion when they find themselves in that situation.

April - posted on 08/09/2010

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hannah...i don't judge you personally but i do judge your actions. this was something that happened to you more than once. i don't believe in making the same mistake twice. and to make the same mistake more than once with the same solution (abortion)...that's using abortion as birth control. even if that's not what you intended.

April - posted on 08/09/2010

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having mutiple abortions is what i call using abortion as a form of birth control. that's wrong.

yes, there should be a restriction on how many you can have, but that restriction can be put aside in special circumstances. if you were raped all 4 times, ok. but just to let everyone know...although i am pro choice, i am not pro abortion and would never get one even if i were raped

[deleted account]

If i got pregnant and truly couldn't afford to raise him/her..i could live with giving the child up to be raised by parents who can afford to bring the child up and love it like there own....what i couldn't live with is having him/her ripped from my womb.My way of thinking.I dont judge anybody and i feel for all who have gone through it..i dont assume its a walk in the park even for the ladies who may use it as a form of contraception.No one is perfect.

Sh** happens as the say.

[deleted account]

I know a few people who have had one abortion in the past. I only know of one person that has had 2 (or maybe 3) now and I could not knowingly associate w/ someone who is still doing that. If it's in the past and they have changed their lives... sure, but w/ how strongly I feel about abortion I couldn't be around someone who is still having them.

[deleted account]

I think I'm pro choice, for medical or unforeseen circumstances. I don't like that some people use it as birth control and I personally could never do it, but I can't stop others since it is their life to live.

I know three people in total that have had an abortion. My mother had one at 16, by force of her mother, and another at 30-something because she didn't want to be trapped with a bad guy. An acquaintance got pregnant twice while using condoms and the pill, aborted both, then got pregnant because she wanted to give her dad a grandchild before he passed. Another friend got 6, that's right 6, all in high school. She had a son 2 years ago to trap her rich boyfriend into marriage and is now trying for another, which she is finding difficult.

Some circumstances, you just have to shake your head at. My mother, she did what she had to do, I guess. Do I like it, no but it isn't my choice. The other two I call idiots.

Sharon - posted on 08/09/2010

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Honestly - everyone should have an abortion - its actually good for you. and the human race - ultimately.

I am pro choice - not "pro abortion" - people who do not believe abortion should be an option are antichoice, slave owners. "you can't do that because "I" said so." "yes massah"

Hannah - posted on 08/09/2010

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I have had two abortions. Do you judge me? For no other reason than stupidity and failed birth control. I live with the guilt every day. I currently have an IUD and DO NOT want any other children. If I were to get pregnant, I would probably have a third. I cannot afford to have another child. I would hate to have that option taken away from me because others judge.

Jenny - posted on 08/09/2010

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I got pregnant on the pill with my first and know two people who have been pregnant with IUD's and had abortions. It's fairly common actually.

Louise - posted on 08/09/2010

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It is a womans rights to do with her body what she wants but ............ I would ask them not to tell me about it if it was a common event. Thee is no need to become repeatedly pregnant in this day and age. yes accidents do happen and peoples circumstances do change so one or possibly two you could sympathise with but 4/5 no this is just stupidity. I would judge somebody who was this irresponsible I mean how difficult is it to put a pill in your mouth every day or have an IUD fitted please!

C. - posted on 08/09/2010

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"Well good for you, I'll mail you a cookie"



Thanks, I'll send you my new address :P



"If someone doesn't WANT to have a child that is a good enough reason to not have one."



Um, if they had enough self control, that would be easy.. Don't have sex! If you don't want a baby that badly.. It should be relatively easy to figure out the most effective way NOT to get pregnant.



"Personally, I think it's reckless to complete a pregnancy before deciding if you can handle raising it. "



Nobody said anything about completing a pregnancy before deciding if you can handle it, Jenny.



Personally, I think it's reckless to use abortion as a form of birth control, or even at all, for that matter, but that's kind of another debate.

Shelley - posted on 08/08/2010

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i know these are extenuating circumstances but i'd like to share this anyway.
A really close friend of mine got involved with a guy in a bikie gang everything was fine untill she fell pregnant at 17 with his baby when she told him he took her to a friend of his who worked in a brothel and she aborted the baby with no medical knowledge an non medical equiptment they plied her with drugs and alcohol so she didn't really know what they were going to do or what they did. Over time he became abusive really possesive and wanted a child so she had a little boy 9 months after the abortion. after the baby everything got better untill one of the bikie guys became interested in her. Her partner noticed what was going on and decided that she needed to be taught a lesson her lesson was that she was held down and forced to do a train. This led to another abortion in a clinic the gang decided that they enjoyed her so much that this became fairly regular 1 more abortion then she fell pregnant again and her partner got drunk and took her outside and beat her which happened often this time he broke her skull in 3 places and her nose she went to hospital and finally someone asked if she needed help. she moved states changed her name and moved on with her life she is now married with a third baby.
Yes she made some poor decisions eg her boyfriend the bikie gang drugs ect but she grieves for those babies she aborted.
So to answer the question if someone has had 3-4 abortions i don't look at them or judge them i figure they've had a harder life than i have.

Jenny - posted on 08/08/2010

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Well good for you, I'll mail you a cookie. If someone doesn't WANT to have a child that is a good enough reason to not have one. Personally, I think it's reckless to complete a pregnancy before deciding if you can handle raising it. If you don't have intentions of raising that child till they are self sufficient DON'T have it in the first place.

C. - posted on 08/08/2010

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You can't say that she'd have been a horrible mother at all.. She didn't even try! Heck, Jenny.. At the time I got pregnant, I had long decided I didn't want kids b/c I just wanted to do anything and everything that I desired when I deisred to do so. I got pregnant and the first couple months I was wondering what kind of mom I was going to be. I decided I was going to be the best mom I could possibly be and I am doing a fantastic job. Even some of my closest friends and family have noticed such a huge change from before I had my son to now and they couldn't be more proud- and yes, they have told me that, I'm not just pulling that out of my butt.

IMO, you have to CHOOSE to be a great mother and do the right thing. It doesn't just happen, you have to decide you are going to do what's right. And using abortions as a form of birth control is just wrong.

Jenny - posted on 08/08/2010

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No I wouldn't judge them. Who the hell am I to have an opinion on another woman's uterus? Maybe we should be thankful she wasn't a terrible mother to four kids she didn't want.

Stifler's - posted on 08/08/2010

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I'm pro choice, I respect your choice to not get pregnant if you don't want kids. Seriously, it's not that hard to not get pregnant.

Jane - posted on 08/08/2010

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Yes, i would look at them differently but no, I don't think there should be restrictions on how many. I am pro-choice (not pro-abortion) and 100% believe in a woman's right to choose, however, I would absolutely look at someone who's had 3 or 4 abortions as stupid and oblivious and would not want to associate with someone like that. I understand accidental pregnancies...except abstinence, nothing is 100% effective but come on...if you've had an abortion once...I'll go even twice and you 'accidentally' get pregnant again, maybe it's time to either have your tubes tied or close your damn legs.

Sharon - posted on 08/08/2010

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Honestly - i would feel a bit bad for that person that the potential for life has so little meanin but ultimately - I'd be glad and grateful that they didn't just birth a kid that they didn't want.

Krista - posted on 08/08/2010

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I think the whole point is that we DON'T know what someone's situation is. There could have been rapes, or fetal abnormalities, or anything like that. That's why instead of judging, I would be concerned. And if it was someone I knew well, I'd ask what was going on. And if there was a lack of knowledge on her part, I'd do my best to educate her and help her out. If it was due to phenomenally bad luck, then I'd commiserate with her. And if she told me it was none of my business, I'd respect that.

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