Leaving kids in the car article

Merry - posted on 02/12/2012 ( 279 moms have responded )

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http://www.circleofmoms.com/track_link.p...





I hope that link works......

Anyways i read through it and I think the only thing wrong she did was put on her hazards. Hazards are for emergencies.

And it doesn't say if she was in a legal parking spot. If she was in a firelane then that would be bad too.

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Jodi - posted on 02/21/2012

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Actually, when I shop, I rarely see screaming kids. I really don't. You make them seem a far more common phenomenon than they actually are.



And can I just say, that when you write each post as if it were an essay, it kind of gets a little difficult to put the bits and pieces together of what you are trying to say when it is spread over 3 or 4 of them. Please don't take that as negative criticism, try to take it as constructive.

Cyndel - posted on 02/19/2012

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I think if the police keep stepping out of their authority on little matters like this more and more people are going to stop trusting them to actually protect us. They keep going after good parents, good people for little things when so many who have committed heinous crimes go free because of error...error that may have been avoided if they hadn't been distracted/overworked because of the ridiculous little things that for the most part isn't illegal merely unadvised.

Also why is the court still perusing this when the cps said there was no signs of neglect/abuse?? This raises serious concerns to me.

Johnny - posted on 02/19/2012

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Is this still going on?



Just a little note that made me think of this thread today. I heard a statistic today that in Canada from October to April, 15% of all hospital emergency room visits are from slips and falls. Many of those result in broken limbs and head injuries. Aside from auto accidents, this is the vast majority of non-medical causes for visits to emergency rooms. I'm guessing they didn't bother to mention the rates of injuries from children being left in cars because it is so incredibly rare.



I also asked my cousin and her boyfriend who work at Vancouver Children's in the emergency department if they had ever had to deal with a child left in a car. They had seen and heard of it on one occasion, about 2 1/2 years ago, when a father had left his children in a car for about 45 minutes in the middle of the day in the summer to go to a beer garden. The kids suffered from severe heat stroke and dehydration. Spent several days in the hospital. A terrible act of negligence. Also the only time they have heard or seen of an incident in over 5 years of working there.



I think there is a real lack of context being applied to this debate. I have looked and have not seen anyone advocating leaving their children in the car for more than two minutes at all. No one has mentioned the car ever being out of view. No one is leaving their kids in the car to grocery shop or go to the bar (like both my grandmothers used to do). Just off the top of my head I can think of so many more serious, concerning and important child welfare issues. This argument makes me a bit depressed.

Jodi - posted on 02/19/2012

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"That would be one of the reasons I never left the house alone w/ them." I think she was trying to point out that there ARE reasons why people don't use strollers (I would think finances would be a huge one, strollers are expensive!!!) She clearly states she never left the house alone with them, therefore eliminated her personal need to lift a stroller OR a carseat.



Also, I had a c-section too and I couldn't lift the infant carrier. I was warned of the danger TO ME if I did, and that danger also applied to my baby. If I were to injure myself while alone with the kids and passed out from pain, or blood loss or whatever, what of my kids then? Both ways are risky. So what did I do? Our infant carriers stayed in the vehicle and I lifted only my children. (This was before the great stroller incident, so I could put them in the stroller!) I could lift a baby, but not the added weight of the carrier.

Jodi - posted on 02/18/2012

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First off, I wouldn't leave my kid in the car in sweltering heat. I rarely take my kids anywhere in the sweltering heat besides the lake! Secondly, it takes me WAY less than 5, 3 or even 2 minutes to return a cart.



Aside from idiots who leave their children in cars in extreme weather and/or for extended periods of time, I think it's about weighing the risks. Is there a larger risk for me to carry two 23 lb babies who can't walk yet and allow my 3 year old to walk across a parking lot with traffic when I can't hold her hand or grab her if I need to, or is the risk larger leaving my children in the car for 1 minute, *maybe* a minute and a half to return the cart? Same parking lot situation, but switch it out with books drops at the library (the kind that are on the outside of the building), or video slot drops at the store. It doesn't make me lazy, and if you took my keys or broke my window, you can bet there would be hell to pay. I have never been gone long enough for someone to even wonder how long I've been gone, a) I'm always in sight of my car and b) if you're getting close enough to my vehicle to see my children in it, you've been close enough the whole time to see me.



To call someone lazy just because they have weighed the risks of one situation over another and came out with a different answer than you...that's just, well...ignorant perhaps? Claiming someone who has decided one situation is SAFER than another, when you have decided the same situation is more dangerous (for YOU) shouldn't have children, that's just judgemental, mean and small minded IMO.

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Mother - posted on 03/11/2012

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Must agree with you Megan. I don't believe that 90% of people on assistance abuse the system. There is a substantial amount of people who honestly need the help and are grateful to receive it. I know there are the ones who abuse and just sit on assistance but I don't believe the amount of people abusing it is that high. In any province.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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Where did you NOT mention a Country??



I do dissagree with your estimate of 90% of people on assistance abuse the system since when I lived in the US and worked as a care aide I saw people who wished they could work, but had to be on disability because of one thing or another. That's not to say I didn't see some people who abused the system or at the very least their relative who were receiving some type of assitance. But thankfully those incidents were rare.



BTW - The incidents of welfare participants not taking care of their children, is not rare here in Canada.... ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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No I am sorry you did not clearly state anything, you said US and obviously it wasn't clear or you would not be telling me I assumed anything.



You assumed I was speaking about ALL low income of which I clearly stated a page back (page 12) I was speaking of those on welfare and only those in Alberta and Nova Scotia. Since I cannot speak for anywhere else. You even said you are "guessing" that's what I mean. So is the pot calling the kettle black here or what?



I am not trying to argue with you Megan, I am simply not going to have anyone tell me I was doing something I was not. Be more clear and other's will understand what you are saying. No where in your 2nd paragraph of disputing my claim of 90% did you mention Canada, you "only" specified the US where you use to live. Go back and read it for crying out loud.



Anyway this is stupid. Be it as it may. I don't know what your problem is honestly. I guess I rubbed you the wrong way. Sorry, didn't mean to...



This is also not the correct thread.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/27/2012

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Meme, you're arguing with me about what you read into my post... again.



I clearly stated that I believed that your estimate of 90% of PEOPLE (no mention of country) being on assistance (no mention of whether it was welfare or disability) were abusing the system was an excessive percentage and then used facts based on where I lived and what I've witnessed from both the US and Canada.



But if you want to continue your behaivour be my guest, just don't expect me to sink to your level.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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Megan, thank you for telling me what I was assuming.. Gracious me. I am way too old to be told what I was doing or thinking. I don't know what you are talking about now anyhow. I figured you were stating in the US because that is all you wrote



Next time specify what you are saying, do not expect anyone to do that for you, I do not know to ask a question when it is not apparent of the need to ask. You said US. If you don't want to have little arguments than I suggest you don't start them. ;)



I hope you are enjoying your stay, I bet it is lovely there...

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/27/2012

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Meme, I'm too old and too tired to keep getting into little arguements with people on the internet. You did assume that I was stating you were saying in the US. I meant both.



And I've been up in Salmon Arm all weekend so I couldn't really check the boards to see what else is on the boards.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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I should mention too that there is a whole debate for this open now.. It may be better to debate there. ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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Megan, OK. However I have lived here 36 years. I have been on assistance for 7 of those years. I have lived in the low income places. I said 90% of the people ON assistance; welfare, are abusing the system... ;) It's OK if you don't believe me, I have lived it and seen it with my own two eyes.



I do dissagree with your estimate of 90% of people on assistance abuse the system since when I lived in the US and worked as a care aide I saw people who wished they could work, but had to be on disability because of one thing or another.



I actually did not assume anything, I took your word for what you were saying... that's all...



Edited to add: I also know people who get disability and don't need it... However, I only know a few of them. i was not talking disability. Before you assume, you should read everything that has been said. I was speaking low income - welfare recipients.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/27/2012

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Meme, I meant the 90% in the US or Canada that I feel your estimate is rather high. I'm sorry if I didn't clarify, but next time instead of assuming I am only speaking of one country ask. I've lived in both now and know of a few people (including my husband) who use some form of public assistance here in Canada.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/27/2012

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90% referring to Canada. I cannot and have not claimed to know anything about the US in regards to assistance... I believe everyone here knows where I am from, so please don't expect anything I say is across the board and entails any Country other than my own. :)



Sorry if I represented it incorrectly, I thought I had covered that base. ;)

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/27/2012

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Meme, here in BC you either have disability which is what DH gets or Welfare so I'm guessing that's what you mean. DH has a permanent disabilities (ADHD and Dyslexia) so was told he couldn't work while in school so the BC government allowed him to qualify.



I do dissagree with your estimate of 90% of people on assistance abuse the system since when I lived in the US and worked as a care aide I saw people who wished they could work, but had to be on disability because of one thing or another. That's not to say I didn't see some people who abused the system or at the very least their relative who were receiving some type of assitance. But thankfully those incidents were rare.



I don't know why Canada doesn't do food stamps like back in the US. To me it would make more sense to give out something to pay for food then give you money to cover your bills. Another silly thing is that since I can't prove that I'm living here in BC social services won't list my older daughter or myself as DH's dependants.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Laura, that is a damn good idea! I love it! I just may pass this along to the Government here, the Government is our client. We do do things for Social Services also. I may have to present this idea in a nonchalant way ;) Thanks for sharing...

Merry - posted on 02/26/2012

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Yes it's a card just like a credit card but you only can buy food. No alcohol,no cigarettes :)

Merry - posted on 02/26/2012

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Well Canada is better then America in many ways I guess it's only fair it's lacking in some ways. Anyways I don't know statistics or anything but just from what I see it seems quite good here.

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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Well, I don't have "little ones". Thirteen isn't really little but she'll always be my babe. Even tho working from home is ideal I'd much rather be out in the work force. By trade I'm a Natural Health Consultant....however the Naturopaths and homeopaths in the area aren't hiring. I was working out of the hospital for a while but was laid off last fall....UGH....I hate it.



Laura is it where you are that your money is put on a credit card and you buy groceries like that?? I thought that was a genius idea. Then you HAD to buy food [not booze or smokes] but it wasn't embarrassing for the mom paying for her food at checkout...when a clerk announces they needed a supervisor to cash out an assistance check.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Kelly, I agree with your sister for sure! That sounds like a very lucrative career and one that would still allow you to be home with the little one's. I wish you luck!



Laura, I wish it was better governized here. Those that really need it wouldn't be left in the dark as much as they are now.... :(

Merry - posted on 02/26/2012

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Meme here in Wisconsin I have no stats but I have to say my gut instinct is our system is much more regulated and a lot less likely to allow freeloaders. I'm sure theres plenty abusing the system but I highly doubt its that high over here. It's really hard to abuse the system here, they require a lot of proofs and if you're late or don't get them the right stuff they cut off your benefits.

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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Well, there is another sewing shop in our town but my mom took 3 pairs of pants in to be hemmed and 3 months later they weren't done. I can sew....and can make an outfit from scratch....it is alterations and tailoring that I need to know. I thought it was a good idea. Even if I started out hemming....taking stuff in...and repairs. My sister thinks I should specialize as well and go into making formal wear....she says people pay an arm and leg for good work.



Thanks MeMe...

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Kelly, a dressmakers diploma sounds awesome! I wish I could sew that well. I have a sewing machine that has not left the box as of yet, I have had it for 4 years now. LOL



Good luck on your indeavor's! I am sure that you will do great getting your diploma and probably be super busy if you are the only one making dresses!! ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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In Alberta and Nova Scotia, so I am assuming across Canada, since Kelly vouched for Ontario. They just give you money and you divide as you see fit. Sometimes, if they feel you are not able to be responsible they will pay your rent for you but it still come out of the monthly money they would have initially given you. You are responsible for everything else, including utilities.



The system is highly abused here. Much more than many that have not been on assistance and lived in a low income area think. It is so bad in Alberta that they have had to start only giving assistance to those that actually have a part time job already.



They are suppose to make you apply for 5 jobs a month and you are to submit the log with the names and numbers of the places you have applied but they NEVER ever do that. It is too much over-head so it falls through the cracks.



It is not well ran here thus why so many people take advantage. I was on "welfare" for 6 years, as soon as I got pregnant otherwise I would have starved and froze because I had nothing.



Now with all that said, there are about 10% of people on assistance that actually do use the system properly. The system is awesome for those people, these are the people that deserve it. They are the ones that don't want to be on assistance forever and really want to do good for themselves and their children. Unfortunately they are few and far between. In Nova Scotia where cost of living is so high, taxes are the highest in the Country and there are not very many good paying jobs (unless you have gone to school, got a diploma or degree and often know someone that know's someone) you are pretty much screwed and many give up before they have even started. :(



Sadly the system is highly abused here in Canada. I wish they would be more strict. We are the ones paying all the taxes for those that abuse it, it isn't fair to those that really need it in order to get off and become self sufficient.

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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No kidding. If they worked as hard at a job as some do trying to screw the system....they'd be rich!!! :D

Merry - posted on 02/26/2012

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Ahh, so here in Wisconsin you can qualify for food money which is on a credit card and only good for food, no alcohol. Or you can qualify for a check every month that can be used for whatever you want. There's varying levels of assistance here and it's very individualized, like some get low income housing, others get money to use for free daycare, some get help on their heating bill, others get just the food money or just the insurance etc.

It's very highly managed and it's quite complicated to keep getting the benefits so I couldn't imagine doing it illegally, they're so strict and they make you give proof for everything and every 6 months they need a review and it's just hard to imagine anyone being able to abuse the system.

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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Laura, we live in Ontario. It's been many years since I was ever on assistance but as far as I know they just give you a check to divide how you see fit. Now, I do know that sometimes they set up automatic withdrawls for your rent and utilities so it is deducted before you get any cash.

Merry - posted on 02/26/2012

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I know many of my friends get state insurance and food stamps but not checks of money they get to use freely.

I think the abusers of the system is much fewer then you think, unless you don't count those of us who don't get checks as to be 'on the system' I don't get low income housing, neither do any of my friends, we all just have no option for insurance so we qualify for state insurance, and we also get food money.

So is this what you mean by on assistance? Or is there a different term for those like me. Because everyone I know doesn't abuse the system, they use their food money well and there's really no way to abuse insurance

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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WOW....kudos!!



I'm married now too but I find myself in a similar position. My daughter is home schooled so it doesn't leave me many options for work. I was a Home Health Care provider out of local hospital and I've done that since 2007. Well just this fall between my patients passing or being put in homes I am out of job. I did not qualify for unemployment and even tho I've applied to jobs in my area....the unemployment rate is high.



I am going, what did that one poster type.....batshit crazy. LOL I'm taking a correspondence course to get my dressmakers diploma because we had our sewing shop close down over a year ago. Figured I could start working out of the house. Any advice Ladies?? Or does anyone have a job available that requires little effort but gives oodles of cash??? LOL

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Kelly, I am now a Software Engineer. Took Computer Sciences with a Database Concentration. It was hard ass work going to school, being poor and being a single Mom (I am married now though) but it sure was worth it in the end! ;)



Back then we lived off of $13 000 (which included the monthly child tax payment) a year and my rent was $525/month. I feel blessed for having had assistance and I wish all on it would properly use it. It's hard getting off but it is sooo worth it. ;)



Edited to add: I agree with you low income does NOT mean bad parents. Although it is more common amongst lower income people. They are stressed out and many have given up on life in general. No not all, I mean, I wasn't a bad parent and neither were you but in general many are...

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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Oh MeMe....I'm not disagreeing with that aspect. I was disagreeing with the fact that low income equates bad parents.



I know many sit on the system but I also think alot are "stuck" on the system. I was on assistance and like you I got out. I think if you continue to pop out kids then yes....it is definitely a money maker but there are lots of parents who are just trying to make ends meet.



where I live now there is not a lot of subsidized housing so you are stuck paying normal rents....it does not leave much money to buy anything else. {that was my experience] I think sometimes living in a large city is easier because there is more opportunity....more housing....more food banks...more possible jobs...etc etc...



What did you end up doing for a career...if you don't mind me asking. If you do....just tell me to sod off and I will. LOL

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Yes Kelly you're right, all kids can get that way. However, I have been on welfare and I lived in very low income places and I am going by what I know and what I saw. I am going by what I still see when shopping.



(It has been 8 years since I have been on assistance and now have a very good career and make excellent money. I used the system the way it is intended and went back to school for 4 years and got a degree)



Many many people on assistance ( a good 90%) abuse the system, they keep popping kids upon kids out for the MONEY, not because they care about the kids. So, they drag them all with them to go buy the few groceries they buy (first stopping at the liquor store) and they do NOT teach their kids anything. Rather they treat them like crap and allow for them to scream the entire time. This is what I was referring to, I did not explain it fully in my original post. Since I live in a city that has a number of low income (assistance) people, I see it all too often and it is sad. These children should NOT be shopping. They should be home being fed and having naps!



Why do you think Social Services is so overwhelmed?



I am not asking you to agree with me. It is what I know and see in the city I live. It is a common occurrence here, I did not say it is where you live or where you shop.... I can only go by my experiences and again, I changed my view to fit Laura's and other's here. Since it is true, if you can stimulate and create a good experience for your children when shopping then that is perfect! ;)

Mother - posted on 02/26/2012

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Who says kids don't learn in a grocery store?? I did not go searching for that comment but what a silly thing to say. Kids learn PERIOD. doesn't matter where or what they are doing they learn. I never had a problem with meltdown....either I'm just fortunate or maybe timed our outings well I don't know but to state that "why I felt that way because many many low income families (those on the system) do not care to teach their children much, let alone make shopping a good experience for them." -- what a horrible, judgmental, false thing to say. Just because someone has money does not mean they are a better parent.



"They are tired, they are hungry and they are BORED" -- low income children are NOT the only kids that get this way. ALL children get this way from time to time.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/26/2012

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Mary that comment is from pages ago, I am the one that said it and I quickly changed my opinion to fit those of you that actually put effort into making it a learning experience for them. Unfortunately not every parent does. Perhaps it is because there are alot of low income families in NS and why I felt that way because many many low income families (those on the system) do not care to teach their children much, let alone make shopping a good experience for them.



Now before anyone jumps on that comment, I am not saying ALL low income parents are like that but the census is that most are. I see it all too often where the child(ren) are not happy and are very distraught while in the store. They are tired, they are hungry and they are BORED. Again, if you can make it a healthy learning experience than you are doing it right and YES it is a positive experience for those children. This is my experience here and I only shop in Bayer's Lake (I know most of you do not know where that is, Krista does), it is close to many government housing.



I can't stand it when they are being yelled at, freaked on, simply because they are not able to enjoy the experience. This is where I was coming from with that.



I apologoze to all of you that took offense, I did not clarify within my original post.



However, I do not often bring my children with me, not because I can't make it fun but because I am always on a mission, to get in and out. It is also my out time during the weekends, I don't get any other me time otherwise. If I bring them, then I take the extra time so they can enjoy it too. Well, my 13.5 year old can entertain herself now, so I am speaking of my 16 month old...;)

Mary Renee - posted on 02/25/2012

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I disagree that children don't learn anything from the grocery store. My daughter isn't even two yet and she learns a ton! She's 21 months, and has been getting groceries with me since she was 4 weeks, since you're out of your mind if you think I'm going to wait to go grocery shopping until midnight when her father closes his store.



Here is just a short list of what she learns at the grocery store:



**Mimicking Reading and Writing: This skill comes before actual reading and writing. She likes to hold my list, and sometimes draw her own "list" and help me cross things out. Sometimes she evens "reads" the list out loud to me



**Names of Food



**Healthy Eating, picking out fruits and vegetables



**Finances (we have to pay for the things that we buy and food we eat)



**Physics (she likes to help stack food in the cart in a nice pile so that it doesn't fall)



**Patience (sometimes we all have to wait in line, regardless of our age... it's the grocery store, not the DMV)



**Decision Making and Consequences (You can stay with Mommy and hold her hand, or you can sit in the cart)





........ Not to mention the stimulation of seeing other people that aren't Mommy and Daddy, making conversation with the cashier and all the other wonderful things that make the grocery store something different than your home or the playground. This is all with a child who isn't even two yet. I imagine you could ask a three year old "What color is that box? Which box is bigger? Which box is smaller."



Sometimes if the trip goes a little longer than I had planned, of corse we have a meltdown, but you keep your cool and tell yourself that everybody in this store knows that occasionally toddlers have meltdowns. It's not a big deal. It's not torture.



I know I'm way way off topic now but I just couldn't disagree more that children shouldn't go grocery shopping and that they can't learn anything from that stimulation. Learning at that age doesn't happen in school or books, it happens when they're exposed to everyday interactions. If you look at our ancestors, or even cultures still existing today, the children do everything with their mothers, they went to the fields with the mother, they gathered the crops with their mothers, they milked the cows with their mothers. I don't think we need to baby our children to the point that they shouldn't go to the grocery store because they *might* get bored.

Mother - posted on 02/25/2012

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I think this is ridiculous. This poor woman was standing by her car. She didn't go in the store....she didn't leave the parking lot....she wasn't even out of ear shot. So, a possible jail term?? Ya, that will do her children a world of good.

Desiree - posted on 02/22/2012

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Johnny and Jackie It doesn't usually happen in Edenvale or should I say it is the first time i have experianced something like that. Normally if i am in the Avenues Families even go for walks with thier dogs in the evening. But i won't lie and say it never happens it does. i think it was more of a fright than anything else. And yes i do live with a massive amount of security, security that I don't want on my home but since they tried to break in last year 4 times I have had to add the burglar bars, electric fencing, and cameras to my property. Its like a prison but not much I can do about it. Lets just say lesson very well learnt on Monday thats for sure. And Thank you for your concen and for the compliment.

**Jackie** - posted on 02/21/2012

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Desiree, I didn't realize it was that bad. I'm not well educated in other cultures, I apologize. You deserve some kind of metal! You sound like a great mom AND your son even knew what to do in that type of situation, you taught him how to stay calm, what to do and he listened and did what was told, awesome job!

**Jackie** - posted on 02/21/2012

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Jersey shore... but not like the show...at least not until the summer lol. I was watching Top Chef last week and they were in BC and I told my husband we HAVE to go. How beautiful it is there! Oh gosh, to look out your window and see mountains :)

Johnny - posted on 02/21/2012

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Desiree, I do think it really depends on where you live. Honestly, if I lived in South Africa, having heard what things are like there from several friends who have relocated here, I would not leave my child in the car for even a moment. My friends who have relocated here often seem paranoid about security to us, but we can understand it when we put it in the context of their previous experience. After being here a while, they adapted to the different environment. One of them is gay, and he would have never walked down the street holding hands with his partner back home like he does here.

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/21/2012

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Out of curiousity, which state? I'm from NY. I miss my 24hr stores, everything here in my part of BC closes at 11pm at the latest and doesn't open until 8am at the earliest

**Jackie** - posted on 02/21/2012

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lol no no it was like 8ish when I typed that. Oh, and I got my press on nails and I plan on popping those suckers on while my daughter takes her nap lol

♥♪Megan♫♥ - posted on 02/21/2012

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Jackie, I hope you live on the East Coast or somewhere else not in North America. Because according to my computer clock, you typed that at nearly 5am my time.



Aw well almost time to go unleash my child on her public school.

**Jackie** - posted on 02/21/2012

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So I have to run to Walmart to get press-on nails because I need them for an upcoming event. I won't be leaving my daughter in the car because not only will she help me pick them out (well....she will bite them) but I also might be in that isle for 2-17 minutes lol you never knowwwwwwww

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/21/2012

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Thanks Jodi, I can see that. I appreciate your thoughts. I do have an issue with getting what I am saying in tight spaces. I have attention to detail and often add too much.. ;)

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 02/21/2012

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You guys failed to see that I reverted my comment about kids going shopping to fit with Laura. Simply because Laura has good methods, you guys may too. However many other parents do not. I don't see many parents making shopping fun for their kids, rather I see the kids being mistreated simply because they are bored/hungry/tired and their parents are not making it enjoyable or understanding. If you are able to make it fun for your kids then absolutely they are learning something and they should be going.



Johnny I agree with you once again, I did not fully explain what I was saying and I apologize.



Jodi:

Every phsychologist will also tell you that if you are just dragging them around and not making it fun and interesting so they can learn something that they should have stayed home... However, if you do make it an event where they can learn, then yes, it is most appropriate. I didn't explain it fully in the one or two comments. Instead I was making the comment for those lack mother's that could careless on how their child felt. I see this often, again I am not saying it is any of you on this thread (there are maybe 20 mother's here, I am speaking about a much larger audience of mother's). I am sorry but when I go shopping I rarely see a screaming kid being properly exercised with their brain. They are more often stuck in the cart and not allowed to get out and are whining the entire store length. These kids should be left home!



I have my opinion for a reason. You have yours. I never said you were wrong but, if you have to say I am to make you feel better for what you do, that's fine. I don't want anyone to feel left out so have a good go....



I am done with this thread, have tried already. I had my opinion, I was asked for reasons of why I have that opinion, I gave multiple. For every reason I gave they were countered for whatever reason, even though they were very reasonable, since they came directly from sites that are warning of leaving children even for a minute unattended. I am unsure of why it pisses so many people off. I am not sure if it is their way to make them feel better about leaving their child unattended or not. I don't care really. I don't do it and that is simply all that matters in my world...

Desiree - posted on 02/21/2012

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As I have previously stated I live in South Africa and children under the age of 12 are not allowed to be left in the car unattended for even a minute. That being said and that my son is 12. I realized yesterday just how fast things can go wrong and won't leave either of my kids in the car alone again. (My daughter is 13) I stopped at the Glass shop very quickly to get a quotation I had requested. I left my son in the car and there were people I knew standing next to the car so he wasn't alone per say. I wasn't even in the store more than a minute when the next thing the guys that were chating by my car came running in to say the cops were outside with guns drawn. My son was in the car still, luckly he is a sensible child so he locked the doors and got down onto the floor until someone came and got him. The cops had chased 2 thieves in thier car stoped just behind my car and arrested them. Needless to say even for a blink of the eye my kids will never again be left in the car no matter thier age. Things can go pretty wrong just far to quickly.

Jodi - posted on 02/21/2012

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"No, if at all possible I do not agree with small children going shopping. They do not need to be in a gorcery store. They are not learning anything until they are school aged. I feel they get too bored, tired and hungry."



Really? Not learning anything until school age while shopping? Every educator and child psychologist in the world would absolutely disagree with you on this one.

Jodi - posted on 02/21/2012

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" I am unsure of what how long you have been driving has anything to do with it but for the record I have been driving for 22 years, if you want to count the 2 years of learners.. "



Oh cool, a pissing contest.....I win!!!!!



Sorry, just had to go there.

Johnny - posted on 02/20/2012

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"No, if at all possible I do not agree with small children going shopping. They do not need to be in a gorcery store. They are not learning anything until they are school aged. I feel they get too bored, tired and hungry."



Wow. That is dumb. My 3 year old knows how to help me with grocery shopping. She helps me load things, practices reading the list, unloading the cart at the till, and packing the bags. Her favorite part is getting to press the button to make the belt run. That is her reward for good behaviour.



It is called teaching life skills. An important part of growing up and learning to be a whole successful person. It does not need to wait until they are school aged. A parent who knows how to engage their child positively can start from a young age. This was one of the things we were encouraged to do with foster kids, because so few people took the time and effort to help them learn these skills.



It may take some time and planning, and I could see how it would be very difficult if not impossible with multiple small children. But the assertion that small kids should not grocery shop has to be countered as the completely silly statement that it is.

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