The Dream Act

[deleted account] ( 24 moms have responded )

What do you all think of the Dream Act?

If you are unfamiliar, the Dream Act allows undocumented immigrants who arrived as children (legally or illegally) to apply for two years of deportation deferment. Meaning they can remain in the US for at least 2 more years without fear of deportation. They also become eligible for other rights, such as scholarships for college, drivers licences, and voting.

To qualify, they have to have arrived in the US as minors and lived here continuously (legally or illegally) for at least 5 years, and graduate an American High School.
If they complete 2 years of military service or 2 years of a 4 year college degree, they can get a 6 year deferment. During that time, if they complete their degree or are honorably discharged from military service, they can earn permanent residency. (Of course, they have to keep criminal records clean, and there are a few other details, but that is the gist of it.)

So what do you think? I am really excited about this bill because a lot of the people I work with in my homeless programs are undocumented immigrants. They are not bad people, they just want a chance to give their kids a good life. A lot of people are really mad that this got passed. They say it encourages illegal immigration. I can understand that, but I also know that for some, it is the only way they can get here.

(This week begins the application process)

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Rosie - posted on 08/29/2012

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sally, wheres your proof that illegal immigrants are far more likely to commit crimes and end up on welfare? you do know that the government doesn't give welfare to illegal immigrants, and that even when they do become legal they have to wait 5 more years for any type of benefit like that? of course some find their way around it...but not the majority by any means. their LEGAL children can get benefits like medicaid and food, but not the the illegal immigrant themselves.heres some info for you. http://www.factcheck.org/2009/04/cost-of...

Jenny - posted on 08/18/2012

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I also believe in a world without borders. Humans should have the right to freedom of movement on our planet. We are all just trying to support our families just like every other animal.

Barbara - posted on 08/28/2012

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In the cases this covers they did not choose anything. They were brought here as children by their parents. Many of them as infants who don't even remember anything else. I know of one case the girl didn't even know she was an illegal until she wanted to go get her drivers license.

Megan - posted on 08/21/2012

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The Dream Act was not passed. Obama authorized the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program. This program temporarily prevents deportation and offers the chance to apply for work to people brought to the US illegally IF they meet ALL 7 of the requirements some of which are:
1. They are currently under the age of 31
2. They were brought here before the age of 16
3. Currently enrolled in school, have a HS Diploma, GED or have been honorably discharged from the military.
4. Have not been convicted of a felony or 3 or more misdemenors.

Therefore the majority of the people you work with Kelly, wouldn't be eligible. AND the agrument that they would be new welfare reciepents doesn't really apply. It's not a realisitc solution to have a kid that can't even remember their 'home' country, has no family or ties to that country 'go back' and apply to come here legally.
Kids can't and shouldn't be held accountable for their parent's bringing them to the US illegally no more than we should punish kids for having alcoholic or drug addicted parent. It's a situation they were placed in with no choice in the matter. The fact that these kids have made the effort to be productive members of society, stayed out of trouble and are trying to right a wrong speaks volumes and are EXACTLY the type of people we should be welcoming. I'm all for providing a path to make them legal provided they meet the requirements. Legal to work, pay taxes and be a contributing member of society. You have to start somewhere. The problem isn't going to go away and no...they obviously won't just be sent back.

Sally - posted on 08/21/2012

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It's just another way to let the illegal immigrants get in ahead of the legal ones so they'll vote for you instead of the people who respect the law. Yes, it is sad that these kids are being punished for their parents crime. However, it is their parents fault and NOT ours. They also have the option of applying to be here legally just like every other immigrant.
Also, it does give people an excuse to keep coming illegally because as soon as their kids have the citizenship (that they took away from someone trying to do it legally), the family members who broke the law to bring them here get moved ahead of all the people who are trying to follow the rules immigration laws. It's punishing people who follow the law by rewarding the people who break the law and there is no way it could ever be fair or right.

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Tracy - posted on 01/18/2013

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Sally, illegal immigrants are more likely to commit crimes (assuming statistically this is true) because they are limited on the avenues of legitimate income possibilities as well as education. Just like teen moms are traditionally known to have unhealthy babies. Not because they are teens, but because in the past they have had to hide their pregnancies and not receive medical care the way an older mother would. Often they haven't been educated on proper eating habits for pregnancy either. Illegal immigrants *might* be more statistically drawn to crime due to social pressures and limitations not because they are inherently driven to commit them simply because they are foreign or WANT to be unethical or immoral.

Tracy - posted on 01/18/2013

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I think it's a great thing IF we change our citizenship laws to begin. I don't see how we can blame children who were forced across the border and then grew up here as long as they have stayed clean of the law and whatnot. None of us should have to suffer for our parents' choices. Especially lose everything we may have worked for because of something our parents did or "forced" us into. But we also need to change our laws to more like that of Canada and others. You only gain citizenship "automatically" if you are born to an existing citizen - not because you were born within the geographical borders.

[deleted account]

Why is it called the Dream Act?
************
Same reason as the Patriot Act. It sounds good and anyone going against means they don't believe in giving people a dream. And anyone voting against the Patriot Act must clearly mean they are traitors to the nation.

Pamela - posted on 01/15/2013

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"ILLEGAL immigrants are far more likely to commit crimes and land on welfare." I'd like to see some statistics on that one Sally.

Rosie - posted on 08/29/2012

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i like it, i think it gives them a positive way to become good productive citizens of the united states. kinda like rewards for a job well done, simple parenting tactic, lol.

Sally - posted on 08/28/2012

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Many of the places LEGAL immigrants come from are third world countries. Very few of them have much in the way of "formal" education and most of them don't speak English particularly well. Because they have enough of a work ethic and respect for our country to follow the laws, most of them learn when they get here. ILLEGAL immigrants are far more likely to commit crimes and land on welfare. Some of their governments even give them pointers on how to get our charity and how to evade criminal prosecutions when they get here. It's sad that children are being deported for their parents crime, but they should be blaming their parents instead of the laws their parents broke.

[deleted account]

I have not removed anything from my previous posts.



I wasn't upset about your majority comment, I was looking for clarification on it. I'm sorry if it came across wrong. I thought that perhaps you misunderstood the population I work with. Many of them do meet the requirements to receive deferment through this program, so I was just wondering what I said that made you think that this program would not help them. Sorry for the confusion.



ETA: I work with the homeless population, most of whom are citizens, but many are undocumented immigrants.



Edited again for clarification. I'm not sure if the "AND the argument that they would be future welfare recipients" was aimed at me or not, but I totally agree with that statement--these immigrants are here to work and become valuable parts of our society and I feel they should have that right.

Megan - posted on 08/28/2012

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Kelly, I'm not sure what exactly you're upset about regarding my "majority" comment. I see you edited your original post and removed a lot of what you said previously however you still reiterated that it wouldn't help the 'majority' so I'm not sure exactly how to respond to you.

[deleted account]

"Therefore the majority of the people you work with Kelly, wouldn't be eligible." Megan



I'm not sure what gave you that idea, Megan. True, the program will not help the majority of people I work with because the majority of them are not immigrants, however, it would help a large percentage of the immigrant population that I work with. When their parents bring them here, they are not moving into homes, they are using a fake address to enroll in school and living on the streets. A lot of the younger, homeless immigrants I work with ARE enrolled in school, they want to go onto college, they are not committing crimes, etc. They meet the requirements. Over the past week, our shelter helped submit over 130 applications. I know 130 people sounds like a drop in the bucket, a number so small it's hard to believe it even matters in the big picture, but if you are one of those 130 people, it's a big deal.



Sally, you still didn't answer my question--how do they learn English with no access to learning materials, no access to books, computers, internet, or teachers? Yes, LEGAL immigrants have been coming to this country for years; however the laws have changed a lot over those years and it is very difficult to immigrate here now. Furthermore, most LEGAL US immigrants come from a place where they have access to books, computers, internet, etc. Why should they be more entitled to citizenship than those who do not have access to educational tools?

[deleted account]

i think it's a good thing because i think depiorting people who were brought here as children back to a country they may not even remember is like punishing them for their parent's choices. if a person is willing to keep their nose clean and work hard then i think they should be allow to stay, not punished for a decision they had no say in. and i don't even really udnerstand why americans get so pissed about mexicans (since that;'s really who they seem to bitch about) "taking their jobs" when a good proportion of them are not taking high demand american jobs, but jobs natural born or legal americans don't want anyways.

Sally - posted on 08/21/2012

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They can apply to be here legally the exact same way every other LEGAL immigrant has done for as long as we have been a country. They can jump through the exact same legal hoops every other LEGAL immigrant has for as long as we have been a country.
The fact that they have chosen to sneak in without playing by the rules is a violation of law. It IS illegal to be here without following the immigration laws. The fact that they are here IS a crime. So yes they ARE ILLEGAL aliens. LEGAL aliens would have followed the necessary laws to come here and their stay would NOT be a crime. In fact, LEGAL immigrants should be made welcome as they have proven they are law abiding.
The Dream act DOES take chances away from others. We can only fit a certain number of new people at a time. A LEGAL immigrant who has spent YEARS and CASH jumping through hoops to follow the rules has to wait longer every single time an ILLEGAL immigrant gets a break so we can feel good about ourselves. As an added non-benefit, we get a new welfare recipient instead of a productive member of society. That is why we should want to keep them out.

[deleted account]

Sally and Shawn, pleas explain to me exactly HOW they can apply to be here legally in our current system. Keep in mind the current requirements and their current situation.
Those that need to come here the most do not speak English or have access to books, internet, or teachers to help them learn. Where are they going to get access to those things? Here.
They do not have jobs that are in demand here because they are uneducated--the get a work VISA you must be in a field where your expertise is in demand and be able to offer something that other American's cannot. Where are they going to get an education to develop those skills? Here.

I'm not saying we should support people coming here illegally, but this is a step in the right direction for making immigration attainable for those who need it most. Sure, it is simple to immigrate here if you are coming from a first world country, but those are not the people who need the most help. The Dream Act does not take legal citizenship away from anyone, in fact, it opens legal immigration up to more people because there are now more slots open in the traditional immigration route--the Dream Act did not cut any of those numbers. Would you rather have them storm across with guns like the white people did? Of course, anyone trying to move in on us today would loose, but why waste the lives?

Furthermore, it is no illegal to be in the US without documentation--I hate the term "illegal aliens", it implies that the person himself is illegal. It is illegal to WORK or collect benefits in the US without documentation, and a person can be deported for committing a crime if they do not have documentation, but just being here is not a crime. It is illegal to cross the boarder at unauthorized places, and illegal to cross the boarder at authorized places without documentation, so if they are here without documentation, it can be assumed, but not proven, that they committed a misdemeanor to get here. Luckily, our justice system relies on proof, so they cannot be deported just for being here without documentation unless they are found working or found guilty of another crime.

What I don't understand is people's intense desire to keep them out. What have they done that is so horrible that they should not have the right to clean water, safe streets, and good schools?

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 08/20/2012

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My thoughts are: If they were brought in as minor children, with no choice in the matter, then this is fine. However, it is still encouraging parents who "want their kids to have a better life" to illegally immigrate, have anchor babies, and then bypass the system.

ALL of my great grandparents were immigrants. They got here legally, by applying for places on the boats that brought them from a war torn Europe. They stayed in quarantine on Ellis Island, and went through all of the legal hoops (at that time). It wasn't any easier then. People died en route. People were turned away at Ellis, some for very superficial reasons.

If I want to live in, say Germany, I have to apply to be a legal alien. I would have to file the appropriate documentation, and would have to continue to update that information while in country. This is pretty much the same for any country.

There are plenty of legal routes to US residency. Work VISA, student VISA, etc. All of these are obtainable. If they do not have a work visa, not only do they run the risk of deportation, but anyone who employs them does as well.

But, as I stated, I'm perfectly OK with the conditions set out for minor children of illegal immigrants. They did not have a choice in the matter. They had to do what mama and papa told them to do. For that, they should not be punished, but should have to fulfill certain terms and conditions for citizenship, which are very clearly outlined, and attainable.

[deleted account]

I don't think this gives them a way to bypass the legal process, I feel it gives those who cannot come in through our current legal immigration system another legal way to reside here.

Parents of minor children here legally are allowed to remain in the US with their child regardless of the parent's status. There are certain criteria to be met, but if we didn't allow this, we'd have a lot of children separated from their parents, which would further clog our already over burdened social system for children.

Immigration to the US legally is possible for many, but it is impossible for those who need to come here the most. People say "If they want to be here, they should do it legally," like it's the easiest thing in the world. I can assure you, if these people were able to do it legally, they would have. Why should they be denied rights just because they were born on the other side of some imaginary line?

I know I've said this before, but in order to legally immigrate to the US, immigrants must have several hundred dollars on hand (keep in mind that these people are coming from a world where only the richest have bank accounts, so they have to save all of this money up in cash, and avoid being robbed while living in high crime areas for the few years it takes to save up this amount.) They have to learn English, which can be impossible without access to books, teachers, or even other English speakers. If you think this is easy, try learning German without any books to go by, no internet, and no teachers. I've not yet met anyone who could do it. Let's not forget that many of the people hoping to escape across our boarder were forced out of school at an early age to care for siblings and work to help support their families. They don't get to take English as a 2nd Language in highschool. Next, there is the wait list. Immigration takes at a minimum, 3 years, but very few get through that fast--the average is 7 years, with some taking up to 15 years. By that time, the children these parents are hoping to help are too old to start school here.

Juliannemarie - posted on 08/17/2012

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I believe in a world without borders. So I 100% agree with this. We were all born on earth, we should share it equally.

Krista - posted on 08/17/2012

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I think it is a great idea. For those people, they came here as kids. The US is their home -- the only home many of them have ever known. Even if their parents did come here illegally, how is it fair to punish those kids and deport them to (what is to them) a foreign country, where they have no friends, connections, or even possibly family?

It's a good process. It's not automatic residency -- they still have to earn it through their schooling or their service. And i would bet you dollars to donuts that those kids are going to work their ASSES off while in school or in the military, and will no doubt make something of themselves. We talk about supporting small businesses and entrepreneurship, and I ask you -- look at how many small businesses are run by immigrants? Just in my teeny-tiny village, we have a convenience store and a pizza joint, both run by Lebanese immigrants. And those businesses have created a small handful of jobs.

I'm excited as hell for those kids, and am happy that they're getting a chance to become permanent residents in the country that has always been their home. I think it will pay a lot of dividends to our economy to have these young, energetic, determined people entering our workforce.

Michele - posted on 08/16/2012

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To answer your question, Dove, the answer is because there are only so many immigrants allowed to come in legally. If they want to be here, then they need to do it legally. This allows immigrants to bypass the process in place and get in ahead of those who do things legally. I know people who came legally who do not like this idea for that reason.

That was the explanation of why not, but I personally believe that minors who grew up here should probably have a chance because they did not have a choice about it. In my experience, they have no connection to their home country and are Americans in attitude if not in actuality. The only problem I have is if their parents, who chose to break the law, are given the same process.

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