Tipping

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Johnny - posted on 05/23/2011

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After reading this whole thread I still don't understand why I need to tip for terrible service?

I tip well for good service, I tip average for average service. But it is still a bonus. If you are incompetent and can't manage your job, should not be rewarded for it. Probably a sign to find a new job.

I don't understand why it should be my problem that your boss doesn't pay you to provide shitty service? Huh?

[deleted account]

I said in the other thread that I EXPECT good service. That's the job of waiters or servers or whatever you call them. If I get super-good service (above and beyond) I'll tip. I will NEVER, EVER tip for bad service, I don't care what the excuse is. I would complain, and I would never go to that restaurant again. And I'd tell my friends that the service is crappy at X restaurant.



You can explain till you're blue in the face that waiters rely on tips because that's the system Not my problem. I feel no obligation to prop up what seems to be a dodgy industrial relations system. When I go to a restaurant I want good food and good service, I don't want to get involved in employer/employee stuff.

Jodi - posted on 05/23/2011

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Mary Renee, we are actually well aware of HOW tipping works in the US, we just do not agree with it. THAT"s why it isn't going to get through - because we disagree. You can beat us over the head, smack us around, and tell us a sob story. It isn't that we don't understand, it is that we don't agree.

Your EMPLOYERS are the ones exploiting you.

Mrs. - posted on 05/23/2011

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"It is not difficult to carry food to a table, keep a cup full, and be nice...."

@Kelly, Wow!

I'm kinda speechless. This is as demeaning a statement as those ignorant people who say things like, "Being a SAHM is easy, you sit on the couch all day and eat bon-bons."

My suggestion, if you haven't already worked serving, go do it again for awhile. You think it is easy right? So, just go work at some chain restaurant for a couple months at see how easily you do all the simple tasks assigned to you with a smile of your face all the time. Take pictures...post them. It'll be very educational.

I know when my fiance cleans the bathrooms every shift at his high end restaurant...the stories of the women's washroom alone make me cringe...he always has a big ole smile on his face. Easy Peasy.

[deleted account]

I'm not sure what thread this is from, but it sounds like a bit of misinformation has been given.

Tipping in the US is NOT compulsory and is simply a gratuity. Many would like to think it's compulsory, but it's not. It's standard to tip 15-20% of the bill for an efficient waiter and the reason it's To Insure Promptness is because it is supposed to be an incentive for the waiter to hustle. The faster you eat and get out, the sooner they can get someone else at that table. It's all geared toward higher turnover.

What I've always thought was unfair is that a restaurant manager can actually pay below minimum wage legally. What they can do is calculate how much you should be able to make in tips and deduct that amount from what they will pay the waiter. So I suppose you can see it as a commission based type of job. The reasoning behind this is to motivate the waiter to be more efficient and produce a higher table turnover.

I've always tipped based on service. There are a few times where I've left nothing and times where I've tipped 200%. Once I was leaving a diner with a friend and we hadn't tipped anything (it was a horrible experience and never went back). The waiter actually followed us out of the restaurant, harassing us the entire way!

However, I actually think wait staff in Australia get paid too much. Why? Because it takes forever to get your meals, they are never attentive (except at high end places where they sort of expect tips) and you don't really get looked after. It annoys me something shocking at how laissez faire wait staff are here.

Emma, people tip and it's a given. If you don't get tips, it's a sign that you better lift your game. Think of the tips as something similar to leaving a comment card. No money = you need improvement. But, even with tipping the standard 15-20%, the bill at a restaurant in the US is still cheaper than here. Also, it's not just waiters that you tip. You're also "supposed" to tip: taxi drivers, bell boys, hair dressers, shampooers, barbers, housekeepers, pet groomers... Pretty much any lower paying service related job.

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Isobel - posted on 05/25/2011

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well...no excuses, but often plenty of reasons.

really...you should see the movie Waiting with Ryan Reynolds and Justin Long...it IS hilarious.

Jodi - posted on 05/25/2011

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Oh, I wasn't suggesting you would give shitty service, I was just saying there is never an excuse for it.

Isobel - posted on 05/25/2011

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For example though...I used to serve this cranky old lady bacon and eggs every Sunday morning, and EVERY week she left her eggs till last and then complained that they were cold. I finally brought her breakfast out to her with no eggs (great service IMHO) and told her that when she was ready for her eggs, I would bring them out to her.

She promptly complained to my boss about my shitty service because I didn't bring her her eggs.

Her bitchiness and inability to recognize good service didn't mean she wasn't getting good service.

Jodi - posted on 05/25/2011

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Oh, and in Australia, often when you tip, it doesn't actually go to that server. ALL of the staff share the tips. So if my meal was crappy, I don't tip either. I'm not adding to the pool for a crappy meal. But the difference is, all staff in Australia receive a generous minimum wage. If they want a tip, they have to work damn hard for it.

Jodi - posted on 05/25/2011

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In all honesty, Laura, I have rarely left a place without leaving a tip. Most servers are great. But there are places here where you just simply DON'T tip. Clubs, pubs, that sort of thing.

I'm actually a very friendly customer, because the servers ARE human (mostly :P). Yeah, I can see how a sneer of contempt would tip you off. But it still doesn't excuse shitty service. Sure, go through the basic motions and don't bend over backwards, but shitty service is never acceptable.

Isobel - posted on 05/25/2011

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but seriously...if you are patient and polite, and have reasonable expectations...your server will usually bend over backwards to give you good service. The problem IS...that the ASSHAT sitting at the table behind you may be ruining it for everybody.

Jodi - posted on 05/25/2011

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Oh, ok :) So you prejudge them, and then provide basic service because they are a shitty customer and when you don't get a good tip....self-fulfilling prophecy?

Jodi - posted on 05/25/2011

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But how can you know which is a good customer if they have never been there before? So you kind of have to be a good server in order to find out don't you?

Isobel - posted on 05/25/2011

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having a good customer makes it easier to be a good server...just sayin ;)

Mrs. - posted on 05/24/2011

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Not to mention...at the restaurant I work at, they made us memorize short order codes for each item and substitute...like old school waiters. We wrote down the codes, but keeping it all in your head was much harder than any script I've ever had to memorize..and I've done a one person show that was an hour long. Seriously, you might see a waiter writing something down, but you may not realize the amount of memorization that is occurring between your mouth and the server's pad.



Sounds like you are basing you opinion of it being an easy job on one place you worked. From what you said, Kelly, it was one place...compared to several of the people here who are career servers or have years of experience in several countries/cities/establishments.



It is your choice if you want to take that one experience and let it blanket over the collective experience of seasoned professionals.



Say what you want about tipping, that's your own karma. However, saying the job is easy, because you worked in one restaurant, in front of a public that may actually not know much about the industry, is damaging and frankly, it is misinformation.



Let's put it this way, you know how annoying it is to hear some rich celebrity say how easy being a mother of one kid is? People who have nannies round the clock, people to do everything for them, it is a bit demoralizing to hear crap like that. Let's say you have not one kid, but five. You have no money, no help and it is a struggle. Would you want that celebrity going around speaking for you and your worth, much less for all the mothers out there saying it is easy?



That is your experience I get it. I'd just like to make it clear to anyone who has not worked in the industry extensively, many, many people do not agree with this opinion. Everyone is entitled to say what they think, but the experience of it being an easy job is not common.



It ain't migrant farm work, but it ain't easy.

Sarah - posted on 05/24/2011

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Exactly Laura!!

Seriously, try serving 200 people, on Xmas day........and tell me it's not hard work! lol (not serving them all by myself of course! That would have killed me!)

Isobel - posted on 05/24/2011

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and you should have the menu and wine/beer list (if there is one) memorized so you can answer questions and give advice.

I think the difficulty level truly depends most on how busy of a place it is, and how high end.

Sarah - posted on 05/24/2011

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Even if you write the orders down, you still have to remember who asked for more water and who asked for more sauce or more napkins or needed whatever the hell these fussy buggers would ask for. LOL!!

I think the unsociable hours were part of the worst bit. I would be at work for 7:30am until 2pm, then back in at 5:30pm until 10....11...12....depending on what was going on. You work bank holidays, weekends, christmas bloody day!!

I was also literally running around ALL the time, carrying 5 plates all balanced up my arm......I swear, I probably walked about 10 miles in a single shift!

I agree though that with most jobs you have to be smiling and polite, it's not that hard to do.....most of the time! ;)

[deleted account]

The "you said it yourself" part was a general you referring to the several posts on previous pages on that subject. Only the first sentence was addressed to you specifically, because you addressed me, while the rest of the post was generalized for everyone. Sorry for the confusion, I did not realize the syntax was that integral to the argument.

I do agree that serving is not THE easiest job out there, but I must argue that it is NOT terribly difficult to do it adequately enough to earn the tip.
My experience with serving was average--I worked in a family chain in a high volume metro area. Yes, there were days I didn't feel like being nice, but that is part of the job so I did it--in fact, it is part of almost every job. You cannot succeed in any field if you lack manors. Yes, the tray can be heavy, but it's not THAT heavy--30lbs tops. Sarah did make a good point about memory, at my chain, we wrote orders down, so I didn't have to memorize them, I suppose some do, but most of the places I've eaten in the server writes it down.

Isobel - posted on 05/24/2011

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I just saw the movie Waiting, with Ryan Reynolds, Justin Long, and Dane Cook...LOVED that movie, and every ex waiter should watch it

Sarah - posted on 05/24/2011

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While I loved being a waitress, I wouldn't say it was the easiest jobs out there.
It's often very unsociable hours, it takes a good memory, you're on your feet all day, you have to be "smiling and happy" even when customers are rude to you (which can happen A LOT), you have to be a perfectionist, and not only a waitress, but in some cases a cleaner, polisher, vacuumer (if that's a word!) washer-upper (if that's a word! lol) and generally work your bloody arse off for not a lot of money.

I waitressed in hotels, and it was HARD work, but it was really fun too.

Anyway, I think there are WAY easier jobs out there than being a waitress. What I do now (working in a supermarket) is 100X easier......but not so fun! lol

Mrs. - posted on 05/24/2011

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"You said yourself that your "boss" in the restaurant is really just a schedule setter,"

Yeah, I didn't say that. Someone might have, but I didn't

Like I did say, if you have worked in the industry, you should give it a try again. I'll pick out the restaurant so you do actually have to "lift heavy objects".

When I worked in the states, in a big chain family style restaurant, it was the most physically demanding serving job I've ever had. Pretty much the most physically demanding job, I've ever had, period. I'm saying this having made my living in musical theatre in the early days, doing six-seven days a week singing and dancing my ass off. Nope, lifting huge buffet trays for high maintenance Americas was the hardest. Anyone who says differently either worked in a low volume environment with small expectations or just didn't work long enough to be able to speak on the subject with authority.

It's not that I don't believe you..it is just that your experience as a server is not common. You might be letting you uncommon experience as a server colour your view of the job. Perhaps it is time for a refresher before you speak for everyone by saying it is easy?

Another example, my fiance worked/owned his on construction business. You know building houses, lifting walls...that kind of stuff. Now, he works in a high end, high volume restaurant. He says, on a busy night, it is far more taxing on the body...but you have the added mental stress. The mental stress generally comes from dealing with the public.

[deleted account]

Rebecca, I have worked as a server. It was easy. Yes, it had it's difficult moments, as every job on earth does, but they were few and far between. You are not going to find a job that is ALWAYS easy, but serving tables is, overall, one of the easiest jobs out there, even when you factor in only jobs with comparable pay. It requires minimal mental or physical effort--yes, you have to stand and walk a lot, but you are not lifting heavy objects, working dangerous machinery, making decisions that effect multitudes of others jobs, working in extreme climates, etc. All you have to do is be nice, write correctly, and bring orders out.



I don't think there is anything "wrong" with the service industry's pay system here, if servers do their jobs adequately, they earn a decent income. I agree with the "do as the Romans" philosophy to the extent of tipping for adequate service, but no one should tip for bad service. Remember, restaurant food in the US costs A LOT less than in other countries because we know a tip will be added. You said yourself that your "boss" in the restaurant is really just a schedule setter, so your real boss is the customer you are serving. In any other industry, you would not expect your boss to pay you for performing inadequately, so why would you expect your customer to?

Isobel - posted on 05/24/2011

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Yes, when I worked at the keg I had to pay out a portion of what I SOLD to the kitchen, another portion to the bar, and another portion to the bussers. If you don't tip, you can actually be making it so that your server is PAYING to serve you.

I'm a very pretty good tipper most of the time, you have to be pretty rude to get less than 15% from me though.

I don't lower my tip based on mistakes or errors, I lower it on the server being rude or snarly and treating me like shit.

Krista - posted on 05/24/2011

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@Shannen.... in a lot of places, if you don't tip you ARE taking money from the servers. The reason is that the servers are expected to tip out a portion of their tips to the kitchen. In most places, this is mandatory.
I can't remember how often I would get so completely upset at the kitchen workers for screwing up because it was MY money they were screwing with. They got their money regardless and that's not right.

As for me, I worked as a server and bartender for over 10 years. It's a hard job. It's physically demanding as well as emotionally demanding. If you think it's an easy job to do, then you're sadly mistaken. In fact, the job of a server is rated one of the most stressful jobs that there are in the world.

Think about it, if someone is having a bad day, it's going to be taken out on you. Then, if they complain, the manager has to take it out on you. Then your tips go down the drain.

I've come to realize that sometimes the person is just VERY overwhelmed and is trying their very best. Many times, restaurants tend to be understaffed on many occasions and so it's extremely hard to take on a section. Often times, I had 12-15 tables to myself. Many of those tables would house 6 guests at a time. Things happen and you forget.

However, I've also come to know when someone just doesn't give a damn. And THAT is when I don't tip.

[deleted account]

That's a good point Cathy, generally I would say I am quite a low demand customer - I like that the server is polite and smiles when serving us and that they where possible are attentive to our needs (i.e. drinks topping up) but I understand that sometimes we do go out to eat during the peak times and so the server will be slower and less attentive during those times - I realise I may have to wait for a table or a little longer for my food and drinks. I also don't necessarily see mistakes as bad service - sometimes people get distracted and forget about little things, as long as the issue is resolved quickly and with a sorry I ignore it, unless it is one of many mistakes or a serious mistake. However, if I am eating in a very expensive restaurant I expect more because I am paying more for the basics.

Mary Renee - I have to completely disagree with that sentiment, if the service is not good (see above I don't ask for a lot, my definition of good may be somebody elses definition of satisfactory service). If I do not recieve my definition of good service I am not going to pay a tip - if my server cannot even smile at me then it is their fault if they are out of pocket at the end of the night. If a server cannot even do basic parts of their job then it really isn't my problem, I always smiled at customers, I was always polite to customers and I was always professional even when I wanted to dump their meal on their head because they were being such arses. I agree that it is not fair when as a server you give good service yet the patron refuses to pay the tip (in the US) as it is relyed on for the wages and tbh it is made pretty clear that you should tip in the US (at least it has been to me everytime I have visited). I will order my food and look in their eyes without feeling shame because if they are not doing their job I am not going to pay for a service I didn't receive, just like if I purchased something in a shop and it was broken I would return it and would expect a refund.

[deleted account]

Agree, Jodi! And the system is allowing the employers to go right on exploiting the waiters. And people wonder why we don't agree!



And the "when in Rome" argument doesn't wash with me. It's a cop out.

[deleted account]

"during the short time you're visiting instead of knowingly take five dollars (or more) out of someone's hard earned."

If i don't tip i'm not taking money from the server i'm just not giving you MY hard earned cash as your employer should be paying you not me, i don't go out to eat to be served by a specific person i dine at an establishment and pay my hard earned money for the whole experience not just one person.

[deleted account]

What Mary Renee fails to realise is that the Japanese also expect good service, but they would not tell you that they do. I'm sorry, but the Japanese leave a gratuity based on the level of service as well and I actually find her statements offensive being an American, Japanese and Australian citizen... and I don't offend easily!

The sense of entitlement is mislaid. Mary is making it sound like the servers should have the sense of entitlement. We OWE servers a tip for just bringing out the food?! Uh, no. How many of us work in a customer service type job and NEVER get tips? Receptionists, secretaries, cafeteria/tuck shop workers, bank tellers, etc. Most people I know, in the US, who are or have been wait staff understand that a tip is just like a bonus. Of course some have to try and live off that, which sucks for them, but it is just a bonus and shouldn't be assumed to be any more.

I actually know someone who is a waitress in a pretty high end restaurant in LA. She makes more in one night than my husband makes in a fortnight! And my husband makes a decent wage by Australian standards. She had to work in the crappy joints and work her way up to the high end place over the course of 6 years, but she actually liked her job and she understood while working at the lower end places (like Denny's and IHOP) that she wouldn't make much, but it was a means to an end. This woman would be the first to tell you that a tip is NOT required, but it is appreciated.

[deleted account]

It is a very shit system! I've known about the low wages since I was in high school, but I also know that a tip is a gratuity (a gift of money over and above payment due for service), NOT a wage. It is not the customer's responsibility to pay for service, it's the owner/manager's job. I also think that you've been handed a crappy excuse for not paying you a decent wage, Mary Renee. You are hired by the restaurant to perform a duty. If you didn't do this duty, the restaurant would go out of business, wouldn't it? So it's quite a key role to the business. Wait staff should be treated fairly and should at least be given the minimum wage (not the "special" reduced wages).

Mind you, the double edge to that sword is the problem faced in Australia. Poor service as a result of a wage that's too high. (yes, I do know it's still a low paying job here too) It's hard for me not to compare service in Australian establishments with ones in the US. US wait staff are by far superior in the performance of their job, out of necessity. Raising wages too far might take some of that motivation away.

I've always thought that perhaps if there were a wait staff union there could be a push for better wages. No one should work a full day, in a difficult job, and be handed a $1 paycheck!

Even though I know about the wages being low, I still leave a gratuity based on service. Now, it is rare that I wouldn't leave a tip, because good service deserves at least the minimum. Bad service deserves little to nothing. Someone said that leaving a small tip would be worse than no tip. I've done that as well. Like leaving the change from the money for the bill. Bad service doesn't deserve a reward and I don't owe anyone to be served food in a restaurant. The boss owes the server a decent wage.

[deleted account]

Mary Renee, I don't need to come out with your anticipated responses, since you've obviously worked that out for yourself.

But thanks for your hospitable attitude. I will point out,not to mary Renee, as she's not here any more, that the lot of the working class is only ever going to be improved with a thorough overhaul of the system.

Yes, I do have a sense of entitlement - to good service.

Constance - posted on 05/23/2011

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I am generally a big tipper. I have worked for tips and I had to pay a percentage to the host/hostess,table busters, and food runners. It really is a group effort in a resturant. If the food is bad it's the chef's fault not the servers. If the serve sucks then the tip gets low.
I tip just about everybody that provides me a service. I do it because it is the right thing to do. When they receive something more then they know they are doing a good job and that is all anyone wants.

Mary Renee - posted on 05/23/2011

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Ok, Kathy, I never defended the system, nor did I whine about my "crummy" job (I haven't been a waitress in two years) I only tried to educate people from countries that do not tip, particularly Australians in my experience, how tipping works in the United States so they could avoid being perceived as cheap snobs.

But since none of this is getting through, and I can no longer come to this thread because it's driving me batty I can only ask that all of you who have some sense of entitlement (poorly disguised as a wish to "change the system" in a country they don't even reside in) please refrain from visiting the United States (particularly Hawaii, thanks) Honestly, we don't need your tourism (particularly since the money you spend here is clearly not going to the working class servers) and the Japanese are much better at respecting and appreciating our service instead of just expecting to get their ass kissed with out paying for it. Alright! I'm out! Enjoy your meals everyone! Hope karma doesn't come back to bite you in the ass!!!!

Let's see, I'm taking names of the non-tippers and dropping them off at the restaurants and hotels in Waikiki so that if anyone tries to start a tab with a credit card or charge room service under these names, the servers will know exactly what kind of service to give you. Hahaha

(cue outraged responses about how immature I am and how I don't deserve a tip especially since I'm "threatening" potential customers, hahaha)

[deleted account]

Even in the US, or anywhere in the world, if the service is bad, you do not need to tip. It would be ridiculous to give a tip to a rude or inefficient server. I know they get paid crap wages, but they CHOSE that job, and they knew when they took it what the pay was like. I have several friends who are servers because it pays so well--yes, the given wage is crap, but they make a ton in tips. It is not difficult to carry food to a table, keep a cup full, and be nice.....sorry, but if a server can't do the job well enough to merit the tips they expect, they need another job.

Sherri - posted on 05/23/2011

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I tip 20% or more for great service. 10% for crap service.



I like the system just fine. It is considered a commission job with the tips being your commission. If you do a great job I have friends walking away $300-$400 a night in tips on a Thurs, Fri and Sat. evening. If you are great at what you do you can make more in 3 days then my husband does working a full time job a week. If you are not up to par your work and pay are sure going to be effected and you won't earn nearly enough to get by.

Mary Renee - posted on 05/23/2011

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but even if it's a shit system, it's not the server's fault so why punish the server? that's what I don't get about the "shit" system arguement. And again, if it's just the system in America and not in your own countries, why can't you just agree "When in Rome, do as Romans do" during the short time you're visiting instead of knowingly take five dollars (or more) out of someone's hard earned.

It seems like a sense of entitlement on the part of the guest that anyone wants to have to end up paying five dollars to serve you. No one wants to serve you that bad... trust me.

[deleted account]

No, it's certainly NOT the server's fault. As I've said all along, it's the SYSTEM'S fault. The system allows, even encourages the employer to exploit his workers! It's the employer's job to pay her workers a living wage! As long as this system is allowed to flourish, the servers will get a crap deal.

I know it can be a crummy job - been there, done that! I also know that doing any job to the best of your ability can be a source of pride. Yes, I know that won't pay the bills, so maybe you should stop defending the system and try to improve the situation by lobbying for better wages and conditions. It seems to me that you'd rather go the easy way and whine about how tough it is and how everyone else has a responsibility to make life easier for you by paying extra!

And don't tell me I have to pay extra for service. I expect good service to be a given when I go out to dine. It's part of the deal, not an optional extra!

Mary Renee - posted on 05/23/2011

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HELLO!!! It's not the SERVER's fault that this is the way it is in the United States!? Why are you so adamant in denying the server the money you owe them for serving you? If you want to be mad about the system, be mad at the system, be mad at the employer, but DON'T take it out on the server!!!


The way it has always been explained to me is that waitressing is in a way like being your own boss, except someone else sets your hours. The "boss" is giving you the opportunity to make your own money. In some places it is very competitive, it's a job that one doesn't need a college education for, and if one is in school, or has to watch their children during the day while they S.O. works a day job, this is the only opportunity they have and they appreciate the opportunity to work - but trust me - they don't appreciate customers taking advantage of their work and not paying for it - which is what you're doing if you refuse to tip. And yes, satisfactory service deserves a tip. You are still getting service. You still have to pay for it.

[deleted account]

If I were in the US and I tipped even when the service was bad, then I certainly WOULD be participating in a bit of exploitation! I would be helping to prop up a system where the employer gets away with not paying her staff a living wage! Now that IS an exploitative system!

Jodi - posted on 05/23/2011

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The point I was making was simply that accusing customers of taking advantage of the server by not tipping, but not holding the employer to the same standard is just a touch ironic, don't you think?

Mrs. - posted on 05/23/2011

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It is a reality that in the states the server makes a wage that is scary. My paycheques there were a joke, any money I made went to my horrible, hardly sufficient insurance. I used to get cheques for a dollar.

You can say it is the employers fault or the governments fault for not doing better by their servers. Still, now you know this is the case, when you sit down to eat in the US, the reality is...you are paying that person's living wage. You can choose not to take a part in this "unfair" treatment and not go out to eat. This is the reality of dining in the US, period.

Do what you want with the facts. If it sits well with you, given that knowledge to not tip - then those are your choices. But, don't fool yourself that you are not participating in a bit of exploitation when you don't.

[deleted account]

I cannot comprehend a system that allows a restaurant owner to get away with paying her staff a miserly wage because she knows the customers will make up the shortfall. This is really turning things upside down – the owner should be the one taking the risks, not poorly paid staff! Sounds to me like the owner has no respect for the rights of his workers! Practically slave labour, but it’s OK because someone else (ie the customer) will fix it up!
As for the argument that wait staff need the prospect of getting more tips as an incentive to work harder, what a load of rubbish. All workers should take pride in their work and do it to the best of their ability. In my experience (both in waiting table and dining at restaurants) the good feeling in a restaurant comes from the top down – the owner/manager sets the tone. If the wait staff are getting flustered and not doing their jobs as well as you might like, it’s time for some reorganisation
I reiterate – I expect good service. Part of the costs on the bill at the end of the night should incorporate good service, it shouldn’t be a separate item. I might tip for extra good service, but I’ll NEVER tip for bad service. But I’ll certainly never go back there!

Jodi - posted on 05/23/2011

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""Taking advantage of a server (allowing them to care for you for free" is pretty low..."

Interesting comment. Isn't this EXACTLY what your employer is doing?

[deleted account]

When in Rome... I've worked as a waitress and would never want to leave one short at the end of the night (unless it's some snotty bitch, but which waitress is, really).
On a side note: we do very much enjoy getting tipped in Ireland, too, despite anything that they might tell you in some tourist brochures...

Janet - posted on 05/23/2011

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I'm a waitress and it's a tough job, so I almost always tip at least 15%, and I find tipping 5% on the nose for bad service is a bigger message than not tipping at all.

One thing I do want to say is that I've worked at numerous places in Southern Ontario Canada and I ALWAYS have to "tip-out" a percentage on sales to the buspeople, bartender and kitchen staff. It's not based on tips made, but on total sales. So if I don't get tipped I am literally paying to wait on you. The average tip-out is 2-5% in my small town depending on the restaurant and this policy has been in effect in every restaurant I have ever worked at.

I also go by the "when in Rome" theory when I travel and expect others to do the same, even with something like tipping.

Mary Renee - posted on 05/23/2011

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@Toni... the biggest problem with your post is that you say "satisfactory service does not deserve a tip regardless of the tipping culture in the country you are in"

I have to disagree, I think this whole entire debate has been about the fact that when you're in the United States, satisfactory service merits a tip. I have to agree with Mary Elizabeth "Taking advantage of a server (allowing them to care for you for free" is pretty low..."

I also provided the example of the fact that I have to tip out the bus boys, so if you knowingly aren't tipping at least 10% then there's a fair chance that your server has to PAY someone else out of their own pocket just because you were their customer. Do you think that's fair? I hear people saying "It's not my job to deal with America's employer/employee relations" but now that you KNOW that this is the way it works here - to still go ahead and refuse to tip for satisfactory service knowing your server has to lose money just because you chose to walk in their restaurant and sit at their table - I just don't know how you could look in their eyes and order your food knowing that... it's wrong.

ME - posted on 05/23/2011

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I always tip, but then, I have been a waitress and bartender. I know what it takes to be great at that job, and when I have a great server they get a great tip. I was paid 3.45/hr as a server, and I think that if you eat out in the states you MUST tip something. If you do not have the money to tip, you should not eat out. If you know that people are basically taking care of you for free (my pay checks were typically blank after taxes), and you fail to tip them, you are quite simply, a jerk. If the service is bad I do not tip a ton, but I give them something; sometimes, no matter how hard I tried, I still had a bad day, and I won't be the cause of someone going home completely empty-handed! I have been stiffed by customers despite giving them my best, and that rudeness and rejection on their part was really deflating. I know that other cultures do things differently...but, I am disgusted by people who take advantage of others, no matter where they do it. Taking advantage of a server (allowing them to care for you for free) is pretty low...

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