Park Politics

Mrs. - posted on 06/03/2011 ( 104 moms have responded )

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Okay, so I'm about ready to slap some nannies and/or parents...

I go to the same park with a playground area for kids on the regular. I often bring my 8 pound Maltese. Dogs are not allowed on the actual playground, they are to stay leashed on a bench, or in my case, to a stroller nearby. I put down a small bowl of water for her and only ever go as far as the sandbox on the opposite side of the playground...because my daughter is still a small toddler and likes to move around the playground.

Now, no matter what I do, small kids will, as soon as I am not within arms reach, try to approach my dog. They don't ask, they run up on her, scare her, tease her and generally, their parents don't move an inch or tell them not to do it. I end up having to go over and say that the dog is shy and doesn't like to play with anyone but the family. Of course, as soon as my daughter runs up to a slide and I go to watch her, these kids swarm back.

Once, this little girl actually untangled my elaborate leash set up to keep the dog safe and keep the stroller balanced - the stroller fell on top of the dog and the little girl just laughed. Not only that, her mom laughed who was sitting on a bench over on the other side laughed too.

Today, was the last straw. As usual, some little kid started teasing the dog. His mother held him up so that he could get closer to it. His grandmother (I assume), started leaning on my stroller as if it was a public bench. I ended up having to grab my daughter, who was screaming at the abrupt exit and leave the park. They just stood there gossiping, looking annoyed that I was moving the stroller...I guess because they thought it was a resting spot?

WTF?

I have to know, do you let you kid approach a dog without the owner being there? Do you think it is cool to use other people's strollers as resting spots? Do you just let you kids run free and not bother to say something if they start getting into trouble?

What is a parents responsibility at the park? Do you allow things there that you would never allow in a person's home?

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Karli - posted on 06/03/2011

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If the dog is shy and doesn't like other people other than your family, why do you bring it to the children's playground? Children are naturally attracted to dogs especially small one's. If you left the dog at home you would not have the problem that you do.

[deleted account]

But, what purpose did it serve to say, "In fact, Filipino nannies are more likely to see the dog as a possible food source"?

It's irrelevant and just.....WOW!

Jane - posted on 06/03/2011

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Your viewpoint is in the right, but what are you going to do? The other parents don't get it, you can't convince them of it, and all you'll do is make yourself and your dog and maybe even your daughter targets. Remember, just because people get to be old enough to vote doesn't mean that they are grown ups.

The simplest solution is to leave the dog at home and focus on your daughter. Walk the dog some other time when you are away from those folks. Watch your daughter at the park and keep her safe and happy. And ignore the morons.

[deleted account]

To the OP, I'd never allow my son to approach any dog without asking the owner first if it's ok for him to touch it. And it's not just that I would worry about if the dog is nice or not, it's a matter of not touching other people's things (or in this case, animals) without asking. And to me, touching another woman's stroller is kinda like touching another woman's purse...a big no no, especially if it's a stranger.



Melissa, I agree that the dog deserves to be outside in the fresh air at any park he is allowed to be in. However, you can't make other people act the way you want them to act. You can berate nannies all you want, but that's not the point and it's not gonna change the fact that they're still gonna spend their time at the park chatting and hardly watching the kids. So that means Rebecca has two choices: continue to take her dog to the park and let it be tortured by kids who don't know any better and are just naturally curious, yet unsupervised? Or leave the dog at home while she takes her daughter to the park and then make short trips to the park just for the dog, where it can do what doggies do and have an enjoyable experience. Sounds to me like option two is the better option.

Sincerely,

One of Those People

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[deleted account]

I dunno what kind of parents are there because I would never allow my son to go up to a strange dog if the owner and myself are not there and the owner hasn't given verbal permission for my son to touch or approach their dog. It's dangerous and those parents at the park are being ridiculous

Janice - posted on 05/01/2012

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I would never let my child play with a strange dog with out permission. (or touch anyone else's stuff) But it probably will never be an issue because dogs are not allowed in any parks with in 20-30 minutes of my home.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 05/01/2012

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Mary--- I do agree with you. A dog should not be tied up, out of distance from its owner. My first fear really, would be my dog may get loose. Since, if she was loose, she would run and she would not come back (at least I think this, since she has only gotten loose twice and man, did we have to run, passerby's had to stop her for us). She is well trained but not when she is free! lol

Now I do not hold onto my dogs leash but I do tie her right beside us, to the pole of the swing set. Not even 3 feet away, more like 2 feet. If, I see any children coming close, I tell them can pet her. If I see another dog and the owner coming close, I tell them, my dog does NOT like other dogs. If they continue, I will untie her and I will tell the owner of the other dog where he can go. ;) I don't need a dog fight, while trying to also care for my 18 month old. Although, most times, my husband is with us too and he holds the dog while we swing.

Mary - posted on 05/01/2012

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MeMe - the point I take issue with is leaving the dog unattended. I have absolutely no problems with taking a friendly, social dog to a playground - as long as that dog is, in some way, attached to it's owner at all times. I can, and have, held onto my two dogs on their double leash while pushing my daughter on a swing. Admittedly, they are very laid-back boys who don't mind this in the least. What I would never do, and wholeheartedly object to, is tying them up somewhere of any distance from me where I could not immediately intercede on their behalf.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 05/01/2012

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Mary---Yes, a dog needs exercise, stimulation, and socialization. A children's park, however, is not the place to accomplish this, especially if you are going to be leaving that dog tied up and unattended.



I agree with this to an extent. For us, when we go for a walk, we end up at the park but we also go for a nice LONG walk. So, my dog can sit her ass down for 10 mins while my son plays. Now, if our intent was to only go to the park, no I would not bring our dog. We also would not be going to our neighbourhood play ground. We would be going to the large one downtown. ;)



Sometimes, when you are going for a walk, it just so happens that you have to please everyone, including the dog and the kid. So, you mix it together. You exercise the dog and get the kid into the fresh air but the kid also wants to go for a quick swing. I am not going to take the dog for a walk and then go home and drop her off, then go back out to the park.



I think it all depends on what your intentions are. If your intentions are to go to the park for a long period, yes, the dog should not be coming. If your intentions are to go on a good walk but have a stop off at the park, yes the dog should get to go. Dogs need to learn how to be patient too. ;)



ETA:

And people need to learn to leave your stuff alone. Period!

Mary - posted on 05/01/2012

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"To the people who say leave the dog at home , clearly they havent owned a dog before and dont realise that the dog needs excercise too, the dog clearly deserves to be there."



As an avid dog lover, owner of two big dogs, and a shelter volunteer, I vehemently disagree with this mindset.



Yes, a dog needs exercise, stimulation, and socialization. A children's park, however, is not the place to accomplish this, especially if you are going to be leaving that dog tied up and unattended. To me, and pretty much any animal welfare organization that you might ask, that is the height of irresponsible ownership. Both of the rescue organizations I work with would revoke an adopter's ownership for that type of neglect.



It really doesn't matter how friendly, well-behaved, or docile your dog is. Leaving any animal tied up when you are not right there with them is leaving them vulnerable to everyone and everything in that environment - with no means of escape. You are setting them up for a potential situation in which even the most even-tempered dog could be forced to snarl, growl, snap or even bite to defend themselves from another animal, or just a stupid kid who thinks it's funny to poke them with a stick. You are a fool if you are trusting other parents to keep their kids from even unintentionally harming, teasing, or just plain aggravating your dog.



As I said, I own two big dogs, and I have a 3 y/o. Those dogs get walked extensively everyday, and somehow, I still manage to get my daughter to her various activities, the park, or wherever in addition to the hour or so she and I spend everyday walking my boys. There is a small, infrequently used playground in my development that we sometimes take the dogs to. It is fenced-in, and if no one else is there, I let the boys run freely while she plays (my ridgeback mix actually loves the slides!). However, if anyone else came in (that didn't know us), those dogs are immediately back on their leash, and I am holding that leash at all times. I will not take a chance that another, unknown child or parent will treat my dogs appropriately. I do not, however, take them to other, more-populated parks if the primary purpose of the visit is for my daughter to play. We walk the boys first to tire them out, and leave them at home.



I want to be clear - that choice has nothing to do with their behavior with others or temperament. They are very well-behaved, and both dog and people friendly. I have absolutely no concerns about their behavior in this scenario; it is the behavior of strangers that I know not to leave to chance. I love and value them entirely too much to ever put them in that situation. I would no more leave them tied to a bench unattended than I would tie up my daughter to a bench while I walked the dogs.

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 05/01/2012

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Nikki---To the people who say leave the dog at home , clearly they havent owned a dog before and dont realise that the dog needs excercise too, the dog clearly deserves to be there.

Exactly!

I mean, come on. A dog deserves to go on the family walk too. I am sorry but I could not leave home to go for a walk and leave my dog, of whom is all excited and crying to go for the walk too. She knows when we are going, she knows us getting the stroller out, means a walk. We just say the word and she is freaking. How cruel to think we, that own dogs, should leave them home, just because so stupid ass parent doesn`t know how to teach their children respect.

I also agree, that my children are taught from a very young age not to touch another animal without asking (and me or Dad with them). If they still choose to and they get bit, well I am not going to blame the owner, for my kid getting too close. I love animals but I do not fully trust them. Anything can make them turn, they are instinctual, you cannot blame them for that. ;)

Nikki - posted on 04/30/2012

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I have a weimaraner ( shes a big dog ) and I do the same thing we go to an off leash park near my house where there is a long fenced in forest where i run her out ( she needs a good few hours of play and excercise a day and this place is great > i also brnig my almost 3 year old we do the off leash area first then the park after where I either tie her to a bench or the stroller, and she passes out. She's the opposite she is super friendly and LOVES attention but we get the opposite reaction people bring their kids to the other side of the park which amazes me, normally she is out cold and shes tied up

To the people who say leave the dog at home , clearly they havent owned a dog before and dont realise that the dog needs excercise too, the dog clearly deserves to be there. I have always taught my son to ask me and the owner first before ever going near another dog , bothering it he knows better and he\s 3 . The fact is these parents clearly are too preoccupied to take responsibility for their children . If my son ran up to a dog and bothered him and got bit, I wouldnt blame the owner or the dog. When he was little he used to pull my cats tails and they put up with a lot but one day he got scratched after that he never hurt them again. These parents clearly arent doing their jobs and you should say something!!

MeMe - Raises Her Hand (-_-) (Mommy Of A Toddler And Teen) - posted on 04/30/2012

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My children are not allowed to approach or touch a dog unless the owner has stated that it is OK and has offered. Even then, they are not allowed unless myself or husband do it with them. I know how dogs can be and like any animal they can turn very quickly. It is also a respect for others' property.



We have a dog too. She does not like other animals, she doesn't mind a little pet here and there by kids, she is a good girl. However, I am protective of her, as I am with any of my things.



I would be very upset and would be telling the children straight up, to get away from my dog and do not touch her. If the parents were advocating them tease and touch my dog, I would be hainvg some words with them too. I don't tolerate ignorance or disrespect, very well. I also do not tolerate others touching my things. The park may be a public place but my things, including my animals, are not public territory.



If I see disrespect from anyone and my children and I are trying to enjoy ourselves, such as at a park, best be sure I will take control of the situation. I will try my best to do it very kindly at first. However, if my first attempt or two fail, yeah, it's probably best the parents get a grip or leave. Once I feel like I have to take control of someone else, including their children, I am not leaving and I am not very friendly. That is not fair to me, my children or my dog. ;)



I also, can not stand when others that have a dog think it is fair game to introduce them to our dog. Our dog is not friendly to other dogs. She will bite them. I always get anxious when I see them coming. I always warn them before they extend their dogs leash. If they continue to, I will tell them where to go with that gesture. I mean, I just told them my dog is not friendly to other dogs. Keep your dog away. If you still choose to and disobey what I just told you, then I am going to shit on you (not literally of course)! ;)

Hope - posted on 04/30/2012

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I teach my children not to approach a dog unless the owner says it is ok. We take our dog to the park with us every time we go and we have no problems with people just touching and harassing him but if they did it would only be once, he is a pup and is very happy and nips. I have never seen anyone touch someone elses pram at the park, how rude. I teach my children not to touch other peoples property. Even in a car if we need to weave through the cars to get to our car my children are not to touch any of the cars, I will correct them if they do. But I can say I have lent on a strangers car before, not that I meant to, I was talking and as soon as I realised what I was doing a apologises to the owner.
As for disciplining others kids at the park. I have done that on occasion but only if it is effecting my family. Just 2 weeks ago there was a little boy at the park, maybe about 9 years old. My 9 year old was at the top of the big tube slide and the other boy was at the bottom. He was yelling swear words up the slide at my son. So I waited to see if the boys parents where there but none came. He keep yelling u the slide so I walked over and asked him if his parents were here, he looked at me and continued yelling up the slide, I asked him again but he kept going, so I told him to stop and he looked at me and yelled up the slide again. Told him to stop and let the other kids use the slide and he still did not listen. I walked over right beside him, I put my hand on his shoulder and told him in a very firm voice to stop and move away. Finally he listened and moved away. He was a little shit and I don't normal call kids shits

Sally - posted on 04/24/2012

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I do not or should say i did not ever allow my children near a dog unless the owner said that it was ok. Also in the park i always watched my children, their mine , so therefore its up to me to make sure they are safe and well-behaved but i have noticed that some parents use the playground as a free babysitting service and it piss's me off. If you don't want to look after them don't bloody have them . Its the same will belongings , teach your children to respect other peoples things ,toys, buggys etc by respecting them yourself.

Jennifer - posted on 04/24/2012

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I have taught my kids to always ask, and they are taught to aproach a dog correctly, from below not above, and they are also taught to asses the dogs temperment and mood, as sometimes owners are wrong! My kids also recognize various working dogs as such, and do not approach them. But I'm not a casual pet owner, most PARENTS can't tell a seeing eye dog from a pet!



I also frequently visit the park with my kids and dogs. While people can annoy the snot out of me, I also understand that a dog is going to draw lots of attention. Two of my dogs draw more attention than most due to the fact that they are hairless Chinese Cresteds. I just deal with it. If I must leave one of my big dogs tied while I go into the toy area, I put them on a down stay. I have no problem telling someone to leave them alone, even from a distance. I've had kids try to untie them, try to pull them, or get them to chase sticks, but they usually stop when I tell them to. My small dogs don't get tied up. I will pick them up and carry them. The socialization the dogs get from the park is important to me, so I deal with the issues. As for adult issues, I don't mind offending an adult!! I often use the phrase, "Do you mind?" as it seems to get the adult to realize they are crossing the line, without being too harsh.

Jasmine - posted on 04/24/2012

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My daughter gets excited when we see a someone walking their dog out on the street, but I always tell her that if she wants to pet it, we need to ask the dog's owner first because it's not our dog. She understands that just fine. Kids need to understand that animals have different temperments and if the dog isn't yours it's not polite to just run up and get in it's face.

[deleted account]

Ew thats really weird. No i would allo wmy daughter to ever go up to a dog that i didnt not know especially when an owner is not present just for my daughters safety and i think that is extremely rude that they were just all over ur stroller that wouldve really bothered me as well. .

Jessi - posted on 06/08/2011

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I haven't read through the 6 pages of post but i'm sure some other's who have posted work with animals as do i. it doesn't matter if the animal has a good temperament or bad....ALWAYS ask the owner because some owners just don't want you touching their pets. My St Bernards (especially my male) love kids but because of there size unless my parents or i are right there chances are you will get jumped on. My son and male are the same age and grew up together so Oliver is definitely used to being terrorized by Tj but that doesn't mean he's going to respond well if some random kid does to him what Tj does. My female is 6 and though she also is not aggressive she doesn't tolerate Tj's antics so she's definitely not going to tolerate some random kid.



My son:

Tj is 3'4" tall and his weight is generally 36lbs

My dogs:

Boo is about 5'-5'3" when on her hind legs and weighs 100lbs.

Oliver is about 5'6" when on his hind legs and weighs 144lbs (same height as me, 9lbs more than me).

Charity - posted on 06/07/2011

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I NEVER approach an animal without asking the owner if it's okay, first. Same for my little girl. Mostly because I don't know the animal's temperament. They might be very friendly, but strangers make them nervous. They might only be friendly with their own family. You never know. But also because I teach my children they are not to touch what doesn't belong to them. I do the same thing in the stores. My daughter knows she can't touch things on the shelves and hangers because it doesn't belong to her. It's EVERY parents' responsibility to teach their OWN child. NO MATTER WHERE THEY ARE. They should know that if something happens between the child and animal (like a bite or a scratch) it's not YOUR fault it happened because THEY should have been taking care of their own child. If you went up to their kid and told them "No." or something, they would be upset if you upset their kid.
If YOU are doing the right thing by keeping your dog where the park's rules tell you to keep her, then they should have enough common sense to respect you and your dog.

Mrs. - posted on 06/06/2011

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Yes, it may well be in bad taste, but I still think it's funny. It's funny because it's horribly true.

Dana - posted on 06/06/2011

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Okay, I had to mark that as funny, even though that might be in bad taste..

Mrs. - posted on 06/06/2011

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"AND...Philippina nannies in Toronto are an interesting phenomenon. They are everywhere! MANY of them are live ins and basically slave labour. I have a friend who is a nanny and she tells me the things her friends go through and it is truly horrendous IMHO. BUT yeah, you get what you pay for when it comes to child care...if you pay somebody next to nothing because you allow them to live in your basement, they're not gonna work to hard at teaching them proper manners or behaviour...just sayin'."

I completely agree. It is why I wonder if I should say anything...I know they are like slave labour. It is a bit of a outnumbered by the nannies situation. I mean, they already look at me like a freak because I'm actually caring for my own kid, in my neighbourhood (It is a wealthy neighbourhood with lots of private homes - I just happen to rent in a building nearby) and not working. I'm a bit of a dinosaur that way.

It is hard to say, "Hey, I know you live in some basement in the neighbourhood and they treat you like a field hand picking cotton pre-civil war, but could you make sure the kid you are caring for doesn't hit my dog?"

Isobel - posted on 06/06/2011

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I would never allow my child to approach any unknown dog. period. ever.

That being said, I can see how a lot of parents would see a smaller dog as being no threat and the fact that you brought it into a playground could solidify their belief. (clearly you wouldn't do it if the dog didn't like children...right?) not that I'm saying they are right...just that I can understand WHY they might feel that way.

I don't know if I would say that you should leave the dog at home, but would it be possible to find a smaller, quieter park? Obviously you are having problems with things other than just the dog (big kids pushing your little girl), perhaps a smaller park (which older kids find boring) would be a better fit for you and your family.

AND...Philippina nannies in Toronto are an interesting phenomenon. They are everywhere! MANY of them are live ins and basically slave labour. I have a friend who is a nanny and she tells me the things her friends go through and it is truly horrendous IMHO. BUT yeah, you get what you pay for when it comes to child care...if you pay somebody next to nothing because you allow them to live in your basement, they're not gonna work to hard at teaching them proper manners or behaviour...just sayin'.

Cyndel - posted on 06/06/2011

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I never allow my son to approach a dog alone right now, let alone a strange dog with no owner near by. Nor do I ever allow him to approach strangers or strangers belongings. He is not allowed to ask for any food that a stranger is passing out to their own children, etc. So many people don't teach basic courtesy to their children. It is sad.

Amanda - posted on 06/06/2011

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no i do not let my kid approch a dog without the owner being there and then i ask if its ok for my child to go near the dog.no other ppls strollers are not resting spots its private property and nobody should of been doing that one to urs at all..i would say somthing to someone if i found them doing that to mine. i do not let my children run free and i do say things to them if they are making trouble..and if they don't listen they get taken out of the play ground and go straight home. i would not allow them to act any different any where else i teach my children that other ppls homes and public places that other ppl are, are suppose to be respected and its the parents responseibility to wacth their children when they are at a park or play ground...i am totally agreeing with u on this one!!!!

Dana - posted on 06/06/2011

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Haha,no Jakki, we're not the same person. That would be weird! I think we're just like minded on some things. Dana is a friend though so like most friends I have on here, if we strongly disagree, I'll just keep away from those debates. So, it's more likely that you'll see us agreeing than not agreeing. :)



Besides, Dana M is weird, I'm not. :P

Amanda - posted on 06/06/2011

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Though I think its a parents responsiblity to teach a child not to apporch a strange dog, it is also your responsiblity to stay by your dog at all times. So if you can not be at the end of the leash why bring the dog? I never bring my dog if I plan on actually playing on the play ground with my children.

[deleted account]

Ummmm - Dana Mak and Dana S - are you the same person? You always seem to post at the same time and agree with each other!!

Angela - posted on 06/06/2011

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I did not read every response but half. Here is my opinion.
I worked at a a Animal Shelter as a Animal care tech and as an ACO (animal control officer) for the Metro DC area. I am a HUGE animal lover and advocate for the protection of them.
That being said I think you have to realize not all people know better than to approach an animal they do not know, and most children even if taught find it hard to resist a small pet. It is you the owner of your dog that is responsible for his/her welfare and if he/she were to hurt another dog/person/cat etc. You yourself state she/he is small and the stroller fell on the dog, that is not good at all but if the dog got hurt you put the dog in that situation.
If you leave the dog leashed to your stroller and go on to attend your child you can't attend to the dog. The dog goes into distress, you can't control others...not a good place for the dog.
If you are having to crate your dog, try a baby gate that is bigger or yes you must take more time for the dog to get out and your daughter. That is your responsibility not other people.
That being said, I strongly advocate to teach your children to not go to strange animals ever. I always tell my little one when she points out a dog, that yes doggies but we don't know that dog. Not all doggies are nice. But I do know she does not fully get it period. I feel responsible for her and make sure she does not approach the dog, I control the situation. I am in control period. So I EXPECT dog owners to be in control at all time also. If your dog got off the leash and hurt my child I would not be happy. If I were working and your dog got hurt I would not be happy. I would hold you responsible in the end.
As far as touching personal property etc...well I am with you on that, not acceptable in my world. As far as putting children at risk and not watching them, I would butt in, sorry but a child's welfare is worth butting in. Also if a child hits or pushes my child I have not any issue with telling the child that is not nice and or speaking with the parent, caregiver.
I am not trying to be a jerk I understand how much you must love your pet and I do appreicate how busy you are as a Mommy of a little one, it is just not a perfect world and we have to make compromise and us Mommies do that a lot
Also do you have a person you trust who can take you dog out for you while you take your daughter to the park? I wish I lived close cuz I would do it in a heart beat! I am always babysitting my friends dogs for them or taking them out for a good run while they are busy. Maybe you can find a dog lover who would enjoy the company of your dog.

Jacquie - posted on 06/05/2011

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Well i think thats kinda dumb. Parents should be watching their children and I hated when people would use my stroller for a resting spot too. Its Rediculous what people think they can do without asking. Maybe theres a different park you can go to. But people should respect other peoples spaces

Stacey - posted on 06/05/2011

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absolutly not! my daughter knows better then to just touch random dogs. she ALWAYS has to ask permision from the owner if she can pet their dog. because 1 we dont know the dog and 2 its just rude not to ask. as far as people touching my stuff i dont like that either, i dont go around touching other peoples stuff i would expect the same from others. and im also around my kids when were at the park and if my friend is with me and she wants to chit chat then shes going to have to fallow me around the playground lol i like to know whats going on around my kids and what their doing because i cant stand it when some parents just ignore their kids at the parks

Jenn - posted on 06/05/2011

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I'd just like to say 2 things: 1 - not ALL kids love dogs or animals, my daughter is terrifed of dogs. 2 - I'm "one of those Moms" who said to leave the dog home, and I do NOT let my kids just go up to animals and pet them, as I already stated.

Jen - posted on 06/05/2011

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@Rebecca Three -- I totally get your perspective here. I would and do correct children who misbehave in my presence -- at least if a supervising adult doesn't get to them first. But I do not tolerate cruelty -- to animals, to other children, to anyone. If I hear a kid call someone a name, I say something, politely but firmly, to that kid. If I saw a nanny neglecting a child in the park, to the point where that child was in danger of falling or teasing an animal, I would talk. I would talk to the nanny, the child, the parent -- and I would not shut up.

Don't let anyone intimidate you -- your child, your dog, your property, and your park are all part of your civic responsibility to oversee and protect.

Just don't slap any nannies along the way!

LadyJane - posted on 06/05/2011

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My kids have learned to never ever approach any dog or pet for that matter without first going to the owner and asking permission. My son was in fact turned down once because the dog was a former police dog and was prone to bite anyone.



It's not like the dog owner could take the dog with them to the actual area their child was playing in, the rules cited stated this. The other parents, nannies, should be teaching their kids proper manners in regards to animals. The best thing I would suggest, is to make a sign to place near the dog simply stating do not approach, dog will bite or something of that sort. I doubt it will stop all kids, but it may stop some. Or, instead take another adult with you, one that will stay by the dog while you're dealing with your daughter. That way the other adult could keep the kids away and you wouldn't have to worry about some child getting hurt because they don't have any manners.

Jane - posted on 06/05/2011

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I used to have the only vegetarian Brownie (and then Girl Scout) troop in South Texas. Many were Hindu, some were Muslim, some were Filipino, and some were from other groups. But none of them ate meat except every now and then a few chicken nuggets. We amazed and astounded the other troops but always had plenty of yummy food at cook outs. Fruit kebobs anyone? Vegetarian pizza (some with jalapenos)?



I cannot eat any animal that I know personally, so I try not to eat any at all. I don't even kill spiders.



And actually, my Hindu friends were most appalled at discovering that McDonald's french fries tasted so good because they use beef suet to flavor the frying fat. They don't mind other people eating cows, but they DO mind being tricked into eating them themselves.

Nicole - posted on 06/05/2011

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Yep, I missed that post, too. =S



And I did know that about the Northern Philippines culture. I am very bothered by that being the dog-lover that I am, but then again, I am sure that those of the Hindu faith are appalled that we eat so many cheeseburgers here in America since they feel the cow to be sacred. This is why I am a Vegetarian and only support eating animal products if those products are achieved in a humane way. That doesn't happen often enough anywhere in the world.



Many Americans wouldn't respect a cow at the park, either. So, point taken. Sorry.

Dana - posted on 06/05/2011

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Ahh, I missed that part about the nannies being Filipino.

It *may have* been a poorly executed post but, I do now get where you're coming from Jane. Each culture is different and they may not hold the highest respect for a dog as we may. We treat our animals like our children, that is a fact.

Jane - posted on 06/05/2011

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People who see dogs as a food source do not see dogs as individuals with personalities that deserve any sort of respect, such as considering that the animal might bite if approached incorrectly.

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But I still don't understand why you thought to mention that the nannie was looking at the dog as a food source? How is that relevant to the conversation? Am I missing something? I don't get it.

Rosie - posted on 06/05/2011

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stereotype much? i have TWO Fillapina aunts. they have dogs, don't eat them and watch their kids...

Jane - posted on 06/05/2011

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The OP said, and I quote: "it is not the parents watching the kids in this park, it is their nannies. The nannies are all Fillipino." Hence why I spoke of this particular ethnic group. And dog eating, even though illegal in the Philippines is still practiced there. On a personal note, I have had discussions with neighbors who are from the Philippines (not Americanized Filipinos, but newly arrived) and they did not have pet dogs because they figured dogs were just for eating and they didn't need to do that here.



FYI: "Despite a national law banning the practice, close to 500 000 dogs are slaughtered and eaten in the Philippines every year. Even though since 1998 it is illegal to consume this meat, the complete lack to enforce this law allows the markets and the restaurants to openly sell live dogs as well as dog meat." This isn't all over the Philippines but especially in the north in and around the region of Baguio City. Perhaps the Filipinos I have met here have all been from there.



I am involved in animal rescue and find that while all ethnic groups include folks who treat dogs badly, a few specific groups consider them food. I cited the Philippines in particular because the OP said the problem was nannies, not parents, and the nannies are all Filipino.



Our family includes Filipino blood, so I have nothing against the Philippines in particular.



Edited to add the source of the second quote: http://www.gan.ca/campaigns/philippines+...

Nicole - posted on 06/05/2011

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Dana, I know that there are many cultures that eat dogs, but I don't know how that pertained to this debate. It just felt off to me... Not to mention, that I couldn't figure out why the need to call out on just one particular ethnicity among the lackadaisical nanny group . It sounded like a personal problem with that ethnicity...

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I don't think you're being sensitive, Nicole. I HOPE her comment was not racially motivated, but I just don't see any other reason why she would say that?!! I guess we'll see....

Nicole - posted on 06/05/2011

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Wait, Jane... Are you being racist with your statement? I don't know, your whole comment rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe you are pointing out something true, I don't know, but it just sounded down-right prejudiced to the Fillipino community and I'm not usually overly sensitive. Hmmm.... Maybe, I am just being overly sensitive today, but I don't think so...

Mary - posted on 06/05/2011

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Melissa, I do understand what you are saying, but....I also know that Rebecca's daughter is close in age to my own. While she only has one dog, who is much smaller than either one of mine, I just can't fathom how you can keep your eyes on your toddler AND your dog in that environment. My local playground also has an off-leash dog park on the same campus, but even though my dogs are exceptionally well-behaved and socialized, I can't just drop them off for an hour or so while my toddler and I hit the playground. Not only would that be against the "rules", but I'm not leaving my fur-children unattended anymore than I would my daughter.

And as for "park politics"....I have simply been astounded at the variances in supervision and discipline amongst other mothers. However, unless it is directly affecting me and mine, I stay out of it. You want sit and play with your smart phone while your 3 and 4 y/o run rampant, that's your business (unless your kid is endangering mine), because honestly, I'm pretty sure that nothing I say is going to have any long term impact.

Jane - posted on 06/05/2011

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I have run across it here in town with Filipinas who are recently arrived in the States.

Jane - posted on 06/05/2011

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A big part of the problem here is probably cultural, The Filipino nannies don't see the dog as any sort of threat to the children So they let the kids play with the dog without asking. In fact, Filipino nannies are more likely to see the dog as a possible food source also. Pets are not viewed as part of the family in the Philippines. And finally, although paid to take care of the kids, these are not their kids. When under the eye of their employers the nannies must speak English and do things required of then. So park time becomes time to gossip in Tagalog with friends.

Karina - posted on 06/05/2011

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Unfortunately, you and your pup are being punished for other peoples misdeeds. One lesson that I have learned over the past years is that people are morons and a-holes, raising morons and a-holes.
the older I have gotten, the more I have become like my mother and great-grandmother; very open with expressing my opinion.
for the safety of the other children and your beloved pup, speak up and say back off. think of a worse case scenario: what if Malty bit a child? then the police would become involved, animal services, and Malty gets penalized by being "jailed" then possibly euthanized and your family is left without a dear family member and the court costs.
I have had to make the hard decision to leave my 15 lbs Boston in her kennel while I take my 2 1/2 year old daughter and 11 week old son to the park. It sucks, but I know that I cannot divide my attention, either one of my little ones (2 or 4 legged) will and can get hurt at the playground.
with that said, since your pup only weighs 8 lbs, have you ever thought of carrying your pup? ya know, use Paris Hilton style and carry a bag with pup in it?

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