How many moms are frustrated with bullying by teachers in our schools today?

Lynda - posted on 02/12/2014

Go figure that I was right that both you, Jodi and Shawnee, are teachers in the school system! Too funny! And I'll explain it again for you two daft idiots that I knew you worked for the school system as Jodi blamed the kids by asking why did the teacher need to raise his/her voice. And of course teachers need to raise their voice from time to time to settle down a class. We can all attest to that happening, but again, it was the "little brats" to the kindrgarten kids, the "little bitches" to the Grade 5 girls, and the "dumb asses" to the Grade 7 and 8 boys that is the problem. And you two working with children, yet we have Jodi saying "I have super thick skin, and I don't put up with the shit" and Shawnie talking about the kids being "precious angels who get everything under the sun"...nice! And then we have Jodi having one of the worst days of her career when having to turn in one if your own and feeling bad about that, but what about the kid that peed their pants in front of all their friends. We were not talking about a drink of water. Not allowing the kid to go to the bathroom and not allowing a kid to go for a drink of water is comparing apples to oranges. I think by your last comments you prove my point that the two of you go to work seeing it as a battle! NICE!!! And for Celeste, I know all teachers aren't bullies and think the way Jodi and Shawnie do, but I am finding more and more parents are in this predicament of their child being bullied by someone in authority and don't know what to do next. Good on you, Celeste, for reporting your co-worker and doing the right thing! Oh, and, Shawnie, it wasn't hearsay as the mom of the boy who was dragged across the room by his neck getting screamed at "you're going to listen to me" is a good friend of mine, and she said the music teacher phoned her the same day crying that he was sorry and he didn't know what he would do if someone did that to his kids. I sure am glad that my kids don't go to the school that Jodi and Shawnie teach at!!

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/12/2014

Lynda, have you googled "teachers BULLIED BY STUDENTS" to see the plethora that comes up there? over 3 MILLION results.

"teachers bullied by parents"? over 3 MILLION results, again.

I googled teachers bullying, and got a few results on actual incidents, and more links to the pages on teachers BEING BULLIED.

I declare your rant to be just that, a rant. Probably one of your angels got shut down when trying to get special privileges, and you felt that they were 'bullied' by their teacher. Well, I'm so sorry that you feel that your angels aren't being treated properly by the school that they are in. Perhaps homeschooling would be an option for you!

Michelle - posted on 02/12/2014

Yes you can teach children to go to the toilet at certain times. My daughter has a habit of needing to go after we sit down for dinner. We make sure she goes before she sits down to get her out of the habit. It has worked and she no longer goes during meal times.
It's up to the parents to let their children know that they need to go during breaks. Yes there will be times that they will need to go during class but it shouldn't become a regular thing.
Were you there when this "bullying" was going on? If not then you are going on your rant just on hearsay. Maybe getting the teachers side of the story would be helpful to find out what actually happened as parents do like to exaggerate what has happened to their children.

Jodi - posted on 02/12/2014

Lynda, I know very few instances of bullying. You are not only rude as hell, but are also making it sound like it is all teachers, or even the majority, and it simply isn't.

Yes, I am a teacher. Yes, I do allow my students to go to the bathroom....and I teach high school (kids who know better). Yes, I HAVE reported a fellow teacher for an incident that was not appropriate and it was a horrible moment in my career to report someone I worked with. So believe me, I know what is appropriate and what isn't.

However, I don't agree that you are using the term bullying appropriately. Am I a bully because 10 minutes before the recess bell I tell a 15 year old they can't go to have a drink, instead I tell them they need to bring a drink bottle to school and fill it for class?

You actually sound like the types of parents of those minority of entitled little cherubs in my class. The ones whose parents just ask "well what do you want me to do about it" when you call home because they yelled expletives at you in class. There are many more students ABUSING and BULLYING than there are teachers. How about you Google THAT.

And Shawnn is right. I didn't ask why a teacher should yell. I'm asking why they should need to. If the kids shut the hell up in the first place when asked for quiet, yelling would not be needed. It's the students who lack respect, more often than not, and with some of the things teachers have to put up with, mental health is a major concern in the profession (it sounds like that music teacher was pushed to his limit and had a breakdown - it happens). I have seen people leave because of the abuse, simply to save their sanity. Me, I have a super thick skin. I also don't put up with the shit.

And parents like you....well, you are the topic of conversation in the welfare meeting when we are trying to find creative ways to manage your child's needs. It's often more about how we manage the parents so that the child can be a positive contributor to the school community rather than a negative one.

Celeste - posted on 02/12/2014

Woah Lynda, please don't lump all teachers and staff as bullies. I am a life skills teacher aide (kids with special needs) and I love my job and adore my kids. A little offensive if you think all staff are like that. And my husband is a teacher.

If name calling and bullying are going on, those teachers need to be addressed. Fortunately I work at a school that this behavior is not tolerated

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/13/2014

Lynda, enough. You are inciteful, you are rude, you are continually violating THUMPS.

You refuse intelligent dialogue, instead resorting to junior high tactics such as name calling, and refusing to do research.

As stated below by Jodi, you are not going to get constructive responses.

Oh, and just FYI, you DO REALIZE, do you not, that NOT ALL who are employed in an educational institution are not professors, instructors, or teachers, correct? There are support staff, there are aides, there are a plethora of employment categories in an educational setting. Since you failed to read/comprehend my posts explaining that I am at University, telling ADULTS (who've been raised by you and your friends to believe that their shit doesn't stink, and they can do no wrong, and no matter what, the word NO does not apply to them) that they need to pull their heads out, kick momma off their backs, grow some balls and take care of their own business. And, no, I am sweet and polite to them, but not so much when dealing with you, the parent, who also has no respect for the rules and regulations at our institution.

I've raised my kids. My youngest will graduate in 2 years. I've worked with kids for 30+ years. When you can say that, then we can speak. Until then, like I said in another post to another helicopter parent who refused intelligent dialogue: Don't send your kids to college here. I'm tired of dealing with them.

I'd much rather interact with students mature enough to handle age appropriate situations, whether they be 5 years old or 15, or 25. They're out there, they're just overshadowed by your kids...the entitled ones.

Post being closed for comments, as this discussion is going nowhere

Lynda - posted on 02/13/2014

For Michelle, PLEASE STOP BLAMING THE KIDS!!! You obviously are not familiar with the video that I am referring to. Go to "hvna teacher bully". And this is why we as parents are resorting to sending our kids into class wired up. You as teachers blame the kids right away or don't believe the kids, and you want proof! Well, you can't dispute an audio tape now, can you? The principal in my girls' school was being taped by parents in meetings because she was breaking confidentiality when talking about other parents to other parents. REAL PROFESSIONAL! So it's not only kids going to the school wired up either! And for Jodi, I wish you would have left with your second last text when saying "all I have left to say...", but you didn't, so to respond to your last message: the statement you put saying it would receive much more positive feedback is laughable! You, Jodi, would have asked for more details just as you did with my question and comment about more examples of teachers bullying! And that is exactly what I would like to reiterate to ALL PARENTS out there: what other examples of teachers bullying kids are out there? And for all you teachers out there thinking that I am lumping you all together, I am not. If you are a teacher/EA doing your job with compassion and really do care about the kids, great! But I am not seeing or experiencing a lot of that, and as parents, we need to expose those who are not doing their job with the kids' best interests at heart! For example, the mentality of "Shawn" the teacher; her comments speak volumes on how she feels about the kids and parents she deals with! I find it deplorable that as a so-called professional, "Shawn" the teacher spoke like that on an international site! But that's the problem: teachers can say and do what they like, because they most likely will just keep on working! Again, parents, is there any more examples of teachers bullying kids? And "Shawn" (I believe the spelling is correct) yes, I do know there are other occupations in the school system, which is why I put "teachers/EA" (educational assistant) and you all should have the kids', regardless of age, best interests at heart. You know nothing about my life or my kids' lives and how privileged we are! And YOU are the one who has been rude when speaking about your presumptions! I got it that you don't teach younger students, but that doesn't give you a pass to write the texts you did about your students being that you are supposed to be a professional! And you say you have all this experience in your personal life and your profession, yet have no problem texting what you did. I have a hard time believing that you are "sweet and polite" to anybody after what you said in your texts! So why don't you just keep your presumptions to yourself. I guess the topic hits a sore spot, so we just won't discuss it; that's another problem that is prevalent in the schools today! Now the matter can be closed for discussion. Have a great day, "Shawn" (again, I think the spelling is correct) And just so you, Shawn, Jodi, and Michelle know that your comments were also abusive and definitely not helpful!

Jodi - posted on 02/12/2014

Just a message for anyone else reading this, I do NOT condone allowing a child to wet themselves, nor do I condone teachers speaking to children in derogatory ways. Nowhere have I condoned any of these things. I do, however, believe the OP has lumped all teachers together and that she may have received a different response altogether if she said:

"My 5 year old daughter wet her pants in class because the teacher refused to allow her to go to the toilet. What do you think?"

Can you see how that is a much more constructive way of getting a positive outcome to your concerns? As a message to all - confrontational language in an OP will not end positively for you. Social skills are a wonderful thing for gaining positive outcomes in real life too.

Jodi - posted on 02/12/2014

Lynda, all I have left to say is that you really are very rude. I have no interest in pursuing a conversation further with someone who is clearly acting like a child. Feel free to wallow in your misery, especially as it appears you can't read properly. Good day!

Michelle - posted on 02/12/2014

You do realize the videos you are talking about are the extremes and not the norm. MOST parents don't have problems with the schools they send their children to. Out of the billions of school children around the world there will of course be those that act up in school to the extreme and schools have to take tougher measures to deal with them.
Just because an autistic boy is well behaved at home doesn't mean that in a school environment with 20+ other children he is the same. Different situations affect different people/children differently.

Lynda - posted on 02/12/2014

As far as I'm concerned Shawn, sweetie, your disgusting texts about how you think of the kids and their parents shows how much of a PROFESSIONAL you really are! And listen, sweetie, if you are a crusty old teacher that is sick of the kids and their parents, why don't you let some fresh blood take your place! It wouldn't take much for the new teacher to surpass your teaching abilities I'm sure! Ah, and not believing the kids and parents overreacting and needing the proof! This mentality is all over the schools as well! It's so prevalent that parents are sending their kids to school all wired up. The Youtube video is a dad who did exactly that when his autistic boy was apparently acting up in school. This was going on for more than a year! And since his boy was a gentle kid at home, (and Shawn, I know YOU don't believe this, and I really don't care if I spell "your name" wrong) he was perplexed in how to address the problem that the teachers were telling him that his son was acting out in school. When his son Akian came home, the 6 to 7 hours of abuse was sickening!!! This was the Cherry Hill school, I believe the name was. Maybe you two idiots work there! And there is your PROOF!!! And as disgusting as what was on that tape, the teachers are STILL WORKING!!! And the dad never named these pathetic teachers on the video and just wants a public apology! Google that, Shawn, sweetie!!!

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/12/2014

Why, thank you, Michelle! ;-)

Michelle - posted on 02/12/2014

You put all of that so well Shawnn.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/12/2014

Lynda, cease with the personal attacks. Calling myself and Jodi 'daft idiots' because we are pointing out to you the differences between your examples and actual bullying is not OK!

And, again, please quit spreading rumours. Or, clarify for us that you actually WITNESSED the teacher in question calling kids bastards, & bitches whilst they were present, and that you did also witness the teacher dragging the child by the neck.

And, sweetie, when you've been on God's earth for as long as I have, and you've dealt with the idiotic situations created (for the most part) by entitled parents feeling that their children's shit doesn't stink, and we should all bow down to those same angelic children...Well, you'd see where I'm coming from. But, as I said, you don't because you ARE one of those types of people, from what I can see.

Your kid most likely did not follow a teacher's direction, or a school rule, and you're pissed about it because you couldn't get the school to see it 'your way', which, of COURSE is the only RIGHT WAY, or at least that's the way that you want the rest of us to see it.

Sorry, honey, but my bullshit meter just went over the top after your last post.

Further more, miss Maturity, at least pull your head out long enough to realize that it is insulting for an adult to deliberately misspell another's name when it's RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEM. You may refer to me as Ms. Lively from here on out, because you refuse to spell my name correctly. Using my given name is a privilege, and you, my dear, do not have that privilege

Michelle - posted on 02/12/2014

I don't think she understands the difference.
I wonder if she enforces rules in her own home, does she class herself a bully. With what has been written I would fall into the category of a bully, instead I'm a Mum making sure my children follow my rules.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/12/2014

I tried to make that point earlier, as well, Michelle.

Michelle - posted on 02/12/2014

I'd also like to add that enforcing school rules/policies ISN'T bullying, it's enforcing rules.
Children have to learn there are rules in society that they have to abide by and school teaches them that.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/12/2014

Oh, Linnie, Take a deep breath, and RELAX. Stop attacking people who respond to your highly inciteful OP. FYI, you are darned right I work in a school system. I work with your 'precious angel' when they come to Uni, and have been given every damned thing under the sun, and have their parents call and 'fix' every damned issue that they get into by being irresponsible.

I, DAILY, deal with students who, by virtue of parents who feel their children can absolutely do no wrong, cannot understand the meaning of a simple two letter word: NO. I, DAILY deal with people who are physically and mentally considered 'adults', yet have no idea about how to handle a simple problem with a professor without having momma call and whine about how her 'baby' should be treated differently than the 295 people in the same boat as they are.

You aren't actually reading responses, either, as I can see from your lack of comprehension of both Jodi's and my own. Just FYI, Jodi ASKED WHY A TEACHER WOULD NEED TO BEGIN BY YELLING, she did not say that the teacher should yell, she asked what the need would be.

And, I did not say that assault on students by teachers does not EVER happen, but I did say that the example you cited, of a child being denied the restroom, would not be considered bullying, and that FULL CIRCUMSTANCES have to be considered, not just one 'injured' parent telling a biased version of events. STORIES, ACCUSATIONS, AND SITUATIONS ALL HAVE MORE THAN ONE VIEWPOINT.

Bullying, in and of itself, is a very valid concern. However, parents such as yourself, in throwing around the term in regards to every disciplinary situation that arises are the ones that actually get the REAL victims minimized.

And, in every single school district or organization (in the US, at least) has a process in which, if proper evidence is provided (not rumours, not hearsay), an investigation into cirumstances will occur, and steps will be taken to correct the problem. So, I'd say that, in your specifically quoted hearsay about the music teacher, there either was not a correct following of grievance procedures, or the district investigated and found nothing amiss. Of course, I doubt that YOU would pass rumours, so I'm certain that you were physically present during the alleged "grabbing around the neck and dragging" of the student, correct?

Celeste - posted on 02/12/2014

Actually I have known a staff person who was bullying one of our special needs kids and I reported it and he was promptly fired

Lynda - posted on 02/12/2014

And, Jodi, so my question still stands: do you or anyone else have any more examples of teachers "bullying"? As I suggested to "Shawnn", google "teachers bullying" and see for yourself the plethora of material that comes up!

Lynda - posted on 02/12/2014

For both Jodi and Shaun, my initial text was that "I" veiwed those stories about the ridiculous staff not letting these small children go to the bathroom as "bullying", and "I" still believe is "BULLYING"!!! How's that for throwing around the word "BULLYING"! And, Jodi, you have got to be kidding when you defend the music teacher and blame the kids by saying he "NEEDS" to yell at them! Of course teachers have to raise their voices from time to time in order to get a class to settle down! It's his choice of words that is OBVIOUSLY abusive! You must work for the school system in some way for you to defend this music teacher's actions!!! And what about this idiot music teacher dragging the Grade 3 boy across the room by his neck screaming at him "you're going to listen to me! "; I suppose that's not "BULLYING" either, Jodi?! As I said for "Shaun", go stick your head in the sand with regards to "BULLYING TEACHERS"!!!!

Jodi - posted on 02/11/2014

"they started the year out with him yelling shut up constsntly."

Why should a teacher even NEED to be yelling at the kids to shut up in the first place?

Jodi - posted on 02/11/2014

"you ranted without knowing all the facts"

Well, you didn't exactly provide the "facts" did you? See how my very FIRST comment to you was "Well, what are the circumstances?". No need for you to be rude about it at all.

Personally, I believe that if children this age ask to go to the bathroom, and clearly had body language happening that meant they needed to go, then yes, they should be able to go, BUT it shouldn't become a habit. It is also our responsibility as parents to teach them toileting responsibility and they need to be working on using their breaks to use the bathroom, not just play. So what if they don't "need" to go at the time? They "need" to learn to try to go anyway. So there is a learning process that needs to take place. My kids learned that just fine. If these children have already been at school for a while already (a year), then they need to be practicing these habits.

As I said, you have not really outlined all the circumstances, so I can't comment whether these particular instances where inappropriate, but it certainly isn't "bullying". Stop throwing the word around inappropriately.

Lynda - posted on 02/11/2014

And by the way, Shaun, that music teacher is still teaching! They just moved him to another school to verbally and physically abuse those kids! This teacher has been in the school system for a long time; tenure, you know! The good old Union protecting the staff again! Parents need to become one voice to protect our "precious babies"!

Lynda - posted on 02/11/2014

Shaun, let me guess, you're a teacher or someone who works in the school system!!! You are all the same!!! And your damn right that that is my "precious baby" and you should be ashamed of yourself for texting about going to tell "Mommy and Daddy", because that is what we tell our kids all the time; to keep ALL lines of communication open! And I still say that it was bullying by these idiot teachers when all they had to do is let the kids go to the bathroom without making a bad situation worse! If you really read my text, the kid was outside and not in the classroom. And to be "brutally honest", why don't you brilliant teachers just use some of your WISDOM AND COMMON SENSE and just diffuse the situation by getting the kid to a bathroom. And as far as who is bullying who, just google "bullying teachers" as I did because I'm sick of it in my daughters' school, as well as in every school around! There is a video of a boy named Akian, who is a special-needs student that will make you SICK!!! Or maybe not you, because that's not your "precious baby"! And as for going through protocol, the school system, WHAT A JOKE!!! No matter how wrong they are, they will ALWAYS back their own! For example, music became mandatory in my girls' school, and they started the year out with him yelling shut up constsntly. Since then, it escalated to the kindergarten kids being called "little brats", Grade 5 girls being called "little bitches", and Grade 7 boys being called "dumb asses"!And since this teacher has been kept around even after all this verbal abuse, he now has put his hands around a Grade 3 boy's neck dragging him across thr classroom yelling at him "you're going to listen to me" in front of the whole class! And you think those poor precious babies shouldn't go home and tell Mommy and Daddy! Go stick your head in the sand and pretend that teachers aren't bullying!

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/11/2014

And to be even more brutally honest, I see more teachers submitting to bullying from their entitled brats that are students than I do students being bullied by teachers...

It used to be that teachers enforcing rules were just that, teachers enforcing rules. Now if precious baby doesn't want to listen, they tell momma and daddy, and momma and daddy whine about how their angel is 'special' and deserves 'special treatment' and that 'nasty bullying teacher' needs to learn that. Well, I disagree.

♫ Shawnn ♪♫♫ - posted on 02/11/2014

Hey, Lynda, how about before jumping down someone's throat, you post more detail if you want that detail taken into consideration?

Because, TBQH, Jodi's reply is pretty sane. If the kid was given ample time for restroom during regularly scheduled break times, if the kid DOES NOT HAVE any medical conditions that would necessitate more frequent trips to the restroom, and if the kid is old enough to know better, then the teacher does not have to let them disrupt the rest of the students.

So, I'll continue: 5 & 6 years old IS MORE THAN old enough to know better. AND, I read on of those posts in question, and the mother never DID clarify whether or not 'after lunch' was within a 10 minute limit, or if the child had peed herself right at the bell. So, that particular one, I call BS on anyway, because if the child had peed herself 'after lunch' and mom is picking her up at 3 pm, the child clearly wasn't 'soaking', and if the child WAS 'soaking', the incident had to have happened at a time when changing wasn't a choice, such as end of day bell. and, further more, no children aren't "dogs that pee on command" (which, I have to say is laughable...Kids are MUCH easier trained than dogs to pee on command) BUT, children CAN BE TAUGHT TO HOLD THEIR BLADDERS AND HAVE A BATHROOM ROUTINE. Hell, I had that very same damned routine when I was in kindergarten 38 years ago!

It is a disruption to the other students to be allowing kids to constantly leave the classroom because they 'didn't go' during the designated times. I can't TELL you how many times I've been the restroom teacher...and had kids screw off during restroom break, even though they DID HAVE TO GO, so that they could try to get out of class and run the halls a few minutes later. They learned to hold their bladders.

Oh, and Lynda? The SANE AND LOGICAL APPROACH would be to contact the school in question, if you have a problem with their policies, instead of coming on to a public, international forum and basically accusing all teachers everywhere of being bullying assholes.

Michelle - posted on 02/11/2014

Lynda: when you don't post all the details then you will get very differing opinions. No need to attack someone who questions the circumstances when it wasn't written to start off with.

I would actually go to the school and let them know their policy needs to be changed, rather than rant about the teachers being bullies. There are better ways to get things changed and help the kids.

Lynda - posted on 02/11/2014

And one other thing, Jodi, if anyone holds their pee in, that could lead to repetitive bladder infections! As a mother, you should be aware of this! So these kids didn't have any medical issues, but if the staff keep this nonsense up with not letting the kids go to the bathroom, they just might end up with a medical issue all because of the school and their STUPID POLICY!!! Again, Jodi, COMMON SENSE!!!!!

Lynda - posted on 02/11/2014

Hey, Jodi. I would be glad to explain some common sense to you. But the way you ranted without knowing all the facts and blaming the kids makes me think you probably work for a school in some way! The two incidents I read about other moms' kids not being allowed to go to the bathroom, the kids were 5 and 6 years old. So they are not "old enough to know better" and the kids didn't have any "medical issues" to address that nonsense. As for your "ample opportunity to go during the break", these are kids; not dogs who go pee on command. And the bullies are the staff who didn't allow these kids to go to bathroom! So here's the common sense, Jodi: If you as the staff member see a little kid, 5 or 6, crossing their legs asking to go to the bathroom after they just had the chance to go, why on earth would you make the situation worse by saying no and they then pee their pants in front of everyone and be humiliated! What happens to us all sometimes when we go from a warm place to a cold place or vice versa is that all of a sudden you have to go to the bathroom! So these little kids weren't trying to put one over on the staff when they said they didn't have to go to the bathroom at the designated time; again, they are 5 and 6! And this is "bullying" by the staff even if it was just one time being that they were ONLY 5 and 6! It was because the policy of the school that once the kids are outside, they can't go back inside the school! Again, COMMON SENSE says that this idiot staff member was being a bully when he/she didn't help these little kids get to a bathroom, either by herself or direct someone else to help!!! Next time before you go off on a rant, get ALL THE FACTS!!!

Jodi - posted on 02/04/2014

Well, what are the circumstances? I would hardly call it bullying, especially if those children had ample opportunity to go during their break, had no medical issues, and are old enough to know better. Also, it is only bullying if it is consistent and ongoing, and if it IS consistent and ongoing, then maybe you need to look into your child's toileting habits. If it is a one-off, it isn't bullying. And I don't think it is fair to generalise because of only a couple of instances.

I must admit, I really hate how people throw the term "bullying" around inappropriately.