Is this a crock or is it just me?!

Kate CP - posted on 01/25/2011 ( 40 moms have responded )

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http://video.foxnews.com/v/4508326/epidu...

http://eon.businesswire.com/news/eon/201...

I have no problem with women who choose to use an epidural but this whole article and video gets under my skin. Now we're supposed to believe that epidurals DON'T lead to an increase in c-section rates, despite all the evidence that they DO? We're supposed to believe now that it's riskier to deliver naturally (less oxygen to the baby and to mom) than without drugs? Does this smell to any one else?!

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Sarah - posted on 01/26/2011

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I don't think mine is going to be a popular view! lol!

I'm not going to proclaim that I know whether epidurals increase the chances of a C-section, because I don't know, although a few random pages I googled seemed to say that it doesn't increase the chance, so there's some chance that there's some truth to it.

I do agree with the point that women shouldn't be made to feel guilty or "less of a woman" for having an epidural. Women should be free to manage their pain how they see fit, whether through medical or natural ways.

I also feel that some women (like me! lol) genuinely benefited from having an epidural, I don't know how I would have coped or continued on without my epidural!! I LOVED it!!

I personally believe that for SOME women, it IS riskier to have a totally natural birth than to have an epidural. I think some women just can't cope with the pain as well as others, and that for them, an epidural can do the world of good for their overall well being at the time.

I've nothing against natural birth, but it wasn't for me at all. I think that taking away some of the stigma and guilt from epidurals is a good thing. :)

Sarah - posted on 01/27/2011

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Yeah, I certainly don't think that all women should have to have an epidural! In the same way that I feel not all women should have to have a natural birth.

Different women feel they need different things.

Personally, I think so long as Mum and baby are happy and healthy at the end of it, it's all good! :)

Tia Melissa - posted on 01/27/2011

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It's not difficult to Google ( don't you live that it's a verb now?) and find out that being on your back, immobile and pushing in the classic C is the least effective way to delivery a baby! Closing the pelvis causes babies to get stuck behind the pubic bone, swelling and tears to the perineum. Epidurals are used to block pain that could be more manageable with mobility, access to showers and such. I don't blame an epidural for the rise in c-sections but the whole mindset of hospitals, doctors and the medical community at large on labor & delivery. A hospital is where necessary but invasive procedures occur. They do things on their time, at their convenience to save or improve the lives of people. In most cases, L&D does not require intervention.

Thank goodness, however, that we DO have hospitals and anesthesia available for those that do need it to safely have their babies. Thank goodness that the SOP is no longer to put the mother into "twilight sleep" to deliver either. We've come a long way from mother/infant mortality due to lack of medical methods and from complete maternal incapacity during delivery practiced in the 40's. Just a little further to the middle and we'll be all right.

Lady Heather - posted on 01/26/2011

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I chose to give birth on my back with the stirrups. We tried lots of stuff and that was the one I liked. hahaha. I also had an IV and monitors on myself and a monitor on the baby (high risk and low oxygen), but no epi.

There are just so many variations to labour and so many different responses to pain. I found the pain useful rather than stressful. Others feel differently. Because there's so much variability no doctor should be able to say there's a cookie cutter answer for every woman. That's what's really wrong with this - the idea that there is one right way.

User - posted on 01/26/2011

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Ooops, sorry, I had to leave the room and hadn't realised my daughter had posted my last post before I'd finished. What I was saying was I feel for the obstetrician whose job is made a little bit more difficult by those pesky women who won't just lie still to give birth. Of course, giving birth is all about the doctor's convenience and not about the woman's choice.

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[deleted account]

So ive never heard that epi's or anything else cause increase of c-section. That idk i havent done the research but to say that natural childbirth is riskier than one with drugs is really weird seems crazy to me. but like some mothers have said that when doing it naturally baby can be "stuck" for hours and i do believe that does cause a danger to the baby so i dont know if introducing drugs would lower that risk. I waited till 8cm to get an epi and i felt a lil "forced" and pushed to get one. But my baby came out fast and next if it happens the same way i wanna deliver naturally with no drugs at all. i dont think an epi should be mandatory but i think that the mother should know that it will always be used if the baby is in danger and delivering without an epi is no longer an option

[deleted account]

sounds fishy to me. i had a natural birth with my Julie. actual delivery only lasted one hour. very little pain even though i was induced and had no meds. i was scared to get an epidural because i didn't want a needle in my spine Dx it scared the hell out of me, especially since the nurses who put my IV in sucked and had to stick me twice. (ooh, just noticed i have a scar from that...)

god, if i couldn't have felt my legs or the baby going through, i wouldn't have been able to do it. i wasn't feeling any pain when pushing anyway so i wasn't pushing enough, but started feeling it when i ripped and then it was over.

glad i didn't use an epidural, i don't ever want to use one.

i think my friend who was due the same day but was induced after her due date had an epidural, and she had a c-section. but her baby's head was turned wrong, so i guess that makes a difference...

Cassie - posted on 01/27/2011

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I had an epi with my first and it was a horrible experience. It made my labor and delivery so much more complicated and difficult (but it was only one factor in a very difficult delievery). One issue is that, because I could not feel anything from the epi, I just pushed. I had no idea where or how to push so I just pushed with everything I had. I ended up tearing several muscles in my back and couldn't shower or walk without assistance for weeks. It made recovery so difficult. After that, I decided that for any subsequent children, I would not have an epi.

I didn't have an epi with Emma. It was my dream delivery and went so much more smoothly than my delivery of Kiera.

I don't think any differently of women who choose and love epidurals. If that is the delivery they want, then it is what is perfect for them. It is unfair and wrong, however, to suggest that all women should have an epidural and are endangering their children if they don't.

Minnie - posted on 01/27/2011

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*sigh* Candi, no one is saying that a woman shouldn't have an epidural if she wants one. Yes there are risks to intervention. It often works well for those who want it, sometimes it doesn't. But no one is saying that you're a bad mother to have one.



What the doctor in the article is saying is that every woman SHOULD have an epidural and to not have one would be dangerous.



What makes you think that those who don't like the epidural haven't had one? I've had one very interventionistic birth, with an epidural and a homebirth.



I call BS to you saying that a woman can't become educated on childbirth and the risks of interventions through the internet (because you say it's edited). Ive got an extensive library dealing with the subject of childbirth, both physiological and interventionistic, and I assure you, that same information is available online.

Cyndel - posted on 01/27/2011

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"If it was unsafe then they wouldnt make it available."
I'm sorry but this comment is a little naive. If you look at the history of medicine and pregnancy/birth their are many interventions and medications that have been given to pregnant and birthing moms that have deformed, and caused other problems including death because of lack of research of the effects of these drugs and procedures on the unborn.
Trust experts, but don't do so blindly.

Stifler's - posted on 01/27/2011

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They don't even DO epidurals at the hospital I gave birth in unless you're having a c-section. I find it hard to believe that not having an epidural is going to cause serious problems for everyone. I didn't have one and I was fine.

Candi - posted on 01/27/2011

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I think this is all BS. I had an epidural and a c-section. Im baffled by what some of you are saying. I think if it never happened to you whether it be an epidural or a c-section then I think you shouldnt even be downing other who have it. We as woman and mothers are giving that right to choose what we want. If it was unsafe then they wouldnt make it available. With most obgyns, doctors and hospitals they all want you to try to have a vaginal birth whether natural or with an epidural and its the womans body that cant have the vaginal birth. I had a very tipped uterious and could not deliver vaginal so where in the world is that the epidurals fault? It not its the womans body. So I think you all should know all the facts and as woman should all know that everyones body is different. I dont give an rats ass what the fucking internet says about it. Call your obgyn and ask them all this BS and you WONT get the same answers. EVERYTHING on the internet is edited. For instants the internet says that once your mucas plug falls out you will go into labor with in 24-48 hourss, BS mine fell out and I NEVER went into labor I had to be induced almost a WEEK later and I wasnt even dilated 1 cm i was O. As for the epidural leading to Postpardum is a crock of shit that has nothing to do with, you cant control if you get Postpardum. It doesnt cause you not to be able to breastfeed or have any problems with it.I know many people who have had an epidural and still breastfed their kids with out a problem. Of course the anesthesiologist is going to recommend you get an epidural because he wants the money for you getting one duh. And if you have an obgyn that is mad or keeps pressuring you to have an epidural against your belief then you should get a new one. My obgyn respects ALL my choices and abides by them. She has all the patients in the world for what ever you choose. Any good obgyn isnt going to care how long delivery takes as long as the baby isnt in any danger.

Amanda: "Though I think a woman shouldnt have guilt if she does have an epi, its insane to say giving birth without an Epi is dangeours."
No I have no guilt and NEVER EVER will it was my choice and I live in America and have that right. I dont think giving birth i dangerous and just because one person who thinks that your going to take it out on everyone that had one. I give ever mother out there that had a 100% natural birth credit because it has to be the most painful thing any one could ever experience.

As you can tell this subject got touchy for me as I read on with all the comments. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but if you never experienced it then you dont have an opinion you have a judgment. And Judgmental people DISGUST ME most of the comments on here never had an epidural or a c-section and I think you guys should have never posted anything because you have nothing to back up your judgment.

Sharon - posted on 01/26/2011

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I had 3 epis.



All THREE worked perfectly.



I had three perfect babies with no breathing issues.



All three were vaginal births.



I only had depression after one birth and that was most likely due to our circumstances at the time (which were pretty shitty) rather than the fact that I had an epidural.

Cyndel - posted on 01/26/2011

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BTW...If you want an epi go for it, but do the research first. Never make medical decisions without researching both sides and weighing the pros and cons before hand.

Cyndel - posted on 01/26/2011

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In general epi's so increase the risks of a c-section. However their are cases when it can help, when a mother is so overwhelmed by long difficult labor that the relief can actually progress labor instead of stalling it. But in most cases it does cause problems.
But usually most of the problems come from an impatient doctor who just wants to go home, or wants something to do because with a normal pregnancy and delivery the doctor is only needed for encouragement and to catch the baby. So he feels helpless and unnecessary. Anyway, Interventions are usually unnecessary.

Carolyn - posted on 01/26/2011

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I'm not surprised at this at all. Foxnews is the same channel that has "informed" people about diabetes by lumping Type 1 and 2 together, making people think that Type 1 is 1) curable and 2) preventable by diet control and exercise. They run with news topics that will stir up the public because they know that if they public tunes in, they get more money for air time. There's a simple solution - block the channel and just hit "ignore." lol.

[deleted account]

Wow what a load of shit, Epidurals lead to more intervention. There is no arguing with that, it has been proven over and over again. Yes some women need them and if you do then have it, but to suggest that by not having one you'll harm your baby even slightly...yeah right, as if.

Epi's take away the control in labour, I felt pretty much all of my piggy back contractions (with the help of gas and air) and I was able to control what was happening - I knew that my son was going back up when I finished pushing because I could feel it, but that is normal, that stopped me tearing really badly because my labour was super fast and I only actually pushed a handful of times, so by him coming up and down he was gently stretching his path, the way nature intended, your more likely to tear with an epi because you have very little to no feeling (depending on the 'success' of the epi) so can't control it properly. I wish people could see the truth that epi's can have very negative affects for women in labour, and for their babies, and books like this do nothing to help that, more women will think it's the best to have an epi as soon as and it truely (for most women) isn't.

Oh and let's not forget it wasn't that long ago that women were made to birth on their back with their legs n stirrups (I don't know what they are called but you know what I mean) because it was best for them...

Melissa - posted on 01/26/2011

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I agree with everything said, and have always been told your more likely to have complications if you are stressed and can feel all the pain. I know I had my first labour without an epidural - my labour was 22 hours I couldnt push because well its painful and you can feel yourself tear and you stop and babyshead keeps going back and the damage is amazing - 3 courses of anti biotics swelling ice packs physio not being able to even walk for week or sit up masking it so hard to breast feed. 2nd birth - epidural at 5.5 cm relaxed because I was relaxed I gave birth in 3 hours and there wasnt any sticthes or difficulties healing or much pain after wards at all i could push without feelingall the intense pain so I could get baby out the cord was wrapped around her neck twice so i had to get her out quick and she was taken straight away for oxygen I know its common as hell but if Id not had the epidural I couldnt push like that my body couldnt handle it I would have been warn down Id hate to think what would have happened tp my baby. episudrals make for a relaxed and stress free birth which is better for mum and baby

Krissy - posted on 01/26/2011

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I tried it natural the first time.... but I have this response to pain where I "bite down" in a way and completely stop breathing... not able to breathe... really... so, there was some truth to the epi helping me deliver my daughter safely... Since i was high risk, they had both of us on a monitor after a while, (somewhat long labor led to her being on a monitor, too)....



I ended up having to get the epi so that her O2 levels didn't drop any further, ..



Not saying it should be considered standard.... but that was true for me.

Amanda - posted on 01/26/2011

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Contorl, control and money! I have given birth 3 times with no interventions, I have never had any depression (though my friends who had Epis all suffered from different levels of depression the first 2 years of their childrens lives).

Though I think a woman shouldnt have guilt if she does have an epi, its insane to say giving birth without an Epi is dangeours.

Interesting statement at the end of the video all you 3 million pregnant woman get this book. So 3 million 12 dollar books and then 3 million epis, this doode sure has a lot of money to make. LOL

[deleted account]

Personally, I would be much more relaxed without a needle and catheter in my spine! I went through 2 labors without them and everything went perfectly fine, no PTSD, no problems breastfeeding.
I have a hard time believing anything regarding childbirth coming from a man. That study is a pile of bull crap!

Caitlin - posted on 01/25/2011

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I'm glad I had one with my first, because if I hadn't had it, they most likely would have knocked me out for emergency intervention. The second time it was blissful epidural, right until about 20 minutes before I started pushing, but they weren't going to top me off then. Sweet merciful crap that hurt (but it was pitocin induced and I think so much worse because I hadn't felt most of them working up to it.

I don't know.. they have their place, but to suggest they don't increase the c-section risk or they do.. kind of tricky territory to tread I think..

Minnie - posted on 01/25/2011

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Oh, sure, like all medical interventions, they have use if there is a true need. Some women do well with it if they've been laboring sooo long and are just exhausted.

But what this dude is saying that women SHOULD have it and that to NOT have one is dangerous. LOL. He's an anesthesiologist. He doesn't want to line his pockets, no not at all.

[deleted account]

I had 2 epidurals and 1 without. Having an epidural made me relax more and not fight the contractions, it helped me dilate faster too. I am glad for the experience for natural childbirth, but would NEVER do it again without and epidural. Let the woman choose what they want to do and leave the men (who will never experience childbirth) out of it.

User - posted on 01/25/2011

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Yet another example of men infantilising women in labour and making asssumptions about how they handle pain.

I feel sorry for the poor obst

Lady Heather - posted on 01/25/2011

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A couple of men talking shit about an experience they will never even have. YAY.

I have no problem with women getting epidurals if they want them. But don't you sit there and tell me that I am risking the health of my baby and myself by NOT having one. Don't you tell me how "painful" the experience will be. Natural childbirth was without a doubt the best feeling ever. I have zero regrets. I asked if I could do it again right afterward. And don't tell me how much "easier" it is to deal with epidural patients. Oh, I'm so sorry that I want to feel my body and heaven forbid maybe move around a little. Sorry if that makes your job more difficult.

They claim the problem is that doctors and midwives are telling women not to have epidurals? Bull. From what I hear most women have the epidural thrown at them.

Hailey - posted on 01/25/2011

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I have had two epidurals. My first thankfully helped because i was so scared and in too much pain to be bareable as my contraction was one long one with no breaks. I did manage to push my first one out after 24 long hours. My second didnt work on one side which was a weird feeling. I think a combination of induction and epidural for this birth was why i needed the c section. This time in july my third birth will be a hypno birth in a water pool!! something a little less medical and a little more natural and painfree. I read they cost £2000 OMG so glad im in the uk so i didnt have to pay that. Makes you wonder why they push it in other contries where you do pay.

Rosie - posted on 01/25/2011

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it makes sense to me!! :) i was stuck at 8 cm for hours upon hours in massive pain, i got an epidural, i relaxed and i started dialating to 10 within an hour.

i'm not sure about it being less risky than do deliver without drugs, but i certainly don't think it increases c-section rates. there are many studies to prove that it doesn't.

Tara - posted on 01/25/2011

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If it smells like shit, it probably is shit.

Didn't even click the link, I've heard it all before, and it's bunk.
My best friend was an L&D nurse, there are far more c-sections as result of epidurals than there are without them. The more natural a labour is, the less chance of needing any intervention. That is simply nature at work.
And a baby is supposed to suffer somewhat during birth, they are supposed to be squeezed and have their lungs compressed etc. it helps them get ready for the task of breathing. Yes there are always going to be exceptions, BUT for the most part, interventions can lead to more interventions which can lead to sections that would have otherwise been prevented had the woman laboured naturally.

Shauna - posted on 01/25/2011

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I dont know, I had 3 failed epidurals! I wanted the pain control!!! .... i was so exhausted from being in so much pain and expecting the epidural to work ... i did end in c-section. I think i the epi would have worked i wouldnt have.

[deleted account]

I calll BULL. Oh you numb your nerves, now push all you can!!! really? and it doesn't increase risk of a section?? I figured if you dont have function of your muscles it would be harder to get the baby out..



ALL medical intervention can cause an increase risk for a section.

Tabitha - posted on 01/25/2011

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Many mothers chose to have epidurals to get rid of their pain. However i believe in experiencing every aspects of childbirth even if it comes with pain. And the fact that my child doesn't have to reap the affects of powerful pain stopping drugs makes it even better that i chose to have a natural child birth.Yes Kate i agree that it is a bit on the stinky side!

Minnie - posted on 01/25/2011

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Oh, no not at all....



Oh ok I'll say it. He absolutely is 100% correct because he's a doctor. And doctors are NEVER swayed by moolah. Never. Heh, I know who wants to strangle me right now ;).



I remember calling my hospital and asking how much they charged for the epidural. $2000.

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